I will have to admit that the engine sizes, in cubic inches, were set before
I started tech stuff. The engine sizes were set by American Hot Rodders
using the decimal system, the APROX. liter sizes were added at a later date
to accommodate the imports. Your engine will be measured with size
determined to American decimal standards. Before the list jumps on the first
sentence let me state that the 'B' class break was changed a few years ago
to do away with a very large jump between classes A, B & C. There are
currently no intentions to modify any other engine class breaks. Research
has shown that what we currently use is workable and satisfactory with the
majority of entrants.
Dan W
----- Original Message -----
From: john robinson <john@engr.wisc.edu>
To: <land-speed@autox.team.net>
Cc: tschoen <j82244@fuse.net>
Sent: Wednesday, February 16, 2000 5:45 AM
Subject: Re: Fw: /MS rules
> Howdy,
> Now I have to admit to guessing here, I had built my engine to
> the c.i. size, less just a tad, a little more than 9 years ago, and really
> had not looked at the engine size rule since then, as I was in compliance.
> Then this thread came up and I as usual jumped in with both feet, and ran
> off at the mouth, or rather, fingers. Anyway, AFTER I had written the
> epistle, I went home and checked the rule book, and then saw the
> controversy that started the thread. Now, I always think that the rule
book
> is guidelines, on the order of smokey yunick, but feel that the engine
> class sizes were following FIA guidelines, where 1/2 cc over a stated
liter
> size put you into another class. I still do think that, and that the
> rulebook merely states one size 1.5 liter to the next size 1.5001 liter.
> but not written that way for reasons unknown to me. Anybody older than me
> got the reason?
>
> At 06:15 PM 2/15/00 , you wrote:
> >John,the rule book states class limits in cu. in not cc's. The cc's
> >mentioned are
> >"approx. liter equiv." pg. 14.Actually 92 cu. in. equals 1507.609888 cc's
> >and 1500
> >cc's equals 91.53555 cu. in. So anyway.........
> >
> >Tim Schoeny
> >
> >john robinson wrote:
> >
> > > Howdy,
> > > I'm running HGCC with a 91.43 c.i. engine, the rules book
states
> > > H class as 1.0 to 1.5 liter. 1.5 liter is 92.000. now maybe the rules
are
> > > applied differently, but I don't think so....
> > >
> > > At 10:06 AM 2/15/00 , you wrote:
> > > >Dan, thanks for the insight,but I'm having one of those brain f--t
days
> > > >and need
> > > >further clarification.If my motor is 91.7577 cu. in. it would be
legal
> > in H
> > > >classes and if I set a record we'd have to remove the head to verify
disp.
> > > >because it's not within 3% of the upper class limit-is that
> > right?Also, the
> > > >motor could displace 92.9999 cu. in. and still be legal-right?Sorry
for my
> > > >confusion but this is kindof important.
> > > > Tim
Schoeny
> > > >
> > > >Dan Warner wrote:
> > > >
> > > > > Tim & list,
> > > > >
> > > > > We certify the engine by direct measurement of the bore and
stroke,
> > formula
> > > > > in last paragraph of Sect II-1. If the engine is built to 3% below
the
> > > > upper
> > > > > limit of the class or 3% above the lower limit of the class (H =
> > between
> > > > > 63.86 to 90.02 ci) then the air pump may be used. The valve
> > operation must
> > > > > be disabled for the pump to work, Sect I-8.
> > > > >
> > > > > Dan W
> > > > > ----- Original Message -----
> > > > > From: tschoen <j82244@fuse.net>
> > > > > To: Dan Warner <dwarner@electrorent.com>
> > > > > Cc: <kturk@ala.net>; <land-speed@autox.team.net>
> > > > > Sent: Tuesday, February 15, 2000 6:33 AM
> > > > > Subject: Re: /MS rules
> > > > >
> > > > > > Dan,let me make sure I've got this right-an "H" class motor can
be
> > > > 92.9999
> > > > > cu.
> > > > > > in.and pass certification-right? How does SCTA measure
> > > > > displacement?Thanks.
> > > > > > Tim Schoeny
> > > > > >
> > > > > > Dan Warner wrote:
> > > > > >
> > > > > > > Keith,
> > > > > > >
> > > > > > > You are allowed out to 305.999999.... It looks like we will
have
> > > > dry ice
> > > > > the
> > > > > > > block when it is measured.
> > > > > > >
> > > > > > > Dan W
> > > > > > > ----- Original Message -----
> > > > > > > From: Keith Turk <kturk@ala.net>
> > > > > > > To: Dan Warner <dwarner@electrorent.com>
> > > > > > > Sent: Monday, February 14, 2000 1:53 PM
> > > > > > > Subject: Re: /MS rules
> > > > > > >
> > > > > > > > Hey Dan.... I am putting together this combination for this
> > year...
> > > > > and
> > > > > > > the
> > > > > > > > best I can come up with is a 305.11 cubic inch is there any
> > > > margin for
> > > > > > > > error here? The only other option I can think of is to
cheat
> > one of
> > > > > the
> > > > > > > > cylinders and spend bout 200 dolllars on a sleeve and
separate
> > > > > piston....
> > > > > > > > any thoughts? Keith
> > > > > > > >
> > > > > > > > ----------
> > > > > > > > > From: Dan Warner <dwarner@electrorent.com>
> > > > > > > > > To: John Beckett <landspeedracer@email.msn.com>
> > > > > > > > > Cc: land-speed@autox.team.net
> > > > > > > > > Subject: Re: /MS rules
> > > > > > > > > Date: Monday, February 14, 2000 9:45 AM
> > > > > > > > >
> > > > > > > > > The body must remain stock from the FIREWALL back. Doors
back
> > > > is too
> > > > > > > far,
> > > > > > > > > can't mod the cowl area. Each vehicle is different though,
the
> > > > doors
> > > > > > > > might
> > > > > > > > > be at the firewall on the 924. I don't pretend to know
> > every car
> > > > > ever
> > > > > > > > made,
> > > > > > > > > that's why I need documentation in impound.
> > > > > > > > >
> > > > > > > > > Dan W
> > > > > > > > > ----- Original Message -----
> > > > > > > > > From: John Beckett <landspeedracer@email.msn.com>
> > > > > > > > > To: George Mitchell <americanpartner@yahoo.com>; Dan
Warner
> > > > > > > > > <dwarner@electrorent.com>
> > > > > > > > > Cc: <land-speed@autox.team.net>
> > > > > > > > > Sent: Monday, February 14, 2000 7:12 AM
> > > > > > > > > Subject: /MS rules
> > > > > > > > >
> > > > > > > > >
> > > > > > > > > > George
> > > > > > > > > >
> > > > > > > > > > I believe its like /CC. You can modify the front end in
> > /MS as
> > > > > long as
> > > > > > > > the
> > > > > > > > > > body is original from the doors back. Might as well
> > stretch it to
> > > > > 130"
> > > > > > > > > > WB...to improve handling, and chop the top...to improve
> > frontal
> > > > > area,
> > > > > > > > > while
> > > > > > > > > > your at it.
> > > > > > > > > >
> > > > > > > > > > John Beckett, LSR #79
> > > > > > > > > >
> > > > > > > > > >
> > > > > > > > > > ----- Original Message -----
> > > > > > > > > > From: "George Mitchell" <americanpartner@yahoo.com>
> > > > > > > > > > To: "Keith Turk" <kturk@ala.net>; "Dan Warner"
> > > > > > > > <dwarner@electrorent.com>;
> > > > > > > > > > "Richard Kensicki" <richk@sparta-junction.com>
> > > > > > > > > > Cc: <land-speed@autox.team.net>
> > > > > > > > > > Sent: Monday, February 14, 2000 9:54 AM
> > > > > > > > > > Subject: Re: Thanks for Opel GT Input
> > > > > > > > > >
> > > > > > > > > >
> > > > > > > > > > > Hey list,
> > > > > > > > > > > It sounds like I picked the right class. Lots of
> > > > > > > > > > > competition. Still waiting on the rule book but...
> > > > > > > > > > > The Porsche body that I am building is a '78. It has
> > > > > > > > > > > what can only be described as sort of a "dirty" nose
> > > > > > > > > > > there is a plastic bumper out there and a lower
> > > > > > > > > > > valance that would surely put air underneath the car
> > > > > > > > > > > at speed.
> > > > > > > > > > > I could update the front with parts that I have for
> > > > > > > > > > > the later Euro Turbo car ('85) which has a hidden
> > > > > > > > > > > bumper and more of a scoopped or staight appearance
> > > > > > > > > > > (think Nascar front end).
> > > > > > > > > > > With the liberal aero rules in M/S would this
> > > > > > > > > > > "updating" be legal? This would be easier for me and
> > > > > > > > > > > the modification would be quick and have somewhat
> > > > > > > > > > > proven aero.
> > > > > > > > > > > George in DC
> > > > > > > > > > >
> > > > > > > > > > >
> > > > > > > > > > > --- Keith Turk <kturk@ala.net> wrote:
> > > > > > > > > > > > Yep Dan..... John Rains didn't ruin D/B/Galt.... he
> > > > > > > > > > > > simply moved the record
> > > > > > > > > > > > out of my pocket book.... I don't have to have his
> > > > > > > > > > > > car to go that fast... I
> > > > > > > > > > > > got to have his MOTOR.... and sans that.... Might as
> > > > > > > > > > > > well build a MS... and
> > > > > > > > > > > > Have at it... I am not building a Berkley... I am
> > > > > > > > > > > > going to build a
> > > > > > > > > > > > Bugeye... little bigger but not enough that a little
> > > > > > > > > > > > HP won't make up for
> > > > > > > > > > > > it....
> > > > > > > > > > > >
> > > > > > > > > > > > Look at Doug Odom.... his Bugeye just got in the Two
> > > > > > > > > > > > Club....K
> > > > > > > > > > > >
> > > > > > > > > > > > ----------
> > > > > > > > > > > > > From: Dan Warner <dwarner@electrorent.com>
> > > > > > > > > > > > > To: Richard Kensicki <richk@sparta-junction.com>
> > > > > > > > > > > > > Cc: land-speed@autox.team.net
> > > > > > > > > > > > > Subject: Re: Thanks for Opel GT Input
> > > > > > > > > > > > > Date: Monday, February 14, 2000 7:15 AM
> > > > > > > > > > > > >
> > > > > > > > > > > > > Richard,
> > > > > > > > > > > > >
> > > > > > > > > > > > > The answer to your question re: the Benham & Carr
> > > > > > > > > > > > Berkley on the 2000
> > > > > > > > > > > > > rulebook cover is easy. The M/S class is
> > > > > > > > > > > > currently/probably the class
> > > > > > > > > > > > most
> > > > > > > > > > > > > open for innovation. A small base vehicle which
> > > > > > > > > > > > was sold as a sports car,
> > > > > > > > > > > > > 130" wb, any frame, and liberal aero make for some
> > > > > > > > > > > > strange bed fellows.
> > > > > > > > > > > > > Engine size aside, as long as an entrant can
> > > > > > > > > > > > provide documentation as to
> > > > > > > > > > > > the
> > > > > > > > > > > > > availability of the base car and the stock
> > > > > > > > > > > > dimensions so that impound can
> > > > > > > > > > > > > verify the legality of the car, that would make
> > > > > > > > > > > > Leonard Carr's car (no
> > > > > > > > > > > > pun
> > > > > > > > > > > > > intended) one of the best choices for class. As in
> > > > > > > > > > > > the past the uproar
> > > > > > > > > > > > that
> > > > > > > > > > > > > this vehicle has destroyed the class "everyone has
> > > > > > > > > > > > to have one" is in the
> > > > > > > > > > > > > wind. When Ron Benham first brought out his Monza
> > > > > > > > > > > > then the Crosley that
> > > > > > > > > > > > Earl
> > > > > > > > > > > > > Wooden currently runs the cry was the same. As you
> > > > > > > > > > > > can see other racers
> > > > > > > > > > > > have
> > > > > > > > > > > > > found ways to compete and set records in various
> > > > > > > > > > > > classes against these
> > > > > > > > > > > > cars
> > > > > > > > > > > > > without using the body dujour.
> > > > > > > > > > > > >
> > > > > > > > > > > > > What are your questions regarding the legality of
> > > > > > > > > > > > the Berkley? Maybe I
> > > > > > > > > > > > can
> > > > > > > > > > > > > help.
> > > > > > > > > > > > >
> > > > > > > > > > > > > Dan W
> > > > > > > > > > > > > ----- Original Message -----
> > > > > > > > > > > > > From: Richard Kensicki <richk@sparta-junction.com>
> > > > > > > > > > > > > To: <land-speed@autox.team.net>
> > > > > > > > > > > > > Sent: Friday, February 11, 2000 4:26 PM
> > > > > > > > > > > > > Subject: Thanks for Opel GT Input
> > > > > > > > > > > > >
> > > > > > > > > > > > >
> > > > > > > > > > > > > > Thanks for all the replies about a possible Opel
> > > > > > > > > > > > GT for the mile. Are
> > > > > > > > > > > > > > there any pictures of Bill Ward's Opel on line?
> > > > > > > > > > > > > >
> > > > > > > > > > > > > > I keep rereading the rule book section for
> > > > > > > > > > > > modified sports and then
> > > > > > > > > > > > look
> > > > > > > > > > > > > > at the rule book cover (2000 edition) and say
> > > > > > > > > > > > (not out loud) how does
> > > > > > > > > > > > > > that car run as B modified sports? I must be too
> > > > > > > > > > > > legalistic.
> > > > > > > > > > > > > >
> > > > > > > > > > > > > > Rich
> > > > > > > > > > > > > >
> > > > > > > > > > > > >
> > > > > > > > > > > >
> > > > > > > > > > > >
> > > > > > > > > > > Do You Yahoo!?
> > > > > > > > > >
> > > > > > > > > >
> > > > > > > > > >
> > > > > > > > >
> > > > > > > >
> > > > > >
> > >
> > > John Robinson, Mechanician
> > > Mechanical Engineering University of Wisconsin
> > > 1513 University Ave.
> > > Madison, Wi. 53706
> > > 608-262-3606
> > > FAX 608-265-2316
> > > Current World Land Speed Record Holder
> > > Bonneville Salt Flats
> > > H/GCC 92 cu.in. 1980 Dodge Colt
> > > 131.333 MPH set 1995
> > > 136.666 MPH set 1996
>
>
> John Robinson, Mechanician
> Mechanical Engineering University of Wisconsin
> 1513 University Ave.
> Madison, Wi. 53706
> 608-262-3606
> FAX 608-265-2316
> Current World Land Speed Record Holder
> Bonneville Salt Flats
> H/GCC 92 cu.in. 1980 Dodge Colt
> 131.333 MPH set 1995
> 136.666 MPH set 1996
>
>
|