Subject: Re: [TR] Troubleshooting TR3A fuel gauge

From: "[email-masked]" <[email-masked]>
Date: Wed, 29 May 2019 23:10:33 -0500

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Barney at Mgaguru.com is a good guy that knows his stuff.   Ohms should roug=
hly go from 10-90(Barney says 0-70) with the clothes hanger and all wires di=
sconnected. =20

Check all your related connections, the sender and the gauge need to be grou=
nded. =20

I would expect 12v at the hot post of the gauge.  If your not getting it try=
 a direct jumper and test the system.   New gauges are NLA but you can eithe=
r find them on eBay or other parts sites, or send your gauge AND sender to o=
ne of the several reputable instrument rebuilders.=20

Bill B
TS30800L

Sent from my DynaTAC 8000X

On May 29, 2019, at 10:29 PM, Dave MacKay <[email-masked]> wrote:

Hello:

I=E2=80=99ve been troubleshooting the fuel gauge on my TR3A because it has n=
ot been providing an accurate indication (or even a reasonable approximation=
) of the fuel level in my tank.

I referred to a number of documents and old posts about how to troubleshoot a=
nd calibrate the fuel gauge and sending unit (e.g., https://www.triumphexp.c=
om/forum/tr2-and-tr3-forum.6/faulty-fuel-gauge-57-tr-3.1244960/ and http://m=
gaguru.com/mgtech/electric/fg_01.htm).

I started by looping a clothes hanger around the float in the tank and readi=
ng how many ohms I saw at different levels. What I found was that the readin=
g fluctuated --- it didn=E2=80=99t stay the same even when I held the float a=
t one level. I then checked to ensure that the grounds were good (they were)=
. Before concluding that the sending unit was flakey, I thought I=E2=80=99d b=
etter ensure that I was getting good power to the unit.

That=E2=80=99s where things got weird.

-       I read 7.6V between the sending unit and ground.

-       I read 7.65V between the T terminal of the fuel gauge (which connect=
s to the fuel tank sending unit) and ground. However, this reading was errat=
ic; the value would change to, say 4V.

-       I read 10.6V at the B terminal of the fuel gauge

-       I read 10.9V at the A4 terminal of the fuse box.

-       I read 11.9V at the A2 terminal of the fuse box.

-       I read 12.5v between the terminals of the battery.

I=E2=80=99m a bit baffled. I expected that I=E2=80=99d see about 12V at all p=
oints. Even if the fuel gauge was bad, I would have expected to see the same=
 voltage at the battery, A2, A4, and the B terminal of the gauge. As it is, I=
=E2=80=99m seeing a drop of about 2V among them.

What might be causing the voltage drops that I=E2=80=99m seeing? Could it be=
 as simple as a broken fuel gauge? If so, how could I test that?

Moss lists the fuel gauge as NLA. Does anyone know of another source?

BTW, when I switched my generator for an alternator years ago, I eliminated t=
he control box (regulator).=20

Thanks in advance.

Dave MacKay

TR3A s/n 68639L

near Toronto, Canada

** [email-masked] **

Archive: http://www.team.net/pipermail/triumphs http://www.team.net/archive

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<html><head><meta http-equiv=3D"content-type" content=3D"text/html; charset=3D=
utf-8"></head><body dir=3D"auto">Barney at <a href=3D"http://Mgaguru.com">Mg=
aguru.com</a> is a good guy that knows his stuff. &nbsp; Ohms should roughly=
 go from 10-90(Barney says 0-70) with the clothes hanger and all wires disco=
nnected. &nbsp;<div><br></div><div>Check all your related connections, the s=
ender and the gauge need to be grounded. &nbsp;<br><div><br></div><div>I wou=
ld expect 12v at the hot post of the gauge. &nbsp;If your not getting it try=
 a direct jumper and test the system. &nbsp; New gauges are NLA but you can e=
ither find them on eBay or other parts sites, or send your gauge AND sender t=
o one of the several reputable instrument rebuilders.&nbsp;</div><div><br></=
div><div>Bill B</div><div>TS30800L<br><br><div id=3D"AppleMailSignature" dir=
=3D"ltr">Sent from my DynaTAC 8000X</div><div dir=3D"ltr"><br>On May 29, 201=
9, at 10:29 PM, Dave MacKay &lt;<a href=3D"mailto:[email-masked]">dave@mdm=
ackay.ca</a>&gt; wrote:<br><br></div><div dir=3D"ltr">

<meta http-equiv=3D"Content-Type" content=3D"text/html; charset=3Dus-ascii">=

<meta name=3D"Generator" content=3D"MS Exchange Server version 16.0.11601.20=
208">
<title>Troubleshooting TR3A fuel gauge</title>

<p dir=3D"LTR"><span lang=3D"en-ca"><font face=3D"Calibri">Hello:</font></sp=
an></p>

<p dir=3D"LTR"><span lang=3D"en-ca"><font face=3D"Calibri">I=E2=80=99ve been=
 troubleshooting the</font></span><span lang=3D"en-ca"></span><span lang=3D"=
en-ca"></span><span lang=3D"en-ca"> <font face=3D"Calibri">fuel gauge on my T=
R3A</font></span><span lang=3D"en-ca"></span><span lang=3D"en-ca"></span><sp=
an lang=3D"en-ca"> <font face=3D"Calibri">because it has not been providing a=
n accurate indication</font></span><span lang=3D"en-ca"></span><span lang=3D=
"en-ca"></span><span lang=3D"en-ca"> <font face=3D"Calibri">(or even</font><=
/span><span lang=3D"en-ca"></span><span lang=3D"en-ca"></span><span lang=3D"=
en-ca"><font face=3D"Calibri"> a reasonable approximation)</font></span><spa=
n lang=3D"en-ca"></span><span lang=3D"en-ca"></span><span lang=3D"en-ca"> <f=
ont face=3D"Calibri">of the fuel level in my tank.</font></span><span lang=3D=
"en-ca"></span><span lang=3D"en-ca"></span><span lang=3D"en-ca"><font face=3D=
"Calibri"></font></span><span lang=3D"en-ca"></span><span lang=3D"en-ca"></s=
pan><span lang=3D"en-ca"> </span></p>

<p dir=3D"LTR"><span lang=3D"en-ca"><font face=3D"Calibri">I referred to a n=
umber of documents and old posts about how to troubleshoot and calibrate the=
 fuel</font></span><span lang=3D"en-ca"></span><span lang=3D"en-ca"></span><=
span lang=3D"en-ca"><font face=3D"Calibri"> gauge and sending unit (e.g.,</f=
ont></span><span lang=3D"en-ca"> </span><a href=3D"https://www.triumphexp.co=
m/forum/tr2-and-tr3-forum.6/faulty-fuel-gauge-57-tr-3.1244960/"><span lang=3D=
"en-ca"></span><span lang=3D"en-ca"></span><span lang=3D"en-ca"><u><font col=
or=3D"#0563C1" face=3D"Calibri">https://www.triumphexp.com/forum/tr2-and-tr3=
-forum.6/faulty-fuel-gauge-57-tr-3.1244960/</font></u></span><span lang=3D"e=
n-ca"></span></a><span lang=3D"en-ca"></span><span lang=3D"en-ca"></span><sp=
an lang=3D"en-ca"><font face=3D"Calibri"> and</font></span><span lang=3D"en-=
ca"> </span><a href=3D"http://mgaguru.com/mgtech/electric/fg_01htm"><span la=
ng=3D"en-ca"></span><span lang=3D"en-ca"></span><span lang=3D"en-ca"><u><fon=
t color=3D"#0563C1" face=3D"Calibri">http://mgaguru.com/mgtech/electric/fg_0=
1.htm</font></u></span><span lang=3D"en-ca"></span></a><span lang=3D"en-ca">=
</span><span lang=3D"en-ca"></span><span lang=3D"en-ca"><font face=3D"Calibr=
i">).</font></span><span lang=3D"en-ca"></span><span lang=3D"en-ca"></span><=
span lang=3D"en-ca"></span></p>

<p dir=3D"LTR"><span lang=3D"en-ca"><font face=3D"Calibri">I</font></span><s=
pan lang=3D"en-ca"></span><span lang=3D"en-ca"></span><span lang=3D"en-ca"> <=
font face=3D"Calibri">started by looping a clothes hanger around the float i=
n the tank and reading how many ohms I saw at different levels. What I found=
 was that the reading fluctuated --- it</font></span><span lang=3D"en-ca"></=
span><span lang=3D"en-ca"></span><span lang=3D"en-ca"> <font face=3D"Calibri=
">didn=E2=80=99t stay the same even when I held the float at one level. I th=
en checked to ensure that the grounds were good (</font></span><span lang=3D=
"en-ca"></span><span lang=3D"en-ca"></span><span lang=3D"en-ca"><font face=3D=
"Calibri">they</font></span><span lang=3D"en-ca"></span><span lang=3D"en-ca"=
></span><span lang=3D"en-ca"><font face=3D"Calibri"> were). Before</font></s=
pan><span lang=3D"en-ca"></span><span lang=3D"en-ca"></span><span lang=3D"en=
-ca"> <font face=3D"Calibri">concludin</font></span><span lang=3D"en-ca"></s=
pan><span lang=3D"en-ca"></span><span lang=3D"en-ca"><font face=3D"Calibri">=
g that the</font></span><span lang=3D"en-ca"></span><span lang=3D"en-ca"></s=
pan><span lang=3D"en-ca"> <font face=3D"Calibri">sending unit</font></span><=
span lang=3D"en-ca"></span><span lang=3D"en-ca"></span><span lang=3D"en-ca">=
<font face=3D"Calibri"> was flakey</font></span><span lang=3D"en-ca"></span>=
<span lang=3D"en-ca"></span><span lang=3D"en-ca"><font face=3D"Calibri">, I t=
ho</font></span><span lang=3D"en-ca"></span><span lang=3D"en-ca"></span><spa=
n lang=3D"en-ca"><font face=3D"Calibri">ught I=E2=80=99d</font></span><span l=
ang=3D"en-ca"></span><span lang=3D"en-ca"></span><span lang=3D"en-ca"> <font=
 face=3D"Calibri">better ensure that</font></span><span lang=3D"en-ca"></spa=
n><span lang=3D"en-ca"></span><span lang=3D"en-ca"><font face=3D"Calibri"> I=
 was getting good power to the unit.</font></span><span lang=3D"en-ca"></spa=
n><span lang=3D"en-ca"></span><span lang=3D"en-ca"> </span></p>

<p dir=3D"LTR"><span lang=3D"en-ca"><font face=3D"Calibri">That=E2=80=99s wh=
ere things got weird.</font></span></p>

<p dir=3D"LTR"><span lang=3D"en-ca"><font face=3D"Calibri">-&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbs=
p;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;</font></span><span lang=3D"en-ca"></span><span lang=3D"=
en-ca"></span><span lang=3D"en-ca"></span><span lang=3D"en-ca"></span><span l=
ang=3D"en-ca"> <font face=3D"Calibri">I read 7.6V between the sending unit a=
nd ground</font></span><span lang=3D"en-ca"></span><span lang=3D"en-ca"></sp=
an><span lang=3D"en-ca"><font face=3D"Calibri">.</font></span><span lang=3D"=
en-ca"></span><span lang=3D"en-ca"></span><span lang=3D"en-ca"> </span></p>

<p dir=3D"LTR"><span lang=3D"en-ca"><font face=3D"Calibri">-&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbs=
p;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;</font></span><span lang=3D"en-ca"></span><span lang=3D"=
en-ca"></span><span lang=3D"en-ca"></span><span lang=3D"en-ca"> <font face=3D=
"Calibri">I</font></span><span lang=3D"en-ca"></span><span lang=3D"en-ca"></=
span><span lang=3D"en-ca"> <font face=3D"Calibri">read</font></span><span la=
ng=3D"en-ca"></span><span lang=3D"en-ca"></span><span lang=3D"en-ca"><font f=
ace=3D"Calibri"></font></span><span lang=3D"en-ca"></span><span lang=3D"en-c=
a"></span><span lang=3D"en-ca"> <font face=3D"Calibri">7.65V</font></span><s=
pan lang=3D"en-ca"></span><span lang=3D"en-ca"></span><span lang=3D"en-ca"><=
font face=3D"Calibri"> between the T terminal of the fuel gauge</font></span=
><span lang=3D"en-ca"></span><span lang=3D"en-ca"></span><span lang=3D"en-ca=
"> <font face=3D"Calibri">(which connects to the fuel tank sendin</font></sp=
an><span lang=3D"en-ca"></span><span lang=3D"en-ca"></span><span lang=3D"en-=
ca"><font face=3D"Calibri">g unit)</font></span><span lang=3D"en-ca"></span>=
<span lang=3D"en-ca"></span><span lang=3D"en-ca"> <font face=3D"Calibri">and=
 ground.</font></span><span lang=3D"en-ca"></span><span lang=3D"en-ca"></spa=
n><span lang=3D"en-ca"><font face=3D"Calibri"></font></span><span lang=3D"en=
-ca"></span><span lang=3D"en-ca"></span><span lang=3D"en-ca"> <font face=3D"=
Calibri">However, this reading was erratic; the value would change to, say 4=
V.</font></span><span lang=3D"en-ca"></span><span lang=3D"en-ca"></span><spa=
n lang=3D"en-ca"></span></p>

<p dir=3D"LTR"><span lang=3D"en-ca"><font face=3D"Calibri">-&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbs=
p;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;</font></span><span lang=3D"en-ca"></span><span lang=3D"=
en-ca"></span><span lang=3D"en-ca"></span><span lang=3D"en-ca"> <font face=3D=
"Calibri">I</font></span><span lang=3D"en-ca"></span><span lang=3D"en-ca"></=
span><span lang=3D"en-ca"> <font face=3D"Calibri">read 10.6V</font></span><s=
pan lang=3D"en-ca"></span><span lang=3D"en-ca"></span><span lang=3D"en-ca"> <=
font face=3D"Calibri">at the B termin</font></span><span lang=3D"en-ca"></sp=
an><span lang=3D"en-ca"></span><span lang=3D"en-ca"><font face=3D"Calibri">a=
l of the fuel gauge</font></span><span lang=3D"en-ca"></span><span lang=3D"e=
n-ca"></span><span lang=3D"en-ca"></span></p>

<p dir=3D"LTR"><span lang=3D"en-ca"><font face=3D"Calibri">-&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbs=
p;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;</font></span><span lang=3D"en-ca"></span><span lang=3D"=
en-ca"></span><span lang=3D"en-ca"></span><span lang=3D"en-ca"> <font face=3D=
"Calibri">I read</font></span><span lang=3D"en-ca"></span><span lang=3D"en-c=
a"></span><span lang=3D"en-ca"> <font face=3D"Calibri">10.9V at the A4 termi=
nal</font></span><span lang=3D"en-ca"></span><span lang=3D"en-ca"></span><sp=
an lang=3D"en-ca"><font face=3D"Calibri"> of the fuse box</font></span><span=
 lang=3D"en-ca"></span><span lang=3D"en-ca"></span><span lang=3D"en-ca"><fon=
t face=3D"Calibri">.</font></span></p>

<p dir=3D"LTR"><span lang=3D"en-ca"><font face=3D"Calibri">-&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbs=
p;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;</font></span><span lang=3D"en-ca"></span><span lang=3D"=
en-ca"></span><span lang=3D"en-ca"></span><span lang=3D"en-ca"> <font face=3D=
"Calibri">I read 11.9V</font></span><span lang=3D"en-ca"></span><span lang=3D=
"en-ca"></span><span lang=3D"en-ca"> <font face=3D"Calibri">at the A2 termin=
al of the fuse box.</font></span></p>

<p dir=3D"LTR"><span lang=3D"en-ca"><font face=3D"Calibri">-&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbs=
p;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;</font></span><span lang=3D"en-ca"></span><span lang=3D"=
en-ca"></span><span lang=3D"en-ca"></span><span lang=3D"en-ca"> <font face=3D=
"Calibri">I read 12.5v between the terminals of the battery.</font></span><s=
pan lang=3D"en-ca"></span><span lang=3D"en-ca"></span><span lang=3D"en-ca"><=
/span></p>

<p dir=3D"LTR"><span lang=3D"en-ca"><font face=3D"Calibri">I=E2=80=99m a bit=
 baffled</font></span><span lang=3D"en-ca"></span><span lang=3D"en-ca"></spa=
n><span lang=3D"en-ca"><font face=3D"Calibri">. I expected that I=E2=80=99d s=
ee about 12V at all points.</font></span><span lang=3D"en-ca"></span><span l=
ang=3D"en-ca"></span><span lang=3D"en-ca"> <font face=3D"Calibri">Even if th=
e</font></span><span lang=3D"en-ca"></span><span lang=3D"en-ca"></span><span=
 lang=3D"en-ca"> <font face=3D"Calibri">fuel</font></span><span lang=3D"en-c=
a"></span><span lang=3D"en-ca"></span><span lang=3D"en-ca"> <font face=3D"Ca=
libri">gauge was bad, I would have expected</font></span><span lang=3D"en-ca=
"></span><span lang=3D"en-ca"></span><span lang=3D"en-ca"> <font face=3D"Cal=
ibri">to see</font></span><span lang=3D"en-ca"></span><span lang=3D"en-ca"><=
/span><span lang=3D"en-ca"> <font face=3D"Calibri">the same voltage at the b=
attery, A2, A4, and the B terminal of the gauge</font></span><span lang=3D"e=
n-ca"></span><span lang=3D"en-ca"></span><span lang=3D"en-ca"><font face=3D"=
Calibri">. As it is, I=E2=80=99m seeing a drop of about 2V among them.</font=
></span><span lang=3D"en-ca"></span><span lang=3D"en-ca"></span><span lang=3D=
"en-ca"></span></p>

<p dir=3D"LTR"><span lang=3D"en-ca"><font face=3D"Calibri">What might be cau=
sing the v</font></span><span lang=3D"en-ca"></span><span lang=3D"en-ca"></s=
pan><span lang=3D"en-ca"><font face=3D"Calibri">oltage drops that I=E2=80=99=
m seeing? Could it be as simple as a broken fuel gauge? If so, how could I t=
est that?</font></span><span lang=3D"en-ca"></span><span lang=3D"en-ca"></sp=
an><span lang=3D"en-ca"></span></p>

<p dir=3D"LTR"><span lang=3D"en-ca"><font face=3D"Calibri">Moss lists the fu=
el gauge as NLA. Does anyone know of ano</font></span><span lang=3D"en-ca"><=
/span><span lang=3D"en-ca"></span><span lang=3D"en-ca"><font face=3D"Calibri=
">ther source?</font></span><span lang=3D"en-ca"></span><span lang=3D"en-ca"=
></span><span lang=3D"en-ca"></span></p>

<p dir=3D"LTR"><span lang=3D"en-ca"><font face=3D"Calibri">BTW, w</font></sp=
an><span lang=3D"en-ca"></span><span lang=3D"en-ca"></span><span lang=3D"en-=
ca"><font face=3D"Calibri">hen I</font></span><span lang=3D"en-ca"></span><s=
pan lang=3D"en-ca"></span><span lang=3D"en-ca"> <font face=3D"Calibri">switc=
h</font></span><span lang=3D"en-ca"></span><span lang=3D"en-ca"></span><span=
 lang=3D"en-ca"><font face=3D"Calibri">ed</font></span><span lang=3D"en-ca">=
</span><span lang=3D"en-ca"></span><span lang=3D"en-ca"><font face=3D"Calibr=
i"> my generator for an alternator</font></span><span lang=3D"en-ca"></span>=
<span lang=3D"en-ca"></span><span lang=3D"en-ca"><font face=3D"Calibri"> yea=
rs ago</font></span><span lang=3D"en-ca"></span><span lang=3D"en-ca"></span>=
<span lang=3D"en-ca"><font face=3D"Calibri">,</font></span><span lang=3D"en-=
ca"></span><span lang=3D"en-ca"></span><span lang=3D"en-ca"> <font face=3D"C=
alibri">I</font></span><span lang=3D"en-ca"></span><span lang=3D"en-ca"></sp=
an><span lang=3D"en-ca"> <font face=3D"Calibri">eliminated the</font></span>=
<span lang=3D"en-ca"></span><span lang=3D"en-ca"></span><span lang=3D"en-ca"=
> <font face=3D"Calibri">control box</font></span><span lang=3D"en-ca"></spa=
n><span lang=3D"en-ca"></span><span lang=3D"en-ca"><font face=3D"Calibri"> (=
regulator)</font></span><span lang=3D"en-ca"></span><span lang=3D"en-ca"></s=
pan><span lang=3D"en-ca"><font face=3D"Calibri">.</font></span><span lang=3D=
"en-ca"></span><span lang=3D"en-ca"></span><span lang=3D"en-ca"> </span></p>=

<p dir=3D"LTR"><span lang=3D"en-ca"><font face=3D"Calibri">Thanks in advance=
.</font></span></p>

<p dir=3D"LTR"><span lang=3D"en-ca"><font face=3D"Calibri">Dave MacKay</font=
></span></p>

<p dir=3D"LTR"><span lang=3D"en-ca"><font face=3D"Calibri">TR3A s/n 68639L</=
font></span></p>

<p dir=3D"LTR"><span lang=3D"en-ca"><font face=3D"Calibri">near Toronto, Can=
ada</font></span><span lang=3D"en-ca"></span><span lang=3D"en-ca"></span><sp=
an lang=3D"en-ca"></span></p>
<br>

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---

From: "Randall" <[email-masked]>
Date: Wed, 29 May 2019 22:36:47 -0700

> I'm a bit baffled. I expected that I'd see about 12V at all 
> points. Even if the fuel gauge was bad, I would have expected 
> to see the same voltage at the battery, A2, A4, and the B 
> terminal of the gauge. As it is, I'm seeing a drop of about 
> 2V among them.
> 
> What might be causing the voltage drops that I'm seeing? 
> Could it be as simple as a broken fuel gauge? If so, how 
> could I test that?

You've got multiple bad connections, in the sense they present some
resistance.  Not at all unusual on these old cars.

The variation is most likely the sender jumping around, but could also be an
intermittent connection somewhere.

I would start walking along the circuit, going point to point along the
conductor instead of each point to ground.  Maybe start with the battery hot
post to the terminal for the brown wire at the starter solenoid.  Then that
terminal to A1 on the fuse block (which should be a direct run of fairly
heavy brown wire).  Etc, etc.  Each time you find a voltage drop,
disassemble, clean and inspect the joint.  

If the drop is happening in the wire, consider replacing the wire.

But my guess is that you have a post-60K TR3A with the Lucar connectors, and
you'll find that all the drops are happening at the Lucar connectors.  They
were never designed to last this long!  Generally though, cleaning the male
tab, smearing a little bit of your favorite preservative on it (silicone
grease or even Vaseline), and pinching the female connection a bit before
reinstalling it; will make a noticeable improvement.  If not, the next step
is to replace the female connector.  Preferably (IMO) with a quality
non-insulated terminal, both crimped and soldered to the wire, then
insulated with two pieces of heat shrink tubing.  I put a short slide show
up at https://imgur.com/a/yETAubD

-- Randall

---

From: Dave Connitt <[email-masked]>
Date: Thu, 30 May 2019 03:22:21 -0400

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Hi Dave,
Doesn=E2=80=99t the TR3 have a voltage regulator for the fuel and temperatur=
e gauges like the TR4 and TR4A?=20
Dave Connitt=20

Sent from my iPhone

> On May 30, 2019, at 12:10 AM, [email-masked] <[email-masked]> wrote:
>=20
> Barney at Mgaguru.com is a good guy that knows his stuff.   Ohms should ro=
ughly go from 10-90(Barney says 0-70) with the clothes hanger and all wires d=
isconnected. =20
>=20
> Check all your related connections, the sender and the gauge need to be gr=
ounded. =20
>=20
> I would expect 12v at the hot post of the gauge.  If your not getting it t=
ry a direct jumper and test the system.   New gauges are NLA but you can eit=
her find them on eBay or other parts sites, or send your gauge AND sender to=
 one of the several reputable instrument rebuilders.=20
>=20
>=20
>=20
>=20
>=20
> I=E2=80=99ve been troubleshooting the fuel gauge on my TR3A because it has=
 not been providing an accurate indication (or even a reasonable approximati=
on) of the fuel level in my tank.
>=20
> I referred to a number of documents and old posts about how to troubleshoo=
t and calibrate the fuel gauge and sending unit (e.g., https://www.triumphex=
p.com/forum/tr2-and-tr3-forum.6/faulty-fuel-gauge-57-tr-3.1244960/ and http:=
//mgaguru.com/mgtech/electric/fg_01.htm).
>=20
> I started by looping a clothes hanger around the float in the tank and rea=
ding how many ohms I saw at different levels. What I found was that the read=
ing fluctuated --- it didn=E2=80=99t stay the same even when I held the floa=
t at one level. I then checked to ensure that the grounds were good (they we=
re). Before concluding that the sending unit was flakey, I thought I=E2=80=99=
d better ensure that I was getting good power to the unit.
>=20
>=20
>=20
> -       I read 7.65V between the T terminal of the fuel gauge (which conne=
cts to the fuel tank sending unit) and ground. However, this reading was err=
atic; the value would change to, say 4V.
>=20
>=20
>=20
>=20
>=20
> I=E2=80=99m a bit baffled. I expected that I=E2=80=99d see about 12V at al=
l points. Even if the fuel gauge was bad, I would have expected to see the s=
ame voltage at the battery, A2, A4, and the B terminal of the gauge. As it i=
s, I=E2=80=99m seeing a drop of about 2V among them.
>=20
> What might be causing the voltage drops that I=E2=80=99m seeing? Could it b=
e as simple as a broken fuel gauge? If so, how could I test that?
>=20
>=20
> BTW, when I switched my generator for an alternator years ago, I eliminate=
d the control box (regulator).
>=20
>=20
>=20
>=20
>=20
>=20
>=20
> Donate: http://www.team.net/donate.html
> Archive: http://www.team.net/pipermail/triumphs  http://www.team.net/archi=
ve
>=20
> Unsubscribe/Manage: http://autox.team.net/mailman/options/triumphs/wbeech@=
flash.net
>=20
> Donate: http://www.team.net/donate.html
> Archive: http://www.team.net/pipermail/triumphs  http://www.team.net/archi=
ve
>=20
> Unsubscribe/Manage: http://autox.team.net/mailman/options/triumphs/dconnit=
[email-masked]

--Apple-Mail-DFE2BA55-0B9C-496D-BD8F-B013BE12327F
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Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable

<html><head><meta http-equiv=3D"content-type" content=3D"text/html; charset=3D=
utf-8"></head><body dir=3D"auto">Hi Dave,<div>Doesn=E2=80=99t the TR3 have a=
 voltage regulator for the fuel and temperature gauges like the TR4 and TR4A=
?&nbsp;</div><div>Dave Connitt&nbsp;<br><br><div id=3D"AppleMailSignature" d=
ir=3D"ltr">Sent from my iPhone</div><div dir=3D"ltr"><br>On May 30, 2019, at=
 12:10 AM, <a href=3D"mailto:[email-masked]">[email-masked]</a> &lt;<a h=
ref=3D"mailto:[email-masked]">[email-masked]</a>&gt; wrote:<br><br></div=
><blockquote type=3D"cite"><div dir=3D"ltr"><meta http-equiv=3D"content-type=
" content=3D"text/html; charset=3Dutf-8">Barney at <a href=3D"http://Mgaguru=
.com">Mgaguru.com</a> is a good guy that knows his stuff. &nbsp; Ohms should=
 roughly go from 10-90(Barney says 0-70) with the clothes hanger and all wir=
es disconnected. &nbsp;<div><br></div><div>Check all your related connection=
s, the sender and the gauge need to be grounded. &nbsp;<br><div><br></div><d=
iv>I would expect 12v at the hot post of the gauge. &nbsp;If your not gettin=
g it try a direct jumper and test the system. &nbsp; New gauges are NLA but y=
ou can either find them on eBay or other parts sites, or send your gauge AND=
 sender to one of the several reputable instrument rebuilders.&nbsp;</div><d=
iv><br></div><div>Bill B</div><div>TS30800L<br><br><div id=3D"AppleMailSigna=
ture" dir=3D"ltr">Sent from my DynaTAC 8000X</div><div dir=3D"ltr"><br>On Ma=
y 29, 2019, at 10:29 PM, Dave MacKay &lt;<a href=3D"mailto:[email-masked]"=
>[email-masked]</a>&gt; wrote:<br><br></div><div dir=3D"ltr">

"en-ca"></span></p>

hs/[email-masked]">http://autox.team.net/mailman/options/triumphs/wbeech@f=
lash.net</a></span><br></div></div></div></div></blockquote><blockquote type=
=3D"cite"><div dir=3D"ltr"><span>** <a href=3D"mailto:[email-masked]=
t">[email-masked]</a> **</span><br><span></span><br><span>Donate: <=
a href=3D"http://www.team.net/donate.html">http://www.team.net/donate.html</=
a></span><br><span>Archive: <a href=3D"http://www.team.net/pipermail/triumph=
s">http://www.team.net/pipermail/triumphs</a> &nbsp;<a href=3D"http://www.te=
am.net/archive">http://www.team.net/archive</a></span><br><span></span><br><=
span>Unsubscribe/Manage: <a href=3D"http://autox.team.net/mailman/options/tr=
iumphs/[email-masked]">http://autox.team.net/mailman/options/triumphs/dco=
[email-masked]</a></span><br></div></blockquote></div></body></html>=

--Apple-Mail-DFE2BA55-0B9C-496D-BD8F-B013BE12327F--

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---

From: Dave MacKay <[email-masked]>
Date: Thu, 30 May 2019 03:41:11 -0400

--===============2473912086810416564==

--000000000000c78e64058a1605af
Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable

Troubleshooting TR3A fuel gauge

>Doesn=E2=80=99t the TR3 have a voltage regulator for the fuel and temperat=
ure
gauges like the TR4 and TR4A?

>Dave Connitt

The TR3A came with a generators that required a control box (voltage
regulator). The regulator can be eliminated if the car is modified to use
an alternator. I got rid of my regulator when I installed the alternator.

When present, the control box only served the ammeter directly. The
ammeter, in turn, is connected to the unswitched side of the fuse box. The
fuel gauge is connected to the switched side of the fuse box..

Thanks,

Dave MacKay

TR3A s/n 68639L

Near Toronto, Canada

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edium)"><title>Troubleshooting TR3A fuel gauge</title><style><!--
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--></style></head><body lang=3D"EN-CA" link=3D"blue" vlink=3D"purple"><div =
class=3D"WordSection1"><p class=3D"MsoNormal"><span style=3D"mso-fareast-la=
nguage:EN-US">On 30 May, </span><span lang=3D"EN-US">Dave Connitt &lt;<a hr=
ef=3D"mailto:[email-masked]">[email-masked]</a>&gt; wrote:</span></p>=
<p class=3D"MsoNormal">&gt;Hi Dave,</p><div><p class=3D"MsoNormal">&gt;Does=
n=E2=80=99t the TR3 have a voltage regulator for the fuel and temperature g=
auges like the TR4 and TR4A?=C2=A0</p></div><div><p class=3D"MsoNormal">&gt=
;Dave Connitt=C2=A0</p><div><p class=3D"MsoNormal">=C2=A0</p><p class=3D"Ms=
oNormal">The TR3A came with a generators that required a control box (volta=
ge regulator). The regulator can be eliminated if the car is modified to us=
e an alternator. I got rid of my regulator when I installed the alternator.=
</p><p class=3D"MsoNormal">=C2=A0</p><p class=3D"MsoNormal">When present, t=
he control box only served the ammeter directly. The ammeter, in turn, is c=
onnected to the unswitched side of the fuse box. The fuel gauge is connecte=
d to the switched side of the fuse box..</p><p class=3D"MsoNormal">=C2=A0</=
p><p class=3D"MsoNormal">Thanks,</p><p class=3D"MsoNormal">=C2=A0</p><p cla=
ss=3D"MsoNormal">Dave MacKay</p><p class=3D"MsoNormal">TR3A s/n 68639L</p><=
p class=3D"MsoNormal">Near Toronto, Canada</p></div></div></div></body></ht=
ml>

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---

From: Dave MacKay <[email-masked]>
Date: Thu, 30 May 2019 03:44:43 -0400

On 30 May, Randall <[email-masked]> wrote:
>> I'm a bit baffled. I expected that I'd see about 12V at all points.
>> Even if the fuel gauge was bad, I would have expected to see the same
>> voltage at the battery, A2, A4, and the B terminal of the gauge. As it
>> is, I'm seeing a drop of about 2V among them.
>>
>> Could it be as simple as a broken fuel gauge? If so, how could I test
>> that?
>
>
>The variation is most likely the sender jumping around, but could also be
an intermittent connection somewhere.
>I would start walking along the circuit, going point to point along the
conductor instead of each point to ground.  Maybe start with the battery
hot post to the terminal for the brown wire at the starter solenoid.  Then
that terminal to A1 on the fuse block >(which should be a direct run of
fairly heavy brown wire).  Etc, etc.  Each time you find a voltage drop,
disassemble, clean and inspect the joint.
>But my guess is that you have a post-60K TR3A with the Lucar connectors,
and you'll find that all the drops are happening at the Lucar connectors.
They were never designed to last this long!  Generally though, cleaning
the male tab, smearing a little bit of >your favorite preservative on it
(silicone grease or even Vaseline), and pinching the female connection a
bit before reinstalling it; will make a noticeable improvement.  If not,
the next step is to replace the female connector.  Preferably (IMO) with a
quality >non-insulated terminal, both crimped and soldered to the wire,
then insulated with two pieces of heat shrink tubing.  I put a short slide
show up at https://imgur.com/a/yETAubD
>-- Randall

Thank-you for your reply.

You are correct in that my car is post 60000 and has Lucar connectors.
I've changed a couple of the connectors in chasing down the fuel gauge
issue. I also changed the fuse box. The wire did look like the first image
in your slide show.

I'm not clear on what you mean about "going point to point along the
conductor instead of each point to ground". I can do a continuity check or
test for resistance between two points on a wire, but I can only measure
voltage at a point to ground. Sorry if I'm a bit dense in comprehending
your meaning.

Is there a point at which the voltage is too low for the fuel gauge
circuit to work? I'm more familiar with digital circuitry where there is a
clearly defined range for 1 and for 0. As long as one is inside the range
all is well.

Thanks,

Dave MacKay
TR3A s/n 68639L
Near Toronto, Canada

---

From: Dave MacKay <[email-masked]>
Date: Thu, 30 May 2019 03:49:15 -0400

--===============3478170530826498506==

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On 30 May, Bill Beech <[email-masked]> wrote:

>Dave,

>Be sure the gauge body is grounded.  Check resistance at the sender with
wires off, with wires connected you should see the gauge moving.

>Good luck,

>Bill

>Thanks Bill.

>I should've thought of connecting 12v directly to the B post of the gauge.
I'll try that to see if it makes a difference. I'll also try putting 12v to
the T post of the gauge (the side going to the sender unit) to see if I get
a steady resistance (ohms).

>I'm happy for your help.

>Thank-you,

>Dave

[email-masked]> wrote:

>Barney at http://Mgaguru.com is a good guy that knows his stuff.   Ohms
should roughly go from 10-90(Barney says 0-70) with the clothes hanger and
all wires disconnected.

>Check all your related connections, the sender and the gauge need to be
grounded

>I would expect 12v at the hot post of the gauge.  If your not getting it
try a direct jumper and test the system.   New gauges are NLA but you can
either find them on eBay or other parts sites, or send your gauge AND
sender to one of the several reputable >instrument rebuilders.

>I=E2=80=99ve been troubleshooting the fuel gauge on my TR3A because it has=
 not
been providing an accurate indication (or even a reasonable approximation)
of the fuel level in my tank.

>I referred to a number of documents and old posts about how to
troubleshoot and calibrate the fuel gauge and sending unit (e.g.,
https://www.triumphexp.com/forum/tr2-and-tr3-forum.6/faulty-fuel-gauge-57-t=
r-3.1244960/
and >http://mgaguru.com/mgtech/electric/fg_01htm).

>I started by looping a clothes hanger around the float in the tank and
reading how many ohms I saw at different levels. What I found was that the
reading fluctuated --- it didn=E2=80=99t stay the same even when I held the=
 float
at one level. I then checked to ensure >that the grounds were good (they
were). Before concluding that the sending unit was flakey, I thought I=E2=
=80=99d
better ensure that I was getting good power to the unit.

>-       I read 7.65V between the T terminal of the fuel gauge (which
connects to the fuel tank sending unit) and ground. However, this reading
was erratic; the value would change to, say 4V.

>I=E2=80=99m a bit baffled. I expected that I=E2=80=99d see about 12V at al=
l points. Even
if the fuel gauge was bad, I would have expected to see the same voltage at
the battery, A2, A4, and the B terminal of the gauge. As it is, I=E2=80=99m=
 seeing
a drop of about 2V among them.

>What might be causing the voltage drops that I=E2=80=99m seeing? Could it =
be as
simple as a broken fuel gauge? If so, how could I test that?

>BTW, when I switched my generator for an alternator years ago, I
eliminated the control box (regulator).

>near Toronto, Canada

Thanks Bill.

The gauge is grounded via the holder with the knurled nut. It reads good. I
hooked up a separate ground wire but it didn=E2=80=99t make a difference so=
 that I
felt confident the ground was good.

When you said to check resistance at the sender with wires off, did you
mean power off (e.g., battery disconnected) or to physically disconnect
both wires? I had thought that as long as the power was off I could just
hook up my multimeter and measure the resistance as I moved the float.

Dave

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--></style></head><body lang=3D"EN-CA" link=3D"blue" vlink=3D"purple"><div =
class=3D"WordSection1"><p class=3D"MsoPlainText">On 30 May, Bill Beech &lt;=
<a href=3D"mailto:[email-masked]">[email-masked]</a>&gt; wrote:</p><p c=
lass=3D"MsoPlainText">&gt;Dave,</p><p class=3D"MsoPlainText">&gt;Be sure th=
e gauge body is grounded.=C2=A0 Check resistance at the sender with wires o=
ff, with wires connected you should see the gauge moving.=C2=A0</p><p class=
=3D"MsoPlainText">&gt;Good luck,</p><p class=3D"MsoPlainText">&gt;Bill</p><=
p class=3D"MsoPlainText">&gt;=C2=A0</p><p class=3D"MsoPlainText">&gt;Sent f=
rom my DynaTAC 8000X</p><p class=3D"MsoPlainText">&gt;=C2=A0</p><p class=3D=
"MsoPlainText">&gt;On May 29, 2019, at 11:38 PM, Dave MacKay &lt;mailto:<a =
href=3D"mailto:[email-masked]">[email-masked]</a>&gt; wrote:</p><p clas=
s=3D"MsoPlainText">&gt;Thanks Bill.=C2=A0</p><p class=3D"MsoPlainText">&gt;=
=C2=A0</p><p class=3D"MsoPlainText">&gt;I should&#39;ve thought of connecti=
ng 12v directly to the B post of the gauge. I&#39;ll try that to see if it =
makes a difference. I&#39;ll also try putting 12v to the T post of the gaug=
e (the side going to the sender unit) to see if I get a steady resistance (=
ohms).</p><p class=3D"MsoPlainText">&gt;=C2=A0</p><p class=3D"MsoPlainText"=
>&gt;I&#39;m happy for your help.</p><p class=3D"MsoPlainText">&gt;=C2=A0</=
p><p class=3D"MsoPlainText">&gt;Thank-you,</p><p class=3D"MsoPlainText">&gt=
;=C2=A0</p><p class=3D"MsoPlainText">&gt;Dave=C2=A0</p><p class=3D"MsoPlain=
Text">&gt;=C2=A0</p><p class=3D"MsoPlainText">&gt;On Thu, May 30, 2019, 12:=
10 AM mailto:<a href=3D"mailto:[email-masked]">[email-masked]</a>, &lt;=
mailto:<a href=3D"mailto:[email-masked]">[email-masked]</a>&gt; wrote:<=
/p><p class=3D"MsoPlainText">&gt;Barney at <a href=3D"http://Mgaguru.com">h=
ttp://Mgaguru.com</a> is a good guy that knows his stuff. =C2=A0 Ohms shoul=
d roughly go from 10-90(Barney says 0-70) with the clothes hanger and all w=
ires disconnected. =C2=A0</p><p class=3D"MsoPlainText">&gt;=C2=A0</p><p cla=
ss=3D"MsoPlainText">&gt;Check all your related connections, the sender and =
the gauge need to be grounded =C2=A0</p><p class=3D"MsoPlainText">&gt;=C2=
=A0</p><p class=3D"MsoPlainText">&gt;I would expect 12v at the hot post of =
the gauge.=C2=A0 If your not getting it try a direct jumper and test the sy=
stem. =C2=A0 New gauges are NLA but you can either find them on eBay or oth=
er parts sites, or send your gauge AND sender to one of the several reputab=
le &gt;instrument rebuilders.=C2=A0</p><p class=3D"MsoPlainText">&gt;=C2=A0=
</p><p class=3D"MsoPlainText">&gt;Bill B</p><p class=3D"MsoPlainText">&gt;T=
S30800L</p><p class=3D"MsoPlainText">&gt;Sent from my DynaTAC 8000X</p><p c=
lass=3D"MsoPlainText">&gt;=C2=A0</p><p class=3D"MsoPlainText">&gt;On May 29=
, 2019, at 10:29 PM, Dave MacKay &lt;mailto:<a href=3D"mailto:dave@mdmackay=
.ca">[email-masked]</a>&gt; wrote:</p><p class=3D"MsoPlainText">&gt;Hello=
:</p><p class=3D"MsoPlainText">&gt;I=E2=80=99ve been troubleshooting the fu=
el gauge on my TR3A because it has not been providing an accurate indicatio=
n (or even a reasonable approximation) of the fuel level in my tank. </p><p=
 class=3D"MsoPlainText">&gt;I referred to a number of documents and old pos=
ts about how to troubleshoot and calibrate the fuel gauge and sending unit =
(e.g., <a href=3D"https://www.triumphexp.com/forum/tr2-and-tr3-forum.6/faul=
ty-fuel-gauge-57-tr-3.1244960/">https://www.triumphexp.com/forum/tr2-and-tr=
3-forum.6/faulty-fuel-gauge-57-tr-3.1244960/</a> and &gt;<a href=3D"http://=
mgaguru.com/mgtech/electric/fg_01htm">http://mgaguru.com/mgtech/electric/fg=
_01htm</a>).</p><p class=3D"MsoPlainText">&gt;I started by looping a clothe=
s hanger around the float in the tank and reading how many ohms I saw at di=
fferent levels. What I found was that the reading fluctuated --- it didn=E2=
=80=99t stay the same even when I held the float at one level. I then check=
ed to ensure &gt;that the grounds were good (they were). Before concluding =
that the sending unit was flakey, I thought I=E2=80=99d better ensure that =
I was getting good power to the unit. </p><p class=3D"MsoPlainText">&gt;Tha=
t=E2=80=99s where things got weird.</p><p class=3D"MsoPlainText">&gt;-=C2=
=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0 I read 7.6V between the sending unit and =
ground. </p><p class=3D"MsoPlainText">&gt;-=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=
=C2=A0 I read 7.65V between the T terminal of the fuel gauge (which connect=
s to the fuel tank sending unit) and ground. However, this reading was erra=
tic; the value would change to, say 4V.</p><p class=3D"MsoPlainText">&gt;-=
=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0 I read 10.6V at the B terminal of the =
fuel gauge</p><p class=3D"MsoPlainText">&gt;-=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=
=C2=A0 I read 10.9V at the A4 terminal of the fuse box.</p><p class=3D"MsoP=
lainText">&gt;-=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0 I read 11.9V at the A2 =
terminal of the fuse box.</p><p class=3D"MsoPlainText">&gt;-=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=
=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0 I read 12.5v between the terminals of the battery.</p=
><p class=3D"MsoPlainText">&gt;I=E2=80=99m a bit baffled. I expected that I=
=E2=80=99d see about 12V at all points. Even if the fuel gauge was bad, I w=
ould have expected to see the same voltage at the battery, A2, A4, and the =
B terminal of the gauge. As it is, I=E2=80=99m seeing a drop of about 2V am=
ong them.</p><p class=3D"MsoPlainText">&gt;What might be causing the voltag=
e drops that I=E2=80=99m seeing? Could it be as simple as a broken fuel gau=
ge? If so, how could I test that?</p><p class=3D"MsoPlainText">&gt;Moss lis=
ts the fuel gauge as NLA. Does anyone know of another source?</p><p class=
=3D"MsoPlainText">&gt;BTW, when I switched my generator for an alternator y=
ears ago, I eliminated the control box (regulator). </p><p class=3D"MsoPlai=
nText">&gt;Thanks in advance.</p><p class=3D"MsoPlainText">&gt;Dave MacKay<=
/p><p class=3D"MsoPlainText">&gt;TR3A s/n 68639L</p><p class=3D"MsoPlainTex=
t">&gt;near Toronto, Canada</p><p class=3D"MsoPlainText">=C2=A0</p><p class=
=3D"MsoPlainText">Thanks Bill.</p><p class=3D"MsoPlainText">=C2=A0</p><p cl=
ass=3D"MsoPlainText">The gauge is grounded via the holder with the knurled =
nut. It reads good. I hooked up a separate ground wire but it didn=E2=80=99=
t make a difference so that I felt confident the ground was good.</p><p cla=
ss=3D"MsoPlainText">=C2=A0</p><p class=3D"MsoPlainText">When you said to ch=
eck resistance at the sender with wires off, did you mean power off (e.g., =
battery disconnected) or to physically disconnect both wires? I had thought=
 that as long as the power was off I could just hook up my multimeter and m=
easure the resistance as I moved the float.</p><p class=3D"MsoPlainText">=
=C2=A0</p><p class=3D"MsoPlainText">Dave</p><p class=3D"MsoPlainText">=C2=
=A0</p><p class=3D"MsoPlainText">=C2=A0</p></div></body></html>

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---

From: Jeff Scarbrough <[email-masked]>
Date: Thu, 30 May 2019 08:59:04 -0400

On Thu, May 30, 2019 at 3:41 AM Dave MacKay <[email-masked]> wrote:
>
> >Doesn’t the TR3 have a voltage regulator for the fuel and temperature gauges like the TR4 and TR4A?
>
> The TR3A came with a generators that required a control box (voltage regulator). The regulator can be eliminated if the car is modified to use an alternator. I got rid of my regulator when I installed the alternator.

I believe he was talking about the regulator that provides 10V to the
fuel gauge and the temperature gauge.  It's on all the newer cars; I
don't know about TR3 though.  Looking at
http://www.advanceautowire.com/tr24a.pdf , it appears that regulator
came in with the TR4.
** [email-masked] **

Unsubscribe/Manage: http://autox.team.net/mailman/options/triumphs/[email-masked]

---

From: "Randall" <[email-masked]>
Date: Thu, 30 May 2019 08:49:52 -0700

> I'm not clear on what you mean about "going point to point 
> along the conductor instead of each point to ground".

If the voltage from point A to ground is 10 volts, and the voltage from
point B to ground is 12 volts; then if you connect your voltmeter from point
A to point B, you should read 2 volts.  Makes it easier to see small
differences; as well as removing any uncertainty about the battery voltage
(or voltage drop at some other point) changing between measurements.

I'm sure there is some minimum voltage for the fuel gauge, but I don't know
what it is.  I'm guessing it's well below 10 volts, though.

The thing is, though, each one of those bad connections is going to generate
heat; which accelerates the degradation of the connection.  

The Pertronix also doesn't like low voltage, it won't work at all if it
doesn't get at least 8 volts or so.  Since the starter motor will still turn
the engine (slowly) on less than 8 volts, this leads to an interesting
situation where the Pertronix flat doesn't work, only when you are trying to
start the engine.  That's the main reason I threw mine back in the box.

-- Randall 
56 TR3 TS13571L once and future daily driver
71 Stag LE1473 - awaiting engine rebuild
71-2-3 Stag - awaiting gearbox rebuild

---

From: Chris Simo <[email-masked]>
Date: Thu, 30 May 2019 21:04:08 -0400

--===============7025031718562190876==

--0000000000004da519058a249856

I still use a stick... One day I'll get around to sorting it out. :)

--0000000000004da519058a249856

<div dir="auto">I still use a stick... One day I&#39;ll get around to sorting it out. :)</div>

--0000000000004da519058a249856--

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---

From: DAVID MASSEY <[email-masked]>
Date: Fri, 31 May 2019 01:43:18 +0000 (UTC)

--===============1669571283813539361==
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 And a gallon can in the trunk?
 
Dave 

-----Original Message-----
From: Chris Simo <[email-masked]>
To: list Triumph <[email-masked]>
Sent: Thu, May 30, 2019 8:04 pm
Subject: Re: [TR] Troubleshooting TR3A fuel gauge

I still use a stick... One day I'll get around to sorting it out. :)** [email-masked] **

------=_Part_7017157_1399188593.1559266998123
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<div style="color:black;font: 12pt Arial, Helvetica, sans-serif;">
<div> <font size="3">And a gallon can in the trunk?</font><br>
</div>

<div> <br>
</div>

<div style="clear:both"><font size="4">Dave </font><br>
<br>
</div>

<div> <br>
</div>

<div> <br>
</div>

<div style="font-family:arial,helvetica;font-size:10pt;color:black">-----Original Message-----<br>
From: Chris Simo &lt;[email-masked]&gt;<br>
To: list Triumph &lt;[email-masked]&gt;<br>
Sent: Thu, May 30, 2019 8:04 pm<br>
Subject: Re: [TR] Troubleshooting TR3A fuel gauge<br>
<br>

<div id="yiv4687738351">
<div>
<div>I still use a stick... One day I'll get around to sorting it out. :)</div>

</div>
</div>

<div class="yqt5465118429" id="yqtfd38425">** <a shape="rect" ymailto="mailto:[email-masked]" rel="noopener noreferrer" href="mailto:[email-masked]">[email-masked]</a> **<br clear="none"><br clear="none">Donate: <a shape="rect" target="_blank" rel="noopener noreferrer" href="http://www.team.net/donate.html">http://www.team.net/donate.html</a><br clear="none">Archive: <a shape="rect" target="_blank" rel="noopener noreferrer" href="http://www.team.net/pipermail/triumphs">http://www.team.net/pipermail/triumphs </a> <a shape="rect" target="_blank" rel="noopener noreferrer" href="http://www.team.net/archive">http://www.team.net/archive</a><br clear="none"><br clear="none">Unsubscribe/Manage: <a shape="rect" target="_blank" rel="noopener noreferrer" href="http://autox.team.net/mailman/options/triumphs/[email-masked]">http://autox.team.net/mailman/options/triumphs/[email-masked]</a><br clear="none"></div>
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---

From: "Kinderlehrer" <[email-masked]>
Date: Fri, 31 May 2019 10:58:47 -0700

Anyone have any experience with the Nexen tire (SB802)? There are very few
tire stores around here that can still mount a tire on a wire wheel and the
only tire they seem to be able to get in a 165/80-15 is the Nexen. If I go
with a wider tire, will I have a problem with rubbing and will the steering
be even harder? 

Thanks,
Bob

---

From: "CFM-TR" <[email-masked]>
Date: Fri, 31 May 2019 14:35:24 -0400

Have the Nexen's; replaced 10 year old Dunlops (because of sidewall
cracking) about 3 years ago.  Very similar tread design.  Don't run many
miles so can't tell you about longevity.  Minimal lead to balance tires.  In
fact, one didn't require any.  I don't know if I believe it but the old guy
that did the balancing said that many times it is the wheel (either wire or
steel or even mag repro's) that cause the balancing problems.  Many times
you can move the tire on the wheel 1/8 or 1/4 turn at a time and eliminate
the issue.

Carl 
1960 Triumph TR3
TS81802LO
Tampa, FL

-----Original Message-----
From: Triumphs [mailto:[email-masked]] On Behalf Of
Kinderlehrer
Sent: Friday, May 31, 2019 1:59 PM
To: [email-masked]
Subject: [TR] Nexen tires for a TR3A

Thanks,
Bob

http://autox.team.net/mailman/options/triumphs/[email-masked]

---

From: "[email-masked]" <[email-masked]>
Date: Fri, 31 May 2019 13:56:51 -0500

I have Vredesteins on the TR3, excellent handling.  Also, Firestone has this size too, Coker may have this in their Michelin X tire, I know they have 155 but not sure about 165.  

As for rubbing with wider tires, someone else needs to comment, I have run 165 width on 6” minilites with great results, more rubber on the ground and no rubbing.  

Just my thoughts,
Bill B
TS30800L

On May 31, 2019, at 12:58 PM, Kinderlehrer <[email-masked]> wrote:

Thanks,
Bob

Unsubscribe/Manage: http://autox.team.net/mailman/options/triumphs/[email-masked]

---

From: "Reihing, Randall S." <[email-masked]>
Date: Fri, 31 May 2019 19:46:57 +0000

--===============7518924611906082970==
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--_000_DM6PR01MB500347EA365952D376E2787EEC190DM6PR01MB5003prod_
Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable

When recently buying a set of four Michelin Defender's for my truck, owned =
since new and never wrecked or damaged, etc., there was a balancing issue w=
ith the new Michelin Defender's. The usual weights were not achieving the v=
ibration free use the prior, worn down but smooth driving BFG tires had dem=
onstrated.

Tireman of Maumee, Ohio (zero affiliation on my part except as a customer),=
 where I buy tires, the salesman said the wheel may be the culprit for my v=
ibration complaint on the brand new Michelin Defender's that had just been =
installed and had been balanced but were vibrating enough at normal express=
way speed limits of 55-65 mph, I could feel it in the steering wheel and it=
 was really annoying.

I returned in less than 8 miles. The Tireman salesman said Tireman had a ba=
lancing option referred to as "Force Balancing" wherein they don't use the =
usual weight's. For "Force Balancing" they use a different machine and move=
 the tire around the rim a very small amount several times until they find =
the perfect balancing location of tire to wheel. This worked for me and an =
hour later the truck is now as vibration free and smooth driving as it was =
when new.

Randall Reihing

1959 TR3A

________________________________
From: Triumphs <[email-masked]> on behalf of Wbeech@flash.=
net <[email-masked]>
Sent: Friday, May 31, 2019 2:56:51 PM
To: Kinderlehrer
Cc: [email-masked]
Subject: Re: [TR] Nexen tires for a TR3A

I have Vredesteins on the TR3, excellent handling.  Also, Firestone has thi=
s size too, Coker may have this in their Michelin X tire, I know they have =
155 but not sure about 165.

As for rubbing with wider tires, someone else needs to comment, I have run =
165 width on 6=94 minilites with great results, more rubber on the ground a=
nd no rubbing.

Just my thoughts,
Bill B
TS30800L

On May 31, 2019, at 12:58 PM, Kinderlehrer <[email-masked]> wrote=
:

Thanks,
Bob

donate.html&d=3DDwIGaQ&c=3DheEcP2AsrLOv4XP8e7I9NA&r=3DM9Vli1OgG7_7RAFFVpeXH=
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<html>
<head>
<meta http-equiv=3D"Content-Type" content=3D"text/html; charset=3DWindows-1=
252">
<style type=3D"text/css" style=3D"display:none;"><!-- P {margin-top:0;margi=
n-bottom:0;} --></style>
</head>
<body dir=3D"ltr">
<div id=3D"divtagdefaultwrapper" style=3D"font-size:12pt;color:#000000;font=
-family:Calibri,Helvetica,sans-serif;" dir=3D"ltr">
<p style=3D"margin-top:0;margin-bottom:0"><br>
</p>
<p style=3D"margin-top:0;margin-bottom:0">When recently&nbsp;buying a set o=
f four Michelin Defender's for my truck, owned since new and never wrecked =
or damaged,&nbsp;etc., there was a balancing issue with the new Michelin De=
fender's.&nbsp;The usual weights were not achieving
 the vibration free use the prior,&nbsp;worn down but&nbsp;smooth driving&n=
bsp;BFG&nbsp;tires had demonstrated.&nbsp;</p>
<p style=3D"margin-top:0;margin-bottom:0"><br>
</p>
<p style=3D"margin-top:0;margin-bottom:0">Tireman of Maumee, Ohio&nbsp;(zer=
o affiliation on my part except as a customer), w<span style=3D"font-size: =
12pt;">here I buy tires,</span><span style=3D"font-size: 12pt;">&nbsp;</spa=
n><span style=3D"font-size: 12pt;">the salesman&nbsp;said
</span><span style=3D"font-size: 12pt;">the wheel may be the&nbsp;</span><s=
pan style=3D"font-size: 12pt;">culprit for my vibration complaint on the br=
and new Michelin Defender's that had just been installed and had been balan=
ced but were vibrating enough at normal&nbsp;expressway
 speed limits of 55-65 mph,&nbsp;I&nbsp;could feel&nbsp;it&nbsp;in the stee=
ring wheel and it was really annoying.&nbsp;</span></p>
<p style=3D"margin-top:0;margin-bottom:0"><br>
</p>
<p style=3D"margin-top:0;margin-bottom:0">I returned in less than 8 miles. =
The&nbsp;Tireman salesman said Tireman&nbsp;had&nbsp;a balancing option ref=
erred to as &quot;Force Balancing&quot; wherein they don't use the usual&nb=
sp;weight's. For &quot;Force Balancing&quot;&nbsp;they use a different mach=
ine
 and&nbsp;move the tire around the rim a very small amount several times un=
til they find the perfect balancing location of tire to wheel. This worked =
for me and an hour later the truck&nbsp;is now as vibration free and&nbsp;s=
mooth driving as it was when new.&nbsp;</p>
<p style=3D"margin-top:0;margin-bottom:0"><br>
</p>
<p style=3D"margin-top:0;margin-bottom:0">Randall Reihing</p>
<p style=3D"margin-top:0;margin-bottom:0">1959 TR3A</p>
<p style=3D"margin-top:0;margin-bottom:0"><br>
</p>
</div>
<hr style=3D"display:inline-block;width:98%" tabindex=3D"-1">
<div id=3D"divRplyFwdMsg" dir=3D"ltr"><font face=3D"Calibri, sans-serif" st=
yle=3D"font-size:11pt" color=3D"#000000"><b>From:</b> Triumphs &lt;triumphs=
[email-masked]&gt; on behalf of [email-masked] &lt;wbeech@flash.=
net&gt;<br>
<b>Sent:</b> Friday, May 31, 2019 2:56:51 PM<br>
<b>To:</b> Kinderlehrer<br>
<b>Cc:</b> [email-masked]<br>
<b>Subject:</b> Re: [TR] Nexen tires for a TR3A</font>
<div>&nbsp;</div>
</div>
<div class=3D"BodyFragment"><font size=3D"2"><span style=3D"font-size:11pt;=
">
<div class=3D"PlainText">I have Vredesteins on the TR3, excellent handling.=
&nbsp; Also, Firestone has this size too, Coker may have this in their Mich=
elin X tire, I know they have 155 but not sure about 165.&nbsp;
<br>
<br>
As for rubbing with wider tires, someone else needs to comment, I have run =
165 width on 6=94 minilites with great results, more rubber on the ground a=
nd no rubbing.&nbsp;
<br>
<br>
Just my thoughts,<br>
Bill B<br>
TS30800L<br>
<br>
Sent from my DynaTAC 8000X<br>
<br>
On May 31, 2019, at 12:58 PM, Kinderlehrer &lt;[email-masked]&gt;=
 wrote:<br>
<br>
Anyone have any experience with the Nexen tire (SB802)? There are very few<=
br>
tire stores around here that can still mount a tire on a wire wheel and the=
<br>
only tire they seem to be able to get in a 165/80-15 is the Nexen. If I go<=
br>
with a wider tire, will I have a problem with rubbing and will the steering=
<br>
be even harder? <br>
<br>
Thanks,<br>
Bob<br>
<br>
** [email-masked] **<br>
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---

From: TERRY SMITH <[email-masked]>
Date: Fri, 31 May 2019 16:15:49 -0400 (EDT)

--===============7481846614465837811==
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Randall was right.  I did have multiple problems.  Closer inspection of the ground in the distributor plate showed it was connected and tested fine with an ohms check, but in truth was hanging on by just a few threads.  Fabricated another and now spark is exceptional out of the wire.  Don't ask me how I know that but if you'd like a recommendation of the type screwdriver to test the wire to ground, I can tell you which kind NOT to use.  

So...the 3 has spark to the plugs and has fuel to the carbs.  Engine cranks but won't catch.  Rechecked float specs and they're good.  Reset richness to 12 flat start-up specs.  So good.  Ran a timing light to see if it had jumped time, tested good.  

I'm now suspecting a severe enough vacuum leak to keep the gas from being sucked into the chambers.  Checked valve lash, no issues.  Compression test shows 90 plus in all cylinders.  I can't see the intake manifold gasket on the bottom, but that's where it would be...if it is.  

Question:  with the carbs off and using the solenoid to crank the engine, how much should one feel suction against ones hand at the ports of the intake manifold?  I'm barely feeling any if at all.  Certainly not enough to draw gas in.  

Thanks, everyone, for your patience!

Terry Smith, '59 TR3A  TS 58667

New Hampshire
------=_Part_393363_1227981733.1559333749967
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<!DOCTYPE html>
<html><head>
    <meta charset=3D"UTF-8">
</head><body><p style=3D"font-size: 12pt; font-family: helvetica, arial, sa=
ns-serif; color: rgb(51, 51, 51);">Randall was right.&#160; I did have mult=
iple problems.&#160; Closer inspection of the ground in the distributor pla=
te showed it was connected and tested fine with an ohms check, but in truth=
 was hanging on by just a few threads.&#160; Fabricated another and now spa=
rk is exceptional out of the wire.&#160; Don&#39;t ask me how I know that b=
ut if you&#39;d like a recommendation of the type screwdriver to test the w=
ire to ground, I can tell you which kind NOT to use.&#160;&#160;</p><p styl=
e=3D"font-size: 12pt; font-family: helvetica, arial, sans-serif; color: rgb=
(51, 51, 51);"><br></p><p style=3D"font-size: 12pt; font-family: helvetica,=
 arial, sans-serif; color: rgb(51, 51, 51);">So...the 3 has spark to the pl=
ugs and has fuel to the carbs.&#160; Engine cranks but won&#39;t catch.&#16=
0; Rechecked float specs and they&#39;re good.&#160; Reset richness to 12 f=
lat start-up specs.&#160; So good.&#160; Ran a timing light to see if it ha=
d jumped time, tested good.&#160;&#160;</p><p style=3D"font-size: 12pt; fon=
t-family: helvetica, arial, sans-serif; color: rgb(51, 51, 51);"><br></p><p=
 style=3D"font-size: 12pt; font-family: helvetica, arial, sans-serif; color=
: rgb(51, 51, 51);">I&#39;m now suspecting a severe enough vacuum leak to k=
eep the gas from being sucked into the chambers.&#160; Checked valve lash, =
no issues.&#160; Compression test shows 90 plus in all cylinders.&#160; I c=
an&#39;t see the intake manifold gasket on the bottom, but that&#39;s where=
 it would be...if it is.&#160;&#160;</p><p style=3D"font-size: 12pt; font-f=
amily: helvetica, arial, sans-serif; color: rgb(51, 51, 51);"><br></p><p st=
yle=3D"font-size: 12pt; font-family: helvetica, arial, sans-serif; color: r=
gb(51, 51, 51);">Question:&#160; with the carbs off and using the solenoid =
to crank the engine, how much should one feel suction against ones hand at =
the ports of the intake manifold?&#160; I&#39;m barely feeling any if at al=
l.&#160; Certainly not enough to draw gas in.&#160;&#160;</p><p style=3D"fo=
nt-size: 12pt; font-family: helvetica, arial, sans-serif; color: rgb(51, 51=
, 51);"><br></p><p style=3D"font-size: 12pt; font-family: helvetica, arial,=
 sans-serif; color: rgb(51, 51, 51);">Thanks, everyone, for your patience!<=
/p><p style=3D"font-size: 12pt; font-family: helvetica, arial, sans-serif; =
color: rgb(51, 51, 51);"><br></p><p style=3D"font-size: 12pt; font-family: =
helvetica, arial, sans-serif; color: rgb(51, 51, 51);">Terry Smith, &#39;59=
 TR3A&#160; TS 58667</p><p style=3D"font-size: 12pt; font-family: helvetica=
, arial, sans-serif; color: rgb(51, 51, 51);">New Hampshire</p><p style=3D"=
font-size: 12pt; font-family: helvetica,arial,sans-serif; color: #333333;" =
class=3D"default-style"></p></body></html>
=20
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---

From: "Jerry Van Vlack" <[email-masked]>
Date: Fri, 31 May 2019 16:20:37 -0400

This is a multi-part message in MIME format.

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Moral of the story is don=92t buy Michelin tires. Actually just my =
personal opinion, I=92ve had them on new cars and could not wait until I =
could replace them. I think they are overrated.=20

From: Reihing, Randall S.=20
Sent: Friday, May 31, 2019 3:46 PM
To: [email-masked] ; Kinderlehrer=20
Cc: [email-masked]=20
Subject: Re: [TR] Nexen tires for a TR3A

When recently buying a set of four Michelin Defender's for my truck, =
owned since new and never wrecked or damaged, etc., there was a =
balancing issue with the new Michelin Defender's. The usual weights were =
not achieving the vibration free use the prior, worn down but smooth =
driving BFG tires had demonstrated.=20

Tireman of Maumee, Ohio (zero affiliation on my part except as a =
customer), where I buy tires, the salesman said the wheel may be the =
culprit for my vibration complaint on the brand new Michelin Defender's =
that had just been installed and had been balanced but were vibrating =
enough at normal expressway speed limits of 55-65 mph, I could feel it =
in the steering wheel and it was really annoying.=20

I returned in less than 8 miles. The Tireman salesman said Tireman had a =
balancing option referred to as "Force Balancing" wherein they don't use =
the usual weight's. For "Force Balancing" they use a different machine =
and move the tire around the rim a very small amount several times until =
they find the perfect balancing location of tire to wheel. This worked =
for me and an hour later the truck is now as vibration free and smooth =
driving as it was when new.=20

Randall Reihing

1959 TR3A

-------------------------------------------------------------------------=
-------

From: Triumphs <[email-masked]> on behalf of =
[email-masked] <[email-masked]>
Sent: Friday, May 31, 2019 2:56:51 PM
To: Kinderlehrer
Cc: [email-masked]
Subject: Re: [TR] Nexen tires for a TR3A=20

I have Vredesteins on the TR3, excellent handling.  Also, Firestone has =
this size too, Coker may have this in their Michelin X tire, I know they =
have 155 but not sure about 165. =20

As for rubbing with wider tires, someone else needs to comment, I have =
run 165 width on 6=94 minilites with great results, more rubber on the =
ground and no rubbing. =20

Just my thoughts,
Bill B
TS30800L

On May 31, 2019, at 12:58 PM, Kinderlehrer <[email-masked]> =
wrote:

Anyone have any experience with the Nexen tire (SB802)? There are very =
few
tire stores around here that can still mount a tire on a wire wheel and =
the
only tire they seem to be able to get in a 165/80-15 is the Nexen. If I =
go
with a wider tire, will I have a problem with rubbing and will the =
steering
be even harder?=20

Thanks,
Bob

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<DIV dir=3Dltr>
<DIV style=3D"FONT-SIZE: 12pt; FONT-FAMILY: 'Calibri'; COLOR: #000000">
<DIV>Moral of the story is don=92t buy Michelin tires. Actually just my =
personal=20
opinion, I=92ve had them on new cars and could not wait until I could =
replace=20
them. I think they are overrated. </DIV>
<DIV=20
style=3D'FONT-SIZE: small; TEXT-DECORATION: none; FONT-FAMILY: =
"Calibri"; FONT-WEIGHT: normal; COLOR: #000000; FONT-STYLE: normal; =
DISPLAY: inline'>
<DIV style=3D"FONT: 10pt tahoma">
<DIV>&nbsp;</DIV>
<DIV style=3D"BACKGROUND: #f5f5f5">
<DIV style=3D"font-color: black"><B>From:</B> <A=20
title=[email-masked]>Reihing, Randall S.</A> </DIV>
<DIV><B>Sent:</B> Friday, May 31, 2019 3:46 PM</DIV>
<DIV><B>To:</B> <A title=[email-masked]>[email-masked]</A> ; <A=20
title=[email-masked]>Kinderlehrer</A> </DIV>
<DIV><B>Cc:</B> <A =
title=[email-masked]>[email-masked]</A>=20
</DIV>
<DIV><B>Subject:</B> Re: [TR] Nexen tires for a TR3A</DIV></DIV></DIV>
<DIV>&nbsp;</DIV></DIV>
<DIV=20
style=3D'FONT-SIZE: small; TEXT-DECORATION: none; FONT-FAMILY: =
"Calibri"; FONT-WEIGHT: normal; COLOR: #000000; FONT-STYLE: normal; =
DISPLAY: inline'>
<DIV id=3Ddivtagdefaultwrapper=20
style=3D"FONT-SIZE: 12pt; FONT-FAMILY: calibri,helvetica,sans-serif; =
COLOR: #000000"=20
dir=3Dltr>
<P style=3D"MARGIN-BOTTOM: 0px; MARGIN-TOP: 0px">&nbsp;</P>
<P style=3D"MARGIN-BOTTOM: 0px; MARGIN-TOP: 0px">When recently buying a =
set of=20
four Michelin Defender's for my truck, owned since new and never wrecked =
or=20
damaged, etc., there was a balancing issue with the new Michelin =
Defender's. The=20
usual weights were not achieving the vibration free use the prior, worn =
down but=20
smooth driving BFG tires had demonstrated. </P>
<P style=3D"MARGIN-BOTTOM: 0px; MARGIN-TOP: 0px">&nbsp;</P>
<P style=3D"MARGIN-BOTTOM: 0px; MARGIN-TOP: 0px">Tireman of Maumee, Ohio =
(zero=20
affiliation on my part except as a customer), w<SPAN=20
style=3D"FONT-SIZE: 12pt">here I buy tires,</SPAN><SPAN=20
style=3D"FONT-SIZE: 12pt">&nbsp;</SPAN><SPAN style=3D"FONT-SIZE: =
12pt">the salesman=20
said </SPAN><SPAN style=3D"FONT-SIZE: 12pt">the wheel may be the =
</SPAN><SPAN=20
style=3D"FONT-SIZE: 12pt">culprit for my vibration complaint on the =
brand new=20
Michelin Defender's that had just been installed and had been balanced =
but were=20
vibrating enough at normal expressway speed limits of 55-65 mph, I could =
feel it=20
in the steering wheel and it was really annoying. </SPAN></P>
<P style=3D"MARGIN-BOTTOM: 0px; MARGIN-TOP: 0px">&nbsp;</P>
<P style=3D"MARGIN-BOTTOM: 0px; MARGIN-TOP: 0px">I returned in less than =
8 miles.=20
The Tireman salesman said Tireman had a balancing option referred to as =
"Force=20
Balancing" wherein they don't use the usual weight's. For "Force =
Balancing" they=20
use a different machine and move the tire around the rim a very small =
amount=20
several times until they find the perfect balancing location of tire to =
wheel.=20
This worked for me and an hour later the truck is now as vibration free =
and=20
smooth driving as it was when new. </P>
<P style=3D"MARGIN-BOTTOM: 0px; MARGIN-TOP: 0px">&nbsp;</P>
<P style=3D"MARGIN-BOTTOM: 0px; MARGIN-TOP: 0px">Randall Reihing</P>
<P style=3D"MARGIN-BOTTOM: 0px; MARGIN-TOP: 0px">1959 TR3A</P>
<P style=3D"MARGIN-BOTTOM: 0px; MARGIN-TOP: 0px">&nbsp;</P></DIV>
<HR tabIndex=3D-1 style=3D"WIDTH: 98%; DISPLAY: inline-block">

<DIV id=3DdivRplyFwdMsg dir=3Dltr><FONT style=3D"FONT-SIZE: 11pt" =
color=3D#000000=20
face=3D"Calibri, sans-serif"><B>From:</B> Triumphs=20
&lt;[email-masked]&gt; on behalf of [email-masked]=20
&lt;[email-masked]&gt;<BR><B>Sent:</B> Friday, May 31, 2019 2:56:51=20
PM<BR><B>To:</B> Kinderlehrer<BR><B>Cc:</B>=20
[email-masked]<BR><B>Subject:</B> Re: [TR] Nexen tires for a=20
TR3A</FONT>=20
<DIV>&nbsp;</DIV></DIV>
<DIV class=3DBodyFragment><FONT size=3D2><SPAN style=3D"FONT-SIZE: =
11pt">
<DIV class=3DPlainText>I have Vredesteins on the TR3, excellent =
handling.&nbsp;=20
Also, Firestone has this size too, Coker may have this in their Michelin =
X tire,=20
I know they have 155 but not sure about 165.&nbsp; <BR><BR>As for =
rubbing with=20
wider tires, someone else needs to comment, I have run 165 width on 6=94 =
minilites=20
with great results, more rubber on the ground and no rubbing.&nbsp; =
<BR><BR>Just=20
my thoughts,<BR>Bill B<BR>TS30800L<BR><BR>Sent from my DynaTAC =
8000X<BR><BR>On=20
May 31, 2019, at 12:58 PM, Kinderlehrer &lt;[email-masked]&gt; =

wrote:<BR><BR>Anyone have any experience with the Nexen tire (SB802)? =
There are=20
very few<BR>tire stores around here that can still mount a tire on a =
wire wheel=20
and the<BR>only tire they seem to be able to get in a 165/80-15 is the =
Nexen. If=20
I go<BR>with a wider tire, will I have a problem with rubbing and will =
the=20
steering<BR>be even harder? <BR><BR>Thanks,<BR>Bob<BR><BR>**=20
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From: "Kinderlehrer" <[email-masked]>
Date: Fri, 31 May 2019 13:22:22 -0700

Thanks. I was offered other brands, like American Tire and BF Goodrich, but at more than twice the price. These are $80/tire, which is really inexpensive - if it's a decent tire. I've seen the Vredesteins on Coker for $120, but I  prefer to buy the tires from the installer.

Bob 

-----Original Message-----
From: [email-masked] [mailto:[email-masked]] 
Sent: Friday, May 31, 2019 11:57 AM
To: Kinderlehrer
Cc: [email-masked]
Subject: Re: [TR] Nexen tires for a TR3A

Just my thoughts,
Bill B
TS30800L

Anyone have any experience with the Nexen tire (SB802)? There are very few tire stores around here that can still mount a tire on a wire wheel and the only tire they seem to be able to get in a 165/80-15 is the Nexen. If I go with a wider tire, will I have a problem with rubbing and will the steering be even harder? 

Thanks,
Bob

---

From: "Kinderlehrer" <[email-masked]>
Date: Fri, 31 May 2019 13:30:15 -0700

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I think you can have those problems with any brand. I replaced the tires on
my daily driver and they couldn't get the vibration out, tried to tell me I
was the wheels and I should go back to Toyota, they had a good laugh. Made
them replace the tires, BF Goodrich if I remember correctly, and the problem
went away.  

Bob

From: Jerry Van Vlack [mailto:[email-masked]] 
Sent: Friday, May 31, 2019 1:21 PM
To: Reihing, Randall S.; [email-masked]; Kinderlehrer
Cc: [email-masked]
Subject: Re: [TR] Nexen tires for a TR3A

Moral of the story is don't buy Michelin tires. Actually just my personal
opinion, I've had them on new cars and could not wait until I could replace
them. I think they are overrated. 

From: Reihing, Randall S. 

To: [email-masked] ; Kinderlehrer 

 

When recently buying a set of four Michelin Defender's for my truck, owned
since new and never wrecked or damaged, etc., there was a balancing issue
with the new Michelin Defender's. The usual weights were not achieving the
vibration free use the prior, worn down but smooth driving BFG tires had
demonstrated. 

Tireman of Maumee, Ohio (zero affiliation on my part except as a customer),
where I buy tires, the salesman said the wheel may be the culprit for my
vibration complaint on the brand new Michelin Defender's that had just been
installed and had been balanced but were vibrating enough at normal
expressway speed limits of 55-65 mph, I could feel it in the steering wheel
and it was really annoying. 

I returned in less than 8 miles. The Tireman salesman said Tireman had a
balancing option referred to as "Force Balancing" wherein they don't use the
usual weight's. For "Force Balancing" they use a different machine and move
the tire around the rim a very small amount several times until they find
the perfect balancing location of tire to wheel. This worked for me and an
hour later the truck is now as vibration free and smooth driving as it was
when new. 

Randall Reihing

1959 TR3A

  _____  

From: Triumphs <[email-masked]> on behalf of

I have Vredesteins on the TR3, excellent handling.  Also, Firestone has this
size too, Coker may have this in their Michelin X tire, I know they have 155
but not sure about 165.  

As for rubbing with wider tires, someone else needs to comment, I have run
165 width on 6" minilites with great results, more rubber on the ground and
no rubbing.  

Just my thoughts,
Bill B
TS30800L

Thanks,
Bob

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<o:idmap v:ext=3D"edit" data=3D"1" />
</o:shapelayout></xml><![endif]--></head><body lang=3DEN-US link=3Dblue =
vlink=3Dpurple><div class=3DWordSection1><p class=3DMsoNormal><span =
style=3D'font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri","sans-serif";color:#1F497=
D'>I think you can have those problems with any brand. I replaced the =
tires on my daily driver and they couldn&#8217;t get the vibration out, =
tried to tell me I was the wheels and I should go back to Toyota, they =
had a good laugh. Made them replace the tires, BF Goodrich if I remember =
correctly, and the problem went away.&nbsp; <o:p></o:p></span></p><p =
class=3DMsoNormal><span =
style=3D'font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri","sans-serif";color:#1F497=
D'>Bob<o:p></o:p></span></p><p class=3DMsoNormal><span =
style=3D'font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri","sans-serif";color:#1F497=
D'><o:p>&nbsp;</o:p></span></p><div><div =
style=3D'border:none;border-top:solid #B5C4DF 1.0pt;padding:3.0pt 0in =
0in 0in'><p class=3DMsoNormal><b><span =
style=3D'font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Tahoma","sans-serif"'>From:</span>=
</b><span style=3D'font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Tahoma","sans-serif"'> =
Jerry Van Vlack [mailto:[email-masked]] <br><b>Sent:</b> Friday, =
May 31, 2019 1:21 PM<br><b>To:</b> Reihing, Randall S.; =
[email-masked]; Kinderlehrer<br><b>Cc:</b> =
[email-masked]<br><b>Subject:</b> Re: [TR] Nexen tires for a =
TR3A<o:p></o:p></span></p></div></div><p =
class=3DMsoNormal><o:p>&nbsp;</o:p></p><div><div><div><p =
class=3DMsoNormal><span =
style=3D'font-family:"Calibri","sans-serif";color:black'>Moral of the =
story is don&#8217;t buy Michelin tires. Actually just my personal =
opinion, I&#8217;ve had them on new cars and could not wait until I =
could replace them. I think they are overrated. =
<o:p></o:p></span></p></div><div><div><div><p class=3DMsoNormal><span =
style=3D'font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Tahoma","sans-serif";color:black'>=
&nbsp;<o:p></o:p></span></p></div><div><div><p class=3DMsoNormal =
style=3D'background:whitesmoke'><b><span =
style=3D'font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Tahoma","sans-serif";color:black'>=
From:</span></b><span =
style=3D'font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Tahoma","sans-serif";color:black'>=
 Reihing, Randall S. <o:p></o:p></span></p></div><div><p =
class=3DMsoNormal style=3D'background:whitesmoke'><b><span =
style=3D'font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Tahoma","sans-serif";color:black'>=
Sent:</span></b><span =
style=3D'font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Tahoma","sans-serif";color:black'>=
 Friday, May 31, 2019 3:46 PM<o:p></o:p></span></p></div><div><p =
class=3DMsoNormal style=3D'background:whitesmoke'><b><span =
style=3D'font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Tahoma","sans-serif";color:black'>=
To:</span></b><span =
style=3D'font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Tahoma","sans-serif";color:black'>=
 <a href=3D"mailto:[email-masked]">[email-masked]</a> ; Kinderlehrer =
<o:p></o:p></span></p></div><div><p class=3DMsoNormal =
style=3D'background:whitesmoke'><b><span =
style=3D'font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Tahoma","sans-serif";color:black'>=
Cc:</span></b><span =
style=3D'font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Tahoma","sans-serif";color:black'>=
 <a href=3D"mailto:[email-masked]">[email-masked]</a> =
<o:p></o:p></span></p></div><div><p class=3DMsoNormal =
style=3D'background:whitesmoke'><b><span =
style=3D'font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Tahoma","sans-serif";color:black'>=
Subject:</span></b><span =
style=3D'font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Tahoma","sans-serif";color:black'>=
 Re: [TR] Nexen tires for a =
TR3A<o:p></o:p></span></p></div></div></div><div><p =
class=3DMsoNormal><span =
style=3D'font-family:"Calibri","sans-serif";color:black'>&nbsp;<o:p></o:p=
></span></p></div></div><div><div id=3Ddivtagdefaultwrapper><p><span =
style=3D'font-family:"Calibri","sans-serif";color:black'>&nbsp;<o:p></o:p=
></span></p><p><span =
style=3D'font-family:"Calibri","sans-serif";color:black'>When recently =
buying a set of four Michelin Defender's for my truck, owned since new =
and never wrecked or damaged, etc., there was a balancing issue with the =
new Michelin Defender's. The usual weights were not achieving the =
vibration free use the prior, worn down but smooth driving BFG tires had =
demonstrated. <o:p></o:p></span></p><p><span =
style=3D'font-family:"Calibri","sans-serif";color:black'>&nbsp;<o:p></o:p=
></span></p><p><span =
style=3D'font-family:"Calibri","sans-serif";color:black'>Tireman of =
Maumee, Ohio (zero affiliation on my part except as a customer), where I =
buy tires,&nbsp;the salesman said the wheel may be the culprit for my =
vibration complaint on the brand new Michelin Defender's that had just =
been installed and had been balanced but were vibrating enough at normal =
expressway speed limits of 55-65 mph, I could feel it in the steering =
wheel and it was really annoying. <o:p></o:p></span></p><p><span =
style=3D'font-family:"Calibri","sans-serif";color:black'>&nbsp;<o:p></o:p=
></span></p><p><span =
style=3D'font-family:"Calibri","sans-serif";color:black'>I returned in =
less than 8 miles. The Tireman salesman said Tireman had a balancing =
option referred to as &quot;Force Balancing&quot; wherein they don't use =
the usual weight's. For &quot;Force Balancing&quot; they use a different =
machine and move the tire around the rim a very small amount several =
times until they find the perfect balancing location of tire to wheel. =
This worked for me and an hour later the truck is now as vibration free =
and smooth driving as it was when new. <o:p></o:p></span></p><p><span =
style=3D'font-family:"Calibri","sans-serif";color:black'>&nbsp;<o:p></o:p=
></span></p><p><span =
style=3D'font-family:"Calibri","sans-serif";color:black'>Randall =
Reihing<o:p></o:p></span></p><p><span =
style=3D'font-family:"Calibri","sans-serif";color:black'>1959 =
TR3A<o:p></o:p></span></p><p><span =
style=3D'font-family:"Calibri","sans-serif";color:black'>&nbsp;<o:p></o:p=
></span></p></div><div class=3DMsoNormal align=3Dcenter =
style=3D'text-align:center'><span =
style=3D'font-family:"Calibri","sans-serif";color:black'><hr size=3D3 =
width=3D"98%" align=3Dcenter></span></div><div id=3DdivRplyFwdMsg><p =
class=3DMsoNormal><b><span =
style=3D'font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri","sans-serif";color:black'=
>From:</span></b><span =
style=3D'font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri","sans-serif";color:black'=
> Triumphs &lt;<a =
href=3D"mailto:[email-masked]">[email-masked]=
am.net</a>&gt; on behalf of <a =
href=3D"mailto:[email-masked]">[email-masked]</a> &lt;<a =
href=3D"mailto:[email-masked]">[email-masked]</a>&gt;<br><b>Sent:</b>=
 Friday, May 31, 2019 2:56:51 PM<br><b>To:</b> =
Kinderlehrer<br><b>Cc:</b> <a =
href=3D"mailto:[email-masked]">[email-masked]</a><br><b=
>Subject:</b> Re: [TR] Nexen tires for a TR3A</span><span =
style=3D'font-family:"Calibri","sans-serif";color:black'> =
<o:p></o:p></span></p><div><p class=3DMsoNormal><span =
style=3D'font-family:"Calibri","sans-serif";color:black'>&nbsp;<o:p></o:p=
></span></p></div></div><div><div><p class=3DMsoNormal><span =
style=3D'font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri","sans-serif";color:black'=
>I have Vredesteins on the TR3, excellent handling.&nbsp; Also, =
Firestone has this size too, Coker may have this in their Michelin X =
tire, I know they have 155 but not sure about 165.&nbsp; <br><br>As for =
rubbing with wider tires, someone else needs to comment, I have run 165 =
width on 6&#8221; minilites with great results, more rubber on the =
ground and no rubbing.&nbsp; <br><br>Just my thoughts,<br>Bill =
B<br>TS30800L<br><br>Sent from my DynaTAC 8000X<br><br>On May 31, 2019, =
at 12:58 PM, Kinderlehrer &lt;<a =
href=3D"mailto:[email-masked]">[email-masked]</a>&gt;=
 wrote:<br><br>Anyone have any experience with the Nexen tire (SB802)? =
There are very few<br>tire stores around here that can still mount a =
tire on a wire wheel and the<br>only tire they seem to be able to get in =
a 165/80-15 is the Nexen. If I go<br>with a wider tire, will I have a =
problem with rubbing and will the steering<br>be even harder? =
<br><br>Thanks,<br>Bob<br><br>** <a =
href=3D"mailto:[email-masked]">[email-masked]</a> =
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From: "wbeech" <[email-masked]>
Date: Fri, 31 May 2019 16:36:25 -0500

This is a multipart message in MIME format.

--===============3706008229095896186==
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	charset="utf-8"
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Terry,

You should definitely feel the suck, remember the manifold is =
cross-connected so you would have to cover both openings at the same =
time.   Have you tried shooting a little starting fluid into the carbs =
to see if it will try to start that way?  I know this sounds dumb, but =
is the rotor on and seated correctly?(BTDT)

Keep chasing you will find it.

=20

All the best,

Bill

=20

From: Triumphs [mailto:[email-masked]] On Behalf Of =
TERRY SMITH
Sent: Friday, May 31, 2019 3:16 PM
To: [email-masked]
Subject: [TR] Vacuum Leak

=20

Randall was right.  I did have multiple problems.  Closer inspection of =
the ground in the distributor plate showed it was connected and tested =
fine with an ohms check, but in truth was hanging on by just a few =
threads.  Fabricated another and now spark is exceptional out of the =
wire.  Don't ask me how I know that but if you'd like a recommendation =
of the type screwdriver to test the wire to ground, I can tell you which =
kind NOT to use. =20

=20

So...the 3 has spark to the plugs and has fuel to the carbs.  Engine =
cranks but won't catch.  Rechecked float specs and they're good.  Reset =
richness to 12 flat start-up specs.  So good.  Ran a timing light to see =
if it had jumped time, tested good. =20

=20

I'm now suspecting a severe enough vacuum leak to keep the gas from =
being sucked into the chambers.  Checked valve lash, no issues.  =
Compression test shows 90 plus in all cylinders.  I can't see the intake =
manifold gasket on the bottom, but that's where it would be...if it is.  =

=20

Question:  with the carbs off and using the solenoid to crank the =
engine, how much should one feel suction against ones hand at the ports =
of the intake manifold?  I'm barely feeling any if at all.  Certainly =
not enough to draw gas in. =20

=20

=20

New Hampshire

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</o:shapelayout></xml><![endif]--></head><body lang=3DEN-US =
link=3D"#0563C1" vlink=3D"#954F72"><div class=3DWordSection1><p =
class=3DMsoNormal><span =
style=3D'font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri",sans-serif;color:#1F497D'=
>Terry,<o:p></o:p></span></p><p class=3DMsoNormal><span =
style=3D'font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri",sans-serif;color:#1F497D'=
>You should definitely feel the suck, remember the manifold is =
cross-connected so you would have to cover both openings at the same =
time.=C2=A0=C2=A0 Have you tried shooting a little starting fluid into =
the carbs to see if it will try to start that way?=C2=A0 I know this =
sounds dumb, but is the rotor on and seated =
correctly?(BTDT)<o:p></o:p></span></p><p class=3DMsoNormal><span =
style=3D'font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri",sans-serif;color:#1F497D'=
>Keep chasing you will find it.<o:p></o:p></span></p><p =
class=3DMsoNormal><span =
style=3D'font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri",sans-serif;color:#1F497D'=
><o:p>&nbsp;</o:p></span></p><p class=3DMsoNormal><span =
style=3D'font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri",sans-serif;color:#1F497D'=
>All the best,<o:p></o:p></span></p><p class=3DMsoNormal><span =
style=3D'font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri",sans-serif;color:#1F497D'=
>Bill<o:p></o:p></span></p><p class=3DMsoNormal><span =
style=3D'font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri",sans-serif;color:#1F497D'=
><o:p>&nbsp;</o:p></span></p><div><div =
style=3D'border:none;border-top:solid #E1E1E1 1.0pt;padding:3.0pt 0in =
0in 0in'><p class=3DMsoNormal><b><span =
style=3D'font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri",sans-serif'>From:</span><=
/b><span style=3D'font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri",sans-serif'> =
Triumphs [mailto:[email-masked]] <b>On Behalf Of =
</b>TERRY SMITH<br><b>Sent:</b> Friday, May 31, 2019 3:16 =
PM<br><b>To:</b> [email-masked]<br><b>Subject:</b> [TR] Vacuum =
Leak<o:p></o:p></span></p></div></div><p =
class=3DMsoNormal><o:p>&nbsp;</o:p></p><p><span =
style=3D'font-family:"Helvetica",sans-serif;color:#333333'>Randall was =
right.&nbsp; I did have multiple problems.&nbsp; Closer inspection of =
the ground in the distributor plate showed it was connected and tested =
fine with an ohms check, but in truth was hanging on by just a few =
threads.&nbsp; Fabricated another and now spark is exceptional out of =
the wire.&nbsp; Don't ask me how I know that but if you'd like a =
recommendation of the type screwdriver to test the wire to ground, I can =
tell you which kind NOT to =
use.&nbsp;&nbsp;<o:p></o:p></span></p><p><span =
style=3D'font-family:"Helvetica",sans-serif;color:#333333'><o:p>&nbsp;</o=
:p></span></p><p><span =
style=3D'font-family:"Helvetica",sans-serif;color:#333333'>So...the 3 =
has spark to the plugs and has fuel to the carbs.&nbsp; Engine cranks =
but won't catch.&nbsp; Rechecked float specs and they're good.&nbsp; =
Reset richness to 12 flat start-up specs.&nbsp; So good.&nbsp; Ran a =
timing light to see if it had jumped time, tested =
good.&nbsp;&nbsp;<o:p></o:p></span></p><p><span =
style=3D'font-family:"Helvetica",sans-serif;color:#333333'><o:p>&nbsp;</o=
:p></span></p><p><span =
style=3D'font-family:"Helvetica",sans-serif;color:#333333'>I'm now =
suspecting a severe enough vacuum leak to keep the gas from being sucked =
into the chambers.&nbsp; Checked valve lash, no issues.&nbsp; =
Compression test shows 90 plus in all cylinders.&nbsp; I can't see the =
intake manifold gasket on the bottom, but that's where it would be...if =
it is.&nbsp;&nbsp;<o:p></o:p></span></p><p><span =
style=3D'font-family:"Helvetica",sans-serif;color:#333333'><o:p>&nbsp;</o=
:p></span></p><p><span =
style=3D'font-family:"Helvetica",sans-serif;color:#333333'>Question:&nbsp=
; with the carbs off and using the solenoid to crank the engine, how =
much should one feel suction against ones hand at the ports of the =
intake manifold?&nbsp; I'm barely feeling any if at all.&nbsp; Certainly =
not enough to draw gas in.&nbsp;&nbsp;<o:p></o:p></span></p><p><span =
style=3D'font-family:"Helvetica",sans-serif;color:#333333'><o:p>&nbsp;</o=
:p></span></p><p><span =
style=3D'font-family:"Helvetica",sans-serif;color:#333333'>Thanks, =
everyone, for your patience!<o:p></o:p></span></p><p><span =
style=3D'font-family:"Helvetica",sans-serif;color:#333333'><o:p>&nbsp;</o=
:p></span></p><p><span =
style=3D'font-family:"Helvetica",sans-serif;color:#333333'>Terry Smith, =
'59 TR3A&nbsp; TS 58667<o:p></o:p></span></p><p><span =
style=3D'font-family:"Helvetica",sans-serif;color:#333333'>New =
Hampshire<o:p></o:p></span></p></div></body></html>
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From: "wbeech" <[email-masked]>
Date: Fri, 31 May 2019 16:36:25 -0500

FWIW, I'm running Nexen tires on my F-150 pickup, they are just fine.
Bill

-----Original Message-----
From: Kinderlehrer [mailto:[email-masked]] 
Sent: Friday, May 31, 2019 3:22 PM
To: [email-masked]' <[email-masked]>
Cc: [email-masked]
Subject: RE: [TR] Nexen tires for a TR3A

Bob 

-----Original Message-----
From: [email-masked] [mailto:[email-masked]] 
Sent: Friday, May 31, 2019 11:57 AM
To: Kinderlehrer
Cc: [email-masked]
Subject: Re: [TR] Nexen tires for a TR3A

Just my thoughts,
Bill B
TS30800L

Thanks,
Bob

---

From: "Reihing, Randall S." <[email-masked]>
Date: Fri, 31 May 2019 21:37:46 +0000

--===============8282152830310731885==
Content-Language: en-US
	boundary="_000_DM6PR01MB500372D0B1CDB6B84B1A371FEC190DM6PR01MB5003prod_"

--_000_DM6PR01MB500372D0B1CDB6B84B1A371FEC190DM6PR01MB5003prod_
Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable

I don't disagree. I thought it was interesting how moving the tire around t=
he rim, as opposed to those clamp on lead weights, resolved the vibration i=
ssue perfectly.

Sincerely,

Randall Reihing

1959 TR3A

________________________________
From: Jerry Van Vlack <[email-masked]>
Sent: Friday, May 31, 2019 4:20:37 PM
To: Reihing, Randall S.; [email-masked]; Kinderlehrer
Cc: [email-masked]
Subject: Re: [TR] Nexen tires for a TR3A

Moral of the story is don=92t buy Michelin tires. Actually just my personal=
 opinion, I=92ve had them on new cars and could not wait until I could repl=
ace them. I think they are overrated.

Randall Reihing

1959 TR3A

Just my thoughts,
Bill B
TS30800L

Thanks,
Bob

Archive: http://www.team.net/pipermail/triumphs  http://www.team.net/archiv=
e

roadrunner.com

--_000_DM6PR01MB500372D0B1CDB6B84B1A371FEC190DM6PR01MB5003prod_
Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable

<html>
<head>
<meta http-equiv=3D"Content-Type" content=3D"text/html; charset=3DWindows-1=
252">
<style type=3D"text/css" style=3D"display:none;"><!-- P {margin-top:0;margi=
n-bottom:0;} --></style>
</head>
<body dir=3D"ltr">
<div id=3D"divtagdefaultwrapper" style=3D"font-size:12pt;color:#000000;font=
-family:Calibri,Helvetica,sans-serif;" dir=3D"ltr">
<p style=3D"margin-top:0;margin-bottom:0">I don't disagree. I thought it wa=
s interesting how&nbsp;moving the tire around the rim, as opposed to those =
clamp on lead weights, resolved the vibration issue perfectly.&nbsp;</p>
<p style=3D"margin-top:0;margin-bottom:0"><br>
</p>
<p style=3D"margin-top:0;margin-bottom:0">Sincerely,</p>
<p style=3D"margin-top:0;margin-bottom:0">Randall Reihing</p>
<p style=3D"margin-top:0;margin-bottom:0">1959 TR3A</p>
<p style=3D"margin-top:0;margin-bottom:0"><br>
</p>
</div>
<hr style=3D"display:inline-block;width:98%" tabindex=3D"-1">
<div id=3D"divRplyFwdMsg" dir=3D"ltr"><font face=3D"Calibri, sans-serif" st=
yle=3D"font-size:11pt" color=3D"#000000"><b>From:</b> Jerry Van Vlack &lt;j=
[email-masked]&gt;<br>
<b>Sent:</b> Friday, May 31, 2019 4:20:37 PM<br>
<b>To:</b> Reihing, Randall S.; [email-masked]; Kinderlehrer<br>
<b>Cc:</b> [email-masked]<br>
<b>Subject:</b> Re: [TR] Nexen tires for a TR3A</font>
<div>&nbsp;</div>
</div>
<style type=3D"text/css" style=3D"display:none">
<!--
p
	{margin-top:0;
	margin-bottom:0}
-->
</style>
<div dir=3D"ltr">
<div dir=3D"ltr">
<div style=3D"font-size:12pt; font-family:'Calibri'; color:#000000">
<div>Moral of the story is don=92t buy Michelin tires. Actually just my per=
sonal opinion, I=92ve had them on new cars and could not wait until I could=
 replace them. I think they are overrated.
</div>
<div style=3D"font-size:small; text-decoration:none; font-family:&quot;Cali=
bri&quot;; font-weight:normal; color:#000000; font-style:normal; display:in=
line">
<div style=3D"font:10pt tahoma">
<div>&nbsp;</div>
<div style=3D"background:#f5f5f5">
<div style=3D""><b>From:</b> <a title=3D"[email-masked]">Reihi=
ng, Randall S.</a>
</div>
<div><b>Sent:</b> Friday, May 31, 2019 3:46 PM</div>
<div><b>To:</b> <a title=3D"[email-masked]">[email-masked]</a> ; <a tit=
le=3D"[email-masked]">
Kinderlehrer</a> </div>
<div><b>Cc:</b> <a title=3D"[email-masked]">[email-masked]=
t</a> </div>
<div><b>Subject:</b> Re: [TR] Nexen tires for a TR3A</div>
</div>
</div>
<div>&nbsp;</div>
</div>
<div style=3D"font-size:small; text-decoration:none; font-family:&quot;Cali=
bri&quot;; font-weight:normal; color:#000000; font-style:normal; display:in=
line">
<div id=3D"x_divtagdefaultwrapper" dir=3D"ltr" style=3D"font-size:12pt; fon=
t-family:calibri,helvetica,sans-serif; color:#000000">
<p style=3D"margin-bottom:0px; margin-top:0px">&nbsp;</p>
<p style=3D"margin-bottom:0px; margin-top:0px">When recently buying a set o=
f four Michelin Defender's for my truck, owned since new and never wrecked =
or damaged, etc., there was a balancing issue with the new Michelin Defende=
r's. The usual weights were not achieving
 the vibration free use the prior, worn down but smooth driving BFG tires h=
ad demonstrated.
</p>
<p style=3D"margin-bottom:0px; margin-top:0px">&nbsp;</p>
<p style=3D"margin-bottom:0px; margin-top:0px">Tireman of Maumee, Ohio (zer=
o affiliation on my part except as a customer), w<span style=3D"font-size:1=
2pt">here I buy tires,</span><span style=3D"font-size:12pt">&nbsp;</span><s=
pan style=3D"font-size:12pt">the salesman said
</span><span style=3D"font-size:12pt">the wheel may be the </span><span sty=
le=3D"font-size:12pt">culprit for my vibration complaint on the brand new M=
ichelin Defender's that had just been installed and had been balanced but w=
ere vibrating enough at normal expressway
 speed limits of 55-65 mph, I could feel it in the steering wheel and it wa=
s really annoying.
</span></p>
<p style=3D"margin-bottom:0px; margin-top:0px">&nbsp;</p>
<p style=3D"margin-bottom:0px; margin-top:0px">I returned in less than 8 mi=
les. The Tireman salesman said Tireman had a balancing option referred to a=
s &quot;Force Balancing&quot; wherein they don't use the usual weight's. Fo=
r &quot;Force Balancing&quot; they use a different machine
 and move the tire around the rim a very small amount several times until t=
hey find the perfect balancing location of tire to wheel. This worked for m=
e and an hour later the truck is now as vibration free and smooth driving a=
s it was when new.
</p>
<p style=3D"margin-bottom:0px; margin-top:0px">&nbsp;</p>
<p style=3D"margin-bottom:0px; margin-top:0px">Randall Reihing</p>
<p style=3D"margin-bottom:0px; margin-top:0px">1959 TR3A</p>
<p style=3D"margin-bottom:0px; margin-top:0px">&nbsp;</p>
</div>
<hr tabindex=3D"-1" style=3D"width:98%; display:inline-block">
<div id=3D"x_divRplyFwdMsg" dir=3D"ltr"><font color=3D"#000000" face=3D"Cal=
ibri, sans-serif" style=3D"font-size:11pt"><b>From:</b> Triumphs &lt;triump=
[email-masked]&gt; on behalf of [email-masked] &lt;wbeech@flas=
h.net&gt;<br>
<b>Sent:</b> Friday, May 31, 2019 2:56:51 PM<br>
<b>To:</b> Kinderlehrer<br>
<b>Cc:</b> [email-masked]<br>
<b>Subject:</b> Re: [TR] Nexen tires for a TR3A</font>
<div>&nbsp;</div>
</div>
<div class=3D"x_BodyFragment"><font size=3D"2"><span style=3D"font-size:11p=
t">
<div class=3D"x_PlainText">I have Vredesteins on the TR3, excellent handlin=
g.&nbsp; Also, Firestone has this size too, Coker may have this in their Mi=
chelin X tire, I know they have 155 but not sure about 165.&nbsp;
<br>
<br>
As for rubbing with wider tires, someone else needs to comment, I have run =
165 width on 6=94 minilites with great results, more rubber on the ground a=
nd no rubbing.&nbsp;
<br>
<br>
Just my thoughts,<br>
Bill B<br>
TS30800L<br>
<br>
Sent from my DynaTAC 8000X<br>
<br>
On May 31, 2019, at 12:58 PM, Kinderlehrer &lt;[email-masked]&gt;=
 wrote:<br>
<br>
Anyone have any experience with the Nexen tire (SB802)? There are very few<=
br>
tire stores around here that can still mount a tire on a wire wheel and the=
<br>
only tire they seem to be able to get in a 165/80-15 is the Nexen. If I go<=
br>
with a wider tire, will I have a problem with rubbing and will the steering=
<br>
be even harder? <br>
<br>
Thanks,<br>
Bob<br>
<br>
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---

From: "Randall" <[email-masked]>
Date: Fri, 31 May 2019 14:36:44 -0700

> Question:  with the carbs off and using the solenoid to crank 
> the engine, how much should one feel suction against ones 
> hand at the ports of the intake manifold?  I'm barely feeling 
> any if at all.  Certainly not enough to draw gas in.  

With only one hand, almost nothing would be normal.  There is a balance tube
in the manifold, so you would have to block both openings at the same time.
If you only block one, it just draws from the other.

One trick that works well with recalcitrant engines is to squirt a dollop of
carb cleaner (eg Gumout) into each carb throat just before cranking the
engine.  Gumout is actually more flammable than "starting fluid" these days
(they don't sell real ether any more no matter what it says on the can).

If it starts and dies, then you're not getting fuel to the cylinders for
some reason.  Blocked jets, not enough choke, or whatever.  Lift the float
bowl caps off and check actual fuel level in the bowl; it's not un-heard of
for the float valves to stick closed (especially with the fuel we get here
in CA, which seems to dry to an extremely hard white substance instead of
the old brown gummy varnish).

If it won't fire at all, you're either not getting ignition, or it's at the
wrong time.  Clean or change the plugs, test for spark right at a plug
connector, double check that the valves are closed and the piston is near
the top when #1 tries to fire.  Note that it's possible to have fire at the
coil and not at the plugs (bad rotor).  It's also possible to have a spark
that will jump the gap with the plug out of the engine, but won't make it
under compression.  I've had a bad condenser do that to me several times
now, but a bad coil wire (or coil) can do it too.

It's easy for even new plugs to get fouled enough to not fire under
compression.  Just being wet with fuel (or oil) can do it.  Another trick
that sometimes works is to remove each plug in turn and hold it gently with
pliers while you heat the business end with a propane torch.  Keep heating
until there is no more yellow in the flame, or if you never see yellow, the
side electrode glows red.  Reinstall the plug and do the next one.  Don't
forget it's hot!

-- Randall

---

From: Brian Kemp <[email-masked]>
Date: Fri, 31 May 2019 16:36:17 -0700

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I've installed Michelin tires on four different cars and been very 
happy.  I would not judge a brand based on the OEM version of the 
tires.  The manufactures care more about a comfortable ride and things 
that help mpg for their overall fleet economy ratings, so even tires 
with the same name can be different between the OEM and retail models.

Brian

On 5/31/2019 1:20 PM, Jerry Van Vlack wrote:
> Moral of the story is don’t buy Michelin tires. Actually just my 
> personal opinion, I’ve had them on new cars and could not wait until I 
> could replace them. I think they are overrated.
> *From:* Reihing, Randall S.
> *Sent:* Friday, May 31, 2019 3:46 PM
> *To:* [email-masked] ; Kinderlehrer
> *Cc:* [email-masked]
> *Subject:* Re: [TR] Nexen tires for a TR3A
>
> When recently buying a set of four Michelin Defender's for my truck, 
> owned since new and never wrecked or damaged, etc., there was a 
> balancing issue with the new Michelin Defender's. The usual weights 
> were not achieving the vibration free use the prior, worn down but 
> smooth driving BFG tires had demonstrated.
>
> Tireman of Maumee, Ohio (zero affiliation on my part except as a 
> customer), where I buy tires,the salesman said the wheel may be the 
> culprit for my vibration complaint on the brand new Michelin 
> Defender's that had just been installed and had been balanced but were 
> vibrating enough at normal expressway speed limits of 55-65 mph, I 
> could feel it in the steering wheel and it was really annoying.
>
> I returned in less than 8 miles. The Tireman salesman said Tireman had 
> a balancing option referred to as "Force Balancing" wherein they don't 
> use the usual weight's. For "Force Balancing" they use a different 
> machine and move the tire around the rim a very small amount several 
> times until they find the perfect balancing location of tire to wheel. 
> This worked for me and an hour later the truck is now as vibration 
> free and smooth driving as it was when new.
>
> Randall Reihing
>
> 1959 TR3A
>
> ------------------------------------------------------------------------
> *From:* Triumphs <[email-masked]> on behalf of 
> *Sent:* Friday, May 31, 2019 2:56:51 PM
> *To:* Kinderlehrer
> *Cc:* [email-masked]
> *Subject:* Re: [TR] Nexen tires for a TR3A
> I have Vredesteins on the TR3, excellent handling.  Also, Firestone 
> has this size too, Coker may have this in their Michelin X tire, I 
> know they have 155 but not sure about 165.
>
> As for rubbing with wider tires, someone else needs to comment, I have 
> run 165 width on 6” minilites with great results, more rubber on the 
> ground and no rubbing.
>
> Just my thoughts,
> Bill B
> TS30800L
>
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    I've installed Michelin tires on four different cars and been very
    happy.  I would not judge a brand based on the OEM version of the
    tires.  The manufactures care more about a comfortable ride and
    things that help mpg for their overall fleet economy ratings, so
    even tires with the same name can be different between the OEM and
    retail models.<br>
    <br>
    Brian <br>
    <br>
    <div class="moz-cite-prefix">On 5/31/2019 1:20 PM, Jerry Van Vlack
      wrote:<br>
    </div>
    <blockquote type="cite"
      cite="mid:CD362232858B49599B58EE935EB711B4@VlackTK121647">
      <meta content="text/html; charset=windows-1252"
        http-equiv="Content-Type">
      <style style="DISPLAY: none" type="text/css"><!-- P {margin-top:0;margin-bottom:0;} --></style>
      <div dir="ltr">
        <div style="FONT-SIZE: 12pt; FONT-FAMILY: 'Calibri'; COLOR:
          #000000">
          <div>Moral of the story is don’t buy Michelin tires. Actually
            just my personal opinion, I’ve had them on new cars and
            could not wait until I could replace them. I think they are
            overrated. </div>
          <div style="FONT-SIZE: small; TEXT-DECORATION: none;
            FONT-FAMILY: &quot;Calibri&quot;; FONT-WEIGHT: normal;
            COLOR: #000000; FONT-STYLE: normal; DISPLAY: inline">
            <div style="FONT: 10pt tahoma">
              <div> </div>
              <div style="BACKGROUND: #f5f5f5">
                <div style="font-color: black"><b>From:</b> <a
                    title="[email-masked]"
                    moz-do-not-send="true">Reihing, Randall S.</a> </div>
                <div><b>Sent:</b> Friday, May 31, 2019 3:46 PM</div>
                <div><b>To:</b> <a title="[email-masked]"
                    moz-do-not-send="true">[email-masked]</a> ; <a
                    title="[email-masked]"
                    moz-do-not-send="true">Kinderlehrer</a> </div>
                <div><b>Cc:</b> <a title="[email-masked]"
                    moz-do-not-send="true">[email-masked]</a> </div>
                <div><b>Subject:</b> Re: [TR] Nexen tires for a TR3A</div>
              </div>
            </div>
            <div> </div>
          </div>
          <div style="FONT-SIZE: small; TEXT-DECORATION: none;
            FONT-FAMILY: &quot;Calibri&quot;; FONT-WEIGHT: normal;
            COLOR: #000000; FONT-STYLE: normal; DISPLAY: inline">
            <div id="divtagdefaultwrapper" style="FONT-SIZE: 12pt;
              FONT-FAMILY: calibri,helvetica,sans-serif; COLOR: #000000"
              dir="ltr">
              <p style="MARGIN-BOTTOM: 0px; MARGIN-TOP: 0px"> </p>
              <p style="MARGIN-BOTTOM: 0px; MARGIN-TOP: 0px">When
                recently buying a set of four Michelin Defender's for my
                truck, owned since new and never wrecked or damaged,
                etc., there was a balancing issue with the new Michelin
                Defender's. The usual weights were not achieving the
                vibration free use the prior, worn down but smooth
                driving BFG tires had demonstrated. </p>
              <p style="MARGIN-BOTTOM: 0px; MARGIN-TOP: 0px"> </p>
              <p style="MARGIN-BOTTOM: 0px; MARGIN-TOP: 0px">Tireman of
                Maumee, Ohio (zero affiliation on my part except as a
                customer), w<span style="FONT-SIZE: 12pt">here I buy
                  tires,</span><span style="FONT-SIZE: 12pt"> </span><span
                  style="FONT-SIZE: 12pt">the salesman said </span><span
                  style="FONT-SIZE: 12pt">the wheel may be the </span><span
                  style="FONT-SIZE: 12pt">culprit for my vibration
                  complaint on the brand new Michelin Defender's that
                  had just been installed and had been balanced but were
                  vibrating enough at normal expressway speed limits of
                  55-65 mph, I could feel it in the steering wheel and
                  it was really annoying. </span></p>
              <p style="MARGIN-BOTTOM: 0px; MARGIN-TOP: 0px"> </p>
              <p style="MARGIN-BOTTOM: 0px; MARGIN-TOP: 0px">I returned
                in less than 8 miles. The Tireman salesman said Tireman
                had a balancing option referred to as "Force Balancing"
                wherein they don't use the usual weight's. For "Force
                Balancing" they use a different machine and move the
                tire around the rim a very small amount several times
                until they find the perfect balancing location of tire
                to wheel. This worked for me and an hour later the truck
                is now as vibration free and smooth driving as it was
                when new. </p>
              <p style="MARGIN-BOTTOM: 0px; MARGIN-TOP: 0px"> </p>
              <p style="MARGIN-BOTTOM: 0px; MARGIN-TOP: 0px">Randall
                Reihing</p>
              <p style="MARGIN-BOTTOM: 0px; MARGIN-TOP: 0px">1959 TR3A</p>
              <p style="MARGIN-BOTTOM: 0px; MARGIN-TOP: 0px"> </p>
            </div>
            <hr tabindex="-1" style="WIDTH: 98%; DISPLAY: inline-block">
            <div id="divRplyFwdMsg" dir="ltr"><font style="FONT-SIZE:
                11pt" face="Calibri, sans-serif" color="#000000"><b>From:</b>
                Triumphs <a class="moz-txt-link-rfc2396E" href="mailto:[email-masked]">&lt;[email-masked]&gt;</a> on
                behalf of <a class="moz-txt-link-abbreviated" href="mailto:[email-masked]">[email-masked]</a> <a class="moz-txt-link-rfc2396E" href="mailto:[email-masked]">&lt;[email-masked]&gt;</a><br>
                <b>Sent:</b> Friday, May 31, 2019 2:56:51 PM<br>
                <b>To:</b> Kinderlehrer<br>
                <b>Cc:</b> <a class="moz-txt-link-abbreviated" href="mailto:[email-masked]">[email-masked]</a><br>
                <b>Subject:</b> Re: [TR] Nexen tires for a TR3A</font>
              <div> </div>
            </div>
            <div class="BodyFragment"><font size="2"><span
                  style="FONT-SIZE: 11pt">
                  <div class="PlainText">I have Vredesteins on the TR3,
                    excellent handling.  Also, Firestone has this size
                    too, Coker may have this in their Michelin X tire, I
                    know they have 155 but not sure about 165.  <br>
                    <br>
                    As for rubbing with wider tires, someone else needs
                    to comment, I have run 165 width on 6” minilites
                    with great results, more rubber on the ground and no
                    rubbing.  <br>
                    <br>
                    Just my thoughts,<br>
                    Bill B<br>
                    TS30800L<br>
                    <br>
                    Sent from my DynaTAC 8000X<br>
                    <br>
                    On May 31, 2019, at 12:58 PM, Kinderlehrer
                    <a class="moz-txt-link-rfc2396E" href="mailto:[email-masked]">&lt;[email-masked]&gt;</a> wrote:<br>
                    <br>
                    Anyone have any experience with the Nexen tire
                    (SB802)? There are very few<br>
                    tire stores around here that can still mount a tire
                    on a wire wheel and the<br>
                    only tire they seem to be able to get in a 165/80-15
                    is the Nexen. If I go<br>
                    with a wider tire, will I have a problem with
                    rubbing and will the steering<br>
                    be even harder? <br>
                    <br>
                    Thanks,<br>
                    Bob<br>
                    <br>
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      <pre class="moz-quote-pre" wrap="">** <a class="moz-txt-link-abbreviated" href="mailto:[email-masked]">[email-masked]</a> **

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