Sam,
14.10.C say (in part) "No changes are allowed to waste gates, pressure
sensors or their location, and to other turbocharger or supercharger boost
limiting system." and also "...any modifications which alter or defeat the
fuel cutoff when it is activated by boost level, are not permitted." I
can't find the reference, but I believe there is also a statement to the
effect that unauthorized parts may not be used even if set to the stardard
settings.
Both of the above apply to the computer. If the computer controls boost in
any way, you're stuck with the stock computer. If the the computer contols
fuel cut, you're stuck with the stock computer. In my mind this puts turbo
cars at a disadvantage in SP, as it greatly limits the tuning flexibility.
I do agree that policing of boost levels is very difficult. It's very
difficult to tell tell if somebody subtly altered the programing of the
stock computer (or the resistance of the right wire, or discharge coeficient
of the right orifice, or ...).
I'm curious how this is handled currently. I've heard of cars being
protested for "excessive boost" in stock class, but in my mind this is like
protesting for too low a ride hight or being under weight. Since legal
changes (e.g, exhaust) can affect boost levels, wouldn't you have to prove
that an ilegal modification was used to increase boost, not just that it
didn't meet a published figure (if one exists)?
If you did allow boost controllers, how would you monitor the boost setting?
Wouldn't you have the same problems you described below? It seems to me if
you allow boost controller, you need to allow whatever the turbo will make
and class accordingly.
Jim
----- Original Message -----
From: "Sam Strano" <strano@stranoparts.com>
To: <evolution-discussions@yahoogroups.com>; <autox@autox.team.net>
Sent: Thursday, December 11, 2003 8:30 PM
Subject: [evolution-disc.] regulating boost limits in SP, let's discuss
(calmly and with sanity...)
> Having run turbo cars in the past, and with my plan to go back to ESP
(with
> two new turbocharged cars) in '04, I'd like some opinions and input from
> the folks here about how to regulate boost pressure.... I've gotten this
> stigma for being a pony-car guy. I happen to like power and
> RWD. Guilty. But I have run turbo cars in the past (still own one),
> including an RX7 in 2000. I know what a few pounds of extra boost can
> do............
>
> Here's my issue: Pretty much any newer car that is turbocharged has boost
> pressure regulated by the computer. In SP, computers are free, as are
> intakes and exhaust systems. Here's my issue. Cars can and do gain boost
> via improved breathing. How are we as competitors and impounds workers to
> tell how much boost increase came from the breathing vs. a computer tuned
> boost increase? Since computers are free, and boost pressure isn't
> regulated by the SCCA, there is nothing to stop someone from turning his
or
> hers up a quick 4 or 5 psi (a very quick 40-50 hp) and claiming the gain
> was from the downpipe or some other part....... Further, many of the new
> computers have more than one mapping that can be quickly changed with the
> flick of switch. This means one could conceivably run illegally modified
> boost, but change mapping on the way to impound. A boost check in impound
> could reveal nothing, or very little increase from the allowed boost
> creep. Anyone wishing to protest would plain out of luck and lose.
>
> One of the caveats with the rules has always been that cars shouldn't get
> special rules. Clearly a turbocharged car can gain a lot of power very
> easily if this is not policed. If you have a Supercharged car, you cannot
> change your blower pulley to gain boost, or you'd get tossed. Clearly
> normally aspirated cars have no equivalent to "boost creep" or altered
> boost pressures and/or mapping. I'd love to be allowed to install
> Sub-frame connectors, but the argument as always been "no equivalent" for
> other cars.
>
> I've expressed these concerns to the SEB and to Doug Gill in writing. As
> usual, I've not heard anything, not even a confirmation that I sent a
> letter. Clearly, having driven the STi and I'm sure soon a Evo8, I'm
> concerned about this. I'm not accusing anyone of cheating, people cheat
in
> other ways with other classes too. But, it would be pretty easy to whack
> the boost and get away with it, which isn't fair to the others in the
class
> who are playing by the rules. I'm a little frustrated that this seems to
> be of no concern to anyone.
>
> My proposal has been and is still this: Allow boost controllers in SP,
but
> limit the gain to a number like 2 psi over max. stock boost. This gives
> the owners of turbocharged cars a power increase. This even helps those
> turbo cars that do not gain a full 2 psi over their stock by allowing them
> to turn the boost to that level. Allowing a boost controller also means
> you can trim back cars that make a lot more boost. It's measurable and
> not a situation where the owner can claim the increase came from here,
> there, or anywhere. Who cares? Do what you want, just keep a cap on it.
>
> Keep in mind this does not just effect ESP, but everyone with a turbo car
> in their class. Not only that, it effects everyone who runs ProSolo's for
> Challenge points. You may have to run a car with altered boost in a
> Challenge sometime. You have the right to protest that car because you
are
> competing against that car.
>
> Let's please keep this civil. I'm all ears, and curious what you think
and
> why you do.
>
>
> Sam Strano Jr.
> Strano Performance Parts
> www.stranoparts.com
> 800-729-1831 orders/price info.
> 814-849-3450 technical info.
>
>
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