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I too use solder and follow the protocol that is outlined in the =
Chrysler manual that Mike attached. HOWEVER, I am on the fence a bit on =
this one. I struggle to get just enough heat to melt the solder fully =
into the twisted wires without melting the adjacent plastic insulation =
and, worse, over-heating the wire for an inch or so either side of the =
joint. Over-heating the wire makes it brittle and prone to failure =
(i.e. breakage), especially if it is in a position where is it is =
vibrating or subject to flexing. The mechanic who services my BMW, and =
who is a fully qualified Bosch technician (a few years ago he re-wired a =
DeLorean from scratch without a manual), swears by crimping because of =
the embrittlement caused by heating. He services older Porches and =
English cars like ours, as well as new stuff, and has noticed that when =
wires break, it is usually within an inch or so of a solder joint.
=20
For now, I am staying with the solder and being very careful, but I take =
the point of the crimping advocates.
=20
Cheers, Mirek
=20
From: Healeys <healeys-bounces@autox.team.net> On Behalf Of Michael =
Salter
Sent: Monday, October 2, 2023 4:17 PM
To: healeys@autox.team.net
Subject: Re: [Healeys] Solder joints
=20
I have always used the method recommended by Chrysler in their Workshop =
Manuals.
Never let me down.
=20
On Mon., Oct. 2, 2023, 11:19 a.m. Michael Oritt via Healeys, =
I did literally thousands of inline and terminal connections while =
building and rewiring the main and sub panels of my boat and always used =
proper cutters, strippers and crimping tools with quality tinned =
terminal fittings--sometimes resin-filled and sometimes not depending =
upon location and service, etc. If there was ever a failure it was only =
due to a bad crimp, etc. =20
=20
In addition to what Bob says re these fittings only being for inline =
butt joints there is always the risk of damaging adjacent wiring with =
careless or too much heat, etc.
They look slick but I think I'd agree with Bob.
=20
Best--Michael =20
=20
On Sun, Oct 1, 2023 at 1:23=E2=80=AFPM Bob Spidell <bspidell@comcast.net =
I've never used these--in fact, this is the first I've heard of =
them--but, of course, that never stopped me from having an opinion or =
two. My 'hot take' (heh):
1) there may be solder formulations that a heat gun could melt, but =
calling this 'solder' seems to be a mis-characterization: the 'fine =
print' says it's 'hot melt adhesive.' I didn't see anything about its =
conductivity, nor it's strength (though the shrink wrap part would be =
reinforcing).=20
2) when I was maintaining my own aircraft, I subscribed to a magazine =
called 'Light Plane Maintenance.' It didn't take any advertising, and =
never shied away from 'calling it like it is.' They did exhaustive =
research and experimentation on the benefit/risk of solder joints vs. =
crimp joints and came to the conclusion that crimping was superior to =
soldering (and easier, to boot). But, it has to be done properly; e.g.:
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=3DeIfoSSmlQR8
3) I only see them as being used for splices; apparently, you still need =
to employ crimping or soldering for terminals (loop, spade, etc.). I'd =
prefer all my wiring to be consistent.
4) the advert claims they are 'waterproof;' that, I think, is a stretch. =
Most similar ads only claim 'water resistant' (for liability, I suspect; =
water will eventually get into almost everything).
5) for most solder joints you want to twist the bare ends together; that =
doesn't seem possible with these.
So, no dice for me.
bs
On 10/1/2023 7:46 AM, Simon Lachlan via Healeys wrote:
Ah, yes. Good point!
200PCs Solderstick Waterproof Solder Wire Connector Kit Original =
Connector Tools | eBay <https://www.ebay.co.uk/itm/404496927584>=20
=20
=20
=20
Sent: 01 October 2023 14:01
To: simon.lachlan@alexarevel.plus.com =
Subject: Re: [Healeys] Solder joints
=20
Simon,
=20
I didn't see a link or attachment.
=20
On Sun, Oct 1, 2023, 3:39 AM Simon Lachlan via Healeys =
Has anyone used these? And, if so, are they any good?
I saw them on some car show and was impressed. Seems like they=E2=80=99d =
make a pretty decent joint if they=E2=80=99re as good as they=E2=80=99re =
cracked up to be. Not very original in their appearance but sound =
enough??=20
Touch wood, I don=E2=80=99t have many (any?) connections to make in the =
3000, but for general use?
Simon
_______________________________________________
Archive: http://www.team.net/pipermail/healeys =
http://autox.team.net/archive/healeys
http://autox.team.net/mailman/listinfo/healeys
http://autox.team.net/mailman/options/healeys/ryan@jimryan.com
=20
=20
_______________________________________________
Archive: http://www.team.net/pipermail/healeys =
http://autox.team.net/archive/healeys
http://autox.team.net/mailman/listinfo/healeys
http://autox.team.net/mailman/options/healeys/michael.oritt@gmail.com
_______________________________________________
Archive: http://www.team.net/pipermail/healeys =
http://autox.team.net/archive/healeys
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</o:shapelayout></xml><![endif]--></head><body lang=3DEN-CA link=3Dblue =
vlink=3Dpurple style=3D'word-wrap:break-word'><div =
class=3DWordSection1><p class=3DMsoNormal><span =
style=3D'mso-fareast-language:EN-US'>I too use solder and follow the =
protocol that is outlined in the Chrysler manual that Mike =
attached.=C2=A0 HOWEVER, I am on the fence a bit on this one.=C2=A0 I =
struggle to get just enough heat to melt the solder fully into the =
twisted wires without melting the adjacent plastic insulation and, =
worse, over-heating the wire for an inch or so either side of the =
joint.=C2=A0 Over-heating the wire makes it brittle and prone to failure =
(i.e. breakage), especially if it is in a position where is it is =
vibrating or subject to flexing.=C2=A0 The mechanic who services my BMW, =
and who is a fully qualified Bosch technician (a few years ago he =
re-wired a DeLorean from scratch without a manual), swears by crimping =
because of the embrittlement caused by heating.=C2=A0 He services older =
Porches and English cars like ours, as well as new stuff, and has =
noticed that when wires break, it is usually within an inch or so of a =
solder joint.<o:p></o:p></span></p><p class=3DMsoNormal><span =
style=3D'mso-fareast-language:EN-US'><o:p> </o:p></span></p><p =
class=3DMsoNormal><span style=3D'mso-fareast-language:EN-US'>For now, I =
am staying with the solder and being very careful, but I take=C2=A0 the =
point of the crimping advocates.<o:p></o:p></span></p><p =
class=3DMsoNormal><span =
style=3D'mso-fareast-language:EN-US'><o:p> </o:p></span></p><p =
class=3DMsoNormal><span style=3D'mso-fareast-language:EN-US'>Cheers, =
Mirek<o:p></o:p></span></p><p class=3DMsoNormal><span =
style=3D'mso-fareast-language:EN-US'><o:p> </o:p></span></p><div =
style=3D'border:none;border-top:solid #E1E1E1 1.0pt;padding:3.0pt 0cm =
0cm 0cm'><p class=3DMsoNormal><b><span =
lang=3DEN-US>From:</span></b><span lang=3DEN-US> Healeys =
<healeys-bounces@autox.team.net> <b>On Behalf Of </b>Michael =
Salter<br><b>Sent:</b> Monday, October 2, 2023 4:17 PM<br><b>To:</b> =
healeys@autox.team.net<br><b>Subject:</b> Re: [Healeys] Solder =
joints<o:p></o:p></span></p></div><p =
class=3DMsoNormal><o:p> </o:p></p><div><p class=3DMsoNormal>I have =
always used the method recommended by Chrysler in their Workshop =
Manuals.<o:p></o:p></p><div><p class=3DMsoNormal>Never let me =
down.<o:p></o:p></p></div></div><p =
class=3DMsoNormal><o:p> </o:p></p><div><div><p class=3DMsoNormal>On =
Mon., Oct. 2, 2023, 11:19 a.m. Michael Oritt via Healeys, <<a =
href=3D"mailto:healeys@autox.team.net";>healeys@autox.team.net</a>> =
wrote:<o:p></o:p></p></div><blockquote =
style=3D'border:none;border-left:solid #CCCCCC 1.0pt;padding:0cm 0cm 0cm =
6.0pt;margin-left:4.8pt;margin-right:0cm'><div><div><p =
class=3DMsoNormal><span style=3D'color:#3333FF'>I did =
literally thousands of inline and terminal connections while =
building and rewiring the main and sub panels of my boat and always used =
<b><i><u>proper</u></i></b> cutters, strippers and crimping tools =
with quality tinned terminal fittings--sometimes resin-filled and =
sometimes not depending upon location and service, etc. If there =
was ever a failure it was only due to a bad crimp, =
etc. <o:p></o:p></span></p></div><div><p =
class=3DMsoNormal><span =
style=3D'color:#3333FF'><o:p> </o:p></span></p></div><p =
class=3DMsoNormal>I<span style=3D'color:blue'>n addition to what Bob =
says re these fittings only being for inline butt joints there is always =
the risk of damaging adjacent wiring with careless or too much heat, =
etc.</span><o:p></o:p></p><div><p class=3DMsoNormal><span =
style=3D'color:#3333FF'>They look slick but I think I'd agree with =
Bob.<o:p></o:p></span></p></div><div><p class=3DMsoNormal><span =
style=3D'color:#3333FF'><o:p> </o:p></span></p></div><div><p =
class=3DMsoNormal><span style=3D'color:#3333FF'>Best--Michael =
<o:p></o:p></span></p></div></div><p =
class=3DMsoNormal><o:p> </o:p></p><div><div><p class=3DMsoNormal>On =
Sun, Oct 1, 2023 at 1:23=E2=80=AFPM Bob Spidell <<a =
href=3D"mailto:bspidell@comcast.net"; =
target=3D"_blank">bspidell@comcast.net</a>> =
wrote:<o:p></o:p></p></div><blockquote =
style=3D'border:none;border-left:solid #CCCCCC 1.0pt;padding:0cm 0cm 0cm =
6.0pt;margin-left:4.8pt;margin-right:0cm'><div><p class=3DMsoNormal =
style=3D'margin-bottom:12.0pt'>I've never used these--in fact, this is =
the first I've heard of them--but, of course, that never stopped me from =
having an opinion or two. My 'hot take' (heh):<br><br>1) there may be =
solder formulations that a heat gun could melt, but calling this =
'solder' seems to be a mis-characterization: the 'fine print' says it's =
'hot melt adhesive.' I didn't see anything about its conductivity, nor =
it's strength (though the shrink wrap part would be reinforcing). =
<br><br>2) when I was maintaining my own aircraft, I subscribed to a =
magazine called 'Light Plane Maintenance.' It didn't take any =
advertising, and never shied away from 'calling it like it is.' They did =
exhaustive research and experimentation on the benefit/risk of solder =
joints vs. crimp joints and came to the conclusion that crimping was =
superior to soldering (and easier, to boot). But, it has to be done =
properly; e.g.:<br><br><a =
href=3D"https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=3DeIfoSSmlQR8"; =
target=3D"_blank">https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=3DeIfoSSmlQR8</a><br><b=
r>3) I only see them as being used for splices; apparently, you still =
need to employ crimping or soldering for terminals (loop, spade, etc.). =
I'd prefer all my wiring to be consistent.<br><br>4) the advert claims =
they are 'waterproof;' that, I think, is a stretch. Most similar ads =
only claim 'water resistant' (for liability, I suspect; water will =
eventually get into almost everything).<br><br>5) for most solder joints =
you want to twist the bare ends together; that doesn't seem possible =
with these.<br><br>So, no dice for =
me.<br><br>bs<br><br><br><o:p></o:p></p><div><p class=3DMsoNormal>On =
10/1/2023 7:46 AM, Simon Lachlan via Healeys =
wrote:<o:p></o:p></p></div><blockquote =
style=3D'margin-top:5.0pt;margin-bottom:5.0pt'><div><p class=3DMsoNormal =
style=3D'mso-margin-top-alt:auto;mso-margin-bottom-alt:auto'>Ah, yes. =
Good point!<o:p></o:p></p><p class=3DMsoNormal =
style=3D'mso-margin-top-alt:auto;mso-margin-bottom-alt:auto'><a =
href=3D"https://www.ebay.co.uk/itm/404496927584"; =
target=3D"_blank">200PCs Solderstick Waterproof Solder Wire Connector =
Kit Original Connector Tools | eBay</a><o:p></o:p></p><p =
class=3DMsoNormal =
style=3D'mso-margin-top-alt:auto;mso-margin-bottom-alt:auto'> <o:p><=
/o:p></p><p class=3DMsoNormal =
style=3D'mso-margin-top-alt:auto;mso-margin-bottom-alt:auto'> <o:p><=
/o:p></p><p class=3DMsoNormal =
style=3D'mso-margin-top-alt:auto;mso-margin-bottom-alt:auto'> <o:p><=
/o:p></p><p class=3DMsoNormal =
style=3D'mso-margin-top-alt:auto;mso-margin-bottom-alt:auto'><b><span =
lang=3DEN-US>From:</span></b><span lang=3DEN-US> Jim Ryan <a =
href=3D"mailto:ryan@jimryan.com"; =
target=3D"_blank"><ryan@jimryan.com></a> <br><b>Sent:</b> 01 =
October 2023 14:01<br><b>To:</b> <a =
href=3D"mailto:simon.lachlan@alexarevel.plus.com"; =
target=3D"_blank">simon.lachlan@alexarevel.plus.com</a><br><b>Cc:</b> =
Healeys <a href=3D"mailto:healeys@autox.team.net"; =
target=3D"_blank"><healeys@autox.team.net></a><br><b>Subject:</b> =
Re: [Healeys] Solder joints</span><o:p></o:p></p><p class=3DMsoNormal =
style=3D'mso-margin-top-alt:auto;mso-margin-bottom-alt:auto'> <o:p><=
/o:p></p><div><p class=3DMsoNormal =
style=3D'mso-margin-top-alt:auto;mso-margin-bottom-alt:auto'>Simon,<o:p><=
/o:p></p><div><p class=3DMsoNormal =
style=3D'mso-margin-top-alt:auto;mso-margin-bottom-alt:auto'> <o:p><=
/o:p></p></div><div><p class=3DMsoNormal =
style=3D'mso-margin-top-alt:auto;mso-margin-bottom-alt:auto'>I didn't =
see a link or attachment.<o:p></o:p></p></div></div><p class=3DMsoNormal =
style=3D'mso-margin-top-alt:auto;mso-margin-bottom-alt:auto'> <o:p><=
/o:p></p><div><div><p class=3DMsoNormal =
style=3D'mso-margin-top-alt:auto;mso-margin-bottom-alt:auto'>On Sun, Oct =
1, 2023, 3:39 AM Simon Lachlan via Healeys <<a =
href=3D"mailto:healeys@autox.team.net"; =
target=3D"_blank">healeys@autox.team.net</a>> =
wrote:<o:p></o:p></p></div><blockquote =
style=3D'border:none;border-left:solid #CCCCCC 1.0pt;padding:0cm 0cm 0cm =
6.0pt;margin-left:4.8pt;margin-top:5.0pt;margin-right:0cm;margin-bottom:5=
.0pt'><div><div><p class=3DMsoNormal =
style=3D'mso-margin-top-alt:auto;mso-margin-bottom-alt:auto'>Has anyone =
used these? And, if so, are they any good?<o:p></o:p></p><p =
class=3DMsoNormal =
style=3D'mso-margin-top-alt:auto;mso-margin-bottom-alt:auto'>I saw them =
on some car show and was impressed. Seems like they=E2=80=99d make a =
pretty decent joint if they=E2=80=99re as good as they=E2=80=99re =
cracked up to be. Not very original in their appearance but sound =
enough?? <br>Touch wood, I don=E2=80=99t have many (any?) connections to =
make in the 3000, but for general =
use?<br>Simon<o:p></o:p></p></div></div><p class=3DMsoNormal =
style=3D'mso-margin-top-alt:auto;margin-bottom:12.0pt'>__________________=
_____________________________<br>Support Team.Net <a =
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