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The rotor speed is obviously the same inside & out but in terms of the swe=
pt area of the pad, as you move out from the centerline, the larger diamete=
r means that the speed of the disc relative to the pad increases, more heat=
, higher wear.I have all of mine tapered straight down the sides, no angle =
cut @ bottom, but that serves the same function.Once you get the taper righ=
t, you can use all of the pad...
Glen Efinger
On Wednesday, July 3, 2024 at 03:11:30 PM EDT, JS Performance Motoring,=
LLC <jason@jsperformancemotoring.com> wrote: =20
Hi Scott,=C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 I've attached a picture showing what I was r=
eferring to as far as pad shape.
I've started rotating between two sets of pads each race weekend.=C2=A0 I t=
rue them up between races.=C2=A0 =C2=A0It's not extreme, but there's enough=
taper wear during half of a weekend that I notice a slightly better pedal =
feel after swapping=C2=A0them out.=C2=A0=C2=A0
Jason SukeyJS Performance Motoring, LLC
440.984.7720jason@jsperformancemotoring.com
https://www.facebook.com/JSPerformanceMotoring/
On Wed, Jul 3, 2024 at 2:51=E2=80=AFPM Scott Janzen <sjanzen@me.com> wrote:
OK, I=E2=80=99m confused and hoping to learn something here.I agree, the pa=
ds wear more on the outside, I=E2=80=99m guessing in part also due to the h=
igher velocity of the rotor at that point, in addition to the heat - relate=
d issues.However, if you get the friction material shaped as a trapezoid, d=
oesn=E2=80=99t that result in either:a) the piston stays square, the back o=
f the pad stays square against the piston, and the outer edge of the pad is=
the only part contacting the rotor and it just wears down until there is f=
ull contact, orb) the pad surface rests square against the rotor, the back =
of the pad is at an angle, forcing the piston to cock in the bore and causi=
ng more wear on those parts?
Personally, when the pads get worn to the point where there is noticeable t=
aper, I generally have found they are well more than half gone and I just r=
eplace them.=C2=A0 I like my brakes to be at max performance.=C2=A0 Same de=
al with rotors - especially stock ones are cheap for these cars, though I h=
ave gotten to splurging on the grooved, dimpled ones that do seem to provid=
e a bit better braking and longer life of all components.
On Jul 3, 2024, at 12:25 PM, JS Performance Motoring, LLC via Fot <fot@auto=
x.team.net> wrote:
Glen, great point!
Seems that many race pad manufacturers=C2=A0try to give us the most materia=
l for our money with a big, rectangular friction material puck.=C2=A0 This =
definitely=C2=A0works against us with the ancient, two piston calipers we r=
un.=C2=A0 More heat, and more surface speed out towards the edge of the rot=
or is a recipe for radial taper.
I've found with enough complaining, I can get them to change the shape of t=
he pad to a trapezoid, and it really does help as you say.=C2=A0 It doesn't=
eliminate taper on my GT6 that's brutal on brakes, but it is a big step in=
the right direction.
In lieu of a properly designed friction puck, I sometimes use a big file to=
adjust the shape of the friction material to accomplish the same thing.
Running a thick spacer behind the pad as they wear down also helps keep the=
pistons true to the bore, and reduces heat transfer to the fluid/seals.
Jason SukeyJS Performance Motoring, LLC
440.984.7720jason@jsperformancemotoring.com
https://www.facebook.com/JSPerformanceMotoring/
On Wed, Jul 3, 2024 at 12:14=E2=80=AFPM fubog1 via Fot <fot@autox.team.net>=
wrote:
Another point to consider re pad selection, & I don't see mentioned, is ma=
ke sure that the pads have the correct taper ie backer flat down, the profi=
le of the pad side should taper down towards the center of the disc/bottom =
of the pad to some degree, a trapezoid with the long side up, ie not be rec=
tangular shape.Reason is that a lot more heat is generated towards the OD o=
f the disc, & they'll wear more; having less friction surface towards the b=
ottom of the pad w/a taper evens the pad wear, & it won't develop the other=
form of "taper", that usually requires that 1st brake pedal stab as the re=
ctangular shaped pads do as they wear.
This applies to all TRs.I've also seen many cases where "interchanges" don'=
t consider the shape of the pad, although the pads are dimensionally correc=
t & fit.
Glen Efinger
On Monday, July 1, 2024 at 04:43:42 PM EDT, Mark Fisher via Fot <fot@au=
tox.team.net> wrote: =20
Hi All:
What do you racers like for front pads on your Spits and GT6s?
Thanks in advance,
Mark Fisher
_______________________________________________
fot@autox.team.net
http://www.fot-racing.com
Archive: http://autox.team.net/archive http://www.team.net/pipermail/fot
m
_______________________________________________
fot@autox.team.net
http://www.fot-racing.com
Archive: http://autox.team.net/archive http://www.team.net/pipermail/fot
rmancemotoring.com
_______________________________________________
fot@autox.team.net
http://www.fot-racing.com
Archive: http://autox.team.net/archive http://www.team.net/pipermail/fot
m
=20
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<html><head></head><body><div class=3D"ydp8a438ae9yahoo-style-wrap" style=
=3D"font-family:Arial, Helvetica, sans-serif;font-size:16px;"><div></div>
<div dir=3D"ltr" data-setdir=3D"false">The rotor speed is obviously=
the same inside & out but in terms of the swept area of the pad, as yo=
u move out from the centerline, the larger diameter means that the speed of=
the disc relative to the pad increases, more heat, higher wear.</div><div =
dir=3D"ltr" data-setdir=3D"false">I have all of mine tapered straight down =
the sides, no angle cut @ bottom, but that serves the same function.</div><=
div dir=3D"ltr" data-setdir=3D"false">Once you get the taper right, you can=
use all of the pad...</div><div dir=3D"ltr" data-setdir=3D"false"><br></di=
v><div dir=3D"ltr" data-setdir=3D"false">Glen Efinger<br></div><div><br></d=
iv>
=20
</div><div id=3D"ydpedcff61yahoo_quoted_0336196563" class=3D"ydpedc=
ff61yahoo_quoted"><div class=3D"ydpedcff61yahoo-style-wrap" style=3D"font-f=
amily:Arial, Helvetica, sans-serif;font-size:16px;">
<div style=3D"font-family:'Helvetica Neue', Helvetica, Arial, s=
ans-serif;font-size:13px;color:#26282a;">
=20
<div class=3D"ydpedcff61quoted-text-header">
On Wednesday, July 3, 2024 at 03:11:30 PM EDT, JS P=
erformance Motoring, LLC <jason@jsperformancemotoring.com> wrote:
</div>
</div><div style=3D"font-family:'Helvetica Neue', Helvetica=
, Arial, sans-serif;font-size:13px;color:#26282a;border-left: 1px solid #cc=
c;padding-left: 8px;margin: 0px 0px 0px 8px" class=3D"ydpedcff61inline_repl=
y_quote_container" data-split-quote-node=3D"true">
<div><br></div><div><br></div>
<div><div id=3D"ydpedcff61yiv8455494798"><div><div dir=3D"l=
tr">Hi Scott,<div> I've attached a picture showing what=
I was referring to as far as pad shape.</div><div><br clear=3D"none"></div=
><div>I've started rotating between two sets of pads each race weekend.&nbs=
p; I true them up between races. It's not extreme, but there's =
enough taper wear during half of a weekend that I notice a slightly better =
pedal feel after swapping them out. </div><div><br clear=3D=
"none"></div><div><br clear=3D"all"><div><div dir=3D"ltr" class=3D"ydpedcff=
61yiv8455494798gmail_signature"><div dir=3D"ltr"><div><div dir=3D"ltr"><div=
><div dir=3D"ltr"><div dir=3D"ltr"><div dir=3D"ltr"><div>Jason Sukey</div><=
div><span></span><span></span>JS Performance Motoring, LLC<br clear=3D"none=
"></div><div>440.984.7720</div><div><a shape=3D"rect" href=3D"mailto:jason@=
jsperformancemotoring.com" rel=3D"nofollow" target=3D"_blank">jason@jsperfo=
rmancemotoring.com</a><br clear=3D"none"></div><div><a shape=3D"rect" href=
=3D"https://www.facebook.com/JSPerformanceMotoring/"; rel=3D"nofollow" targe=
t=3D"_blank">https://www.facebook.com/JSPerformanceMotoring/</a><br clear=
=3D"none"></div></div></div></div></div></div></div></div></div></div><br c=
lear=3D"none"></div></div><br clear=3D"none"><div id=3D"ydpedcff61yiv845549=
4798yqt33420" class=3D"ydpedcff61yiv8455494798yqt9326623096"><div class=3D"=
ydpedcff61yiv8455494798gmail_quote"><div dir=3D"ltr" class=3D"ydpedcff61yiv=
8455494798gmail_attr">On Wed, Jul 3, 2024 at 2:51=E2=80=AFPM Scott Janzen &=
lt;<a shape=3D"rect" href=3D"mailto:sjanzen@me.com"; rel=3D"nofollow" target=
=3D"_blank">sjanzen@me.com</a>> wrote:<br clear=3D"none"></div><blockquo=
te style=3D"margin:0px 0px 0px 0.8ex;border-left:1px solid rgb(204,204,204)=
;padding-left:1ex;" class=3D"ydpedcff61yiv8455494798gmail_quote"><div>OK, I=
=E2=80=99m confused and hoping to learn something here.<div>I agree, the pa=
ds wear more on the outside, I=E2=80=99m guessing in part also due to the h=
igher velocity of the rotor at that point, in addition to the heat - relate=
d issues.</div><div>However, if you get the friction material shaped as a t=
rapezoid, doesn=E2=80=99t that result in either:</div><div>a) the piston st=
ays square, the back of the pad stays square against the piston, and the ou=
ter edge of the pad is the only part contacting the rotor and it just wears=
down until there is full contact, or</div><div>b) the pad surface rests sq=
uare against the rotor, the back of the pad is at an angle, forcing the pis=
ton to cock in the bore and causing more wear on those parts?</div><div><br=
clear=3D"none"></div><div>Personally, when the pads get worn to the point =
where there is noticeable taper, I generally have found they are well more =
than half gone and I just replace them. I like my brakes to be at max=
performance. Same deal with rotors - especially stock ones are cheap=
for these cars, though I have gotten to splurging on the grooved, dimpled =
ones that do seem to provide a bit better braking and longer life of all co=
mponents.<br clear=3D"none"><div><br clear=3D"none"><div>On Jul 3, 2024, at=
12:25 PM, JS Performance Motoring, LLC via Fot <<a shape=3D"rect" href=
=3D"mailto:fot@autox.team.net"; rel=3D"nofollow" target=3D"_blank">fot@autox=
.team.net</a>> wrote:</div><br clear=3D"none"><div><div dir=3D"ltr">Glen=
, great point!<div><br clear=3D"none"></div><div>Seems that many race pad m=
anufacturers try to give us the most material for our money with a big=
, rectangular friction material puck. This definitely works agai=
nst us with the ancient, two piston calipers we run. More heat, and m=
ore surface speed out towards the edge of the rotor is a recipe for radial =
taper.</div><div><br clear=3D"none"></div><div>I've found with enough compl=
aining, I can get them to change the shape of the pad to a trapezoid, and i=
t really does help as you say. It doesn't eliminate taper on my GT6 t=
hat's brutal on brakes, but it is a big step in the right direction.</div><=
div><br clear=3D"none"></div><div>In lieu of a properly designed friction p=
uck, I sometimes use a big file to adjust the shape of the friction materia=
l to accomplish the same thing.</div><div><br clear=3D"none"></div><div>Run=
ning a thick spacer behind the pad as they wear down also helps keep the pi=
stons true to the bore, and reduces heat transfer to the fluid/seals.</div>=
<div><br clear=3D"none"></div><div><br clear=3D"none"></div><div><div><div =
dir=3D"ltr" class=3D"ydpedcff61yiv8455494798gmail_signature"><div dir=3D"lt=
r"><div><div dir=3D"ltr"><div><div dir=3D"ltr"><div dir=3D"ltr"><div dir=3D=
"ltr"><div>Jason Sukey</div><div><span></span><span></span>JS Performance M=
otoring, LLC<br clear=3D"none"></div><div>440.984.7720</div><div><a shape=
=3D"rect" href=3D"mailto:jason@jsperformancemotoring.com"; rel=3D"nofollow" =
target=3D"_blank">jason@jsperformancemotoring.com</a><br clear=3D"none"></d=
iv><div><a shape=3D"rect" href=3D"https://www.facebook.com/JSPerformanceMot=
oring/" rel=3D"nofollow" target=3D"_blank">https://www.facebook.com/JSPerfo=
rmanceMotoring/</a><br clear=3D"none"></div></div></div></div></div></div><=
/div></div></div></div><br clear=3D"none"></div></div><br clear=3D"none"><d=
iv class=3D"ydpedcff61yiv8455494798gmail_quote"><div dir=3D"ltr" class=3D"y=
dpedcff61yiv8455494798gmail_attr">On Wed, Jul 3, 2024 at 12:14=E2=80=AFPM f=
ubog1 via Fot <<a shape=3D"rect" href=3D"mailto:fot@autox.team.net"; rel=
=3D"nofollow" target=3D"_blank">fot@autox.team.net</a>> wrote:<br clear=
=3D"none"></div><blockquote style=3D"margin:0px 0px 0px 0.8ex;border-left:1=
px solid rgb(204,204,204);padding-left:1ex;" class=3D"ydpedcff61yiv84554947=
98gmail_quote"><div><div style=3D"font-family:Arial, Helvetica, sans-serif;=
font-size:16px;"><div></div>
<div dir=3D"ltr">Another point to consider re pad selection, & =
I don't see mentioned, is make sure that the pads have the correct taper ie=
backer flat down, the profile of the pad side should taper down towards th=
e center of the disc/bottom of the pad to some degree, a trapezoid with the=
long side up, ie not be rectangular shape.</div><div dir=3D"ltr">Reason is=
that a lot more heat is generated towards the OD of the disc, & they'l=
l wear more; having less friction surface towards the bottom of the pad w/a=
taper evens the pad wear, & it won't develop the other form of "taper"=
, that usually requires that 1st brake pedal stab as the rectangular shaped=
pads do as they wear.<br clear=3D"none"></div><div dir=3D"ltr">This applie=
s to all TRs.</div><div dir=3D"ltr">I've also seen many cases where "interc=
hanges" don't consider the shape of the pad, although the pads are dimensio=
nally correct & fit.</div><div dir=3D"ltr"><br clear=3D"none"></div><di=
v dir=3D"ltr">Glen Efinger<br clear=3D"none"></div><div><br clear=3D"none">=
</div>
=20
</div><div id=3D"ydpedcff61yiv8455494798m_1767234530914675755m_-287=
1832781424524163ydp23b6118fyahoo_quoted_0565246479"><div style=3D"font-fami=
ly:Arial, Helvetica, sans-serif;font-size:16px;">
<div style=3D"font-family:Helvetica, Arial, sans-serif;font-siz=
e:13px;color:rgb(38,40,42);">
=20
<div>
On Monday, July 1, 2024 at 04:43:42 PM EDT, Mark Fi=
sher via Fot <<a shape=3D"rect" href=3D"mailto:fot@autox.team.net"; rel=
=3D"nofollow" target=3D"_blank">fot@autox.team.net</a>> wrote:
</div>
</div><div style=3D"font-family:Helvetica, Arial, sans-seri=
f;font-size:13px;color:rgb(38,40,42);border-left:1px solid rgb(204,204,204)=
;padding-left:8px;margin:0px 0px 0px 8px;">
<div><br clear=3D"none"></div><div><br clear=3D"none"></div=
>
<div><div id=3D"ydpedcff61yiv8455494798m_176723453091467575=
5m_-2871832781424524163ydp23b6118fyiv3112983551"><div><div style=3D"font-fa=
mily:new times, serif;font-size:18px;"><div dir=3D"ltr">Hi All:</div><div d=
ir=3D"ltr"><br clear=3D"none"></div><div dir=3D"ltr">What do you racers lik=
e for front pads on your Spits and GT6s?</div><div dir=3D"ltr"><br clear=3D=
"none"></div><div dir=3D"ltr">Thanks in advance,</div><div dir=3D"ltr"><br =
clear=3D"none"></div><div dir=3D"ltr">Mark Fisher</div><div dir=3D"ltr"><br=
clear=3D"none"></div></div></div></div>___________________________________=
____________<br clear=3D"none"><a shape=3D"rect" href=3D"mailto:fot@autox.t=
eam.net" rel=3D"nofollow" target=3D"_blank">fot@autox.team.net</a><br clear=
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g.com/" rel=3D"nofollow" target=3D"_blank">http://www.fot-racing.com</a><br=
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</div></div></div>_______________________________________________<b=
r clear=3D"none">
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</blockquote></div>
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