Having just gone through this (actually still in the process) I'll post
my experiences to date as related to your questions.
> -----Original Message-----
> From: shop-talk-owner@autox.team.net
> [mailto:shop-talk-owner@autox.team.net]On Behalf Of Mark Andy
> Sent: Monday, February 09, 2004 1:16 PM
> To: shop-talk@autox.team.net
> Subject: Building a shop
>
>
>
> Howdy,
>
> So we're in the final stages of figuring out an offer to make
> on a house
> in Springfield Township, OH. The house has a well and septic system,
> along with utility line gas. There is no zoning.
>
> At that house, we want to build a 30x54x12 steel building
> shop and extend
> the (blacktop, currently) driveway to the shop. The shop has to be
> heated, preferably with the utility gas. I'd also like there
> to be water
> at the shop, along with a bathroom.
We have city water/septic with a sewer line just run in front of the
house. I plan on tapping the house and shop into the sewer when it is
made available. I have plans for the same things that you mentioned.
My building size is a bit different (40x50x12 with a 4/12 pitch). If
you plan on a pitch other than 1/12 it will cost you more to build it.
4/12 is pretty steep for a steel building. I just put the last panel on
the roof yesterday and I am very glad I don't have to get up there again
for awhile. I used 4/12 because it makes the building look more
residential/less commercial. I got an estimate of construction cost
from a couple of contractors that specialize in steel building
construction. The first was for $14K from slab up, the other was $12K
from slab up. This did not include anything other than erecting the
building (ie. no power, plumbing, heating, ...).
>
> I have about one million questions. :-)
>
> First, how do I go about finding someone to be a general contractor on
> this? Am I correct is assuming that person should be able to handle
> everything from slab plans to plumbing to electrical to how
> to tie into
> the existing sewer, working with the steel building supplier, etc?
Look around for someone building a steel building and ask who they are
using and if they like them. You can also get names from the company
selling the building.
>
> If I am using a general contractor, is it normal for me to do
> some of the
> work? For instance, I'd love the following to occur...
Sure, as long as you spell it out beforehand. I didn't use a contractor
for this building but we did this when we built a house in OK.
>
> 1) permits all get approved (ideally this would be prior to
> us actually
> closing on the house, as not being able to build the shop
> would make us
> not want the house...) (me? Someone else?)
>
Permits? I only had to get a building permit. No inspections of any
type. Can't help much there.
> 2) Basic Plumbing gets done (tie in to well water and septic system,
> stubbed out at the shop site) (Someone else)
I haven't done the plumbing or electrical yet but put conduit into the
slab for gas, electric, phone, cable, and water.
>
> 3) slab gets poured. (Someone else)
I had the footer dug and poured with help from a local guy I know with a
backhoe and couple of his buddies. He knew a bricklayer that did the
stem wall for me. $150 to dig the footer, $180 to pour it plus whatever
concrete went into it. The stem wall was $1.10 per brick, something
like 450-475 bricks.
I have about 7 loads of stone in the hole, mostly due to the springs
popping up and wanting to provide adequate drainage all the way around
the footer. I have a buddy up the road with a front end loader
(probably 3 yd bucket) and I moved most of the stone with it. I
smoothed it out by hand with a string, rake, and compactor for a solid
base.
I hired another local guy to pour the floor. He is part of a regular
crew that does floors every day. It was hard to work me in because mine
was a relatively small pour for them. 2000 sq. ft. 5 inches thick.
Something like 32 yds or so. I had piers formed off for the main
columns and the end columns which added about a yard each (6) to the
concrete. That day cost me $2000. The floor is perfect. When it was
uncovered and rained the water never puddled up anywhere. It just kind
of floated around the floor in a pool about the depth of a dime.
Beautiful job, it's a shame to have to put stuff on top of it :-)
>
> 4) steel building gets delivered and erected (me and friends)
I had to supply a forklift to remove the parts from a small flatbed
trailer pulled by a 1 ton Dodge dually. He had to use 4wd to get up to
where I wanted it but the driver was cool about it. One of the local
farmers/school bus driver came by with his forks on his loader and
unloaded the bulding for me with a couple of guys from work to help
where needed.
I bought a scissor lift off eBay for $500 and used it extensively during
construction. I absolutely cannot imagine doing it without something
like it. The basic skeleton (up to the eaves) went together in about 2
weekends with help from friends. 4-5 guys all day Saturday and most of
Sunday both weekends. My dad was there to help keep things square and
plumb (He used to be in tool and die, it bothered him that one corner of
the building is 1/8 out of square :-) ). I had to hire a boom truck to
set the main rafter. Since it was a 4 hour minimum ($45/hour I think)
he also set the eave struts and the end rafters for me.
All of the purlins were set by myself, my wife, and my son using a
ladder and the scissor lift.
The walls took at least 3 people to set up. 2 people to put a sheet up
and then one of them would hold it up. 1 guy up top on the inside of
the building standing on the scissor lift to screw it down. 1 guy on
the bottom to screw it down. The insulation came in really long rolls
and had to be cut to length. Double sided tape held it up well enough
until the sheet steel was laid up against it. We could do almost 1
whole wall in one day.
To do the roof I had one guy from work help Matthew (my son) and I set
the first 4 panels. This took all day due to taking great care in
aligning both sides with each other and making sure the first couple
were straight. After that it was Matthew and I. We would roll the
insulation up and over the purlins using the lift to roll from one side
to the other. Than I would take the top of the panel up a ladder with
me while Matthew pushed it up as far as he could. Then I would run it
up the rest of the way pushing it over my head. We could do 8 panels a
day this way.
The weather has been my biggest foe. You can't put the insulation up in
a wind and I got rained/snowed out of a lot of days.
>
> 5) Electrical panel installed & hooked to pole (someone else)
This is my next step. One of the guys I work with is a certified
electrician and will do this for free.
>
> 6) Shop is wired (me)
Same here. Immediate needs are lights, welder, and compressor.
>
> 7) sinks/toilets installed and interior plumbing completed (me)
Probably this summer. I also put in a spot for a shower.
>
> 8) interior finished (me)
I haven't decided what I am going to do to the inside for wall finish.
I would like to just leave the walls bare but I know the insulation will
get torn up doing that.
>
>
> Is this sounding like something a general contractor would
> help with or
> would I need to be my own general contractor?
I would do the contracting myself.
If I was the general
> contractor, how does the permit stuff work? A very brief
> check with the
> Mahoning county website related to new buildings
> (http://www.mahoning-health.org/building/home.htm) indicates
> that you need
> licensed folks to do plumbing & electrical permits for instance...
Move to rural WV :-)
>
>
> On the other hand, are there general contractors that specialize in
> building shops such as this? At steelbuilding.com I get a
> price of ~$17k
> for the building itself with insulation, doors, etc.
> Obviously the slab,
> plumbing, electrical, etc. adds to that. If doubling+ the
> cost to cover
> that stuff (around $40k total for instance) is reasonable to me
> financially, am I better off just paying someone to do it
> all? What's a
> realistic amount I'd save by doing as much as I can myself vs. paying
> someone?
Shop around some more. My 40x50x12 with a roll up 8x10 door, 2 framed
openings (8x10 and 12x12), fully insulated, 1 ridge vent, 4/12 pitch,
and 2 skylights was only $12,800 delivered. I got mine from united
steel factory. It is a commercial style building.
I hate paying others for something I can do myself. But, it has taken
me since Late September to get to where I am now (However, since about
mid October I have been working 60-70 hours/week which means I only have
weekends to do the work). A contractor should be able to have it up
(from the slab completion) in only a few days. I figure I saved at
least $11.8K dollars doing it myself (my friends have consumed a lot of
liquid refreshment :-) ).
>
> Pointers / help appreciated. Ideally this would be done (i.e. house
> bought and shop built) by June/July this year.
If you're going to do it yourself make sure you really have the time.
>
> Thanks!
Anytime.
Ron
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