--===============0670823139920202184==
--001a11c148247ef8fe051f5158e6
John, do you -- or anyone else -- know of any diesel-engined TRs (!) over
the years? Somebody's probably done it at some point...
On Wed, Sep 9, 2015 at 8:48 AM, John Macartney <john.macartney@ukpips.org.uk
> wrote:
> The wet liner four was used in:
>
> All TR models from TR2 to TR4A
> Triumph Renown
> Triumph Roadster
> All Standard Vanguards from 1948-1959/60 before being replaced by the 2
> litre six pot in the Vignale
> There was also a Vanguard diesel variant in the mid 50's for car, van and
> pick-up
> The Ferguson Tractor (in modified forms)
> Standard Ensign in 1.6 and 2.1 litre variants
> Leyland 15 and 20 revamps of the (ghastly) Standard Atlas van / pick-up /
> Minibus
> Rover SD1 made in India
> Morgan
> Swallow Doretti
> Warwick
>
> And as an industrial power unit for trailer compressors, concrete mixers,
> stand-by generators and pedestrian controlled road rollers - all of which
> were as normally aspirated diesels.
>
> Jonmac
>
>
> -----Original Message-----
> From: Triumphs [mailto:triumphs-bounces@autox.team.net] On Behalf Of Brad
> Kahler
> Sent: 09 September 2015 14:02
> To: Dave <dave1massey@cs.com>
> Cc: Triumphs <Triumphs@autox.team.net>
> Subject: Re: [TR] TR4 road draft tube plug
>
> I forgot the TR3/4 engine was also used in a few other Triumph models.
> Maybe Andy Mace will chime in with his knowledge of the other Triumph
> models.
>
>
>
> dave1massey@cs.com> > wrote:
>
>
> Well, of course the upper part isn't sealed from the lower. The
> oil pumped to the rockers has to drain back down somehow. As was mentioned
> previously, it goes through the push rod tubes.
>
> My guess is that the cover is used in other applications
> (Vanguard?) and whatever it was for was not implemented on the TR. Not
> enough space under the hood.
>
>
> Dave Massey
>
>
> -----Original Message-----
> >
> Subject: Re: [TR] TR4 road draft tube plug
>
>
> Alan,
>
> So much for the official Triumph documentation!
>
> Does anyone know why the real early TR4s (and I think late TR3Bs)
> had the brass plug in the top of the valve cover? I've never seen anything
> relating to that plug written anywhere.
>
> I don't think the bottom end can be completely sealed due to the
> openings for the push rods. When the switch was made to the "sealed"
> system the draft tube went away for good.
>
> Thanks,
>
> Brad
>
>
> On Tue, Sep 8, 2015 at 4:48 PM, Alan Myers <amfoto1@aol.com
>
>
>
>
>
> ... Then at
> engine number CT14234E through end of TR4
> production the
> cars had air
> filters with vent openings coming from a flame
> trap from the valve
> cover
> along with a "sealed" valve cover cap and no road
> draft tube. TR4As had
> a
> gulp valve with a vented (1/8" metered opening in
> the cap) valve cover
> cap
> and no road draft tube. This information was
> found in Service
> Bulletin
>
>
>
> I can tell you for certain that's incorrect. The change
> from open breathing to flame-trap, etc. came later than that.
>
> CT17791E (fitted to CT17602L, built in late October, 1962)
> originally had the vented cap and the road draft tube.
>
> The cap is the push on type, has big vents on the
> underside and filled with coarse "steel wool" to reduce oil spray, I'm
> sure.
>
> The road draft (or draught, I suppose) tube is large
> diameter, press fit into the side of the block and locked in place with two
> screws (maybe 1/4 or 5/16").
>
> The original valve cover has no vent, but it does have a
> large brass plug where one could be fitted.
>
> Never had a problem with oil out of the push on cap or an
> unusual amount of leaks.... but the road draft tube kept most of the
> underside of the car rust free!
>
> The car now has an aftermarket cast alu valve cover with a
> breather pipe and a low profile, twist-in filler cap (with a single, tiny
> breather hole).
>
> I've replaced the road draft tube, but didn't plug it. It
> now has a nipple for a 1/2" or larger hose fitting. I don't think it's a
> good idea to completely seal up the bottom end of the engine. It needs to
> be able to breathe, same as the top end.
>
> Car is not yet back on the road, but when it is the plan
> is to have a catch tank or can fitted with a breather cap, with hoses
> running from both the valve cover and the fitting at the draft tube.
>
> I intend to use a catch can similar to this:
> http://www.summitracing.com/parts/jrc-555-6402
>
>
>
> Alan Myers
> San Jose Calif.
> '62 TR4 CT17602L
> http://www.triumphowners.com/to-car/tr4-14/
>
>
>
>
> <http://autox.team.net/mailman/options/triumphs/dave1massey@cs.com
> >
>
>
>
>
>
> ---
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> ** triumphs@autox.team.net **
>
> Donate: http://www.team.net/donate.html
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>
--001a11c148247ef8fe051f5158e6
Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable
<div dir=3D"ltr">John, do you -- or anyone else -- know of any diesel-engin=
ed TRs (!) over the years?=C2=A0 Somebody's probably done it at some po=
int...</div><div class=3D"gmail_extra"><br><div class=3D"gmail_quote">On We=
d, Sep 9, 2015 at 8:48 AM, John Macartney <span dir=3D"ltr"><<a href=3D"=
mailto:john.macartney@ukpips.org.uk"; target=3D"_blank">john.macartney@ukpip=
s.org.uk</a>></span> wrote:<br><blockquote class=3D"gmail_quote" style=
=3D"margin:0 0 0 .8ex;border-left:1px #ccc solid;padding-left:1ex">The wet =
liner four was used in:<br>
<br>
All TR models from TR2 to TR4A<br>
Triumph Renown<br>
Triumph Roadster<br>
All Standard Vanguards from 1948-1959/60 before being replaced by the 2 lit=
re six pot in the Vignale<br>
There was also a Vanguard diesel variant in the mid 50's for car, van a=
nd pick-up<br>
The Ferguson Tractor (in modified forms)<br>
Standard Ensign in 1.6 and 2.1 litre variants<br>
Leyland 15 and 20 revamps of the (ghastly) Standard Atlas van / pick-up / M=
inibus<br>
Rover SD1 made in India<br>
Morgan<br>
Swallow Doretti<br>
Warwick<br>
<br>
And as an industrial power unit for trailer compressors, concrete mixers, s=
tand-by generators and pedestrian controlled road rollers - all of which we=
re as normally aspirated diesels.<br>
<br>
Jonmac<br>
<br>
<br>
-----Original Message-----<br>
From: Triumphs [mailto:<a href=3D"mailto:triumphs-bounces@autox.team.net";>t=
riumphs-bounces@autox.team.net</a>] On Behalf Of Brad Kahler<br>
Sent: 09 September 2015 14:02<br>
To: Dave <<a href=3D"mailto:dave1massey@cs.com";>dave1massey@cs.com</a>&g=
t;<br>
Cc: Triumphs <<a href=3D"mailto:Triumphs@autox.team.net";>Triumphs@autox.=
team.net</a>><br>
Subject: Re: [TR] TR4 road draft tube plug<br>
<br>
I forgot the TR3/4 engine was also used in a few other Triumph models.=C2=
=A0 Maybe Andy Mace will chime in with his knowledge of the other Triumph m=
odels.<br>
<br>
<br>
<br>
On Tue, Sep 8, 2015 at 10:10 PM, Dave <<a href=3D"mailto:dave1massey@cs.=
com">dave1massey@cs.com</a> <mailto:<a href=3D"mailto:dave1massey@cs.com=
">dave1massey@cs.com</a>> > wrote:<br>
<br>
<br>
=C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 Well, of course the upper part isn't sealed=
from the lower.=C2=A0 The oil pumped to the rockers has to drain back down=
somehow.=C2=A0 As was mentioned previously, it goes through the push rod t=
ubes.<br>
<br>
=C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 My guess is that the cover is used in other app=
lications (Vanguard?) and whatever it was for was not implemented on the TR=
.=C2=A0 Not enough space under the hood.<br>
<br>
<br>
=C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 Dave Massey<br>
<br>
<br>
=C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 -----Original Message-----<br>
=C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 From: Brad Kahler <<a href=3D"mailto:bkahler=
1@gmail.com">bkahler1@gmail.com</a> <mailto:<a href=3D"mailto:bkahler1@g=
mail.com">bkahler1@gmail.com</a>> ><br>
=C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 Subject: Re: [TR] TR4 road draft tube plug<br>
<br>
<br>
=C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 Alan,<br>
<br>
=C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 So much for the official Triumph documentation!=
<br>
<br>
=C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 Does anyone know why the real early TR4s (and I=
think late TR3Bs) had the brass plug in the top of the valve cover?=C2=A0 =
I've never seen anything relating to that plug written anywhere.<br>
<br>
=C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 I don't think the bottom end can be complet=
ely sealed due to the openings for the push rods.=C2=A0 When the switch was=
made to the "sealed" system the draft tube went away for good.<b=
r>
<br>
=C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 Thanks,<br>
<br>
=C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 Brad<br>
<br>
<br>
=C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 On Tue, Sep 8, 2015 at 4:48 PM, Alan Myers <=
<a href=3D"mailto:amfoto1@aol.com";>amfoto1@aol.com</a> <mailto:<a href=
=3D"mailto:amfoto1@aol.com";>amfoto1@aol.com</a>> > wrote:<br>
<br>
<br>
<br>
<br>
<br>
=C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=
=A0 =C2=A0 ... Then at<br>
=C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=
=A0 =C2=A0 engine number CT14234E through end of TR4 production the<br>
=C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=
=A0 =C2=A0 cars had air<br>
=C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=
=A0 =C2=A0 filters with vent openings coming from a flame trap from the val=
ve<br>
=C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=
=A0 =C2=A0 cover<br>
=C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=
=A0 =C2=A0 along with a "sealed" valve cover cap and no road draf=
t tube.=C2=A0 TR4As had<br>
=C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=
=A0 =C2=A0 a<br>
=C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=
=A0 =C2=A0 gulp valve with a vented (1/8" metered opening in the cap) =
valve cover<br>
=C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=
=A0 =C2=A0 cap<br>
=C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=
=A0 =C2=A0 and no road draft tube.=C2=A0 This information was found in Serv=
ice<br>
=C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=
=A0 =C2=A0 Bulletin<br>
<br>
<br>
<br>
=C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 I can tell you for =
certain that's incorrect. The change from open breathing to flame-trap,=
etc. came later than that.<br>
<br>
=C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 CT17791E (fitted to=
CT17602L, built in late October, 1962) originally had the vented cap and t=
he road draft tube.<br>
<br>
=C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 The cap is the push=
on type, has big vents on the underside and filled with coarse=C2=A0 "=
;steel wool" to reduce oil spray, I'm sure.<br>
<br>
=C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 The road draft (or =
draught, I suppose) tube is large diameter, press fit into the side of the =
block and locked in place with two screws (maybe 1/4 or 5/16").<br>
<br>
=C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 The original valve =
cover has no vent, but it does have a large brass plug where one could be f=
itted.<br>
<br>
=C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 Never had a problem=
with oil out of the push on cap or an unusual amount of leaks.... but the =
road draft tube kept most of the underside of the car rust free!<br>
<br>
=C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 The car now has an =
aftermarket cast alu valve cover with a breather pipe and a low profile, tw=
ist-in filler cap (with a single, tiny breather hole).<br>
<br>
=C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 I've replaced t=
he road draft tube, but didn't plug it. It now has a nipple for a 1/2&q=
uot; or larger hose fitting. I don't think it's a good idea to comp=
letely seal up the bottom end of the engine. It needs to be able to breathe=
, same as the top end.<br>
<br>
=C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 Car is not yet back=
on the road, but when it is the plan is=C2=A0 to have a catch tank or can =
fitted with a breather cap, with hoses running from both the valve cover an=
d the fitting at the draft tube.<br>
<br>
=C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 I intend to use a c=
atch can similar to this: <a href=3D"http://www.summitracing.com/parts/jrc-=
555-6402" rel=3D"noreferrer" target=3D"_blank">http://www.summitracing.com/=
parts/jrc-555-6402</a><br>
<br>
<br>
<br>
=C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 Alan Myers<br>
=C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 San Jose Calif.<br>
=C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 '62 TR4 CT17602=
L<br>
=C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 <a href=3D"mailto:a=
mfoto1@aol.com">amfoto1@aol.com</a> <mailto:<a href=3D"mailto:amfoto1@ao=
l.com">amfoto1@aol.com</a>><br>
=C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 <a href=3D"http://w=
ww.triumphowners.com/to-car/tr4-14/" rel=3D"noreferrer" target=3D"_blank">h=
ttp://www.triumphowners.com/to-car/tr4-14/</a><br>
<br>
<br>
<br>
<br>
=C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 <<a href=3D"http://autox.team.net/mailman/op=
tions/triumphs/dave1massey@cs.com" rel=3D"noreferrer" target=3D"_blank">htt=
p://autox.team.net/mailman/options/triumphs/dave1massey@cs.com</a>><br>
<br>
<br>
<br>
<br>
<br>
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</blockquote></div><br></div>
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