Subject: Re: [TR] Strombergs running rich

From: Anthony Rhodes <[email-masked]>
Date: Tue, 3 Oct 2023 16:30:51 -0400

If it is dumping gas that badly, then it is not a problem with the metering needle.   That is really a fine tuning device.

That much gas may be from the float chambers having too much fuel.   Way too much.  

Check the pressure in the fuel line.  If it is too high it will overcome the float valve.   

Maybe the float valves are not sealing?  Maybe the floats are not adjusted properly?  Or not actually floating and are just sinkers?

-Tony

Sent from my 1837 Babbage Analytical Engine

> On Oct 3, 2023, at 2:44 PM, [email-masked] wrote:
> 
> Message: 1
> Date: Thu, 28 Sep 2023 17:57:54 -0700
> From: Frank Burkhart

>  I?m hoping that someone out in Triumph world can provide some clarification on carburetors.  Currently, Zenith Stromberg carbs on my 1975 TR6.  The car has been running poorly since Trimphest (too many RPMs?).  And then it died completely but turned out to need a new rotor.  Asked the mechanic, Mike, to take a look at the everything to figure out what can be made better.  What he found was the carbs were dumping gas into the cylinders especially when starting, to the point the gas was washing down the cylinder walls preventing the rings from sealing.  Result was a lot of white smoke.
> 
> The carbs were rebuilt about 18 months ago by Apple Hydraulics in New York.  Supposedly all new parts including a new piston in one of the carbs.  Mechanic Mike is questioning the quality but . . .  Several paths to try:
> 
> 1.  New needles and basic over haul.  Least expensive but maybe stopgap measure.
> 
> 2.  Rebuild these carbs using a different shop.  Mike recommends a shop in Colorado. I?m would worry about a 2nd rebuild in short period of time.
> 
> 3.  Replace the carbs.
> 3a.  Mike has a pair of SU carbs in good shape.  Mike would replace ?consumables? and install
> 
> 3b.  Find a pair Stromberg carbs
> 
> 3c.  Mike likes carbs by Mikuni
> 
> 3c.  Replace with Webers
> 
> Any ideas / suggestions on what path seems the best?
> 
> Hope all the world is going well for all.  Hope to see everyone at Velocity.
> 
> 
> Thank you,
> Frank Burkhart

** [email-masked] **

Archive: http://www.team.net/pipermail/triumphs  http://www.team.net/archive

---

From: DAVID MASSEY <[email-masked]>
Date: Tue, 3 Oct 2023 23:46:10 +0000 (UTC)

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Another non-obvious problem could be the top of the float bowl has no vent.=
=C2=A0 In this case a bubble of air can be trapped in there and not allow t=
he fuel level to rise and shut off fuel.=C2=A0 The late model TR6 carbs had=
 a small valve that switches this vent from the port on the face of the car=
burettor and a special port that connects to the charcoal canister.=C2=A0 I=
f the air filter gasket doesn't have a hole lined up with that port the air=
 can't vent out.=C2=A0 Also, the special port, which is active only during =
closed throttle is part of the Anti-Run-On system.=C2=A0 If that has been s=
tripped out all bets are off as to what happened to the special port.=C2=A0=
=20

Make sure the holes in the A-F gasket match the holes in the carb face and =
make sure that extra port is not capped off.

Dave=20

=20

    On Tuesday, October 3, 2023 at 05:38:09 PM CDT, Anthony Rhodes <spamiam=
@comcast.net> wrote: =20
=20
 If it is dumping gas that badly, then it is not a problem with the meterin=
g needle.=C2=A0 That is really a fine tuning device.

That much gas may be from the float chambers having too much fuel.=C2=A0 Wa=
y too much.=C2=A0=20

Check the pressure in the fuel line.=C2=A0 If it is too high it will overco=
me the float valve.=C2=A0=20

Maybe the float valves are not sealing?=C2=A0 Maybe the floats are not adju=
sted properly?=C2=A0 Or not actually floating and are just sinkers?

-Tony

>=20

>=C2=A0 I?m hoping that someone out in Triumph world can provide some clari=
fication on carburetors.=C2=A0 Currently, Zenith Stromberg carbs on my 1975=
 TR6.=C2=A0 The car has been running poorly since Trimphest (too many RPMs?=
).=C2=A0 And then it died completely but turned out to need a new rotor.=C2=
=A0 Asked the mechanic, Mike, to take a look at the everything to figure ou=
t what can be made better.=C2=A0 What he found was the carbs were dumping g=
as into the cylinders especially when starting, to the point the gas was wa=
shing down the cylinder walls preventing the rings from sealing.=C2=A0 Resu=
lt was a lot of white smoke.
>=20
> The carbs were rebuilt about 18 months ago by Apple Hydraulics in New Yor=
k.=C2=A0 Supposedly all new parts including a new piston in one of the carb=
s.=C2=A0 Mechanic Mike is questioning the quality but . . .=C2=A0 Several p=
aths to try:
>=20
> 1.=C2=A0 New needles and basic over haul.=C2=A0 Least expensive but maybe=
 stopgap measure.
>=20
> 2.=C2=A0 Rebuild these carbs using a different shop.=C2=A0 Mike recommend=
s a shop in Colorado. I?m would worry about a 2nd rebuild in short period o=
f time.
>=20
> 3.=C2=A0 Replace the carbs.
> 3a.=C2=A0 Mike has a pair of SU carbs in good shape.=C2=A0 Mike would rep=
lace ?consumables? and install
>=20
> 3b.=C2=A0 Find a pair Stromberg carbs
>=20
> 3c.=C2=A0 Mike likes carbs by Mikuni
>=20
> 3c.=C2=A0 Replace with Webers
>=20
>=20
> Hope all the world is going well for all.=C2=A0 Hope to see everyone at V=
elocity.
>=20
>=20

Archive: http://www.team.net/pipermail/triumphs=C2=A0 http://www.team.net/a=
rchive

[email-masked]
 =20
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<html><head></head><body><div class=3D"ydp1e81e41fyahoo-style-wrap" style=
=3D"font-family:Arial, Helvetica, sans-serif;font-size:16px;"><div><div dir=
=3D"ltr" data-setdir=3D"false">Another non-obvious problem could be the top=
 of the float bowl has no vent.&nbsp; In this case a bubble of air can be t=
rapped in there and not allow the fuel level to rise and shut off fuel.&nbs=
p; The late model TR6 carbs had a small valve that switches this vent from =
the port on the face of the carburettor and a special port that connects to=
 the charcoal canister.&nbsp; If the air filter gasket doesn't have a hole =
lined up with that port the air can't vent out.&nbsp; Also, the special por=
t, which is active only during closed throttle is part of the Anti-Run-On s=
ystem.&nbsp; If that has been stripped out all bets are off as to what happ=
ened to the special port.&nbsp; <br></div><div dir=3D"ltr" data-setdir=3D"f=
alse"><br></div><div dir=3D"ltr" data-setdir=3D"false">Make sure the holes =
in the A-F gasket match the holes in the carb face and make sure that extra=
 port is not capped off.<br></div><div><br></div><div class=3D"ydp1e81e41fs=
ignature"><div style=3D"color: black; font-style: normal; font-weight: norm=
al; font-stretch: normal; font-size: 12pt; line-height: normal; font-family=
: Arial, Helvetica, sans-serif; font-size-adjust: none;"><div style=3D"colo=
r: black; font-style: normal; font-weight: normal; font-stretch: normal; fo=
nt-size: 12pt; line-height: normal; font-family: Arial, Helvetica, sans-ser=
if; font-size-adjust: none;"><div><font size=3D"4">Dave <br></font></div><d=
iv><span style=3D"font-size:10.0pt;font-family:sans-serif;color:black;"><br=
></span></div><br></div></div></div></div>
        <div><br></div><div><br></div>
       =20
        </div><div id=3D"ydpc0c3ad6fyahoo_quoted_6900672725" class=3D"ydpc0=
c3ad6fyahoo_quoted">
            <div style=3D"font-family:'Helvetica Neue', Helvetica, Arial, s=
ans-serif;font-size:13px;color:#26282a;">
               =20
                <div>
                    On Tuesday, October 3, 2023 at 05:38:09 PM CDT, Anthony=
 Rhodes &lt;[email-masked]&gt; wrote:
                </div>
                <div><br></div>
                <div><br></div>
                <div><div dir=3D"ltr">If it is dumping gas that badly, then=
 it is not a problem with the metering needle.&nbsp;  That is really a fine=
 tuning device.<br></div><div dir=3D"ltr"><br></div><div dir=3D"ltr">That m=
uch gas may be from the float chambers having too much fuel.&nbsp;  Way too=
 much.&nbsp; <br></div><div dir=3D"ltr"><br></div><div dir=3D"ltr">Check th=
e pressure in the fuel line.&nbsp; If it is too high it will overcome the f=
loat valve.&nbsp;  <br></div><div dir=3D"ltr"><br></div><div dir=3D"ltr">Ma=
ybe the float valves are not sealing?&nbsp; Maybe the floats are not adjust=
ed properly?&nbsp; Or not actually floating and are just sinkers?<br></div>=
<div dir=3D"ltr"><br></div><div dir=3D"ltr">-Tony<br></div><div dir=3D"ltr"=
><br></div><div dir=3D"ltr">Sent from my 1837 Babbage Analytical Engine<br>=
</div><div dir=3D"ltr"><br></div><div dir=3D"ltr">&gt; On Oct 3, 2023, at 2=
:44 PM, <a href=3D"mailto:[email-masked]" rel=3D"nofollow"=
 target=3D"_blank">[email-masked]</a> wrote:<br></div><div=
 dir=3D"ltr">&gt; <br></div><div dir=3D"ltr">&gt; Message: 1<br></div><div =
dir=3D"ltr">&gt; Date: Thu, 28 Sep 2023 17:57:54 -0700<br></div><div dir=3D=
"ltr">&gt; From: Frank Burkhart<br></div><div dir=3D"ltr"><br></div><div di=
r=3D"ltr"><br></div><div dir=3D"ltr">&gt;&nbsp; I?m hoping that someone out=
 in Triumph world can provide some clarification on carburetors.&nbsp; Curr=
ently, Zenith Stromberg carbs on my 1975 TR6.&nbsp; The car has been runnin=
g poorly since Trimphest (too many RPMs?).&nbsp; And then it died completel=
y but turned out to need a new rotor.&nbsp; Asked the mechanic, Mike, to ta=
ke a look at the everything to figure out what can be made better.&nbsp; Wh=
at he found was the carbs were dumping gas into the cylinders especially wh=
en starting, to the point the gas was washing down the cylinder walls preve=
nting the rings from sealing.&nbsp; Result was a lot of white smoke.<br></d=
iv><div dir=3D"ltr">&gt; <br></div><div dir=3D"ltr">&gt; The carbs were reb=
uilt about 18 months ago by Apple Hydraulics in New York.&nbsp; Supposedly =
all new parts including a new piston in one of the carbs.&nbsp; Mechanic Mi=
ke is questioning the quality but . . .&nbsp; Several paths to try:<br></di=
v><div dir=3D"ltr">&gt; <br></div><div dir=3D"ltr">&gt; 1.&nbsp; New needle=
s and basic over haul.&nbsp; Least expensive but maybe stopgap measure.<br>=
</div><div dir=3D"ltr">&gt; <br></div><div dir=3D"ltr">&gt; 2.&nbsp; Rebuil=
d these carbs using a different shop.&nbsp; Mike recommends a shop in Color=
ado. I?m would worry about a 2nd rebuild in short period of time.<br></div>=
<div dir=3D"ltr">&gt; <br></div><div dir=3D"ltr">&gt; 3.&nbsp; Replace the =
carbs.<br></div><div dir=3D"ltr">&gt; 3a.&nbsp; Mike has a pair of SU carbs=
 in good shape.&nbsp; Mike would replace ?consumables? and install<br></div=
><div dir=3D"ltr">&gt; <br></div><div dir=3D"ltr">&gt; 3b.&nbsp; Find a pai=
r Stromberg carbs<br></div><div dir=3D"ltr">&gt; <br></div><div dir=3D"ltr"=
>&gt; 3c.&nbsp; Mike likes carbs by Mikuni<br></div><div dir=3D"ltr">&gt; <=
br></div><div dir=3D"ltr">&gt; 3c.&nbsp; Replace with Webers<br></div><div =
dir=3D"ltr">&gt; <br></div><div dir=3D"ltr">&gt; Any ideas / suggestions on=
 what path seems the best?<br></div><div dir=3D"ltr">&gt; <br></div><div di=
r=3D"ltr">&gt; Hope all the world is going well for all.&nbsp; Hope to see =
everyone at Velocity.<br></div><div dir=3D"ltr">&gt; <br></div><div dir=3D"=
ltr">&gt; <br></div><div dir=3D"ltr">&gt; Thank you,<br></div><div dir=3D"l=
tr">&gt; Frank Burkhart<br></div><div dir=3D"ltr"><br></div><div dir=3D"ltr=
">** <a href=3D"mailto:[email-masked]" rel=3D"nofollow" target=3D"=
_blank">[email-masked]</a> **<br></div><div dir=3D"ltr"><br></div>=
<div dir=3D"ltr">Donate: <a href=3D"http://www.team.net/donate.html" rel=3D=
"nofollow" target=3D"_blank">http://www.team.net/donate.html</a><br></div><=
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 rel=3D"nofollow" target=3D"_blank">http://www.team.net/pipermail/triumphs<=
/a>&nbsp; <a href=3D"http://www.team.net/archive" rel=3D"nofollow" target=
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/div><div dir=3D"ltr">Unsubscribe/Manage: <a href=3D"http://autox.team.net/=
mailman/options/triumphs/[email-masked]" rel=3D"nofollow" target=3D"_bl=
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From: dave northrup <[email-masked]>
Date: Wed, 4 Oct 2023 00:29:24 +0000

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Well said.  Good analysis

-------- Original message --------
From: Anthony Rhodes <[email-masked]>
Date: 10/3/23 6:09 PM (GMT-06:00)
To: [email-masked]
Subject: Re: [TR] Strombergs running rich

If it is dumping gas that badly, then it is not a problem with the metering=
 needle.   That is really a fine tuning device.

That much gas may be from the float chambers having too much fuel.   Way to=
o much.

Check the pressure in the fuel line.  If it is too high it will overcome th=
e float valve.

Maybe the float valves are not sealing?  Maybe the floats are not adjusted =
properly?  Or not actually floating and are just sinkers?

-Tony

>  I?m hoping that someone out in Triumph world can provide some clarificat=
ion on carburetors.  Currently, Zenith Stromberg carbs on my 1975 TR6.  The=
 car has been running poorly since Trimphest (too many RPMs?).  And then it=
 died completely but turned out to need a new rotor.  Asked the mechanic, M=
ike, to take a look at the everything to figure out what can be made better=
.  What he found was the carbs were dumping gas into the cylinders especial=
ly when starting, to the point the gas was washing down the cylinder walls =
preventing the rings from sealing.  Result was a lot of white smoke.
> The carbs were rebuilt about 18 months ago by Apple Hydraulics in New Yor=
k.  Supposedly all new parts including a new piston in one of the carbs.  M=
echanic Mike is questioning the quality but . . .  Several paths to try:
>
> 1.  New needles and basic over haul.  Least expensive but maybe stopgap m=
easure.
>
> 2.  Rebuild these carbs using a different shop.  Mike recommends a shop i=
n Colorado. I?m would worry about a 2nd rebuild in short period of time.
>
> 3.  Replace the carbs.
> 3a.  Mike has a pair of SU carbs in good shape.  Mike would replace ?cons=
umables? and install
> Hope all the world is going well for all.  Hope to see everyone at Veloci=
ty.

Archive: http://www.team.net/pipermail/triumphs  http://www.team.net/archiv=
e

teer.com

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<html>
<head>
<meta http-equiv=3D"Content-Type" content=3D"text/html; charset=3Dus-ascii"=
<meta name=3D"Generator" content=3D"Microsoft Exchange Server">
<!-- converted from text --><style><!-- .EmailQuote { margin-left: 1pt; pad=
ding-left: 4pt; border-left: #800000 2px solid; } --></style>
</head>
<body>
<div dir=3D"auto">Well said.&nbsp; Good analysis&nbsp;
<div><br>
</div>
<div><br>
</div>
<div>-------- Original message --------</div>
<div>From: Anthony Rhodes &lt;[email-masked]&gt; </div>
<div>Date: 10/3/23 6:09 PM (GMT-06:00) </div>
<div>To: [email-masked] </div>
<div>Subject: Re: [TR] Strombergs running rich </div>
<div><br>
</div>
</div>
<font size=3D"2"><span style=3D"font-size:10pt;">
<div class=3D"PlainText">If it is dumping gas that badly, then it is not a =
problem with the metering needle.&nbsp;&nbsp; That is really a fine tuning =
device.<br>
<br>
That much gas may be from the float chambers having too much fuel.&nbsp;&nb=
sp; Way too much.&nbsp;
<br>
<br>
Check the pressure in the fuel line.&nbsp; If it is too high it will overco=
me the float valve.&nbsp;&nbsp;
<br>
<br>
Maybe the float valves are not sealing?&nbsp; Maybe the floats are not adju=
sted properly?&nbsp; Or not actually floating and are just sinkers?<br>
<br>
-Tony<br>
<br>
Sent from my 1837 Babbage Analytical Engine<br>
<br>
&gt; On Oct 3, 2023, at 2:44 PM, [email-masked] wrote:<br>
&gt; <br>
&gt; Message: 1<br>
&gt; Date: Thu, 28 Sep 2023 17:57:54 -0700<br>
&gt; From: Frank Burkhart<br>
<br>
<br>
&gt;&nbsp; I?m hoping that someone out in Triumph world can provide some cl=
arification on carburetors.&nbsp; Currently, Zenith Stromberg carbs on my 1=
975 TR6.&nbsp; The car has been running poorly since Trimphest (too many RP=
Ms?).&nbsp; And then it died completely but turned out
 to need a new rotor.&nbsp; Asked the mechanic, Mike, to take a look at the=
 everything to figure out what can be made better.&nbsp; What he found was =
the carbs were dumping gas into the cylinders especially when starting, to =
the point the gas was washing down the cylinder
 walls preventing the rings from sealing.&nbsp; Result was a lot of white s=
moke.<br>
&gt; <br>
&gt; The carbs were rebuilt about 18 months ago by Apple Hydraulics in New =
York.&nbsp; Supposedly all new parts including a new piston in one of the c=
arbs.&nbsp; Mechanic Mike is questioning the quality but . . .&nbsp; Severa=
l paths to try:<br>
&gt; <br>
&gt; 1.&nbsp; New needles and basic over haul.&nbsp; Least expensive but ma=
ybe stopgap measure.<br>
&gt; <br>
&gt; 2.&nbsp; Rebuild these carbs using a different shop.&nbsp; Mike recomm=
ends a shop in Colorado. I?m would worry about a 2nd rebuild in short perio=
d of time.<br>
&gt; <br>
&gt; 3.&nbsp; Replace the carbs.<br>
&gt; 3a.&nbsp; Mike has a pair of SU carbs in good shape.&nbsp; Mike would =
replace ?consumables? and install<br>
&gt; <br>
&gt; 3b.&nbsp; Find a pair Stromberg carbs<br>
&gt; <br>
&gt; 3c.&nbsp; Mike likes carbs by Mikuni<br>
&gt; <br>
&gt; 3c.&nbsp; Replace with Webers<br>
&gt; <br>
&gt; Any ideas / suggestions on what path seems the best?<br>
&gt; <br>
&gt; Hope all the world is going well for all.&nbsp; Hope to see everyone a=
t Velocity.<br>
&gt; <br>
&gt; <br>
&gt; Thank you,<br>
&gt; Frank Burkhart<br>
<br>
** [email-masked] **<br>
<br>
ate.html</a><br>
Archive: <a href=3D"http://www.team.net/pipermail/triumphs">http://www.team=
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<br>
hs/[email-masked]">
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From: Patrick Baize <[email-masked]> EivoJBw7/TftwDQbgrJ4bkfT2OMbMn+m76qUc/e1MhdPWcAz4uoI/KLd13tov3Sjr4HAbb0sIZzQzA==
Date: Tue, 3 Oct 2023 19:34:20 -0500

for sure the floats!   had same problem, 1 was not adjusted correctly. 
My stag would actually from time to time quit running. one time it quit, 
I thought to disconnect the fuel pump (electric)  and it started up 
after a few cranks

Patrick

71 Stag

On 10/3/2023 3:30 PM, Anthony Rhodes wrote:
> Donate: http://www.team.net/donate.html
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