Jay,
In response to yours:
> George Ryan wrote:
>
> > The Lotii are a sweet breed, and win in every class they
> > are in, almost exclusively.
>
> Uhh, lessee here:
>
> 1. Super Stock - Lotus Esprit Turbo. Ever seen one a'them win?
How right you are - - waaayyyyy too much turbo lag
> 2. AS - Elan, Esprit, Europa Twin Cam, Europa Renault. Hmmm, can't
> remember AS being dominated by a Lotus.
> 3. CS - 7, 7A, Eclat, Elan +2, Elite (original), Elite ('70s one). We
> all know what a threat those cars are, right? Be afraid. Be very afraid.
> 4. ES - Lotus Cortina. That's a real dominant one, too.
Since I have never seen or driven a stock Lotus (except Espirit), even
on the street, I can't really address any of the Lotii capabilities (again
except the Espirit) in stock.
I DID specify SP, P, and Mod in my original letter (Mod really is what
started this dialogue) in my original statement, as follows:
>> <snip> If you buy a Lotii, be it SP, P, or
>> Mod - - you have a much higher pertantile chance of walking
>> away with a trophy, be it at the regional, divisional, National
>> Tour, or Nationals level. One almost instantly improves as a
>> driver behind the wheel of a Lotii, it seems.
> 5. ASP - Last won by a female driving an RX-7tt. Sure enough, the Elans
> are always a threat to win, but non-Lotus cars can and do win this class
> with regularity.
I never stated dominated, but they sure are very competitive. I HAVE
driven an ASP Elan (would love to have one) and can most assuredly
tell you that I think I could immediately improve as an autocross driver
by running a Lotus Elan in ASP or AP over a similar classed and
prepped vehicle in the same classes. The Lotii are just sweet driving
cars!!
> 6. AP - I think this is the class you mean by "every."
I stated early on that I was addressing this class, and the one to which
I am most knowledgeable.
> 7. Mod classes. Given that you can do almost anything to a car in Mod,
> what you start with has a LOT less to do with winning than what you DO
> to the car.
I will let those D Mod drivers that started this thread address this
further,
I am no expert.
> Have you ever actually DRIVEN a Lotus in Solo II?
Only in Fun Runs.
> > But also have a higher winning percentile because the SCCA
> > seems to class them, and rule for them more favorably.
>
> Lesse here. My Lotus Europa has 1565cc, makes 82 hp stock, and it's in
> ASP. Exactly how is that "favorable" classing?
And weighs in at how much, compared to your competitors?
> > Now
> > that statement WILL cause a furor, but so be it.
>
> No furor here. The statement is incorrect, but I'm not mad that you made
> it.
>
> <snip A Prepared stuff>
> > And then there is the Lotii, 1400 (oh, let's see, they added 50 lbs
> > this year - no advantages now - - HAHH!!) in that foray.
>
> It may well be that AP is unfairly biased towards Lotuses. I can't say,
> since I don't run there. Since Prepared uses the archaic Production
> practice of "competition adjustments" to rim sizes, minimum weights, and
> venturi sizes to fine-tune the classes, I suggest you ask the SEB to
> reduce your minimum weight. That would be the quickest way to achieve
> some kind of parity.
The extra 50 lbs was added last year to the Lotus (and the results
are still evident) as a result of this conversation with Denver. I did ask
for a weight reduction for the Fiero, but even if they granted that it
would be futile. To reduce weight more, I would have to cut it to the
point I would have to pay a weight penalty!!
> >If you look
> > simply at HP to weight ratio, there is quite an advantage there.
>
> If HP to weight were the definitive factor, LOTS of cars would be
> competitive that aren't.
I am not sure I follow you. On an autocross course, the (not known
for fact, but rumored) 170 to 180hp in the Babb's Elan at 1470lbs is
very much more sprightly than my 248hp hp in my 1978lb Fiero - -
An RX-7 is somewhat more lively than a 340hp Supra, etc, etc. There
may be and probably are exceptions (torque differences also plays a
big part in that formula. Maybe I should have said hp/torque to weight).
Put my car against the Babb's or the Supra against the RX-7 on the
dragstrip, that would be a different story. But on an autocross course -
- -
> > In EM, sure Tamandli is winning. A tube frame Formula Atlantic
> > chassis, a lightweight Rover V8, and a rubber and 'glass body
> > by Fiero. It is competitive against Lotii (and Lotii cloned) V8
> > powered cars simply because his body weight, and hp to weight
> > ratio is similar. But to call it a Fiero - - that's quite a stretch.
>
> Calling Chris O'Donnell's car a "Lotus" requires an equal stretch. What
> is Mod supposed to be, if not a relatively free Category?
I concede here. Again, D Mod started this dialogue, I will let them
defend the Mod issues. But notice I did state that Tamandli has similar
ratios to the V8 Lotus.
> > In my own case, give me back FP with the Mazda and Nissan/
> > Datsun cars. Let the high HP and limited production cars (Tiger,
> > Vixen, Cobra, and YES - - the Lotii fall into that catagory) have
> > their own AP back.
>
> And, exactly how many Fieros did GM make with Quad Four engines? In what
> way do production numbers have ANY impact on Prepared or Mod fairness?
The rules allow me in P. GM had some prototype Q4 powered cars
out there. The Q4 was to be offered in the Fiero in 1989. GM had been
campaigning the Q4 in the factory backed GT cars - the Spice Fiero
and the Dole Pineapple sponsored car being the most successful - in
1988.
I don't know that I agree with the rules, but neither do I agree with
allowing a late model 302 in an early Mustang, or some of the other
swaps allowed in "P". All the same, I am legal (at least for the
moment) in Prepared.
The whole point to my statement is that I would prefer the to play
in the Mod catagory. But even if I tubed the car, got the weight to
1500lbs, I doubt the car could ever be Nationally competitive with
a 2.3 motor. My point is, was, and always has been, that I would
love to see the heavier Mod class that was previously proposed.
> It appears that maybe AP needs some tweaking, but that's how Prepared
> works. Have you raised these issues with the SEB?
>
Yes, several letters have been sent.
> Jay
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