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Re: [Healeys] Sad news - Rallyist Killed in Healey 100

To: "'Michael Oritt'" <michael.oritt@gmail.com>, "'Mike Sinclair'" <phoenix722@comcast.net>
Subject: Re: [Healeys] Sad news - Rallyist Killed in Healey 100
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Date: Fri, 7 Oct 2022 10:11:13 -0400
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It is clear that Josef had some sort of problem with older rich =
Americans invading his environment.  His outburst, and continued =
doubling down, suggests he truly has some sort of an issue with =
courtesy.  Now that it has emerged that the gentleman who died was not =
only not American, but was a Brit who lived in central Europe, his focus =
on age is all that remains from his initial set of assumptions.  While I =
don=E2=80=99t expect any kind of apology from Josef, it is a reminder to =
all of us that =E2=80=9Cjumping to assumptions=E2=80=9D is rarely a good =
thing.   It is very easy to slip into prejudice and outrage, when =
perhaps neither is warranted.  =20

=20

I personally would like this thread to fade into oblivion.

Thanks

-skip-

=20

From: Healeys <healeys-bounces@autox.team.net> On Behalf Of Michael =
Oritt
Sent: Thursday, October 6, 2022 10:10 PM
To: Mike Sinclair <phoenix722@comcast.net>
Cc: healeys@autox.team.net
Subject: Re: [Healeys] Sad news - Rallyist Killed in Healey 100

=20

I'm 79 and still actively race.  I'm glad that Josef--otherwise known as =
Mr. Sensitivity--isn't on the qualifications committee.

=20

Best--Michael Oritt

=20

On Thu, Oct 6, 2022 at 8:21 PM Mike Sinclair <phoenix722@comcast.net =

Maybe you better quit driving, now Josef, before you get old and =
decrepit.

Mike

Age 82

On 10/6/22 12:32 PM, josef-eckert--- via Healeys wrote:

Yes, please forward my comment to his family.=20

This person hasn=C2=B4t recognizsed his limits and was a danger for =
other people on the road, drivers, bikers and cyclists, and even =
pedestrians, which are on our rural roads as well and also want to live =
and be not hurt by such a person.

Sorry, no mercy at all from my side.

=20

=20

=20

=20

=20

=20

-----Original-Nachricht-----

Betreff: Re: [Healeys] Sad news - Rallyist Killed in Healey 100

Datum: 2022-10-06T21:15:03+0200



=20

=20

=20

Well, THAT was harsh.  You might want to forward that to his family just =
so they know how you feel about him.  When exactly is it you think  we =
should all stop driving?  Is it 75?  80?  I'm 71, I just want to get =
your advice on what age I'm endangering other people.=20

=20

That was easily the most insensitive posting I have ever seen on this =
list.

=20

On Thu, Oct 6, 2022 at 11:52 AM josef-eckert--- via Healeys =

To be honest, I have no respect for such a person, or better 82 years =
old fart who brought others in danger with his driving. Thankfully no =
other person was invoved and injured.=20

Its very common all over in central Europe to have these ditches, trees =
or even walls along country roads. That is how we love it.=20

For big money you can book in to take part in one of these leasure =
ra=C4=BAlys, where you get all accomodation organised, only you have to =
come from a to b along. these rallys are mainly booked from those mainly =
elderly people who do not know what to do otherwise with their money, =
even they are completely overextended by driving an old classic car.=20

One should be wise enough to give up driving, when you are no more =
capable to drive.=20

I am only sorry about the wrecked Austin-Healey.

=20

Josef Eckert

konigswinter/GERMANY


 =20

 =20

 =20

-----Original-Nachricht-----=20

Betreff: Re: [Healeys] Sad news - Rallyist Killed in Healey 100=20

Datum: 2022-10-06T10:31:49+0200=20

Von: "Michael Oritt" <michael.oritt@gmail.com =

An: "Michael Salter" <michaelsalter@gmail.com =

 =20

 =20

 =20

Michael--=20

 =20

Most of them weren't "open" ditches--they were filled with rocks.  =20

I fondly recall the time we missed a left-hander, went off the road, =
somehow hurtled OVER the ditch and landed in a tree in a fellow's front =
yard.  As I remember it he stood there rather stunned while we cleared =
the branches out of the wheel openings, then hopped into the car and =
took off without much conversation.=20

 =20

Best--Michael Oritt=20


On Wed, Oct 5, 2022 at 10:36 PM Michael Salter via Healeys =

"all the roads are surrounded by open drainage ditches."=20

Just like Newfoundland which for me was a major factor in giving up on =
the Targa there.=20

 =20

M=20

On Wed., Oct. 5, 2022, 1:06 a.m. Alan Seigrist via Healeys, =

Italian roads are amazing for driving through beautiful countryside, but =
they are deadly because all the roads are surrounded by open drainage =
ditches.=20


On Wed, 5 Oct 2022 at 3:27 AM, Richard Kahn via Healeys =

I saw this yesterday. Very sad on so many levels. I was wondering if =
this is the drive a number of the Southern California Healey Association =
members are on in Europe at this moment.=20

 =20

From: Healeys <healeys-bounces@autox.team.net =
Sent: Tuesday, October 4, 2022 5:40 AM=20
>=20
Subject: [Healeys] Sad news - Rallyist Killed in Healey 100=20

 =20

Awful. =20

 =20

https://www.the-sun.com/news/6355269/british-expat-killed-horror-crash-ra=
lly-austin-healey/=20

 =20

Randy=20

_______________________________________________=20

Archive: http://www.team.net/pipermail/healeys =
http://autox.team.net/archive/healeys=20

http://autox.team.net/mailman/listinfo/healeys=20

http://autox.team.net/mailman/options/healeys/healey.nut@gmail.com=20

_______________________________________________=20

Archive: http://www.team.net/pipermail/healeys =
http://autox.team.net/archive/healeys=20

http://autox.team.net/mailman/listinfo/healeys=20

http://autox.team.net/mailman/options/healeys/michaelsalter@gmail.com=20

_______________________________________________=20

Archive: http://www.team.net/pipermail/healeys =
http://autox.team.net/archive/healeys=20

http://autox.team.net/mailman/listinfo/healeys=20

http://autox.team.net/mailman/options/healeys/michael.oritt@gmail.com=20




_______________________________________________

Archive: http://www.team.net/pipermail/healeys =
http://autox.team.net/archive/healeys

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http://autox.team.net/mailman/options/healeys/ryan@jimryan.com




=20

--=20

Jim Ryan

=C2=A9=C2=BF=C2=A9=C2=AC

=EF=BB=BF=20

_______________________________________________
=20
Archive: http://www.team.net/pipermail/healeys =
http://autox.team.net/archive/healeys
=20
http://autox.team.net/mailman/listinfo/healeys
=20
http://autox.team.net/mailman/options/healeys/phoenix722@comcast.net
=20

_______________________________________________

Archive: http://www.team.net/pipermail/healeys =
http://autox.team.net/archive/healeys

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http://autox.team.net/mailman/options/healeys/michael.oritt@gmail.com


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vlink=3Dpurple style=3D'word-wrap:break-word'><div =
class=3DWordSection1><p class=3DMsoNormal>It is clear that Josef had =
some sort of problem with older rich Americans invading his =
environment.=C2=A0 His outburst, and continued doubling down, suggests =
he truly has some sort of an issue with courtesy.=C2=A0 Now that it has =
emerged that the gentleman who died was not only not American, but was a =
Brit who lived in central Europe, his focus on age is all that remains =
from his initial set of assumptions.=C2=A0 While I don=E2=80=99t expect =
any kind of apology from Josef, it is a reminder to all of us that =
=E2=80=9Cjumping to assumptions=E2=80=9D is rarely a good thing. =
=C2=A0=C2=A0It is very easy to slip into prejudice and outrage, when =
perhaps neither is warranted.=C2=A0=C2=A0 <o:p></o:p></p><p =
class=3DMsoNormal><o:p>&nbsp;</o:p></p><p class=3DMsoNormal>I personally =
would like this thread to fade into oblivion.<o:p></o:p></p><p =
class=3DMsoNormal>Thanks<o:p></o:p></p><p =
class=3DMsoNormal>-skip-<o:p></o:p></p><p =
class=3DMsoNormal><o:p>&nbsp;</o:p></p><div =
style=3D'border:none;border-top:solid #E1E1E1 1.0pt;padding:3.0pt 0in =
0in 0in'><p class=3DMsoNormal><b>From:</b> Healeys =
&lt;healeys-bounces@autox.team.net&gt; <b>On Behalf Of </b>Michael =
Oritt<br><b>Sent:</b> Thursday, October 6, 2022 10:10 PM<br><b>To:</b> =
Mike Sinclair &lt;phoenix722@comcast.net&gt;<br><b>Cc:</b> =
healeys@autox.team.net<br><b>Subject:</b> Re: [Healeys] Sad news - =
Rallyist Killed in Healey 100<o:p></o:p></p></div><p =
class=3DMsoNormal><o:p>&nbsp;</o:p></p><div><div><p =
class=3DMsoNormal><span style=3D'color:#3333FF'>I'm 79 and still =
actively&nbsp;race.&nbsp; I'm glad that Josef--otherwise known as Mr. =
Sensitivity--isn't on the qualifications =
committee.<o:p></o:p></span></p></div><div><p class=3DMsoNormal><span =
style=3D'color:#3333FF'><o:p>&nbsp;</o:p></span></p></div><div><p =
class=3DMsoNormal><span style=3D'color:#3333FF'>Best--Michael =
Oritt<o:p></o:p></span></p></div></div><p =
class=3DMsoNormal><o:p>&nbsp;</o:p></p><div><div><p class=3DMsoNormal>On =
Thu, Oct 6, 2022 at 8:21 PM Mike Sinclair &lt;<a =
href=3D"mailto:phoenix722@comcast.net";>phoenix722@comcast.net</a>&gt; =
wrote:<o:p></o:p></p></div><blockquote =
style=3D'border:none;border-left:solid #CCCCCC 1.0pt;padding:0in 0in 0in =
6.0pt;margin-left:4.8pt;margin-right:0in'><div><p><span =
style=3D'font-family:"Tahoma",sans-serif'>Maybe you better quit driving, =
now Josef, before you get old and =
decrepit.</span><o:p></o:p></p><p><span =
style=3D'font-family:"Tahoma",sans-serif'>Mike</span><o:p></o:p></p><p><s=
pan style=3D'font-family:"Tahoma",sans-serif'>Age =
82</span><o:p></o:p></p><div><p class=3DMsoNormal>On 10/6/22 12:32 PM, =
josef-eckert--- via Healeys wrote:<o:p></o:p></p></div><blockquote =
style=3D'margin-top:5.0pt;margin-bottom:5.0pt'><p =
style=3D'margin:0in'><span =
style=3D'font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Arial",sans-serif;color:black'>Yes=
, please forward my comment to his family. </span><o:p></o:p></p><p =
style=3D'margin:0in'><span =
style=3D'font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Arial",sans-serif;color:black'>Thi=
s person hasn=C2=B4t recognizsed his limits and was a danger for other =
people on the road, drivers, bikers and cyclists, and even pedestrians, =
which are on our rural roads as well and also want to live and be not =
hurt by such a person.</span><o:p></o:p></p><p =
style=3D'margin:0in'><span =
style=3D'font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Arial",sans-serif;color:black'>Sor=
ry, no mercy at all from my side.</span><o:p></o:p></p><p =
style=3D'margin:0in'>&nbsp;<o:p></o:p></p><p =
style=3D'margin:0in'>&nbsp;<o:p></o:p></p><p =
style=3D'margin:0in'>&nbsp;<o:p></o:p></p><p style=3D'margin:0in'><span =
style=3D'font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Arial",sans-serif;color:black'>&nb=
sp;</span><o:p></o:p></p><p style=3D'margin:0in'>&nbsp;<o:p></o:p></p><p =
style=3D'margin:0in'>&nbsp;<o:p></o:p></p><p =
style=3D'margin:0in'>-----Original-Nachricht-----<o:p></o:p></p><p =
style=3D'margin:0in'>Betreff: Re: [Healeys] Sad news - Rallyist Killed =
in Healey 100<o:p></o:p></p><p style=3D'margin:0in'>Datum: =
2022-10-06T21:15:03+0200<o:p></o:p></p><p style=3D'margin:0in'>Von: =
&quot;Jim Ryan&quot; <a href=3D"mailto:ryan@jimryan.com"; =
target=3D"_blank">&lt;ryan@jimryan.com&gt;</a><o:p></o:p></p><p =
style=3D'margin:0in'>An: <a href=3D"mailto:josef-eckert@t-online.de"; =
target=3D"_blank">&quot;josef-eckert@t-online.de&quot;</a> <a =
href=3D"mailto:josef-eckert@t-online.de"; =
target=3D"_blank">&lt;josef-eckert@t-online.de&gt;</a><o:p></o:p></p><p =
style=3D'margin:0in'>&nbsp;<o:p></o:p></p><p =
style=3D'margin:0in'>&nbsp;<o:p></o:p></p><p =
style=3D'margin:0in'>&nbsp;<o:p></o:p></p><div><div><p =
class=3DMsoNormal>Well, THAT was harsh.&nbsp; You might want to forward =
that to his family just so they know how you feel about him.&nbsp; When =
exactly is it you think&nbsp; we should all stop driving?&nbsp; Is it =
75?&nbsp; 80?&nbsp; I'm 71, I just want to get your advice on what age =
I'm endangering&nbsp;other people. <o:p></o:p></p><div><p =
class=3DMsoNormal>&nbsp;<o:p></o:p></p></div><div><p =
class=3DMsoNormal>That was easily the most insensitive&nbsp;posting I =
have ever seen on this list.<o:p></o:p></p></div></div><p =
class=3DMsoNormal><o:p>&nbsp;</o:p></p><div><div><p class=3DMsoNormal>On =
Thu, Oct 6, 2022 at 11:52 AM josef-eckert--- via Healeys &lt;<a =
href=3D"mailto:healeys@autox.team.net"; =
target=3D"_blank">healeys@autox.team.net</a>&gt; =
wrote:<o:p></o:p></p></div><blockquote =
style=3D'border:none;border-left:solid #CCCCCC 1.0pt;padding:0in 0in 0in =
6.0pt;margin-left:4.8pt;margin-right:0in'><div><div><p class=3DMsoNormal =
style=3D'background:white'><span style=3D'color:black'>To be honest, I =
have no respect for such a person, or better 82 years old fart who =
brought others in danger with his driving. Thankfully no other person =
was invoved and injured. <br><br>Its very common all over in central =
Europe to have these ditches, trees or even walls along country roads. =
That is how we love it. <br><br>For big money you can book in to take =
part in one of these leasure ra=C4=BAlys, where you get all accomodation =
organised, only you have to come from a to b along. these rallys are =
mainly booked from those mainly elderly people who do not know what to =
do otherwise with their money, even they are completely overextended by =
driving an old classic car. <br><br>One should be wise enough to give up =
driving, when you are no more capable to drive. <br><br>I am only sorry =
about the wrecked Austin-Healey.</span><o:p></o:p></p></div><div><p =
class=3DMsoNormal style=3D'background:white'><span =
style=3D'color:black'>&nbsp;</span><o:p></o:p></p></div><div><p =
class=3DMsoNormal style=3D'background:white'><span =
style=3D'color:black'>Josef Eckert</span><o:p></o:p></p></div><div><p =
class=3DMsoNormal style=3D'margin-bottom:12.0pt;background:white'><span =
style=3D'color:black'>konigswinter/GERMANY<br><br><br>&nbsp; =
<br><br>&nbsp; <br><br>&nbsp; <br><br>-----Original-Nachricht----- =
<br><br>Betreff: Re: [Healeys] Sad news - Rallyist Killed in Healey 100 =
<br><br>Datum: 2022-10-06T10:31:49+0200 <br><br>Von: &quot;Michael =
Oritt&quot; &lt;<a href=3D"mailto:michael.oritt@gmail.com"; =
target=3D"_blank">michael.oritt@gmail.com</a>&gt; <br><br>An: =
&quot;Michael Salter&quot; &lt;<a =
href=3D"mailto:michaelsalter@gmail.com"; =
target=3D"_blank">michaelsalter@gmail.com</a>&gt; <br><br>&nbsp; =
<br><br>&nbsp; <br><br>&nbsp; <br><br>Michael-- <br><br>&nbsp; =
<br><br>Most of them weren't &quot;open&quot; ditches--they were filled =
with rocks.&nbsp;&nbsp; <br><br>I fondly recall the time we missed a =
left-hander, went off the road, somehow hurtled OVER the ditch and =
landed in a tree in a fellow's front yard.&nbsp; As I remember it he =
stood there rather stunned while we cleared the branches out of the =
wheel openings, then hopped into the car and took off without much =
conversation. <br><br>&nbsp; <br><br>Best--Michael Oritt <br><br><br>On =
Wed, Oct 5, 2022 at 10:36 PM Michael Salter via Healeys &lt;<a =
href=3D"mailto:healeys@autox.team.net"; =
target=3D"_blank">healeys@autox.team.net</a>&gt; wrote: =
<br><br>&quot;all the roads are surrounded by open drainage =
ditches.&quot; <br><br>Just like Newfoundland which for me was a major =
factor in giving up on the Targa there. <br><br>&nbsp; <br><br>M =
<br><br>On Wed., Oct. 5, 2022, 1:06 a.m. Alan Seigrist via Healeys, =
&lt;<a href=3D"mailto:healeys@autox.team.net"; =
target=3D"_blank">healeys@autox.team.net</a>&gt; wrote: <br><br>Italian =
roads are amazing for driving through beautiful countryside, but they =
are deadly because all the roads are surrounded by open drainage =
ditches. <br><br><br>On Wed, 5 Oct 2022 at 3:27 AM, Richard Kahn via =
Healeys &lt;<a href=3D"mailto:healeys@autox.team.net"; =
target=3D"_blank">healeys@autox.team.net</a>&gt; wrote: <br><br>I saw =
this yesterday. Very sad on so many levels. I was wondering if this is =
the drive a number of the Southern California Healey Association members =
are on in Europe at this moment. <br><br>&nbsp; <br><br>From: Healeys =
&lt;<a href=3D"mailto:healeys-bounces@autox.team.net"; =
target=3D"_blank">healeys-bounces@autox.team.net</a>&gt; on behalf of =
Randy Hicks via Healeys &lt;<a href=3D"mailto:healeys@autox.team.net"; =
target=3D"_blank">healeys@autox.team.net</a>&gt; <br>Sent: Tuesday, =
October 4, 2022 5:40 AM <br>To: Healey List &lt;<a =
href=3D"mailto:healeys@autox.team.net"; =
target=3D"_blank">healeys@autox.team.net</a>&gt; <br>Subject: [Healeys] =
Sad news - Rallyist Killed in Healey 100 <br><br>&nbsp; =
<br><br>Awful.&nbsp; <br><br>&nbsp; <br><br><a =
href=3D"https://www.the-sun.com/news/6355269/british-expat-killed-horror-=
crash-rally-austin-healey/" =
target=3D"_blank">https://www.the-sun.com/news/6355269/british-expat-kill=
ed-horror-crash-rally-austin-healey/</a> <br><br>&nbsp; <br><br>Randy =
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t@gmail.com</a> <br><br>_______________________________________________ =
<br>Support Team.Net <a href=3D"http://www.team.net/donate.html"; =
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lter@gmail.com</a> =
<br><br>_______________________________________________ <br>Support =
Team.Net <a href=3D"http://www.team.net/donate.html"; =
target=3D"_blank">http://www.team.net/donate.html</a> <br>Suggested =
annual donation&nbsp; $12.75 <br><br>Archive: <a =
href=3D"http://www.team.net/pipermail/healeys"; =
target=3D"_blank">http://www.team.net/pipermail/healeys</a> <a =
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target=3D"_blank">http://autox.team.net/archive/healeys</a> <br><br><a =
href=3D"mailto:Healeys@autox.team.net"; =
target=3D"_blank">Healeys@autox.team.net</a> <br><a =
href=3D"http://autox.team.net/mailman/listinfo/healeys"; =
target=3D"_blank">http://autox.team.net/mailman/listinfo/healeys</a> =
<br><br>Unsubscribe/Manage: <a =
href=3D"http://autox.team.net/mailman/options/healeys/michael.oritt@gmail=
.com" =
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ritt@gmail.com</a> <br><br><br></span><o:p></o:p></p></div></div><p =
class=3DMsoNormal =
style=3D'margin-bottom:12.0pt'>__________________________________________=
_____<br>Support Team.Net <a href=3D"http://www.team.net/donate.html"; =
target=3D"_blank">http://www.team.net/donate.html</a><br>Suggested =
annual donation&nbsp; $12.75<br><br>Archive: <a =
href=3D"http://www.team.net/pipermail/healeys"; =
target=3D"_blank">http://www.team.net/pipermail/healeys</a> <a =
href=3D"http://autox.team.net/archive/healeys"; =
target=3D"_blank">http://autox.team.net/archive/healeys</a><br><br><a =
href=3D"mailto:Healeys@autox.team.net"; =
target=3D"_blank">Healeys@autox.team.net</a><br><a =
href=3D"http://autox.team.net/mailman/listinfo/healeys"; =
target=3D"_blank">http://autox.team.net/mailman/listinfo/healeys</a><br><=
br>Unsubscribe/Manage: <a =
href=3D"http://autox.team.net/mailman/options/healeys/ryan@jimryan.com"; =
target=3D"_blank">http://autox.team.net/mailman/options/healeys/ryan@jimr=
yan.com</a><o:p></o:p></p></blockquote></div><p class=3DMsoNormal><br =
clear=3Dall><o:p></o:p></p><div><p =
class=3DMsoNormal>&nbsp;<o:p></o:p></p></div><p class=3DMsoNormal>-- =
<o:p></o:p></p><div><div><p style=3D'margin:0in'><span =
style=3D'font-size:10.0pt;color:navy'>Jim Ryan</span><span =
style=3D'font-size:9.5pt'><o:p></o:p></span></p><p =
style=3D'margin:0in'><span =
style=3D'font-size:9.5pt'>=C2=A9=C2=BF=C2=A9=C2=AC<o:p></o:p></span></p><=
/div></div></div><p class=3DMsoNormal>=EF=BB=BF =
<o:p></o:p></p><pre>_______________________________________________<o:p><=
/o:p></pre><pre>Support Team.Net <a =
href=3D"http://www.team.net/donate.html"; =
target=3D"_blank">http://www.team.net/donate.html</a><o:p></o:p></pre><pr=
e>Suggested annual donation=C2=A0 =
$12.75<o:p></o:p></pre><pre><o:p>&nbsp;</o:p></pre><pre>Archive: <a =
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target=3D"_blank">http://autox.team.net/archive/healeys</a><o:p></o:p></p=
re><pre><o:p>&nbsp;</o:p></pre><pre><a =
href=3D"mailto:Healeys@autox.team.net"; =
target=3D"_blank">Healeys@autox.team.net</a><o:p></o:p></pre><pre><a =
href=3D"http://autox.team.net/mailman/listinfo/healeys"; =
target=3D"_blank">http://autox.team.net/mailman/listinfo/healeys</a><o:p>=
</o:p></pre><pre><o:p>&nbsp;</o:p></pre><pre>Unsubscribe/Manage: <a =
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2@comcast.net</a><o:p></o:p></pre><pre><o:p>&nbsp;</o:p></pre></blockquot=
e></div><p class=3DMsoNormal =
style=3D'margin-bottom:12.0pt'>__________________________________________=
_____<br>Support Team.Net <a href=3D"http://www.team.net/donate.html"; =
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target=3D"_blank">http://www.team.net/pipermail/healeys</a> <a =
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target=3D"_blank">http://autox.team.net/archive/healeys</a><br><br><a =
href=3D"mailto:Healeys@autox.team.net"; =
target=3D"_blank">Healeys@autox.team.net</a><br><a =
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ritt@gmail.com</a><o:p></o:p></p></blockquote></div></div></body></html>
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