Subject: Re: [TR] How did the factory add on factory options

From: bill beecher <[email-masked]>
Date: Thu, 4 Jun 2020 18:13:43 -0500

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John/Don,
John, Lovely account, thank you for sharing.  But, please tell me: What is a=
 wire-disk Spit?

Don, great pictures are there links to more?

All the best,
Bill B

On Jun 4, 2020, at 5:02 PM, John Macartney <[email-masked]> wr=
ote:

=EF=BB=BFDon,

I do know the Herald and the Toledo went in the crusher. The cost of rectify=
ing the Herald exceeded the cost of materials and direct labour to make it. T=
he Toledo as well. With a spot welded monocoque body done in a jig, you don=E2=
=80=99t have much choice but to throw it out.

The Spitfire is a slightly longer story. It escaped from the factory as it h=
ad been built and even got through the pre delivery check at the selling dea=
ler. Reason? The dealer only got five pounds to do the check so released the=
 car to the customer AND charged him for the wire wheels he hadn=E2=80=99t o=
rdered and didn=E2=80=99t want with the promise they would sort it out at th=
e free first service at 1000 miles. Two days later, customer turns up at BL H=
ead office seeking to tell the CEO what he thought. I was the CEOs PA for co=
nsumer issues so it fell to me to sort it all out. He took me downstairs to s=
ee the car and I was so amazed to see it as it was, that I laughed. Not a go=
od idea because the owner was more than piddled off and he hit me so hard on=
 the jaw, I landed on the pavement. I got it all sorted out (the car) very q=
uickly and customer was happy to have three months free fuel as a goodwill g=
esture. Fast forward forty years to my time at the BMIHT museum and I met th=
e owner again gazing wistfully at the last Spitfire off the line and we star=
ted chatting. Didn=E2=80=99t take too long to realise this was the guy who h=
ad hit me. Once reacquainted, He insisted on buying me a slap up lunch that v=
ery day and we departed in his version of the worlds most popular taxi (Merc=
edes) thoiugh to be fair, it wasn=E2=80=99t a 2400cc diesel.

We had a truly great afternoon and I returned to work well fed and even more=
 well lubricated at about 4.30pm. However, explaining my absence to an irate=
 female Managing Director about my tardiness did nothing to convince her I w=
as being truthful. That=E2=80=99s why I=E2=80=99m SO glad I no longer have a=
nything to do with the motor industry any more. It was fun in those days, bu=
t not now. Different people, different ethos and product that in most cases i=
s boringly reliable, too well made and can only be worked on with a diagnost=
ic plug.

Cheers, John

At the Battle of Waterloo, 1815:
Lord Uxbridge:  =E2=80=9CBy God, Sir - I=E2=80=99ve lost my leg=E2=80=9D
Duke of Wellington: =E2=80=9CBy God, Sir - so you have!=E2=80=9D

> On 4 Jun 2020, at 20:12, Don Hiscock <[email-masked]> wrote:
>=20
> John, I've thought about, and laughed, at your memory of that "three door"=
 Toledo, the right-left Herald, and the wire-disk Spit.  Truly funny.  Knowi=
ng how eager S-T were to sell car, I'd be willing to bet at least two of tho=
se were sold on.  Heck, maybe all three.
>=20
> Sidescreen TRs in the US have all kinds of variations in windscreen washer=
s.  Some never had their dash blanking panel pierced for where a switch usua=
lly went.  I'd have believed all cars got nozzles mounted to the scuttle, bu=
t I didn't know all cars got washers.
>=20
> The 1956 09 S-T accessories brochure still shows windscreen washers as an o=
ption, but they note even then they were rapidly becoming an essential.
> https://photos.smugmug.com/photos/i-vncLKFm/1/3100b418/O/i-vncLKFm.jpg
>=20
> BR,
>=20
> Don
>=20
>> On Thu, Jun 4, 2020 at 1:52 PM John Macartney <[email-masked].=
uk> wrote:
>> Small correction, Don. Screen washers were a legal requirement in most wo=
rld markets and for those countries that didn=E2=80=99t specify them, they g=
ot them anyway. A normal line fitted item.
>>=20
>> Jonmac
>>=20
>> At the Battle of Waterloo, 1815:
>> Lord Uxbridge:  =E2=80=9CBy God, Sir - I=E2=80=99ve lost my leg=E2=80=9D
>> Duke of Wellington: =E2=80=9CBy God, Sir - so you have!=E2=80=9D
>>=20
>>=20
>>> On 4 Jun 2020, at 19:24, Don Hiscock <[email-masked]> wrote:
>>>=20
>>> Here's what part of the Coventry production lines looked like in 1958.  M=
aybe this will give some insight into how things were done.  It's clear S-T c=
ampaigned body colors, and possibly interior colors too.
>>> https://photos.smugmug.com/photos/i-Zq7NRxF/0/3dfea902/O/i-Zq7NRxF.jpg
>>> https://photos.smugmug.com/photos/i-3c968hL/0/e52b3d42/O/i-3c968hL.jpg
>>> https://photos.smugmug.com/photos/i-n5fdGBR/0/48115ef0/O/i-n5fdGBR.jpg
>>> https://photos.smugmug.com/photos/i-9RpSbmS/0/9d49a652/O/i-9RpSbmS.jpg
>>>=20
>>> Jonmac and I were having an email conversation about some of the regiona=
l customization the other day (around lighting regulation differences across=
 the continent in the day) that might be relevant here, too.  John noted tha=
t customization could be done in line production, in Sales Conversion, off-l=
ine before dispatch by train, or by the selling dealer.  Where options were a=
dded relate to how deep they're built into the car.  Adjustable steering on a=
 sidescreen car would obviously be done on the line.  Windscreen washers and=
 mirrors, for example, were usually done by the dealer.
>>>=20
>>> Don
>>> Saint Louis
>>>=20
>>>=20
>>>> On Thu, Jun 4, 2020 at 12:46 PM Sujit Roy <[email-masked]> wrote=
:
>>>> I'm just wondering how the factory added options to cars.
>>>> Did the production line have branches off the main line at certain stag=
es and then they would merge back on the main line? Or were the cars lifted o=
ff the line with some crane?
>>>> Sujit
>>>>=20
>>>>=20
>>>> --=20
>>>> Sujit Roy
>>>> Cupertino, California
>>>>=20
>>>> https://triumphstagblog.wordpress.com/
>>>>=20
>>>> ** [email-masked] **
>>>>=20
>>>> Donate: http://www.team.net/donate.html
>>>> Archive: http://www.team.net/pipermail/triumphs  http://www.team.net/ar=
chive
>>>>=20
>>>> Unsubscribe/Manage: http://autox.team.net/mailman/options/triumphs/don.=
[email-masked]
>>> ** [email-masked] **
>>>=20
>>> Donate: http://www.team.net/donate.html
>>> Archive: http://www.team.net/pipermail/triumphs  http://www.team.net/arc=
hive
>>>=20
>>> Unsubscribe/Manage: http://autox.team.net/mailman/options/triumphs/john.=
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<html><head><meta http-equiv=3D"content-type" content=3D"text/html; charset=3D=
utf-8"></head><body dir=3D"auto"><div dir=3D"ltr">John/Don,</div><div dir=3D=
"ltr">John, Lovely account, thank you for sharing. &nbsp;But, please tell me=
: What is a wire-disk Spit?</div><div dir=3D"ltr"><br></div><div dir=3D"ltr"=
>Don, great pictures are there links to more?</div><div dir=3D"ltr"><br></di=
v><div dir=3D"ltr">All the best,</div><div dir=3D"ltr">Bill B</div><div dir=3D=
"ltr"><br>On Jun 4, 2020, at 5:02 PM, John Macartney &lt;John.Macartney@ukpi=
ps.org.uk&gt; wrote:<br><br></div><div dir=3D"ltr">=EF=BB=BF<meta http-equiv=
=3D"content-type" content=3D"text/html; charset=3Dutf-8">Don,<div><br></div>=
<div>I do know the Herald and the Toledo went in the crusher. The cost of re=
ctifying the Herald exceeded the cost of materials and direct labour to make=
 it. The Toledo as well. With a spot welded monocoque body done in a jig, yo=
u don=E2=80=99t have much choice but to throw it out.</div><div><br></div><d=
iv>The Spitfire is a slightly longer story. It escaped from the factory as i=
t had been built and even got through the pre delivery check at the selling d=
ealer. Reason? The dealer only got five pounds to do the check so released t=
he car to the customer AND charged him for the wire wheels he hadn=E2=80=99t=
 ordered and didn=E2=80=99t want with the promise they would sort it out at t=
he free first service at 1000 miles. Two days later, customer turns up at BL=
 Head office seeking to tell the CEO what he thought. I was the CEOs PA for c=
onsumer issues so it fell to me to sort it all out. He took me downstairs to=
 see the car and I was so amazed to see it as it was, that I laughed. Not a g=
ood idea because the owner was more than piddled off and he hit me so hard o=
n the jaw, I landed on the pavement. I got it all sorted out (the car) very q=
uickly and customer was happy to have three months free fuel as a goodwill g=
esture. Fast forward forty years to my time at the BMIHT museum and I met th=
e owner again gazing wistfully at the last Spitfire off the line and we star=
ted chatting. Didn=E2=80=99t take too long to realise this was the guy who h=
ad hit me. Once reacquainted, He insisted on buying me a slap up lunch that v=
ery day and we departed in his version of the worlds most popular taxi (Merc=
edes) thoiugh to be fair, it wasn=E2=80=99t a 2400cc diesel.</div><div><br><=
/div><div>We had a truly great afternoon and I returned to work well fed and=
 even more well lubricated at about 4.30pm. However, explaining my absence t=
o an irate female Managing Director about my tardiness did nothing to convin=
ce her I was being truthful. That=E2=80=99s why I=E2=80=99m SO glad I no lon=
ger have anything to do with the motor industry any more. It was fun in thos=
e days, but not now. Different people, different ethos and product that in m=
ost cases is boringly reliable, too well made and can only be worked on with=
 a diagnostic plug.</div><div><br></div><div>Cheers, John</div><div><br><br>=
<div dir=3D"ltr">At the Battle of Waterloo, 1815:<div>Lord Uxbridge: &nbsp;=E2=
=80=9CBy God, Sir - I=E2=80=99ve lost my leg=E2=80=9D</div><div>Duke of Well=
ington: =E2=80=9CBy God, Sir - so you have!=E2=80=9D</div><div><br></div></d=
iv><div dir=3D"ltr"><br>On 4 Jun 2020, at 20:12, Don Hiscock &lt;<a href=3D"=
mailto:[email-masked]">[email-masked]</a>&gt; wrote:<br><br></=
div><blockquote type=3D"cite"><div dir=3D"ltr"><div dir=3D"ltr">John, I've t=
hought about, and laughed, at your memory of that "three door" Toledo, the r=
ight-left Herald, and the wire-disk Spit.&nbsp; Truly funny.&nbsp; Knowing h=
ow eager S-T were to sell car, I'd be willing to bet at least two of those w=
ere sold on.&nbsp; Heck, maybe all three.<div><br></div><div>Sidescreen TRs i=
n the US have all kinds of variations in windscreen washers.&nbsp; Some neve=
r had their dash blanking panel pierced for where a switch usually went.&nbs=
p; I'd have believed all cars got nozzles mounted to the scuttle, but I didn=
't know all cars got washers.</div><div><br></div><div>The 1956 09 S-T acces=
sories brochure still shows windscreen washers as an option, but they note e=
ven then they were rapidly becoming an essential.</div><div><a href=3D"https=
://photos.smugmug.com/photos/i-vncLKFm/1/3100b418/O/i-vncLKFm.jpg">https://p=
hotos.smugmug.com/photos/i-vncLKFm/1/3100b418/O/i-vncLKFm.jpg</a><br></div><=
div><br></div><div>BR,</div><div><br></div><div>Don</div></div><br><div clas=
s=3D"gmail_quote"><div dir=3D"ltr" class=3D"gmail_attr">On Thu, Jun 4, 2020 a=
t 1:52 PM John Macartney &lt;<a href=3D"mailto:[email-masked]"=
>[email-masked]</a>&gt; wrote:<br></div><blockquote class=3D"g=
mail_quote" style=3D"margin:0px 0px 0px 0.8ex;border-left:1px solid rgb(204,=
204,204);padding-left:1ex"><div dir=3D"auto">Small correction, Don. Screen w=
ashers were a legal requirement in most world markets and for those countrie=
s that didn=E2=80=99t specify them, they got them anyway. A normal line fitt=
ed item.<div><br></div><div>Jonmac<br><br><div id=3D"gmail-m_-58503190722342=
58843AppleMailSignature" dir=3D"ltr">At the Battle of Waterloo, 1815:<div>Lo=
rd Uxbridge: &nbsp;=E2=80=9CBy God, Sir - I=E2=80=99ve lost my leg=E2=80=9D<=
/div><div>Duke of Wellington: =E2=80=9CBy God, Sir - so you have!=E2=80=9D</=
div><div><br></div></div><div dir=3D"ltr"><br>On 4 Jun 2020, at 19:24, Don H=
iscock &lt;<a href=3D"mailto:[email-masked]" target=3D"_blank">don.hi=
[email-masked]</a>&gt; wrote:<br><br></div><blockquote type=3D"cite"><div d=
ir=3D"ltr"><div dir=3D"ltr">Here's what part of the Coventry production line=
s looked like in 1958.&nbsp; Maybe this will give some insight into how thin=
gs were done.&nbsp; It's clear S-T campaigned body colors, and possibly inte=
rior colors too.<div><a href=3D"https://photos.smugmug.com/photos/i-Zq7NRxF/=
0/3dfea902/O/i-Zq7NRxF.jpg" target=3D"_blank">https://photos.smugmug.com/pho=
tos/i-Zq7NRxF/0/3dfea902/O/i-Zq7NRxF.jpg</a></div><div><a href=3D"https://ph=
otos.smugmug.com/photos/i-3c968hL/0/e52b3d42/O/i-3c968hL.jpg" target=3D"_bla=
nk">https://photos.smugmug.com/photos/i-3c968hL/0/e52b3d42/O/i-3c968hL.jpg</=
a></div><div><a href=3D"https://photos.smugmug.com/photos/i-n5fdGBR/0/48115e=
f0/O/i-n5fdGBR.jpg" target=3D"_blank">https://photos.smugmug.com/photos/i-n5=
fdGBR/0/48115ef0/O/i-n5fdGBR.jpg</a></div><div><a href=3D"https://photos.smu=
gmug.com/photos/i-9RpSbmS/0/9d49a652/O/i-9RpSbmS.jpg" target=3D"_blank">http=
s://photos.smugmug.com/photos/i-9RpSbmS/0/9d49a652/O/i-9RpSbmS.jpg</a></div>=
<div><br></div><div>Jonmac and I were having&nbsp;an email conversation abou=
t some of the regional customization the other day (around lighting regulati=
on differences across the continent in the day) that might be relevant here,=
&nbsp;too.&nbsp; John noted that customization could be done in line product=
ion, in Sales Conversion, off-line before dispatch by train, or by the selli=
ng dealer.&nbsp; Where options were added relate to how deep they're built i=
nto the car.&nbsp; Adjustable steering on a sidescreen car would obviously b=
e done on the line.&nbsp; Windscreen washers and mirrors, for example, were u=
sually done by the dealer.</div><div><br></div><div>Don</div><div>Saint Loui=
s<br><div><br></div></div></div><br><div class=3D"gmail_quote"><div dir=3D"l=
tr" class=3D"gmail_attr">On Thu, Jun 4, 2020 at 12:46 PM Sujit Roy &lt;<a hr=
ef=3D"mailto:[email-masked]" target=3D"_blank">[email-masked]<=
/a>&gt; wrote:<br></div><blockquote class=3D"gmail_quote" style=3D"margin:0p=
x 0px 0px 0.8ex;border-left:1px solid rgb(204,204,204);padding-left:1ex"><di=
v dir=3D"ltr">I'm just&nbsp;wondering&nbsp;how the factory added options to c=
ars.<div>Did the production&nbsp;line have branches off the main line at cer=
tain stages and then they would merge back on the main line? Or were the car=
s lifted off the line with some crane?</div><div>Sujit</div><div><br clear=3D=
"all"><div><br></div>-- <br><div dir=3D"ltr"><div dir=3D"ltr"><div>Sujit Roy=
<br>Cupertino, California</div><div><br><a href=3D"https://triumphstagblog.w=
ordpress.com/" target=3D"_blank">https://triumphstagblog.wordpress.com/</a><=
br><br></div></div></div></div></div>
** <a href=3D"mailto:[email-masked]" target=3D"_blank">triumphs@aut=
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From: "Keith Stewart" <[email-masked]>
Date: Fri, 5 Jun 2020 16:22:24 -0400

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Pretty clear when you read the description of the car.

Wire =E2=80=93 two wire wheels

Disk =E2=80=93 two disc wheels

Spit =E2=80=93 Spitfire car

=20

Hence, Wire-dsik Spit. =F0=9F=98=8A

=20

Keith

=20

=20

=20

John, Lovely account, thank you for sharing.  But, please tell me: What =
is a wire-disk Spit?

=20

=20

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vlink=3Dpurple><div class=3DWordSection1><p class=3DMsoPlainText>Pretty =
clear when you read the description of the car.<o:p></o:p></p><p =
class=3DMsoPlainText>Wire =E2=80=93 two wire wheels<o:p></o:p></p><p =
class=3DMsoPlainText>Disk =E2=80=93 two disc wheels<o:p></o:p></p><p =
class=3DMsoPlainText>Spit =E2=80=93 Spitfire car<o:p></o:p></p><p =
class=3DMsoPlainText><o:p>&nbsp;</o:p></p><p class=3DMsoPlainText>Hence, =
Wire-dsik Spit. <span style=3D'font-family:"Segoe UI =
Emoji",sans-serif'>&#128522;</span><o:p></o:p></p><p =
class=3DMsoPlainText><o:p>&nbsp;</o:p></p><p =
class=3DMsoPlainText>Keith<o:p></o:p></p><p =
class=3DMsoPlainText><o:p>&nbsp;</o:p></p><p class=3DMsoNormal><span =
style=3D'mso-fareast-language:EN-US'><o:p>&nbsp;</o:p></span></p><p =
class=3DMsoNormal><span =
style=3D'mso-fareast-language:EN-US'><o:p>&nbsp;</o:p></span></p><div><p =
class=3DMsoNormal>John, Lovely account, thank you for sharing. =
&nbsp;But, please tell me: What is a wire-disk =
Spit?<o:p></o:p></p></div><div><p =
class=3DMsoNormal><o:p>&nbsp;</o:p></p></div><div><p =
class=3DMsoNormal><o:p>&nbsp;</o:p></p></div></div></body></html>
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From: DAVID MASSEY <[email-masked]>
Date: Sat, 6 Jun 2020 00:02:49 +0000 (UTC)

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 More like a Wire-Disc-BrokeJaw-Spit.
=20
Dave=20

=20
=20
-----Original Message-----
From: Keith Stewart <[email-masked]>
To: 'bill beecher' <[email-masked]>; 'John Macartney' <John.Macartney=
@ukpips.org.uk>
Cc: 'Triumphs' <[email-masked]>
Sent: Fri, Jun 5, 2020 3:22 pm
Subject: Re: [TR] How did the factory add on factory options

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disc wheelsSpit =E2=80=93 Spitfire car =C2=A0Hence, Wire-dsik Spit. =F0=9F=
=98=8A =C2=A0Keith =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0John, Lovely account, thank you for =
sharing. =C2=A0But, please tell me: What is a wire-disk Spit? =C2=A0 =C2=A0=
** [email-masked] **

Archive: http://www.team.net/pipermail/triumphs  http://www.team.net/archiv=
e

[email-masked]

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<div style=3D"color:black;font: 12pt Arial, Helvetica, sans-serif;">
<div> <font size=3D"3">More like a Wire-Disc-BrokeJaw-Spit.</font><br>
</div>

<div> <br>
</div>

<div style=3D"clear:both"><font size=3D"4">Dave </font><br>
<br>
</div>

<div> <br>
</div>

<div> <br>
</div>

<div style=3D"font-family:arial,helvetica;font-size:10pt;color:black">-----=
Original Message-----<br>
From: Keith Stewart &lt;[email-masked]&gt;<br>
To: 'bill beecher' &lt;[email-masked]&gt;; 'John Macartney' &lt;John.=
[email-masked]&gt;<br>
Cc: 'Triumphs' &lt;[email-masked]&gt;<br>
Sent: Fri, Jun 5, 2020 3:22 pm<br>
Subject: Re: [TR] How did the factory add on factory options<br>
<br>

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<div class=3D"yiv8042551414WordSection1">
<div class=3D"yiv8042551414MsoPlainText">Pretty clear when you read the des=
cription of the car.</div>

<div class=3D"yiv8042551414MsoPlainText">Wire =E2=80=93 two wire wheels</di=
v>

<div class=3D"yiv8042551414MsoPlainText">Disk =E2=80=93 two disc wheels</di=
v>

<div class=3D"yiv8042551414MsoPlainText">Spit =E2=80=93 Spitfire car</div>

<div class=3D"yiv8042551414MsoPlainText"> &nbsp;</div>

<div class=3D"yiv8042551414MsoPlainText">Hence, Wire-dsik Spit. <span style=
=3D"font-family:&quot;Segoe UI Emoji&quot;, sans-serif;">=F0=9F=98=8A</span=
></div>

<div class=3D"yiv8042551414MsoPlainText"> &nbsp;</div>

<div class=3D"yiv8042551414MsoPlainText">Keith</div>

<div class=3D"yiv8042551414MsoPlainText"> &nbsp;</div>

<div class=3D"yiv8042551414MsoNormal"><span style=3D""> &nbsp;</span></div>

<div class=3D"yiv8042551414MsoNormal"><span style=3D""> &nbsp;</span></div>

<div>
<div class=3D"yiv8042551414MsoNormal">John, Lovely account, thank you for s=
haring. &nbsp;But, please tell me: What is a wire-disk Spit?</div>
</div>

<div>
<div class=3D"yiv8042551414MsoNormal"> &nbsp;</div>
</div>

<div>
<div class=3D"yiv8042551414MsoNormal"> &nbsp;</div>
</div>
</div>
</div>
</div>
** <a ymailto=3D"mailto:[email-masked]" href=3D"mailto:triumphs@au=
tox.team.net">[email-masked]</a> **<br>
<br>
//www.team.net/donate.html</a><br>
Archive: <a href=3D"http://www.team.net/pipermail/triumphs" target=3D"_blan=
k">http://www.team.net/pipermail/triumphs </a> <a href=3D"http://www.team.n=
et/archive" target=3D"_blank">http://www.team.net/archive</a><br>
<br>
hs/[email-masked]" target=3D"_blank">http://autox.team.net/mailman/opti=
ons/triumphs/[email-masked]</a><br>
</div>
</div>

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From: bill beecher <[email-masked]>
Date: Fri, 5 Jun 2020 21:27:09 -0500

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Actually a mental picture of some type of a hybrid wheel, disk with wire ins=
erts came to mind.  Not pretty.=20

Bill
Serenity Now......

On Jun 5, 2020, at 3:22 PM, Keith Stewart <[email-masked]> wrote:

=EF=BB=BF
=20=

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<html><head><meta http-equiv=3D"content-type" content=3D"text/html; charset=3D=
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 hybrid wheel, disk with wire inserts came to mind. &nbsp;Not pretty.&nbsp;<=
br><br>Bill<br><div dir=3D"ltr">Serenity Now......</div><div dir=3D"ltr"><br=
>On Jun 5, 2020, at 3:22 PM, Keith Stewart &lt;[email-masked]&gt; wro=
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oPlainText">Pretty clear when you read the description of the car.<o:p></o:p=
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<p class=3D"MsoPlainText">Disk =E2=80=93 two disc wheels<o:p></o:p></p><p cl=
ass=3D"MsoPlainText">Spit =E2=80=93 Spitfire car<o:p></o:p></p><p class=3D"M=
soPlainText"><o:p>&nbsp;</o:p></p><p class=3D"MsoPlainText">Hence, Wire-dsik=
 Spit. <span style=3D"font-family:&quot;Segoe UI Emoji&quot;,sans-serif">=F0=
=9F=98=8A</span><o:p></o:p></p><p class=3D"MsoPlainText"><o:p>&nbsp;</o:p></=
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so-fareast-language:EN-US"><o:p>&nbsp;</o:p></span></p><div><p class=3D"MsoN=
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e: What is a wire-disk Spit?<o:p></o:p></p></div><div><p class=3D"MsoNormal"=
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</div></body></html>=

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