Agreed, _very_ few things are more annoying than the
self-righteous volunteer. While it's hard to get mad at such
people because they are actually doing useful work few others
want to do, it shouldn't hurt to remind them that most people
manage to do it without being jerks. I'm glad I didn't respond
because you and Jeremy said the same thing more diplomatically
than I would have managed. Cheers to you.
Debbie Cunningham wrote:
>
> My issue was the manner in which the ideas were dismissed. It wasn't very
> pleasant. There is no reason to slam people for making suggestions or
> expressing ideas, whether you agree with them or not. If the response were
> friendlier, you might get more people willing to volunteer at these events.
> Who knows, I might even decide to come out of the "cheap seats" and shift
> some of my volunteer time away from Meals on Wheels and helping disabled
> kids ride horses. IMHO.
>
> Debbie
>
> ----- Original Message -----
> From: "Pat Kelly" <lollipop@ricochet.net>
> To: "Debbie Cunningham" <bartsmom@mindspring.com>
> Cc: "Jeremy Bergsman" <jeremybb@leland.Stanford.EDU>;
> <ba-autox@autox.team.net>
> Sent: Tuesday, May 23, 2000 7:43 AM
> Subject: Re: Three Runs
>
> > Debbie,
> > In the real world, if everybody was paid what they were worth, there
> would
> > be no place for car nuts to play, even if the car nuts were full of great
> > ideas.
> > The great ideas for improving events, believe it or not, have all been
> > discussed for the last 30 years or more. Some have been implemented which
> > probably shouldn't have been, others have been discarded when they
> shouldn't
> > have been. Implementation of all the ideas require someone to actually DO
> it.
> > --Pat Kelly
> >
> >
> > Debbie Cunningham wrote:
> >
> > > Jeremy, I think your response was very thoughtful and diplomatic and I
> agree
> > > with what you are saying. Are suggestions unwelcome if the one making
> the
> > > suggestion is unable to do the "90%" of the work required to implement
> the
> > > idea? If so, that doesn't make a whole lot of sense to me. In this day
> and
> > > age, people get paid big money for using their head . That is as it
> should
> > > be. The unfortunate part of this equation is that those who volunteer
> to
> > > run these events do not get paid. That does not make the ideas any less
> > > valuable.
> > >
> > > I don't feel that people resenting those who do not do "as much work"
> as
> > > they do is a reason for people with good ideas and no means (ie., time)
> to
> > > implement them to be summarily dismissed and chastised for being forward
> > > thinking enough to suggest them.
> > >
> > > Sorry for my long winded and unsolicited opinion...oh, not really ;~)
> > >
> > > Debbie*who supposes she will be appropriately chastised for expressing
> her
> > > opinion"
> > > ----- Original Message -----
> > > From: "Jeremy Bergsman" <jeremybb@leland.Stanford.EDU>
> > > To: <ba-autox@autox.team.net>
> > > Sent: Monday, May 22, 2000 6:35 PM
> > > Subject: Re: Three Runs
> > >
> > > > "Grantz, Sherry" wrote:
> > > >
> > > > > Great ideas, Jeremy. You're hired. We (the 10% who do 90% of the
> work)
> > > will
> > > > > expect you to be at Oakland Coliseum next Sunday at 8 a.m ready to
> > > conduct
> > > > > the orientation and number the flag stations and maintain this log
> > > > > throughout the day.
> > > > >
> > > > > Oh, you thought the 10% were going to volunteer to take this on,
> too?
> > > Nope,
> > > > > we're already busy doing the 90%.
> > > >
> > > > I am in the 10% in most of my endeavors (e.g.
> > > > http://www.stanford.edu/~jeremybb/beerstuff/wow.html) and I always
> resent
> > > > the 90%, so I endeavor not to be one of the slackers (and I will admit
> > > here
> > > > in public that I missed the first few minutes of my work assignment on
> > > > Saturday). I hope my comments are being interpreted as attempts to be
> > > > helpful and not grumbling. Of course typing in suggestions is not as
> much
> > > > work as implementing them, but I don't see making constructive
> suggestions
> > > > as a negative. Even if I never become one of the 10% I don't see how
> that
> > > > reflects on the merit of the ideas. I prefaced the suggestions with
> the
> > > > acknowledgment that they may not be good so why don't we concentrate
> on
> > > > whether they are good or not instead of whether *I* will implement
> them.
> > > If
> > > > you think they are simply too much work why not say that and omit the
> ad
> > > > hominem?
> > > >
> > > > > Since I don't seem to remember you being an event chair this year
> (or to
> > > > > have volunteered for any upcoming events) and you want to contribute
> to
> > > SFR
> > > > > autocross, I don't see how you can refuse to accept our offer.
> > > >
> > > > Was it an offer? Well, if people think it's a good idea to run an
> > > > orientation in the mornings (not my suggestion) I volunteer to do it
> when
> > > > I'm running in the morning groups. I will also be willing to do it at
> > > > another time, as I suggested. As for being an event chair you can be
> sure
> > > > I'll be volunteering for that too at some point, but as a newbie
> myself it
> > > > seems counterproductive for me to be an event chair since that will
> result
> > > > in a much more delayed event than we experienced on Saturday. What I
> have
> > > > been doing is volunteering for different work duties in an attempt to
> > > learn
> > > > them all so that I can be available to pick up slack where needed.
> > > >
> > > > > In fact, if a whole bunch more of you people who show up, run, work,
> go
> > > > > home, and then helpfully type up all sorts of ways to improve
> events,
> > > would
> > > > > start putting in more time working at events we could probably run
> 275
> > > > > cars/4 runs each and finish by 6 pm (which BTW is when we have to be
> out
> > > of
> > > > > the Coliseum lot).
> > > >
> > > > If members of the 10% could suggest ways outside of the work
> assignment to
> > > > help out I (and I imagine others) would be happy to do so. As I've
> posted
> > > > here in the past it is tough to know what to do/how to help out when
> you
> > > are
> > > > new. In fact that's the point of my orientation suggestion. A few
> events
> > > > back I worked set up. When I offered to work the course in addition
> to
> > > set
> > > > up I was dismissed brusquely by the event chair. I'm still willing to
> > > work
> > > > extra but such experiences reduce the incentive for discovering the
> best
> > > way
> > > > to do so.
> > > >
> > > > I apologize in advance if I'm reading your tone wrong, but it seems as
> if
> > > > you resent doing 90% of the work. If this is the case can *you* make
> a
> > > > suggestion for how to change that? The only suggestion I can extract
> from
> > > > your email is to volunteer to be an event chair. I don't imagine
> quashing
> > > > well meaning suggestions is one of the best ways to lighten your work
> > > load.
> > > > --
> > > > Jeremy Bergsman
> > > > jeremybb@stanford.edu
> > > > http://www.stanford.edu/~jeremybb
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