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Theo
Thank you for your driving experience with an EV; its good to see =
firsthand information.
I=E2=80=99m still curious about an EV=E2=80=99s driving range in the =
cold of winter.
=20
Ron Fraser
=20
From: Tigers <tigers-bounces@autox.team.net> On Behalf Of Theo Smit
Sent: Tuesday, October 04, 2022 11:06 AM
To: michael king <michael.s.king@gmail.com>
Cc: David Sosna <sosnaenergyconsulting@gmail.com>; David Sosna via =
Tigers <tigers@autox.team.net>
Subject: Re: [Tigers] The answer to a question that no one asked...
=20
(for non-EV-interested people, feel free to ignore)
=20
I've had a Polestar 2 as my daily driver since April. Polestar is a =
joint venture between Volvo and Geely (the chinese car maker that is =
behind a bunch of upcoming EV technology).
The spec range for it is 250 miles (400 km) from a 78 kWh battery. 400 =
hp and all wheel drive make it a pretty quick ride but it's heavier than =
a Tesla model 3. The Polestar uses a standard SAE J1772 charge plug and =
it's actually delivered with an charge cord that has both a 14-50P =
(250V, 50A) plug and a 110V 16A plug adapter. In a pinch, you can plug =
it in at any place that could also accommodate an RV.
=20
A couple of weeks ago we drove it to Edmonton. 200 miles at 75 mph used =
up about 70 percent of the battery, and we did that in one shot. As it =
happened, the car dealer across from our hotel had a public 24 kW DC =
charger. That's in the 'fast' category but not nearly as fast as most =
other public chargers, which range from 50 to 350 kW. So we charged it =
for about an hour that afternoon while we were getting set up at the =
hotel, and again for about an hour the next morning while we were having =
breakfast. That put us back at about 75% battery.
=20
When we started driving back to Calgary, the nav system predicted we'd =
be four percent short and suggested we put in a charging stop. We set =
off without doing that, but (unlike the previous day) our range =
prediction got more gloomy over the first half hour or so, so we decided =
to hit a 50 kW charger in Red Deer. A 35 minute stop there (with a =
coffee break) got us 30% more charge and we actually finished the trip =
with about 35% left in the battery. Our net 'extra time' over what we =
would otherwise do was maybe ten minutes max, since we normally already =
do make a stop halfway back for a coffee or whatever.
=20
I think in general, EV technology is at a bit of an inflection point =
right now. There are a bunch of new cars coming to market, some from =
well established makers and some from people you've never heard of. For =
all of us that can accommodate a level 2 charger in the garage or =
carport, the cost of electricity makes the operating cost a no brainer. =
Depending on your transportation needs, you might never need a public =
charger for regular commuting.
There are at least half a dozen charger infrastructure tracking apps =
that will tell you where the public chargers are and whether they are =
currently in use. It's maybe not as slick as the Tesla network but it is =
coming along pretty quickly. Probably the biggest issue is that =
sometimes chargers show up on a map but they are not functional - the =
crowdsourced reviews can help you there. Secondary issue is that a =
charger might be occupied when you get there. Probably not a huge deal =
if it's another EV (although that might delay your trip by half an hour) =
but it sucks when it's someone that's parked their car there just to =
block the charger from being used.
=20
Since this is kind of off-topic for the Tiger mailing list, feel free to =
reply direct and not through the list if you think that's more =
appropriate.
=20
Cheers,
Theo
=20
_____ =20
From: "michael king via Tigers" <tigers@autox.team.net =
Cc: "David Sosna" <sosnaenergyconsulting@gmail.com>, "David Sosna via =
Sent: Tuesday, October 4, 2022 6:45:29 AM
Subject: Re: [Tigers] The answer to a question that no one asked...
=20
Tesla have the jump on everyone with infrastructure...which makes owning =
their products easier...
As for the cars.. The Koreans with the EV range from Hyundai and KIA =
seem to have made big ground on Telsa and if the charging infrastructure =
becomes more generic other brands will come along.
=20
The Chinese cars have a huge diversity of products... Good and bad... =
How many make it beyond their borders guven global tensions will be =
interesting.
=20
=20
On Tuesday, 4 October 2022, GARY WINBLAD <garywinblad@comcast.net =
David,=20
The Tesla supercharger network is pretty much what you want. Not every =
pole but...=20
They are all over at least out in CA. It can add 200 miles in only 20 =
minutes and they put them=20
right by restaurants, shopping malls, coffee shops, hotels, etc. The =
big display on the dash tells you=20
when you need a charge and directs you in. It gives options and it =
knows if there will be any=20
wait or anything. Pretty impressive. The future is here.=20
Unfortunately, that's why the only EV I would consider right now is a =
Tesla...=20
Gary=20
=20
On 10/03/2022 1:11 PM David Sosna via Tigers <tigers@autox.team.net =
=20
=20
Hey, Ron:
I'll qualify my response by noting that I don't have an EV, so this is =
largely theoretical for me.
I like the idea of a charger on each phone pole. Seriously. Travelling =
between cities it seems like I could stop at a handy phone pole, whip =
out my credit card, get information on what that particular electricity =
provider is selling a KWH for, go ahead with my transaction and get a =
receipt. Okay, SOMEbody has to make sure that the roll of receipt paper =
on each phone-pole charger is kept full. =F0=9F=98=89
Given that my city is gradually undergrounding telephone and electric =
utilities, a lack of phone poles in a city doesn't seem like a big deal; =
conventional charging stations would be--in the same future of =
phone-pole chargers--as readily available there as gas stations are now.
There's probably a lot of reasons why it wouldn't work and I'm guessing =
your suggestion was tongue-in-cheek, but I still like it--it's elegant. =
=F0=9F=98=81
Best Regards
David Sosna
=20
On 10/3/22 07:21, Ron Fraser wrote:=20
I saw the All Girls Garage show and it seems to me the Borla rep stated =
that there were several different engine sounds in the controller =
including Ferrari and more were being developed. Alright, a Prius with =
Ferrari engine sound.
=20
I think Borla found a niche for those who just can=E2=80=99t be without =
the latest electronic gismo. Borla will make a profit until the craze =
evaporates or a government body says NO more please.
=20
Seems to me California and New York have already banned the sale of =
petrol engine by 2035. My 1st question would be how many of those =
politicians own an EV now? My guess, few.
=20
IMO the politicians have jumped to step 20 without considering the =
consequences. The power grid is not ready, the charging stations are =
not ready, battery technology is better but not totally ready for prime =
time and more important; until the EV range is specified for 20 degrees =
F, I=E2=80=99m not interested. Regional Transit here has some EV buses =
and if it get too cold they can=E2=80=99t use them, the range drops too =
far. =20
=20
I would only consider a Hybrid vehicle in snow country.
=20
EV vehicles are needed for major cities to clear the air but country =
folks drive longer distances for everything including work. Some of =
those EV=E2=80=99s are going to leave people stranded in the winter =
unless they put a charging station on every telephone pole.
=20
Ron Fraser
=20
=20
<tigers-bounces@autox.team.net> On Behalf Of GARY WINBLAD
Sent: Monday, October 03, 2022 8:18 AM
Subject: Re: [Tigers] The answer to a question that no one asked...
=20
This same thing happened when horses became obsolete, some people just =
don't adapt
to modern technology.
Nothing wrong with electric cars except the price and fear that the =
power grid won't support
all of them.
Most of us Tiger guys won't live long enough (unfortunately) to worry =
about this one.
Most of my miles now is our Prius Prime running on solar panel charged =
electricity. All
our local trips can be done with the 30 mile ranged but it gets 70MPG on =
trips, great
transportation device!
73,
Gary
Oh, I like that sound device, I have been thinking of how I could build =
one myself. The
Prius has the worst worn out brake pad sound of scraping, screeching =
sounder to warm blind
pedestrians.. where the heck did they come up with that, a V8 burble =
would be so much
better.
On 10/03/2022 1:00 AM Jim B via Tigers <tigers@autox.team.net =
=20
=20
Okay, here is my take. My first impression is this is as stupid as =
stupid gets. I did hear somewhere that =E2=80=9Csome=E2=80=9D people are =
worried about deaf and/or blind folks not being able to hear an =
approaching EV. From experience, I can tell you that NO ONE even hears =
my F150. Many people step into traffic around here without even looking. =
We will probably replace my wife=E2=80=99s compact SUV with an EV in the =
near future. We already have a solar array designed to make up for the =
juice required and I plan to install a level 2 charger in the garage. We =
almost never travel far enough in that car to have to look for a =
charging station. As for us California guys, speaking for myself, I =
think I=E2=80=99ll be long gone before there is absolutely no petrol to =
be had. Somewhere down the line, it will probably get very expensive to =
buy (as if it is not bad already) but, I have to actually make a point =
of driving the Tiger and my big block Ford just to keep em running =
right. Car shows and Sunday drives are the norm.=20
With all that said; I kinda like the George Jetson sound idea! I can see =
EV drivers gettin creative with sound effects. That could be a hoot. =
AND, I have to admit that I clothes pinned playing cards into the spokes =
of my bicycle as a kid!=20
JMHO
Cheers
Jim B
=20
On Oct 2, 2022, at 8:14 PM, Jim Sencindiver <jd.sencindiver@gmail.com =
=20
Just saw (this weekend) the Borla system get installed on a Mustang =
MachE on an episode of All Girls Garage (Motor Trend TV).
=20
On Sun, Oct 2, 2022, 9:39 PM Stu <sabre2tgr@gmail.com =
Just what every EV owner needs...=20
=20
Borla Active Performance Sound for Electric Vehicles =
<https://www.borla.com/products/active-performance-sound-for-electric-veh=
icles/> =20
_______________________________________________=20
Archive: http://www.team.net/pipermail/tigers =
http://autox.team.net/archive=20
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=20
=20
Archive: http://www.team.net/pipermail/tigers =
http://autox.team.net/archive
=20
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--=20
Regards
Michael King
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</o:shapelayout></xml><![endif]--></head><body lang=3DEN-US link=3Dblue =
vlink=3Dpurple><div class=3DWordSection1><p =
class=3DMsoNormal>Theo<o:p></o:p></p><p class=3DMsoNormal>Thank you for =
your driving experience with an EV; its good to see firsthand =
information.<o:p></o:p></p><p class=3DMsoNormal>I=E2=80=99m still =
curious about an EV=E2=80=99s driving range in the cold of =
winter.<o:p></o:p></p><p class=3DMsoNormal><o:p> </o:p></p><p =
class=3DMsoNormal>Ron Fraser<o:p></o:p></p><p =
class=3DMsoNormal><o:p> </o:p></p><div><div =
style=3D'border:none;border-top:solid #E1E1E1 1.0pt;padding:3.0pt 0in =
0in 0in'><p class=3DMsoNormal><b>From:</b> Tigers =
<tigers-bounces@autox.team.net> <b>On Behalf Of </b>Theo =
Smit<br><b>Sent:</b> Tuesday, October 04, 2022 11:06 AM<br><b>To:</b> =
michael king <michael.s.king@gmail.com><br><b>Cc:</b> David Sosna =
<sosnaenergyconsulting@gmail.com>; David Sosna via Tigers =
<tigers@autox.team.net><br><b>Subject:</b> Re: [Tigers] The answer =
to a question that no one asked...<o:p></o:p></p></div></div><p =
class=3DMsoNormal><o:p> </o:p></p><div><div><p =
class=3DMsoNormal><span =
style=3D'font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Arial",sans-serif;color:black'>(fo=
r non-EV-interested people, feel free to =
ignore)<o:p></o:p></span></p></div><div><p class=3DMsoNormal><span =
style=3D'font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Arial",sans-serif;color:black'><o:=
p> </o:p></span></p></div><div><p class=3DMsoNormal><span =
style=3D'font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Arial",sans-serif;color:black'>I'v=
e had a Polestar 2 as my daily driver since April. Polestar is a joint =
venture between Volvo and Geely (the chinese car maker that is behind a =
bunch of upcoming EV technology).<o:p></o:p></span></p></div><div><p =
class=3DMsoNormal><span =
style=3D'font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Arial",sans-serif;color:black'>The=
spec range for it is 250 miles (400 km) from a 78 kWh battery. 400 hp =
and all wheel drive make it a pretty quick ride but it's heavier than a =
Tesla model 3. The Polestar uses a standard SAE J1772 charge plug and =
it's actually delivered with an charge cord that has both a 14-50P =
(250V, 50A) plug and a 110V 16A plug adapter. In a pinch, you can plug =
it in at any place that could also accommodate an =
RV.<o:p></o:p></span></p></div><div><p class=3DMsoNormal><span =
style=3D'font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Arial",sans-serif;color:black'><o:=
p> </o:p></span></p></div><div><p class=3DMsoNormal><span =
style=3D'font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Arial",sans-serif;color:black'>A =
couple of weeks ago we drove it to Edmonton. 200 miles at 75 mph =
used up about 70 percent of the battery, and we did that in one shot. As =
it happened, the car dealer across from our hotel had a public 24 kW DC =
charger. That's in the 'fast' category but not nearly as fast as most =
other public chargers, which range from 50 to 350 kW. So we charged it =
for about an hour that afternoon while we were getting set up at the =
hotel, and again for about an hour the next morning while we were having =
breakfast. That put us back at about 75% =
battery.<o:p></o:p></span></p></div><div><p class=3DMsoNormal><span =
style=3D'font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Arial",sans-serif;color:black'><o:=
p> </o:p></span></p></div><div><p class=3DMsoNormal><span =
style=3D'font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Arial",sans-serif;color:black'>Whe=
n we started driving back to Calgary, the nav system predicted we'd be =
four percent short and suggested we put in a charging stop. We set off =
without doing that, but (unlike the previous day) our range prediction =
got more gloomy over the first half hour or so, so we decided to hit a =
50 kW charger in Red Deer. A 35 minute stop there (with a coffee break) =
got us 30% more charge and we actually finished the trip with about 35% =
left in the battery. Our net 'extra time' over what we would otherwise =
do was maybe ten minutes max, since we normally already do make a stop =
halfway back for a coffee or =
whatever.<o:p></o:p></span></p></div><div><p class=3DMsoNormal><span =
style=3D'font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Arial",sans-serif;color:black'><o:=
p> </o:p></span></p></div><div><p class=3DMsoNormal><span =
style=3D'font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Arial",sans-serif;color:black'>I =
think in general, EV technology is at a bit of an inflection point right =
now. There are a bunch of new cars coming to market, some from well =
established makers and some from people you've never heard of. For all =
of us that can accommodate a level 2 charger in the garage or carport, =
the cost of electricity makes the operating cost a no brainer. Depending =
on your transportation needs, you might never need a public charger for =
regular commuting.<o:p></o:p></span></p></div><div><p =
class=3DMsoNormal><span =
style=3D'font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Arial",sans-serif;color:black'>The=
re are at least half a dozen charger infrastructure tracking apps that =
will tell you where the public chargers are and whether they are =
currently in use. It's maybe not as slick as the Tesla network but it is =
coming along pretty quickly. Probably the biggest issue is that =
sometimes chargers show up on a map but they are not functional - the =
crowdsourced reviews can help you there. Secondary issue is that a =
charger might be occupied when you get there. Probably not a huge deal =
if it's another EV (although that might delay your trip by half an hour) =
but it sucks when it's someone that's parked their car there just to =
block the charger from being used.<o:p></o:p></span></p></div><div><p =
class=3DMsoNormal><span =
style=3D'font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Arial",sans-serif;color:black'><o:=
p> </o:p></span></p></div><div><p class=3DMsoNormal><span =
style=3D'font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Arial",sans-serif;color:black'>Sin=
ce this is kind of off-topic for the Tiger mailing list, feel free to =
reply direct and not through the list if you think that's more =
appropriate.<o:p></o:p></span></p></div><div><p class=3DMsoNormal><span =
style=3D'font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Arial",sans-serif;color:black'><o:=
p> </o:p></span></p></div><div><p class=3DMsoNormal><span =
style=3D'font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Arial",sans-serif;color:black'>Che=
ers,<o:p></o:p></span></p></div><div><p class=3DMsoNormal><span =
style=3D'font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Arial",sans-serif;color:black'>The=
o<o:p></o:p></span></p></div><div><p class=3DMsoNormal><span =
style=3D'font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Arial",sans-serif;color:black'><o:=
p> </o:p></span></p></div><div class=3DMsoNormal align=3Dcenter =
style=3D'text-align:center'><span =
style=3D'font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Arial",sans-serif;color:black'><hr=
size=3D2 width=3D"100%" align=3Dcenter id=3Dzwchr></span></div><div><p =
class=3DMsoNormal><b><span =
style=3D'font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Arial",sans-serif;color:black'>Fro=
m: </span></b><span =
style=3D'font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Arial",sans-serif;color:black'>&qu=
ot;michael king via Tigers" <<a =
href=3D"mailto:tigers@autox.team.net";>tigers@autox.team.net</a>><br><b=
>To: </b>"Gary" <<a =
href=3D"mailto:garywinblad@comcast.net";>garywinblad@comcast.net</a>><b=
r><b>Cc: </b>"David Sosna" <<a =
href=3D"mailto:sosnaenergyconsulting@gmail.com";>sosnaenergyconsulting@gma=
il.com</a>>, "David Sosna via Tigers" <<a =
href=3D"mailto:tigers@autox.team.net";>tigers@autox.team.net</a>><br><b=
>Sent: </b>Tuesday, October 4, 2022 6:45:29 AM<br><b>Subject: </b>Re: =
[Tigers] The answer to a question that no one =
asked...<o:p></o:p></span></p></div><div><p class=3DMsoNormal><span =
style=3D'font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Arial",sans-serif;color:black'><o:=
p> </o:p></span></p></div><div><p class=3DMsoNormal><span =
style=3D'font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Arial",sans-serif;color:black'>Tes=
la have the jump on everyone with infrastructure...which makes owning =
their products easier...<o:p></o:p></span></p><div><p =
class=3DMsoNormal><span =
style=3D'font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Arial",sans-serif;color:black'>As =
for the cars.. The Koreans with the EV range from Hyundai and KIA seem =
to have made big ground on Telsa and if the charging infrastructure =
becomes more generic other brands will come =
along.<o:p></o:p></span></p></div><p class=3DMsoNormal><span =
style=3D'font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Arial",sans-serif;color:black'><o:=
p> </o:p></span></p><div><p class=3DMsoNormal><span =
style=3D'font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Arial",sans-serif;color:black'>The=
Chinese cars have a huge diversity of products... Good and bad... How =
many make it beyond their borders guven global tensions will be =
interesting.<o:p></o:p></span></p></div><p class=3DMsoNormal><span =
style=3D'font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Arial",sans-serif;color:black'><o:=
p> </o:p></span></p><div><p class=3DMsoNormal><span =
style=3D'font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Arial",sans-serif;color:black'><o:=
p> </o:p></span></p><div><p class=3DMsoNormal><span =
style=3D'font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Arial",sans-serif;color:black'><br=
>On Tuesday, 4 October 2022, GARY WINBLAD <<a =
href=3D"mailto:garywinblad@comcast.net"; =
target=3D"_blank">garywinblad@comcast.net</a>> =
wrote:<o:p></o:p></span></p><blockquote =
style=3D'border:none;border-left:solid #CCCCCC 1.0pt;padding:0in 0in 0in =
6.0pt;margin-left:4.8pt;margin-right:0in'><div><div><p =
class=3DMsoNormal><span =
style=3D'font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Arial",sans-serif;color:black'>Dav=
id, <o:p></o:p></span></p></div><div><p class=3DMsoNormal><span =
style=3D'font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Arial",sans-serif;color:black'>&nb=
sp;The Tesla supercharger network is pretty much what you want. =
Not every pole but... <o:p></o:p></span></p></div><div><p =
class=3DMsoNormal><span =
style=3D'font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Arial",sans-serif;color:black'>The=
y are all over at least out in CA. It can add 200 miles in only 20 =
minutes and they put them <o:p></o:p></span></p></div><div><p =
class=3DMsoNormal><span =
style=3D'font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Arial",sans-serif;color:black'>rig=
ht by restaurants, shopping malls, coffee shops, hotels, etc. The =
big display on the dash tells you <o:p></o:p></span></p></div><div><p =
class=3DMsoNormal><span =
style=3D'font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Arial",sans-serif;color:black'>whe=
n you need a charge and directs you in. It gives options and it =
knows if there will be any <o:p></o:p></span></p></div><div><p =
class=3DMsoNormal><span =
style=3D'font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Arial",sans-serif;color:black'>wai=
t or anything. Pretty impressive. The future is here. =
<o:p></o:p></span></p></div><div><p class=3DMsoNormal><span =
style=3D'font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Arial",sans-serif;color:black'>Unf=
ortunately, that's why the only EV I would consider right now is a =
Tesla... <o:p></o:p></span></p></div><div><p class=3DMsoNormal><span =
style=3D'font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Arial",sans-serif;color:black'>Gar=
y <o:p></o:p></span></p></div><div><p class=3DMsoNormal><span =
style=3D'font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Arial",sans-serif;color:black'><o:=
p> </o:p></span></p></div><blockquote =
style=3D'margin-top:5.0pt;margin-bottom:5.0pt'><div><p =
class=3DMsoNormal><span =
style=3D'font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Arial",sans-serif;color:black'>On =
10/03/2022 1:11 PM David Sosna via Tigers <<a =
href=3D"mailto:tigers@autox.team.net"; =
target=3D"_blank">tigers@autox.team.net</a>> wrote: =
<o:p></o:p></span></p></div><div><p class=3DMsoNormal><span =
style=3D'font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Arial",sans-serif;color:black'><o:=
p> </o:p></span></p></div><div><p class=3DMsoNormal><span =
style=3D'font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Arial",sans-serif;color:black'><o:=
p> </o:p></span></p></div><p><span =
style=3D'font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Arial",sans-serif;color:black'>Hey=
, Ron:<o:p></o:p></span></p><p><span =
style=3D'font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Arial",sans-serif;color:black'>I'l=
l qualify my response by noting that I don't have an EV, so this is =
largely theoretical for me.<o:p></o:p></span></p><p><span =
style=3D'font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Arial",sans-serif;color:black'>I =
like the idea of a charger on each phone pole. Seriously. =
Travelling between cities it seems like I could stop at a handy phone =
pole, whip out my credit card, get information on what that particular =
electricity provider is selling a KWH for, go ahead with my transaction =
and get a receipt. Okay, SOMEbody has to make sure that the roll =
of receipt paper on each phone-pole charger is kept full. </span><span =
style=3D'font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Segoe UI =
Emoji",sans-serif;color:black'>😉</span><span =
style=3D'font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Arial",sans-serif;color:black'><o:=
p></o:p></span></p><p><span =
style=3D'font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Arial",sans-serif;color:black'>Giv=
en that my city is gradually undergrounding telephone and electric =
utilities, a lack of phone poles in a city doesn't seem like a big deal; =
conventional charging stations would be--in the same future of =
phone-pole chargers--as readily available there as gas stations are =
now.<o:p></o:p></span></p><p><span =
style=3D'font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Arial",sans-serif;color:black'>The=
re's probably a lot of reasons why it wouldn't work and I'm guessing =
your suggestion was tongue-in-cheek, but I still like it--it's elegant. =
</span><span style=3D'font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Segoe UI =
Emoji",sans-serif;color:black'>😁</span><span =
style=3D'font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Arial",sans-serif;color:black'><o:=
p></o:p></span></p><p><span =
style=3D'font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Arial",sans-serif;color:black'>Bes=
t Regards<o:p></o:p></span></p><p><span =
style=3D'font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Arial",sans-serif;color:black'>Dav=
id Sosna<o:p></o:p></span></p><p><span =
style=3D'font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Arial",sans-serif;color:black'><o:=
p> </o:p></span></p><div><p class=3DMsoNormal><span =
style=3D'font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Arial",sans-serif;color:black'>On =
10/3/22 07:21, Ron Fraser wrote: <o:p></o:p></span></p></div><blockquote =
style=3D'margin-top:5.0pt;margin-bottom:5.0pt'><div><p class=3DMsoNormal =
style=3D'mso-margin-top-alt:auto;mso-margin-bottom-alt:auto'><span =
style=3D'font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Arial",sans-serif;color:black'>I =
saw the All Girls Garage show and it seems to me the Borla rep stated =
that there were several different engine sounds in the controller =
including Ferrari and more were being developed. Alright, a =
Prius with Ferrari engine sound.<o:p></o:p></span></p><p =
class=3DMsoNormal =
style=3D'mso-margin-top-alt:auto;mso-margin-bottom-alt:auto'><span =
style=3D'font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Arial",sans-serif;color:black'><o:=
p> </o:p></span></p><p class=3DMsoNormal =
style=3D'mso-margin-top-alt:auto;mso-margin-bottom-alt:auto'><span =
style=3D'font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Arial",sans-serif;color:black'>I =
think Borla found a niche for those who just can=E2=80=99t be without =
the latest electronic gismo. Borla will make a profit until =
the craze evaporates or a government body says NO more =
please.<o:p></o:p></span></p><p class=3DMsoNormal =
style=3D'mso-margin-top-alt:auto;mso-margin-bottom-alt:auto'><span =
style=3D'font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Arial",sans-serif;color:black'><o:=
p> </o:p></span></p><p class=3DMsoNormal =
style=3D'mso-margin-top-alt:auto;mso-margin-bottom-alt:auto'><span =
style=3D'font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Arial",sans-serif;color:black'>See=
ms to me California and New York have already banned the sale of petrol =
engine by 2035. My 1<sup>st</sup> question would be how many =
of those politicians own an EV now? My guess, =
few.<o:p></o:p></span></p><p class=3DMsoNormal =
style=3D'mso-margin-top-alt:auto;mso-margin-bottom-alt:auto'><span =
style=3D'font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Arial",sans-serif;color:black'><o:=
p> </o:p></span></p><p class=3DMsoNormal =
style=3D'mso-margin-top-alt:auto;mso-margin-bottom-alt:auto'><span =
style=3D'font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Arial",sans-serif;color:black'>IMO=
the politicians have jumped to step 20 without considering the =
consequences. The power grid is not ready, the charging =
stations are not ready, battery technology is better but not totally =
ready for prime time and more important; until the EV range is specified =
for 20 degrees F, I=E2=80=99m not interested. Regional =
Transit here has some EV buses and if it get too cold they can=E2=80=99t =
use them, the range drops too far. <o:p></o:p></span></p><p =
class=3DMsoNormal =
style=3D'mso-margin-top-alt:auto;mso-margin-bottom-alt:auto'><span =
style=3D'font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Arial",sans-serif;color:black'><o:=
p> </o:p></span></p><p class=3DMsoNormal =
style=3D'mso-margin-top-alt:auto;mso-margin-bottom-alt:auto'><span =
style=3D'font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Arial",sans-serif;color:black'>I =
would only consider a Hybrid vehicle in snow =
country.<o:p></o:p></span></p><p class=3DMsoNormal =
style=3D'mso-margin-top-alt:auto;mso-margin-bottom-alt:auto'><span =
style=3D'font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Arial",sans-serif;color:black'><o:=
p> </o:p></span></p><p class=3DMsoNormal =
style=3D'mso-margin-top-alt:auto;mso-margin-bottom-alt:auto'><span =
style=3D'font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Arial",sans-serif;color:black'>EV =
vehicles are needed for major cities to clear the air but country folks =
drive longer distances for everything including work. Some =
of those EV=E2=80=99s are going to leave people stranded in the winter =
unless they put a charging station on every telephone =
pole.<o:p></o:p></span></p><p class=3DMsoNormal =
style=3D'mso-margin-top-alt:auto;mso-margin-bottom-alt:auto'><span =
style=3D'font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Arial",sans-serif;color:black'><o:=
p> </o:p></span></p><p class=3DMsoNormal =
style=3D'mso-margin-top-alt:auto;mso-margin-bottom-alt:auto'><span =
style=3D'font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Arial",sans-serif;color:black'>Ron=
Fraser<o:p></o:p></span></p><p class=3DMsoNormal =
style=3D'mso-margin-top-alt:auto;mso-margin-bottom-alt:auto'><span =
style=3D'font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Arial",sans-serif;color:black'><o:=
p> </o:p></span></p><p class=3DMsoNormal =
style=3D'mso-margin-top-alt:auto;mso-margin-bottom-alt:auto'><span =
style=3D'font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Arial",sans-serif;color:black'><o:=
p> </o:p></span></p><div><div style=3D'border:none;border-top:solid =
#E1E1E1 1.0pt;padding:3.0pt 0in 0in 0in'><p class=3DMsoNormal =
style=3D'mso-margin-top-alt:auto;mso-margin-bottom-alt:auto'><strong><spa=
n =
style=3D'font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Arial",sans-serif;color:black'>Fro=
m:</span></strong><span =
style=3D'font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Arial",sans-serif;color:black'> =
Tigers <a href=3D"mailto:tigers-bounces@autox.team.net"; =
target=3D"_blank"><tigers-bounces@autox.team.net></a> =
<strong><span style=3D'font-family:"Arial",sans-serif'>On Behalf Of =
</span></strong>GARY WINBLAD<br><strong><span =
style=3D'font-family:"Arial",sans-serif'>Sent:</span></strong> Monday, =
October 03, 2022 8:18 AM<br><strong><span =
style=3D'font-family:"Arial",sans-serif'>To:</span></strong> Jim B <a =
href=3D"mailto:jbsyv@yahoo.com"; =
target=3D"_blank"><jbsyv@yahoo.com></a>; Jim B via Tigers <a =
href=3D"mailto:tigers@autox.team.net"; =
target=3D"_blank"><tigers@autox.team.net></a><br><strong><span =
style=3D'font-family:"Arial",sans-serif'>Subject:</span></strong> Re: =
[Tigers] The answer to a question that no one =
asked...<o:p></o:p></span></p></div></div><p class=3DMsoNormal =
style=3D'mso-margin-top-alt:auto;mso-margin-bottom-alt:auto'><span =
style=3D'font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Arial",sans-serif;color:black'><o:=
p> </o:p></span></p><div><p class=3DMsoNormal =
style=3D'mso-margin-top-alt:auto;mso-margin-bottom-alt:auto'><span =
style=3D'font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Arial",sans-serif;color:black'>Thi=
s same thing happened when horses became obsolete, some people just =
don't adapt<o:p></o:p></span></p></div><div><p class=3DMsoNormal =
style=3D'mso-margin-top-alt:auto;mso-margin-bottom-alt:auto'><span =
style=3D'font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Arial",sans-serif;color:black'>to =
modern technology.<o:p></o:p></span></p></div><div><p class=3DMsoNormal =
style=3D'mso-margin-top-alt:auto;mso-margin-bottom-alt:auto'><span =
style=3D'font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Arial",sans-serif;color:black'>Not=
hing wrong with electric cars except the price and fear that the power =
grid won't support<o:p></o:p></span></p></div><div><p class=3DMsoNormal =
style=3D'mso-margin-top-alt:auto;mso-margin-bottom-alt:auto'><span =
style=3D'font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Arial",sans-serif;color:black'>all=
of them.<o:p></o:p></span></p></div><div><p class=3DMsoNormal =
style=3D'mso-margin-top-alt:auto;mso-margin-bottom-alt:auto'><span =
style=3D'font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Arial",sans-serif;color:black'>Mos=
t of us Tiger guys won't live long enough (unfortunately) to worry about =
this one.<o:p></o:p></span></p></div><div><p class=3DMsoNormal =
style=3D'mso-margin-top-alt:auto;mso-margin-bottom-alt:auto'><span =
style=3D'font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Arial",sans-serif;color:black'>Mos=
t of my miles now is our Prius Prime running on solar panel charged =
electricity. All<o:p></o:p></span></p></div><div><p =
class=3DMsoNormal =
style=3D'mso-margin-top-alt:auto;mso-margin-bottom-alt:auto'><span =
style=3D'font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Arial",sans-serif;color:black'>our=
local trips can be done with the 30 mile ranged but it gets 70MPG on =
trips, great<o:p></o:p></span></p></div><div><p class=3DMsoNormal =
style=3D'mso-margin-top-alt:auto;mso-margin-bottom-alt:auto'><span =
style=3D'font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Arial",sans-serif;color:black'>tra=
nsportation device!<o:p></o:p></span></p></div><div><p class=3DMsoNormal =
style=3D'mso-margin-top-alt:auto;mso-margin-bottom-alt:auto'><span =
style=3D'font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Arial",sans-serif;color:black'>73,=
<o:p></o:p></span></p></div><div><p class=3DMsoNormal =
style=3D'mso-margin-top-alt:auto;mso-margin-bottom-alt:auto'><span =
style=3D'font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Arial",sans-serif;color:black'>Gar=
y<o:p></o:p></span></p></div><div><p class=3DMsoNormal =
style=3D'mso-margin-top-alt:auto;mso-margin-bottom-alt:auto'><span =
style=3D'font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Arial",sans-serif;color:black'>Oh,=
I like that sound device, I have been thinking of how I could build one =
myself. The<o:p></o:p></span></p></div><div><p class=3DMsoNormal =
style=3D'mso-margin-top-alt:auto;mso-margin-bottom-alt:auto'><span =
style=3D'font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Arial",sans-serif;color:black'>Pri=
us has the worst worn out brake pad sound of scraping, screeching =
sounder to warm blind<o:p></o:p></span></p></div><div><p =
class=3DMsoNormal =
style=3D'mso-margin-top-alt:auto;mso-margin-bottom-alt:auto'><span =
style=3D'font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Arial",sans-serif;color:black'>ped=
estrians.. where the heck did they come up with that, a V8 burble would =
be so much<o:p></o:p></span></p></div><div><p class=3DMsoNormal =
style=3D'mso-margin-top-alt:auto;mso-margin-bottom-alt:auto'><span =
style=3D'font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Arial",sans-serif;color:black'>bet=
ter.<o:p></o:p></span></p></div><blockquote =
style=3D'margin-top:5.0pt;margin-bottom:5.0pt'><div><p class=3DMsoNormal =
style=3D'mso-margin-top-alt:auto;mso-margin-bottom-alt:auto'><span =
style=3D'font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Arial",sans-serif;color:black'>On =
10/03/2022 1:00 AM Jim B via Tigers <<a =
href=3D"mailto:tigers@autox.team.net"; =
target=3D"_blank">tigers@autox.team.net</a>> =
wrote:<o:p></o:p></span></p></div><div><p class=3DMsoNormal =
style=3D'mso-margin-top-alt:auto;mso-margin-bottom-alt:auto'><span =
style=3D'font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Arial",sans-serif;color:black'><o:=
p> </o:p></span></p></div><div><p class=3DMsoNormal =
style=3D'mso-margin-top-alt:auto;mso-margin-bottom-alt:auto'><span =
style=3D'font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Arial",sans-serif;color:black'><o:=
p> </o:p></span></p></div><p class=3DMsoNormal =
style=3D'mso-margin-top-alt:auto;mso-margin-bottom-alt:auto'><span =
style=3D'font-size:10.5pt;font-family:"Arial",sans-serif;color:black'>Oka=
y, here is my take. My first impression is this is as stupid as stupid =
gets. I did hear somewhere that =E2=80=9Csome=E2=80=9D =
people are worried about deaf and/or blind folks not being able to hear =
an approaching EV. From experience, I can tell you that NO ONE even =
hears my F150. Many people step into traffic around here without even =
looking. We will probably replace my wife=E2=80=99s compact SUV with an =
EV in the near future. We already have a solar array designed to =
make up for the juice required and I plan to install a level 2 charger =
in the garage. We almost never travel far enough in that car to have to =
look for a charging station. As for us California guys, speaking for =
myself, I think I=E2=80=99ll be long gone before there is =
absolutely no petrol to be had. Somewhere down the line, it will =
probably get very expensive to buy (as if it is not bad already) but, I =
have to actually make a point of driving the Tiger and my big block Ford =
just to keep em running right. Car shows and Sunday drives are the =
norm. </span><span =
style=3D'font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Arial",sans-serif;color:black'><o:=
p></o:p></span></p><div><p class=3DMsoNormal =
style=3D'mso-margin-top-alt:auto;mso-margin-bottom-alt:auto'><span =
style=3D'font-size:10.5pt;font-family:"Arial",sans-serif;color:black'>Wit=
h all that said; I kinda like the George Jetson sound idea! I can =
see EV drivers gettin creative with sound effects. That could be a hoot. =
AND, I have to admit that I clothes pinned playing cards into =
the spokes of my bicycle as a kid! </span><span =
style=3D'font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Arial",sans-serif;color:black'><o:=
p></o:p></span></p></div><div><p class=3DMsoNormal =
style=3D'mso-margin-top-alt:auto;mso-margin-bottom-alt:auto'><span =
style=3D'font-size:10.5pt;font-family:"Arial",sans-serif;color:black'>JMH=
O</span><span =
style=3D'font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Arial",sans-serif;color:black'><o:=
p></o:p></span></p></div><div><p class=3DMsoNormal =
style=3D'mso-margin-top-alt:auto;mso-margin-bottom-alt:auto'><span =
style=3D'font-size:10.5pt;font-family:"Arial",sans-serif;color:black'>Che=
ers</span><span =
style=3D'font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Arial",sans-serif;color:black'><o:=
p></o:p></span></p></div><div><p class=3DMsoNormal =
style=3D'mso-margin-top-alt:auto;mso-margin-bottom-alt:auto'><span =
style=3D'font-size:10.5pt;font-family:"Arial",sans-serif;color:black'>Jim=
B</span><span =
style=3D'font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Arial",sans-serif;color:black'><o:=
p></o:p></span></p><div><p class=3DMsoNormal =
style=3D'mso-margin-top-alt:auto;margin-bottom:12.0pt'><span =
style=3D'font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Arial",sans-serif;color:black'><o:=
p> </o:p></span></p><blockquote =
style=3D'margin-top:5.0pt;margin-bottom:5.0pt'><div><p class=3DMsoNormal =
style=3D'mso-margin-top-alt:auto;mso-margin-bottom-alt:auto'><span =
style=3D'font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Arial",sans-serif;color:black'>On =
Oct 2, 2022, at 8:14 PM, Jim Sencindiver <<a =
href=3D"mailto:jd.sencindiver@gmail.com"; =
target=3D"_blank">jd.sencindiver@gmail.com</a>> =
wrote:<o:p></o:p></span></p></div><p class=3DMsoNormal =
style=3D'mso-margin-top-alt:auto;mso-margin-bottom-alt:auto'><span =
style=3D'font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Arial",sans-serif;color:black'><o:=
p> </o:p></span></p><div><div><p class=3DMsoNormal =
style=3D'mso-margin-top-alt:auto;mso-margin-bottom-alt:auto'><span =
style=3D'font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Arial",sans-serif;color:black'>Jus=
t saw (this weekend) the Borla system get installed on a Mustang MachE =
on an episode of All Girls Garage (Motor Trend =
TV).<o:p></o:p></span></p></div><p class=3DMsoNormal =
style=3D'mso-margin-top-alt:auto;mso-margin-bottom-alt:auto'><span =
style=3D'font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Arial",sans-serif;color:black'><o:=
p> </o:p></span></p><div><div><p class=3DMsoNormal =
style=3D'mso-margin-top-alt:auto;mso-margin-bottom-alt:auto'><span =
style=3D'font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Arial",sans-serif;color:black'>On =
Sun, Oct 2, 2022, 9:39 PM Stu <<a href=3D"mailto:sabre2tgr@gmail.com"; =
target=3D"_blank">sabre2tgr@gmail.com</a>> =
wrote:<o:p></o:p></span></p></div><blockquote =
style=3D'margin-top:5.0pt;margin-bottom:5.0pt'><div><div><div><p =
class=3DMsoNormal =
style=3D'mso-margin-top-alt:auto;mso-margin-bottom-alt:auto'><span =
style=3D'font-size:12.0pt;font-family:"Arial",sans-serif;color:black'>Jus=
t what every EV owner needs... </span><span =
style=3D'font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Arial",sans-serif;color:black'><o:=
p></o:p></span></p></div><div><p class=3DMsoNormal =
style=3D'mso-margin-top-alt:auto;mso-margin-bottom-alt:auto'><span =
style=3D'font-size:12.0pt;font-family:"Arial",sans-serif;color:black'>&nb=
sp;</span><span =
style=3D'font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Arial",sans-serif;color:black'><o:=
p></o:p></span></p></div><div><p class=3DMsoNormal =
style=3D'mso-margin-top-alt:auto;mso-margin-bottom-alt:auto'><span =
style=3D'font-size:12.0pt;font-family:"Arial",sans-serif;color:black'><a =
href=3D"https://www.borla.com/products/active-performance-sound-for-elect=
ric-vehicles/" target=3D"_blank">Borla Active Performance Sound for =
Electric Vehicles</a> </span><span =
style=3D'font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Arial",sans-serif;color:black'><o:=
p></o:p></span></p></div></div></div><p class=3DMsoNormal =
style=3D'mso-margin-top-alt:auto;margin-bottom:12.0pt'><span =
style=3D'font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Arial",sans-serif;color:black'>___=
____________________________________________ <br><br><a =
href=3D"mailto:tigers@autox.team.net"; =
target=3D"_blank">tigers@autox.team.net</a> <br><br>Donate: <a =
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target=3D"_blank">http://www.team.net/donate.html</a> <br>Archive: <a =
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iver@gmail.com</a> <o:p></o:p></span></p></blockquote></div><p =
class=3DMsoNormal =
style=3D'mso-margin-top-alt:auto;margin-bottom:12.0pt'><span =
style=3D'font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Arial",sans-serif;color:black'>___=
____________________________________________ <br><br><a =
href=3D"mailto:tigers@autox.team.net"; =
target=3D"_blank">tigers@autox.team.net</a> <br><br>Donate: <a =
href=3D"http://www.team.net/donate.html"; =
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o.com</a> <o:p></o:p></span></p></div></blockquote></div><p =
class=3DMsoNormal =
style=3D'mso-margin-top-alt:auto;mso-margin-bottom-alt:auto'><span =
style=3D'font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Arial",sans-serif;color:black'><o:=
p> </o:p></span></p></div><p class=3DMsoNormal =
style=3D'mso-margin-top-alt:auto;margin-bottom:12.0pt'><span =
style=3D'font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Arial",sans-serif;color:black'>___=
____________________________________________ <br><br><a =
href=3D"mailto:tigers@autox.team.net"; =
target=3D"_blank">tigers@autox.team.net</a> <br><br>Donate: <a =
href=3D"http://www.team.net/donate.html"; =
target=3D"_blank">http://www.team.net/donate.html</a> <br>Archive: <a =
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d@comcast.net</a> <o:p></o:p></span></p></blockquote></div><p =
class=3DMsoNormal><span =
style=3D'font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Arial",sans-serif;color:black'><o:=
p> </o:p></span></p><pre><span =
style=3D'color:black'>_______________________________________________<o:p=
></o:p></span></pre><pre><span =
style=3D'color:black'><o:p> </o:p></span></pre><pre><span =
style=3D'color:black'><a href=3D"mailto:tigers@autox.team.net"; =
target=3D"_blank">tigers@autox.team.net</a><o:p></o:p></span></pre><pre><=
span style=3D'color:black'><o:p> </o:p></span></pre><pre><span =
style=3D'color:black'>Donate: <a =
href=3D"http://www.team.net/donate.html"; =
target=3D"_blank">http://www.team.net/donate.html</a><o:p></o:p></span></=
pre><pre><span style=3D'color:black'>Archive: <a =
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target=3D"_blank">http://autox.team.net/archive</a><o:p></o:p></span></pr=
e><pre><span =
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style=3D'color:black'>Unsubscribe: <a =
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yconsulting@cox.net</a><o:p></o:p></span></pre><pre><span =
style=3D'color:black'><o:p> </o:p></span></pre><pre><span =
style=3D'color:black'><o:p> </o:p></span></pre></blockquote><p =
class=3DMsoNormal style=3D'margin-bottom:12.0pt'><span =
style=3D'font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Arial",sans-serif;color:black'>___=
____________________________________________ <br><br><a =
href=3D"mailto:tigers@autox.team.net"; =
target=3D"_blank">tigers@autox.team.net</a> <br><br>Donate: <a =
href=3D"http://www.team.net/donate.html"; =
target=3D"_blank">http://www.team.net/donate.html</a> <br>Archive: <a =
href=3D"http://www.team.net/pipermail/tigers"; =
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d@comcast.net</a> =
<br><br><o:p></o:p></span></p></blockquote></div></blockquote></div></div=
><p class=3DMsoNormal><span =
style=3D'font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Arial",sans-serif;color:black'><br=
><br>-- <br>Regards<br><br>Michael =
King<br><br>_______________________________________________<br><br><a =
href=3D"mailto:tigers@autox.team.net";>tigers@autox.team.net</a><br><br>Do=
nate: <a =
href=3D"http://www.team.net/donate.html";>http://www.team.net/donate.html<=
/a><br>Archive: <a =
href=3D"http://www.team.net/pipermail/tigers";>http://www.team.net/piperma=
il/tigers</a> <a =
href=3D"http://autox.team.net/archive";>http://autox.team.net/archive</a><=
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