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I'll offer what I know/have heard*. I have the 'high capacity' type in
my BJ8, which is what the DWR techs/sales people recommended for a road
car. Older 6-cyl cars had a rotor type pump. They (the rotor type) are
supposed to be more efficient--i.e. they pump more oil--at lower RPMs.
At some point it was discovered, probably from service bay repairs, that
this type of pump put an excessive shear load on the bevel gears on the
cam that drive the pump, causing them to wear out. Later cars started
getting the gear type pump, which is less efficient at lower RPMs but
puts less of a load on the cam, and is probably less expensive to
manufacture as well (esp. if the gears are the sintered iron variety).
I think the bevel gears on the cams were re-engineered, IIRC they got an
additional tooth to spread the load.
The Welch HC pump is the rotor type. I did a full engine rebuild and
installed the DWR HC pump; I didn't notice any pressure change worth
mentioning--I 'gained' 15 PSI at idle when I had my gauge
overhauled--but the 'high capacity' I believe refers to volume rather
than pressure (which, of course, is mostly dictated by engine speed).
The 'standard type' pump is a gear type, hence it's more appropriate for
high-RPM race engines as pump flow is proportional to RPM, and at 6K RPM
or more you'll get plenty of oil with less load from the gear type.
I'm not positive, but if you look at the photos closely, you can see the
'gallery plug' on the top of the case. I suppose it allows inspection
of the innards of the pump without having to break the case. I believe
it's threaded so not likely to pop out. If you're getting a new pump
you'll likely need a new drive shaft and, surprisingly, DWR sells it
cheaper than our (US) vendors sell it at (I think they might import the
DWR shaft).
* apply appropriate grains of salt
Bob
On 10/30/2018 5:12 AM, simon.lachlan@alexarevel.plus.com wrote:
>
> Hi,
>
> Has anyone got the Denis Welch oil pump ENG672M? See:-
>
> https://www.bighealey.co.uk/performance-parts/austin-healey/engines/3000-bottom-end?page=3
>
>
> Their text:- ?Heat treated castings for longer life and removable
> gallery plugs to be sure it is clean are advantages of both types
> of oil pumps we offer. We recommend the high capacity for all road
> engines using a standard type crank up to 6000 rpm and the
> standard pump for race engines, steel cranks or anything over 6000
> rpm. Both are precision machined and assembled in-house to control
> the highest quality.
> - ENG672 is the standard type.
> - ENG672M is the high capacity pump.?
>
> What are ?removable gallery plugs??
>
> Is it just me or is the above a bit counter-intuitive? ?High capacity?
> for road cars and ?standard? for race engines? Surely the highest
> capacity is needed where the engine is working hardest ie racing?
>
> And don?t I remember that, with the standard BMC pumps, the older type
> is reckoned to be better than the newer type? Is this something
> similar to Denis Welch?s two pumps?
>
> Anyhow, if anyone?s got one?..what?s it like? Did the oil pressure
> improve at all?
>
> I?m guessing that most people will have fitted one as part of a big
> rebuild thus they won?t have straightforward ?before and after?
> comparisons. I?m thinking of fitting mine to my engine as part of a
> small winter project and hope I can squeeze a few more psi into the
> system.
>
> Thanks,
>
> Simon
>
>
>
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<p>I'll offer what I know/have heard*. I have the 'high capacity'
type in my BJ8, which is what the DWR techs/sales people
recommended for a road car. Older 6-cyl cars had a rotor type
pump. They (the rotor type) are supposed to be more
efficient--i.e. they pump more oil--at lower RPMs. At some point
it was discovered, probably from service bay repairs, that this
type of pump put an excessive shear load on the bevel gears on the
cam that drive the pump, causing them to wear out. Later cars
started getting the gear type pump, which is less efficient at
lower RPMs but puts less of a load on the cam, and is probably
less expensive to manufacture as well (esp. if the gears are the
sintered iron variety). I think the bevel gears on the cams were
re-engineered, IIRC they got an additional tooth to spread the
load.<br>
</p>
<p>The Welch HC pump is the rotor type. I did a full engine rebuild
and installed the DWR HC pump; I didn't notice any pressure change
worth mentioning--I 'gained' 15 PSI at idle when I had my gauge
overhauled--but the 'high capacity' I believe refers to volume
rather than pressure (which, of course, is mostly dictated by
engine speed). The 'standard type' pump is a gear type, hence
it's more appropriate for high-RPM race engines as pump flow is
proportional to RPM, and at 6K RPM or more you'll get plenty of
oil with less load from the gear type.</p>
<p>I'm not positive, but if you look at the photos closely, you can
see the 'gallery plug' on the top of the case. I suppose it
allows inspection of the innards of the pump without having to
break the case. I believe it's threaded so not likely to pop
out. If you're getting a new pump you'll likely need a new drive
shaft and, surprisingly, DWR sells it cheaper than our (US)
vendors sell it at (I think they might import the DWR shaft).<br>
</p>
* apply appropriate grains of salt<br>
<br>
Bob<br>
<br>
<div class="moz-cite-prefix">On 10/30/2018 5:12 AM,
<a class="moz-txt-link-abbreviated"
href="mailto:simon.lachlan@alexarevel.plus.com";>simon.lachlan@alexarevel.plus.com</a>
wrote:<br>
</div>
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<div class="WordSection1">
<p class="MsoNormal">Hi,<o:p></o:p></p>
<p class="MsoNormal">Has anyone got the Denis Welch oil pump
ENG672M? See:-<o:p></o:p></p>
<p class="MsoNormal"><a
href="https://www.bighealey.co.uk/performance-parts/austin-healey/engines/3000-bottom-end?page=3";
moz-do-not-send="true">https://www.bighealey.co.uk/performance-parts/austin-healey/engines/3000-bottom-end?page=3</a><o:p></o:p></p>
<h2
style="mso-margin-top-alt:6.0pt;margin-right:0cm;margin-bottom:6.0pt;margin-left:0cm;line-height:20.25pt">Their
text:- ?<span
style="font-size:9.0pt;font-family:"Arial",sans-serif;color:#555555;mso-fareast-language:EN-GB">Heat
treated castings for longer life and removable gallery plugs
to be sure it is clean are advantages of both types of oil
pumps we offer. We recommend the high capacity for all road
engines using a standard type crank up to 6000 rpm and the
standard pump for race engines, steel cranks or anything
over 6000 rpm. Both are precision machined and assembled
in-house to control the highest quality.<br>
</span><span
style="font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Arial",sans-serif;color:#555555;mso-fareast-language:EN-GB">-
ENG672 is the standard type.</span><span
style="font-size:9.0pt;font-family:"Arial",sans-serif;color:#555555;mso-fareast-language:EN-GB"><br>
- ENG672M is the high capacity pump.?<o:p></o:p></span></h2>
<p class="MsoNormal"
style="margin-bottom:12.75pt;line-height:14.4pt"><span
style="font-size:9.0pt;font-family:"Arial",sans-serif;color:#555555;mso-fareast-language:EN-GB">What
are ?removable gallery plugs??<o:p></o:p></span></p>
<p class="MsoNormal"
style="margin-bottom:12.75pt;line-height:14.4pt"><span
style="font-size:9.0pt;font-family:"Arial",sans-serif;color:#555555;mso-fareast-language:EN-GB">Is
it just me or is the above a bit counter-intuitive? ?High
capacity? for road cars and ?standard? for race engines?
Surely the highest capacity is needed where the engine is
working hardest ie racing? <o:p></o:p></span></p>
<p class="MsoNormal"
style="margin-bottom:12.75pt;line-height:14.4pt"><span
style="font-size:9.0pt;font-family:"Arial",sans-serif;color:#555555;mso-fareast-language:EN-GB">And
don?t I remember that, with the standard BMC pumps, the
older type is reckoned to be better than the newer type? Is
this something similar to Denis Welch?s two
pumps?<o:p></o:p></span></p>
<p class="MsoNormal"
style="margin-bottom:12.75pt;line-height:14.4pt"><span
style="font-size:9.0pt;font-family:"Arial",sans-serif;color:#555555;mso-fareast-language:EN-GB">Anyhow,
if anyone?s got one?..what?s it like? Did the oil pressure
improve at all?<o:p></o:p></span></p>
<p class="MsoNormal"
style="margin-bottom:12.75pt;line-height:14.4pt"><span
style="font-size:9.0pt;font-family:"Arial",sans-serif;color:#555555;mso-fareast-language:EN-GB">I?m
guessing that most people will have fitted one as part of a
big rebuild thus they won?t have straightforward ?before and
after? comparisons. I?m thinking of fitting mine to my
engine as part of a small winter project and hope I can
squeeze a few more psi into the system. <o:p></o:p></span></p>
<p class="MsoNormal">Thanks,<o:p></o:p></p>
<p class="MsoNormal">Simon<o:p></o:p></p>
</div>
<br>
<fieldset class="mimeAttachmentHeader"></fieldset>
<br>
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