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peter... I want enough to search the net, watch a video on YouTube..=
=2Ejust=20
general access... no streaming or heavy downloads/uploads... I got dia=
l up=20
speeds now =20
and some of these suggestions are way above my budget for garage acces=
s... I=20
just thought powerline might be a reasonably cheap alternative to cat-=
5
----- Original Message -----
From: Peter Murray <peterwmurray@gmail.com>
To: john niolon <jniolon@att.net>, Shop-Talk List <shop-talk@autox.tea=
m.net>
Sent: 4/11/2022 9:40:56 PM
Subject: Re: [Shop-talk] shop internet
John-
How much bandwidth do you want in your shop?
I have used network-over-powerline adapters for quite a while now, and=
have had=20
good success with them. I have an outbuilding/home office about=20
200' from my house, and those adapters provided a very serviceable con=
nection between the outbuilding and the house (about 25Mbit). As other=
s have pointed out, you'll=20
have best luck with them with them both operating on the same hot leg =
of your=20
240V split-phase power. It can be hit or miss, but a pair of "2000Mbit=
" units=20
isn't terribly expensive. I wouldn't be surprised in the least if you =
find they=20
work just fine for you. I would connect one of them to an available LA=
N=20
ethernet ports (likely on your router) and the other (in the shop) in =
a=20
convenient outlet. You can get versions that have built in PoE (for an=
access=20
point, perhaps), or you can adapt another router/AP to simply provide =
wifi in=20
the shop. There are also network-over-power/AP combo units as well.=20=
Don't forget that the network-over-powerline units don't operate in pa=
irs - you=20
can place several wherever you need them, and=20
they'll act like additional ethernet ports. I like the TP-Link gear, a=
nd units with a pass-through power port and a couple of ports are wick=
ed handy.
In my situation, I do have clear line of sight and have "upgraded" fro=
m the network-over-power units to a Ubiquiti mesh link, which yields a=
bout 150-200Mbit of actual throughput. If you are truly only 300'=20
from one building to the other, I think=20
you'll not have any trouble linking the two locations using 5GHz wirel=
ess. The trees will attenuate, but you can focus the power available t=
o increase your link budget and "burn through" the vegetation. I'd=20
look at a pair of Ubiquiti LiteBeam Gen2 units (pretty cheap on Amazon=
) -=20
they'll get you somewhere around 250-300Mbit of throughput with 80MHz =
channel usage. Narrower channel usage will yield better reliability if=
that balance needs to be struck. They have about a 12 degree beamwidt=
h, so they're=20
pretty forgiving with your aim, but the available power is focused whe=
re you=20
want it.
When I installed 60A/240V service in my tiny outbuilding, I had the se=
rvice run=20
in plastic conduit - but - for reasons that escape me right now -=20
didn't run any fiber. I regret that, and intend to order a pre-made 6-=
strand OS3 fiber cable and pull it through this summer. I'll=20
light it up at 1Gbit (for the moment). With LC connectors on each end =
of the=20
fiber, the ethernet switches and mini-GBIC units needed to turn it int=
o=20
conventional copper ethernet are cheap, and I=20
don't worry about my ham radio RF or lightning strikes acting on a big=
copper ethernet line like an antenna. LANShack is who I'm=20
looking at for the fiber, by the way.
If you're not averse to running a copper cable, 330' is your ethernet =
maximum=20
(100m). If you go that route, I'd go with Cat6, and I'd put it in flex=
ible=20
conduit, guessing that you don't already have conduit in place. You do=
n't=20
really even need to worry about putting it below the frost line - good=
ness=20
knows that Cox (our local coax cable company) and Verizon FiOS=20
don't. That said, I would suggest calling your local utility marking o=
utfit before you dig.
Happy to talk further!
-Peter (independent IT guy, radio amateur)
On Mon, Apr 11, 2022 at 6:02 PM john niolon <jniolon@att.net> wrote:
I'm=20
trying to get some 'reliable' internet service to my unattached shop=20=
building... just a shade too far for cable access (just under 300 fee=
t of=20
cable) and too many obstacles for wireless
\even with an extender... looking at powerline units... two boxes...m=
odem=20
plugs into one and it plugs into 120 v plug...other box plugs into any=
other=20
plug on same
breaker box and the laptop plugs into it with cat-5-cable.. =20
anyone have any experienced with this type service ??
example:
https://www.ebay.com/itm/275159414599?_trkparms=3Damclksrc%3DITM%26aid=
%3D1110018%26algo%3DHOMESPLICE.COMPLISTINGS%26ao%3D1%26asc%3D238115%26=
meid%3D9d4234b8cade433b81c8265e84d81de8%26pid%3D101196%26rk%3D10%26rkt=
%3D12%26sd%3D265638365047%26itm%3D275159414599%26pmt%3D1%26noa%3D0%26p=
g%3D2047675%26algv%3DItemStripV101HighAdFeeWithCompV3Ranker%26brand%3D=
NETGEAR&_trksid=3Dp2047675.c101196.m2219&amdata=3Dcksum%3A275159414599=
9d4234b8cade433b81c8265e84d81de8%7Cenc%3AAQAGAAABAMwaiCkD4Jz%252FAA1yt=
ZhxVAzuCsqdmLW9ojO6k7lKEs76vKeVo8baO64duoLIjpcgMP90FFiVgMKbdjh7IgvEI%2=
52BQJgW4gEnxkDA5yYEh7wlEj%252FSuKUyH0RJbKQh7dzMgt%252BJRsfe1bI7Jq%252B=
zI1fyQLcD4HuL%252FMQUHFh10KutrC3t3VJZoR0sVMt6IDKUo7JSyE07Tq52Ka8iPzC9c=
zJ30Nj43ezZTHfxDa3MVT0chETDN2ahqtYKn1MU6wPLlb5sYl6h8pA6VP72FCgmJMYEVr0=
A8gmzhmomEh75XqFQfAefFiX4hPo%252BiZmySE8%252Bh4nUWX3cDN7k4ixdEcXiYyvMa=
WhsA%253D%7Campid%3APL_CLK%7Cclp%3A2047675&epid=3D1186426581
thanks
john
_______________________________________________
Shop-talk@autox.team.net
Archive: http://www.team.net/pipermail/shop-talk http://autox.team.net=
/archive
talk/peterwmurray@gmail.com
--REZmsw5qHloxqCFVnL6wMRpM=_Z4WXQk2W
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<HTML><HEAD>
<META name=3DGENERATOR content=3D"MSHTML 11.00.10570.1001"></HEAD>
<BODY>
<DIV><FONT face=3D"Segoe UI">peter...<EM> </EM> I want enou=
gh to search the net, watch a video on YouTube...just general access..=
=2E no streaming or heavy downloads/uploads... I got dial up speeds no=
w </FONT></DIV>
<DIV><FONT face=3D"Segoe UI">and some of these suggestions are way abo=
ve my budget for garage access... I just thought powerline=
might be a reasonably cheap alternative to cat-5</FONT></DIV>
<DIV> </DIV>
<DIV> </DIV>
<BLOCKQUOTE style=3D"PADDING-BOTTOM: 0px; PADDING-TOP: 0px; PADDING-LE=
FT: 0.5em; BORDER-LEFT: #c7e5ff 1px solid; MARGIN: 0px 0px 0px 0.5em; =
PADDING-RIGHT: 0px">
<DIV style=3D"FONT-SIZE: 12pt; FONT-FAMILY: 'Segoe UI'; COLOR: #000000=
"><B>----- Original Message -----</B></DIV>
<DIV style=3D"FONT-SIZE: 12pt; FONT-FAMILY: 'Segoe UI'; COLOR: #000000=
"><B>From:</B> Peter Murray <<A href=3D"mailto:peterwmurray@gmail.c=
om">peterwmurray@gmail.com</A>></DIV>
<DIV style=3D"FONT-SIZE: 12pt; FONT-FAMILY: 'Segoe UI'; COLOR: #000000=
"><B>To:</B> john niolon <<A href=3D"mailto:jniolon@att.net";>jniolo=
n@att.net</A>>, Shop-Talk List <<A href=3D"mailto:shop-talk@auto=
x.team.net">shop-talk@autox.team.net</A>></DIV>
<DIV style=3D"FONT-SIZE: 12pt; FONT-FAMILY: 'Segoe UI'; COLOR: #000000=
"><B>Sent:</B> 4/11/2022 9:40:56 PM</DIV>
<DIV style=3D"FONT-SIZE: 12pt; FONT-FAMILY: 'Segoe UI'; COLOR: #000000=
"><B>Subject:</B> Re: [Shop-talk] shop internet</DIV>
<HR style=3D"BORDER-TOP: medium none; HEIGHT: 1px; BORDER-RIGHT: mediu=
m none; BORDER-BOTTOM: medium none; COLOR: #ccc; BORDER-LEFT: medium n=
one; BACKGROUND-COLOR: #ccc">
<DIV dir=3Dltr>John-
<DIV><BR></DIV>
<DIV>How much bandwidth do you want in your shop?</DIV>
<DIV><BR></DIV>
<DIV>I have used network-over-powerline adapters for quite a while now=
, and have had good success with them. I have an outbuilding/home offi=
ce about 200' from my house, and those adapters provided a very servic=
eable connection between the outbuilding and the house (about 25Mbit).=
As others have pointed out, you'll have best luck with them with them=
both operating on the same hot leg of your 240V split-phase power. It=
can be hit or miss, but a pair of "2000Mbit" units isn't terribly exp=
ensive. I wouldn't be surprised in the least if you find they work jus=
t fine for you. I would connect one of them to an available LAN ethern=
et ports (likely on your router) and the other (in the shop) in a conv=
enient outlet. You can get versions that have built in PoE (for an acc=
ess point, perhaps), or you can adapt another router/AP to simply prov=
ide wifi in the shop. There are also network-over-power/AP combo units=
as well. Don't forget that the network-over-powerline units don't ope=
rate in pairs - you can place several wherever you need them, and=
they'll act like additional ethernet ports. I like the TP-Link gear, =
and units with a pass-through power port and a couple of ports are wic=
ked handy.</DIV>
<DIV><BR></DIV>
<DIV>
<DIV>In my situation, I do have clear line of sight and have "upgraded=
" from the network-over-power units to a Ubiquiti mesh link, which yie=
lds about 150-200Mbit of actual throughput. If you are truly only 300'=
from one building to the other, I think you'll not have any trouble l=
inking the two locations using 5GHz wireless. The trees will attenuate=
, but you can focus the power available to increase your link budget a=
nd "burn through" the vegetation. I'd look at a pair of Ubiquiti LiteB=
eam Gen2 units (pretty cheap on <A href=3D"https://www.amazon.com/Ubiq=
uiti-LBE-5AC-GEN2-US-LiteBeam-Wireless-Bridge/dp/B06Y2JH7PV?th=3D1">Am=
azon</A>) - they'll get you somewhere around 250-300Mbit of throughput=
with 80MHz channel usage. Narrower channel usage will yield better re=
liability if that balance needs to be struck. They have about a 12 deg=
ree beamwidth, so they're pretty forgiving with your aim, but the avai=
lable power is focused where you want it.</DIV></DIV>
<DIV><BR></DIV>
<DIV>When I installed 60A/240V service in my tiny outbuilding, I had t=
he service run in plastic conduit - but - for reasons that escape=
me right now - didn't run any fiber. I regret that, and intend to ord=
er a pre-made 6-strand OS3 fiber cable and pull it through this summer=
=2E I'll light it up at 1Gbit (for the moment). With LC connectors on =
each end of the fiber, the ethernet switches and mini-GBIC units neede=
d to turn it into conventional copper ethernet are cheap, and I don't =
worry about my ham radio RF or lightning strikes acting on a big coppe=
r ethernet line like an antenna. LANShack is who I'm looking at for th=
e fiber, by the way.</DIV>
<DIV><BR></DIV>
<DIV>If you're not averse to running a copper cable, 330' is your ethe=
rnet maximum (100m). If you go that route, I'd go with Cat6, and I'd p=
ut it in flexible conduit, guessing that you don't already have c=
onduit in place. You don't really even need to worry about putting it =
below the frost line - goodness knows that Cox (our local coax cable c=
ompany) and Verizon FiOS don't. That said, I would suggest calling you=
r local utility marking outfit before you dig.</DIV>
<DIV><BR></DIV>
<DIV>Happy to talk further!<BR></DIV>
<DIV><BR></DIV>
<DIV>-Peter (independent IT guy, radio amateur)</DIV></DIV><BR>
<DIV class=3Dgmail_quote>
<DIV class=3Dgmail_attr dir=3Dltr>On Mon, Apr 11, 2022 at 6:02 PM john=
niolon <<A href=3D"mailto:jniolon@att.net";>jniolon@att.net</A>>=
wrote:<BR></DIV>
<BLOCKQUOTE class=3Dgmail_quote style=3D"PADDING-LEFT: 1ex; BORDER-LEF=
T: rgb(204,204,204) 1px solid; MARGIN: 0px 0px 0px 0.8ex">
<DIV>
<DIV><FONT face=3D"Segoe UI">I'm trying to get some 'reliable' interne=
t service to my unattached shop building... just a shade too far for c=
able access (just under 300 feet of cable) and too many obs=
tacles for wireless</FONT></DIV>
<DIV><FONT face=3D"Segoe UI">\even with an extender... looking at powe=
rline units... two boxes...modem plugs into one and it plugs int=
o 120 v plug...other box plugs into any other plug on same</FONT></DIV=
>
<DIV><FONT face=3D"Segoe UI">breaker box and the laptop plugs into it =
with cat-5-cable.. </FONT></DIV>
<DIV><FONT face=3D"Segoe UI"></FONT> </DIV>
<DIV><FONT face=3D"Segoe UI">anyone have any experienced with this typ=
e service ??</FONT></DIV>
<DIV><FONT face=3D"Segoe UI"></FONT> </DIV>
<DIV><FONT face=3D"Segoe UI">example:</FONT></DIV>
<DIV><FONT face=3D"Segoe UI"></FONT> </DIV>
<DIV><FONT face=3D"Segoe UI"><A href=3D"https://www.ebay.com/itm/27515=
9414599?_trkparms=3Damclksrc%3DITM%26aid%3D1110018%26algo%3DHOMESPLICE=
=2ECOMPLISTINGS%26ao%3D1%26asc%3D238115%26meid%3D9d4234b8cade433b81c82=
65e84d81de8%26pid%3D101196%26rk%3D10%26rkt%3D12%26sd%3D265638365047%26=
itm%3D275159414599%26pmt%3D1%26noa%3D0%26pg%3D2047675%26algv%3DItemStr=
ipV101HighAdFeeWithCompV3Ranker%26brand%3DNETGEAR&_trksid=3Dp20476=
75.c101196.m2219&amdata=3Dcksum%3A2751594145999d4234b8cade433b81c8=
265e84d81de8%7Cenc%3AAQAGAAABAMwaiCkD4Jz%252FAA1ytZhxVAzuCsqdmLW9ojO6k=
7lKEs76vKeVo8baO64duoLIjpcgMP90FFiVgMKbdjh7IgvEI%252BQJgW4gEnxkDA5yYEh=
7wlEj%252FSuKUyH0RJbKQh7dzMgt%252BJRsfe1bI7Jq%252BzI1fyQLcD4HuL%252FMQ=
UHFh10KutrC3t3VJZoR0sVMt6IDKUo7JSyE07Tq52Ka8iPzC9czJ30Nj43ezZTHfxDa3MV=
T0chETDN2ahqtYKn1MU6wPLlb5sYl6h8pA6VP72FCgmJMYEVr0A8gmzhmomEh75XqFQfAe=
fFiX4hPo%252BiZmySE8%252Bh4nUWX3cDN7k4ixdEcXiYyvMaWhsA%253D%7Campid%3A=
PL_CLK%7Cclp%3A2047675&epid=3D1186426581" target=3D_blank>https://=
www.ebay.com/itm/275159414599?_trkparms=3Damclksrc%3DITM%26aid%3D11100=
18%26algo%3DHOMESPLICE.COMPLISTINGS%26ao%3D1%26asc%3D238115%26meid%3D9=
d4234b8cade433b81c8265e84d81de8%26pid%3D101196%26rk%3D10%26rkt%3D12%26=
sd%3D265638365047%26itm%3D275159414599%26pmt%3D1%26noa%3D0%26pg%3D2047=
675%26algv%3DItemStripV101HighAdFeeWithCompV3Ranker%26brand%3DNETGEAR&=
amp;_trksid=3Dp2047675.c101196.m2219&amdata=3Dcksum%3A275159414599=
9d4234b8cade433b81c8265e84d81de8%7Cenc%3AAQAGAAABAMwaiCkD4Jz%252FAA1yt=
ZhxVAzuCsqdmLW9ojO6k7lKEs76vKeVo8baO64duoLIjpcgMP90FFiVgMKbdjh7IgvEI%2=
52BQJgW4gEnxkDA5yYEh7wlEj%252FSuKUyH0RJbKQh7dzMgt%252BJRsfe1bI7Jq%252B=
zI1fyQLcD4HuL%252FMQUHFh10KutrC3t3VJZoR0sVMt6IDKUo7JSyE07Tq52Ka8iPzC9c=
zJ30Nj43ezZTHfxDa3MVT0chETDN2ahqtYKn1MU6wPLlb5sYl6h8pA6VP72FCgmJMYEVr0=
A8gmzhmomEh75XqFQfAefFiX4hPo%252BiZmySE8%252Bh4nUWX3cDN7k4ixdEcXiYyvMa=
WhsA%253D%7Campid%3APL_CLK%7Cclp%3A2047675&epid=3D1186426581</A></=
FONT></DIV>
<DIV><FONT face=3D"Segoe UI"></FONT> </DIV>
<DIV><FONT face=3D"Segoe UI">thanks</FONT></DIV>
<DIV><FONT face=3D"Segoe UI">john</FONT></DIV></DIV>__________________=
_____________________________<BR><BR><A href=3D"mailto:Shop-talk@autox=
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/BLOCKQUOTE></DIV></BLOCKQUOTE></BODY></HTML>
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_______________________________________________
Shop-talk@autox.team.net
Archive: http://www.team.net/pipermail/shop-talk http://autox.team.net/archive
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