Subject: Re: [TR] Leaking rear seal on my TR3A's engine

From: Gerald Van Vlack <[email-masked]>
Date: Wed, 12 Feb 2025 16:23:01 +0000

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I'm following this rear seal thread and need to comment.  The newest seal d=
esign works well with a few items that need followed in conjunction with it=
's install.

  1.
Be certain that the flywheel bolts do not cut into the installed seal. If u=
sing the ARP bolts they need to be shortened a small amount by grinding the=
 ends slightly. I don't know if the stock bolts need the same modification =
but worth inspecting to be sure.
  2.
The best seal will be blamed for a leak when in fact it's not the source of=
 the leak. When installing the rear main bearing cap very careful attention=
 needs to be paid to sealing the cap to the block. That large rectangular s=
lot that requires a rope seal pounded into it if not sealed well enough wil=
l leak and frequently is the source of oil being seen dripping from the hol=
e in the bellhousing. And then folks blame the rear main seal when in fact =
it's that interface between the block and cap that is the source of the lea=
k.

My comment is don't blame the crank seal in many cases.

JVV

________________________________
From: Triumphs <[email-masked]> on behalf of Dave MacKay <=
[email-masked]>
Sent: Wednesday, February 12, 2025 10:39 AM
To: [email-masked] <[email-masked]>
Subject: [TR] Leaking rear seal on my TR3A's engine

I followed the recent exchange about =93TR Rear Crank Seal Rope?=94 with
interest and corresponded with all who replied to the OP. That has me
thinking about how I might address my situation.

In 2008, the engine in my TR3A was rebuilt. As part of that effort an OIL
SEAL CONVERSION KIT was fitted. The conversion required that the scroll on
the crankshaft be ground down. It has always leaked.

I had convinced myself that fixing the leak would be too much trouble and
too expensive to be worth doing. I envisioned having to replace the
crankshaft and then using a more modern conversion (Moss 837-160). I
wanted to check with the list to see if that=92s the case or not.

I believe --- but am not certain --- that the conversion was sourced from
Moss (perhaps p/n 837-006). I am aware that incorrect instructions were
provided with some of the conversion kits so that the crankshafts were
ground too small. I don=92t know if that=92s the case with my conversion: t=
he
crank may have been ground to the correct dimensions, or it might not have
been.

I have three questions:

1) Is there a way to check the crankshaft dimensions to see what it has
been ground to that doesn=92t require pulling the engine? I=92d like to kno=
w
if the crank had to ground to the correct dimensions or not.

2) If the crankshaft was ground to the wrong dimensions, is there a way to
fix it (e.g., special seal) short of replacing the crankshaft? Replacement
crankshafts are scarce and quite expensive (>USD$1600).

3) If the crankshaft was ground to the correct dimensions, what have
others done to keep that oil seal conversion from leaking?

I=92d welcome any input from those on this list.

Dave MacKay
1960 Triumph TR3A, s/n 68639L
near Toronto, Canada
** [email-masked] **

Archive: http://www.team.net/pipermail/triumphs  http://www.team.net/archiv=
e

[email-masked]

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<html>
<head>
<meta http-equiv=3D"Content-Type" content=3D"text/html; charset=3DWindows-1=
252">
<style type=3D"text/css" style=3D"display:none;"> P {margin-top:0;margin-bo=
ttom:0;} </style>
</head>
<body dir=3D"ltr">
<div class=3D"elementToProof" style=3D"font-family: Aptos, Aptos_EmbeddedFo=
nt, Aptos_MSFontService, Calibri, Helvetica, sans-serif; font-size: 11pt; c=
olor: rgb(0, 0, 0);">
I'm following this rear seal thread and need to comment.&nbsp; The newest s=
eal design works well with a few items that need followed in conjunction wi=
th it's install.</div>
<div class=3D"elementToProof" style=3D"font-family: Aptos, Aptos_EmbeddedFo=
nt, Aptos_MSFontService, Calibri, Helvetica, sans-serif; font-size: 11pt; c=
olor: rgb(0, 0, 0);">
<br>
</div>
<ol start=3D"1" data-editing-info=3D"{&quot;applyListStyleFromLevel&quot;:f=
alse,&quot;orderedStyleType&quot;:1}" style=3D"list-style-type: decimal;">
<li style=3D"font-family: Aptos, Aptos_EmbeddedFont, Aptos_MSFontService, C=
alibri, Helvetica, sans-serif; font-size: 11pt; color: rgb(0, 0, 0);">
<div class=3D"elementToProof">Be certain that the flywheel bolts do not cut=
 into the installed seal. If using the ARP bolts they need to be shortened =
a small amount by grinding the ends slightly. I don't know if the stock bol=
ts need the same modification but
 worth inspecting to be sure.</div>
</li><li style=3D"font-family: Aptos, Aptos_EmbeddedFont, Aptos_MSFontServi=
ce, Calibri, Helvetica, sans-serif; font-size: 11pt; color: rgb(0, 0, 0);">
<div class=3D"elementToProof">The best seal will be blamed for a leak when =
in fact it's not the source of the leak. When installing the rear main bear=
ing cap very careful attention needs to be paid to sealing the cap to the b=
lock. That large rectangular slot
 that requires a rope seal pounded into it if not sealed well&nbsp;enough w=
ill leak and frequently is the source of oil being seen dripping from the h=
ole in the bellhousing. And then folks blame the rear main seal when in fac=
t it's that interface between the block
 and cap that is the source of the leak.</div>
</li></ol>
<div class=3D"elementToProof" style=3D"font-family: Aptos, Aptos_EmbeddedFo=
nt, Aptos_MSFontService, Calibri, Helvetica, sans-serif; font-size: 11pt; c=
olor: rgb(0, 0, 0);">
My comment is don't blame the crank seal in many cases.</div>
<div class=3D"elementToProof" style=3D"font-family: Aptos, Aptos_EmbeddedFo=
nt, Aptos_MSFontService, Calibri, Helvetica, sans-serif; font-size: 11pt; c=
olor: rgb(0, 0, 0);">
<br>
</div>
<div class=3D"elementToProof" style=3D"font-family: Aptos, Aptos_EmbeddedFo=
nt, Aptos_MSFontService, Calibri, Helvetica, sans-serif; font-size: 11pt; c=
olor: rgb(0, 0, 0);">
JVV</div>
<div id=3D"appendonsend"></div>
<div style=3D"font-family:Aptos,Aptos_EmbeddedFont,Aptos_MSFontService,Cali=
bri,Helvetica,sans-serif; font-size:11pt; color:rgb(0,0,0)">
<br>
</div>
<hr tabindex=3D"-1" style=3D"display:inline-block; width:98%">
<div id=3D"divRplyFwdMsg" dir=3D"ltr"><font face=3D"Calibri, sans-serif" co=
lor=3D"#000000" style=3D"font-size:11pt"><b>From:</b> Triumphs &lt;triumphs=
[email-masked]&gt; on behalf of Dave MacKay &lt;[email-masked]&g=
t;<br>
<b>Sent:</b> Wednesday, February 12, 2025 10:39 AM<br>
<b>To:</b> [email-masked] &lt;[email-masked]&gt;<br>
<b>Subject:</b> [TR] Leaking rear seal on my TR3A's engine</font>
<div>&nbsp;</div>
</div>
<div class=3D"BodyFragment"><font size=3D"2"><span style=3D"font-size:11pt"=
<div class=3D"PlainText">I followed the recent exchange about =93TR Rear Cr=
ank Seal Rope?=94 with<br>
interest and corresponded with all who replied to the OP. That has me<br>
thinking about how I might address my situation.<br>
<br>
In 2008, the engine in my TR3A was rebuilt. As part of that effort an OIL<b=
r>
SEAL CONVERSION KIT was fitted. The conversion required that the scroll on<=
br>
the crankshaft be ground down. It has always leaked.<br>
<br>
I had convinced myself that fixing the leak would be too much trouble and<b=
r>
too expensive to be worth doing. I envisioned having to replace the<br>
crankshaft and then using a more modern conversion (Moss 837-160). I<br>
wanted to check with the list to see if that=92s the case or not.<br>
<br>
I believe --- but am not certain --- that the conversion was sourced from<b=
r>
Moss (perhaps p/n 837-006). I am aware that incorrect instructions were<br>
provided with some of the conversion kits so that the crankshafts were<br>
ground too small. I don=92t know if that=92s the case with my conversion: t=
he<br>
crank may have been ground to the correct dimensions, or it might not have<=
br>
been.<br>
<br>
I have three questions:<br>
<br>
1) Is there a way to check the crankshaft dimensions to see what it has<br>
been ground to that doesn=92t require pulling the engine? I=92d like to kno=
w<br>
if the crank had to ground to the correct dimensions or not.<br>
<br>
2) If the crankshaft was ground to the wrong dimensions, is there a way to<=
br>
fix it (e.g., special seal) short of replacing the crankshaft? Replacement<=
br>
crankshafts are scarce and quite expensive (&gt;USD$1600).<br>
<br>
3) If the crankshaft was ground to the correct dimensions, what have<br>
others done to keep that oil seal conversion from leaking?<br>
<br>
I=92d welcome any input from those on this list.<br>
<br>
Dave MacKay<br>
1960 Triumph TR3A, s/n 68639L<br>
near Toronto, Canada<br>
** [email-masked] **<br>
<br>
ble">http://www.team.net/donate.html</a><br>
Archive: <a href=3D"http://www.team.net/pipermail/triumphs" data-auth=3D"No=
tApplicable">
http://www.team.net/pipermail/triumphs</a>&nbsp; <a href=3D"http://www.team=
.net/archive" data-auth=3D"NotApplicable">
<br>
hs/[email-masked]" data-auth=3D"NotApplicable">
http://autox.team.net/mailman/options/triumphs/[email-masked]</a><br=
</div>
</span></font></div>
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** [email-masked] **

Archive: http://www.team.net/pipermail/triumphs  http://www.team.net/archive

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From: "J.C. Hassall" <[email-masked]>
Date: Wed, 12 Feb 2025 12:33:57 -0500

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I also bought the Moss seal kit which had the incorrect scroll dimension.
Yep, it leaked.  The fix was to shorten the seal spring by (as I recall)
1/2" and very carefully trim the seal faces slightly to ensure they were
perfectly parallel.  It was a fiddly process but worked.  Thanks to Tony
Drews (FoT racer) for the tip.  For exact dimensions, check Tony's web page
(https://tonydrews.com/uncle_jacks_engine_building_tips.htm#Crank).

hth

jim

On Wed, Feb 12, 2025 at 10:50=E2=80=AFAM Dave MacKay <[email-masked]> wro=
te:

> I followed the recent exchange about =E2=80=9CTR Rear Crank Seal Rope?=E2=
=80=9D with
> SEAL CONVERSION KIT was fitted. The conversion required that the scroll o=
n
> wanted to check with the list to see if that=E2=80=99s the case or not.
>
> ground too small. I don=E2=80=99t know if that=E2=80=99s the case with my=
 conversion: the
> crank may have been ground to the correct dimensions, or it might not hav=
e
> been ground to that doesn=E2=80=99t require pulling the engine? I=E2=80=
=99d like to know
> 2) If the crankshaft was ground to the wrong dimensions, is there a way t=
o
> fix it (e.g., special seal) short of replacing the crankshaft? Replacemen=
t
> I=E2=80=99d welcome any input from those on this list.
>
> Dave MacKay
> Donate: http://www.team.net/donate.html
> Unsubscribe/Manage:
> http://autox.team.net/mailman/options/triumphs/[email-masked]
>

--=20
jim  W4BEA

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<div dir=3D"ltr">I also bought the Moss seal kit which had the incorrect sc=
roll dimension.=C2=A0 Yep, it leaked.=C2=A0 The fix was to shorten the seal=
 spring by (as I recall) 1/2&quot; and very carefully trim the seal faces s=
lightly to ensure they were perfectly parallel.=C2=A0 It was a fiddly proce=
ss but worked.=C2=A0 Thanks to Tony Drews (FoT racer) for the tip.=C2=A0 Fo=
r exact dimensions, check Tony&#39;s web page (<a href=3D"https://tonydrews=
.com/uncle_jacks_engine_building_tips.htm#Crank">https://tonydrews.com/uncl=
e_jacks_engine_building_tips.htm#Crank</a>).=C2=A0=C2=A0<div><br></div><div=
>hth</div><div><br></div><div>jim</div></div><br><div class=3D"gmail_quote =
gmail_quote_container"><div dir=3D"ltr" class=3D"gmail_attr">On Wed, Feb 12=
, 2025 at 10:50=E2=80=AFAM Dave MacKay &lt;<a href=3D"mailto:dave@mdmackay.=
ca">[email-masked]</a>&gt; wrote:<br></div><blockquote class=3D"gmail_quo=
te" style=3D"margin:0px 0px 0px 0.8ex;border-left:1px solid rgb(204,204,204=
);padding-left:1ex">I followed the recent exchange about =E2=80=9CTR Rear C=
rank Seal Rope?=E2=80=9D with<br>
interest and corresponded with all who replied to the OP. That has me<br>
thinking about how I might address my situation.<br>
<br>
In 2008, the engine in my TR3A was rebuilt. As part of that effort an OIL<b=
r>
SEAL CONVERSION KIT was fitted. The conversion required that the scroll on<=
br>
the crankshaft be ground down. It has always leaked.<br>
<br>
I had convinced myself that fixing the leak would be too much trouble and<b=
r>
too expensive to be worth doing. I envisioned having to replace the<br>
crankshaft and then using a more modern conversion (Moss 837-160). I<br>
wanted to check with the list to see if that=E2=80=99s the case or not.<br>
<br>
I believe --- but am not certain --- that the conversion was sourced from<b=
r>
Moss (perhaps p/n 837-006). I am aware that incorrect instructions were<br>
provided with some of the conversion kits so that the crankshafts were<br>
ground too small. I don=E2=80=99t know if that=E2=80=99s the case with my c=
onversion: the<br>
crank may have been ground to the correct dimensions, or it might not have<=
br>
been.<br>
<br>
I have three questions:<br>
<br>
1) Is there a way to check the crankshaft dimensions to see what it has<br>
been ground to that doesn=E2=80=99t require pulling the engine? I=E2=80=99d=
 like to know<br>
if the crank had to ground to the correct dimensions or not.<br>
<br>
2) If the crankshaft was ground to the wrong dimensions, is there a way to<=
br>
fix it (e.g., special seal) short of replacing the crankshaft? Replacement<=
br>
crankshafts are scarce and quite expensive (&gt;USD$1600).<br>
<br>
3) If the crankshaft was ground to the correct dimensions, what have<br>
others done to keep that oil seal conversion from leaking?<br>
<br>
I=E2=80=99d welcome any input from those on this list.<br>
<br>
Dave MacKay<br>
1960 Triumph TR3A, s/n 68639L<br>
near Toronto, Canada<br>
** <a href=3D"mailto:[email-masked]" target=3D"_blank">triumphs@au=
tox.team.net</a> **<br>
<br>
et=3D"_blank">http://www.team.net/donate.html</a><br>
Archive: <a href=3D"http://www.team.net/pipermail/triumphs" rel=3D"noreferr=
er" target=3D"_blank">http://www.team.net/pipermail/triumphs</a>=C2=A0 <a h=
ref=3D"http://www.team.net/archive" rel=3D"noreferrer" target=3D"_blank">ht=
tp://www.team.net/archive</a><br>
<br>
hs/[email-masked]" rel=3D"noreferrer" target=3D"_blank">http://autox.te=
am.net/mailman/options/triumphs/[email-masked]</a><br>
</blockquote></div><div><br clear=3D"all"></div><div><br></div><span class=
=3D"gmail_signature_prefix">-- </span><br><div dir=3D"ltr" class=3D"gmail_s=
ignature"><div dir=3D"ltr"><div><div dir=3D"ltr"><div><div dir=3D"ltr"><div=
><div dir=3D"ltr"><div><div><span style=3D"color:rgb(0,0,0);font-family:ari=
al,helvetica,sans-serif;background-color:rgb(250,250,251)">jim=C2=A0 W4BEA<=
/span></div></div></div></div></div></div></div></div></div></div>

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From: Frank Fisher <[email-masked]>
Date: Wed, 12 Feb 2025 22:38:22 +0000 (UTC)

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 1) Is there a way to check the crankshaft dimensions to see what it has
been ground to that doesn=E2=80=99t require pulling the engine? I=E2=80=99d=
 like to know
if the crank had to ground to the correct dimensions or not.
you would have to pull the oil pan off and remove the rear main cap and the=
n you could get a measurement.
2) If the crankshaft was ground to the wrong dimensions, is there a way to
fix it (e.g., special seal) short of replacing the crankshaft? Replacement
crankshafts are scarce and quite expensive (>USD$1600).
nope. if its undersize your done.
3) If the crankshaft was ground to the correct dimensions, what have
others done to keep that oil seal conversion from leaking?

i have done 2 that required the crank be machined.i found in both cases tha=
t i needed to shim something. the new scroll seal was interfering with the =
flywheel. im thinking i had to shim the flywheel with a single washer. just=
 be sure you check that things turn ok with the transmission mounted before=
 you put it in the car. yes i put it in the car the first time without chec=
king.its been more that 10 years since i did those builds so forgive the me=
mory.the other thing i did when assembling the scroll and seal was:1) make =
sure the scroll and rubber seal are very clean by wiping with alcohol or si=
milar.2) then i wiped the crankshaft at the point of touching the seal with=
 oil on my fingers. just enough to leave a thin film.=C2=A03) where the rub=
ber seal comes together i applied some RTV silicone adhesive to the joint. =
its ok if it oozes a little as the oil on the crank will not allow it to st=
ick to the crank.4) once assembled let it sit for about a week to let the s=
ealant fully cure. do not turn the crank, do not move any parts.having done=
 this method twice i have had what id like to say is no leak, but a small s=
tain occasionally has been experienced.

Frank

    On Wednesday, February 12, 2025 at 07:56:15 AM PST, Dave MacKay <dave@m=
dmackay.ca> wrote: =20
=20
 I followed the recent exchange about =E2=80=9CTR Rear Crank Seal Rope?=E2=
=80=9D with
interest and corresponded with all who replied to the OP. That has me
thinking about how I might address my situation.

onversion: the

I have three questions:

 like to know

Dave MacKay

Archive: http://www.team.net/pipermail/triumphs=C2=A0 http://www.team.net/a=
rchive

[email-masked]
 =20
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<html><head></head><body><div class=3D"ydpd02c096fyahoo-style-wrap" style=
=3D"font-family:Helvetica Neue, Helvetica, Arial, sans-serif;font-size:16px=
;"><div></div>
        <div dir=3D"ltr" data-setdir=3D"false"><div><div dir=3D"ltr" style=
=3D"font-family: Helvetica Neue, Helvetica, Arial, sans-serif;">1) Is there=
 a way to check the crankshaft dimensions to see what it has<br></div><div =
dir=3D"ltr" style=3D"font-family: Helvetica Neue, Helvetica, Arial, sans-se=
rif;">been ground to that doesn=E2=80=99t require pulling the engine? I=E2=
=80=99d like to know<br></div><div dir=3D"ltr" style=3D"font-family: Helvet=
ica Neue, Helvetica, Arial, sans-serif;">if the crank had to ground to the =
correct dimensions or not.<br></div><div dir=3D"ltr" style=3D"font-family: =
Helvetica Neue, Helvetica, Arial, sans-serif;" data-setdir=3D"false"><font =
color=3D"#cb008e">you would have to pull the oil pan off and remove the rea=
r main cap and then you could get a measurement.</font></div><div dir=3D"lt=
r" style=3D"font-family: Helvetica Neue, Helvetica, Arial, sans-serif;"><br=
></div><div dir=3D"ltr" style=3D"font-family: Helvetica Neue, Helvetica, Ar=
ial, sans-serif;">2) If the crankshaft was ground to the wrong dimensions, =
is there a way to<br></div><div dir=3D"ltr" style=3D"font-family: Helvetica=
 Neue, Helvetica, Arial, sans-serif;">fix it (e.g., special seal) short of =
replacing the crankshaft? Replacement<br></div><div dir=3D"ltr" style=3D"fo=
nt-family: Helvetica Neue, Helvetica, Arial, sans-serif;">crankshafts are s=
carce and quite expensive (&gt;USD$1600).<br></div><div dir=3D"ltr" style=
=3D"font-family: Helvetica Neue, Helvetica, Arial, sans-serif;" data-setdir=
=3D"false"><font color=3D"#cb008e">nope. if its undersize your done.</font>=
</div><div dir=3D"ltr" style=3D"font-family: Helvetica Neue, Helvetica, Ari=
al, sans-serif;"><br></div><div dir=3D"ltr" style=3D"font-family: Helvetica=
 Neue, Helvetica, Arial, sans-serif;">3) If the crankshaft was ground to th=
e correct dimensions, what have<br></div><div dir=3D"ltr" style=3D"font-fam=
ily: Helvetica Neue, Helvetica, Arial, sans-serif;">others done to keep tha=
t oil seal conversion from leaking?</div></div><br></div><div dir=3D"ltr" d=
ata-setdir=3D"false"><font color=3D"#cb008e"><br></font></div><div dir=3D"l=
tr" data-setdir=3D"false"><div><div dir=3D"ltr" style=3D"font-family: Helve=
tica Neue, Helvetica, Arial, sans-serif; font-size: 16px;"><font color=3D"#=
cb008e">i have done 2 that required the crank be machined.</font></div><div=
 dir=3D"ltr" style=3D"font-family: Helvetica Neue, Helvetica, Arial, sans-s=
erif; font-size: 16px;"><font color=3D"#cb008e">i found in both cases that =
i needed to shim something. the new scroll seal was interfering with the fl=
ywheel. im thinking i had to shim the flywheel with a single washer. just b=
e sure you check that things turn ok with the transmission mounted before y=
ou put it in the car. yes i put it in the car the first time without checki=
ng.</font></div><div dir=3D"ltr" style=3D"font-family: Helvetica Neue, Helv=
etica, Arial, sans-serif; font-size: 16px;"><font color=3D"#cb008e">its bee=
n more that 10 years since i did those builds so forgive the memory.</font>=
</div><div dir=3D"ltr" style=3D"font-family: Helvetica Neue, Helvetica, Ari=
al, sans-serif; font-size: 16px;"><font color=3D"#cb008e">the other thing i=
 did when assembling the scroll and seal was:</font></div><div dir=3D"ltr" =
style=3D"font-family: Helvetica Neue, Helvetica, Arial, sans-serif; font-si=
ze: 16px;"><font color=3D"#cb008e">1) make sure the scroll and rubber seal =
are very clean by wiping with alcohol or similar.</font></div><div dir=3D"l=
tr" style=3D"font-family: Helvetica Neue, Helvetica, Arial, sans-serif; fon=
t-size: 16px;"><font color=3D"#cb008e">2) then i wiped the crankshaft at th=
e point of touching the seal with oil on my fingers. just enough to leave a=
 thin film.</font></div><div dir=3D"ltr" style=3D"font-family: Helvetica Ne=
ue, Helvetica, Arial, sans-serif; font-size: 16px;"><font color=3D"#cb008e"=
>&nbsp;3) where the rubber seal comes together i applied some RTV silicone =
adhesive to the joint. its ok if it oozes a little as the oil on the crank =
will not allow it to stick to the crank.</font></div><div dir=3D"ltr" style=
=3D"font-family: Helvetica Neue, Helvetica, Arial, sans-serif; font-size: 1=
6px;"><font color=3D"#cb008e">4) once assembled let it sit for about a week=
 to let the sealant fully cure. do not turn the crank, do not move any part=
s.</font></div><div dir=3D"ltr" style=3D"font-family: Helvetica Neue, Helve=
tica, Arial, sans-serif; font-size: 16px;"><font color=3D"#cb008e">having d=
one this method twice i have had what id like to say is no leak, but a smal=
l stain occasionally has been experienced.</font></div></div><br></div><div=
 dir=3D"ltr" data-setdir=3D"false"><br></div><div dir=3D"ltr" data-setdir=
=3D"false">Frank</div><div dir=3D"ltr" data-setdir=3D"false"><br></div><div=
 dir=3D"ltr" data-setdir=3D"false"><br></div><div><br></div>
       =20
        </div><div id=3D"ydp2827218dyahoo_quoted_0277346035" class=3D"ydp28=
27218dyahoo_quoted">
            <div style=3D"font-family:'Helvetica Neue', Helvetica, Arial, s=
ans-serif;font-size:13px;color:#26282a;">
               =20
                <div>
                        On Wednesday, February 12, 2025 at 07:56:15 AM PST,=
 Dave MacKay &lt;[email-masked]&gt; wrote:
                    </div>
                    <div><br></div>
                    <div><br></div>
               =20
               =20
                <div><div dir=3D"ltr">I followed the recent exchange about =
=E2=80=9CTR Rear Crank Seal Rope?=E2=80=9D with<br></div><div dir=3D"ltr">i=
nterest and corresponded with all who replied to the OP. That has me<br></d=
iv><div dir=3D"ltr">thinking about how I might address my situation.<br></d=
iv><div dir=3D"ltr"><br></div><div dir=3D"ltr">In 2008, the engine in my TR=
3A was rebuilt. As part of that effort an OIL<br></div><div dir=3D"ltr">SEA=
L CONVERSION KIT was fitted. The conversion required that the scroll on<br>=
</div><div dir=3D"ltr">the crankshaft be ground down. It has always leaked.=
<br></div><div dir=3D"ltr"><br></div><div dir=3D"ltr">I had convinced mysel=
f that fixing the leak would be too much trouble and<br></div><div dir=3D"l=
tr">too expensive to be worth doing. I envisioned having to replace the<br>=
</div><div dir=3D"ltr">crankshaft and then using a more modern conversion (=
Moss 837-160). I<br></div><div dir=3D"ltr">wanted to check with the list to=
 see if that=E2=80=99s the case or not.<br></div><div dir=3D"ltr"><br></div=
><div dir=3D"ltr">I believe --- but am not certain --- that the conversion =
was sourced from<br></div><div dir=3D"ltr">Moss (perhaps p/n 837-006). I am=
 aware that incorrect instructions were<br></div><div dir=3D"ltr">provided =
with some of the conversion kits so that the crankshafts were<br></div><div=
 dir=3D"ltr">ground too small. I don=E2=80=99t know if that=E2=80=99s the c=
ase with my conversion: the<br></div><div dir=3D"ltr">crank may have been g=
round to the correct dimensions, or it might not have<br></div><div dir=3D"=
ltr">been.<br></div><div dir=3D"ltr"><br></div><div dir=3D"ltr">I have thre=
e questions:<br></div><div dir=3D"ltr"><br></div><div dir=3D"ltr">1) Is the=
re a way to check the crankshaft dimensions to see what it has<br></div><di=
v dir=3D"ltr">been ground to that doesn=E2=80=99t require pulling the engin=
e? I=E2=80=99d like to know<br></div><div dir=3D"ltr">if the crank had to g=
round to the correct dimensions or not.<br></div><div dir=3D"ltr"><br></div=
><div dir=3D"ltr">2) If the crankshaft was ground to the wrong dimensions, =
is there a way to<br></div><div dir=3D"ltr">fix it (e.g., special seal) sho=
rt of replacing the crankshaft? Replacement<br></div><div dir=3D"ltr">crank=
shafts are scarce and quite expensive (&gt;USD$1600).<br></div><div dir=3D"=
ltr"><br></div><div dir=3D"ltr">3) If the crankshaft was ground to the corr=
ect dimensions, what have<br></div><div dir=3D"ltr">others done to keep tha=
t oil seal conversion from leaking?<br></div><div dir=3D"ltr"><br></div><di=
v dir=3D"ltr">I=E2=80=99d welcome any input from those on this list.<br></d=
iv><div dir=3D"ltr"><br></div><div dir=3D"ltr">Dave MacKay<br></div><div di=
r=3D"ltr">1960 Triumph TR3A, s/n 68639L<br></div><div dir=3D"ltr">near Toro=
nto, Canada<br></div><div dir=3D"ltr">** <a href=3D"mailto:[email-masked]=
eam.net" rel=3D"nofollow" target=3D"_blank">[email-masked]</a> **<=
br></div><div dir=3D"ltr"><br></div><div dir=3D"ltr">Donate: <a href=3D"htt=
p://www.team.net/donate.html" rel=3D"nofollow" target=3D"_blank">http://www=
.team.net/donate.html</a><br></div><div dir=3D"ltr">Archive: <a href=3D"htt=
p://www.team.net/pipermail/triumphs" rel=3D"nofollow" target=3D"_blank">htt=
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t/archive" rel=3D"nofollow" target=3D"_blank">http://www.team.net/archive</=
a><br></div><div dir=3D"ltr"><br></div><div dir=3D"ltr">Unsubscribe/Manage:=
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ns/triumphs/[email-masked]</a><br></div></div>
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From: Frank Fisher <[email-masked]>
Date: Wed, 12 Feb 2025 22:41:19 +0000 (UTC)

--===============3158768746868174728==
	boundary="----=_Part_73770_47597772.1739400079393"

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 Gerald=C2=A0thank you for your comment #1.and to those who have seen my la=
st 2 responses, the interference is a Gerald remained me.i did not grind th=
e flywheel bolts, i just added a washer under the head.the memory is fickle=
 thing eh?
Frank

    On Wednesday, February 12, 2025 at 08:40:45 AM PST, Gerald Van Vlack <j=
[email-masked]> wrote: =20
=20
 I'm following this rear seal thread and need to comment.=C2=A0 The newest =
seal design works well with a few items that need followed in conjunction w=
ith it's install.
  =20
   - Be certain that the flywheel bolts do not cut into the installed seal.=
 If using the ARP bolts they need to be shortened a small amount by grindin=
g the ends slightly. I don't know if the stock bolts need the same modifica=
tion but worth inspecting to be sure.
   - The best seal will be blamed for a leak when in fact it's not the sour=
ce of the leak. When installing the rear main bearing cap very careful atte=
ntion needs to be paid to sealing the cap to the block. That large rectangu=
lar slot that requires a rope seal pounded into it if not sealed well=C2=A0=
enough will leak and frequently is the source of oil being seen dripping fr=
om the hole in the bellhousing. And then folks blame the rear main seal whe=
n in fact it's that interface between the block and cap that is the source =
of the leak.
My comment is don't blame the crank seal in many cases.
JVV
From: Triumphs <[email-masked]> on behalf of Dave MacKay <=
[email-masked]>
Sent: Wednesday, February 12, 2025 10:39 AM
To: [email-masked] <[email-masked]>
Subject: [TR] Leaking rear seal on my TR3A's engine=C2=A0I followed the rec=
ent exchange about =E2=80=9CTR Rear Crank Seal Rope?=E2=80=9D with
interest and corresponded with all who replied to the OP. That has me
thinking about how I might address my situation.

I have three questions:

Dave MacKay

[email-masked]

[email-masked]
 =20
------=_Part_73770_47597772.1739400079393
Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable

<html><head></head><body><div class=3D"ydpc0068be8yahoo-style-wrap" style=
=3D"font-family:Helvetica Neue, Helvetica, Arial, sans-serif;font-size:16px=
;"><div></div>
        <div dir=3D"ltr" data-setdir=3D"false">Gerald&nbsp;</div><div dir=
=3D"ltr" data-setdir=3D"false">thank you for your comment #1.</div><div dir=
=3D"ltr" data-setdir=3D"false">and to those who have seen my last 2 respons=
es, the interference is a Gerald remained me.</div><div dir=3D"ltr" data-se=
tdir=3D"false">i did not grind the flywheel bolts, i just added a washer un=
der the head.</div><div dir=3D"ltr" data-setdir=3D"false">the memory is fic=
kle thing eh?</div><div dir=3D"ltr" data-setdir=3D"false"><br></div><div di=
r=3D"ltr" data-setdir=3D"false">Frank</div><div dir=3D"ltr" data-setdir=3D"=
false"><br></div><div dir=3D"ltr" data-setdir=3D"false"><br></div><div dir=
=3D"ltr" data-setdir=3D"false"><br></div><div><br></div>
       =20
        </div><div id=3D"ydpcd329a03yahoo_quoted_0376345569" class=3D"ydpcd=
329a03yahoo_quoted">
            <div style=3D"font-family:'Helvetica Neue', Helvetica, Arial, s=
ans-serif;font-size:13px;color:#26282a;">
               =20
                <div>
                        On Wednesday, February 12, 2025 at 08:40:45 AM PST,=
 Gerald Van Vlack &lt;[email-masked]&gt; wrote:
                    </div>
                    <div><br></div>
                    <div><br></div>
               =20
               =20
                <div><div id=3D"ydpcd329a03yiv8250301294"><div dir=3D"ltr">
<div style=3D"font-family:Aptos, Calibri, Helvetica, sans-serif;font-size:1=
1pt;color:rgb(0, 0, 0);" class=3D"ydpcd329a03yiv8250301294elementToProof">
I'm following this rear seal thread and need to comment.&nbsp; The newest s=
eal design works well with a few items that need followed in conjunction wi=
th it's install.</div>
<div style=3D"font-family:Aptos, Calibri, Helvetica, sans-serif;font-size:1=
1pt;color:rgb(0, 0, 0);" class=3D"ydpcd329a03yiv8250301294elementToProof">
<br clear=3D"none">
</div>
<ol start=3D"1" style=3D"list-style-type:decimal;"><li style=3D"font-family=
:Aptos, Calibri, Helvetica, sans-serif;font-size:11pt;color:rgb(0, 0, 0);">
<div class=3D"ydpcd329a03yiv8250301294elementToProof">Be certain that the f=
lywheel bolts do not cut into the installed seal. If using the ARP bolts th=
ey need to be shortened a small amount by grinding the ends slightly. I don=
't know if the stock bolts need the same modification but
 worth inspecting to be sure.</div>
</li><li style=3D"font-family:Aptos, Calibri, Helvetica, sans-serif;font-si=
ze:11pt;color:rgb(0, 0, 0);">
<div class=3D"ydpcd329a03yiv8250301294elementToProof">The best seal will be=
 blamed for a leak when in fact it's not the source of the leak. When insta=
lling the rear main bearing cap very careful attention needs to be paid to =
sealing the cap to the block. That large rectangular slot
 that requires a rope seal pounded into it if not sealed well&nbsp;enough w=
ill leak and frequently is the source of oil being seen dripping from the h=
ole in the bellhousing. And then folks blame the rear main seal when in fac=
t it's that interface between the block
 and cap that is the source of the leak.</div>
</li></ol>
<div style=3D"font-family:Aptos, Calibri, Helvetica, sans-serif;font-size:1=
1pt;color:rgb(0, 0, 0);" class=3D"ydpcd329a03yiv8250301294elementToProof">
My comment is don't blame the crank seal in many cases.</div>
<div style=3D"font-family:Aptos, Calibri, Helvetica, sans-serif;font-size:1=
1pt;color:rgb(0, 0, 0);" class=3D"ydpcd329a03yiv8250301294elementToProof">
<br clear=3D"none">
</div>
<div style=3D"font-family:Aptos, Calibri, Helvetica, sans-serif;font-size:1=
1pt;color:rgb(0, 0, 0);" class=3D"ydpcd329a03yiv8250301294elementToProof">
JVV</div>
<div id=3D"ydpcd329a03yiv8250301294appendonsend"></div>
<div style=3D"font-family:Aptos, Calibri, Helvetica, sans-serif;font-size:1=
1pt;color:rgb(0,0,0);">
<br clear=3D"none">
</div>
<hr tabindex=3D"-1" style=3D"display:inline-block;width:98%;">
<div id=3D"ydpcd329a03yiv8250301294yqtfd04841" class=3D"ydpcd329a03yiv82503=
01294yqt4175319239"><div dir=3D"ltr" id=3D"ydpcd329a03yiv8250301294divRplyF=
wdMsg"><font face=3D"Calibri, sans-serif" color=3D"#000000" style=3D"font-s=
ize:11pt;"><b>From:</b> Triumphs &lt;[email-masked]&gt; on=
 behalf of Dave MacKay &lt;[email-masked]&gt;<br clear=3D"none">
<b>Sent:</b> Wednesday, February 12, 2025 10:39 AM<br clear=3D"none">
<b>To:</b> [email-masked] &lt;[email-masked]&gt;<br clear=
=3D"none">
<b>Subject:</b> [TR] Leaking rear seal on my TR3A's engine</font>
<div>&nbsp;</div>
</div>
</div><div class=3D"ydpcd329a03yiv8250301294BodyFragment"><div id=3D"ydpcd3=
29a03yiv8250301294yqtfd92825" class=3D"ydpcd329a03yiv8250301294yqt417531923=
9"><font size=3D"2"><span style=3D"font-size:11pt;">
</span></font></div><div class=3D"ydpcd329a03yiv8250301294PlainText"><div i=
d=3D"ydpcd329a03yiv8250301294yqtfd48993" class=3D"ydpcd329a03yiv8250301294y=
qt4175319239">I followed the recent exchange about =E2=80=9CTR Rear Crank S=
eal Rope?=E2=80=9D with<br clear=3D"none">
interest and corresponded with all who replied to the OP. That has me<br cl=
ear=3D"none">
thinking about how I might address my situation.<br clear=3D"none">
<br clear=3D"none">
In 2008, the engine in my TR3A was rebuilt. As part of that effort an OIL<b=
r clear=3D"none">
SEAL CONVERSION KIT was fitted. The conversion required that the scroll on<=
br clear=3D"none">
the crankshaft be ground down. It has always leaked.<br clear=3D"none">
<br clear=3D"none">
I had convinced myself that fixing the leak would be too much trouble and<b=
r clear=3D"none">
too expensive to be worth doing. I envisioned having to replace the<br clea=
r=3D"none">
crankshaft and then using a more modern conversion (Moss 837-160). I<br cle=
ar=3D"none">
wanted to check with the list to see if that=E2=80=99s the case or not.<br =
clear=3D"none">
<br clear=3D"none">
I believe --- but am not certain --- that the conversion was sourced from<b=
r clear=3D"none">
Moss (perhaps p/n 837-006). I am aware that incorrect instructions were<br =
clear=3D"none">
provided with some of the conversion kits so that the crankshafts were<br c=
lear=3D"none">
ground too small. I don=E2=80=99t know if that=E2=80=99s the case with my c=
onversion: the<br clear=3D"none">
crank may have been ground to the correct dimensions, or it might not have<=
br clear=3D"none">
been.<br clear=3D"none">
<br clear=3D"none">
I have three questions:<br clear=3D"none">
<br clear=3D"none">
1) Is there a way to check the crankshaft dimensions to see what it has<br =
clear=3D"none">
been ground to that doesn=E2=80=99t require pulling the engine? I=E2=80=99d=
 like to know<br clear=3D"none">
if the crank had to ground to the correct dimensions or not.<br clear=3D"no=
ne">
<br clear=3D"none">
2) If the crankshaft was ground to the wrong dimensions, is there a way to<=
br clear=3D"none">
fix it (e.g., special seal) short of replacing the crankshaft? Replacement<=
br clear=3D"none">
crankshafts are scarce and quite expensive (&gt;USD$1600).<br clear=3D"none=
">
<br clear=3D"none">
3) If the crankshaft was ground to the correct dimensions, what have<br cle=
ar=3D"none">
others done to keep that oil seal conversion from leaking?<br clear=3D"none=
">
<br clear=3D"none">
I=E2=80=99d welcome any input from those on this list.<br clear=3D"none">
<br clear=3D"none">
Dave MacKay<br clear=3D"none">
1960 Triumph TR3A, s/n 68639L<br clear=3D"none">
near Toronto, Canada<br clear=3D"none">
** [email-masked] **<br clear=3D"none">
<br clear=3D"none">
ofollow" target=3D"_blank">http://www.team.net/donate.html</a><br clear=3D"=
none">
Archive: <a shape=3D"rect" href=3D"http://www.team.net/pipermail/triumphs" =
rel=3D"nofollow" target=3D"_blank">
http://www.team.net/pipermail/triumphs</a>&nbsp; <a shape=3D"rect" href=3D"=
<br clear=3D"none">
ailman/options/triumphs/[email-masked]" rel=3D"nofollow" target=3D"_=
blank">
http://autox.team.net/mailman/options/triumphs/[email-masked]</a><di=
v id=3D"ydpcd329a03yiv8250301294yqtfd96306" class=3D"ydpcd329a03yiv82503012=
94yqt4175319239"><br clear=3D"none">
</div></div><div id=3D"ydpcd329a03yiv8250301294yqtfd46253" class=3D"ydpcd32=
9a03yiv8250301294yqt4175319239">
</div></div><div id=3D"ydpcd329a03yiv8250301294yqtfd66437" class=3D"ydpcd32=
9a03yiv8250301294yqt4175319239">
</div></div></div><div class=3D"ydpcd329a03yqt4175319239" id=3D"ydpcd329a03=
yqtfd43999">** <a shape=3D"rect" href=3D"mailto:[email-masked]" re=
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From: Tony Drews <[email-masked]>
Date: Wed, 12 Feb 2025 17:35:49 -0600

This is a multi-part message in MIME format.
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If you use a washer, make sure it's hardened.  If not it will wear and 
your flywheel will get loose.  Not good.

Cheers, Tony Drews

On 2/12/2025 4:41 PM, Frank Fisher wrote:
> Gerald
> thank you for your comment #1.
> and to those who have seen my last 2 responses, the interference is a 
> Gerald remained me.
> i did not grind the flywheel bolts, i just added a washer under the head.
> the memory is fickle thing eh?
>
> Frank
>
>
>
>
> On Wednesday, February 12, 2025 at 08:40:45 AM PST, Gerald Van Vlack 
> <[email-masked]> wrote:
>
>
> I'm following this rear seal thread and need to comment.  The newest 
> seal design works well with a few items that need followed in 
> conjunction with it's install.
>
> 1.
>     Be certain that the flywheel bolts do not cut into the installed
>     seal. If using the ARP bolts they need to be shortened a small
>     amount by grinding the ends slightly. I don't know if the stock
>     bolts need the same modification but worth inspecting to be sure.
> 2.
>     The best seal will be blamed for a leak when in fact it's not the
>     source of the leak. When installing the rear main bearing cap very
>     careful attention needs to be paid to sealing the cap to the
>     block. That large rectangular slot that requires a rope seal
>     pounded into it if not sealed well enough will leak and frequently
>     is the source of oil being seen dripping from the hole in the
>     bellhousing. And then folks blame the rear main seal when in fact
>     it's that interface between the block and cap that is the source
>     of the leak.
>
> ------------------------------------------------------------------------
> *From:* Triumphs <[email-masked]> on behalf of Dave 
> MacKay <[email-masked]>
> *Sent:* Wednesday, February 12, 2025 10:39 AM
> *To:* [email-masked] <[email-masked]>
> *Subject:* [TR] Leaking rear seal on my TR3A's engine
> I followed the recent exchange about “TR Rear Crank Seal Rope?” with
> wanted to check with the list to see if that’s the case or not.
>
> ground too small. I don’t know if that’s the case with my conversion: the
> been ground to that doesn’t require pulling the engine? I’d like to know
> I’d welcome any input from those on this list.
>
> Dave MacKay
> http://autox.team.net/mailman/options/triumphs/[email-masked]
>
> http://autox.team.net/mailman/options/triumphs/[email-masked]
>
> [email-masked] **
>
> Donate:http://www.team.net/donate.html
> Archive:http://www.team.net/pipermail/triumphs  http://www.team.net/archive
>
> Unsubscribe/Manage:http://autox.team.net/mailman/options/triumphs/[email-masked]
--------------VWK1mqDwvEjEeM5vpWiA7pJg
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    <meta http-equiv="Content-Type" content="text/html; charset=UTF-8">
  </head>
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    <p>If you use a washer, make sure it's hardened.  If not it will
      wear and your flywheel will get loose.  Not good.</p>
    <p>Cheers, Tony Drews<br>
    </p>
    <div class="moz-cite-prefix">On 2/12/2025 4:41 PM, Frank Fisher
      wrote:<br>
    </div>
    <blockquote type="cite"
      cite="mid:[email-masked]">
      <meta http-equiv="content-type" content="text/html; charset=UTF-8">
      <div class="ydpc0068be8yahoo-style-wrap"
style="font-family:Helvetica Neue, Helvetica, Arial, sans-serif;font-size:16px;">
        <div dir="ltr" data-setdir="false">Gerald </div>
        <div dir="ltr" data-setdir="false">thank you for your comment
          #1.</div>
        <div dir="ltr" data-setdir="false">and to those who have seen my
          last 2 responses, the interference is a Gerald remained me.</div>
        <div dir="ltr" data-setdir="false">i did not grind the flywheel
          bolts, i just added a washer under the head.</div>
        <div dir="ltr" data-setdir="false">the memory is fickle thing
          eh?</div>
        <div dir="ltr" data-setdir="false"><br>
        </div>
        <div dir="ltr" data-setdir="false">Frank</div>
        <div dir="ltr" data-setdir="false"><br>
        </div>
        <div dir="ltr" data-setdir="false"><br>
        </div>
        <div dir="ltr" data-setdir="false"><br>
        </div>
        <div><br>
        </div>
      </div>
      <div id="ydpcd329a03yahoo_quoted_0376345569"
        class="ydpcd329a03yahoo_quoted">
        <div
style="font-family:'Helvetica Neue', Helvetica, Arial, sans-serif;font-size:13px;color:#26282a;">
          <div> On Wednesday, February 12, 2025 at 08:40:45 AM PST,
            Gerald Van Vlack <a class="moz-txt-link-rfc2396E" href="mailto:[email-masked]">&lt;[email-masked]&gt;</a> wrote: </div>
          <div><br>
          </div>
          <div><br>
          </div>
          <div>
            <div id="ydpcd329a03yiv8250301294">
              <div dir="ltr">
                <div
style="font-family:Aptos, Calibri, Helvetica, sans-serif;font-size:11pt;color:rgb(0, 0, 0);"
                  class="ydpcd329a03yiv8250301294elementToProof">
                  I'm following this rear seal thread and need to
                  comment.  The newest seal design works well with a few
                  items that need followed in conjunction with it's
                  install.</div>
                <div
style="font-family:Aptos, Calibri, Helvetica, sans-serif;font-size:11pt;color:rgb(0, 0, 0);"
                  class="ydpcd329a03yiv8250301294elementToProof">
                  <br clear="none">
                </div>
                <ol start="1" style="list-style-type:decimal;">
                  <li
style="font-family:Aptos, Calibri, Helvetica, sans-serif;font-size:11pt;color:rgb(0, 0, 0);">
                    <div class="ydpcd329a03yiv8250301294elementToProof">Be
                      certain that the flywheel bolts do not cut into
                      the installed seal. If using the ARP bolts they
                      need to be shortened a small amount by grinding
                      the ends slightly. I don't know if the stock bolts
                      need the same modification but worth inspecting to
                      be sure.</div>
                  </li>
                  <li
style="font-family:Aptos, Calibri, Helvetica, sans-serif;font-size:11pt;color:rgb(0, 0, 0);">
                    <div class="ydpcd329a03yiv8250301294elementToProof">The
                      best seal will be blamed for a leak when in fact
                      it's not the source of the leak. When installing
                      the rear main bearing cap very careful attention
                      needs to be paid to sealing the cap to the block.
                      That large rectangular slot that requires a rope
                      seal pounded into it if not sealed well enough
                      will leak and frequently is the source of oil
                      being seen dripping from the hole in the
                      bellhousing. And then folks blame the rear main
                      seal when in fact it's that interface between the
                      block and cap that is the source of the leak.</div>
                  </li>
                </ol>
                <div
style="font-family:Aptos, Calibri, Helvetica, sans-serif;font-size:11pt;color:rgb(0, 0, 0);"
                  class="ydpcd329a03yiv8250301294elementToProof">
                  My comment is don't blame the crank seal in many
                  cases.</div>
                <div
style="font-family:Aptos, Calibri, Helvetica, sans-serif;font-size:11pt;color:rgb(0, 0, 0);"
                  class="ydpcd329a03yiv8250301294elementToProof">
                  <br clear="none">
                </div>
                <div
style="font-family:Aptos, Calibri, Helvetica, sans-serif;font-size:11pt;color:rgb(0, 0, 0);"
                  class="ydpcd329a03yiv8250301294elementToProof">
                  JVV</div>
                <div
style="font-family:Aptos, Calibri, Helvetica, sans-serif;font-size:11pt;color:rgb(0,0,0);">
                  <br clear="none">
                </div>
                <hr tabindex="-1"
                  style="display:inline-block;width:98%;">
                <div id="ydpcd329a03yiv8250301294yqtfd04841"
                  class="ydpcd329a03yiv8250301294yqt4175319239">
                  <div dir="ltr"
                    id="ydpcd329a03yiv8250301294divRplyFwdMsg"><font
                      face="Calibri, sans-serif" color="#000000"
                      style="font-size:11pt;"><b>From:</b> Triumphs
                      <a class="moz-txt-link-rfc2396E" href="mailto:[email-masked]">&lt;[email-masked]&gt;</a> on behalf
                      of Dave MacKay <a class="moz-txt-link-rfc2396E" href="mailto:[email-masked]">&lt;[email-masked]&gt;</a><br
                        clear="none">
                      <b>Sent:</b> Wednesday, February 12, 2025 10:39 AM<br
                        clear="none">
                      <b>To:</b> <a class="moz-txt-link-abbreviated" href="mailto:[email-masked]">[email-masked]</a>
                      <a class="moz-txt-link-rfc2396E" href="mailto:[email-masked]">&lt;[email-masked]&gt;</a><br clear="none">
                      <b>Subject:</b> [TR] Leaking rear seal on my
                      TR3A's engine</font>
                    <div> </div>
                  </div>
                </div>
                <div class="ydpcd329a03yiv8250301294BodyFragment">
                  <div id="ydpcd329a03yiv8250301294yqtfd92825"
                    class="ydpcd329a03yiv8250301294yqt4175319239"><font
                      size="2"><span style="font-size:11pt;">
                      </span></font></div>
                  <div class="ydpcd329a03yiv8250301294PlainText">
                    <div id="ydpcd329a03yiv8250301294yqtfd48993"
                      class="ydpcd329a03yiv8250301294yqt4175319239">I
                      followed the recent exchange about “TR Rear Crank
                      Seal Rope?” with<br clear="none">
                      interest and corresponded with all who replied to
                      the OP. That has me<br clear="none">
                      thinking about how I might address my situation.<br
                        clear="none">
                      <br clear="none">
                      In 2008, the engine in my TR3A was rebuilt. As
                      part of that effort an OIL<br clear="none">
                      SEAL CONVERSION KIT was fitted. The conversion
                      required that the scroll on<br clear="none">
                      the crankshaft be ground down. It has always
                      leaked.<br clear="none">
                      <br clear="none">
                      I had convinced myself that fixing the leak would
                      be too much trouble and<br clear="none">
                      too expensive to be worth doing. I envisioned
                      having to replace the<br clear="none">
                      crankshaft and then using a more modern conversion
                      (Moss 837-160). I<br clear="none">
                      wanted to check with the list to see if that’s the
                      case or not.<br clear="none">
                      <br clear="none">
                      I believe --- but am not certain --- that the
                      conversion was sourced from<br clear="none">
                      Moss (perhaps p/n 837-006). I am aware that
                      incorrect instructions were<br clear="none">
                      provided with some of the conversion kits so that
                      the crankshafts were<br clear="none">
                      ground too small. I don’t know if that’s the case
                      with my conversion: the<br clear="none">
                      crank may have been ground to the correct
                      dimensions, or it might not have<br clear="none">
                      been.<br clear="none">
                      <br clear="none">
                      I have three questions:<br clear="none">
                      <br clear="none">
                      1) Is there a way to check the crankshaft
                      dimensions to see what it has<br clear="none">
                      been ground to that doesn’t require pulling the
                      engine? I’d like to know<br clear="none">
                      if the crank had to ground to the correct
                      dimensions or not.<br clear="none">
                      <br clear="none">
                      2) If the crankshaft was ground to the wrong
                      dimensions, is there a way to<br clear="none">
                      fix it (e.g., special seal) short of replacing the
                      crankshaft? Replacement<br clear="none">
                      crankshafts are scarce and quite expensive
                      (&gt;USD$1600).<br clear="none">
                      <br clear="none">
                      3) If the crankshaft was ground to the correct
                      dimensions, what have<br clear="none">
                      others done to keep that oil seal conversion from
                      leaking?<br clear="none">
                      <br clear="none">
                      I’d welcome any input from those on this list.<br
                        clear="none">
                      <br clear="none">
                      Dave MacKay<br clear="none">
                      1960 Triumph TR3A, s/n 68639L<br clear="none">
                      near Toronto, Canada<br clear="none">
                      ** <a class="moz-txt-link-abbreviated" href="mailto:[email-masked]">[email-masked]</a> **<br clear="none">
                      <br clear="none">
                      Donate: <a shape="rect"
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                  class="ydpcd329a03yiv8250301294yqt4175319239">
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            <div class="ydpcd329a03yqt4175319239"
              id="ydpcd329a03yqtfd43999">** <a shape="rect"
                href="mailto:[email-masked]" rel="nofollow"
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      <pre wrap="" class="moz-quote-pre">** <a class="moz-txt-link-abbreviated" href="mailto:[email-masked]">[email-masked]</a> **

Archive: <a class="moz-txt-link-freetext" href="http://www.team.net/pipermail/triumphs">http://www.team.net/pipermail/triumphs</a>  <a class="moz-txt-link-freetext" href="http://www.team.net/archive">http://www.team.net/archive</a>

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  </body>
</html>

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--===============3477295181082889185==
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--===============3477295181082889185==--

---

From: Frank Fisher <[email-masked]>
Date: Thu, 13 Feb 2025 01:03:03 +0000 (UTC)

--===============3445720273679050000==
	boundary="----=_Part_11961255_253140490.1739408583790"

------=_Part_11961255_253140490.1739408583790
Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable

 i have been using grade 8 only.=C2=A0but that said its been 10 years or mo=
re with no problems. can remember if for sure i used grade 8

    On Wednesday, February 12, 2025 at 04:27:23 PM PST, Tony Drews <tony@to=
nydrews.com> wrote: =20
=20
 =20
If you use a washer, make sure it's hardened.=C2=A0 If not it will wear and=
 your flywheel will get loose.=C2=A0 Not good.
=20
Cheers, Tony Drews
=20
 On 2/12/2025 4:41 PM, Frank Fisher wrote:
 =20
=20
 Gerald=C2=A0 thank you for your comment #1. and to those who have seen my =
last 2 responses, the interference is a Gerald remained me. i did not grind=
 the flywheel bolts, i just added a washer under the head. the memory is fi=
ckle thing eh?=20
  Frank=20
 =20
 =20
 =20
      On Wednesday, February 12, 2025 at 08:40:45 AM PST, Gerald Van Vlack =
<[email-masked]> wrote: =20
 =20
      I'm following this rear seal thread and need to comment.=C2=A0 The ne=
west seal design works well with a few items that need followed in conjunct=
ion with it's install. =20
    =20
   -  Be certain that the flywheel bolts do not cut into the installed seal=
. If using the ARP bolts they need to be shortened a small amount by grindi=
ng the ends slightly. I don't know if the stock bolts need the same modific=
ation but worth inspecting to be sure.=20
   -  The best seal will be blamed for a leak when in fact it's not the sou=
rce of the leak. When installing the rear main bearing cap very careful att=
ention needs to be paid to sealing the cap to the block. That large rectang=
ular slot that requires a rope seal pounded into it if not sealed well=C2=
=A0enough will leak and frequently is the source of oil being seen dripping=
 from the hole in the bellhousing. And then folks blame the rear main seal =
when in fact it's that interface between the block and cap that is the sour=
ce of the leak.=20
  My comment is don't blame the crank seal in many cases. =20
   JVV =20
    From: Triumphs <[email-masked]> on behalf of Dave MacK=
ay <[email-masked]>
 Sent: Wednesday, February 12, 2025 10:39 AM
 To: [email-masked] <[email-masked]>
 Subject: [TR] Leaking rear seal on my TR3A's engine =C2=A0       I followe=
d the recent exchange about =E2=80=9CTR Rear Crank Seal Rope?=E2=80=9D with
 interest and corresponded with all who replied to the OP. That has me
 thinking about how I might address my situation.
=20
 In 2008, the engine in my TR3A was rebuilt. As part of that effort an OIL
 SEAL CONVERSION KIT was fitted. The conversion required that the scroll on
 the crankshaft be ground down. It has always leaked.
=20
 I had convinced myself that fixing the leak would be too much trouble and
 too expensive to be worth doing. I envisioned having to replace the
 crankshaft and then using a more modern conversion (Moss 837-160). I
 wanted to check with the list to see if that=E2=80=99s the case or not.
=20
 I believe --- but am not certain --- that the conversion was sourced from
 Moss (perhaps p/n 837-006). I am aware that incorrect instructions were
 provided with some of the conversion kits so that the crankshafts were
 ground too small. I don=E2=80=99t know if that=E2=80=99s the case with my =
conversion: the
 crank may have been ground to the correct dimensions, or it might not have
 been.
=20
 I have three questions:
=20
 1) Is there a way to check the crankshaft dimensions to see what it has
 been ground to that doesn=E2=80=99t require pulling the engine? I=E2=80=99=
d like to know
 if the crank had to ground to the correct dimensions or not.
=20
 2) If the crankshaft was ground to the wrong dimensions, is there a way to
 fix it (e.g., special seal) short of replacing the crankshaft? Replacement
 crankshafts are scarce and quite expensive (>USD$1600).
=20
 3) If the crankshaft was ground to the correct dimensions, what have
 others done to keep that oil seal conversion from leaking?
=20
 I=E2=80=99d welcome any input from those on this list.
=20
 Dave MacKay
 1960 Triumph TR3A, s/n 68639L
 near Toronto, Canada
 ** [email-masked] **
=20
 Donate: http://www.team.net/donate.html
 Archive:  http://www.team.net/pipermail/triumphs=C2=A0  http://www.team.ne=
t/archive
=20
 Unsubscribe/Manage:  http://autox.team.net/mailman/options/triumphs/jerryv=
[email-masked]=20
          ** [email-masked] **
=20
 Donate: http://www.team.net/donate.html
 Archive: http://www.team.net/pipermail/triumphs=C2=A0 http://www.team.net/=
archive
=20
 Unsubscribe/Manage: http://autox.team.net/mailman/options/triumphs/yellowt=
[email-masked]
    =20
  ** [email-masked] **Donate: http://www.team.net/donate.htmlArchi=
ve: http://www.team.net/pipermail/triumphs http://www.team.net/archiveUnsub=
scribe/Manage: http://autox.team.net/mailman/options/triumphs/tony@tonydrew=
s.com ** [email-masked] **

[email-masked]
 =20
------=_Part_11961255_253140490.1739408583790
Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable

<html><head></head><body><div class=3D"ydp8531b7a6yahoo-style-wrap" style=
=3D"font-family:Helvetica Neue, Helvetica, Arial, sans-serif;font-size:16px=
;"><div></div>
        <div dir=3D"ltr" data-setdir=3D"false">i have been using grade 8 on=
ly.&nbsp;</div><div dir=3D"ltr" data-setdir=3D"false">but that said its bee=
n 10 years or more with no problems. can remember if for sure i used grade =
8</div><div dir=3D"ltr" data-setdir=3D"false"><br></div><div><br></div>
       =20
        </div><div id=3D"ydpe84f908dyahoo_quoted_9719093930" class=3D"ydpe8=
4f908dyahoo_quoted">
            <div style=3D"font-family:'Helvetica Neue', Helvetica, Arial, s=
ans-serif;font-size:13px;color:#26282a;">
               =20
                <div>
                        On Wednesday, February 12, 2025 at 04:27:23 PM PST,=
 Tony Drews &lt;[email-masked]&gt; wrote:
                    </div>
                    <div><br></div>
                    <div><br></div>
               =20
               =20
                <div><div id=3D"ydpe84f908dyiv5828049392"><div>
    <p>If you use a washer, make sure it's hardened.&nbsp; If not it will
      wear and your flywheel will get loose.&nbsp; Not good.</p>
    <p>Cheers, Tony Drews<br clear=3D"none">
    </p>
    <div class=3D"ydpe84f908dyiv5828049392moz-cite-prefix">On 2/12/2025 4:4=
1 PM, Frank Fisher
      wrote:<br clear=3D"none">
    </div>
    <blockquote type=3D"cite">
      </blockquote></div><div><div style=3D"font-family:Helvetica Neue, Hel=
vetica, Arial, sans-serif;font-size:16px;" class=3D"ydpe84f908dyiv582804939=
2ydpc0068be8yahoo-style-wrap">
        <div dir=3D"ltr">Gerald&nbsp;</div>
        <div dir=3D"ltr">thank you for your comment
          #1.</div>
        <div dir=3D"ltr">and to those who have seen my
          last 2 responses, the interference is a Gerald remained me.</div>
        <div dir=3D"ltr">i did not grind the flywheel
          bolts, i just added a washer under the head.</div>
        <div dir=3D"ltr">the memory is fickle thing
          eh?</div>
        <div dir=3D"ltr"><br clear=3D"none">
        </div>
        <div dir=3D"ltr">Frank</div>
        <div dir=3D"ltr"><br clear=3D"none">
        </div>
        <div dir=3D"ltr"><br clear=3D"none">
        </div>
        <div dir=3D"ltr"><br clear=3D"none">
        </div>
        <div><br clear=3D"none">
        </div>
      </div>
      <div id=3D"ydpe84f908dyiv5828049392ydpcd329a03yahoo_quoted_0376345569=
" class=3D"ydpe84f908dyiv5828049392ydpcd329a03yahoo_quoted">
        <div style=3D"font-family:'Helvetica Neue', Helvetica, Arial, sans-=
serif;font-size:13px;color:#26282a;">
          <div> On Wednesday, February 12, 2025 at 08:40:45 AM PST,
            Gerald Van Vlack <a shape=3D"rect" href=3D"mailto:jerryvvtr4a@g=
mail.com" class=3D"ydpe84f908dyiv5828049392moz-txt-link-rfc2396E" rel=3D"no=
follow" target=3D"_blank">&lt;[email-masked]&gt;</a> wrote: </div>
          <div><br clear=3D"none">
          </div>
          <div><br clear=3D"none">
          </div>
          <div>
            <div id=3D"ydpe84f908dyiv5828049392ydpcd329a03yiv8250301294">
              <div dir=3D"ltr">
                <div style=3D"font-family:Aptos, Calibri, Helvetica, sans-s=
erif;font-size:11pt;color:rgb(0, 0, 0);" class=3D"ydpe84f908dyiv5828049392y=
dpcd329a03yiv8250301294elementToProof">
                  I'm following this rear seal thread and need to
                  comment.&nbsp; The newest seal design works well with a f=
ew
                  items that need followed in conjunction with it's
                  install.</div>
                <div style=3D"font-family:Aptos, Calibri, Helvetica, sans-s=
erif;font-size:11pt;color:rgb(0, 0, 0);" class=3D"ydpe84f908dyiv5828049392y=
dpcd329a03yiv8250301294elementToProof">
                  <br clear=3D"none">
                </div>
                <ol start=3D"1" style=3D"list-style-type:decimal;"><li styl=
e=3D"font-family:Aptos, Calibri, Helvetica, sans-serif;font-size:11pt;color=
:rgb(0, 0, 0);">
                    <div class=3D"ydpe84f908dyiv5828049392ydpcd329a03yiv825=
0301294elementToProof">Be
                      certain that the flywheel bolts do not cut into
                      the installed seal. If using the ARP bolts they
                      need to be shortened a small amount by grinding
                      the ends slightly. I don't know if the stock bolts
                      need the same modification but worth inspecting to
                      be sure.</div>
                  </li><li style=3D"font-family:Aptos, Calibri, Helvetica, =
sans-serif;font-size:11pt;color:rgb(0, 0, 0);">
                    <div class=3D"ydpe84f908dyiv5828049392ydpcd329a03yiv825=
0301294elementToProof">The
                      best seal will be blamed for a leak when in fact
                      it's not the source of the leak. When installing
                      the rear main bearing cap very careful attention
                      needs to be paid to sealing the cap to the block.
                      That large rectangular slot that requires a rope
                      seal pounded into it if not sealed well&nbsp;enough
                      will leak and frequently is the source of oil
                      being seen dripping from the hole in the
                      bellhousing. And then folks blame the rear main
                      seal when in fact it's that interface between the
                      block and cap that is the source of the leak.</div>
                  </li></ol>
                <div style=3D"font-family:Aptos, Calibri, Helvetica, sans-s=
erif;font-size:11pt;color:rgb(0, 0, 0);" class=3D"ydpe84f908dyiv5828049392y=
dpcd329a03yiv8250301294elementToProof">
                  My comment is don't blame the crank seal in many
                  cases.</div>
                <div style=3D"font-family:Aptos, Calibri, Helvetica, sans-s=
erif;font-size:11pt;color:rgb(0, 0, 0);" class=3D"ydpe84f908dyiv5828049392y=
dpcd329a03yiv8250301294elementToProof">
                  <br clear=3D"none">
                </div>
                <div style=3D"font-family:Aptos, Calibri, Helvetica, sans-s=
erif;font-size:11pt;color:rgb(0, 0, 0);" class=3D"ydpe84f908dyiv5828049392y=
dpcd329a03yiv8250301294elementToProof">
                  JVV</div>
                <div style=3D"font-family:Aptos, Calibri, Helvetica, sans-s=
erif;font-size:11pt;color:rgb(0,0,0);">
                  <br clear=3D"none">
                </div>
                <hr tabindex=3D"-1" style=3D"display:inline-block;width:98%=
;">
                <div id=3D"ydpe84f908dyiv5828049392ydpcd329a03yiv8250301294=
yqtfd04841" class=3D"ydpe84f908dyiv5828049392ydpcd329a03yiv8250301294yqt417=
5319239">
                  <div dir=3D"ltr" id=3D"ydpe84f908dyiv5828049392ydpcd329a0=
3yiv8250301294divRplyFwdMsg"><font face=3D"Calibri, sans-serif" color=3D"#0=
00000" style=3D"font-size:11pt;"><b>From:</b> Triumphs
                      <a shape=3D"rect" href=3D"mailto:triumphs-bounces@aut=
ox.team.net" class=3D"ydpe84f908dyiv5828049392moz-txt-link-rfc2396E" rel=3D=
"nofollow" target=3D"_blank">&lt;[email-masked]&gt;</a> on=
 behalf
                      of Dave MacKay <a shape=3D"rect" href=3D"mailto:dave@=
mdmackay.ca" class=3D"ydpe84f908dyiv5828049392moz-txt-link-rfc2396E" rel=3D=
"nofollow" target=3D"_blank">&lt;[email-masked]&gt;</a><br clear=3D"none"=
                      <b>Sent:</b> Wednesday, February 12, 2025 10:39 AM<br=
 clear=3D"none">
                      <b>To:</b> <a shape=3D"rect" href=3D"mailto:triumphs@=
autox.team.net" class=3D"ydpe84f908dyiv5828049392moz-txt-link-abbreviated" =
rel=3D"nofollow" target=3D"_blank">[email-masked]</a>
                      <a shape=3D"rect" href=3D"mailto:[email-masked].=
net" class=3D"ydpe84f908dyiv5828049392moz-txt-link-rfc2396E" rel=3D"nofollo=
w" target=3D"_blank">&lt;[email-masked]&gt;</a><br clear=3D"none">
                      <b>Subject:</b> [TR] Leaking rear seal on my
                      TR3A's engine</font>
                    <div>&nbsp;</div>
                  </div>
                </div>
                <div class=3D"ydpe84f908dyiv5828049392ydpcd329a03yiv8250301=
294BodyFragment">
                  <div id=3D"ydpe84f908dyiv5828049392ydpcd329a03yiv82503012=
94yqtfd92825" class=3D"ydpe84f908dyiv5828049392ydpcd329a03yiv8250301294yqt4=
175319239"><font size=3D"2"><span style=3D"font-size:11pt;">
                      </span></font></div>
                  <div class=3D"ydpe84f908dyiv5828049392ydpcd329a03yiv82503=
01294PlainText">
                    <div id=3D"ydpe84f908dyiv5828049392ydpcd329a03yiv825030=
1294yqtfd48993" class=3D"ydpe84f908dyiv5828049392ydpcd329a03yiv8250301294yq=
t4175319239">I
                      followed the recent exchange about =E2=80=9CTR Rear C=
rank
                      Seal Rope?=E2=80=9D with<br clear=3D"none">
                      interest and corresponded with all who replied to
                      the OP. That has me<br clear=3D"none">
                      thinking about how I might address my situation.<br c=
lear=3D"none">
                      <br clear=3D"none">
                      In 2008, the engine in my TR3A was rebuilt. As
                      part of that effort an OIL<br clear=3D"none">
                      SEAL CONVERSION KIT was fitted. The conversion
                      required that the scroll on<br clear=3D"none">
                      the crankshaft be ground down. It has always
                      leaked.<br clear=3D"none">
                      <br clear=3D"none">
                      I had convinced myself that fixing the leak would
                      be too much trouble and<br clear=3D"none">
                      too expensive to be worth doing. I envisioned
                      having to replace the<br clear=3D"none">
                      crankshaft and then using a more modern conversion
                      (Moss 837-160). I<br clear=3D"none">
                      wanted to check with the list to see if that=E2=80=99=
s the
                      case or not.<br clear=3D"none">
                      <br clear=3D"none">
                      I believe --- but am not certain --- that the
                      conversion was sourced from<br clear=3D"none">
                      Moss (perhaps p/n 837-006). I am aware that
                      incorrect instructions were<br clear=3D"none">
                      provided with some of the conversion kits so that
                      the crankshafts were<br clear=3D"none">
                      ground too small. I don=E2=80=99t know if that=E2=80=
=99s the case
                      with my conversion: the<br clear=3D"none">
                      crank may have been ground to the correct
                      dimensions, or it might not have<br clear=3D"none">
                      been.<br clear=3D"none">
                      <br clear=3D"none">
                      I have three questions:<br clear=3D"none">
                      <br clear=3D"none">
                      1) Is there a way to check the crankshaft
                      dimensions to see what it has<br clear=3D"none">
                      been ground to that doesn=E2=80=99t require pulling t=
he
                      engine? I=E2=80=99d like to know<br clear=3D"none">
                      if the crank had to ground to the correct
                      dimensions or not.<br clear=3D"none">
                      <br clear=3D"none">
                      2) If the crankshaft was ground to the wrong
                      dimensions, is there a way to<br clear=3D"none">
                      fix it (e.g., special seal) short of replacing the
                      crankshaft? Replacement<br clear=3D"none">
                      crankshafts are scarce and quite expensive
                      (&gt;USD$1600).<br clear=3D"none">
                      <br clear=3D"none">
                      3) If the crankshaft was ground to the correct
                      dimensions, what have<br clear=3D"none">
                      others done to keep that oil seal conversion from
                      leaking?<br clear=3D"none">
                      <br clear=3D"none">
                      I=E2=80=99d welcome any input from those on this list=
.<br clear=3D"none">
                      <br clear=3D"none">
                      Dave MacKay<br clear=3D"none">
                      1960 Triumph TR3A, s/n 68639L<br clear=3D"none">
                      near Toronto, Canada<br clear=3D"none">
                      ** <a shape=3D"rect" href=3D"mailto:[email-masked]=
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      </div><pre class=3D"ydpe84f908dyiv5828049392moz-quote-pre"><div id=3D=
"ydpe84f908dyiv5828049392yqtfd75171" class=3D"ydpe84f908dyiv5828049392yqt04=
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</div></pre><div id=3D"ydpe84f908dyiv5828049392yqtfd01782" class=3D"ydpe84f=
908dyiv5828049392yqt0454207461">
   =20
  </div></div></div><div class=3D"ydpe84f908dyqt0454207461" id=3D"ydpe84f90=
8dyqtfd95079">** <a shape=3D"rect" href=3D"mailto:[email-masked]" =
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