--===============4179410303137924673==
--000000000000a191fa060635137e
Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable
I attempted to repair my original horns but the wiring inside was
crumbling. I saved them for a future project. What I installed in my car
was a pair of Hella dual trumpet horns. You can see them at
https://www.summitracing.com/parts/hla-007424801. They come with a relay
and they mount up in the original locations with the original wiring. I
didn't use the relay but I might go back and add it. I tested them before
I installed them and they were really loud but they didn't seem to be as
loud after I installed them. So I'm guessing that if I rewire them and use
the relay I can get more current to them and have a louder sound.
Have Fun,
Joe Brown
On Mon, Sep 25, 2023 at 3:21=E2=80=AFPM GARY WINBLAD <garywinblad@comcast.n=
et>
wrote:
> Most all aftermarket horns have only one terminal or have 2 terminals tha=
t
> are both 12V.
> There was only one brand that Paul Reisentz found to use.. I wish I could
> remember.
> I think it was SPAL (the fan guys) but googling I can't find them.
>
> I remember because I dissected a defective original horn for him. Unlike
> Theo, I couldn't
> see any way to fix that one.
>
> Bob, you will probably need to look for some original horns (that still
> work) or add a relay for the
> fans you already have.
> Gary W.
>
>
>
> On 09/24/2023 8:08 PM PDT Bob Wanty <bobwanty@gmail.com> wrote:
>
>
>
> My horns have a single terminal so I will get two terminal horns. The
> relay idea sounds good.
> Thanks for the help.
> Bob
>
> On Sep 24, 2023, at 9:45 PM, Theo Smit <tsmit@shaw.ca> wrote:
>
> Hi Bob,
>
> The wiring diagram here:
> http://tigersunited.com/resources/wsm/tt-images/MKIABIGwiring.jpg shows
> two solid purple wires to the horns feeding 12 volts, and two purple with
> black stripe wires that are the horn ring connections. There is no separa=
te
> jumper wire from one horn to the other; if your car has that then it was
> added by a previous owner.
> <Screenshot 2023-09-24 at 7.34.26 PM.png>
>
> But, if the horns already start to sound when you connect just the hot
> side, then there is an internal short in at least one horn, which is not
> how it's intended to be. if you have an ohm-meter that can measure very l=
ow
> resistances then you can take measurements across the two horn terminals
> and from each terminal to the horn body (or the frame mount). That would
> help you isolate where the wiring problem is.
> <Screenshot 2023-09-24 at 7.38.18 PM.png>
> This is a sketch of the high-tone horn. The low-tone horn has an L cast
> into the bell. The two terminals connect (through the wire coil and the
> points) to each other, but there should be no connection to the horn body
> itself. The way you're describing the operation of your horns, connecting
> one of the terminals to hot causes the horn to go, even if the other wire
> is not connected (or, without pushing the horn ring on the steering
> wheel).
>
> Do both horns work the same way (i.e. they go off when only the hot is
> connected) or does only one horn do that? If one horn works properly
> (connect the purple wire to one terminal, connect the
> purple-with-black-stripe wire to the other) then that horn is fine and it=
's
> the other one that has an internal short. It can probably be fixed by
> opening the horn up and figuring out where the short is.
>
> Theo
>
> ------------------------------
> *From: *"Bob Wanty" <bobwanty@gmail.com>
> *To: *"Theo Smit" <tsmit@shaw.ca>
> *Cc: *"Tom Witt" <atwittsend@verizon.net>, "tigers" <tigers@autox.team.ne=
t>
>
> *Sent: *Sunday, September 24, 2023 6:41:37 PM
> *Subject: *Re: [Tigers] Horn Wiring
>
> Thanks for the responses.
> Everything is wired to the horns, they look original. There are 2 purple
> wires to each horn, one is hot from the fuse box the other wire goes to
> ground when the horn ring is pressed. When I plug the hot wire to the ho=
rn
> it works fine, even honks. So the horns must not be original since they a=
re
> grounded to the frame. I still have 4 purple wires when I only have
> connections for two and the wiring diagram only shows two wires, one to
> each horn.
> So should I isolate the horn frame ground, plug the hot wire to the horn,
> use the existing jumper between the horns and connect the horn ring wire =
to
> the other horn?
>
> On Sun, Sep 24, 2023 at 1:50=E2=80=AFPM Theo Smit <tsmit@shaw.ca> wrote:
>
>
> Correct except that Rootes (or Lucas) would never use a relay where they
> could instead pass all the current through a finicky sliding contact.
>
> Bob, the horns, when properly adjusted, draw about three amps each. It
> would be a good idea to wire in a cube type relay so that the ring contac=
t
> does not have to pass that much current.
> If you like I can draw up a wiring diagram for that.
>
> Theo
>
> On Sep 23, 2023, at 10:52 PM, Tom Witt via Tigers <tigers@autox.team.net>
> wrote:
>
> I believe most horns have a relay and the 12v+ is already at said relay.
> When the horn ring makes contact it GROUNDS the relay (completing the
> circuit) and the relay contact points connect. That passes through the 12=
V+
> to the horns. So, typically the horn ring simply grounds the relay to
> activate it. Sorry too late for me to check the manual for Tiger specific=
s
> but MOST cars function that way.
>
> Think of yourself standing at a light switch in the house. When someone
> presses you on the shoulder (connecting to ground) you and the switch act
> like the relay moving the switch to the on position. This then send power
> to the light (horn). When the person pressing on your shoulder releases y=
ou
> turn the switch off. Hope that helps.
>
> On 9/23/2023 5:59 PM, Robert Wanty wrote:
>
> I am working on wiring the horns for the first time since my 15 year
> restore. I am working with the original wiring harness and horns. Startin=
g
> at the horns there is one on each side with a jumper wire between the tw=
o
> horns, there are 2 purple wires leading to each horn, one wire on each si=
de
> is hot and wired to the fuse box the second wire is not hot or grounded.=
I
> installed a new horn ring from SS and have one wire from the contact on t=
he
> horn ring and a second wire for the circle contact off the signal switch,=
I
> think the wire for the circle contact should be hot but I don't seem to
> have a connector for it in the harness under the dash and nothing for the
> wire to the horn ring.
> It would seem to me that I should have a hot wire to the ring contact the=
n
> a hot to the horns when the horn ring is pressed. but the wiring harness
> does not seem to follow that way of thinking.
> The wiring diagram is some help but as usual my limited knowledge on this
> will probably start a fire.
> Any help would be appreciated, I would rather not rewire the circuits so
> hopefully I can restore the Lucas system.to its original splendor.
>
>
> Bob
>
>
>
>
> _______________________________________________
> tigers@autox.team.net
>
> Donate: http://www.team.net/donate.html
> Archive: http://www.team.net/pipermail/tigers http://autox.team.net/archi=
ve
>
> Unsubscribe: http://autox.team.net/mailman/options/tigers/atwittsend@veri=
zon.net
>
> _______________________________________________
>
> tigers@autox.team.net
>
> Donate: http://www.team.net/donate.html
> Archive: http://www.team.net/pipermail/tigers
> http://autox.team.net/archive
>
> Unsubscribe:
> http://autox.team.net/mailman/options/tigers/bobwanty@gmail.com
>
>
> _______________________________________________
>
> tigers@autox.team.net
>
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> _______________________________________________
>
> tigers@autox.team.net
>
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>
--000000000000a191fa060635137e
Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable
<div dir=3D"ltr">I attempted to repair my original horns but the wiring ins=
ide was crumbling.=C2=A0 I saved them for a future project.=C2=A0 What I in=
stalled in my car was a pair of Hella dual trumpet horns.=C2=A0 You can see=
them at=C2=A0<a href=3D"https://www.summitracing.com/parts/hla-007424801";>=
https://www.summitracing.com/parts/hla-007424801</a>.=C2=A0 They come with =
a relay and they mount up in the original locations with the original wirin=
g.=C2=A0 I didn't use the relay but I might go back and add it.=C2=A0 I=
tested them before I installed them and they were really loud but they did=
n't seem to be as loud after I installed them.=C2=A0 So I'm guessin=
g that if I rewire them and use the relay I can get more current to them an=
d have a louder sound.<div><br></div><div>Have Fun,</div><div>Joe Brown</di=
v></div><br><div class=3D"gmail_quote"><div dir=3D"ltr" class=3D"gmail_attr=
">On Mon, Sep 25, 2023 at 3:21=E2=80=AFPM GARY WINBLAD <<a href=3D"mailt=
o:garywinblad@comcast.net">garywinblad@comcast.net</a>> wrote:<br></div>=
<blockquote class=3D"gmail_quote" style=3D"margin:0px 0px 0px 0.8ex;border-=
left:1px solid rgb(204,204,204);padding-left:1ex"><u></u>
=20
=20
=20
<div>
<div>
Most all aftermarket horns have only one terminal or have 2 terminals th=
at are both 12V.
</div>=20
<div>
There was only one brand that Paul Reisentz found to use.. I wish I coul=
d remember.
</div>=20
<div>
I think it was SPAL (the fan guys) but googling I can't find them.
</div>=20
<div>
=C2=A0
</div>=20
<div>
I remember because I dissected a defective original horn for him.=C2=A0 =
Unlike Theo, I couldn't
</div>=20
<div>
see any way to fix that one.
</div>=20
<div>
=C2=A0
</div>=20
<div>
Bob, you will probably need to look for some original horns (that still =
work) or add a relay for the
</div>=20
<div>
fans you already have.
</div>=20
<div>
Gary W.
</div>=20
<div>
=C2=A0
</div>=20
<div>
=C2=A0
</div>=20
<blockquote type=3D"cite">=20
<div>
On 09/24/2023 8:08 PM PDT Bob Wanty <<a href=3D"mailto:bobwanty@gmai=
l.com" target=3D"_blank">bobwanty@gmail.com</a>> wrote:
</div>=20
<div>
=C2=A0
</div>=20
<div>
=C2=A0
</div>=20
<div dir=3D"ltr">
=C2=A0
</div>=20
<div dir=3D"ltr">
My horns have a single terminal so I will get two terminal horns. The r=
elay idea sounds good.
</div>=20
<div dir=3D"ltr">
Thanks for the help.
</div>=20
<div dir=3D"ltr">
Bob
</div>=20
<div dir=3D"ltr">
<br>=20
<blockquote type=3D"cite">
On Sep 24, 2023, at 9:45 PM, Theo Smit <<a href=3D"mailto:tsmit@sha=
w.ca" target=3D"_blank">tsmit@shaw.ca</a>> wrote:
<br>
<br>
</blockquote>=20
</div>=20
<blockquote type=3D"cite">=20
<div dir=3D"ltr">=20
<div style=3D"font-family:arial,helvetica,sans-serif;font-size:10pt;co=
lor:rgb(0,0,0)">=20
<div>
Hi Bob,
</div>=20
<div>
=C2=A0
</div>=20
<div>
The wiring diagram here: <a href=3D"http://tigersunited.com/resource=
s/wsm/tt-images/MKIABIGwiring.jpg" target=3D"_blank">http://tigersunited.co=
m/resources/wsm/tt-images/MKIABIGwiring.jpg</a> shows two solid purple wire=
s to the horns feeding 12 volts, and two purple with black stripe wires tha=
t are the horn ring connections. There is no separate jumper wire from one =
horn to the other; if your car has that then it was added by a previous own=
er.
</div>=20
<div>=20
<div>
<Screenshot 2023-09-24 at 7.34.26 PM.png>
</div>=20
</div>=20
<div>
=C2=A0
</div>=20
<div>
But, if the horns already start to sound when you connect just the h=
ot side, then there is an internal short in at least one horn, which is not=
how it's intended to be. if you have an ohm-meter that can measure ver=
y low resistances then you can take measurements across the two horn termin=
als and from each terminal to the horn body (or the frame mount). That woul=
d help you isolate where the wiring problem is.
</div>=20
<div>=20
<div>
<Screenshot 2023-09-24 at 7.38.18 PM.png>
</div>=20
</div>=20
<div>
This is a sketch of the high-tone horn. The low-tone horn has an L c=
ast into the bell. The two terminals connect (through the wire coil and the=
points) to each other, but there should be no connection to the horn body =
itself. The way you're describing the operation of your horns, connecti=
ng one of the terminals to hot causes the horn to go, even if the other wir=
e is not connected (or, without pushing the horn ring on the steering wheel=
).=C2=A0
</div>=20
<div>
=C2=A0
</div>=20
<div>
Do both horns work the same way (i.e. they go off when only the hot =
is connected) or does only one horn do that? If one horn works properly (co=
nnect the purple wire to one terminal, connect the purple-with-black-stripe=
wire to the other) then that horn is fine and it's the other one that =
has an internal short. It can probably be fixed by opening the horn up and =
figuring out where the short is.
</div>=20
<div>
=C2=A0
</div>=20
<div>
Theo
</div>=20
<div>
=C2=A0
</div>=20
<hr id=3D"m_-7690374029801399408zwchr">=20
<div>
<strong>From: </strong>"Bob Wanty" <<a href=3D"mailto:b=
obwanty@gmail.com" target=3D"_blank">bobwanty@gmail.com</a>>
<br><strong>To: </strong>"Theo Smit" <<a href=3D"mailto=
:tsmit@shaw.ca" target=3D"_blank">tsmit@shaw.ca</a>>
<br><strong>Cc: </strong>"Tom Witt" <<a href=3D"mailto:=
atwittsend@verizon.net" target=3D"_blank">atwittsend@verizon.net</a>>, &=
quot;tigers" <<a href=3D"mailto:tigers@autox.team.net"; target=3D"_b=
lank">tigers@autox.team.net</a>>
<br><strong>Sent: </strong>Sunday, September 24, 2023 6:41:37 PM
<br><strong>Subject: </strong>Re: [Tigers] Horn Wiring
</div>=20
<div>
=C2=A0
</div>=20
<div>=20
<div dir=3D"ltr">
Thanks for the responses.=20
<div>=20
<div>
Everything is wired to the horns, they look original. There are 2=
purple wires to each horn, one is hot from the fuse box the other wire goe=
s to ground when the horn ring is pressed. When I plug the hot wire to the=
=C2=A0 horn it works fine, even honks. So the horns must not be original si=
nce they are grounded to the frame.=C2=A0 I still have 4 purple wires when =
I only have connections for two and the wiring diagram only shows two wires=
, one to each horn.
</div>=20
</div>=20
<div>
So should I isolate the horn frame ground, plug the hot wire to th=
e horn, use the existing jumper between the horns and connect the horn ring=
wire to the other horn?
</div>=20
</div>=20
<br>=20
<div class=3D"gmail_quote">=20
<div class=3D"gmail_attr" dir=3D"ltr">
On Sun, Sep 24, 2023 at 1:50=E2=80=AFPM Theo Smit <<a href=3D"m=
ailto:tsmit@shaw.ca" rel=3D"noopener" target=3D"_blank">tsmit@shaw.ca</a>&g=
t; wrote:
</div>=20
<blockquote>=20
<div dir=3D"auto">=20
<div dir=3D"ltr">
=C2=A0
</div>=20
<div dir=3D"ltr">
Correct except that Rootes (or Lucas) would never use a relay wh=
ere they could instead pass all the current through a finicky sliding conta=
ct.=C2=A0
</div>=20
<div dir=3D"ltr">
=C2=A0
</div>=20
<div dir=3D"ltr">
Bob, the horns, when properly adjusted, draw about three amps ea=
ch. It would be a good idea to wire in a cube type relay so that the ring c=
ontact does not have to pass that much current.=C2=A0
</div>=20
<div dir=3D"ltr">
If you like I can draw up a wiring diagram for that.=C2=A0
</div>=20
<div dir=3D"ltr">
=C2=A0
</div>=20
<div dir=3D"ltr">
Theo
<br>=20
<blockquote>
On Sep 23, 2023, at 10:52 PM, Tom Witt via Tigers <<a href=
=3D"mailto:tigers@autox.team.net"; rel=3D"noopener" target=3D"_blank">tigers=
@autox.team.net</a>> wrote:
<br>
<br>
</blockquote>=20
</div>=20
<blockquote>=20
<div dir=3D"ltr">=20
<p>I believe most horns have a relay and the 12v+ is already at=
said relay. When the horn ring makes contact it GROUNDS the relay (complet=
ing the circuit) and the relay contact points connect. That passes through =
the 12V+ to the horns. So, typically the horn ring simply grounds the relay=
to activate it. Sorry too late for me to check the manual for Tiger specif=
ics but MOST cars function that way.</p>=20
<p>=C2=A0Think of yourself standing at a light switch in the ho=
use. When someone presses you on the shoulder (connecting to ground) you an=
d the switch act like the relay moving the switch to the on position. This =
then send power to the light (horn). When the person pressing on your shoul=
der releases you turn the switch off. Hope that helps.</p>=20
<div>
=C2=A0
</div>=20
<div>
On 9/23/2023 5:59 PM, Robert Wanty wrote:
</div>=20
<blockquote>=20
<div dir=3D"ltr">
I am working on wiring the horns for the first time since my =
15 year restore. I am working with the original wiring harness and horns. S=
tarting at the horns there is one on=C2=A0 each side with a jumper wire bet=
ween the two horns, there are 2 purple wires leading to each horn, one wire=
on each side is hot=C2=A0 and wired to the fuse box the second wire is not=
hot or grounded. I installed a new horn ring from SS and have one wire fro=
m the contact on the horn ring and a second wire for the circle contact off=
the signal switch, I think the wire for the circle contact should be hot=
=C2=A0 but I don't seem to have a connector for it in the harness under=
the dash and nothing for the wire to the horn ring.=20
<div>
It would seem to me that I should have a hot wire to the rin=
g contact then a hot to the horns when the horn ring is pressed. but the wi=
ring harness does not seem to follow=C2=A0that way of thinking.
<br>=20
<div>
The wiring diagram is some help but as usual my limited kno=
wledge on this will probably start a fire.
</div>=20
<div>
Any help would be=C2=A0appreciated, I would rather not rewi=
re the circuits so hopefully I can restore the Lucas <a href=3D"http://syst=
em.to" rel=3D"noopener" target=3D"_blank">system.to</a> its original splend=
or.
</div>=20
<div>
=C2=A0
</div>=20
<div>
=C2=A0
</div>=20
<div>
Bob=C2=A0
</div>=20
<div>
=C2=A0
</div>=20
<div>
<br>=20
<div>
=C2=A0=C2=A0
</div>=20
</div>=20
</div>=20
</div>=20
<br>=20
<pre>_______________________________________________
<a href=3D"mailto:tigers@autox.team.net"; rel=3D"noopener" target=3D"_blank"=
>tigers@autox.team.net</a>
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Archive: <a href=3D"http://www.team.net/pipermail/tigers"; rel=3D"noopener" =
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eam.net/archive</a>
Unsubscribe: <a href=3D"http://autox.team.net/mailman/options/tigers/atwitt=
send@verizon.net" rel=3D"noopener" target=3D"_blank">http://autox.team.net/=
mailman/options/tigers/atwittsend@verizon.net</a>
</pre>=20
</blockquote>=20
</div>=20
</blockquote>=20
</div> _______________________________________________
<br>
<br><a href=3D"mailto:tigers@autox.team.net"; rel=3D"noopener" targ=
et=3D"_blank">tigers@autox.team.net</a>
<br>
<br>Donate: <a href=3D"http://www.team.net/donate.html"; rel=3D"noo=
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<br>
<br>
<br>
</blockquote>=20
</div>=20
</div>=20
</div>=20
</div>=20
</blockquote> _______________________________________________
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--000000000000a191fa060635137e--
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