Subject: Re: [TR] TR4A IRS Suspension Question

From: glewis999 <[email-masked]>
Date: Wed, 24 Mar 2021 18:05:11 +0000 (UTC)

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On some rear shocker conversions to the IRS, the shocker mounting bracket i=
s bolted to the car=E2=80=99s body as well as to the mounting points for th=
e original lever arm shocks. This might account for the ride height.Graham

Sent from the all-new AOL app for iOS

On Wednesday, March 24, 2021, 5:49 pm, Brian K <[email-masked]> wrote:

Simple test on the rear shock conversion - disconnect one end of the shock =
and slide it out of the way. Roll the car a little with the shock out of th=
e way then measure again. Don't drive this way.
Like other replies, I would not expect the tube shocks to provide lift.

Brian
On Mar 24, 2021 4:37 AM, Jim Henningsen <[email-masked]> wrote:

Great thoughts and much appreciated.=C2=A0 I believe the higher rear height=
 is from the steel brackets used in the tube shock conversion kit, but I co=
uld be wrong.=C2=A0=C2=A0 Let me drive it some more and get it loosened up =
and then measure again and also include measuring floor to frame on each co=
rner.=C2=A0 I need to do something as it doesn=E2=80=99t quite look right v=
isually either and a TR has to look right when it sits.=C2=A0 In my opinion=
.=C2=A0 Thanks
Jim

> On Mar 23, 2021, at 9:17 PM, Michael Marr <[email-masked]> wro=
te:
>=20
> =EF=BB=BFAnother thought.=C2=A0 On my TR3A, there is a spacer on one of t=
he rear springs that, effectively, increases the unloaded ride height on th=
e driver's side to account for the fact that the car is driven driver-only =
most of the time.=C2=A0 Does the same situation exist with the 4A?=C2=A0 Is=
 one rear spring longer than the other to provide the ride height differenc=
e?=C2=A0 Have you tried measuring the ride height with someone (an adult, p=
referably) in the driver's seat?
>=20
> Mike
>=20
> Michael J Marr, P.E., CEng.
> Albion Technical Services
> W5918 Hackbarth Rd
> Fort Atkinson, WI 53538
>=20
> Cell:=C2=A0 630-202-0065
> Email:=C2=A0 [email-masked]
>=20
> -----Original Message-----
> From: Triumphs <[email-masked]> On Behalf Of Michael Mar=
r
> Sent: Tuesday, March 23, 2021 8:03 PM
> To: Jim Henningsen <[email-masked]>; [email-masked]
> Subject: Re: [TR] TR4A IRS Suspension Question
>=20
> Have you driven the car?=C2=A0 A few road miles will help the suspension =
settle.=C2=A0 There's a lot of "stiction" in those new components.
>=20
> Also, I agree with Jim Kirby - the new shocks will not affect ride height=
, unless, for some reason, they have bottomed out and are bound up.
>=20
> Mike
>=20
> Michael J Marr, P.E., CEng.
> Albion Technical Services
> W5918 Hackbarth Rd
> Fort Atkinson, WI 53538
>=20
> Cell:=C2=A0 630-202-0065
> Email:=C2=A0 [email-masked]
>=20
> -----Original Message-----
> From: Triumphs <[email-masked]> On Behalf Of Jim Henning=
sen
> Sent: Tuesday, March 23, 2021 7:06 PM
> To: [email-masked]
> Subject: [TR] TR4A IRS Suspension Question
>=20
> Ok, just finished redoing front and rear suspension on my 67 4A IRS.
> Complete disassembly, clean, repaint, new urethane bushings, tie rod ends=
, trunnions, etc.=C2=A0 New comp springs ( 1 inch lower) all corners, new s=
tock tubes shocks up front and new KYB gas shocks on the tube shock convers=
ion brackets for the IRS.=C2=A0 Reinstalled all alignment shims as installe=
d as the car drove pretty straight.=C2=A0 Urethane packings on springs.=20
>=20
> After completing, I noticed that all four corners have a slightly differe=
nt ride height when measured from garage floor to bottom on fender lip at c=
enter of each wheel.=C2=A0 Left front: 26 3/4 inches, Right front: 26 1/4, =
Left
> rear: 27 3/8, right rear: 27 7/8.=C2=A0 I think the higher rear height is=
 coming
> from the tube shock conversion as it was lower with the levers.=C2=A0=C2=
=A0=C2=A0 So about
> a half inch off each side.=C2=A0=C2=A0 I don't recall having this issue w=
hen I redid
> my TR6, but that was a while ago.=C2=A0=C2=A0 Rears also have stock trail=
ing arm
> brackets (one and two notch brackets on each side - believe these are ori=
ginal from new given history of the car).=C2=A0=20
>=20
> Looking for help on next steps before bringing it in for an alignment.=C2=
=A0 Will alignment correct height difference or do I need to add 1/2 inch s=
pacers on lower sides.=C2=A0 I am going to put uprated valved levers back o=
n rear to eliminate the extra height in rear.=C2=A0=20
>=20
> Any help appreciated.=C2=A0=C2=A0=20
>=20
> Thanks
> Jim Henningsen
> Ocala FL
> Too many TRs to maintain!
> 61 3A
> 62 4
> 67 4A
> 75 6
> 81 8
>=20
> ** [email-masked] **
>=20
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<html xmlns=3D"http://www.w3.org/1999/xhtml" xmlns:v=3D"urn:schemas-microso=
ft-com:vml" xmlns:o=3D"urn:schemas-microsoft-com:office:office"><head><!--[=
if gte mso 9]><xml><o:OfficeDocumentSettings><o:AllowPNG/><o:PixelsPerInch>=
96</o:PixelsPerInch></o:OfficeDocumentSettings></xml><![endif]--></head><bo=
dy>
On some rear shocker conversions to the IRS, the shocker mounting bracket i=
s bolted to the car=E2=80=99s body as well as to the mounting points for th=
e original lever arm shocks. This might account for the ride height.<div>Gr=
aham<br><br><br><a href=3D"https://apps.apple.com/us/app/aol-news-email-wea=
ther-video/id646100661">Sent from the all-new AOL app for iOS</a><br><br><p=
 class=3D"yahoo-quoted-begin" style=3D"font-size: 15px; color: #715FFA; pad=
ding-top: 15px; margin-top: 0">On Wednesday, March 24, 2021, 5:49 pm, Brian=
 K &lt;[email-masked]&gt; wrote:</p><blockquote class=3D"iosymail"><div=
 id=3D"yiv7144059350"><div><div>Simple test on the rear shock conversion - =
disconnect one end of the shock and slide it out of the way. Roll the car a=
 little with the shock out of the way then measure again. Don't drive this =
way.<div><br clear=3D"none"></div><div>Like other replies, I would not expe=
ct the tube shocks to provide lift.<br clear=3D"none"><div><br clear=3D"non=
e"></div><div>Brian</div></div></div><div class=3D"yiv7144059350gmail_extra=
"><br clear=3D"none"><div class=3D"yiv7144059350yqt9249108226" id=3D"yiv714=
4059350yqtfd30474"><div class=3D"yiv7144059350gmail_quote">On Mar 24, 2021 =
4:37 AM, Jim Henningsen &lt;[email-masked]&gt; wrote:<br clear=3D"none">=
<blockquote class=3D"yiv7144059350quote" style=3D"margin:0 0 0 .8ex;border-=
left:1px #ccc solid;padding-left:1ex;"><p dir=3D"ltr">Great thoughts and mu=
ch appreciated.&nbsp; I believe the higher rear height is from the steel br=
ackets used in the tube shock conversion kit, but I could be wrong.&nbsp;&n=
bsp; Let me drive it some more and get it loosened up and then measure agai=
n and also include measuring floor to frame on each corner.&nbsp; I need to=
 do something as it doesn=E2=80=99t quite look right visually either and a =
TR has to look right when it sits.&nbsp; In my opinion.&nbsp; Thanks<br cle=
ar=3D"none">
Jim<br clear=3D"none"></p>
<p dir=3D"ltr">&gt; On Mar 23, 2021, at 9:17 PM, Michael Marr &lt;mmarr@alb=
iontechnical.com&gt; wrote:<br clear=3D"none">
&gt; <br clear=3D"none">
&gt; =EF=BB=BFAnother thought.&nbsp; On my TR3A, there is a spacer on one o=
f the rear springs that, effectively, increases the unloaded ride height on=
 the driver's side to account for the fact that the car is driven driver-on=
ly most of the time.&nbsp; Does the same situation exist with the 4A?&nbsp;=
 Is one rear spring longer than the other to provide the ride height differ=
ence?&nbsp; Have you tried measuring the ride height with someone (an adult=
, preferably) in the driver's seat?<br clear=3D"none">
&gt; <br clear=3D"none">
&gt; Mike<br clear=3D"none">
&gt; <br clear=3D"none">
&gt; Michael J Marr, P.E., CEng.<br clear=3D"none">
&gt; Albion Technical Services<br clear=3D"none">
&gt; W5918 Hackbarth Rd<br clear=3D"none">
&gt; Fort Atkinson, WI 53538<br clear=3D"none">
&gt; <br clear=3D"none">
&gt; Cell:&nbsp; 630-202-0065<br clear=3D"none">
&gt; Email:&nbsp; [email-masked]<br clear=3D"none">
&gt; <br clear=3D"none">
&gt; -----Original Message-----<br clear=3D"none">
&gt; From: Triumphs &lt;[email-masked]&gt; On Behalf Of Mi=
chael Marr<br clear=3D"none">
&gt; Sent: Tuesday, March 23, 2021 8:03 PM<br clear=3D"none">
&gt; To: Jim Henningsen &lt;[email-masked]&gt;; [email-masked]<=
br clear=3D"none">
&gt; Subject: Re: [TR] TR4A IRS Suspension Question<br clear=3D"none">
&gt; <br clear=3D"none">
&gt; Have you driven the car?&nbsp; A few road miles will help the suspensi=
on settle.&nbsp; There's a lot of "stiction" in those new components.<br cl=
ear=3D"none">
&gt; <br clear=3D"none">
&gt; Also, I agree with Jim Kirby - the new shocks will not affect ride hei=
ght, unless, for some reason, they have bottomed out and are bound up.<br c=
lear=3D"none">
&gt; <br clear=3D"none">
&gt; Mike<br clear=3D"none">
&gt; <br clear=3D"none">
&gt; Michael J Marr, P.E., CEng.<br clear=3D"none">
&gt; Albion Technical Services<br clear=3D"none">
&gt; W5918 Hackbarth Rd<br clear=3D"none">
&gt; Fort Atkinson, WI 53538<br clear=3D"none">
&gt; <br clear=3D"none">
&gt; Cell:&nbsp; 630-202-0065<br clear=3D"none">
&gt; Email:&nbsp; [email-masked]<br clear=3D"none">
&gt; <br clear=3D"none">
&gt; -----Original Message-----<br clear=3D"none">
&gt; From: Triumphs &lt;[email-masked]&gt; On Behalf Of Ji=
m Henningsen<br clear=3D"none">
&gt; Sent: Tuesday, March 23, 2021 7:06 PM<br clear=3D"none">
&gt; To: [email-masked]<br clear=3D"none">
&gt; Subject: [TR] TR4A IRS Suspension Question<br clear=3D"none">
&gt; <br clear=3D"none">
&gt; Ok, just finished redoing front and rear suspension on my 67 4A IRS.<b=
r clear=3D"none">
&gt; Complete disassembly, clean, repaint, new urethane bushings, tie rod e=
nds, trunnions, etc.&nbsp; New comp springs ( 1 inch lower) all corners, ne=
w stock tubes shocks up front and new KYB gas shocks on the tube shock conv=
ersion brackets for the IRS.&nbsp; Reinstalled all alignment shims as insta=
lled as the car drove pretty straight.&nbsp; Urethane packings on springs. =
<br clear=3D"none">
&gt; <br clear=3D"none">
&gt; After completing, I noticed that all four corners have a slightly diff=
erent ride height when measured from garage floor to bottom on fender lip a=
t center of each wheel.&nbsp; Left front: 26 3/4 inches, Right front: 26 1/=
4, Left<br clear=3D"none">
&gt; rear: 27 3/8, right rear: 27 7/8.&nbsp; I think the higher rear height=
 is coming<br clear=3D"none">
&gt; from the tube shock conversion as it was lower with the levers.&nbsp;&=
nbsp;&nbsp; So about<br clear=3D"none">
&gt; a half inch off each side.&nbsp;&nbsp; I don't recall having this issu=
e when I redid<br clear=3D"none">
&gt; my TR6, but that was a while ago.&nbsp;&nbsp; Rears also have stock tr=
ailing arm<br clear=3D"none">
&gt; brackets (one and two notch brackets on each side - believe these are =
original from new given history of the car).&nbsp; <br clear=3D"none">
&gt; <br clear=3D"none">
&gt; Looking for help on next steps before bringing it in for an alignment.=
&nbsp; Will alignment correct height difference or do I need to add 1/2 inc=
h spacers on lower sides.&nbsp; I am going to put uprated valved levers bac=
k on rear to eliminate the extra height in rear.&nbsp; <br clear=3D"none">
&gt; <br clear=3D"none">
&gt; Any help appreciated.&nbsp;&nbsp; <br clear=3D"none">
&gt; <br clear=3D"none">
&gt; Thanks<br clear=3D"none">
&gt; Jim Henningsen<br clear=3D"none">
&gt; Ocala FL<br clear=3D"none">
&gt; Too many TRs to maintain!<br clear=3D"none">
&gt; 61 3A<br clear=3D"none">
&gt; 62 4<br clear=3D"none">
&gt; 67 4A<br clear=3D"none">
&gt; 75 6<br clear=3D"none">
&gt; 81 8<br clear=3D"none">
&gt; <br clear=3D"none">
&gt; ** [email-masked] **<br clear=3D"none">
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---

From: James Henningsen <[email-masked]>
Date: Wed, 24 Mar 2021 14:25:38 -0400

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Good idea.  Thanks.=20

> On Mar 24, 2021, at 1:48 PM, Brian K <[email-masked]> wrote:
>=20
> =EF=BB=BF
> Simple test on the rear shock conversion - disconnect one end of the shock=
> Great thoughts and much appreciated.  I believe the higher rear height is f=
rom the steel brackets used in the tube shock conversion kit, but I could be=
 wrong.   Let me drive it some more and get it loosened up and then measure a=
gain and also include measuring floor to frame on each corner.  I need to do=
 something as it doesn=E2=80=99t quite look right visually either and a TR h=
as to look right when it sits.  In my opinion.  Thanks
> Jim
>=20
> > On Mar 23, 2021, at 9:17 PM, Michael Marr <[email-masked]> wr=
ote:
> >=20
> > =EF=BB=BFAnother thought.  On my TR3A, there is a spacer on one of the r=
ear springs that, effectively, increases the unloaded ride height on the dri=
ver's side to account for the fact that the car is driven driver-only most o=
f the time.  Does the same situation exist with the 4A?  Is one rear spring l=
onger than the other to provide the ride height difference?  Have you tried m=
easuring the ride height with someone (an adult, preferably) in the driver's=
 seat?
> > Cell:  630-202-0065
> > Email:  [email-masked]
> >=20
> > From: Triumphs <[email-masked]> On Behalf Of Michael Ma=
rr
> > Have you driven the car?  A few road miles will help the suspension sett=
le.  There's a lot of "stiction" in those new components.
> >=20
> > Also, I agree with Jim Kirby - the new shocks will not affect ride heigh=
t, unless, for some reason, they have bottomed out and are bound up.
> > Cell:  630-202-0065
> > Email:  [email-masked]
> >=20
> > From: Triumphs <[email-masked]> On Behalf Of Jim Hennin=
gsen
> > Complete disassembly, clean, repaint, new urethane bushings, tie rod end=
s, trunnions, etc.  New comp springs ( 1 inch lower) all corners, new stock t=
ubes shocks up front and new KYB gas shocks on the tube shock conversion bra=
ckets for the IRS.  Reinstalled all alignment shims as installed as the car d=
rove pretty straight.  Urethane packings on springs.=20
> >=20
> > After completing, I noticed that all four corners have a slightly differ=
ent ride height when measured from garage floor to bottom on fender lip at c=
enter of each wheel.  Left front: 26 3/4 inches, Right front: 26 1/4, Left
> > rear: 27 3/8, right rear: 27 7/8.  I think the higher rear height is com=
ing
> > from the tube shock conversion as it was lower with the levers.    So ab=
out
> > a half inch off each side.   I don't recall having this issue when I red=
id
> > my TR6, but that was a while ago.   Rears also have stock trailing arm
> > brackets (one and two notch brackets on each side - believe these are or=
iginal from new given history of the car). =20
> >=20
> > Looking for help on next steps before bringing it in for an alignment.  W=
ill alignment correct height difference or do I need to add 1/2 inch spacers=
 on lower sides.  I am going to put uprated valved levers back on rear to el=
iminate the extra height in rear. =20
> >=20
> > Any help appreciated.  =20
> >=20
> > Thanks
> > Jim Henningsen
> > Ocala FL
> > Donate: https://urldefense.proofpoint.com/v2/url?u=3Dhttp-3A__www.team.n=
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<html><head><meta http-equiv=3D"content-type" content=3D"text/html; charset=3D=
utf-8"></head><body dir=3D"auto"><div dir=3D"ltr">Good idea. &nbsp;Thanks.&n=
bsp;</div><div dir=3D"ltr"><br><blockquote type=3D"cite">On Mar 24, 2021, at=
 1:48 PM, Brian K &lt;[email-masked]&gt; wrote:<br><br></blockquote></di=
v><blockquote type=3D"cite"><div dir=3D"ltr">=EF=BB=BF<div dir=3D"auto">Simp=
le test on the rear shock conversion - disconnect one end of the shock and s=
lide it out of the way. Roll the car a little with the shock out of the way t=
hen measure again. Don't drive this way.<div dir=3D"auto"><br></div><div dir=
=3D"auto">Like other replies, I would not expect the tube shocks to provide l=
ift.<br><div dir=3D"auto"><br></div><div dir=3D"auto">Brian</div></div></div=
><div class=3D"gmail_extra"><br><div class=3D"gmail_quote">On Mar 24, 2021 4=
:37 AM, Jim Henningsen &lt;[email-masked]&gt; wrote:<br type=3D"attributi=
on"><blockquote class=3D"quote" style=3D"margin:0 0 0 .8ex;border-left:1px #=
ccc solid;padding-left:1ex"><p dir=3D"ltr">Great thoughts and much appreciat=
ed.&nbsp; I believe the higher rear height is from the steel brackets used i=
n the tube shock conversion kit, but I could be wrong.&nbsp;&nbsp; Let me dr=
ive it some more and get it loosened up and then measure again and also incl=
ude measuring floor to frame on each corner.&nbsp; I need to do something as=
 it doesn=E2=80=99t quite look right visually either and a TR has to look ri=
ght when it sits.&nbsp; In my opinion.&nbsp; Thanks<br>
Jim<br></p>
<p dir=3D"ltr">&gt; On Mar 23, 2021, at 9:17 PM, Michael Marr &lt;mmarr@albi=
ontechnical.com&gt; wrote:<br>
&gt; <br>
&gt; =EF=BB=BFAnother thought.&nbsp; On my TR3A, there is a spacer on one of=
 the rear springs that, effectively, increases the unloaded ride height on t=
he driver's side to account for the fact that the car is driven driver-only m=
ost of the time.&nbsp; Does the same situation exist with the 4A?&nbsp; Is o=
ne rear spring longer than the other to provide the ride height difference?&=
nbsp; Have you tried measuring the ride height with someone (an adult, prefe=
rably) in the driver's seat?<br>
&gt; <br>
&gt; Mike<br>
&gt; <br>
&gt; Michael J Marr, P.E., CEng.<br>
&gt; Albion Technical Services<br>
&gt; W5918 Hackbarth Rd<br>
&gt; Fort Atkinson, WI 53538<br>
&gt; <br>
&gt; Cell:&nbsp; 630-202-0065<br>
&gt; Email:&nbsp; [email-masked]<br>
&gt; <br>
&gt; -----Original Message-----<br>
&gt; From: Triumphs &lt;[email-masked]&gt; On Behalf Of Mic=
hael Marr<br>
&gt; Sent: Tuesday, March 23, 2021 8:03 PM<br>
&gt; To: Jim Henningsen &lt;[email-masked]&gt;; [email-masked]<b=
r>
&gt; Subject: Re: [TR] TR4A IRS Suspension Question<br>
&gt; <br>
&gt; Have you driven the car?&nbsp; A few road miles will help the suspensio=
n settle.&nbsp; There's a lot of "stiction" in those new components.<br>
&gt; <br>
&gt; Also, I agree with Jim Kirby - the new shocks will not affect ride heig=
ht, unless, for some reason, they have bottomed out and are bound up.<br>
&gt; <br>
&gt; Mike<br>
&gt; <br>
&gt; Michael J Marr, P.E., CEng.<br>
&gt; Albion Technical Services<br>
&gt; W5918 Hackbarth Rd<br>
&gt; Fort Atkinson, WI 53538<br>
&gt; <br>
&gt; Cell:&nbsp; 630-202-0065<br>
&gt; Email:&nbsp; [email-masked]<br>
&gt; <br>
&gt; -----Original Message-----<br>
&gt; From: Triumphs &lt;[email-masked]&gt; On Behalf Of Jim=
 Henningsen<br>
&gt; Sent: Tuesday, March 23, 2021 7:06 PM<br>
&gt; To: [email-masked]<br>
&gt; Subject: [TR] TR4A IRS Suspension Question<br>
&gt; <br>
&gt; Ok, just finished redoing front and rear suspension on my 67 4A IRS.<br=
&gt; Complete disassembly, clean, repaint, new urethane bushings, tie rod en=
ds, trunnions, etc.&nbsp; New comp springs ( 1 inch lower) all corners, new s=
tock tubes shocks up front and new KYB gas shocks on the tube shock conversi=
on brackets for the IRS.&nbsp; Reinstalled all alignment shims as installed a=
s the car drove pretty straight.&nbsp; Urethane packings on springs. <br>
&gt; <br>
&gt; After completing, I noticed that all four corners have a slightly diffe=
rent ride height when measured from garage floor to bottom on fender lip at c=
enter of each wheel.&nbsp; Left front: 26 3/4 inches, Right front: 26 1/4, L=
eft<br>
&gt; rear: 27 3/8, right rear: 27 7/8.&nbsp; I think the higher rear height i=
s coming<br>
&gt; from the tube shock conversion as it was lower with the levers.&nbsp;&n=
bsp;&nbsp; So about<br>
&gt; a half inch off each side.&nbsp;&nbsp; I don't recall having this issue=
 when I redid<br>
&gt; my TR6, but that was a while ago.&nbsp;&nbsp; Rears also have stock tra=
iling arm<br>
&gt; brackets (one and two notch brackets on each side - believe these are o=
riginal from new given history of the car).&nbsp; <br>
&gt; <br>
&gt; Looking for help on next steps before bringing it in for an alignment.&=
nbsp; Will alignment correct height difference or do I need to add 1/2 inch s=
pacers on lower sides.&nbsp; I am going to put uprated valved levers back on=
 rear to eliminate the extra height in rear.&nbsp; <br>
&gt; <br>
&gt; Any help appreciated.&nbsp;&nbsp; <br>
&gt; <br>
&gt; Thanks<br>
&gt; Jim Henningsen<br>
&gt; Ocala FL<br>
&gt; Too many TRs to maintain!<br>
&gt; 61 3A<br>
&gt; 62 4<br>
&gt; 67 4A<br>
&gt; 75 6<br>
&gt; 81 8<br>
&gt; <br>
&gt; ** [email-masked] **<br>
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