"Kramer"(as you can see below, that is all I have for your name ) I'll try
to answer your questions based on my own experience as a concours participant
-- NOT as a judge. I have seen Chris's answer and agree with him that it is
ultimately up to the concours judge on the field.
I'll answer your questions inside your original e-mail - which I have quoted
below.
In a message dated 97-04-24 11:28:40 EDT, streeter@sanders.com (Ken Streeter)
relays:
> To: ebk@buffnet.net
> CC: arthurk101@aol.com, cak@dimebank.com
>
> Kramer wrote:
>
> > I own 2- TR4/A. They both have undercoating on them. I'm restoring 1
> > now,& I have removed ALL the undercoating off of it. Q: Did that car
have
> > undercoating on it as; a factory opption, dealer opption, or an after
> market
> > opption.
As far as I know (and this is with some certainty)
1) Undercoating was not a factory option ( I would have ordered it if it
had been available)
2) Undercoating was a dealer option in some parts of the US due to
winter weather. This was because of the salt which was placed on the roads
in those parts of the country.
3) If the dealer did not offer undercoating, it was very easy to get
the car undercoated at a shop which specialized in that. Many people did
this - including me. Since I had picked up my car at the factory and had no
dealer, I had my '64 TR4 undercoated within days of getting it off the boat
at Bayonne NJ. (I had shipped it from Bremen Germany about three weeks
after I picked it up at Coventry).
> > I want to put some "Rocker Pannel-Schutz" on, BUT I might want
> > to enter it in a concor judging sometime. Therefore: I don't want to
> remove
> > the schutz (after all the work I put into it) to enter it in concor
> judging
> > just to gain a few points, which could have me a place position in the
1st
> > time of judging. Cosmo
It has been my experience, when I have put my car into concours competition,
that the judges either ignored the undercoating or had a discussion about the
fact that many owners in the '60s would have had the cars undercoated -
especially if the owners lived in cold climes. My impression was that if the
"modification" to the car is "period" then it is OK and that undercoating
fits this category. As to whether it cost me points --- I don't know because
the judges will not release the details of the scoring.
[Hmmm! That just lit my fire, I'd forgotten about that. Seems that some
jerks in the past (when the judging info WAS released to the concours
participants) did such whining and crying and trying to get the judges to
change their ruling that the scoring sheets are no longer released. That
upsets me because now the concours participant can not have the experts'
opinions on what is needed for the car to be brought up to the standards used
by the concours judges. So because of a few crybabies who are OBSESSED with
winning - we all suffer.]
What I'm saying is that IM (personal)O it PROBABLY shouldn't hurt your scores
in concours. I guess I'm also saying that it depends on how uptight you are
about "winning". If you feel really, really strong about that then you might
want to not add anything which might result in points off. (Oh and maybe
keep the car in an airconditioned garage to be taken out only when a meet is
scheduled.) But that is not my cup of tea - I drive mine as often as
possible (daily). To each his own. It boils down to what YOU think is the
purpose of your automobile.
Hope that helps you. Sorry that It took me so long to answer but I wanted to
check on the availability of a factory option regarding undercoating.
Art Kelly '64TR4 CT33118L (original owner)
VTR TR4 vehicle consultant
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