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Thanks for all the replies. After playing with everything over the weekend=
, I was able to get the clutch to work by playing with the push rod length =
for the clutch MC. I'm not sure why this adjustment was needed, but somethi=
ng about the combination of parts resulted in inadequate motion at the clut=
ch fork. I'll sort it out later, but I may upgrade from the 3/4" clutch MC =
to a 7/8" as part of the eventual solution.
On the downside - I spun the thrust washers in the C/R tranny, so it looks =
like another case is toast.
But the car should run okay now, so I'm ready for Thompson in a couple of w=
eeks.
Thanks again!
rml
On Sunday, June 2, 2019, 6:07:51 PM EDT, Jason Sukey <jsukey@gmail.com>=
wrote: =20
=20
Hi Bob,
=C2=A0 If I didn't know any better your symptoms sound like a cracked or no=
t fully seated taper pin that's rocking back into the "home" position when =
not under force.=C2=A0 (A stretch i know...).
What about the difference in disc thickness; .010" probably translates into=
a lot more than=C2=A0 .010" additional required travel at the slave cylind=
er due science and stuff. :). What size master are you using with the Tilto=
n setup?
I hope you get it licked.
Jason
On Sat, Jun 1, 2019, 5:24 PM Robert Lang via Fot <fot@autox.team.net> wrote=
:
Hi,
I have a bum c/r tranny, so I figured I'd swap in a stock box just to run w=
hile I figure out the problem with the c/r box. Due to the differences with=
the input shaft, I had to switch to from the 21 spline clutch disk to the =
stock 10 spline disk. I have done this a couple of times in the past due to=
"pesky layshaft thrust washers" Both clutch disks measure to within .010 t=
hickness. I bolt everything up and verify via the clutch cross shaft approx=
. 1/2 inch of travel, which is normal. In neutral, the output flange spins =
freely. If I try to put the tranny in any gear and push the clutch pedal to=
the floor and try to spin the output flange by hand, it's locked. The clut=
ch is not releasing.
I've measured everything a few times looking for anything that looks amiss =
and so for, nothing seems to be an indication of why the clutch won't relea=
se.=20
Just to be sure that things are free in the bellhousing, I used a pipe on t=
he cross shaft arm and slowly applied pressure and the clutch DOES release =
so the indication is that I either have mechanical sloppyness or insufficie=
nt hydraulic linear motion. I verified that the pivots have no slop and non=
e of the pivot holes are egged out. I did find the pin to the pivot arm was=
slightly worn, so I threw in a 5/16 bolt to take up slack there, but that =
was to no avail.
In the process, I have tried switching in two different transmissions and s=
everal combinations of clutch disks and pressure plates and to this point t=
he clutch will not release when using the clutch pedal but will release as =
described above when using a pipe on the pivot arm.
I plan to re-install the original gear box (and the proper clutch disk) at =
some point just to see if the problem is resolved but I have no idea if tha=
t will work or not. I guess I just have to try and see. But to be honest, d=
oing around 8 transmission swaps in 12 hours is fairly physical not to ment=
ion the challenge due to the roll cage. But that's just me being a wimp. ;-=
) I mean, I could have used that time to actually FIX the C/R transmission =
- right?
All this is more or less a long way of asking - are there any documented me=
asurements for things like the "finger height of the pressure plate measure=
d to the clutch disk" or the height measure from the rear engine plate inte=
rface to the clutch fork pin? I bolted several PP's to a spare flywheel and=
came up with "around 1 inch" when the PP is bolted down, but that doesn't =
tell me anything like how far the fingers have to depress to open the clutc=
h up. As I mentioned earlier, 1/2" of lever motion usually is adequate, so =
think that part of the system is correct.
In any case, I'm confused and puzzled by this case not to mention slightly =
bummed because I had to miss some lapping at Lime Rock because the car isn'=
t in a running state right now. I thought about pinging "Click and Clack" a=
nd posing this as a "puzzlah", but decided not to. I also know that the sol=
ution should be obvious, but to this point is alluding me. So I need a kick=
in the right direction.
TIA,Bob Lang339-927-4489
_______________________________________________
fot@autox.team.net
http://www.fot-racing.com
Archive: http://autox.team.net/archive http://www.team.net/pipermail/fot
com
=20
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<html><head></head><body><div class=3D"ydp9d6ddae8yahoo-style-wrap" style=
=3D"font-family:Helvetica Neue, Helvetica, Arial, sans-serif;font-size:13px=
;"><div></div>
<div>Thanks for all the replies. After playing with everything over=
the weekend, I was able to get the clutch to work by playing with the push=
rod length for the clutch MC. I'm not sure why this adjustment was needed,=
but something about the combination of parts resulted in inadequate motion=
at the clutch fork. I'll sort it out later, but I may upgrade from the 3/4=
" clutch MC to a 7/8" as part of the eventual solution.</div><div><br></div=
><div>On the downside - I spun the thrust washers in the C/R tranny, so it =
looks like another case is toast.</div><div><br></div><div>But the car shou=
ld run okay now, so I'm ready for Thompson in a couple of weeks.</div><div>=
<br></div><div>Thanks again!</div><div><br></div><div>rml<br></div><div><br=
></div>
=20
</div><div id=3D"yahoo_quoted_9984879917" class=3D"yahoo_quoted">
<div style=3D"font-family:'Helvetica Neue', Helvetica, Arial, s=
ans-serif;font-size:13px;color:#26282a;">
=20
<div>
On Sunday, June 2, 2019, 6:07:51 PM EDT, Jason Sukey &l=
t;jsukey@gmail.com> wrote:
</div>
<div><br></div>
<div><br></div>
<div><div id=3D"yiv6973558967"><div><div><div>Hi Bob,<div><=
br clear=3D"none"></div> If I didn't know any better your symptoms so=
und like a cracked or not fully seated taper pin that's rocking back into t=
he "home" position when not under force. (A stretch i know...).</div>=
<div><br clear=3D"none"></div><div>What about the difference in disc thickn=
ess; .010" probably translates into a lot more than .010" additional =
required travel at the slave cylinder due science and stuff. :). What size =
master are you using with the Tilton setup?</div><div><br clear=3D"none"></=
div><div>I hope you get it licked.</div><div><br clear=3D"none"></div><div>=
Jason</div><div><br clear=3D"none"></div><div><br clear=3D"none"><br clear=
=3D"none"><div class=3D"yiv6973558967gmail_quote"><div class=3D"yiv69735589=
67yqt0279111145" id=3D"yiv6973558967yqt04240"><div class=3D"yiv6973558967gm=
ail_attr" dir=3D"ltr">On Sat, Jun 1, 2019, 5:24 PM Robert Lang via Fot <=
<a rel=3D"nofollow" shape=3D"rect" ymailto=3D"mailto:fot@autox.team.net"; ta=
rget=3D"_blank" href=3D"mailto:fot@autox.team.net";>fot@autox.team.net</a>&g=
t; wrote:<br clear=3D"none"></div><blockquote class=3D"yiv6973558967gmail_q=
uote" style=3D"margin:0 0 0 .8ex;border-left:1px #ccc solid;padding-left:1e=
x;"><div><div class=3D"yiv6973558967m_-1236374070186621336m_470738977292376=
1311yahoo-style-wrap" style=3D"font-family:Helvetica Neue, Helvetica, Arial=
, sans-serif;font-size:13px;"><div>Hi,</div><div><br clear=3D"none"></div><=
div>I have a bum c/r tranny, so I figured I'd swap in a stock box just to r=
un while I figure out the problem with the c/r box. Due to the differences =
with the input shaft, I had to switch to from the 21 spline clutch disk to =
the stock 10 spline disk. I have done this a couple of times in the past du=
e to "pesky layshaft thrust washers" Both clutch disks measure to within .0=
10 thickness. I bolt everything up and verify via the clutch cross shaft ap=
prox. 1/2 inch of travel, which is normal. In neutral, the output flange sp=
ins freely. If I try to put the tranny in any gear and push the clutch peda=
l to the floor and try to spin the output flange by hand, it's locked. The =
clutch is not releasing.</div><div><br clear=3D"none"></div><div>I've measu=
red everything a few times looking for anything that looks amiss and so for=
, nothing seems to be an indication of why the clutch won't release. <br cl=
ear=3D"none"></div><div><br clear=3D"none"></div><div>Just to be sure that =
things are free in the bellhousing, I used a pipe on the cross shaft arm an=
d slowly applied pressure and the clutch DOES release so the indication is =
that I either have mechanical sloppyness or insufficient hydraulic linear m=
otion. I verified that the pivots have no slop and none of the pivot holes =
are egged out. I did find the pin to the pivot arm was slightly worn, so I =
threw in a 5/16 bolt to take up slack there, but that was to no avail.</div=
><div><br clear=3D"none"></div><div>In the process, I have tried switching =
in two different transmissions and several combinations of clutch disks and=
pressure plates and to this point the clutch will not release when using t=
he clutch pedal but will release as described above when using a pipe on th=
e pivot arm.</div><div><br clear=3D"none"></div><div>I plan to re-install t=
he original gear box (and the proper clutch disk) at some point just to see=
if the problem is resolved but I have no idea if that will work or not. I =
guess I just have to try and see. But to be honest, doing around 8 transmis=
sion swaps in 12 hours is fairly physical not to mention the challenge due =
to the roll cage. But that's just me being a wimp. ;-) I mean, I could have=
used that time to actually FIX the C/R transmission - right?<br clear=3D"n=
one"></div><div><br clear=3D"none"></div><div>All this is more or less a lo=
ng way of asking - are there any documented measurements for things like th=
e "finger height of the pressure plate measured to the clutch disk" or the =
height measure from the rear engine plate interface to the clutch fork pin?=
I bolted several PP's to a spare flywheel and came up with "around 1 inch"=
when the PP is bolted down, but that doesn't tell me anything like how far=
the fingers have to depress to open the clutch up. As I mentioned earlier,=
1/2" of lever motion usually is adequate, so think that part of the system=
is correct.</div><div><br clear=3D"none"></div><div>In any case, I'm confu=
sed and puzzled by this case not to mention slightly bummed because I had t=
o miss some lapping at Lime Rock because the car isn't in a running state r=
ight now. I thought about pinging "Click and Clack" and posing this as a "p=
uzzlah", but decided not to. I also know that the solution should be obviou=
s, but to this point is alluding me. So I need a kick in the right directio=
n.</div><div><br clear=3D"none"></div><div>TIA,</div><div>Bob Lang</div><di=
v>339-927-4489<br clear=3D"none"></div></div></div>________________________=
_______________________<br clear=3D"none">
<a rel=3D"nofollow" shape=3D"rect" ymailto=3D"mailto:fot@autox.team.net"; ta=
rget=3D"_blank" href=3D"mailto:fot@autox.team.net";>fot@autox.team.net</a><b=
r clear=3D"none">
<br clear=3D"none">
<a rel=3D"nofollow" shape=3D"rect" target=3D"_blank" href=3D"http://www.fot=
-racing.com">http://www.fot-racing.com</a><br clear=3D"none">
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/www.team.net/donate.html">http://www.team.net/donate.html</a><br clear=3D"=
none">
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</blockquote></div></div></div></div></div></div></div>
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_______________________________________________
fot@autox.team.net
http://www.fot-racing.com
Archive: http://autox.team.net/archive http://www.team.net/pipermail/fot
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