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Hi. John Esposito is the best LBC mechanic in CT and he has a shop in Oxfor=
d, CT called Quantum Mechanics. He is a math nut and works with the MG club=
and does the rebuilding work for TRF. He was making TR main shafts after h=
e found no saleable units.
Joe Mato62 Wood RoadRedding, CT 06896917 232 1555=20
On Monday, March 20, 2023 at 02:49:34 PM EDT, triumphs-request@autox.te=
am.net <triumphs-request@autox.team.net> wrote: =20
=20
Send Triumphs mailing list submissions to
=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0 triumphs@autox.team.net
To subscribe or unsubscribe via the World Wide Web, visit
=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0 http://autox.team.net/mailman/listinfo/triumphs
or, via email, send a message with subject or body 'help' to
=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0 triumphs-request@autox.team.net
You can reach the person managing the list at
=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0 triumphs-owner@autox.team.net
When replying, please edit your Subject line so it is more specific
than "Re: Contents of Triumphs digest..."
Today's Topics:
=C2=A0 1. Calling anyone with transmission rebuilding experience -
=C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 second attempt, part 1 (aribert neumann)
=C2=A0 2. Calling anyone with transmission rebuilding experience - 2nd
=C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 attempt, part2 (aribert neumann)
=C2=A0 3. Re: Calling anyone with transmission rebuilding experience -
=C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 second attempt, part 1 (DAVID MASSEY)
=C2=A0 4. Re: Calling anyone with transmission rebuilding experience -
=C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 2nd attempt, part2 (DAVID MASSEY)
----------------------------------------------------------------------
Message: 1
Date: Sun, 19 Mar 2023 19:46:53 -0400
From: aribert neumann <aribertn@gmail.com>
To: triumphs@autox.team.net
Subject: [TR] Calling anyone with transmission rebuilding experience -
=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0 second attempt, part 1
Message-ID:
=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0 <CAGkVM28WONnczb-ObP54A8pB0O4nMs-6QzVN_432Y8LqZ=3DZq4A@m=
ail.gmail.com>
I tried to send this message yesterday but it has not appeared yet so I am
resending it - guessing that I may have had too many (or too large of)
images.=C2=A0 I'll splint it into two messages and reduce the image file si=
zes
- hopefully this message will go thru.
I'll start off with a quick comment - as I started to type the e-mail
address, up popped suggestions that started with TR.=C2=A0 Third on the lis=
t
was "TR3driver" - the late Randall (Young, I think).=C2=A0 I sincerely hope
someone will "fill his shoes" with respect to my questions.=C2=A0 I'm not o=
n
any other Triumph related groups - you are all I've got for input.
I am in the process of reassembling (or trying to) my GT6 transmission -
please don't tune out, conceptually the trans is similar to the big
Triumphs.=C2=A0 On dismantling my trans, I observed that the split collars =
had
spun on the main shaft, wearing a relief in the collars and raising an edge
on the main shaft.=C2=A0 What keeps the collars from rotating when 1st gear=
is
in motion?=C2=A0 I am focused on preventing this problem in the future.=C2=
=A0 When I
rotate first gear on the shaft, the split washers rotate with the shaft.=C2=
=A0 I
am wondering if the tolerance stack up of the 2nd & 3rd gear bushings,
spacers, etc (from the circlip to the split collars) was too large allowing
first gear to push the split collars forward on the shaft.=C2=A0 What else =
could
cause this rotation/wear?
Images as follows - old mainshaft with raised edge from the spinning split
washers, good & worn split washers, good split washers nested in the first
gear pocket.=C2=A0 =C2=A0 Off in digest mode preparing part 2 of this messa=
ge.
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------------------------------
Message: 2
Date: Sun, 19 Mar 2023 19:52:24 -0400
From: aribert neumann <aribertn@gmail.com>
To: triumphs@autox.team.net
Subject: [TR] Calling anyone with transmission rebuilding experience -
=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0 2nd attempt, part2
Message-ID:
=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0 <CAGkVM2_qddwDt8R2M5Wx1mGzUgXgX1kQH6noupRw_yA7JqY-BQ@mai=
l.gmail.com>
Next question - my (new) replacement main shaft is oversize in a couple of
places.=C2=A0 The diameter under the 2nd & 3rd gear bushings (I have opened=
up
the bushings to only have a light interference fit).=C2=A0 Worst is the dia=
meter
under the rear bearing.=C2=A0 I can install the bearing but I have to hamme=
r it
***hard*** to get it to fit on the shaft - can't be good for the bearing -
guessing I might change the inner race diameter a miniscule amount.=C2=A0 I=
'm
thinking of sending this main shaft back to Spitbits and reusing my old
main shaft.=C2=A0 I have cleaned up the groove for the split collars on my
lathe.=C2=A0 The other damage on the shaft is on the nose where the cage be=
aring
rides in the input shaft - this damage is only on one side of the shaft and
only on half of the bearing surface (fore/aft).=C2=A0 I am already going to
replace the cage bearing with a bearing bronze bushing since the surface
inside the input shaft pocket is showing wear also.=C2=A0 The max amount of
surface missing on the nose of the old main shaft is 0.003 in diameter.
Images:=C2=A0 exploded view from Bentley=C2=A0 manual, nose of the old, wo=
rn
mainshaft
Your thoughts and suggestions please - off in digest mode awaiting your
responses.=C2=A0 Trying to formulate a new plan of attack for Monday mornin=
g.
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------------------------------
Message: 3
Date: Mon, 20 Mar 2023 12:39:48 +0000 (UTC)
From: DAVID MASSEY <dave1massey@cs.com>
To: "aribertn@gmail.com" <aribertn@gmail.com>,
=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0 "triumphs@autox.team.net" <triumphs@autox.team.net>
Subject: Re: [TR] Calling anyone with transmission rebuilding
=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0 experience - second attempt, part 1
It has been many years (< 25, I think) but I once rebuilt a TR6 transmissi=
on with a used mainshaft that had similar wear on a shoulder like that.? Th=
ere was a thrust washer that fitted up against shoulder.? A few years later=
I was rebuilding it again.? The thrust washer had broken into parts.? My s=
olution was to buy a new mainshaft (that is a story in itself) along with s=
ome other parts.? 25 years later that part is still soldering on.? (I had t=
o rebuild again for layshaft issues but that's unrelated)
I would be very reluctant to reuse that mainshaft.? The raised ridge is not=
what worries me it is the fact that the edge of the grove is not square an=
d the thrust applied by the helical gears will point load the split collars=
and they will fail again.? The TR6 transmission si probably different but =
the basic design is similar and the force loading is also similar.? Helical=
gears are sued to keep tooth noise down but the fact that they are wound i=
n a helical manner around the axis means the forces applied to the gears is=
at an angle to that axis.? Part of that force is used to rotate the shaft =
but the other is applied to the bearings at either end of the transmission =
meaning the split collars in your case will take up that force as an interf=
ace between the shaft and the bearing inner race.? I don't have enough expe=
rience to say whether the transmission will last a week, month, year or 10 =
years with that shaft but I would have much more confidence in a new, quali=
ty shaft.
=20
Dave=20
=20
=20
-----Original Message-----
From: aribert neumann <aribertn@gmail.com>
To: triumphs@autox.team.net
Sent: Sun, Mar 19, 2023 6:46 pm
Subject: [TR] Calling anyone with transmission rebuilding experience - seco=
nd attempt, part 1
I tried to send this message yesterday but it has not appeared yet so I am =
resending it - guessing that I may have had too many (or too large of) imag=
es.? ?I'll splint it into two messages and reduce the image file sizes - ho=
pefully this message will go thru.
I'll start off with a quick comment - as I started to type the e-mail addre=
ss, up popped suggestions that started with TR.? ?Third on the list was "TR=
3driver" - the late Randall (Young, I think).? ?I sincerely hope someone wi=
ll "fill his shoes" with respect to my questions.? ?I'm not on any other Tr=
iumph related groups - you are all I've got for input.
I am in the process of reassembling (or trying to) my GT6 transmission - pl=
ease don't tune out, conceptually the trans is similar to the big Triumphs.=
? ?On dismantling my trans, I observed that the split collars had spun on t=
he main shaft, wearing a relief in the collars and raising an edge on the m=
ain shaft.? What keeps the collars from rotating when 1st gear is in motion=
?? I am focused on preventing this problem in the future.? When I rotate fi=
rst gear on the shaft, the split washers rotate with the shaft.? I am wonde=
ring if the tolerance stack up of the 2nd & 3rd gear bushings, spacers, etc=
(from the circlip to the split collars) was too large allowing first gear =
to push the split collars forward on the shaft.? What else could cause this=
rotation/wear???
Images as follows - old mainshaft with raised edge from the spinning split =
washers, good & worn split washers, good split washers nested in the first =
gear pocket.? ? Off in digest mode preparing part 2 of this message.
** triumphs@autox.team.net **
Archive: http://www.team.net/pipermail/triumphs? http://www.team.net/archiv=
e
sey@cs.com
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------------------------------
Message: 4
Date: Mon, 20 Mar 2023 13:30:54 +0000 (UTC)
From: DAVID MASSEY <dave1massey@cs.com>
To: "aribertn@gmail.com" <aribertn@gmail.com>,
=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0 "triumphs@autox.team.net" <triumphs@autox.team.net>
Subject: Re: [TR] Calling anyone with transmission rebuilding
=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0 experience - 2nd attempt, part2
That looks like the heat treated, hardened? surface is starting to break u=
p.? That is what happened to my layshaft.? Another reason to abandon that m=
ainshaft.? If you have an alternate bearing combination that doesn't relay =
on that surface for the bearing rollers then the hardened surface is no lon=
ger critical.? But this is above my pay grade.
BTW, I misinterpreted one of your previous photos.? The split washers trans=
fer the lateral forces from the synchro hub to the mainshaft but the end re=
sult is the same, with a compromised groove surface like that the split col=
lars will fail prematurely.?? If you open the grove to clean up the shoulde=
r will the split washers stay in place?? If they fall out you have serious =
problems.? Even if they stay in place will it increase backlash?? Can you g=
et oversized split collars?? Make shims?? All this is above my pay grade.
=20
Dave=20
=20
=20
-----Original Message-----
From: aribert neumann <aribertn@gmail.com>
To: triumphs@autox.team.net
Sent: Sun, Mar 19, 2023 6:52 pm
Subject: [TR] Calling anyone with transmission rebuilding experience - 2nd =
attempt, part2
Next question - my (new) replacement main shaft is oversize in a couple of =
places.? ?The diameter under the 2nd & 3rd gear bushings (I have opened up =
the bushings to only have a light interference fit).? Worst is the diameter=
under the rear bearing.? I can install the bearing but I have to hammer it=
***hard*** to get it to fit on the shaft - can't be good for the bearing -=
guessing I might change the inner race diameter a miniscule amount.? I'm t=
hinking of sending this main shaft back to Spitbits and reusing my old main=
shaft.? I have cleaned up the groove for the split collars on my lathe.? T=
he other damage on the shaft is on the nose where the cage bearing rides in=
the input shaft - this damage is only on one side of the shaft and only on=
half of the bearing surface (fore/aft).? I am already going to replace the=
cage bearing with a bearing bronze bushing since the surface inside the in=
put shaft pocket is showing wear also.? The max amount of surface missing o=
n the nose of the old m
ain shaft is 0.003 in diameter.? ?Images:? exploded view from Bentley? man=
ual, nose of the old, worn mainshaft
Your thoughts and suggestions please - off in digest mode awaiting your res=
ponses.? Trying to formulate a new plan of attack for Monday morning.
** triumphs@autox.team.net **
Archive: http://www.team.net/pipermail/triumphs? http://www.team.net/archiv=
e
sey@cs.com
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------------------------------
Subject: Digest Footer
_______________________________________________
Triumphs mailing list
Triumphs@autox.team.net
http://autox.team.net/mailman/listinfo/triumphs
------------------------------
End of Triumphs Digest, Vol 16, Issue 39
****************************************
=20
------=_Part_3024852_277828695.1679396173444
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<html><head></head><body><div class=3D"ydp457cbbe1yahoo-style-wrap" style=
=3D"font-family:verdana, helvetica, sans-serif;font-size:16px;"><div><div d=
ir=3D"ltr" data-setdir=3D"false">Hi. John Esposito is the best LBC mechanic=
in CT and he has a shop in Oxford, CT called Quantum Mechanics. He is a ma=
th nut and works with the MG club and does the rebuilding work for TRF. He =
was making TR main shafts after he found no saleable units.</div><div><br><=
/div><div class=3D"ydp457cbbe1signature">Joe Mato<div>62 Wood Road</div><di=
v>Redding, CT 06896</div><div>917 232 1555</div></div></div>
<div><br></div><div><br></div>
=20
</div><div id=3D"ydp50442b40yahoo_quoted_0249459439" class=3D"ydp50=
442b40yahoo_quoted">
<div style=3D"font-family:'Helvetica Neue', Helvetica, Arial, s=
ans-serif;font-size:13px;color:#26282a;">
=20
<div>
On Monday, March 20, 2023 at 02:49:34 PM EDT, triumphs-=
request@autox.team.net <triumphs-request@autox.team.net> wrote:
</div>
<div><br></div>
<div><br></div>
<div><div dir=3D"ltr">Send Triumphs mailing list submission=
s to<br></div><div dir=3D"ltr"> <a href=3D"mailto:triumph=
s@autox.team.net" rel=3D"nofollow" target=3D"_blank">triumphs@autox.team.ne=
t</a><br></div><div dir=3D"ltr"><br></div><div dir=3D"ltr">To subscribe or =
unsubscribe via the World Wide Web, visit<br></div><div dir=3D"ltr"> &=
nbsp; <a href=3D"http://autox.team.net/mailman/listinfo/triumphs"; rel=
=3D"nofollow" target=3D"_blank">http://autox.team.net/mailman/listinfo/triu=
mphs</a><br></div><div dir=3D"ltr">or, via email, send a message with subje=
ct or body 'help' to<br></div><div dir=3D"ltr"> <a href=
=3D"mailto:triumphs-request@autox.team.net"; rel=3D"nofollow" target=3D"_bla=
nk">triumphs-request@autox.team.net</a><br></div><div dir=3D"ltr"><br></div=
><div dir=3D"ltr">You can reach the person managing the list at<br></div><d=
iv dir=3D"ltr"> <a href=3D"mailto:triumphs-owner@autox.te=
am.net" rel=3D"nofollow" target=3D"_blank">triumphs-owner@autox.team.net</a=
><br></div><div dir=3D"ltr"><br></div><div dir=3D"ltr">When replying, pleas=
e edit your Subject line so it is more specific<br></div><div dir=3D"ltr">t=
han "Re: Contents of Triumphs digest..."<br></div><div dir=3D"ltr"><br></di=
v><div dir=3D"ltr"><br></div><div dir=3D"ltr">Today's Topics:<br></div><div=
dir=3D"ltr"><br></div><div dir=3D"ltr"> 1. Calling anyone with tran=
smission rebuilding experience -<br></div><div dir=3D"ltr"> &n=
bsp; second attempt, part 1 (aribert neumann)<br></div><div dir=3D"ltr">&nb=
sp; 2. Calling anyone with transmission rebuilding experience - 2nd<br></d=
iv><div dir=3D"ltr"> attempt, part2 (aribert neumann)<b=
r></div><div dir=3D"ltr"> 3. Re: Calling anyone with transmission re=
building experience -<br></div><div dir=3D"ltr"> second=
attempt, part 1 (DAVID MASSEY)<br></div><div dir=3D"ltr"> 4. Re: Ca=
lling anyone with transmission rebuilding experience -<br></div><div dir=3D=
"ltr"> 2nd attempt, part2 (DAVID MASSEY)<br></div><div =
dir=3D"ltr"><br></div><div dir=3D"ltr"><br></div><div dir=3D"ltr">---------=
-------------------------------------------------------------<br></div><div=
dir=3D"ltr"><br></div><div dir=3D"ltr">Message: 1<br></div><div dir=3D"ltr=
">Date: Sun, 19 Mar 2023 19:46:53 -0400<br></div><div dir=3D"ltr">From: ari=
bert neumann <<a href=3D"mailto:aribertn@gmail.com"; rel=3D"nofollow" tar=
get=3D"_blank">aribertn@gmail.com</a>><br></div><div dir=3D"ltr">To: <a =
href=3D"mailto:triumphs@autox.team.net"; rel=3D"nofollow" target=3D"_blank">=
triumphs@autox.team.net</a><br></div><div dir=3D"ltr">Subject: [TR] Calling=
anyone with transmission rebuilding experience -<br></div><div dir=3D"ltr"=
> second attempt, part 1<br></div><div dir=3D"ltr">Messag=
e-ID:<br></div><div dir=3D"ltr"> <CAGkVM28WONnczb-ObP5=
4A8pB0O4nMs-6QzVN_432Y8LqZ=3DZq4A@mail.gmail.com><br></div><div dir=3D"l=
tr">Content-Type: text/plain; charset=3D"utf-8"<br></div><div dir=3D"ltr"><=
br></div><div dir=3D"ltr">I tried to send this message yesterday but it has=
not appeared yet so I am<br></div><div dir=3D"ltr">resending it - guessing=
that I may have had too many (or too large of)<br></div><div dir=3D"ltr">i=
mages. I'll splint it into two messages and reduce the image file si=
zes<br></div><div dir=3D"ltr">- hopefully this message will go thru.<br></d=
iv><div dir=3D"ltr"><br></div><div dir=3D"ltr">I'll start off with a quick =
comment - as I started to type the e-mail<br></div><div dir=3D"ltr">address=
, up popped suggestions that started with TR. Third on the list<br><=
/div><div dir=3D"ltr">was "TR3driver" - the late Randall (Young, I think).&=
nbsp; I sincerely hope<br></div><div dir=3D"ltr">someone will "fill his sh=
oes" with respect to my questions. I'm not on<br></div><div dir=3D"l=
tr">any other Triumph related groups - you are all I've got for input.<br><=
/div><div dir=3D"ltr"><br></div><div dir=3D"ltr">I am in the process of rea=
ssembling (or trying to) my GT6 transmission -<br></div><div dir=3D"ltr">pl=
ease don't tune out, conceptually the trans is similar to the big<br></div>=
<div dir=3D"ltr">Triumphs. On dismantling my trans, I observed that =
the split collars had<br></div><div dir=3D"ltr">spun on the main shaft, wea=
ring a relief in the collars and raising an edge<br></div><div dir=3D"ltr">=
on the main shaft. What keeps the collars from rotating when 1st gear=
is<br></div><div dir=3D"ltr">in motion? I am focused on preventing t=
his problem in the future. When I<br></div><div dir=3D"ltr">rotate fi=
rst gear on the shaft, the split washers rotate with the shaft. I<br>=
</div><div dir=3D"ltr">am wondering if the tolerance stack up of the 2nd &a=
mp; 3rd gear bushings,<br></div><div dir=3D"ltr">spacers, etc (from the cir=
clip to the split collars) was too large allowing<br></div><div dir=3D"ltr"=
>first gear to push the split collars forward on the shaft. What else=
could<br></div><div dir=3D"ltr">cause this rotation/wear?<br></div><div di=
r=3D"ltr"><br></div><div dir=3D"ltr">Images as follows - old mainshaft with=
raised edge from the spinning split<br></div><div dir=3D"ltr">washers, goo=
d & worn split washers, good split washers nested in the first<br></div=
><div dir=3D"ltr">gear pocket. Off in digest mode preparing pa=
rt 2 of this message.<br></div><div dir=3D"ltr">-------------- next part --=
------------<br></div><div dir=3D"ltr">An HTML attachment was scrubbed...<b=
r></div><div dir=3D"ltr">URL: <<a href=3D"http://autox.team.net/pipermai=
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ow" target=3D"_blank">http://autox.team.net/pipermail/triumphs/attachments/=
20230319/d071644c/attachment-0001.htm</a>><br></div><div dir=3D"ltr">---=
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hment was scrubbed...<br></div><div dir=3D"ltr">Name: GT6 split collars in =
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=3D"ltr">Size: 123314 bytes<br></div><div dir=3D"ltr">Desc: not available<b=
r></div><div dir=3D"ltr">URL: <<a href=3D"http://autox.team.net/pipermai=
l/triumphs/attachments/20230319/d071644c/attachment-0005.jpg" rel=3D"nofoll=
ow" target=3D"_blank">http://autox.team.net/pipermail/triumphs/attachments/=
20230319/d071644c/attachment-0005.jpg</a>><br></div><div dir=3D"ltr"><br=
></div><div dir=3D"ltr">------------------------------<br></div><div dir=3D=
"ltr"><br></div><div dir=3D"ltr">Message: 2<br></div><div dir=3D"ltr">Date:=
Sun, 19 Mar 2023 19:52:24 -0400<br></div><div dir=3D"ltr">From: aribert ne=
umann <<a href=3D"mailto:aribertn@gmail.com"; rel=3D"nofollow" target=3D"=
_blank">aribertn@gmail.com</a>><br></div><div dir=3D"ltr">To: <a href=3D=
"mailto:triumphs@autox.team.net"; rel=3D"nofollow" target=3D"_blank">triumph=
s@autox.team.net</a><br></div><div dir=3D"ltr">Subject: [TR] Calling anyone=
with transmission rebuilding experience -<br></div><div dir=3D"ltr"> =
2nd attempt, part2<br></div><div dir=3D"ltr">Message-ID:<br></=
div><div dir=3D"ltr"> <<a href=3D"mailto:CAGkVM2_qddwD=
t8R2M5Wx1mGzUgXgX1kQH6noupRw_yA7JqY-BQ@mail.gmail.com" rel=3D"nofollow" tar=
get=3D"_blank">CAGkVM2_qddwDt8R2M5Wx1mGzUgXgX1kQH6noupRw_yA7JqY-BQ@mail.gma=
il.com</a>><br></div><div dir=3D"ltr">Content-Type: text/plain; charset=
=3D"utf-8"<br></div><div dir=3D"ltr"><br></div><div dir=3D"ltr">Next questi=
on - my (new) replacement main shaft is oversize in a couple of<br></div><d=
iv dir=3D"ltr">places. The diameter under the 2nd & 3rd gear bus=
hings (I have opened up<br></div><div dir=3D"ltr">the bushings to only have=
a light interference fit). Worst is the diameter<br></div><div dir=
=3D"ltr">under the rear bearing. I can install the bearing but I have=
to hammer it<br></div><div dir=3D"ltr">***hard*** to get it to fit on the =
shaft - can't be good for the bearing -<br></div><div dir=3D"ltr">guessing =
I might change the inner race diameter a miniscule amount. I'm<br></d=
iv><div dir=3D"ltr">thinking of sending this main shaft back to Spitbits an=
d reusing my old<br></div><div dir=3D"ltr">main shaft. I have cleaned=
up the groove for the split collars on my<br></div><div dir=3D"ltr">lathe.=
The other damage on the shaft is on the nose where the cage bearing<=
br></div><div dir=3D"ltr">rides in the input shaft - this damage is only on=
one side of the shaft and<br></div><div dir=3D"ltr">only on half of the be=
aring surface (fore/aft). I am already going to<br></div><div dir=3D"=
ltr">replace the cage bearing with a bearing bronze bushing since the surfa=
ce<br></div><div dir=3D"ltr">inside the input shaft pocket is showing wear =
also. The max amount of<br></div><div dir=3D"ltr">surface missing on =
the nose of the old main shaft is 0.003 in diameter.<br></div><div dir=3D"l=
tr"> Images: exploded view from Bentley manual, nose of the old=
, worn<br></div><div dir=3D"ltr">mainshaft<br></div><div dir=3D"ltr"><br></=
div><div dir=3D"ltr">Your thoughts and suggestions please - off in digest m=
ode awaiting your<br></div><div dir=3D"ltr">responses. Trying to form=
ulate a new plan of attack for Monday morning.<br></div><div dir=3D"ltr">--=
------------ next part --------------<br></div><div dir=3D"ltr">An HTML att=
achment was scrubbed...<br></div><div dir=3D"ltr">URL: <<a href=3D"http:=
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ail/triumphs/attachments/20230319/a2533ad4/attachment-0001.htm</a>><br><=
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tox.team.net/pipermail/triumphs/attachments/20230319/a2533ad4/attachment-00=
02.jpg" rel=3D"nofollow" target=3D"_blank">http://autox.team.net/pipermail/=
triumphs/attachments/20230319/a2533ad4/attachment-0002.jpg</a>><br></div=
><div dir=3D"ltr">-------------- next part --------------<br></div><div dir=
=3D"ltr">A non-text attachment was scrubbed...<br></div><div dir=3D"ltr">Na=
me: GT6 Wear on nose of mainshaft.jpg<br></div><div dir=3D"ltr">Type: image=
/jpeg<br></div><div dir=3D"ltr">Size: 120690 bytes<br></div><div dir=3D"ltr=
">Desc: not available<br></div><div dir=3D"ltr">URL: <<a href=3D"http://=
autox.team.net/pipermail/triumphs/attachments/20230319/a2533ad4/attachment-=
0003.jpg" rel=3D"nofollow" target=3D"_blank">http://autox.team.net/pipermai=
l/triumphs/attachments/20230319/a2533ad4/attachment-0003.jpg</a>><br></d=
iv><div dir=3D"ltr"><br></div><div dir=3D"ltr">----------------------------=
--<br></div><div dir=3D"ltr"><br></div><div dir=3D"ltr">Message: 3<br></div=
><div dir=3D"ltr">Date: Mon, 20 Mar 2023 12:39:48 +0000 (UTC)<br></div><div=
dir=3D"ltr">From: DAVID MASSEY <<a href=3D"mailto:dave1massey@cs.com"; r=
el=3D"nofollow" target=3D"_blank">dave1massey@cs.com</a>><br></div><div =
dir=3D"ltr">To: "aribertn@gmail.com" <<a href=3D"mailto:aribertn@gmail.c=
om" rel=3D"nofollow" target=3D"_blank">aribertn@gmail.com</a>>,<br></div=
><div dir=3D"ltr"> "triumphs@autox.team.net" <<a href=
=3D"mailto:triumphs@autox.team.net"; rel=3D"nofollow" target=3D"_blank">triu=
mphs@autox.team.net</a>><br></div><div dir=3D"ltr">Subject: Re: [TR] Cal=
ling anyone with transmission rebuilding<br></div><div dir=3D"ltr"> &n=
bsp; experience - second attempt, part 1<br></div><div dir=3D"ltr">Me=
ssage-ID: <<a href=3D"mailto:2090616878.2487776.1679315988251@mail.yahoo=
.com" rel=3D"nofollow" target=3D"_blank">2090616878.2487776.1679315988251@m=
ail.yahoo.com</a>><br></div><div dir=3D"ltr">Content-Type: text/plain; c=
harset=3D"utf-8"<br></div><div dir=3D"ltr"><br></div><div dir=3D"ltr"> It h=
as been many years (< 25, I think) but I once rebuilt a TR6 transmission=
with a used mainshaft that had similar wear on a shoulder like that.? Ther=
e was a thrust washer that fitted up against shoulder.? A few years later I=
was rebuilding it again.? The thrust washer had broken into parts.? My sol=
ution was to buy a new mainshaft (that is a story in itself) along with som=
e other parts.? 25 years later that part is still soldering on.? (I had to =
rebuild again for layshaft issues but that's unrelated)<br></div><div dir=
=3D"ltr">I would be very reluctant to reuse that mainshaft.? The raised rid=
ge is not what worries me it is the fact that the edge of the grove is not =
square and the thrust applied by the helical gears will point load the spli=
t collars and they will fail again.? The TR6 transmission si probably diffe=
rent but the basic design is similar and the force loading is also similar.=
? Helical gears are sued to keep tooth noise down but the fact that they ar=
e wound in a helical manner around the axis means the forces applied to the=
gears is at an angle to that axis.? Part of that force is used to rotate t=
he shaft but the other is applied to the bearings at either end of the tran=
smission meaning the split collars in your case will take up that force as =
an interface between the shaft and the bearing inner race.? I don't have en=
ough experience to say whether the transmission will last a week, month, ye=
ar or 10 years with that shaft but I would have much more confidence in a n=
ew, quality shaft.<br></div><div dir=3D"ltr"> <br></div><div dir=3D"ltr">Da=
ve <br></div><div dir=3D"ltr"><br></div><div dir=3D"ltr"><br></div><div dir=
=3D"ltr"> <br></div><div dir=3D"ltr"> <br></div><div dir=3D"ltr">-----Origi=
nal Message-----<br></div><div dir=3D"ltr">From: aribert neumann <<a hre=
f=3D"mailto:aribertn@gmail.com"; rel=3D"nofollow" target=3D"_blank">aribertn=
@gmail.com</a>><br></div><div dir=3D"ltr">To: <a href=3D"mailto:triumphs=
@autox.team.net" rel=3D"nofollow" target=3D"_blank">triumphs@autox.team.net=
</a><br></div><div dir=3D"ltr">Sent: Sun, Mar 19, 2023 6:46 pm<br></div><di=
v dir=3D"ltr">Subject: [TR] Calling anyone with transmission rebuilding exp=
erience - second attempt, part 1<br></div><div dir=3D"ltr"><br></div><div d=
ir=3D"ltr">I tried to send this message yesterday but it has not appeared y=
et so I am resending it - guessing that I may have had too many (or too lar=
ge of) images.? ?I'll splint it into two messages and reduce the image file=
sizes - hopefully this message will go thru.<br></div><div dir=3D"ltr">I'l=
l start off with a quick comment - as I started to type the e-mail address,=
up popped suggestions that started with TR.? ?Third on the list was "TR3dr=
iver" - the late Randall (Young, I think).? ?I sincerely hope someone will =
"fill his shoes" with respect to my questions.? ?I'm not on any other Trium=
ph related groups - you are all I've got for input.<br></div><div dir=3D"lt=
r">I am in the process of reassembling (or trying to) my GT6 transmission -=
please don't tune out, conceptually the trans is similar to the big Triump=
hs.? ?On dismantling my trans, I observed that the split collars had spun o=
n the main shaft, wearing a relief in the collars and raising an edge on th=
e main shaft.? What keeps the collars from rotating when 1st gear is in mot=
ion?? I am focused on preventing this problem in the future.? When I rotate=
first gear on the shaft, the split washers rotate with the shaft.? I am wo=
ndering if the tolerance stack up of the 2nd & 3rd gear bushings, space=
rs, etc (from the circlip to the split collars) was too large allowing firs=
t gear to push the split collars forward on the shaft.? What else could cau=
se this rotation/wear???<br></div><div dir=3D"ltr">Images as follows - old =
mainshaft with raised edge from the spinning split washers, good & worn=
split washers, good split washers nested in the first gear pocket.? ? Off =
in digest mode preparing part 2 of this message.<br></div><div dir=3D"ltr">=
<br></div><div dir=3D"ltr"><br></div><div dir=3D"ltr">** <a href=3D"mailto:=
triumphs@autox.team.net" rel=3D"nofollow" target=3D"_blank">triumphs@autox.=
team.net</a> **<br></div><div dir=3D"ltr"><br></div><div dir=3D"ltr">Donate=
: <a href=3D"http://www.team.net/donate.html"; rel=3D"nofollow" target=3D"_b=
lank">http://www.team.net/donate.html</a><br></div><div dir=3D"ltr">Archive=
: http://www.team.net/pipermail/triumphs? <a href=3D"http://www.team.net/ar=
chive" rel=3D"nofollow" target=3D"_blank">http://www.team.net/archive</a><b=
r></div><div dir=3D"ltr"><br></div><div dir=3D"ltr">Unsubscribe/Manage: <a =
href=3D"http://autox.team.net/mailman/options/triumphs/dave1massey@cs.com"; =
rel=3D"nofollow" target=3D"_blank">http://autox.team.net/mailman/options/tr=
iumphs/dave1massey@cs.com</a><br></div><div dir=3D"ltr">-------------- next=
part --------------<br></div><div dir=3D"ltr">An HTML attachment was scrub=
bed...<br></div><div dir=3D"ltr">URL: <<a href=3D"http://autox.team.net/=
pipermail/triumphs/attachments/20230320/3ea8a84d/attachment-0001.htm" rel=
=3D"nofollow" target=3D"_blank">http://autox.team.net/pipermail/triumphs/at=
tachments/20230320/3ea8a84d/attachment-0001.htm</a>><br></div><div dir=
=3D"ltr"><br></div><div dir=3D"ltr">------------------------------<br></div=
><div dir=3D"ltr"><br></div><div dir=3D"ltr">Message: 4<br></div><div dir=
=3D"ltr">Date: Mon, 20 Mar 2023 13:30:54 +0000 (UTC)<br></div><div dir=3D"l=
tr">From: DAVID MASSEY <<a href=3D"mailto:dave1massey@cs.com"; rel=3D"nof=
ollow" target=3D"_blank">dave1massey@cs.com</a>><br></div><div dir=3D"lt=
r">To: "aribertn@gmail.com" <<a href=3D"mailto:aribertn@gmail.com"; rel=
=3D"nofollow" target=3D"_blank">aribertn@gmail.com</a>>,<br></div><div d=
ir=3D"ltr"> "triumphs@autox.team.net" <<a href=3D"mail=
to:triumphs@autox.team.net" rel=3D"nofollow" target=3D"_blank">triumphs@aut=
ox.team.net</a>><br></div><div dir=3D"ltr">Subject: Re: [TR] Calling any=
one with transmission rebuilding<br></div><div dir=3D"ltr"> &nbs=
p; experience - 2nd attempt, part2<br></div><div dir=3D"ltr">Message-ID: &l=
t;<a href=3D"mailto:583075131.2506945.1679319054463@mail.yahoo.com"; rel=3D"=
nofollow" target=3D"_blank">583075131.2506945.1679319054463@mail.yahoo.com<=
/a>><br></div><div dir=3D"ltr">Content-Type: text/plain; charset=3D"utf-=
8"<br></div><div dir=3D"ltr"><br></div><div dir=3D"ltr"> That looks like th=
e heat treated, hardened? surface is starting to break up.? That is what ha=
ppened to my layshaft.? Another reason to abandon that mainshaft.? If you h=
ave an alternate bearing combination that doesn't relay on that surface for=
the bearing rollers then the hardened surface is no longer critical.? But =
this is above my pay grade.<br></div><div dir=3D"ltr"><br></div><div dir=3D=
"ltr">BTW, I misinterpreted one of your previous photos.? The split washers=
transfer the lateral forces from the synchro hub to the mainshaft but the =
end result is the same, with a compromised groove surface like that the spl=
it collars will fail prematurely.?? If you open the grove to clean up the s=
houlder will the split washers stay in place?? If they fall out you have se=
rious problems.? Even if they stay in place will it increase backlash?? Can=
you get oversized split collars?? Make shims?? All this is above my pay gr=
ade.<br></div><div dir=3D"ltr"> <br></div><div dir=3D"ltr">Dave <br></div><=
div dir=3D"ltr"><br></div><div dir=3D"ltr"><br></div><div dir=3D"ltr"> <br>=
</div><div dir=3D"ltr"> <br></div><div dir=3D"ltr">-----Original Message---=
--<br></div><div dir=3D"ltr">From: aribert neumann <<a href=3D"mailto:ar=
ibertn@gmail.com" rel=3D"nofollow" target=3D"_blank">aribertn@gmail.com</a>=
><br></div><div dir=3D"ltr">To: <a href=3D"mailto:triumphs@autox.team.ne=
t" rel=3D"nofollow" target=3D"_blank">triumphs@autox.team.net</a><br></div>=
<div dir=3D"ltr">Sent: Sun, Mar 19, 2023 6:52 pm<br></div><div dir=3D"ltr">=
Subject: [TR] Calling anyone with transmission rebuilding experience - 2nd =
attempt, part2<br></div><div dir=3D"ltr"><br></div><div dir=3D"ltr">Next qu=
estion - my (new) replacement main shaft is oversize in a couple of places.=
? ?The diameter under the 2nd & 3rd gear bushings (I have opened up the=
bushings to only have a light interference fit).? Worst is the diameter un=
der the rear bearing.? I can install the bearing but I have to hammer it **=
*hard*** to get it to fit on the shaft - can't be good for the bearing - gu=
essing I might change the inner race diameter a miniscule amount.? I'm thin=
king of sending this main shaft back to Spitbits and reusing my old main sh=
aft.? I have cleaned up the groove for the split collars on my lathe.? The =
other damage on the shaft is on the nose where the cage bearing rides in th=
e input shaft - this damage is only on one side of the shaft and only on ha=
lf of the bearing surface (fore/aft).? I am already going to replace the ca=
ge bearing with a bearing bronze bushing since the surface inside the input=
shaft pocket is showing wear also.? The max amount of surface missing on t=
he nose of the old m<br></div><div dir=3D"ltr"> ain shaft is 0.003 in diame=
ter.? ?Images:? exploded view from Bentley? manual, nose of the old, worn m=
ainshaft<br></div><div dir=3D"ltr"><br></div><div dir=3D"ltr">Your thoughts=
and suggestions please - off in digest mode awaiting your responses.? Tryi=
ng to formulate a new plan of attack for Monday morning.<br></div><div dir=
=3D"ltr"><br></div><div dir=3D"ltr">** <a href=3D"mailto:triumphs@autox.tea=
m.net" rel=3D"nofollow" target=3D"_blank">triumphs@autox.team.net</a> **<br=
></div><div dir=3D"ltr"><br></div><div dir=3D"ltr">Donate: <a href=3D"http:=
//www.team.net/donate.html" rel=3D"nofollow" target=3D"_blank">http://www.t=
eam.net/donate.html</a><br></div><div dir=3D"ltr">Archive: http://www.team.=
net/pipermail/triumphs? <a href=3D"http://www.team.net/archive"; rel=3D"nofo=
llow" target=3D"_blank">http://www.team.net/archive</a><br></div><div dir=
=3D"ltr"><br></div><div dir=3D"ltr">Unsubscribe/Manage: <a href=3D"http://a=
utox.team.net/mailman/options/triumphs/dave1massey@cs.com" rel=3D"nofollow"=
target=3D"_blank">http://autox.team.net/mailman/options/triumphs/dave1mass=
ey@cs.com</a><br></div><div dir=3D"ltr">-------------- next part ----------=
----<br></div><div dir=3D"ltr">An HTML attachment was scrubbed...<br></div>=
<div dir=3D"ltr">URL: <<a href=3D"http://autox.team.net/pipermail/triump=
hs/attachments/20230320/f8dfe8ba/attachment-0001.htm" rel=3D"nofollow" targ=
et=3D"_blank">http://autox.team.net/pipermail/triumphs/attachments/20230320=
/f8dfe8ba/attachment-0001.htm</a>><br></div><div dir=3D"ltr"><br></div><=
div dir=3D"ltr">------------------------------<br></div><div dir=3D"ltr"><b=
r></div><div dir=3D"ltr">Subject: Digest Footer<br></div><div dir=3D"ltr"><=
br></div><div dir=3D"ltr">_______________________________________________<b=
r></div><div dir=3D"ltr"><br></div><div dir=3D"ltr">Triumphs mailing list<b=
r></div><div dir=3D"ltr"><a href=3D"mailto:Triumphs@autox.team.net"; rel=3D"=
nofollow" target=3D"_blank">Triumphs@autox.team.net</a><br></div><div dir=
=3D"ltr"><a href=3D"http://autox.team.net/mailman/listinfo/triumphs"; rel=3D=
"nofollow" target=3D"_blank">http://autox.team.net/mailman/listinfo/triumph=
s</a><br></div><div dir=3D"ltr"><br></div><div dir=3D"ltr"><br></div><div d=
ir=3D"ltr">------------------------------<br></div><div dir=3D"ltr"><br></d=
iv><div dir=3D"ltr">End of Triumphs Digest, Vol 16, Issue 39<br></div><div =
dir=3D"ltr">****************************************<br></div></div>
</div>
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