Well it looks like we agree, but I would clarify the difference between
something that is done, and something that is legal.
The reason these laws stand is because nobody has challenged them. States
frequently pass laws that violate the Federal Constitution. And the Supreme
Court cannot initiate stepping in to change it -- instead, somebody who is
directly affected by the law must first sue the State to change it. Only
after the case is initiated can the Supreme Court step in. And even then,
they don't have to step in. They usually wait until the case resolves
itself. So they they rarely take a case until it reaches them through a long
string of appeals all initiated by the person who initiated the case to
begin with.
James Bakke comes to mind as an example . . . as does Rosa Parks. . .
Fortunately or unfortunately, depending on your point of view, it is such a
royal PITA to initiate such a case that it is done only rarely, and only for
the most egregious violations. Most of us are just too busy living
productive lives to bother with it, and I suppose that's as it should be.
My point is that just because the police do it, does not make it legal, nor
does it make it right. It's not much different from a thief who has not yet
been caught. He's breaking the law but nobody's done anything about it yet.
I should use a better example -- since I respect most police officers but I
don't respect thieves. But the idea is the same.
So I guess we agree. I would admire anybody who chose to fight it, but
personally I think life is too short and one must choose his battles more
wisely. . .
However, writing a letter is a lot less hassle and if more people did that I
believe things would change. Every time a politician receives a well
articulated and well reasoned letter from a pissed off citizen, I can tell
you it is a wake-up call. In other words, if people didn't act like sheep,
our "leaders" wouldn't be trying to herd us. . .
Regards,
-----Original Message-----
From: Steve Kupper [mailto:skupper@2xtreme.net]
Sent: Friday, August 10, 2001 16:08
To: Michael R. Clements; John J. Stimson-III; jeff
Cc: ba-autox@autox.team.net
Subject: RE: Fw: CA Special Alert
There is already a law where the police can put a roadblock and pull
everyone over. I am sure some of us went through a few sobriety checks in
our lives. If that passed. This one will stand too.
and yes, i am against both.
steve
-----Original Message-----
From: owner-ba-autox@autox.team.net
[mailto:owner-ba-autox@autox.team.net]On Behalf Of Michael R. Clements
Sent: Friday, August 10, 2001 10:37 AM
To: John J. Stimson-III; jeff
Cc: ba-autox@autox.team.net
Subject: RE: Fw: CA Special Alert
Personally, the portion of the law that I would contest is if officers can
do it indiscriminately. In general, the law should require that no officer
can ever detain anybody at any time, unless the officer has a "damn good
reason". This would include (a) a warrant, or (b) probable cause.
In the example you give, the clouds of thick smoke would constitute probable
cause. A general roadblock does not meet either of these conditions and
should thus be illegal (IMO, of course).
-----Original Message-----
From: owner-ba-autox@autox.team.net
[mailto:owner-ba-autox@autox.team.net]On Behalf Of John J. Stimson-III
Sent: Friday, August 10, 2001 10:51
To: jeff
Cc: ba-autox@autox.team.net
Subject: Re: Fw: CA Special Alert
Huh. So it is the opinion of the NMA that if a cop sees a car going
down the road pouring forth thick clouds of smoke, it should be
illegal for the cop to pull that car over?
On Fri, Aug 10, 2001 at 08:43:03AM -0700, jeff wrote:
> ----- Original Message -----
> From: "Eric Skrum (National Motorists Association)" <nma@motorists.org>
> To: "National Motorists Association" <nma@motorists.org>
> Sent: Thursday, August 09, 2001 12:31 PM
> Subject: CA Special Alert
>
>
> > Dear CA Members,
> >
> > A program is being implemented by the State of California which should
> cause
> > concern to all motorists and vehicle owners. A section in the California
> > Vehicle Code, Health and Safety Code section 44081, allows your car to
be
> > stopped for a smog equipment and emissions inspection. This was recently
> > reported by NMA member Nestor Valdes. On June 27, in Camarillo, a
> roadblock
> > was set up and vehicles were pulled over for inspection and testing. The
> > actual wording in the code says "The procedures may include pullovers
for
> > roadside emissions testing and inspection."
> >
> > If this concerns you, and it should, please take action by communicating
> > your thoughts to the Governor and to your elected representatives in the
> > California Senate and in the Assembly. We need to jump on this quickly,
> > before it spreads to all areas of the State. In your letters, e-mails,
and
> > phone calls, please reference the above California Vehicle Code # 44081.
> >
> > You can visit http://www.leginfo.ca.gov/index.html to find the contact
> > information for your elected representatives.
> >
> > You can visit http://www.ca.gov/state/portal/myca_homepage.jsp to find
the
> > Governor's home page and his contact information.
> >
> > Thank you
> >
> > Jim Thomas
> > CA Activist
> > fastestdog@prodigy.net
--
john@idsfa.net John Stimson
http://www.idsfa.net/~john/ HMC Physics '94
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