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Ken has the original CNC ground master, so presumably it is ground from
a copy which will be less accurate. - Larry
On 1/26/2023 10:57 AM, Ken Knight via Fot wrote:
>
> Everyone should be aware this cam is ground on an original TR cam
> core, not a new blank. Ken
>
> *From:* Fot <fot-bounces@autox.team.net> *On Behalf Of *Tony and Annie
> Garmey via Fot
> *Sent:* Sunday, January 22, 2023 3:24 PM
> *To:* Tony Drews <tony@tonydrews.com>
> *Cc:* fot@autox.team.net
> *Subject:* Re: [Fot] A cam for Rick
>
> The Larry  young DX cam profile is available at Webb Camshaft,
> Riverside Ca.
>
> Iâ??ve used this profile with a lot of success for multiple clients .
>
> Sent from my iPhone
>
>
>
> On Jan 22, 2023, at 2:58 PM, Tony Drews via Fot
> <fot@autox.team.net> wrote:
>
> 
>
> I was going to keep out of this one but am not capable of it. :)
>
> I run Larry's original design cams. I'm not quite sure who is
> making them now - Ken Knight had some made last go-round. It's
> fast but not as peaky as the Erson 24 - coming out of a turn at
> 3000 rpm is fine, 3500 is better, pulls through 6500 RPM, not sure
> where it drops off - haven't had the courage to rev that high.
>
> Most of the front runners (to my knowledge at least) run the Erson
> 24. I ran a modified one of those (experimental) and hated that
> one because it was even worse at low RPM than the Erson.
>
> We ran an Isky 666 cam early on and it might be more suitable for
> a less highly stressed engine. It was tractable and pulled
> through 6000, not sure about higher - I suspect going over 6000
> won't be worth it. With a built engine, ported head, all the
> goodies it's not as fast / powerful as the Larry or Erson ones.
>
> The Isky would be easier on the valve train. Larry's profile
> requires full diameter stock lifters - if you've gone with the
> GT40 lifters sleeved down it'll wipe the cam. One set of lifters
> I bought from BPNW they had put a chamfer around the edge to break
> the sharp edge and that was enough to wipe a cam too. It's pretty
> high lift so you need to have your ducks in a row for there not to
> be spring bind, have the seat pressures right, and consider valves
> and springs a replaceable wear item. I suspect the same is true
> for the Erson 24 grind as well. I believe there's an Erson 23
> grind which is less radical that might be an option.
>
> I'm trying to point out possible "off the shelf" items that don't
> require you to send a profile to a cam grinder...
>
> The Erson ones are hopefully still available from Brian Howlett /
> BFE / www.BritishFrameandEngine.com
> <http://www.BritishFrameandEngine.com>. Not sure who's making the
> Larry Young design ones now.
>
> Cheers, Tony Drews
>
> On 1/22/2023 11:30 AM, Larry Young via Fot wrote:
>
> The numbers for Erson/BFE #24 mentioned by David and Henry is
> the last one in my list and has the longest duration. Like
> Henry said, if you drop below 4,000 your dead.
>
> I got interested in the history of cam design. According the
> Speedy Bill Smith (Speedway Motors) the real innovators after
> WWII were Ed Winfield and Collins of Harmon-Collins (see the
> book "Souping the Stock Engine). He said their designs were
> heavily copied by the others. I think Kas's cams were designed
> by someone from Harmon-Collins.
>
> I certainly don't have the experience of many others on this
> list, but I'll contribute a few comments on what Rick has
> said. Cams is a subject that is mysterious (Rick said "black
> art") to many, so it is easy for them to be fooled. There is
> nothing mysterious about it. I agree that most people put to
> much emphasis on peak HP rather than the entire range you will
> operate in.
> Â - Larry
>
>
> On 1/22/2023 6:46 AM, David Gott via Fot wrote:
>
> Hi FOT,
>
> I used Larry Youngâ??s site to learn a lot about cams and
> their relative effects on engine performance with some
> crude engine modeling software, in the quest to pick the
> right cam for my wants, building a strong mid range
> engine, trying not to spin over 6,000 if I can help it
> with a stock based crank. Â Â Does anyone happen to have
> the specs on the Gillanderâ??s #24 they could share? Â Just
> curious. Â Maybe itâ??s at the pointy end of the list below?
>
> Rick McCurdy, hereâ??s the cam reference list Larry put
> together, below, and Iâ??d sure be curious what Rick
> Parentâ??s software would say I should have done!!!
>
> Triumph Cams
> <https://www.tildentechnologies.com/Cams/TriumphCams.html>
>
>
>
>
> _______________________________________________
>
> fot@autox.team.net
>
> http://www.fot-racing.com
>
> Donate:http://www.team.net/donate.html
>
> Archive:http://autox.team.net/archive
> http://www.team.net/pipermail/fot
>
>
> Unsubscribe/Manage:http://autox.team.net/mailman/options/fot/tony@tonydrews.com
>
> _______________________________________________
> fot@autox.team.net
>
> http://www.fot-racing.com
>
> Donate: http://www.team.net/donate.html
> Archive: http://autox.team.net/archive
> http://www.team.net/pipermail/fot
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>
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> fot@autox.team.net
>
> http://www.fot-racing.com
>
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Ken has the original CNC ground master, so presumably it is ground
from a copy which will be less accurate. - Larry<br>
<br>
<div class="moz-cite-prefix">On 1/26/2023 10:57 AM, Ken Knight via
Fot wrote:<br>
</div>
<blockquote type="cite"
cite="mid:000001d931a7$531b7c70$f9527550$@klaenv.com">
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<div class="WordSection1">
<p class="MsoNormal">Everyone should be aware this cam is ground
on an original TR cam core, not a new blank. Ken<o:p></o:p></p>
<p class="MsoNormal"><o:p>Â </o:p></p>
<div>
<div style="border:none;border-top:solid #E1E1E1
1.0pt;padding:3.0pt 0in 0in 0in">
<p class="MsoNormal"><b>From:</b> Fot
<a class="moz-txt-link-rfc2396E"
href="mailto:fot-bounces@autox.team.net";><fot-bounces@autox.team.net></a>
<b>On Behalf Of </b>Tony
and Annie Garmey via Fot<br>
<b>Sent:</b> Sunday, January 22, 2023 3:24 PM<br>
<b>To:</b> Tony Drews <a class="moz-txt-link-rfc2396E"
href="mailto:tony@tonydrews.com";><tony@tonydrews.com></a><br>
<b>Cc:</b> <a class="moz-txt-link-abbreviated"
href="mailto:fot@autox.team.net";>fot@autox.team.net</a><br>
<b>Subject:</b> Re: [Fot] A cam for Rick<o:p></o:p></p>
</div>
</div>
<p class="MsoNormal"><o:p>Â </o:p></p>
<p class="MsoNormal">The Larry  young DX cam profile is
available at Webb Camshaft, Riverside Ca. <o:p></o:p></p>
<div>
<p class="MsoNormal" style="margin-bottom:12.0pt">Iâ??ve used
this profile with a lot of success for multiple clients
. <o:p></o:p></p>
<div>
<p class="MsoNormal">Sent from my iPhone<o:p></o:p></p>
</div>
<div>
<p class="MsoNormal"><br>
<br>
<o:p></o:p></p>
<blockquote style="margin-top:5.0pt;margin-bottom:5.0pt">
<p class="MsoNormal" style="margin-bottom:12.0pt">On Jan
22, 2023, at 2:58 PM, Tony Drews via Fot <<a
href="mailto:fot@autox.team.net";
moz-do-not-send="true"
class="moz-txt-link-freetext">fot@autox.team.net</a>>
wrote:<o:p></o:p></p>
</blockquote>
</div>
<blockquote style="margin-top:5.0pt;margin-bottom:5.0pt">
<div>
<p class="MsoNormal"> <o:p></o:p></p>
<p>I was going to keep out of this one but am not capable
of it. :)<o:p></o:p></p>
<p>I run Larry's original design cams. I'm not quite sure
who is making them now - Ken Knight had some made last
go-round. It's fast but not as peaky as the Erson 24 -
coming out of a turn at 3000 rpm is fine, 3500 is
better, pulls through 6500 RPM, not sure where it drops
off - haven't had the courage to rev that high.<o:p></o:p></p>
<p>Most of the front runners (to my knowledge at least)
run the Erson 24. I ran a modified one of those
(experimental) and hated that one because it was even
worse at low RPM than the Erson.<o:p></o:p></p>
<p>We ran an Isky 666 cam early on and it might be more
suitable for a less highly stressed engine. It was
tractable and pulled through 6000, not sure about higher
- I suspect going over 6000 won't be worth it. With a
built engine, ported head, all the goodies it's not as
fast / powerful as the Larry or Erson ones.<o:p></o:p></p>
<p>The Isky would be easier on the valve train. Larry's
profile requires full diameter stock lifters - if you've
gone with the GT40 lifters sleeved down it'll wipe the
cam. One set of lifters I bought from BPNW they had put
a chamfer around the edge to break the sharp edge and
that was enough to wipe a cam too. It's pretty high
lift so you need to have your ducks in a row for there
not to be spring bind, have the seat pressures right,
and consider valves and springs a replaceable wear
item. I suspect the same is true for the Erson 24 grind
as well. I believe there's an Erson 23 grind which is
less radical that might be an option.<o:p></o:p></p>
<p>I'm trying to point out possible "off the shelf" items
that don't require you to send a profile to a cam
grinder...<o:p></o:p></p>
<p>The Erson ones are hopefully still available from Brian
Howlett / BFE / <a
href="http://www.BritishFrameandEngine.com";
moz-do-not-send="true">www.BritishFrameandEngine.com</a>.Â
Not sure who's making the Larry Young design ones
now.<o:p></o:p></p>
<p>Cheers, Tony Drews<o:p></o:p></p>
<div>
<p class="MsoNormal">On 1/22/2023 11:30 AM, Larry Young
via Fot wrote:<o:p></o:p></p>
</div>
<blockquote style="margin-top:5.0pt;margin-bottom:5.0pt">
<p class="MsoNormal">The numbers for Erson/BFE #24
mentioned by David and Henry is the last one in my
list and has the longest duration. Like Henry said, if
you drop below 4,000 your dead.<br>
<br>
I got interested in the history of cam design.
According the Speedy Bill Smith (Speedway Motors) the
real innovators after WWII were Ed Winfield and
Collins of Harmon-Collins (see the book "Souping the
Stock Engine). He said their designs were heavily
copied by the others. I think Kas's cams were designed
by someone from Harmon-Collins.<br>
<br>
I certainly don't have the experience of many others
on this list, but I'll contribute a few comments on
what Rick has said. Cams is a subject that is
mysterious (Rick said "black art") to many, so it is
easy for them to be fooled. There is nothing
mysterious about it. I agree that most people put to
much emphasis on peak HP rather than the entire range
you will operate in.<br>
 - Larry <br>
<br>
<br>
On 1/22/2023 6:46 AM, David Gott via Fot wrote:<br>
<br>
<o:p></o:p></p>
<blockquote style="margin-top:5.0pt;margin-bottom:5.0pt">
<p class="MsoNormal">Hi FOT, <o:p></o:p></p>
<div>
<p class="MsoNormal"><o:p>Â </o:p></p>
</div>
<div>
<p class="MsoNormal">I used Larry Youngâ??s site to
learn a lot about cams and their relative effects
on engine performance with some crude engine
modeling software, in the quest to pick the right
cam for my wants, building a strong mid range
engine, trying not to spin over 6,000 if I can
help it with a stock based crank. Â Â Does anyone
happen to have the specs on the Gillanderâ??s #24
they could share? Â Just curious. Â Maybe itâ??s at
the pointy end of the list below?<o:p></o:p></p>
</div>
<div>
<p class="MsoNormal"><o:p>Â </o:p></p>
</div>
<div>
<p class="MsoNormal">Rick McCurdy, hereâ??s the cam
reference list Larry put together, below, and Iâ??d
sure be curious what Rick Parentâ??s software would
say I should have done!!! Â <o:p></o:p></p>
</div>
<div>
<p class="MsoNormal"><o:p>Â </o:p></p>
</div>
<div>
<p class="MsoNormal"><a
href="https://www.tildentechnologies.com/Cams/TriumphCams.html";
target="_blank" moz-do-not-send="true">Triumph
Cams</a>Â <o:p></o:p></p>
</div>
<div>
<p class="MsoNormal"><o:p>Â </o:p></p>
</div>
<p class="MsoNormal"><o:p>Â </o:p></p>
</blockquote>
<p class="MsoNormal"><br>
<br>
<br>
<o:p></o:p></p>
<pre>_______________________________________________<o:p></o:p></pre>
<pre><a href="mailto:fot@autox.team.net"; moz-do-not-send="true"
class="moz-txt-link-freetext">fot@autox.team.net</a><o:p></o:p></pre>
<pre><o:p>Â </o:p></pre>
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class="moz-txt-link-freetext">http://www.fot-racing.com</a><o:p></o:p></pre>
<pre><o:p>Â </o:p></pre>
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<pre><o:p>Â </o:p></pre>
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