Subject: Re: [TR] Paint code

From: Lawarence Schwartz <[email-masked]>
Date: Sun, 10 Feb 2019 08:06:17 -0500

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With reference to the Tr3 engine  block markings I remember reading several y=
ears ago along with having conversations a Tr gatherings that at the end of t=
he engine production line there was one employee with only one arm and he wa=
s responsible for writing TR 3 using just one finger which he zipped into th=
e orange red paint and scribbled the markings on the engine block. Larry Sch=
wartz

Sent from my iPhone

> On Jan 18, 2019, at 12:44 AM, wbeech <[email-masked]> wrote:
>=20
> Great picture Don, I have always re-painted the orange =E2=80=9CTR3=E2=80=9D=
 after an engine rebuild, used Chevrolet engine orange.  Had never seen the c=
hina marker markings before.
> Bill
> =20
> From: Triumphs [mailto:[email-masked]] On Behalf Of Don H=
iscock
> Sent: Thursday, January 17, 2019 5:47 PM
> To: John Macartney <[email-masked]>; Triumphs <triumphs@auto=
x.team.net>
> Subject: Re: [TR] Paint code
> =20
> Here's an image of the Coventry assembly line taken by a member of the tou=
r group on Triumph USA's 1958 Rally of Europe for new owners who took their d=
elivery at the factory and toured the Continent.  One can see some of the va=
rious marshalling marks on the engines ready to be used on the line.
> https://photos.smugmug.com/photos/i-b5KrzK2/0/86ac2744/O/i-b5KrzK2.jpg
> =20
> On Thu, Jan 17, 2019 at 5:38 PM John Macartney <[email-masked].=
uk> wrote:
> Thing is Jack, that this far down the track, no one knows! In fact, I doub=
t the majority of people at the factory did either:)
> =20
> Cheers, John
>=20
> Sent from my iPad
>=20
> On 17 Jan 2019, at 17:50, Jack McGahey <[email-masked]> wrote:
>=20
> I have those markings on my TR6 block - reapplied after engine rebuild dur=
ing restoration.
> =20
> I can=E2=80=99t speak about TRA, but I can say that neither VTR or 6-pack l=
ook for these markings, or deduct for their absence, during Concours judging=
 - and I=E2=80=99ve never heard anybody say they knew what they meant or why=
 they are there.=20
> =20
> Cheers,
> Jack Mc
>=20
> Sent from my iPad
>=20
> On Jan 17, 2019, at 9:27 AM, John Macartney <[email-masked]>=
 wrote:
>=20
> Jim
> =20
> In the rebuild of your car, did you by chance find any obscure markings in=
 yellow or white chinagraph chalk on the engine block? These were common ide=
ntifiers used at the factory that were understood by those who worked in eng=
ine assembly =E2=80=93 but no-one else. Primarily, the mark was to distingui=
sh the machined but unassembled block as being an ultimate engine for a Nort=
h America spec car. Not all the blocks had these marks but I do know many ot=
hers have encountered them years later and wondered what the hell they were.=
 Being anxious to replicate what had been there after re-painting the block,=
 they replaced the code. I=E2=80=99d be very surprised if TRA or VTR have ex=
tra marks in their judging books =E2=80=93 or even deduct marks if they were=
n=E2=80=99t there.
> =20
> Cheers, Jonmac
> =20
> From: Triumphs <[email-masked]> On Behalf Of Jim Henningse=
n
> Sent: 17 January 2019 12:31
> To: [email-masked]
> Cc: Triumphs <[email-masked]>
> Subject: Re: [TR] Paint code
> =20
> Bill:
> I have the TRA judging guide for the TR4 and have been using it as my plum=
b line for the restoration going back to 2010 when I purchased the car.  The=
 trick is what to tell the auto paint store for a color to match that would b=
e acceptable to judges.  My goal isn=E2=80=99t to beat everyone in a concour=
s but to faithfully recreate the car as it was born.  I am not interested in=
 trophies.  Over the 8 years restoring this car, s I have sometimes found it=
 hard to get info from the expert judges and respected restorers of these ca=
rs. I=E2=80=99d love to know more specifics on the color and or source that e=
xperts in TRA think correct.  Also, I heard Macy=E2=80=99s Garage had an ear=
ly TR4at the last TRA event.  Does anyone have any detailed photos of that c=
ar they could share.  The few I saw looked magnificent and they have such a g=
reat reputation. =20
> Thanks so much,
> Jim Henningsen
>=20
> Sent from my iPad
>=20
> On Jan 16, 2019, at 10:42 PM, [email-masked] <[email-masked]> wrote:
>=20
> Judging guide Reference Should be TRA, my oversight.=20
> Bill
> =20
> On Jan 16, 2019, at 8:29 PM, [email-masked] <[email-masked]> wrote:
>=20
> If y=E2=80=99all will allow one more =E2=80=9Cauthority=E2=80=9D to weigh i=
n, the VTR Judging Guidlines state, =E2=80=9CThe canister is painted ice blu=
e (specific color unknown) which takes a pale green caste with age.=E2=80=9D=

> =20
> I=E2=80=99ll stick with my Valspar Peacock Blue.=20
> =20
> Cheers,
> Bill
>=20
> Sent from my Motorola 8000X
>=20
> On Jan 16, 2019, at 2:09 PM, Don Hiscock <[email-masked]> wrote:
>=20
> The TR Register (UK) forum had a thread on the subject of oil filter canis=
ter housings a few years ago.
> https://www.tr-register.co.uk/forums/index.php?/topic/44252-oil-filter-bow=
l/
> =20
> Note especially the comments by our late, great friend Alec Pringle about h=
is experience with lots of variations and the quite realistic comment that S=
-T were a lot more worried about keeping lines going and spares supplied tha=
n getting details "right" around shade.
> =20
> The thread has some useful info, but this is one of those don't-sweat-it s=
ubjects around our cars.
> =20
> Don
> 1962 TR3B TSF202L
> =20
> On Tue, Jan 15, 2019 at 11:01 PM James Henningsen <[email-masked]> wrot=
e:
> Anyone have a source for correct paint color on early 1962 TR4 oil filter c=
anister housing.  TRA judging manual says ice blue that patinas to a pale gr=
een.  Looking for a color code I can give my paint shop.   Thanks to any con=
cours experts out there.=20
> Jim Henningsen=20
> Ocala FL
>=20
>=20
> Sent from my iPhone
> ** [email-masked] **
>=20
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<html><head><meta http-equiv=3D"content-type" content=3D"text/html; charset=3D=
utf-8"></head><body dir=3D"auto">With reference to the Tr3 engine &nbsp;bloc=
k markings I remember reading several years ago along with having conversati=
ons a Tr gatherings that at the end of the engine production line there was o=
ne employee with only one arm and he was responsible for writing TR 3 using j=
ust one finger which he zipped into the orange red paint and scribbled the m=
arkings on the engine block. Larry Schwartz<br><br><div id=3D"AppleMailSigna=
ture" dir=3D"ltr">Sent from my iPhone</div><div dir=3D"ltr"><br>On Jan 18, 2=
019, at 12:44 AM, wbeech &lt;<a href=3D"mailto:[email-masked]">wbeech@flas=
h.net</a>&gt; wrote:<br><br></div><blockquote type=3D"cite"><div dir=3D"ltr"=
><meta http-equiv=3D"Content-Type" content=3D"text/html; charset=3Dutf-8"><m=
eta name=3D"Generator" content=3D"Microsoft Word 15 (filtered medium)"><!--[=
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</o:shapelayout></xml><![endif]--><div class=3D"WordSection1"><p class=3D"Ms=
oNormal"><span style=3D"font-size:11.0pt;font-family:&quot;Calibri&quot;,san=
s-serif;color:#1F497D">Great picture Don, I have always re-painted the orang=
e =E2=80=9CTR3=E2=80=9D after an engine rebuild, used Chevrolet engine orang=
e.&nbsp; Had never seen the china marker markings before.<o:p></o:p></span><=
/p><p class=3D"MsoNormal"><span style=3D"font-size:11.0pt;font-family:&quot;=
Calibri&quot;,sans-serif;color:#1F497D">Bill<o:p></o:p></span></p><p class=3D=
"MsoNormal"><span style=3D"font-size:11.0pt;font-family:&quot;Calibri&quot;,=
sans-serif;color:#1F497D"><o:p>&nbsp;</o:p></span></p><p class=3D"MsoNormal"=
><b><span style=3D"font-size:11.0pt;font-family:&quot;Calibri&quot;,sans-ser=
if">From:</span></b><span style=3D"font-size:11.0pt;font-family:&quot;Calibr=
i&quot;,sans-serif"> Triumphs [<a href=3D"mailto:[email-masked]=
.net">mailto:[email-masked]</a>] <b>On Behalf Of </b>Don Hi=
scock<br><b>Sent:</b> Thursday, January 17, 2019 5:47 PM<br><b>To:</b> John M=
acartney &lt;<a href=3D"mailto:[email-masked]">John.Macartney@=
ukpips.org.uk</a>&gt;; Triumphs &lt;<a href=3D"mailto:[email-masked]=
t">[email-masked]</a>&gt;<br><b>Subject:</b> Re: [TR] Paint code<o:=
p></o:p></span></p><p class=3D"MsoNormal"><o:p>&nbsp;</o:p></p><div><div><p c=
lass=3D"MsoNormal">Here's an image of the Coventry assembly line taken by a m=
ember of the tour group on Triumph USA's 1958 Rally of Europe for new owners=
 who took their delivery at the factory and toured the Continent.&nbsp; One c=
an see some of the various marshalling marks on the engines ready to be used=
 on the line.<o:p></o:p></p><div><p class=3D"MsoNormal"><a href=3D"https://p=
hotos.smugmug.com/photos/i-b5KrzK2/0/86ac2744/O/i-b5KrzK2.jpg">https://photo=
s.smugmug.com/photos/i-b5KrzK2/0/86ac2744/O/i-b5KrzK2.jpg</a><o:p></o:p></p>=
</div></div></div><p class=3D"MsoNormal"><o:p>&nbsp;</o:p></p><div><div><p c=
lass=3D"MsoNormal">On Thu, Jan 17, 2019 at 5:38 PM John Macartney &lt;<a hre=
f=3D"mailto:[email-masked]">[email-masked]</a>&g=
t; wrote:<o:p></o:p></p></div><blockquote style=3D"border:none;border-left:s=
olid #CCCCCC 1.0pt;padding:0in 0in 0in 6.0pt;margin-left:4.8pt;margin-right:=
0in"><div><p class=3D"MsoNormal">Thing is Jack, that this far down the track=
, no one knows! In fact, I doubt the majority of people at the factory did e=
ither:)<o:p></o:p></p><div><p class=3D"MsoNormal"><o:p>&nbsp;</o:p></p></div=
><div><p class=3D"MsoNormal" style=3D"margin-bottom:12.0pt">Cheers, John<o:p=
></o:p></p><div id=3D"gmail-m_1217474439255518928AppleMailSignature"><p clas=
s=3D"MsoNormal">Sent from my iPad<o:p></o:p></p></div><div><p class=3D"MsoNo=
rmal" style=3D"margin-bottom:12.0pt"><br>On 17 Jan 2019, at 17:50, Jack McGa=
hey &lt;<a href=3D"mailto:[email-masked]" target=3D"_blank">McGaheyRx@aol=
.com</a>&gt; wrote:<o:p></o:p></p></div><blockquote style=3D"margin-top:5.0p=
t;margin-bottom:5.0pt"><div><p class=3D"MsoNormal">I have those markings on m=
y TR6 block - reapplied after engine rebuild during restoration.<o:p></o:p><=
/p><div><p class=3D"MsoNormal"><o:p>&nbsp;</o:p></p></div><div><p class=3D"M=
soNormal">I can=E2=80=99t speak about TRA, but I can say that neither VTR or=
 6-pack look for these markings, or deduct for their absence, during Concour=
s judging - and I=E2=80=99ve never heard anybody say they knew what they mea=
nt or why they are there.&nbsp;<o:p></o:p></p></div><div><p class=3D"MsoNorm=
al"><o:p>&nbsp;</o:p></p></div><div><p class=3D"MsoNormal">Cheers,<o:p></o:p=
></p></div><div><p class=3D"MsoNormal" style=3D"margin-bottom:12.0pt">Jack M=
c<o:p></o:p></p><div id=3D"gmail-m_1217474439255518928AppleMailSignature"><p=
 class=3D"MsoNormal">Sent from my iPad<o:p></o:p></p></div><div><p class=3D"=
MsoNormal" style=3D"margin-bottom:12.0pt"><br>On Jan 17, 2019, at 9:27 AM, J=
ohn Macartney &lt;<a href=3D"mailto:[email-masked]" target=3D"=
_blank">[email-masked]</a>&gt; wrote:<o:p></o:p></p></div><blo=
ckquote style=3D"margin-top:5.0pt;margin-bottom:5.0pt"><div><div><p class=3D=
"MsoNormal" style=3D"mso-margin-top-alt:auto;mso-margin-bottom-alt:auto">Jim=
<o:p></o:p></p><p class=3D"MsoNormal" style=3D"mso-margin-top-alt:auto;mso-m=
argin-bottom-alt:auto">&nbsp;<o:p></o:p></p><p class=3D"MsoNormal" style=3D"=
mso-margin-top-alt:auto;mso-margin-bottom-alt:auto">In the rebuild of your c=
ar, did you by chance find any obscure markings in yellow or white chinagrap=
h chalk on the engine block? These were common identifiers used at the facto=
ry that were understood by those who worked in engine assembly =E2=80=93 but=
 no-one else. Primarily, the mark was to distinguish the machined but unasse=
mbled block as being an ultimate engine for a North America spec car. Not al=
l the blocks had these marks but I do know many others have encountered them=
 years later and wondered what the hell they were. Being anxious to replicat=
e what had been there after re-painting the block, they replaced the code. I=
=E2=80=99d be very surprised if TRA or VTR have extra marks in their judging=
 books =E2=80=93 or even deduct marks if they weren=E2=80=99t there.<o:p></o=
:p></p><p class=3D"MsoNormal" style=3D"mso-margin-top-alt:auto;mso-margin-bo=
ttom-alt:auto">&nbsp;<o:p></o:p></p><p class=3D"MsoNormal" style=3D"mso-marg=
in-top-alt:auto;mso-margin-bottom-alt:auto">Cheers, Jonmac<o:p></o:p></p><p c=
lass=3D"MsoNormal" style=3D"mso-margin-top-alt:auto;mso-margin-bottom-alt:au=
to">&nbsp;<o:p></o:p></p><div><div style=3D"border:none;border-top:solid #E1=
E1E1 1.0pt;padding:3.0pt 0in 0in 0in"><p class=3D"MsoNormal" style=3D"mso-ma=
rgin-top-alt:auto;mso-margin-bottom-alt:auto"><b>From:</b> Triumphs &lt;<a h=
ref=3D"mailto:[email-masked]" target=3D"_blank">triumphs-bo=
[email-masked]</a>&gt; <b>On Behalf Of </b>Jim Henningsen<br><b>Sent:</=
b> 17 January 2019 12:31<br><b>To:</b> <a href=3D"mailto:[email-masked]" t=
arget=3D"_blank">[email-masked]</a><br><b>Cc:</b> Triumphs &lt;<a href=3D"=
mailto:[email-masked]" target=3D"_blank">[email-masked]</a=
>&gt;<br><b>Subject:</b> Re: [TR] Paint code<o:p></o:p></p></div></div><p cl=
ass=3D"MsoNormal" style=3D"mso-margin-top-alt:auto;mso-margin-bottom-alt:aut=
o">&nbsp;<o:p></o:p></p><p class=3D"MsoNormal" style=3D"mso-margin-top-alt:a=
uto;mso-margin-bottom-alt:auto">Bill:<o:p></o:p></p><div><p class=3D"MsoNorm=
al" style=3D"mso-margin-top-alt:auto;mso-margin-bottom-alt:auto">I have the T=
RA judging guide for the TR4 and have been using it as my plumb line for the=
 restoration going back to 2010 when I purchased the car.&nbsp; The trick is=
 what to tell the auto paint store for a color to match that would be accept=
able to judges.&nbsp; My goal isn=E2=80=99t to beat everyone in a concours b=
ut to faithfully recreate the car as it was born.&nbsp; I am not interested i=
n trophies.&nbsp; Over the 8 years restoring this car, s I have sometimes fo=
und it hard to get info from the expert judges and respected restorers of th=
ese cars. I=E2=80=99d love to know more specifics on the color and or source=
 that experts in TRA think correct.&nbsp; Also, I heard Macy=E2=80=99s Garag=
e had an early TR4at the last TRA event.&nbsp; Does anyone have any detailed=
 photos of that car they could share.&nbsp; The few I saw looked magnificent=
 and they have such a great reputation. &nbsp;<o:p></o:p></p></div><div><p c=
lass=3D"MsoNormal" style=3D"mso-margin-top-alt:auto;mso-margin-bottom-alt:au=
to">Thanks so much,<o:p></o:p></p></div><div><p class=3D"MsoNormal" style=3D=
"mso-margin-top-alt:auto;margin-bottom:12.0pt">Jim Henningsen<o:p></o:p></p>=
<div id=3D"gmail-m_1217474439255518928AppleMailSignature"><p class=3D"MsoNor=
mal" style=3D"mso-margin-top-alt:auto;mso-margin-bottom-alt:auto">Sent from m=
y iPad<o:p></o:p></p></div><div><p class=3D"MsoNormal" style=3D"mso-margin-t=
op-alt:auto;margin-bottom:12.0pt"><br>On Jan 16, 2019, at 10:42 PM, <a href=3D=
"mailto:[email-masked]" target=3D"_blank">[email-masked]</a> &lt;<a href=
=3D"mailto:[email-masked]" target=3D"_blank">[email-masked]</a>&gt; wrot=
e:<o:p></o:p></p></div><blockquote style=3D"margin-top:5.0pt;margin-bottom:5=
.0pt"><div><div><p class=3D"MsoNormal" style=3D"mso-margin-top-alt:auto;mso-=
margin-bottom-alt:auto">Judging guide Reference Should be TRA, my oversight.=
&nbsp;<o:p></o:p></p></div><div><p class=3D"MsoNormal" style=3D"mso-margin-t=
op-alt:auto;mso-margin-bottom-alt:auto">Bill<o:p></o:p></p></div><div><p cla=
ss=3D"MsoNormal" style=3D"mso-margin-top-alt:auto;mso-margin-bottom-alt:auto=
">&nbsp;<o:p></o:p></p></div><div><p class=3D"MsoNormal" style=3D"mso-margin=
-top-alt:auto;margin-bottom:12.0pt">On Jan 16, 2019, at 8:29 PM, <a href=3D"=
mailto:[email-masked]" target=3D"_blank">[email-masked]</a> &lt;<a href=3D=
"mailto:[email-masked]" target=3D"_blank">[email-masked]</a>&gt; wrote:<=
o:p></o:p></p></div><div><p class=3D"MsoNormal" style=3D"mso-margin-top-alt:=
auto;mso-margin-bottom-alt:auto">If y=E2=80=99all will allow one more =E2=80=
=9Cauthority=E2=80=9D to weigh in, the VTR Judging Guidlines state, =E2=80=9C=
The canister is painted ice blue (specific color unknown) which takes a pale=
 green caste with age.=E2=80=9D<o:p></o:p></p><div><p class=3D"MsoNormal" st=
yle=3D"mso-margin-top-alt:auto;mso-margin-bottom-alt:auto">&nbsp;<o:p></o:p>=
</p></div><div><p class=3D"MsoNormal" style=3D"mso-margin-top-alt:auto;mso-m=
argin-bottom-alt:auto">I=E2=80=99ll stick with my Valspar Peacock Blue.&nbsp=
;<o:p></o:p></p></div><div><p class=3D"MsoNormal" style=3D"mso-margin-top-al=
t:auto;mso-margin-bottom-alt:auto">&nbsp;<o:p></o:p></p></div><div><p class=3D=
"MsoNormal" style=3D"mso-margin-top-alt:auto;mso-margin-bottom-alt:auto">Che=
ers,<o:p></o:p></p></div><div><p class=3D"MsoNormal" style=3D"mso-margin-top=
-alt:auto;margin-bottom:12.0pt">Bill<o:p></o:p></p><div><p class=3D"MsoNorma=
l" style=3D"mso-margin-top-alt:auto;mso-margin-bottom-alt:auto">Sent from my=
 Motorola 8000X<o:p></o:p></p></div><div><p class=3D"MsoNormal" style=3D"mso=
-margin-top-alt:auto;margin-bottom:12.0pt"><br>On Jan 16, 2019, at 2:09 PM, D=
on Hiscock &lt;<a href=3D"mailto:[email-masked]" target=3D"_blank">do=
[email-masked]</a>&gt; wrote:<o:p></o:p></p></div><div><div><div><p cla=
ss=3D"MsoNormal" style=3D"mso-margin-top-alt:auto;mso-margin-bottom-alt:auto=
">The TR Register (UK) forum had a thread on the subject of oil filter canis=
ter housings a few years ago.<o:p></o:p></p><div><p class=3D"MsoNormal" styl=
e=3D"mso-margin-top-alt:auto;mso-margin-bottom-alt:auto"><a href=3D"https://=
wwwtr-register.co.uk/forums/index.php?/topic/44252-oil-filter-bowl/" target=3D=
"_blank">https://www.tr-register.co.uk/forums/index.php?/topic/44252-oil-fil=
ter-bowl/</a><o:p></o:p></p></div><div><p class=3D"MsoNormal" style=3D"mso-m=
argin-top-alt:auto;mso-margin-bottom-alt:auto">&nbsp;<o:p></o:p></p></div><d=
iv><p class=3D"MsoNormal" style=3D"mso-margin-top-alt:auto;mso-margin-bottom=
-alt:auto">Note especially the comments by our late, great friend Alec Pring=
le about his experience with lots of variations and the quite realistic comm=
ent that S-T were a lot more worried about keeping lines going and spares su=
pplied than getting details "right" around shade.<o:p></o:p></p></div><div><=
p class=3D"MsoNormal" style=3D"mso-margin-top-alt:auto;mso-margin-bottom-alt=
:auto">&nbsp;<o:p></o:p></p></div><div><p class=3D"MsoNormal" style=3D"mso-m=
argin-top-alt:auto;mso-margin-bottom-alt:auto">The thread has some useful in=
fo, but this is one of those don't-sweat-it subjects around our cars.<o:p></=
o:p></p></div><div><p class=3D"MsoNormal" style=3D"mso-margin-top-alt:auto;m=
so-margin-bottom-alt:auto">&nbsp;<o:p></o:p></p></div><div><p class=3D"MsoNo=
rmal" style=3D"mso-margin-top-alt:auto;mso-margin-bottom-alt:auto">Don<o:p><=
/o:p></p></div><div><p class=3D"MsoNormal" style=3D"mso-margin-top-alt:auto;=
mso-margin-bottom-alt:auto">1962 TR3B TSF202L<o:p></o:p></p></div></div></di=
v><p class=3D"MsoNormal" style=3D"mso-margin-top-alt:auto;mso-margin-bottom-=
alt:auto">&nbsp;<o:p></o:p></p><div><div><p class=3D"MsoNormal" style=3D"mso=
-margin-top-alt:auto;mso-margin-bottom-alt:auto">On Tue, Jan 15, 2019 at 11:=
01 PM James Henningsen &lt;<a href=3D"mailto:[email-masked]" target=3D"_b=
lank">[email-masked]</a>&gt; wrote:<o:p></o:p></p></div><blockquote style=
=3D"border:none;border-left:solid #CCCCCC 1.0pt;padding:0in 0in 0in 6.0pt;ma=
rgin-left:4.8pt;margin-top:5.0pt;margin-right:0in;margin-bottom:5.0pt"><p cl=
ass=3D"MsoNormal" style=3D"mso-margin-top-alt:auto;mso-margin-bottom-alt:aut=
o">Anyone have a source for correct paint color on early 1962 TR4 oil filter=
 canister housing.&nbsp; TRA judging manual says ice blue that patinas to a p=
ale green.&nbsp; Looking for a color code I can give my paint shop.&nbsp; &n=
bsp;Thanks to any concours experts out there. <br>Jim Henningsen <br>Ocala FL=
<br><br><br>Sent from my iPhone<br>** <a href=3D"mailto:[email-masked].=
net" target=3D"_blank">[email-masked]</a> **<br><br>Donate: <a href=
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ote></div></div><div><p class=3D"MsoNormal" style=3D"mso-margin-top-alt:auto=
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--===============2833396749522299719==
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** [email-masked] **

Archive: http://www.team.net/pipermail/triumphs  http://www.team.net/archive

--===============2833396749522299719==--

---

From: Don Hiscock <[email-masked]>
Date: Sun, 10 Feb 2019 07:25:21 -0600

--===============8161536743363631832==

--00000000000072450305818a20e9
Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable

Perhaps our forum friend John Macartney canl come in with more and better
information, but Sir John Black made a real commitment to disabled war
vets.  S-T found productive work for many, for years and years.  It
wouldn't surprise me at all that one of those positions was marking engines=
.

Don
1962 TR3B TSF202L

On Sun, Feb 10, 2019 at 7:06 AM Lawarence Schwartz <[email-masked]> wrote:

> With reference to the Tr3 engine  block markings I remember reading
> several years ago along with having conversations a Tr gatherings that at
> the end of the engine production line there was one employee with only on=
e
> arm and he was responsible for writing TR 3 using just one finger which h=
e
> zipped into the orange red paint and scribbled the markings on the engine
> block. Larry Schwartz
>
> Sent from my iPhone
>
> Great picture Don, I have always re-painted the orange =E2=80=9CTR3=E2=80=
=9D after an
> engine rebuild, used Chevrolet engine orange.  Had never seen the china
> marker markings before.
>
> Bill
>
>
>
> *From:* Triumphs [mailto:[email-masked]
> <[email-masked]>] *On Behalf Of *Don Hiscock
> *Sent:* Thursday, January 17, 2019 5:47 PM
> *To:* John Macartney <[email-masked]>; Triumphs <
> [email-masked]>
> *Subject:* Re: [TR] Paint code
>
>
>
> Here's an image of the Coventry assembly line taken by a member of the
> tour group on Triumph USA's 1958 Rally of Europe for new owners who took
> their delivery at the factory and toured the Continent.  One can see some
> of the various marshalling marks on the engines ready to be used on the
> line.
>
> On Thu, Jan 17, 2019 at 5:38 PM John Macartney <
> [email-masked]> wrote:
>
> Thing is Jack, that this far down the track, no one knows! In fact, I
> doubt the majority of people at the factory did either:)
>
>
>
> Cheers, John
>
> Sent from my iPad
>
>
> I have those markings on my TR6 block - reapplied after engine rebuild
> during restoration.
>
>
>
> I can=E2=80=99t speak about TRA, but I can say that neither VTR or 6-pack=
 look for
> these markings, or deduct for their absence, during Concours judging - an=
d
> I=E2=80=99ve never heard anybody say they knew what they meant or why the=
y are
> there.
>
>
>
> Cheers,
>
> Jack Mc
>
> Sent from my iPad
>
>
> On Jan 17, 2019, at 9:27 AM, John Macartney <[email-masked]=
>
> wrote:
>
> Jim
>
>
>
> In the rebuild of your car, did you by chance find any obscure markings i=
n
> yellow or white chinagraph chalk on the engine block? These were common
> identifiers used at the factory that were understood by those who worked =
in
> engine assembly =E2=80=93 but no-one else. Primarily, the mark was to dis=
tinguish
> the machined but unassembled block as being an ultimate engine for a Nort=
h
> America spec car. Not all the blocks had these marks but I do know many
> others have encountered them years later and wondered what the hell they
> were. Being anxious to replicate what had been there after re-painting th=
e
> block, they replaced the code. I=E2=80=99d be very surprised if TRA or VT=
R have
> extra marks in their judging books =E2=80=93 or even deduct marks if they=
 weren=E2=80=99t
> there.
>
>
>
> Cheers, Jonmac
>
>
>
> *From:* Triumphs <[email-masked]
> <[email-masked]>> *On Behalf Of *Jim Henningsen
> *Sent:* 17 January 2019 12:31
> *To:* [email-masked]
> *Cc:* Triumphs <[email-masked]>
> *Subject:* Re: [TR] Paint code
>
>
>
> Bill:
>
> I have the TRA judging guide for the TR4 and have been using it as my
> plumb line for the restoration going back to 2010 when I purchased the
> car.  The trick is what to tell the auto paint store for a color to match
> that would be acceptable to judges.  My goal isn=E2=80=99t to beat everyo=
ne in a
> concours but to faithfully recreate the car as it was born.  I am not
> interested in trophies.  Over the 8 years restoring this car, s I have
> sometimes found it hard to get info from the expert judges and respected
> restorers of these cars. I=E2=80=99d love to know more specifics on the c=
olor and
> or source that experts in TRA think correct.  Also, I heard Macy=E2=80=99=
s Garage
> had an early TR4at the last TRA event.  Does anyone have any detailed
> photos of that car they could share.  The few I saw looked magnificent an=
d
> they have such a great reputation.
>
> Thanks so much,
>
> Jim Henningsen
>
> Sent from my iPad
>
>
> Judging guide Reference Should be TRA, my oversight.
>
> Bill
>
>
>
> If y=E2=80=99all will allow one more =E2=80=9Cauthority=E2=80=9D to weigh=
 in, the VTR Judging
> Guidlines state, =E2=80=9CThe canister is painted ice blue (specific colo=
r unknown)
> which takes a pale green caste with age.=E2=80=9D
>
>
>
> I=E2=80=99ll stick with my Valspar Peacock Blue.
>
>
>
> Cheers,
>
> Bill
>
> The TR Register (UK) forum had a thread on the subject of oil filter
> canister housings a few years ago.
>
>
> https://www.tr-register.co.uk/forums/index.php?/topic/44252-oil-filter-bo=
wl/
> <https://wwwtr-register.co.uk/forums/index.php?/topic/44252-oil-filter-bo=
wl/>
>
>
>
> Note especially the comments by our late, great friend Alec Pringle about
> his experience with lots of variations and the quite realistic comment th=
at
> S-T were a lot more worried about keeping lines going and spares supplied
> than getting details "right" around shade.
>
>
>
> The thread has some useful info, but this is one of those don't-sweat-it
> subjects around our cars.
>
>
>
> Don
>
> 1962 TR3B TSF202L
>
>
>
> On Tue, Jan 15, 2019 at 11:01 PM James Henningsen <[email-masked]>
> wrote:
>
> Anyone have a source for correct paint color on early 1962 TR4 oil filter
> canister housing.  TRA judging manual says ice blue that patinas to a pal=
e
> green.  Looking for a color code I can give my paint shop.   Thanks to an=
y
> concours experts out there.
> Jim Henningsen
> Ocala FL
>
>
> Sent from my iPhone
> Unsubscribe/Manage:
> http://autoxteam.net/mailman/options/triumphs/[email-masked]
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>
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--00000000000072450305818a20e9
Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable

<div dir=3D"ltr">Perhaps our forum friend John Macartney canl come in with =
more and better information, but Sir John Black made a real commitment to d=
isabled war vets.=C2=A0 S-T found productive work for many, for years and y=
ears.=C2=A0 It wouldn&#39;t surprise me at all that one of those positions =
was marking engines.<div><br></div><div>Don</div><div>1962 TR3B TSF202L</di=
v></div><br><div class=3D"gmail_quote"><div dir=3D"ltr" class=3D"gmail_attr=
">On Sun, Feb 10, 2019 at 7:06 AM Lawarence Schwartz &lt;<a href=3D"mailto:=
[email-masked]">[email-masked]</a>&gt; wrote:<br></div><blockquote class=3D"g=
mail_quote" style=3D"margin:0px 0px 0px 0.8ex;border-left:1px solid rgb(204=
,204,204);padding-left:1ex"><div dir=3D"auto">With reference to the Tr3 eng=
ine =C2=A0block markings I remember reading several years ago along with ha=
ving conversations a Tr gatherings that at the end of the engine production=
 line there was one employee with only one arm and he was responsible for w=
riting TR 3 using just one finger which he zipped into the orange red paint=
 and scribbled the markings on the engine block. Larry Schwartz<br><br><div=
 id=3D"gmail-m_-7582095811443505830AppleMailSignature" dir=3D"ltr">Sent fro=
m my iPhone</div><div dir=3D"ltr"><br>On Jan 18, 2019, at 12:44 AM, wbeech =
&lt;<a href=3D"mailto:[email-masked]" target=3D"_blank">[email-masked]<=
/a>&gt; wrote:<br><br></div><blockquote type=3D"cite"><div dir=3D"ltr"><div=
 class=3D"gmail-m_-7582095811443505830WordSection1"><p class=3D"MsoNormal">=
<span style=3D"font-size:11pt;font-family:Calibri,sans-serif;color:rgb(31,7=
3,125)">Great picture Don, I have always re-painted the orange =E2=80=9CTR3=
=E2=80=9D after an engine rebuild, used Chevrolet engine orange.=C2=A0 Had =
never seen the china marker markings before.<u></u><u></u></span></p><p cla=
ss=3D"MsoNormal"><span style=3D"font-size:11pt;font-family:Calibri,sans-ser=
if;color:rgb(31,73,125)">Bill<u></u><u></u></span></p><p class=3D"MsoNormal=
"><span style=3D"font-size:11pt;font-family:Calibri,sans-serif;color:rgb(31=
,73,125)"><u></u>=C2=A0<u></u></span></p><p class=3D"MsoNormal"><b><span st=
yle=3D"font-size:11pt;font-family:Calibri,sans-serif">From:</span></b><span=
 style=3D"font-size:11pt;font-family:Calibri,sans-serif"> Triumphs [<a href=
=3D"mailto:[email-masked]" target=3D"_blank">mailto:triump=
[email-masked]</a>] <b>On Behalf Of </b>Don Hiscock<br><b>Sent:<=
/b> Thursday, January 17, 2019 5:47 PM<br><b>To:</b> John Macartney &lt;<a =
href=3D"mailto:[email-masked]" target=3D"_blank">John.Macartn=
[email-masked]</a>&gt;; Triumphs &lt;<a href=3D"mailto:[email-masked]=
m.net" target=3D"_blank">[email-masked]</a>&gt;<br><b>Subject:</b>=
 Re: [TR] Paint code<u></u><u></u></span></p><p class=3D"MsoNormal"><u></u>=
=C2=A0<u></u></p><div><div><p class=3D"MsoNormal">Here&#39;s an image of th=
e Coventry assembly line taken by a member of the tour group on Triumph USA=
&#39;s 1958 Rally of Europe for new owners who took their delivery at the f=
actory and toured the Continent.=C2=A0 One can see some of the various mars=
halling marks on the engines ready to be used on the line.<u></u><u></u></p=
><div><p class=3D"MsoNormal"><a href=3D"https://photos.smugmug.com/photos/i=
-b5KrzK2/0/86ac2744/O/i-b5KrzK2.jpg" target=3D"_blank">https://photos.smugm=
ug.com/photos/i-b5KrzK2/0/86ac2744/O/i-b5KrzK2.jpg</a><u></u><u></u></p></d=
iv></div></div><p class=3D"MsoNormal"><u></u>=C2=A0<u></u></p><div><div><p =
class=3D"MsoNormal">On Thu, Jan 17, 2019 at 5:38 PM John Macartney &lt;<a h=
ref=3D"mailto:[email-masked]" target=3D"_blank">John.Macartne=
[email-masked]</a>&gt; wrote:<u></u><u></u></p></div><blockquote style=3D"=
border-top:none;border-right:none;border-bottom:none;border-left:1pt solid =
rgb(204,204,204);padding:0in 0in 0in 6pt;margin-left:4.8pt;margin-right:0in=
"><div><p class=3D"MsoNormal">Thing is Jack, that this far down the track, =
no one knows! In fact, I doubt the majority of people at the factory did ei=
ther:)<u></u><u></u></p><div><p class=3D"MsoNormal"><u></u>=C2=A0<u></u></p=
></div><div><p class=3D"MsoNormal" style=3D"margin-bottom:12pt">Cheers, Joh=
n<u></u><u></u></p><div id=3D"gmail-m_-7582095811443505830gmail-m_121747443=
9255518928AppleMailSignature"><p class=3D"MsoNormal">Sent from my iPad<u></=
u><u></u></p></div><div><p class=3D"MsoNormal" style=3D"margin-bottom:12pt"=
><br>On 17 Jan 2019, at 17:50, Jack McGahey &lt;<a href=3D"mailto:McGaheyRx=
@aol.com" target=3D"_blank">[email-masked]</a>&gt; wrote:<u></u><u></u><=
/p></div><blockquote style=3D"margin-top:5pt;margin-bottom:5pt"><div><p cla=
ss=3D"MsoNormal">I have those markings on my TR6 block - reapplied after en=
gine rebuild during restoration.<u></u><u></u></p><div><p class=3D"MsoNorma=
l"><u></u>=C2=A0<u></u></p></div><div><p class=3D"MsoNormal">I can=E2=80=99=
t speak about TRA, but I can say that neither VTR or 6-pack look for these =
markings, or deduct for their absence, during Concours judging - and I=E2=
=80=99ve never heard anybody say they knew what they meant or why they are =
there.=C2=A0<u></u><u></u></p></div><div><p class=3D"MsoNormal"><u></u>=C2=
=A0<u></u></p></div><div><p class=3D"MsoNormal">Cheers,<u></u><u></u></p></=
div><div><p class=3D"MsoNormal" style=3D"margin-bottom:12pt">Jack Mc<u></u>=
<u></u></p><div id=3D"gmail-m_-7582095811443505830gmail-m_12174744392555189=
28AppleMailSignature"><p class=3D"MsoNormal">Sent from my iPad<u></u><u></u=
></p></div><div><p class=3D"MsoNormal" style=3D"margin-bottom:12pt"><br>On =
Jan 17, 2019, at 9:27 AM, John Macartney &lt;<a href=3D"mailto:john.macartn=
[email-masked]" target=3D"_blank">[email-masked]</a>&gt; wr=
ote:<u></u><u></u></p></div><blockquote style=3D"margin-top:5pt;margin-bott=
om:5pt"><div><div><p class=3D"MsoNormal">Jim<u></u><u></u></p><p class=3D"M=
soNormal">=C2=A0<u></u><u></u></p><p class=3D"MsoNormal">In the rebuild of =
your car, did you by chance find any obscure markings in yellow or white ch=
inagraph chalk on the engine block? These were common identifiers used at t=
he factory that were understood by those who worked in engine assembly =E2=
=80=93 but no-one else. Primarily, the mark was to distinguish the machined=
 but unassembled block as being an ultimate engine for a North America spec=
 car. Not all the blocks had these marks but I do know many others have enc=
ountered them years later and wondered what the hell they were. Being anxio=
us to replicate what had been there after re-painting the block, they repla=
ced the code. I=E2=80=99d be very surprised if TRA or VTR have extra marks =
in their judging books =E2=80=93 or even deduct marks if they weren=E2=80=
=99t there.<u></u><u></u></p><p class=3D"MsoNormal">=C2=A0<u></u><u></u></p=
><p class=3D"MsoNormal">Cheers, Jonmac<u></u><u></u></p><p class=3D"MsoNorm=
al">=C2=A0<u></u><u></u></p><div><div style=3D"border-right:none;border-bot=
tom:none;border-left:none;border-top:1pt solid rgb(225,225,225);padding:3pt=
 0in 0in"><p class=3D"MsoNormal"><b>From:</b> Triumphs &lt;<a href=3D"mailt=
o:[email-masked]" target=3D"_blank">triumphs-bounces@autox=
.teamnet</a>&gt; <b>On Behalf Of </b>Jim Henningsen<br><b>Sent:</b> 17 Janu=
ary 2019 12:31<br><b>To:</b> <a href=3D"mailto:[email-masked]" target=3D"=
_blank">[email-masked]</a><br><b>Cc:</b> Triumphs &lt;<a href=3D"mailto:t=
[email-masked]" target=3D"_blank">[email-masked]</a>&gt;<b=
r><b>Subject:</b> Re: [TR] Paint code<u></u><u></u></p></div></div><p class=
=3D"MsoNormal">=C2=A0<u></u><u></u></p><p class=3D"MsoNormal">Bill:<u></u><=
u></u></p><div><p class=3D"MsoNormal">I have the TRA judging guide for the =
TR4 and have been using it as my plumb line for the restoration going back =
to 2010 when I purchased the car.=C2=A0 The trick is what to tell the auto =
paint store for a color to match that would be acceptable to judges.=C2=A0 =
My goal isn=E2=80=99t to beat everyone in a concours but to faithfully recr=
eate the car as it was born.=C2=A0 I am not interested in trophies.=C2=A0 O=
ver the 8 years restoring this car, s I have sometimes found it hard to get=
 info from the expert judges and respected restorers of these cars. I=E2=80=
=99d love to know more specifics on the color and or source that experts in=
 TRA think correct.=C2=A0 Also, I heard Macy=E2=80=99s Garage had an early =
TR4at the last TRA event.=C2=A0 Does anyone have any detailed photos of tha=
t car they could share.=C2=A0 The few I saw looked magnificent and they hav=
e such a great reputation. =C2=A0<u></u><u></u></p></div><div><p class=3D"M=
soNormal">Thanks so much,<u></u><u></u></p></div><div><p class=3D"MsoNormal=
" style=3D"margin-bottom:12pt">Jim Henningsen<u></u><u></u></p><div id=3D"g=
mail-m_-7582095811443505830gmail-m_1217474439255518928AppleMailSignature"><=
p class=3D"MsoNormal">Sent from my iPad<u></u><u></u></p></div><div><p clas=
s=3D"MsoNormal" style=3D"margin-bottom:12pt"><br>On Jan 16, 2019, at 10:42 =
PM, <a href=3D"mailto:[email-masked]" target=3D"_blank">[email-masked]<=
/a> &lt;<a href=3D"mailto:[email-masked]" target=3D"_blank">wbeech@flash.=
net</a>&gt; wrote:<u></u><u></u></p></div><blockquote style=3D"margin-top:5=
pt;margin-bottom:5pt"><div><div><p class=3D"MsoNormal">Judging guide Refere=
nce Should be TRA, my oversight.=C2=A0<u></u><u></u></p></div><div><p class=
=3D"MsoNormal">Bill<u></u><u></u></p></div><div><p class=3D"MsoNormal">=C2=
=A0<u></u><u></u></p></div><div><p class=3D"MsoNormal" style=3D"margin-bott=
om:12pt">On Jan 16, 2019, at 8:29 PM, <a href=3D"mailto:[email-masked]" t=
arget=3D"_blank">[email-masked]</a> &lt;<a href=3D"mailto:[email-masked]=
t" target=3D"_blank">[email-masked]</a>&gt; wrote:<u></u><u></u></p></div=
><div><p class=3D"MsoNormal">If y=E2=80=99all will allow one more =E2=80=9C=
authority=E2=80=9D to weigh in, the VTR Judging Guidlines state, =E2=80=9CT=
he canister is painted ice blue (specific color unknown) which takes a pale=
 green caste with age.=E2=80=9D<u></u><u></u></p><div><p class=3D"MsoNormal=
">=C2=A0<u></u><u></u></p></div><div><p class=3D"MsoNormal">I=E2=80=99ll st=
ick with my Valspar Peacock Blue.=C2=A0<u></u><u></u></p></div><div><p clas=
s=3D"MsoNormal">=C2=A0<u></u><u></u></p></div><div><p class=3D"MsoNormal">C=
heers,<u></u><u></u></p></div><div><p class=3D"MsoNormal" style=3D"margin-b=
ottom:12pt">Bill<u></u><u></u></p><div><p class=3D"MsoNormal">Sent from my =
Motorola 8000X<u></u><u></u></p></div><div><p class=3D"MsoNormal" style=3D"=
margin-bottom:12pt"><br>On Jan 16, 2019, at 2:09 PM, Don Hiscock &lt;<a hre=
f=3D"mailto:[email-masked]" target=3D"_blank">[email-masked]<=
/a>&gt; wrote:<u></u><u></u></p></div><div><div><div><p class=3D"MsoNormal"=
>The TR Register (UK) forum had a thread on the subject of oil filter canis=
ter housings a few years ago.<u></u><u></u></p><div><p class=3D"MsoNormal">=
<a href=3D"https://wwwtr-register.co.uk/forums/index.php?/topic/44252-oil-f=
ilter-bowl/" target=3D"_blank">https://www.tr-register.co.uk/forums/index.p=
hp?/topic/44252-oil-filter-bowl/</a><u></u><u></u></p></div><div><p class=
=3D"MsoNormal">=C2=A0<u></u><u></u></p></div><div><p class=3D"MsoNormal">No=
te especially the comments by our late, great friend Alec Pringle about his=
 experience with lots of variations and the quite realistic comment that S-=
T were a lot more worried about keeping lines going and spares supplied tha=
n getting details &quot;right&quot; around shade.<u></u><u></u></p></div><d=
iv><p class=3D"MsoNormal">=C2=A0<u></u><u></u></p></div><div><p class=3D"Ms=
oNormal">The thread has some useful info, but this is one of those don&#39;=
t-sweat-it subjects around our cars.<u></u><u></u></p></div><div><p class=
=3D"MsoNormal">=C2=A0<u></u><u></u></p></div><div><p class=3D"MsoNormal">Do=
n<u></u><u></u></p></div><div><p class=3D"MsoNormal">1962 TR3B TSF202L<u></=
u><u></u></p></div></div></div><p class=3D"MsoNormal">=C2=A0<u></u><u></u><=
/p><div><div><p class=3D"MsoNormal">On Tue, Jan 15, 2019 at 11:01 PM James =
Henningsen &lt;<a href=3D"mailto:[email-masked]" target=3D"_blank">trguy=
[email-masked]</a>&gt; wrote:<u></u><u></u></p></div><blockquote style=3D"bor=
der-top:none;border-right:none;border-bottom:none;border-left:1pt solid rgb=
(204,204,204);padding:0in 0in 0in 6pt;margin:5pt 0in 5pt 4.8pt"><p class=3D=
"MsoNormal">Anyone have a source for correct paint color on early 1962 TR4 =
oil filter canister housing.=C2=A0 TRA judging manual says ice blue that pa=
tinas to a pale green.=C2=A0 Looking for a color code I can give my paint s=
hop.=C2=A0 =C2=A0Thanks to any concours experts out there. <br>Jim Hennings=
en <br>Ocala FL<br><br><br>Sent from my iPhone<br>** <a href=3D"mailto:triu=
[email-masked]" target=3D"_blank">[email-masked]</a> **<br><b=
r>Donate: <a href=3D"http://www.team.net/donate.html" target=3D"_blank">htt=
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---

From: "[email-masked]" <[email-masked]>
Date: Sun, 10 Feb 2019 08:59:58 -0600

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Larry,
The account I heard was close to that, except that it was for sorting before=
 the engines came to the line.  I doubt the painting was done by finger, all=
 that I have seen looked like a 1=E2=80=9D brush has been used.  Sir John wa=
s known for hiring war veterans so the one armed notation my very well be tr=
ue.   John McCartney would probably be the authoritarian on these kind of th=
ings.=20
Bill

On Feb 10, 2019, at 7:06 AM, Lawarence Schwartz <[email-masked]> wrote:

Sent from my iPhone

iscock
x.team.net>
> =20
> Cheers, John
>=20
> Sent from my iPad
>=20
> On 17 Jan 2019, at 17:50, Jack McGahey <McGaheyRx@aolcom> wrote:
>=20
ing restoration.
n

l/
ubjects around our cars.
ve
[email-masked]
ve
flash.net
ve
@gmail.com
ve
[email-masked]
ve
[email-masked]
ve
ol.com

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<html><head><meta http-equiv=3D"content-type" content=3D"text/html; charset=3D=
utf-8"></head><body dir=3D"auto"><div dir=3D"ltr">Larry,</div><div dir=3D"lt=
r">The account I heard was close to that, except that it was for sorting bef=
ore the engines came to the line. &nbsp;I doubt the painting was done by fin=
ger, all that I have seen looked like a 1=E2=80=9D brush has been used. &nbs=
p;Sir John was known for hiring war veterans so the one armed notation my ve=
ry well be true. &nbsp; John McCartney would probably be the authoritarian o=
n these kind of things.&nbsp;</div><div dir=3D"ltr">Bill</div><div dir=3D"lt=
r"><br>On Feb 10, 2019, at 7:06 AM, Lawarence Schwartz &lt;<a href=3D"mailto=
:[email-masked]">[email-masked]</a>&gt; wrote:<br><br></div><div dir=3D"ltr"><=
meta http-equiv=3D"content-type" content=3D"text/html; charset=3Dutf-8">With=
 reference to the Tr3 engine &nbsp;block markings I remember reading several=
 years ago along with having conversations a Tr gatherings that at the end o=
f the engine production line there was one employee with only one arm and he=
 was responsible for writing TR 3 using just one finger which he zipped into=
 the orange red paint and scribbled the markings on the engine block. Larry S=
chwartz<br><br><div dir=3D"ltr">Sent from my iPhone</div><div dir=3D"ltr"><b=
r>On Jan 18, 2019, at 12:44 AM, wbeech &lt;<a href=3D"mailto:[email-masked]=
t">[email-masked]</a>&gt; wrote:<br><br></div><blockquote type=3D"cite"><d=
iv dir=3D"ltr"><meta http-equiv=3D"Content-Type" content=3D"text/html; chars=
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</xml><![endif]--><!--[if gte mso 9]><xml>
<o:shapelayout v:ext=3D"edit">
<o:idmap v:ext=3D"edit" data=3D"1" />
</o:shapelayout></xml><![endif]--><div class=3D"WordSection1"><p class=3D"Ms=
oNormal"><span style=3D"font-size:11.0pt;font-family:&quot;Calibri&quot;,san=
s-serif;color:#1F497D">Great picture Don, I have always re-painted the orang=
e =E2=80=9CTR3=E2=80=9D after an engine rebuild, used Chevrolet engine orang=
e.&nbsp; Had never seen the china marker markings before.<o:p></o:p></span><=
/p><p class=3D"MsoNormal"><span style=3D"font-size:11.0pt;font-family:&quot;=
Calibri&quot;,sans-serif;color:#1F497D">Bill<o:p></o:p></span></p><p class=3D=
"MsoNormal"><span style=3D"font-size:11.0pt;font-family:&quot;Calibri&quot;,=
sans-serif;color:#1F497D"><o:p>&nbsp;</o:p></span></p><p class=3D"MsoNormal"=
net">mailto:[email-masked]</a>] <b>On Behalf Of </b>Don His=
cock<br><b>Sent:</b> Thursday, January 17, 2019 5:47 PM<br><b>To:</b> John M=
com</a>&gt; wrote:<o:p></o:p></p></div><blockquote style=3D"margin-top:5.0pt=
;margin-bottom:5.0pt"><div><p class=3D"MsoNormal">I have those markings on m=
0pt"><div><div><p class=3D"MsoNormal" style=3D"mso-margin-top-alt:auto;mso-m=
argin-bottom-alt:auto">Judging guide Reference Should be TRA, my oversight.&=
nbsp;<o:p></o:p></p></div><div><p class=3D"MsoNormal" style=3D"mso-margin-to=
p-alt:auto;mso-margin-bottom-alt:auto">Bill<o:p></o:p></p></div><div><p clas=
s=3D"MsoNormal" style=3D"mso-margin-top-alt:auto;mso-margin-bottom-alt:auto"=
>&nbsp;<o:p></o:p></p></div><div><p class=3D"MsoNormal" style=3D"mso-margin-=
top-alt:auto;margin-bottom:12.0pt">On Jan 16, 2019, at 8:29 PM, <a href=3D"m=
ailto:[email-masked]" target=3D"_blank">[email-masked]</a> &lt;<a href=3D=
team.net/mailman/options/triumphs/[email-masked]">http://autox.team.net/mailm=
an/options/triumphs/[email-masked]</a></span><br></div></blockquote></div></b=
ody></html>=

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From: Stan Foster <[email-masked]>
Date: Sun, 10 Feb 2019 15:10:40 +0000

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From: Don Hiscock <[email-masked]>
Date: Sun, 10 Feb 2019 10:34:33 -0600

--===============3592020637720086029==

--00000000000077508e05818cc42b
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My April 1962 TR3B=E2=80=99s engine=E2=80=99s marshaling marks were brushed=
 for sure.

On Sunday, February 10, 2019, Stan Foster <[email-masked]> wrote:

> The few that I have seen personally have a brushed appearance. =C2=BE inc=
h
> wide, coarse brush. A one armed man can still use a brush.
>
>
>
> Stan
>
>
>
> *From:* Triumphs <[email-masked]> *On Behalf Of *Don
> Hiscock
> *Sent:* Sunday, February 10, 2019 8:25 AM
> *To:* Lawarence Schwartz <[email-masked]>
> wouldn't surprise me at all that one of those positions was marking engin=
es.
e
e
=9D after an
 look for
d
y are
n
in
tinguish
h
e
R have
 weren=E2=80=99t
ne in a
olor and
s Garage
d
 in, the VTR Judging
r unknown)
> https://www.tr-register.co.uk/forums/index.php?/topic/44252-
> oil-filter-bowl/
wl/>
at
e
y
> Unsubscribe/Manage: http://autoxteam.net/mailman/
> options/triumphs/[email-masked]
> Unsubscribe/Manage: http://autox.team.net/mailman/
> options/triumphs/[email-masked]
>
> Unsubscribe/Manage: http://autox.team.net/mailman/
> options/triumphs/[email-masked]
>
>
>
> [image:
> https://ipmcdn.avast.com/images/icons/icon-envelope-tick-round-orange-ani=
mated-no-repeat-v1.gif]
> Unsubscribe/Manage: http://autox.team.net/mailman/
> options/triumphs/[email-masked]
>
> Unsubscribe/Manage: http://autoxteam.net/mailman/
> options/triumphs/[email-masked]
> Unsubscribe/Manage: http://autox.team.net/mailman/
> options/triumphs/[email-masked]
>
>

--00000000000077508e05818cc42b
Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable

My April 1962 TR3B=E2=80=99s engine=E2=80=99s marshaling marks were brushed=
 for sure.=C2=A0<br><br>On Sunday, February 10, 2019, Stan Foster &lt;<a hr=
ef=3D"mailto:[email-masked]">[email-masked]</a>&gt; wrote:<br><blockquote=
 class=3D"gmail_quote" style=3D"margin:0 0 0 .8ex;border-left:1px #ccc soli=
d;padding-left:1ex">

<div lang=3D"EN-US" link=3D"blue" vlink=3D"purple">
<div>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal">The few that I have seen personally have a brushed a=
ppearance. =C2=BE inch wide, coarse brush. A one armed man can still use a =
brush.<u></u><u></u></p>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal"><u></u>=C2=A0<u></u></p>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal">Stan<u></u><u></u></p>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal"><u></u>=C2=A0<u></u></p>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal"><b>From:</b> Triumphs &lt;<a href=3D"mailto:triumphs=
[email-masked]" target=3D"_blank">[email-masked].<wbr=
>net</a>&gt; <b>On Behalf Of
</b>Don Hiscock<br>
<b>Sent:</b> Sunday, February 10, 2019 8:25 AM<br>
<b>To:</b> Lawarence Schwartz &lt;<a href=3D"mailto:[email-masked]" target=
=3D"_blank">[email-masked]</a>&gt;<br>
<b>Cc:</b> Triumphs &lt;<a href=3D"mailto:[email-masked]" target=
=3D"_blank">[email-masked]</a>&gt;<br>
<b>Subject:</b> Re: [TR] Paint code<u></u><u></u></p>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal"><u></u>=C2=A0<u></u></p>
<div>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal">Perhaps our forum friend John Macartney canl come in=
 with more and better information, but Sir John Black made a real commitmen=
t to disabled war vets.=C2=A0 S-T found productive work for many, for years=
 and years.=C2=A0 It wouldn&#39;t surprise me at
 all that one of those positions was marking engines.<u></u><u></u></p>
<div>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal"><u></u>=C2=A0<u></u></p>
</div>
<div>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal">Don<u></u><u></u></p>
</div>
<div>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal">1962 TR3B TSF202L<u></u><u></u></p>
</div>
</div>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal"><u></u>=C2=A0<u></u></p>
<div>
<div>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal">On Sun, Feb 10, 2019 at 7:06 AM Lawarence Schwartz &=
lt;<a href=3D"mailto:[email-masked]" target=3D"_blank">[email-masked]</a>&gt;=
 wrote:<u></u><u></u></p>
</div>
<blockquote style=3D"border:none;border-left:solid #cccccc 1.0pt;padding:0i=
n 0in 0in 6.0pt;margin-left:4.8pt;margin-right:0in">
<div>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal" style=3D"margin-bottom:12.0pt">With reference to the=
 Tr3 engine =C2=A0block markings I remember reading several years ago along=
 with having conversations a Tr gatherings that at the end of the engine pr=
oduction line there was one employee with
 only one arm and he was responsible for writing TR 3 using just one finger=
 which he zipped into the orange red paint and scribbled the markings on th=
e engine block. Larry Schwartz<u></u><u></u></p>
<div>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal">Sent from my iPhone<u></u><u></u></p>
</div>
<div>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal" style=3D"margin-bottom:12.0pt"><br>
On Jan 18, 2019, at 12:44 AM, wbeech &lt;<a href=3D"mailto:[email-masked]=
" target=3D"_blank">[email-masked]</a>&gt; wrote:<u></u><u></u></p>
</div>
<blockquote style=3D"margin-top:5.0pt;margin-bottom:5.0pt">
<div>
<div>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal"><span style=3D"color:#1f497d">Great picture Don, I h=
ave always re-painted the orange =E2=80=9CTR3=E2=80=9D after an engine rebu=
ild, used Chevrolet engine orange.=C2=A0 Had never seen the china marker
 markings before.</span><u></u><u></u></p>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal"><span style=3D"color:#1f497d">Bill</span><u></u><u><=
/u></p>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal"><span style=3D"color:#1f497d">=C2=A0</span><u></u><u=
></u></p>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal"><b>From:</b> Triumphs [<a href=3D"mailto:triumphs-bo=
[email-masked]" target=3D"_blank">mailto:triumphs-bounces@<wbr>autox.=
team.net</a>]
<b>On Behalf Of </b>Don Hiscock<br>
<b>Sent:</b> Thursday, January 17, 2019 5:47 PM<br>
<b>To:</b> John Macartney &lt;<a href=3D"mailto:[email-masked]=
k" target=3D"_blank">[email-masked]</a>&gt;<wbr>; Triumphs &l=
t;<a href=3D"mailto:[email-masked]" target=3D"_blank">triumphs@aut=
ox.team.net</a>&gt;<br>
<b>Subject:</b> Re: [TR] Paint code<u></u><u></u></p>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal">=C2=A0<u></u><u></u></p>
<div>
<div>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal">Here&#39;s an image of the Coventry assembly line ta=
ken by a member of the tour group on Triumph USA&#39;s 1958 Rally of Europe=
 for new owners who took their delivery at the factory and
 toured the Continent.=C2=A0 One can see some of the various marshalling ma=
rks on the engines ready to be used on the line.<u></u><u></u></p>
<div>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal"><a href=3D"https://photos.smugmug.com/photos/i-b5Krz=
K2/0/86ac2744/O/i-b5KrzK2.jpg" target=3D"_blank">https://photos.smugmug.com=
/<wbr>photos/i-b5KrzK2/0/86ac2744/O/<wbr>i-b5KrzK2.jpg</a><u></u><u></u></p=
</div>
</div>
</div>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal">=C2=A0<u></u><u></u></p>
<div>
<div>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal">On Thu, Jan 17, 2019 at 5:38 PM John Macartney &lt;<=
a href=3D"mailto:[email-masked]" target=3D"_blank">John.Macar=
[email-masked]</a>&gt; wrote:<u></u><u></u></p>
</div>
<blockquote style=3D"border:none;border-left:solid #cccccc 1.0pt;padding:0i=
n 0in 0in 6.0pt;margin-left:4.8pt;margin-top:5.0pt;margin-right:0in;margin-=
bottom:5.0pt">
<div>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal">Thing is Jack, that this far down the track, no one =
knows! In fact, I doubt the majority of people at the factory did either:)<=
u></u><u></u></p>
<div>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal">=C2=A0<u></u><u></u></p>
</div>
<div>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal" style=3D"margin-bottom:12.0pt">Cheers, John<u></u><u=
></u></p>
<div>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal">Sent from my iPad<u></u><u></u></p>
</div>
<div>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal" style=3D"margin-bottom:12.0pt"><br>
On 17 Jan 2019, at 17:50, Jack McGahey &lt;<a href=3D"mailto:McGaheyRx@aol.=
com" target=3D"_blank">[email-masked]</a>&gt; wrote:<u></u><u></u></p>
</div>
<blockquote style=3D"margin-top:5.0pt;margin-bottom:5.0pt">
<div>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal">I have those markings on my TR6 block - reapplied af=
ter engine rebuild during restoration.<u></u><u></u></p>
<div>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal">=C2=A0<u></u><u></u></p>
</div>
<div>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal">I can=E2=80=99t speak about TRA, but I can say that =
neither VTR or 6-pack look for these markings, or deduct for their absence,=
 during Concours judging - and I=E2=80=99ve never heard anybody say
 they knew what they meant or why they are there.=C2=A0<u></u><u></u></p>
</div>
<div>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal">=C2=A0<u></u><u></u></p>
</div>
<div>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal">Cheers,<u></u><u></u></p>
</div>
<div>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal" style=3D"margin-bottom:12.0pt">Jack Mc<u></u><u></u>=
</p>
<div>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal">Sent from my iPad<u></u><u></u></p>
</div>
<div>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal" style=3D"margin-bottom:12.0pt"><br>
On Jan 17, 2019, at 9:27 AM, John Macartney &lt;<a href=3D"mailto:john.maca=
[email-masked]" target=3D"_blank">[email-masked]</a>&gt;=
 wrote:<u></u><u></u></p>
</div>
<blockquote style=3D"margin-top:5.0pt;margin-bottom:5.0pt">
<div>
<div>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal">Jim<u></u><u></u></p>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal">=C2=A0<u></u><u></u></p>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal">In the rebuild of your car, did you by chance find a=
ny obscure markings in yellow or white chinagraph chalk on the engine block=
? These were common identifiers used at the factory
 that were understood by those who worked in engine assembly =E2=80=93 but =
no-one else. Primarily, the mark was to distinguish the machined but unasse=
mbled block as being an ultimate engine for a North America spec car. Not a=
ll the blocks had these marks but I do know
 many others have encountered them years later and wondered what the hell t=
hey were. Being anxious to replicate what had been there after re-painting =
the block, they replaced the code. I=E2=80=99d be very surprised if TRA or =
VTR have extra marks in their judging books
 =E2=80=93 or even deduct marks if they weren=E2=80=99t there.<u></u><u></u=
></p>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal">=C2=A0<u></u><u></u></p>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal">Cheers, Jonmac<u></u><u></u></p>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal">=C2=A0<u></u><u></u></p>
<div>
<div style=3D"border:none;border-top:solid #e1e1e1 1.0pt;padding:3.0pt 0in =
0in 0in">
<p class=3D"MsoNormal"><b>From:</b> Triumphs &lt;<a href=3D"mailto:triumphs=
[email-masked]" target=3D"_blank">triumphs-bounces@autox.<wbr>team=
net</a>&gt;
<b>On Behalf Of </b>Jim Henningsen<br>
<b>Sent:</b> 17 January 2019 12:31<br>
<b>To:</b> <a href=3D"mailto:[email-masked]" target=3D"_blank">wbeech@fla=
sh.net</a><br>
<b>Cc:</b> Triumphs &lt;<a href=3D"mailto:[email-masked]" target=
=3D"_blank">[email-masked]</a>&gt;<br>
<b>Subject:</b> Re: [TR] Paint code<u></u><u></u></p>
</div>
</div>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal">=C2=A0<u></u><u></u></p>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal">Bill:<u></u><u></u></p>
<div>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal">I have the TRA judging guide for the TR4 and have be=
en using it as my plumb line for the restoration going back to 2010 when I =
purchased the car.=C2=A0 The trick is what to tell the
 auto paint store for a color to match that would be acceptable to judges.=
=C2=A0 My goal isn=E2=80=99t to beat everyone in a concours but to faithful=
ly recreate the car as it was born.=C2=A0 I am not interested in trophies.=
=C2=A0 Over the 8 years restoring this car, s I have sometimes
 found it hard to get info from the expert judges and respected restorers o=
f these cars. I=E2=80=99d love to know more specifics on the color and or s=
ource that experts in TRA think correct.=C2=A0 Also, I heard Macy=E2=80=99s=
 Garage had an early TR4at the last TRA event.=C2=A0 Does
 anyone have any detailed photos of that car they could share.=C2=A0 The fe=
w I saw looked magnificent and they have such a great reputation. =C2=A0<u>=
</u><u></u></p>
</div>
<div>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal">Thanks so much,<u></u><u></u></p>
</div>
<div>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal" style=3D"margin-bottom:12.0pt">Jim Henningsen<u></u>=
<u></u></p>
<div>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal">Sent from my iPad<u></u><u></u></p>
</div>
<div>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal" style=3D"margin-bottom:12.0pt"><br>
On Jan 16, 2019, at 10:42 PM, <a href=3D"mailto:[email-masked]" target=3D=
"_blank">[email-masked]</a> &lt;<a href=3D"mailto:[email-masked]" targe=
t=3D"_blank">[email-masked]</a>&gt; wrote:<u></u><u></u></p>
</div>
<blockquote style=3D"margin-top:5.0pt;margin-bottom:5.0pt">
<div>
<div>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal">Judging guide Reference Should be TRA, my oversight.=
=C2=A0<u></u><u></u></p>
</div>
<div>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal">Bill<u></u><u></u></p>
</div>
<div>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal">=C2=A0<u></u><u></u></p>
</div>
<div>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal" style=3D"margin-bottom:12.0pt">On Jan 16, 2019, at 8=
:29 PM,
<a href=3D"mailto:[email-masked]" target=3D"_blank">[email-masked]</a> =
&lt;<a href=3D"mailto:[email-masked]" target=3D"_blank">[email-masked]<=
/a>&gt; wrote:<u></u><u></u></p>
</div>
<div>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal">If y=E2=80=99all will allow one more =E2=80=9Cauthor=
ity=E2=80=9D to weigh in, the VTR Judging Guidlines state, =E2=80=9CThe can=
ister is painted ice blue (specific color unknown) which takes a pale green=
 caste
 with age.=E2=80=9D<u></u><u></u></p>
<div>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal">=C2=A0<u></u><u></u></p>
</div>
<div>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal">I=E2=80=99ll stick with my Valspar Peacock Blue.=C2=
=A0<u></u><u></u></p>
</div>
<div>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal">=C2=A0<u></u><u></u></p>
</div>
<div>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal">Cheers,<u></u><u></u></p>
</div>
<div>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal" style=3D"margin-bottom:12.0pt">Bill<u></u><u></u></p=
<div>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal">Sent from my Motorola 8000X<u></u><u></u></p>
</div>
<div>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal" style=3D"margin-bottom:12.0pt"><br>
On Jan 16, 2019, at 2:09 PM, Don Hiscock &lt;<a href=3D"mailto:don.hiscock@=
gmail.com" target=3D"_blank">[email-masked]</a>&gt; wrote:<u></u><u>=
</u></p>
</div>
<div>
<div>
<div>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal">The TR Register (UK) forum had a thread on the subje=
ct of oil filter canister housings a few years ago.<u></u><u></u></p>
<div>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal"><a href=3D"https://wwwtr-register.co.uk/forums/index=
.php?/topic/44252-oil-filter-bowl/" target=3D"_blank">https://www.tr-regist=
er.co.uk/<wbr>forums/index.php?/topic/44252-<wbr>oil-filter-bowl/</a><u></u=
><u></u></p>
</div>
<div>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal">=C2=A0<u></u><u></u></p>
</div>
<div>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal">Note especially the comments by our late, great frie=
nd Alec Pringle about his experience with lots of variations and the quite =
realistic comment that S-T were a lot more worried
 about keeping lines going and spares supplied than getting details &quot;r=
ight&quot; around shade.<u></u><u></u></p>
</div>
<div>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal">=C2=A0<u></u><u></u></p>
</div>
<div>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal">The thread has some useful info, but this is one of =
those don&#39;t-sweat-it subjects around our cars.<u></u><u></u></p>
</div>
<div>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal">=C2=A0<u></u><u></u></p>
</div>
<div>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal">Don<u></u><u></u></p>
</div>
<div>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal">1962 TR3B TSF202L<u></u><u></u></p>
</div>
</div>
</div>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal">=C2=A0<u></u><u></u></p>
<div>
<div>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal">On Tue, Jan 15, 2019 at 11:01 PM James Henningsen &l=
t;<a href=3D"mailto:[email-masked]" target=3D"_blank">[email-masked]<=
/a>&gt; wrote:<u></u><u></u></p>
</div>
<blockquote style=3D"border:none;border-left:solid #cccccc 1.0pt;padding:0i=
n 0in 0in 6.0pt;margin-left:4.8pt;margin-top:5.0pt;margin-right:0in;margin-=
bottom:5.0pt">
<p class=3D"MsoNormal">Anyone have a source for correct paint color on earl=
y 1962 TR4 oil filter canister housing.=C2=A0 TRA judging manual says ice b=
lue that patinas to a pale green.=C2=A0 Looking for a color
 code I can give my paint shop.=C2=A0 =C2=A0Thanks to any concours experts =
out there. <br>
Jim Henningsen <br>
Ocala FL<br>
<br>
<br>
Sent from my iPhone<br>
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--00000000000077508e05818cc42b--

--===============3592020637720086029==
Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit
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--===============3592020637720086029==--

---

From: John Macartney <[email-masked]>
Date: Sun, 10 Feb 2019 21:45:48 +0000

--===============8314103180213086276==
	boundary=Apple-Mail-08BECC04-C6EE-4818-A147-B0A7F13DA649
Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit

--Apple-Mail-08BECC04-C6EE-4818-A147-B0A7F13DA649
	charset=utf-8
Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable

Makes me laugh sometimes when this lore comes back. Ye gods, Standard could a=
fford to provide a one armed war wounded man a paintbrush!!!
What so many over the pond continuously fail to appreciate when it comes to t=
he wet liner four pot is that the block was common to many different uses. T=
he basic block appeared in the TR, Vanguard, Ensign, Leyland 15 and 20 later=
 on and in differing sizes for industrial applications. One basic block, man=
y different engine types! The =E2=80=9Cpaint codes, colours and shapes=E2=80=
=9D were worked out by engine assembly people in line with engine build shee=
ts. They knew what they were doing and as long as the correct unit was built=
, no one else worried.
The story about Sir John Black and returning servicemen is another affair of=
 equal import. I wrote it out for TVT some years ago but someone chopped lum=
ps out of it and I vetoed the print because it gave a rather different and b=
y no means as comprehensive account, and skewed the narrative to Black=E2=80=
=99s disadvantage.

Jonmac

Sent from my iPad

> On 10 Feb 2019, at 16:34, Don Hiscock <[email-masked]> wrote:
>=20
> My April 1962 TR3B=E2=80=99s engine=E2=80=99s marshaling marks were brushe=
d for sure.=20
>> The few that I have seen personally have a brushed appearance. =C2=BE inc=
h wide, coarse brush. A one armed man can still use a brush.
>>=20
>> =20
>>=20
>> Stan
>>=20
>> =20
>>=20
>> From: Triumphs <[email-masked]> On Behalf Of Don Hiscock=

>> Sent: Sunday, February 10, 2019 8:25 AM
>> To: Lawarence Schwartz <[email-masked]>
>> Perhaps our forum friend John Macartney canl come in with more and better=
 information, but Sir John Black made a real commitment to disabled war vets=
.  S-T found productive work for many, for years and years.  It wouldn't sur=
prise me at all that one of those positions was marking engines.
>>=20
>> =20
>>=20
>> Don
>>=20
>> 1962 TR3B TSF202L
>>=20
>> =20
>>=20
>> On Sun, Feb 10, 2019 at 7:06 AM Lawarence Schwartz <[email-masked]> wrote:=

>>=20
>> With reference to the Tr3 engine  block markings I remember reading sever=
al years ago along with having conversations a Tr gatherings that at the end=
 of the engine production line there was one employee with only one arm and h=
e was responsible for writing TR 3 using just one finger which he zipped int=
o the orange red paint and scribbled the markings on the engine block. Larry=
 Schwartz
>> Great picture Don, I have always re-painted the orange =E2=80=9CTR3=E2=80=
=9D after an engine rebuild, used Chevrolet engine orange.  Had never seen t=
he china marker markings before.
iscock
>> To: John Macartney <[email-masked]>; Triumphs <triumphs@aut=
ox.team.net>
>> Here's an image of the Coventry assembly line taken by a member of the to=
ur group on Triumph USA's 1958 Rally of Europe for new owners who took their=
 delivery at the factory and toured the Continent.  One can see some of the v=
arious marshalling marks on the engines ready to be used on the line.
>> On Thu, Jan 17, 2019 at 5:38 PM John Macartney <[email-masked]=
.uk> wrote:
>>=20
>> Thing is Jack, that this far down the track, no one knows! In fact, I dou=
bt the majority of people at the factory did either:)
>> I have those markings on my TR6 block - reapplied after engine rebuild du=
ring restoration.
>> I can=E2=80=99t speak about TRA, but I can say that neither VTR or 6-pack=
 look for these markings, or deduct for their absence, during Concours judgi=
ng - and I=E2=80=99ve never heard anybody say they knew what they meant or w=
hy they are there.=20
>> In the rebuild of your car, did you by chance find any obscure markings i=
n yellow or white chinagraph chalk on the engine block? These were common id=
entifiers used at the factory that were understood by those who worked in en=
gine assembly =E2=80=93 but no-one else. Primarily, the mark was to distingu=
ish the machined but unassembled block as being an ultimate engine for a Nor=
th America spec car. Not all the blocks had these marks but I do know many o=
thers have encountered them years later and wondered what the hell they were=
. Being anxious to replicate what had been there after re-painting the block=
, they replaced the code. I=E2=80=99d be very surprised if TRA or VTR have e=
xtra marks in their judging books =E2=80=93 or even deduct marks if they wer=
en=E2=80=99t there.
>>=20
>> =20
>>=20
>> Cheers, Jonmac
>>=20
>> =20
>>=20
>> From: Triumphs <[email-masked]> On Behalf Of Jim Hennings=
en
>> I have the TRA judging guide for the TR4 and have been using it as my plu=
mb line for the restoration going back to 2010 when I purchased the car.  Th=
e trick is what to tell the auto paint store for a color to match that would=
 be acceptable to judges.  My goal isn=E2=80=99t to beat everyone in a conco=
urs but to faithfully recreate the car as it was born.  I am not interested i=
n trophies.  Over the 8 years restoring this car, s I have sometimes found i=
t hard to get info from the expert judges and respected restorers of these c=
ars. I=E2=80=99d love to know more specifics on the color and or source that=
 experts in TRA think correct.  Also, I heard Macy=E2=80=99s Garage had an e=
arly TR4at the last TRA event.  Does anyone have any detailed photos of that=
 car they could share.  The few I saw looked magnificent and they have such a=
 great reputation. =20
>> If y=E2=80=99all will allow one more =E2=80=9Cauthority=E2=80=9D to weigh=
 in, the VTR Judging Guidlines state, =E2=80=9CThe canister is painted ice b=
lue (specific color unknown) which takes a pale green caste with age.=E2=80=9D=

>> The TR Register (UK) forum had a thread on the subject of oil filter cani=
ster housings a few years ago.
wl/
>>=20
>> =20
>>=20
>> Note especially the comments by our late, great friend Alec Pringle about=
 his experience with lots of variations and the quite realistic comment that=
 S-T were a lot more worried about keeping lines going and spares supplied t=
han getting details "right" around shade.
ubjects around our cars.
>>=20
>> =20
>>=20
>> Don
>>=20
>> 1962 TR3B TSF202L
>>=20
>> =20
>>=20
>> On Tue, Jan 15, 2019 at 11:01 PM James Henningsen <[email-masked]> wro=
te:
>>=20
>> Anyone have a source for correct paint color on early 1962 TR4 oil filter=
 canister housing.  TRA judging manual says ice blue that patinas to a pale g=
reen.  Looking for a color code I can give my paint shop.   Thanks to any co=
ncours experts out there.=20
>> Archive: http://www.team.net/pipermail/triumphs  http://www.team.net/arch=
ive
>>=20
>> Unsubscribe/Manage: http://autoxteam.net/mailman/options/triumphs/don.his=
[email-masked]
>> Archive: http://www.team.net/pipermail/triumphs  http://www.team.net/arch=
ive
>>=20
>> Unsubscribe/Manage: http://autox.team.net/mailman/options/triumphs/wbeech=
@flash.net
>> Archive: http://www.team.net/pipermail/triumphs  http://www.team.net/arch=
ive
>>=20
>> Unsubscribe/Manage: http://autox.team.net/mailman/options/triumphs/trguy7=
[email-masked]
>> Archive: http://www.team.net/pipermail/triumphs  http://www.team.net/arch=
ive
>>=20
>> Unsubscribe/Manage: http://autox.team.net/mailman/options/triumphs/mcgahe=
[email-masked]
>> Archive: http://www.team.net/pipermail/triumphs  http://www.team.net/arch=
ive
>>=20
>> Unsubscribe/Manage: http://autoxteam.net/mailman/options/triumphs/don.his=
[email-masked]
>> Archive: http://www.team.net/pipermail/triumphs  http://www.team.net/arch=
ive
>>=20
>> Unsubscribe/Manage: http://autox.team.net/mailman/options/triumphs/l1j1s@=
aol.com
ve
>=20
> Unsubscribe/Manage: http://autox.team.net/mailman/options/triumphs/john.ma=
[email-masked]

--Apple-Mail-08BECC04-C6EE-4818-A147-B0A7F13DA649
	charset=utf-8
Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable

<html><head><meta http-equiv=3D"content-type" content=3D"text/html; charset=3D=
utf-8"></head><body dir=3D"auto">Makes me laugh sometimes when this lore com=
es back. Ye gods, Standard could afford to provide a one armed war wounded m=
an a paintbrush!!!<div>What so many over the pond continuously fail to appre=
ciate when it comes to the wet liner four pot is that the block was common t=
o many different uses. The basic block appeared in the TR, Vanguard, Ensign,=
 Leyland 15 and 20 later on and in differing sizes for industrial applicatio=
ns. One basic block, many different engine types! The =E2=80=9Cpaint codes, c=
olours and shapes=E2=80=9D were worked out by engine assembly people in line=
 with engine build sheets. They knew what they were doing and as long as the=
 correct unit was built, no one else worried.</div><div>The story about Sir J=
ohn Black and returning servicemen is another affair of equal import. I wrot=
e it out for TVT some years ago but someone chopped lumps out of it and I ve=
toed the print because it gave a rather different and by no means as compreh=
ensive account, and skewed the narrative to Black=E2=80=99s disadvantage.</d=
iv><div><br></div><div>Jonmac<br><br><div id=3D"AppleMailSignature" dir=3D"l=
tr">Sent from my iPad</div><div dir=3D"ltr"><br>On 10 Feb 2019, at 16:34, Do=
n Hiscock &lt;<a href=3D"mailto:[email-masked]">[email-masked]=
</a>&gt; wrote:<br><br></div><blockquote type=3D"cite"><div dir=3D"ltr">My A=
pril 1962 TR3B=E2=80=99s engine=E2=80=99s marshaling marks were brushed for s=
ure.&nbsp;<br><br>On Sunday, February 10, 2019, Stan Foster &lt;<a href=3D"m=
ailto:[email-masked]">[email-masked]</a>&gt; wrote:<br><blockquote class=3D=
"gmail_quote" style=3D"margin:0 0 0 .8ex;border-left:1px #ccc solid;padding-=
left:1ex">

<div lang=3D"EN-US" link=3D"blue" vlink=3D"purple">
<div>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal">The few that I have seen personally have a brushed ap=
pearance. =C2=BE inch wide, coarse brush. A one armed man can still use a br=
ush.<u></u><u></u></p>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal"><u></u>&nbsp;<u></u></p>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal">Stan<u></u><u></u></p>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal"><u></u>&nbsp;<u></u></p>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal"><b>From:</b> Triumphs &lt;<a href=3D"mailto:triumphs-=
[email-masked]" target=3D"_blank">[email-masked].<wbr>n=
et</a>&gt; <b>On Behalf Of
</b>Don Hiscock<br>
<b>Sent:</b> Sunday, February 10, 2019 8:25 AM<br>
<b>To:</b> Lawarence Schwartz &lt;<a href=3D"mailto:[email-masked]" target=3D=
"_blank">[email-masked]</a>&gt;<br>
<b>Cc:</b> Triumphs &lt;<a href=3D"mailto:[email-masked]" target=3D=
"_blank">[email-masked]</a>&gt;<br>
<b>Subject:</b> Re: [TR] Paint code<u></u><u></u></p>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal"><u></u>&nbsp;<u></u></p>
<div>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal">Perhaps our forum friend John Macartney canl come in w=
ith more and better information, but Sir John Black made a real commitment t=
o disabled war vets.&nbsp; S-T found productive work for many, for years and=
 years.&nbsp; It wouldn't surprise me at
 all that one of those positions was marking engines.<u></u><u></u></p>
<div>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal"><u></u>&nbsp;<u></u></p>
</div>
<div>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal">Don<u></u><u></u></p>
</div>
<div>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal">1962 TR3B TSF202L<u></u><u></u></p>
</div>
</div>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal"><u></u>&nbsp;<u></u></p>
<div>
<div>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal">On Sun, Feb 10, 2019 at 7:06 AM Lawarence Schwartz &l=
t;<a href=3D"mailto:[email-masked]" target=3D"_blank">[email-masked]</a>&gt; w=
rote:<u></u><u></u></p>
</div>
<blockquote style=3D"border:none;border-left:solid #cccccc 1.0pt;padding:0in=
 0in 0in 6.0pt;margin-left:4.8pt;margin-right:0in">
<div>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal" style=3D"margin-bottom:12.0pt">With reference to the T=
r3 engine &nbsp;block markings I remember reading several years ago along wi=
th having conversations a Tr gatherings that at the end of the engine produc=
tion line there was one employee with
 only one arm and he was responsible for writing TR 3 using just one finger w=
hich he zipped into the orange red paint and scribbled the markings on the e=
ngine block. Larry Schwartz<u></u><u></u></p>
<div>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal">Sent from my iPhone<u></u><u></u></p>
</div>
<div>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal" style=3D"margin-bottom:12.0pt"><br>
On Jan 18, 2019, at 12:44 AM, wbeech &lt;<a href=3D"mailto:[email-masked]"=
 target=3D"_blank">[email-masked]</a>&gt; wrote:<u></u><u></u></p>
</div>
<blockquote style=3D"margin-top:5.0pt;margin-bottom:5.0pt">
<div>
<div>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal"><span style=3D"color:#1f497d">Great picture Don, I ha=
ve always re-painted the orange =E2=80=9CTR3=E2=80=9D after an engine rebuil=
d, used Chevrolet engine orange.&nbsp; Had never seen the china marker
 markings before.</span><u></u><u></u></p>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal"><span style=3D"color:#1f497d">Bill</span><u></u><u></=
u></p>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal"><span style=3D"color:#1f497d">&nbsp;</span><u></u><u>=
</u></p>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal"><b>From:</b> Triumphs [<a href=3D"mailto:triumphs-bou=
[email-masked]" target=3D"_blank">mailto:triumphs-bounces@<wbr>autox.te=
am.net</a>]
<b>On Behalf Of </b>Don Hiscock<br>
<b>Sent:</b> Thursday, January 17, 2019 5:47 PM<br>
<b>To:</b> John Macartney &lt;<a href=3D"mailto:[email-masked]=
" target=3D"_blank">[email-masked]</a>&gt;<wbr>; Triumphs &lt;=
<a href=3D"mailto:[email-masked]" target=3D"_blank">triumphs@autox.=
team.net</a>&gt;<br>
<b>Subject:</b> Re: [TR] Paint code<u></u><u></u></p>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal">&nbsp;<u></u><u></u></p>
<div>
<div>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal">Here's an image of the Coventry assembly line taken b=
y a member of the tour group on Triumph USA's 1958 Rally of Europe for new o=
wners who took their delivery at the factory and
 toured the Continent.&nbsp; One can see some of the various marshalling mar=
ks on the engines ready to be used on the line.<u></u><u></u></p>
<div>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal"><a href=3D"https://photos.smugmug.com/photos/i-b5KrzK=
2/0/86ac2744/O/i-b5KrzK2.jpg" target=3D"_blank">https://photos.smugmug.com/<=
wbr>photos/i-b5KrzK2/0/86ac2744/O/<wbr>i-b5KrzK2.jpg</a><u></u><u></u></p>
</div>
</div>
</div>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal">&nbsp;<u></u><u></u></p>
<div>
<div>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal">On Thu, Jan 17, 2019 at 5:38 PM John Macartney &lt;<a=
 href=3D"mailto:[email-masked]" target=3D"_blank">John.Macartn=
[email-masked]</a>&gt; wrote:<u></u><u></u></p>
</div>
<blockquote style=3D"border:none;border-left:solid #cccccc 1.0pt;padding:0in=
 0in 0in 6.0pt;margin-left:4.8pt;margin-top:5.0pt;margin-right:0in;margin-bo=
ttom:5.0pt">
<div>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal">Thing is Jack, that this far down the track, no one k=
nows! In fact, I doubt the majority of people at the factory did either:)<u>=
</u><u></u></p>
<div>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal">&nbsp;<u></u><u></u></p>
</div>
<div>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal" style=3D"margin-bottom:12.0pt">Cheers, John<u></u><u>=
</u></p>
<div>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal">Sent from my iPad<u></u><u></u></p>
</div>
<div>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal" style=3D"margin-bottom:12.0pt"><br>
On 17 Jan 2019, at 17:50, Jack McGahey &lt;<a href=3D"mailto:[email-masked]=
om" target=3D"_blank">[email-masked]</a>&gt; wrote:<u></u><u></u></p>
</div>
<blockquote style=3D"margin-top:5.0pt;margin-bottom:5.0pt">
<div>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal">I have those markings on my TR6 block - reapplied aft=
er engine rebuild during restoration.<u></u><u></u></p>
<div>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal">&nbsp;<u></u><u></u></p>
</div>
<div>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal">I can=E2=80=99t speak about TRA, but I can say that n=
either VTR or 6-pack look for these markings, or deduct for their absence, d=
uring Concours judging - and I=E2=80=99ve never heard anybody say
 they knew what they meant or why they are there.&nbsp;<u></u><u></u></p>
</div>
<div>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal">&nbsp;<u></u><u></u></p>
</div>
<div>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal">Cheers,<u></u><u></u></p>
</div>
<div>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal" style=3D"margin-bottom:12.0pt">Jack Mc<u></u><u></u><=
/p>
<div>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal">Sent from my iPad<u></u><u></u></p>
</div>
<div>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal" style=3D"margin-bottom:12.0pt"><br>
On Jan 17, 2019, at 9:27 AM, John Macartney &lt;<a href=3D"mailto:john.macar=
[email-masked]" target=3D"_blank">[email-masked]</a>&gt; w=
rote:<u></u><u></u></p>
</div>
<blockquote style=3D"margin-top:5.0pt;margin-bottom:5.0pt">
<div>
<div>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal">Jim<u></u><u></u></p>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal">&nbsp;<u></u><u></u></p>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal">In the rebuild of your car, did you by chance find an=
y obscure markings in yellow or white chinagraph chalk on the engine block? T=
hese were common identifiers used at the factory
 that were understood by those who worked in engine assembly =E2=80=93 but n=
o-one else. Primarily, the mark was to distinguish the machined but unassemb=
led block as being an ultimate engine for a North America spec car. Not all t=
he blocks had these marks but I do know
 many others have encountered them years later and wondered what the hell th=
ey were. Being anxious to replicate what had been there after re-painting th=
e block, they replaced the code. I=E2=80=99d be very surprised if TRA or VTR=
 have extra marks in their judging books
 =E2=80=93 or even deduct marks if they weren=E2=80=99t there.<u></u><u></u>=
</p>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal">&nbsp;<u></u><u></u></p>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal">Cheers, Jonmac<u></u><u></u></p>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal">&nbsp;<u></u><u></u></p>
<div>
<div style=3D"border:none;border-top:solid #e1e1e1 1.0pt;padding:3.0pt 0in 0=
in 0in">
<p class=3D"MsoNormal"><b>From:</b> Triumphs &lt;<a href=3D"mailto:triumphs-=
[email-masked]" target=3D"_blank">triumphs-bounces@autox.<wbr>teamne=
t</a>&gt;
<b>On Behalf Of </b>Jim Henningsen<br>
<b>Sent:</b> 17 January 2019 12:31<br>
<b>To:</b> <a href=3D"mailto:[email-masked]" target=3D"_blank">wbeech@flas=
h.net</a><br>
<b>Cc:</b> Triumphs &lt;<a href=3D"mailto:[email-masked]" target=3D=
"_blank">[email-masked]</a>&gt;<br>
<b>Subject:</b> Re: [TR] Paint code<u></u><u></u></p>
</div>
</div>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal">&nbsp;<u></u><u></u></p>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal">Bill:<u></u><u></u></p>
<div>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal">I have the TRA judging guide for the TR4 and have bee=
n using it as my plumb line for the restoration going back to 2010 when I pu=
rchased the car.&nbsp; The trick is what to tell the
 auto paint store for a color to match that would be acceptable to judges.&n=
bsp; My goal isn=E2=80=99t to beat everyone in a concours but to faithfully r=
ecreate the car as it was born.&nbsp; I am not interested in trophies.&nbsp;=
 Over the 8 years restoring this car, s I have sometimes
 found it hard to get info from the expert judges and respected restorers of=
 these cars. I=E2=80=99d love to know more specifics on the color and or sou=
rce that experts in TRA think correct.&nbsp; Also, I heard Macy=E2=80=99s Ga=
rage had an early TR4at the last TRA event.&nbsp; Does
 anyone have any detailed photos of that car they could share.&nbsp; The few=
 I saw looked magnificent and they have such a great reputation. &nbsp;<u></=
u><u></u></p>
</div>
<div>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal">Thanks so much,<u></u><u></u></p>
</div>
<div>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal" style=3D"margin-bottom:12.0pt">Jim Henningsen<u></u><=
u></u></p>
<div>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal">Sent from my iPad<u></u><u></u></p>
</div>
<div>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal" style=3D"margin-bottom:12.0pt"><br>
On Jan 16, 2019, at 10:42 PM, <a href=3D"mailto:[email-masked]" target=3D"=
_blank">[email-masked]</a> &lt;<a href=3D"mailto:[email-masked]" target=3D=
"_blank">[email-masked]</a>&gt; wrote:<u></u><u></u></p>
</div>
<blockquote style=3D"margin-top:5.0pt;margin-bottom:5.0pt">
<div>
<div>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal">Judging guide Reference Should be TRA, my oversight.&=
nbsp;<u></u><u></u></p>
</div>
<div>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal">Bill<u></u><u></u></p>
</div>
<div>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal">&nbsp;<u></u><u></u></p>
</div>
<div>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal" style=3D"margin-bottom:12.0pt">On Jan 16, 2019, at 8:=
29 PM,
<a href=3D"mailto:[email-masked]" target=3D"_blank">[email-masked]</a> &=
lt;<a href=3D"mailto:[email-masked]" target=3D"_blank">[email-masked]</a=
>&gt; wrote:<u></u><u></u></p>
</div>
<div>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal">If y=E2=80=99all will allow one more =E2=80=9Cauthori=
ty=E2=80=9D to weigh in, the VTR Judging Guidlines state, =E2=80=9CThe canis=
ter is painted ice blue (specific color unknown) which takes a pale green ca=
ste
 with age.=E2=80=9D<u></u><u></u></p>
<div>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal">&nbsp;<u></u><u></u></p>
</div>
<div>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal">I=E2=80=99ll stick with my Valspar Peacock Blue.&nbsp=
;<u></u><u></u></p>
</div>
<div>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal">&nbsp;<u></u><u></u></p>
</div>
<div>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal">Cheers,<u></u><u></u></p>
</div>
<div>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal" style=3D"margin-bottom:12.0pt">Bill<u></u><u></u></p>=

<div>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal">Sent from my Motorola 8000X<u></u><u></u></p>
</div>
<div>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal" style=3D"margin-bottom:12.0pt"><br>
On Jan 16, 2019, at 2:09 PM, Don Hiscock &lt;<a href=3D"mailto:don.hiscock@g=
mail.com" target=3D"_blank">[email-masked]</a>&gt; wrote:<u></u><u></=
u></p>
</div>
<div>
<div>
<div>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal">The TR Register (UK) forum had a thread on the subjec=
t of oil filter canister housings a few years ago.<u></u><u></u></p>
<div>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal"><a href=3D"https://wwwtr-register.co.uk/forums/index.=
php?/topic/44252-oil-filter-bowl/" target=3D"_blank">https://www.tr-register=
.co.uk/<wbr>forums/index.php?/topic/44252-<wbr>oil-filter-bowl/</a><u></u><u=
></u></p>
</div>
<div>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal">&nbsp;<u></u><u></u></p>
</div>
<div>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal">Note especially the comments by our late, great frien=
d Alec Pringle about his experience with lots of variations and the quite re=
alistic comment that S-T were a lot more worried
 about keeping lines going and spares supplied than getting details "right" a=
round shade.<u></u><u></u></p>
</div>
<div>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal">&nbsp;<u></u><u></u></p>
</div>
<div>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal">The thread has some useful info, but this is one of t=
hose don't-sweat-it subjects around our cars.<u></u><u></u></p>
</div>
<div>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal">&nbsp;<u></u><u></u></p>
</div>
<div>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal">Don<u></u><u></u></p>
</div>
<div>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal">1962 TR3B TSF202L<u></u><u></u></p>
</div>
</div>
</div>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal">&nbsp;<u></u><u></u></p>
<div>
<div>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal">On Tue, Jan 15, 2019 at 11:01 PM James Henningsen &lt=
;<a href=3D"mailto:[email-masked]" target=3D"_blank">[email-masked]</a=
>&gt; wrote:<u></u><u></u></p>
</div>
<blockquote style=3D"border:none;border-left:solid #cccccc 1.0pt;padding:0in=
 0in 0in 6.0pt;margin-left:4.8pt;margin-top:5.0pt;margin-right:0in;margin-bo=
ttom:5.0pt">
<p class=3D"MsoNormal">Anyone have a source for correct paint color on early=
 1962 TR4 oil filter canister housing.&nbsp; TRA judging manual says ice blu=
e that patinas to a pale green.&nbsp; Looking for a color
 code I can give my paint shop.&nbsp; &nbsp;Thanks to any concours experts o=
ut there. <br>
Jim Henningsen <br>
Ocala FL<br>
<br>
<br>
Sent from my iPhone<br>
** <a href=3D"mailto:[email-masked]" target=3D"_blank">triumphs@aut=
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<p class=3D"MsoNormal">&nbsp;<u></u><u></u></p>
<table border=3D"1" cellspacing=3D"3" cellpadding=3D"0" style=3D"border:none=
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--Apple-Mail-08BECC04-C6EE-4818-A147-B0A7F13DA649--

--===============8314103180213086276==
Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit
Content-Disposition: inline

--===============8314103180213086276==--

---

From: Don Hiscock <[email-masked]>
Date: Sun, 10 Feb 2019 16:31:32 -0600

--===============5017417556494972254==

--0000000000001b38f2058191c1d4
Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable

John, you=E2=80=99ve previously discussed that commission number plates wer=
e
stamped by wounded veteran servicemen. I=E2=80=99ve always liked that thoug=
ht.

On Sunday, February 10, 2019, John Macartney <[email-masked]>
wrote:

> Makes me laugh sometimes when this lore comes back. Ye gods, Standard
> could afford to provide a one armed war wounded man a paintbrush!!!
> What so many over the pond continuously fail to appreciate when it comes
> to the wet liner four pot is that the block was common to many different
> uses. The basic block appeared in the TR, Vanguard, Ensign, Leyland 15 an=
d
> 20 later on and in differing sizes for industrial applications. One basic
> block, many different engine types! The =E2=80=9Cpaint codes, colours and=
 shapes=E2=80=9D
> were worked out by engine assembly people in line with engine build sheet=
s.
> They knew what they were doing and as long as the correct unit was built,
> no one else worried.
> The story about Sir John Black and returning servicemen is another affair
> of equal import. I wrote it out for TVT some years ago but someone choppe=
d
> lumps out of it and I vetoed the print because it gave a rather different
> and by no means as comprehensive account, and skewed the narrative to
> Black=E2=80=99s disadvantage.
>
> Jonmac
>
> Sent from my iPad
>
> My April 1962 TR3B=E2=80=99s engine=E2=80=99s marshaling marks were brush=
ed for sure.
>> The few that I have seen personally have a brushed appearance. =C2=BE in=
ch
>> Perhaps our forum friend John Macartney canl come in with more and bette=
r
>> wouldn't surprise me at all that one of those positions was marking engi=
nes.
>>
>>
>>
>> Don
>>
>> 1962 TR3B TSF202L
>>
>>
>>
>> On Sun, Feb 10, 2019 at 7:06 AM Lawarence Schwartz <[email-masked]> wrote=
:
>> several years ago along with having conversations a Tr gatherings that a=
t
>> the end of the engine production line there was one employee with only o=
ne
>> arm and he was responsible for writing TR 3 using just one finger which =
he
>> zipped into the orange red paint and scribbled the markings on the engin=
e
>> Great picture Don, I have always re-painted the orange =E2=80=9CTR3=E2=
=80=9D after an
>> their delivery at the factory and toured the Continent.  One can see som=
e
>> I can=E2=80=99t speak about TRA, but I can say that neither VTR or 6-pac=
k look
>> for these markings, or deduct for their absence, during Concours judging=
 -
>> and I=E2=80=99ve never heard anybody say they knew what they meant or wh=
y they are
>> there.
>>
>>
>>
>> Cheers,
>>
>> Jack Mc
>>
>> Sent from my iPad
>>
>>
>> On Jan 17, 2019, at 9:27 AM, John Macartney <[email-masked]=
k>
>> wrote:
>>
>> Jim
>>
>>
>>
>> In the rebuild of your car, did you by chance find any obscure markings
>> in yellow or white chinagraph chalk on the engine block? These were comm=
on
>> identifiers used at the factory that were understood by those who worked=
 in
>> engine assembly =E2=80=93 but no-one else. Primarily, the mark was to di=
stinguish
>> the machined but unassembled block as being an ultimate engine for a Nor=
th
>> were. Being anxious to replicate what had been there after re-painting t=
he
>> block, they replaced the code. I=E2=80=99d be very surprised if TRA or V=
TR have
>> extra marks in their judging books =E2=80=93 or even deduct marks if the=
y weren=E2=80=99t
>> car.  The trick is what to tell the auto paint store for a color to matc=
h
>> that would be acceptable to judges.  My goal isn=E2=80=99t to beat every=
one in a
>> restorers of these cars. I=E2=80=99d love to know more specifics on the =
color and
>> or source that experts in TRA think correct.  Also, I heard Macy=E2=80=
=99s Garage
>> photos of that car they could share.  The few I saw looked magnificent a=
nd
>> If y=E2=80=99all will allow one more =E2=80=9Cauthority=E2=80=9D to weig=
h in, the VTR Judging
>> Guidlines state, =E2=80=9CThe canister is painted ice blue (specific col=
or unknown)
>> <https://wwwtr-register.co.uk/forums/index.php?/topic/44252-oil-filter-b=
owl/>
>>
>>
>>
>> Note especially the comments by our late, great friend Alec Pringle abou=
t
>> his experience with lots of variations and the quite realistic comment t=
hat
>> S-T were a lot more worried about keeping lines going and spares supplie=
d
>> Anyone have a source for correct paint color on early 1962 TR4 oil filte=
r
>> canister housing.  TRA judging manual says ice blue that patinas to a pa=
le
>> green.  Looking for a color code I can give my paint shop.   Thanks to a=
ny
>> Unsubscribe/Manage: http://autoxteam.net/mailman/o
>> ptions/triumphs/[email-masked]
>> https://ipmcdn.avast.com/images/icons/icon-envelope-tick-round-orange-an=
imated-no-repeat-v1.gif]
>> <https://www.avast.com/sig-email?utm_medium=3Demail&utm_source=3Dlink&ut=
m_campaign=3Dsig-email&utm_content=3Demailclient>
>> <https://www.avast.com/sig-email?utm_medium=3Demail&utm_source=3Dlink&ut=
m_campaign=3Dsig-email&utm_content=3Demailclient>
>> Unsubscribe/Manage: http://autoxteam.net/mailman/o
>> ptions/triumphs/[email-masked]
> Unsubscribe/Manage: http://autox.team.net/mailman/options/triumphs/john.
> [email-masked]
>
>

--0000000000001b38f2058191c1d4
Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable

John, you=E2=80=99ve previously discussed that commission number plates wer=
e stamped by wounded veteran servicemen. I=E2=80=99ve always liked that tho=
ught.=C2=A0<br><br>On Sunday, February 10, 2019, John Macartney &lt;<a href=
=3D"mailto:[email-masked]">[email-masked]</a>&g=
t; wrote:<br><blockquote class=3D"gmail_quote" style=3D"margin:0 0 0 .8ex;b=
order-left:1px #ccc solid;padding-left:1ex"><div dir=3D"auto">Makes me laug=
h sometimes when this lore comes back. Ye gods, Standard could afford to pr=
ovide a one armed war wounded man a paintbrush!!!<div>What so many over the=
 pond continuously fail to appreciate when it comes to the wet liner four p=
ot is that the block was common to many different uses. The basic block app=
eared in the TR, Vanguard, Ensign, Leyland 15 and 20 later on and in differ=
ing sizes for industrial applications. One basic block, many different engi=
ne types! The =E2=80=9Cpaint codes, colours and shapes=E2=80=9D were worked=
 out by engine assembly people in line with engine build sheets. They knew =
what they were doing and as long as the correct unit was built, no one else=
 worried.</div><div>The story about Sir John Black and returning servicemen=
 is another affair of equal import. I wrote it out for TVT some years ago b=
ut someone chopped lumps out of it and I vetoed the print because it gave a=
 rather different and by no means as comprehensive account, and skewed the =
narrative to Black=E2=80=99s disadvantage.</div><div><br></div><div>Jonmac<=
br><br><div dir=3D"ltr">Sent from my iPad</div><div dir=3D"ltr"><br>On 10 F=
eb 2019, at 16:34, Don Hiscock &lt;<a href=3D"mailto:[email-masked]"=
 target=3D"_blank">[email-masked]</a>&gt; wrote:<br><br></div><block=
quote type=3D"cite"><div dir=3D"ltr">My April 1962 TR3B=E2=80=99s engine=E2=
=80=99s marshaling marks were brushed for sure.=C2=A0<br><br>On Sunday, Feb=
ruary 10, 2019, Stan Foster &lt;<a href=3D"mailto:[email-masked]" target=
=3D"_blank">[email-masked]</a>&gt; wrote:<br><blockquote class=3D"gmail_qu=
ote" style=3D"margin:0 0 0 .8ex;border-left:1px #ccc solid;padding-left:1ex=
">

[email-masked]" target=3D"_blank">[email-masked]<wb=
r>et</a>&gt; <b>On Behalf Of
[email-masked]" target=3D"_blank">mailto:triumphs-bounces@autox<wbr>.=
/pho<wbr>tos/i-b5KrzK2/0/86ac2744/O/i-<wbr>b5KrzK2.jpg</a><u></u><u></u></p=
</div>
</div>
</div>
<div>
[email-masked]" target=3D"_blank">[email-masked]<wb=
r>t</a>&gt;
<div>
</div>
<div>
//www.team.net/donate.htm<wbr>l</a><br>
http://autoxteam.net/mailman/o<wbr>ptions/triumphs/don.hiscock@gm<wbr>ail.c=
//www.team.net/donate.htm<wbr>l</a><br>
//www.team.net/donate.htm<wbr>l</a><br>
http://autox.team.net/mailman/<wbr>options/triumphs/trguy75@gmail<wbr>.com<=
</td>
</tr>
</tbody>
</table>
</div>
</div>
</blockquote>
//www.team.net/donate.htm<wbr>l</a><br>
http://autox.team.net/mailman/<wbr>options/triumphs/mcgaheyrx@aol<wbr>.com<=
//www.team.net/donate.htm<wbr>l</a><br>
http://autoxteam.net/mailman/o<wbr>ptions/triumphs/don.hiscock@gm<wbr>ail.c=
//www.team.net/donate.htm<wbr>l</a><br>
</div>
</blockquote>
</div>
</blockquote>
</div>
</div>
</div>

</blockquote>
</div></blockquote><blockquote type=3D"cite"><div dir=3D"ltr"><span>** <a h=
ref=3D"mailto:[email-masked]" target=3D"_blank">[email-masked]=
m.net</a> **</span><br><span></span><br><span>Donate: <a href=3D"http://www=
.team.net/donate.html" target=3D"_blank">http://www.team.net/donate.<wbr>ht=
ml</a></span><br><span>Archive: <a href=3D"http://www.team.net/pipermail/tr=
iumphs" target=3D"_blank">http://www.team.net/pipermail/<wbr>triumphs</a> =
=C2=A0<a href=3D"http://www.team.net/archive" target=3D"_blank">http://www.=
team.net/archive</a></span><br><span></span><br><span>Unsubscribe/Manage: <=
a href=3D"http://autox.team.net/mailman/options/triumphs/john.macartney@ukp=
ips.org.uk" target=3D"_blank">http://autox.team.net/mailman/<wbr>options/tr=
iumphs/john.<wbr>[email-masked]</a></span><br></div></blockquote><=
/div></div></blockquote>

--0000000000001b38f2058191c1d4--

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---

From: Stan Foster <[email-masked]>
Date: Sun, 10 Feb 2019 22:44:54 +0000

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--===============8006148038180166007==--

---

From: James Henningsen <[email-masked]>
Date: Sun, 10 Feb 2019 18:56:25 -0500

--===============7678827226961505020==
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	charset=utf-8
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Me too !  Ever since your story on the commission plates I=E2=80=99ve had a m=
uch greater appreciation for the misaligned numbers and letters. Jim Henning=
sen=20

Sent from my iPhone

> On Feb 10, 2019, at 5:44 PM, Stan Foster <[email-masked]> wrote:
>=20
> John, if you still have that  article I bet I=E2=80=99m not the only one t=
hat would like to see it. This was an important time for Triumph and the Bri=
tish car industry and the role that returning servicemen and women played a r=
ole would be of interest to me.
> =20
> Stan
> =20
> From: John Macartney <[email-masked]>=20
> Sent: Sunday, February 10, 2019 4:46 PM
> To: Don Hiscock <[email-masked]>
> Cc: Stan Foster <[email-masked]>; [email-masked]
> Makes me laugh sometimes when this lore comes back. Ye gods, Standard coul=
d afford to provide a one armed war wounded man a paintbrush!!!
> What so many over the pond continuously fail to appreciate when it comes t=
o the wet liner four pot is that the block was common to many different uses=
. The basic block appeared in the TR, Vanguard, Ensign, Leyland 15 and 20 la=
ter on and in differing sizes for industrial applications. One basic block, m=
any different engine types! The =E2=80=9Cpaint codes, colours and shapes=E2=80=
=9D were worked out by engine assembly people in line with engine build shee=
ts. They knew what they were doing and as long as the correct unit was built=
, no one else worried.
> The story about Sir John Black and returning servicemen is another affair o=
f equal import. I wrote it out for TVT some years ago but someone chopped lu=
mps out of it and I vetoed the print because it gave a rather different and b=
y no means as comprehensive account, and skewed the narrative to Black=E2=80=
=99s disadvantage.
d for sure.=20
> The few that I have seen personally have a brushed appearance. =C2=BE inch=
> =20
> Stan
> =20
> From: Triumphs <[email-masked]> On Behalf Of Don Hiscock
> Perhaps our forum friend John Macartney canl come in with more and better i=
nformation, but Sir John Black made a real commitment to disabled war vets. =
 S-T found productive work for many, for years and years.  It wouldn't surpr=
ise me at all that one of those positions was marking engines.
> With reference to the Tr3 engine  block markings I remember reading severa=
l years ago along with having conversations a Tr gatherings that at the end o=
f the engine production line there was one employee with only one arm and he=
 was responsible for writing TR 3 using just one finger which he zipped into=
 the orange red paint and scribbled the markings on the engine block. Larry S=
chwartz
iscock
x.team.net>
ing restoration.
n

l/
ubjects around our cars.
ve
[email-masked]
ve
flash.net
ve
@gmail.com
ve
[email-masked]
ve
[email-masked]
ve
ol.com
ve
[email-masked]
ve
@gmail.com

--Apple-Mail-44A12BBB-0E39-4FAF-A950-4338A646BC7C
	charset=utf-8
Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable

<html><head><meta http-equiv=3D"content-type" content=3D"text/html; charset=3D=
utf-8"></head><body dir=3D"auto">Me too ! &nbsp;Ever since your story on the=
 commission plates I=E2=80=99ve had a much greater appreciation for the misa=
ligned numbers and letters. Jim Henningsen&nbsp;<br><br><div id=3D"AppleMail=
Signature" dir=3D"ltr">Sent from my iPhone</div><div dir=3D"ltr"><br>On Feb 1=
0, 2019, at 5:44 PM, Stan Foster &lt;<a href=3D"mailto:[email-masked]">stan=
@redtr6.com</a>&gt; wrote:<br><br></div><blockquote type=3D"cite"><div dir=3D=
"ltr">

<meta http-equiv=3D"Content-Type" content=3D"text/html; charset=3Dutf-8">
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<div class=3D"WordSection1">
<p class=3D"MsoNormal">John, if you still have that&nbsp; article I bet I=E2=
=80=99m not the only one that would like to see it. This was an important ti=
me for Triumph and the British car industry and the role that returning serv=
icemen and women played a role would be of interest
 to me.<o:p></o:p></p>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal"><o:p>&nbsp;</o:p></p>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal">Stan<o:p></o:p></p>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal"><o:p>&nbsp;</o:p></p>
<div>
<div style=3D"border:none;border-top:solid #E1E1E1 1.0pt;padding:3.0pt 0in 0=
in 0in">
<p class=3D"MsoNormal"><b>From:</b> John Macartney &lt;<a href=3D"mailto:Joh=
[email-masked]">[email-masked]</a>&gt; <br>
<b>Sent:</b> Sunday, February 10, 2019 4:46 PM<br>
<b>To:</b> Don Hiscock &lt;<a href=3D"mailto:[email-masked]">don.hisc=
[email-masked]</a>&gt;<br>
<b>Cc:</b> Stan Foster &lt;<a href=3D"mailto:[email-masked]">[email-masked]=
m</a>&gt;; <a href=3D"mailto:[email-masked]">[email-masked]=
t</a><br>
<b>Subject:</b> Re: [TR] Paint code<o:p></o:p></p>
</div>
</div>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal"><o:p>&nbsp;</o:p></p>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal">Makes me laugh sometimes when this lore comes back. Y=
e gods, Standard could afford to provide a one armed war wounded man a paint=
brush!!!<o:p></o:p></p>
<div>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal">What so many over the pond continuously fail to appre=
ciate when it comes to the wet liner four pot is that the block was common t=
o many different uses. The basic block appeared in the TR, Vanguard, Ensign,=
 Leyland 15 and 20 later on and
 in differing sizes for industrial applications. One basic block, many diffe=
rent engine types! The =E2=80=9Cpaint codes, colours and shapes=E2=80=9D wer=
e worked out by engine assembly people in line with engine build sheets. The=
y knew what they were doing and as long as the
 correct unit was built, no one else worried.<o:p></o:p></p>
</div>
<div>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal">The story about Sir John Black and returning servicem=
en is another affair of equal import. I wrote it out for TVT some years ago b=
ut someone chopped lumps out of it and I vetoed the print because it gave a r=
ather different and by no means
 as comprehensive account, and skewed the narrative to Black=E2=80=99s disad=
vantage.<o:p></o:p></p>
</div>
<div>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal"><o:p>&nbsp;</o:p></p>
</div>
<div>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal" style=3D"margin-bottom:12.0pt">Jonmac<o:p></o:p></p>
<div id=3D"AppleMailSignature">
<p class=3D"MsoNormal">Sent from my iPad<o:p></o:p></p>
</div>
<div>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal" style=3D"margin-bottom:12.0pt"><br>
On 10 Feb 2019, at 16:34, Don Hiscock &lt;<a href=3D"mailto:don.hiscock@gmai=
l.com">[email-masked]</a>&gt; wrote:<o:p></o:p></p>
</div>
<blockquote style=3D"margin-top:5.0pt;margin-bottom:5.0pt">
<div>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal">My April 1962 TR3B=E2=80=99s engine=E2=80=99s marshal=
ing marks were brushed for sure.&nbsp;<br>
<br>
On Sunday, February 10, 2019, Stan Foster &lt;<a href=3D"mailto:stan@redtr6.=
com">[email-masked]</a>&gt; wrote:<o:p></o:p></p>
<blockquote style=3D"border:none;border-left:solid #CCCCCC 1.0pt;padding:0in=
 0in 0in 6.0pt;margin-left:4.8pt;margin-right:0in">
<div>
<div>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal" style=3D"mso-margin-top-alt:auto;mso-margin-bottom-al=
t:auto">The few that I have seen personally have a brushed appearance. =C2=BE=
 inch wide, coarse brush. A one armed man can still use a brush.<o:p></o:p><=
/p>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal" style=3D"mso-margin-top-alt:auto;mso-margin-bottom-al=
t:auto">&nbsp;<o:p></o:p></p>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal" style=3D"mso-margin-top-alt:auto;mso-margin-bottom-al=
t:auto">Stan<o:p></o:p></p>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal" style=3D"mso-margin-top-alt:auto;mso-margin-bottom-al=
t:auto">&nbsp;<o:p></o:p></p>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal" style=3D"mso-margin-top-alt:auto;mso-margin-bottom-al=
t:auto"><b>From:</b> Triumphs &lt;<a href=3D"mailto:[email-masked]=
eam.net" target=3D"_blank">[email-masked]</a>&gt;
<b>On Behalf Of </b>Don Hiscock<br>
<b>Sent:</b> Sunday, February 10, 2019 8:25 AM<br>
<b>To:</b> Lawarence Schwartz &lt;<a href=3D"mailto:[email-masked]" target=3D=
"_blank">[email-masked]</a>&gt;<br>
<b>Cc:</b> Triumphs &lt;<a href=3D"mailto:[email-masked]" target=3D=
"_blank">[email-masked]</a>&gt;<br>
<b>Subject:</b> Re: [TR] Paint code<o:p></o:p></p>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal" style=3D"mso-margin-top-alt:auto;mso-margin-bottom-al=
t:auto">&nbsp;<o:p></o:p></p>
<div>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal" style=3D"mso-margin-top-alt:auto;mso-margin-bottom-al=
t:auto">Perhaps our forum friend John Macartney canl come in with more and b=
etter information, but Sir John Black made a real commitment to disabled war=
 vets.&nbsp; S-T found productive work
 for many, for years and years.&nbsp; It wouldn't surprise me at all that on=
e of those positions was marking engines.<o:p></o:p></p>
<div>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal" style=3D"mso-margin-top-alt:auto;mso-margin-bottom-al=
t:auto">&nbsp;<o:p></o:p></p>
</div>
<div>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal" style=3D"mso-margin-top-alt:auto;mso-margin-bottom-al=
t:auto">Don<o:p></o:p></p>
</div>
<div>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal" style=3D"mso-margin-top-alt:auto;mso-margin-bottom-al=
t:auto">1962 TR3B TSF202L<o:p></o:p></p>
</div>
</div>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal" style=3D"mso-margin-top-alt:auto;mso-margin-bottom-al=
t:auto">&nbsp;<o:p></o:p></p>
<div>
<div>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal" style=3D"mso-margin-top-alt:auto;mso-margin-bottom-al=
t:auto">On Sun, Feb 10, 2019 at 7:06 AM Lawarence Schwartz &lt;<a href=3D"ma=
ilto:[email-masked]" target=3D"_blank">[email-masked]</a>&gt; wrote:<o:p></o:p=
></p>
</div>
<blockquote style=3D"border:none;border-left:solid #CCCCCC 1.0pt;padding:0in=
 0in 0in 6.0pt;margin-left:4.8pt;margin-top:5.0pt;margin-right:0in;margin-bo=
ttom:5.0pt">
<div>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal" style=3D"mso-margin-top-alt:auto;margin-bottom:12.0pt=
">With reference to the Tr3 engine &nbsp;block markings I remember reading s=
everal years ago along with having conversations a Tr gatherings that at the=
 end of the engine production line there
 was one employee with only one arm and he was responsible for writing TR 3 u=
sing just one finger which he zipped into the orange red paint and scribbled=
 the markings on the engine block. Larry Schwartz<o:p></o:p></p>
<div>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal" style=3D"mso-margin-top-alt:auto;mso-margin-bottom-al=
t:auto">Sent from my iPhone<o:p></o:p></p>
</div>
<div>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal" style=3D"mso-margin-top-alt:auto;margin-bottom:12.0pt=
"><br>
On Jan 18, 2019, at 12:44 AM, wbeech &lt;<a href=3D"mailto:[email-masked]"=
 target=3D"_blank">[email-masked]</a>&gt; wrote:<o:p></o:p></p>
</div>
<blockquote style=3D"margin-top:5.0pt;margin-bottom:5.0pt">
<div>
<div>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal" style=3D"mso-margin-top-alt:auto;mso-margin-bottom-al=
t:auto"><span style=3D"color:#1F497D">Great picture Don, I have always re-pa=
inted the orange =E2=80=9CTR3=E2=80=9D after an engine rebuild, used Chevrol=
et engine orange.&nbsp; Had never seen the china marker
 markings before.</span><o:p></o:p></p>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal" style=3D"mso-margin-top-alt:auto;mso-margin-bottom-al=
t:auto"><span style=3D"color:#1F497D">Bill</span><o:p></o:p></p>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal" style=3D"mso-margin-top-alt:auto;mso-margin-bottom-al=
t:auto"><span style=3D"color:#1F497D">&nbsp;</span><o:p></o:p></p>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal" style=3D"mso-margin-top-alt:auto;mso-margin-bottom-al=
t:auto"><b>From:</b> Triumphs [<a href=3D"mailto:[email-masked]=
.net" target=3D"_blank">mailto:[email-masked]</a>]
<b>On Behalf Of </b>Don Hiscock<br>
<b>Sent:</b> Thursday, January 17, 2019 5:47 PM<br>
<b>To:</b> John Macartney &lt;<a href=3D"mailto:[email-masked]=
" target=3D"_blank">[email-masked]</a>&gt;; Triumphs &lt;<a hr=
ef=3D"mailto:[email-masked]" target=3D"_blank">[email-masked].=
net</a>&gt;<br>
<b>Subject:</b> Re: [TR] Paint code<o:p></o:p></p>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal" style=3D"mso-margin-top-alt:auto;mso-margin-bottom-al=
t:auto">&nbsp;<o:p></o:p></p>
<div>
<div>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal" style=3D"mso-margin-top-alt:auto;mso-margin-bottom-al=
t:auto">Here's an image of the Coventry assembly line taken by a member of t=
he tour group on Triumph USA's 1958 Rally of Europe for new owners who took t=
heir delivery at the factory and
 toured the Continent.&nbsp; One can see some of the various marshalling mar=
ks on the engines ready to be used on the line.<o:p></o:p></p>
<div>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal" style=3D"mso-margin-top-alt:auto;mso-margin-bottom-al=
t:auto"><a href=3D"https://photos.smugmug.com/photos/i-b5KrzK2/0/86ac2744/O/=
i-b5KrzK2.jpg" target=3D"_blank">https://photos.smugmug.com/photos/i-b5KrzK2=
/0/86ac2744/O/i-b5KrzK2.jpg</a><o:p></o:p></p>
</div>
</div>
</div>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal" style=3D"mso-margin-top-alt:auto;mso-margin-bottom-al=
t:auto">&nbsp;<o:p></o:p></p>
<div>
<div>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal" style=3D"mso-margin-top-alt:auto;mso-margin-bottom-al=
t:auto">On Thu, Jan 17, 2019 at 5:38 PM John Macartney &lt;<a href=3D"mailto=
:[email-masked]" target=3D"_blank">[email-masked]=
k</a>&gt; wrote:<o:p></o:p></p>
</div>
<blockquote style=3D"border:none;border-left:solid #CCCCCC 1.0pt;padding:0in=
 0in 0in 6.0pt;margin-left:4.8pt;margin-top:5.0pt;margin-right:0in;margin-bo=
ttom:5.0pt">
<div>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal" style=3D"mso-margin-top-alt:auto;mso-margin-bottom-al=
t:auto">Thing is Jack, that this far down the track, no one knows! In fact, I=
 doubt the majority of people at the factory did either:)<o:p></o:p></p>
<div>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal" style=3D"mso-margin-top-alt:auto;mso-margin-bottom-al=
t:auto">&nbsp;<o:p></o:p></p>
</div>
<div>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal" style=3D"mso-margin-top-alt:auto;margin-bottom:12.0pt=
">Cheers, John<o:p></o:p></p>
<div>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal" style=3D"mso-margin-top-alt:auto;mso-margin-bottom-al=
t:auto">Sent from my iPad<o:p></o:p></p>
</div>
<div>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal" style=3D"mso-margin-top-alt:auto;margin-bottom:12.0pt=
"><br>
On 17 Jan 2019, at 17:50, Jack McGahey &lt;<a href=3D"mailto:[email-masked]=
om" target=3D"_blank">[email-masked]</a>&gt; wrote:<o:p></o:p></p>
</div>
<blockquote style=3D"margin-top:5.0pt;margin-bottom:5.0pt">
<div>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal" style=3D"mso-margin-top-alt:auto;mso-margin-bottom-al=
t:auto">I have those markings on my TR6 block - reapplied after engine rebui=
ld during restoration.<o:p></o:p></p>
<div>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal" style=3D"mso-margin-top-alt:auto;mso-margin-bottom-al=
t:auto">&nbsp;<o:p></o:p></p>
</div>
<div>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal" style=3D"mso-margin-top-alt:auto;mso-margin-bottom-al=
t:auto">I can=E2=80=99t speak about TRA, but I can say that neither VTR or 6=
-pack look for these markings, or deduct for their absence, during Concours j=
udging - and I=E2=80=99ve never heard anybody say
 they knew what they meant or why they are there.&nbsp;<o:p></o:p></p>
</div>
<div>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal" style=3D"mso-margin-top-alt:auto;mso-margin-bottom-al=
t:auto">&nbsp;<o:p></o:p></p>
</div>
<div>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal" style=3D"mso-margin-top-alt:auto;mso-margin-bottom-al=
t:auto">Cheers,<o:p></o:p></p>
</div>
<div>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal" style=3D"mso-margin-top-alt:auto;margin-bottom:12.0pt=
">Jack Mc<o:p></o:p></p>
<div>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal" style=3D"mso-margin-top-alt:auto;mso-margin-bottom-al=
t:auto">Sent from my iPad<o:p></o:p></p>
</div>
<div>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal" style=3D"mso-margin-top-alt:auto;margin-bottom:12.0pt=
"><br>
On Jan 17, 2019, at 9:27 AM, John Macartney &lt;<a href=3D"mailto:john.macar=
[email-masked]" target=3D"_blank">[email-masked]</a>&gt; w=
rote:<o:p></o:p></p>
</div>
<blockquote style=3D"margin-top:5.0pt;margin-bottom:5.0pt">
<div>
<div>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal" style=3D"mso-margin-top-alt:auto;mso-margin-bottom-al=
t:auto">Jim<o:p></o:p></p>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal" style=3D"mso-margin-top-alt:auto;mso-margin-bottom-al=
t:auto">&nbsp;<o:p></o:p></p>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal" style=3D"mso-margin-top-alt:auto;mso-margin-bottom-al=
t:auto">In the rebuild of your car, did you by chance find any obscure marki=
ngs in yellow or white chinagraph chalk on the engine block? These were comm=
on identifiers used at the factory
 that were understood by those who worked in engine assembly =E2=80=93 but n=
o-one else. Primarily, the mark was to distinguish the machined but unassemb=
led block as being an ultimate engine for a North America spec car. Not all t=
he blocks had these marks but I do know
 many others have encountered them years later and wondered what the hell th=
ey were. Being anxious to replicate what had been there after re-painting th=
e block, they replaced the code. I=E2=80=99d be very surprised if TRA or VTR=
 have extra marks in their judging books
 =E2=80=93 or even deduct marks if they weren=E2=80=99t there.<o:p></o:p></p=
<p class=3D"MsoNormal" style=3D"mso-margin-top-alt:auto;mso-margin-bottom-al=
t:auto">&nbsp;<o:p></o:p></p>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal" style=3D"mso-margin-top-alt:auto;mso-margin-bottom-al=
t:auto">Cheers, Jonmac<o:p></o:p></p>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal" style=3D"mso-margin-top-alt:auto;mso-margin-bottom-al=
t:auto">&nbsp;<o:p></o:p></p>
<div>
<div style=3D"border:none;border-top:solid #E1E1E1 1.0pt;padding:3.0pt 0in 0=
in 0in">
<p class=3D"MsoNormal" style=3D"mso-margin-top-alt:auto;mso-margin-bottom-al=
t:auto"><b>From:</b> Triumphs &lt;<a href=3D"mailto:[email-masked]=
eam.net" target=3D"_blank">[email-masked]</a>&gt;
<b>On Behalf Of </b>Jim Henningsen<br>
<b>Sent:</b> 17 January 2019 12:31<br>
<b>To:</b> <a href=3D"mailto:[email-masked]" target=3D"_blank">wbeech@flas=
h.net</a><br>
<b>Cc:</b> Triumphs &lt;<a href=3D"mailto:[email-masked]" target=3D=
"_blank">[email-masked]</a>&gt;<br>
<b>Subject:</b> Re: [TR] Paint code<o:p></o:p></p>
</div>
</div>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal" style=3D"mso-margin-top-alt:auto;mso-margin-bottom-al=
t:auto">&nbsp;<o:p></o:p></p>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal" style=3D"mso-margin-top-alt:auto;mso-margin-bottom-al=
t:auto">Bill:<o:p></o:p></p>
<div>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal" style=3D"mso-margin-top-alt:auto;mso-margin-bottom-al=
t:auto">I have the TRA judging guide for the TR4 and have been using it as m=
y plumb line for the restoration going back to 2010 when I purchased the car=
.&nbsp; The trick is what to tell the
 auto paint store for a color to match that would be acceptable to judges.&n=
bsp; My goal isn=E2=80=99t to beat everyone in a concours but to faithfully r=
ecreate the car as it was born.&nbsp; I am not interested in trophies.&nbsp;=
 Over the 8 years restoring this car, s I have sometimes
 found it hard to get info from the expert judges and respected restorers of=
 these cars. I=E2=80=99d love to know more specifics on the color and or sou=
rce that experts in TRA think correct.&nbsp; Also, I heard Macy=E2=80=99s Ga=
rage had an early TR4at the last TRA event.&nbsp; Does
 anyone have any detailed photos of that car they could share.&nbsp; The few=
 I saw looked magnificent and they have such a great reputation. &nbsp;<o:p>=
</o:p></p>
</div>
<div>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal" style=3D"mso-margin-top-alt:auto;mso-margin-bottom-al=
t:auto">Thanks so much,<o:p></o:p></p>
</div>
<div>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal" style=3D"mso-margin-top-alt:auto;margin-bottom:12.0pt=
">Jim Henningsen<o:p></o:p></p>
<div>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal" style=3D"mso-margin-top-alt:auto;mso-margin-bottom-al=
t:auto">Sent from my iPad<o:p></o:p></p>
</div>
<div>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal" style=3D"mso-margin-top-alt:auto;margin-bottom:12.0pt=
"><br>
On Jan 16, 2019, at 10:42 PM, <a href=3D"mailto:[email-masked]" target=3D"=
_blank">[email-masked]</a> &lt;<a href=3D"mailto:[email-masked]" target=3D=
"_blank">[email-masked]</a>&gt; wrote:<o:p></o:p></p>
</div>
<blockquote style=3D"margin-top:5.0pt;margin-bottom:5.0pt">
<div>
<div>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal" style=3D"mso-margin-top-alt:auto;mso-margin-bottom-al=
t:auto">Judging guide Reference Should be TRA, my oversight.&nbsp;<o:p></o:p=
></p>
</div>
<div>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal" style=3D"mso-margin-top-alt:auto;mso-margin-bottom-al=
t:auto">Bill<o:p></o:p></p>
</div>
<div>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal" style=3D"mso-margin-top-alt:auto;mso-margin-bottom-al=
t:auto">&nbsp;<o:p></o:p></p>
</div>
<div>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal" style=3D"mso-margin-top-alt:auto;margin-bottom:12.0pt=
">On Jan 16, 2019, at 8:29 PM,
<a href=3D"mailto:[email-masked]" target=3D"_blank">[email-masked]</a> &=
lt;<a href=3D"mailto:[email-masked]" target=3D"_blank">[email-masked]</a=
>&gt; wrote:<o:p></o:p></p>
</div>
<div>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal" style=3D"mso-margin-top-alt:auto;mso-margin-bottom-al=
t:auto">If y=E2=80=99all will allow one more =E2=80=9Cauthority=E2=80=9D to w=
eigh in, the VTR Judging Guidlines state, =E2=80=9CThe canister is painted i=
ce blue (specific color unknown) which takes a pale green caste
 with age.=E2=80=9D<o:p></o:p></p>
<div>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal" style=3D"mso-margin-top-alt:auto;mso-margin-bottom-al=
t:auto">&nbsp;<o:p></o:p></p>
</div>
<div>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal" style=3D"mso-margin-top-alt:auto;mso-margin-bottom-al=
t:auto">I=E2=80=99ll stick with my Valspar Peacock Blue.&nbsp;<o:p></o:p></p=
</div>
<div>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal" style=3D"mso-margin-top-alt:auto;mso-margin-bottom-al=
t:auto">&nbsp;<o:p></o:p></p>
</div>
<div>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal" style=3D"mso-margin-top-alt:auto;mso-margin-bottom-al=
t:auto">Cheers,<o:p></o:p></p>
</div>
<div>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal" style=3D"mso-margin-top-alt:auto;margin-bottom:12.0pt=
">Bill<o:p></o:p></p>
<div>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal" style=3D"mso-margin-top-alt:auto;mso-margin-bottom-al=
t:auto">Sent from my Motorola 8000X<o:p></o:p></p>
</div>
<div>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal" style=3D"mso-margin-top-alt:auto;margin-bottom:12.0pt=
"><br>
On Jan 16, 2019, at 2:09 PM, Don Hiscock &lt;<a href=3D"mailto:don.hiscock@g=
mail.com" target=3D"_blank">[email-masked]</a>&gt; wrote:<o:p></o:p><=
/p>
</div>
<div>
<div>
<div>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal" style=3D"mso-margin-top-alt:auto;mso-margin-bottom-al=
t:auto">The TR Register (UK) forum had a thread on the subject of oil filter=
 canister housings a few years ago.<o:p></o:p></p>
<div>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal" style=3D"mso-margin-top-alt:auto;mso-margin-bottom-al=
t:auto"><a href=3D"https://wwwtr-register.co.uk/forums/index.php?/topic/4425=
2-oil-filter-bowl/" target=3D"_blank">https://www.tr-register.co.uk/forums/i=
ndex.php?/topic/44252-oil-filter-bowl/</a><o:p></o:p></p>
</div>
<div>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal" style=3D"mso-margin-top-alt:auto;mso-margin-bottom-al=
t:auto">&nbsp;<o:p></o:p></p>
</div>
<div>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal" style=3D"mso-margin-top-alt:auto;mso-margin-bottom-al=
t:auto">Note especially the comments by our late, great friend Alec Pringle a=
bout his experience with lots of variations and the quite realistic comment t=
hat S-T were a lot more worried
 about keeping lines going and spares supplied than getting details "right" a=
round shade.<o:p></o:p></p>
</div>
<div>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal" style=3D"mso-margin-top-alt:auto;mso-margin-bottom-al=
t:auto">&nbsp;<o:p></o:p></p>
</div>
<div>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal" style=3D"mso-margin-top-alt:auto;mso-margin-bottom-al=
t:auto">The thread has some useful info, but this is one of those don't-swea=
t-it subjects around our cars.<o:p></o:p></p>
</div>
<div>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal" style=3D"mso-margin-top-alt:auto;mso-margin-bottom-al=
t:auto">&nbsp;<o:p></o:p></p>
</div>
<div>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal" style=3D"mso-margin-top-alt:auto;mso-margin-bottom-al=
t:auto">Don<o:p></o:p></p>
</div>
<div>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal" style=3D"mso-margin-top-alt:auto;mso-margin-bottom-al=
t:auto">1962 TR3B TSF202L<o:p></o:p></p>
</div>
</div>
</div>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal" style=3D"mso-margin-top-alt:auto;mso-margin-bottom-al=
t:auto">&nbsp;<o:p></o:p></p>
<div>
<div>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal" style=3D"mso-margin-top-alt:auto;mso-margin-bottom-al=
t:auto">On Tue, Jan 15, 2019 at 11:01 PM James Henningsen &lt;<a href=3D"mai=
lto:[email-masked]" target=3D"_blank">[email-masked]</a>&gt; wrote:<o:=
p></o:p></p>
</div>
<blockquote style=3D"border:none;border-left:solid #CCCCCC 1.0pt;padding:0in=
 0in 0in 6.0pt;margin-left:4.8pt;margin-top:5.0pt;margin-right:0in;margin-bo=
ttom:5.0pt">
<p class=3D"MsoNormal" style=3D"mso-margin-top-alt:auto;mso-margin-bottom-al=
t:auto">Anyone have a source for correct paint color on early 1962 TR4 oil f=
ilter canister housing.&nbsp; TRA judging manual says ice blue that patinas t=
o a pale green.&nbsp; Looking for a color
 code I can give my paint shop.&nbsp; &nbsp;Thanks to any concours experts o=
ut there. <br>
Jim Henningsen <br>
Ocala FL<br>
<br>
<br>
Sent from my iPhone<br>
** <a href=3D"mailto:[email-masked]" target=3D"_blank">triumphs@aut=
ox.team.net</a> **<br>
<br>
/www.team.net/donate.html</a><br>
Archive: <a href=3D"http://www.team.net/pipermail/triumphs" target=3D"_blank=
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<a href=3D"http://www.team.net/archive" target=3D"_blank">http://www.team.ne=
t/archive</a><br>
<br>
s/[email-masked]" target=3D"_blank">
http://autoxteam.net/mailman/options/triumphs/[email-masked]</a><o:p>=
</o:p></p>
</blockquote>
</div>
</div>
<div>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal" style=3D"mso-margin-top-alt:auto;mso-margin-bottom-al=
t:auto">**
<a href=3D"mailto:[email-masked]" target=3D"_blank">triumphs@autox.=
team.net</a> **<br>
<br>
/www.team.net/donate.html</a><br>
Archive: <a href=3D"http://www.team.net/pipermail/triumphs" target=3D"_blank=
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<br>
s/[email-masked]" target=3D"_blank">
http://autox.team.net/mailman/options/triumphs/[email-masked]</a><o:p></o:=
p></p>
</div>
</div>
</div>
</div>
</blockquote>
<blockquote style=3D"margin-top:5.0pt;margin-bottom:5.0pt">
<div>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal" style=3D"mso-margin-top-alt:auto;mso-margin-bottom-al=
t:auto">**
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Archive: <a href=3D"http://www.team.net/pipermail/triumphs" target=3D"_blank=
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<br>
s/[email-masked]" target=3D"_blank">
http://autox.team.net/mailman/options/triumphs/[email-masked]</a><o:p></o=
:p></p>
</div>
</blockquote>
</div>
</div>
<div>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal" style=3D"mso-margin-top-alt:auto;mso-margin-bottom-al=
t:auto">&nbsp;<o:p></o:p></p>
<table class=3D"MsoNormalTable" border=3D"1" cellspacing=3D"3" cellpadding=3D=
"0" style=3D"border:none;border-top:solid #D3D4DE 1.0pt">
<tbody>
<tr>
<td width=3D"55" style=3D"width:41.25pt;border:none;padding:9.75pt .75pt .75=
pt .75pt">
<p class=3D"MsoNormal" style=3D"mso-margin-top-alt:auto;mso-margin-bottom-al=
t:auto"><a href=3D"https://www.avast.com/sig-email?utm_medium=3Demail&amp;ut=
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ns/icon-envelope-tick-round-orange-animated-no-repeat-v1.gif"></span></a><o:=
p></o:p></p>
</td>
<td width=3D"470" style=3D"width:352.5pt;border:none;padding:9.0pt .75pt .75=
pt .75pt">
<p class=3D"MsoNormal" style=3D"mso-margin-top-alt:auto;mso-margin-bottom-al=
t:auto;line-height:13.5pt">
<span style=3D"font-size:10.0pt;font-family:&quot;Arial&quot;,sans-serif;col=
or:#41424E">Virus-free.
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<span style=3D"color:#4453EA">www.avast.com</span></a> </span><o:p></o:p></p=
</td>
</tr>
</tbody>
</table>
</div>
</div>
</blockquote>
<blockquote style=3D"margin-top:5.0pt;margin-bottom:5.0pt">
<div>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal" style=3D"mso-margin-top-alt:auto;mso-margin-bottom-al=
t:auto">**
<a href=3D"mailto:[email-masked]" target=3D"_blank">triumphs@autox.=
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s/[email-masked]" target=3D"_blank">
http://autox.team.net/mailman/options/triumphs/[email-masked]</a><o:p></o=
:p></p>
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t:auto">**
<a href=3D"mailto:[email-masked]" target=3D"_blank">triumphs@autox.=
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t/archive</a><br>
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s/[email-masked]" target=3D"_blank">
http://autoxteam.net/mailman/options/triumphs/[email-masked]</a><o:p>=
</o:p></p>
</blockquote>
</div>
</div>
</div>
</blockquote>
<blockquote style=3D"margin-top:5.0pt;margin-bottom:5.0pt">
<div>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal" style=3D"mso-margin-top-alt:auto;mso-margin-bottom-al=
t:auto">**
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Archive: <a href=3D"http://www.team.net/pipermail/triumphs" target=3D"_blank=
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s/[email-masked]" target=3D"_blank">
http://autox.team.net/mailman/options/triumphs/[email-masked]</a><o:p></o:p><=
/p>
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<p class=3D"MsoNormal">** <a href=3D"mailto:[email-masked]">triumph=
[email-masked]</a> **<br>
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te.html</a><br>
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s/[email-masked]">
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</div></blockquote><blockquote type=3D"cite"><div dir=3D"ltr"><span>** <a hr=
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From: John Macartney <[email-masked]>
Date: Mon, 11 Feb 2019 00:20:03 +0000

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Bill Beecher also asked much the same. I=E2=80=99m more than happy to reissu=
e it but wouldn=E2=80=99t it be better if it was offered by one of you to TV=
T=E2=80=99s new editor? He says he wants material and I know that the histor=
y that Paul Richardson and I write about seems to have a US/Canada following=
. As Paul is TVTs UK correspondent, I think the matter needs to be squared w=
ith him first via the editor and if he wants what I wrote (which his predece=
ssor preferred not to use) then I=E2=80=99m happy to send it over for everyo=
ne to read.

Jonmac

> On 10 Feb 2019, at 22:44, Stan Foster <[email-masked]> wrote:
>=20
d for sure.=20
iscock
x.team.net>
ing restoration.
n

l/
ubjects around our cars.
ve
[email-masked]
ve
flash.net
ve
@gmail.com
ve
[email-masked]
ve
[email-masked]
ve
ol.com
ve
[email-masked]
ve
[email-masked]

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<html><head><meta http-equiv=3D"content-type" content=3D"text/html; charset=3D=
utf-8"></head><body dir=3D"auto">Bill Beecher also asked much the same. I=E2=
=80=99m more than happy to reissue it but wouldn=E2=80=99t it be better if i=
t was offered by one of you to TVT=E2=80=99s new editor? He says he wants ma=
terial and I know that the history that Paul Richardson and I write about se=
ems to have a US/Canada following. As Paul is TVTs UK correspondent, I think=
 the matter needs to be squared with him first via the editor and if he want=
s what I wrote (which his predecessor preferred not to use) then I=E2=80=99m=
 happy to send it over for everyone to read.<div><br></div><div>Jonmac<br><b=
r><div dir=3D"ltr"><br>On 10 Feb 2019, at 22:44, Stan Foster &lt;<a href=3D"=
mailto:[email-masked]">[email-masked]</a>&gt; wrote:<br><br></div><blockqu=
ote type=3D"cite"><div dir=3D"ltr">

</div>
</div>
<div>
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</td>
</tr>
</tbody>
</table>
</div>
</div>
</blockquote>

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From: TERRY SMITH <[email-masked]>
Date: Sun, 10 Feb 2019 19:25:52 -0500 (EST)

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When I restored my TR3 back in 2004'ish, it took a total re-start, includin=
g a bit of welding at the frame.  The block was, I though, solid, but turns=
 out the machinist found cracks in the webbing that supported the liners.  =
A List member gave me a free block.  Only cost was a trip to Connecticut to=
 pick it up.  Solid cars.=20

> On February 10, 2019 at 4:45 PM John Macartney <[email-masked]=
.uk> wrote:
>=20
>     Makes me laugh sometimes when this lore comes back. Ye gods, Standard=
>     What so many over the pond continuously fail to appreciate when it co=
mes to the wet liner four pot is that the block was common to many differen=
t uses. The basic block appeared in the TR, Vanguard, Ensign, Leyland 15 an=
d 20 later on and in differing sizes for industrial applications. One basic=
 block, many different engine types! The =E2=80=9Cpaint codes, colours and =
shapes=E2=80=9D were worked out by engine assembly people in line with engi=
ne build sheets. They knew what they were doing and as long as the correct =
unit was built, no one else worried.
>     The story about Sir John Black and returning servicemen is another af=
fair of equal import. I wrote it out for TVT some years ago but someone cho=
pped lumps out of it and I vetoed the print because it gave a rather differ=
ent and by no means as comprehensive account, and skewed the narrative to B=
lack=E2=80=99s disadvantage.
>=20
>     Jonmac
>=20
>     Sent from my iPad
>=20
>     On 10 Feb 2019, at 16:34, Don Hiscock < [email-masked] mailto:=
[email-masked] > wrote:
>=20
>=20
>         > >         My April 1962 TR3B=E2=80=99s engine=E2=80=99s marshal=
ing marks were brushed for sure.=20
> >=20
> >         On Sunday, February 10, 2019, Stan Foster < [email-masked] mai=
lto:[email-masked] > wrote:
> >=20
> >             > > >=20
> > >             The few that I have seen personally have a brushed appear=
ance. =C2=BE inch wide, coarse brush. A one armed man can still use a brush=
.
> > >=20
> > >             =20
> > >=20
> > >             Stan
> > >=20
> > >             =20
> > >=20
> > >             From: Triumphs <[email-masked] mailto:tr=
[email-masked] > On Behalf Of Don Hiscock
> > >             To: Lawarence Schwartz <[email-masked] mailto:[email-masked]=
m >
> > >             Cc: Triumphs <[email-masked] mailto:triumphs@aut=
ox.team.net >
> > >             Perhaps our forum friend John Macartney canl come in with=
 more and better information, but Sir John Black made a real commitment to =
disabled war vets.  S-T found productive work for many, for years and years=
.  It wouldn't surprise me at all that one of those positions was marking e=
ngines.
> > >=20
> > >             =20
> > >=20
> > >             Don
> > >=20
> > >             1962 TR3B TSF202L
> > >=20
> > >             =20
> > >=20
> > >             On Sun, Feb 10, 2019 at 7:06 AM Lawarence Schwartz <L1j1s=
@aol.com mailto:[email-masked] > wrote:
> > >=20
> > >                 > > > >=20
> > > >                 With reference to the Tr3 engine  block markings I =
remember reading several years ago along with having conversations a Tr gat=
herings that at the end of the engine production line there was one employe=
e with only one arm and he was responsible for writing TR 3 using just one =
finger which he zipped into the orange red paint and scribbled the markings=
 on the engine block. Larry Schwartz
> > > >=20
> > > >                 Sent from my iPhone
> > > >=20
> > > >=20
> > > >                 On Jan 18, 2019, at 12:44 AM, wbeech <wbeech@flash.=
net mailto:[email-masked] > wrote:
> > > >=20
> > > >                     > > > > >=20
> > > > >                     Great picture Don, I have always re-painted t=
he orange =E2=80=9CTR3=E2=80=9D after an engine rebuild, used Chevrolet eng=
ine orange.  Had never seen the china marker markings before.
> > > > >=20
> > > > >                     Bill
> > > > >=20
> > > > >                     =20
> > > > >=20
> > > > >                     From: Triumphs [mailto:triumphs-bounces@autox=
.team.net mailto:[email-masked] ] On Behalf Of Don Hiscock
> > > > >                     To: John Macartney <[email-masked]=
.uk mailto:[email-masked] >; Triumphs <[email-masked]=
t mailto:[email-masked] >
> > > > >                     Here's an image of the Coventry assembly line=
 taken by a member of the tour group on Triumph USA's 1958 Rally of Europe =
for new owners who took their delivery at the factory and toured the Contin=
ent.  One can see some of the various marshalling marks on the engines read=
y to be used on the line.
> > > > >=20
> > > > >                     https://photos.smugmug.com/photos/i-b5KrzK2/0=
/86ac2744/O/i-b5KrzK2.jpg https://photos.smugmug.com/photos/i-b5KrzK2/0/86a=
c2744/O/i-b5KrzK2.jpg
> > > > >=20
> > > > >                     =20
> > > > >=20
> > > > >                     On Thu, Jan 17, 2019 at 5:38 PM John Macartne=
y <[email-masked] mailto:[email-masked] > wrote=
:
> > > > >=20
> > > > >                         > > > > > >=20
> > > > > >                         Thing is Jack, that this far down the t=
rack, no one knows! In fact, I doubt the majority of people at the factory =
did either:)
> > > > > >=20
> > > > > >                         =20
> > > > > >=20
> > > > > >                         Cheers, John
> > > > > >=20
> > > > > >                         Sent from my iPad
> > > > > >=20
> > > > > >=20
> > > > > >                         On 17 Jan 2019, at 17:50, Jack McGahey =
<[email-masked] mailto:[email-masked] > wrote:
> > > > > >=20
> > > > > >                             > > > > > > >=20
> > > > > > >                             I have those markings on my TR6 b=
lock - reapplied after engine rebuild during restoration.
> > > > > > >=20
> > > > > > >                             =20
> > > > > > >=20
> > > > > > >                             I can=E2=80=99t speak about TRA, =
but I can say that neither VTR or 6-pack look for these markings, or deduct=
 for their absence, during Concours judging - and I=E2=80=99ve never heard =
anybody say they knew what they meant or why they are there.=20
> > > > > > >=20
> > > > > > >                             =20
> > > > > > >=20
> > > > > > >                             Cheers,
> > > > > > >=20
> > > > > > >                             Jack Mc
> > > > > > >=20
> > > > > > >                             Sent from my iPad
> > > > > > >=20
> > > > > > >=20
> > > > > > >                             On Jan 17, 2019, at 9:27 AM, John=
 Macartney <[email-masked] mailto:[email-masked]=
k > wrote:
> > > > > > >=20
> > > > > > >                                 > > > > > > > >=20
> > > > > > > >                                 Jim
> > > > > > > >=20
> > > > > > > >                                 =20
> > > > > > > >=20
> > > > > > > >                                 In the rebuild of your car,=
 did you by chance find any obscure markings in yellow or white chinagraph =
chalk on the engine block? These were common identifiers used at the factor=
y that were understood by those who worked in engine assembly =E2=80=93 but=
 no-one else. Primarily, the mark was to distinguish the machined but unass=
embled block as being an ultimate engine for a North America spec car. Not =
all the blocks had these marks but I do know many others have encountered t=
hem years later and wondered what the hell they were. Being anxious to repl=
icate what had been there after re-painting the block, they replaced the co=
de. I=E2=80=99d be very surprised if TRA or VTR have extra marks in their j=
udging books =E2=80=93 or even deduct marks if they weren=E2=80=99t there.
> > > > > > > >=20
> > > > > > > >                                 =20
> > > > > > > >=20
> > > > > > > >                                 Cheers, Jonmac
> > > > > > > >=20
> > > > > > > >                                 =20
> > > > > > > >=20
> > > > > > > >                                 From: Triumphs <triumphs-bo=
[email-masked] mailto:[email-masked] > On Behalf Of J=
im Henningsen
> > > > > > > >                                 To: [email-masked] mailto=
:[email-masked]
> > > > > > > >                                 Cc: Triumphs <triumphs@auto=
x.team.net mailto:[email-masked] >
> > > > > > > >                                 Subject: Re: [TR] Paint cod=
e
> > > > > > > >=20
> > > > > > > >                                 =20
> > > > > > > >=20
> > > > > > > >                                 Bill:
> > > > > > > >=20
> > > > > > > >                                 I have the TRA judging guid=
e for the TR4 and have been using it as my plumb line for the restoration g=
oing back to 2010 when I purchased the car.  The trick is what to tell the =
auto paint store for a color to match that would be acceptable to judges.  =
My goal isn=E2=80=99t to beat everyone in a concours but to faithfully recr=
eate the car as it was born.  I am not interested in trophies.  Over the 8 =
years restoring this car, s I have sometimes found it hard to get info from=
 the expert judges and respected restorers of these cars. I=E2=80=99d love =
to know more specifics on the color and or source that experts in TRA think=
 correct.  Also, I heard Macy=E2=80=99s Garage had an early TR4at the last =
TRA event.  Does anyone have any detailed photos of that car they could sha=
re.  The few I saw looked magnificent and they have such a great reputation=
. =20
> > > > > > > >=20
> > > > > > > >                                 Thanks so much,
> > > > > > > >=20
> > > > > > > >                                 Jim Henningsen
> > > > > > > >=20
> > > > > > > >                                 Sent from my iPad
> > > > > > > >=20
> > > > > > > >=20
> > > > > > > >                                 On Jan 16, 2019, at 10:42 P=
M, [email-masked] mailto:[email-masked] <[email-masked] mailto:wbeech=
@flash.net > wrote:
> > > > > > > > >                                     Judging guide Referen=
ce Should be TRA, my oversight.=20
> > > > > > > > >                                     On Jan 16, 2019, at 8=
:29 PM, [email-masked] mailto:[email-masked] <[email-masked] mailto:w=
[email-masked] > wrote:
> > > > > > > > >                                     If y=E2=80=99all will=
 allow one more =E2=80=9Cauthority=E2=80=9D to weigh in, the VTR Judging Gu=
idlines state, =E2=80=9CThe canister is painted ice blue (specific color un=
known) which takes a pale green caste with age.=E2=80=9D
> > > > > > > > >                                     I=E2=80=99ll stick wi=
th my Valspar Peacock Blue.=20
> > > > > > > > >                                     Sent from my Motorola=
 8000X
> > > > > > > > >                                     On Jan 16, 2019, at 2=
:09 PM, Don Hiscock <[email-masked] mailto:[email-masked] > w=
rote:
> > > > > > > > >                                     The TR Register (UK) =
forum had a thread on the subject of oil filter canister housings a few yea=
rs ago.
> > > > > > > > >                                     https://www.tr-regist=
er.co.uk/forums/index.php?/topic/44252-oil-filter-bowl/ https://wwwtr-regis=
ter.co.uk/forums/index.php?/topic/44252-oil-filter-bowl/
> > > > > > > > >                                     Note especially the c=
omments by our late, great friend Alec Pringle about his experience with lo=
ts of variations and the quite realistic comment that S-T were a lot more w=
orried about keeping lines going and spares supplied than getting details "=
right" around shade.
> > > > > > > > >                                     The thread has some u=
seful info, but this is one of those don't-sweat-it subjects around our car=
s.
> > > > > > > > >                                     On Tue, Jan 15, 2019 =
at 11:01 PM James Henningsen <[email-masked] mailto:[email-masked] > =
wrote:
> > > > > > > > >                                         > > > > > > > > >=
> > > > > > > > > >                                         Anyone have a s=
ource for correct paint color on early 1962 TR4 oil filter canister housing=
.  TRA judging manual says ice blue that patinas to a pale green.  Looking =
for a color code I can give my paint shop.   Thanks to any concours experts=
 out there.
> > > > > > > > > >                                         Sent from my iP=
hone
> > > > > > > > > >                                         ** triumphs@aut=
ox.team.net mailto:[email-masked] **
> > > > > > > > > >                                         Donate: http://=
www.team.net/donate.html http://www.team.net/donate.html
> > > > > > > > > >                                         Archive: http:/=
/www.team.net/pipermail/triumphs http://www.team.net/pipermail/triumphs   h=
ttp://www.team.net/archive
> > > > > > > > > >                                         Unsubscribe/Man=
age: http://autoxteam.net/mailman/options/triumphs/[email-masked] ht=
tp://autox.team.net/mailman/options/triumphs/[email-masked]
> > > > > > > > > >                                     > > > > > > > > >=
=20
> > > > > > > > >                                     ** [email-masked]=
m.net mailto:[email-masked] **
> > > > > > > > >                                     Donate: http://www.te=
am.net/donate.html http://www.team.net/donate.html
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eam.net/pipermail/triumphs http://www.team.net/pipermail/triumphs  http://w=
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ttp://autox.team.net/mailman/options/triumphs/[email-masked] http://autox=
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mnet mailto:[email-masked] **
> > > > > > > > >                                     Donate: http://www.te=
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> > > > > > > > >=20
> > > > > > > > >                                 > > > > > > > >=20
> > > > > > > >                                 =20
> > > > > > > >=20
> > > > > > > >                                 [https://ipmcdn.avast.com/i=
mages/icons/icon-envelope-tick-round-orange-animated-no-repeat-v1.gif] http=
s://www.avast.com/sig-email?utm_medium=3Demail&utm_source=3Dlink&utm_campai=
gn=3Dsig-email&utm_content=3Demailclient
> > > > > > > >=20
> > > > > > > >                                 Virus-free. www.avast.com h=
ttps://www.avast.com/sig-email?utm_medium=3Demail&utm_source=3Dlink&utm_cam=
paign=3Dsig-email&utm_content=3Demailclient
> > > > > > > >=20
> > > > > > > >                             > > > > > > >=20
> > > > > > >                                 > > > > > > > >=20
> > > > > > > >                                 ** [email-masked] =
mailto:[email-masked] **
> > > > > > > >=20
> > > > > > > >                                 Donate: http://www.team.net=
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> > > > > > > >=20
> > > > > > > >                             > > > > > > >=20
> > > > > > >                         > > > > > >=20
> > > > > >                         ** [email-masked] mailto:trium=
[email-masked] **
> > > > > >=20
> > > > > >                         Donate: http://www.team.net/donate.html=
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ve
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> > > > > >                         Unsubscribe/Manage: http://autoxteam.ne=
t/mailman/options/triumphs/[email-masked] http://autox.team.net/mail=
man/options/triumphs/[email-masked]
> > > > > >=20
> > > > > >                     > > > > >=20
> > > > >                 > > > >=20
> > > >                     > > > > >=20
> > > > >                     ** [email-masked] mailto:triumphs@au=
tox.team.net **
> > > > >=20
> > > > >                     Donate: http://www.team.net/donate.html http:=
//www.team.net/donate.html
> > > > >                     Archive: http://www.team.net/pipermail/triump=
hs http://www.team.net/pipermail/triumphs  http://www.team.net/archive
> > > > >=20
> > > > >                     Unsubscribe/Manage: http://autox.team.net/mai=
lman/options/triumphs/[email-masked] http://autox.team.net/mailman/options/t=
riumphs/[email-masked]
> > > > >=20
> > > > >                 > > > >=20
> > > >             > > >=20
> > >         > >=20
> >     >=20
>         > >         ** [email-masked] mailto:[email-masked]=
.net **
> >         Archive: http://www.team.net/pipermail/triumphs  http://www.tea=
m.net/archive
> >=20
> >         Unsubscribe/Manage: http://autox.team.net/mailman/options/trium=
phs/[email-masked]

=20

>     Archive: http://www.team.net/pipermail/triumphs http://www.team.net/a=
rchive
>=20
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    <meta charset=3D"UTF-8">
</head><body><p style=3D"font-size: 12pt; font-family: helvetica, arial, sa=
ns-serif; color: rgb(51, 51, 51);">When I restored my TR3 back in 2004&#39;=
ish, it took a total re-start, including a bit of welding at the frame.&#16=
0; The block was, I though, solid, but turns out the machinist found cracks=
 in the webbing that supported the liners.&#160; A List member gave me a fr=
ee block.&#160; Only cost was a trip to Connecticut to pick it up.&#160; So=
lid cars.&#160; <br></p><blockquote type=3D"cite">On February 10, 2019 at 4=
:45 PM John Macartney &#60;[email-masked]&#62; wrote: <br> <b=
r>Makes me laugh sometimes when this lore comes back. Ye gods, Standard cou=
ld afford to provide a one armed war wounded man a paintbrush!!!<div>What s=
o many over the pond continuously fail to appreciate when it comes to the w=
et liner four pot is that the block was common to many different uses. The =
basic block appeared in the TR, Vanguard, Ensign, Leyland 15 and 20 later o=
n and in differing sizes for industrial applications. One basic block, many=
 different engine types! The &#8220;paint codes, colours and shapes&#8221; =
were worked out by engine assembly people in line with engine build sheets.=
 They knew what they were doing and as long as the correct unit was built, =
no one else worried.</div><div>The story about Sir John Black and returning=
 servicemen is another affair of equal import. I wrote it out for TVT some =
years ago but someone chopped lumps out of it and I vetoed the print becaus=
e it gave a rather different and by no means as comprehensive account, and =
skewed the narrative to Black&#8217;s disadvantage.</div><div><br></div><di=
v>Jonmac <br> <br><div id=3D"ox-e42666aa1a-AppleMailSignature" dir=3D"ltr">=
Sent from my iPad</div><div dir=3D"ltr"><br>On 10 Feb 2019, at 16:34, Don H=
iscock &#60; <a href=3D"mailto:[email-masked]">[email-masked]=
</a>&#62; wrote: <br> <br></div><blockquote type=3D"cite"><div dir=3D"ltr">=
My April 1962 TR3B&#8217;s engine&#8217;s marshaling marks were brushed for=
 sure.&#160; <br> <br>On Sunday, February 10, 2019, Stan Foster &#60; <a hr=
ef=3D"mailto:[email-masked]">[email-masked]</a>&#62; wrote: <br><blockquo=
te><div><div><p class=3D"ox-e42666aa1a-MsoNormal">The few that I have seen =
personally have a brushed appearance. &#190; inch wide, coarse brush. A one=
 armed man can still use a brush.<u></u><u></u></p><p class=3D"ox-e42666aa1=
a-MsoNormal"><u></u>&#160;<u></u></p><p class=3D"ox-e42666aa1a-MsoNormal">S=
tan<u></u><u></u></p><p class=3D"ox-e42666aa1a-MsoNormal"><u></u>&#160;<u><=
/u></p><p class=3D"ox-e42666aa1a-MsoNormal"><strong>From:</strong> Triumphs=
 &#60;<a href=3D"mailto:[email-masked]" target=3D"_blank" =
rel=3D"noopener">[email-masked].<wbr/>net</a>&#62; <strong>On =
Behalf Of </strong>Don Hiscock<br> <strong>Sent:</strong> Sunday, February =
10, 2019 8:25 AM<br> <strong>To:</strong> Lawarence Schwartz &#60;<a href=
=3D"mailto:[email-masked]" target=3D"_blank" rel=3D"noopener">[email-masked]<=
/a>&#62;<br> <strong>Cc:</strong> Triumphs &#60;<a href=3D"mailto:triumphs@=
autox.team.net" target=3D"_blank" rel=3D"noopener">[email-masked]<=
/a>&#62;<br> <strong>Subject:</strong> Re: [TR] Paint code<u></u><u></u></p=
><p class=3D"ox-e42666aa1a-MsoNormal"><u></u>&#160;<u></u></p><div><p class=
=3D"ox-e42666aa1a-MsoNormal">Perhaps our forum friend John Macartney canl c=
ome in with more and better information, but Sir John Black made a real com=
mitment to disabled war vets.&#160; S-T found productive work for many, for=
 years and years.&#160; It wouldn&#39;t surprise me at all that one of thos=
e positions was marking engines.<u></u><u></u></p><div><p class=3D"ox-e4266=
6aa1a-MsoNormal"><u></u>&#160;<u></u></p></div><div><p class=3D"ox-e42666aa=
1a-MsoNormal">Don<u></u><u></u></p></div><div><p class=3D"ox-e42666aa1a-Mso=
Normal">1962 TR3B TSF202L<u></u><u></u></p></div></div><p class=3D"ox-e4266=
6aa1a-MsoNormal"><u></u>&#160;<u></u></p><div><div><p class=3D"ox-e42666aa1=
a-MsoNormal">On Sun, Feb 10, 2019 at 7:06 AM Lawarence Schwartz &#60;<a hre=
f=3D"mailto:[email-masked]" target=3D"_blank" rel=3D"noopener">[email-masked]=
</a>&#62; wrote:<u></u><u></u></p></div><blockquote><div><p class=3D"ox-e42=
666aa1a-MsoNormal" style=3D"margin-bottom: 12.0pt;">With reference to the T=
r3 engine &#160;block markings I remember reading several years ago along w=
ith having conversations a Tr gatherings that at the end of the engine prod=
uction line there was one employee with only one arm and he was responsible=
 for writing TR 3 using just one finger which he zipped into the orange red=
 paint and scribbled the markings on the engine block. Larry Schwartz<u></u=
><u></u></p><div><p class=3D"ox-e42666aa1a-MsoNormal">Sent from my iPhone<u=
></u><u></u></p></div><div><p class=3D"ox-e42666aa1a-MsoNormal" style=3D"ma=
rgin-bottom: 12.0pt;"><br> On Jan 18, 2019, at 12:44 AM, wbeech &#60;<a hre=
f=3D"mailto:[email-masked]" target=3D"_blank" rel=3D"noopener">wbeech@fla=
sh.net</a>&#62; wrote:<u></u><u></u></p></div><blockquote><div><div><p clas=
s=3D"ox-e42666aa1a-MsoNormal"><span style=3D"color: #1f497d;">Great picture=
 Don, I have always re-painted the orange &#8220;TR3&#8221; after an engine=
 rebuild, used Chevrolet engine orange.&#160; Had never seen the china mark=
er markings before.</span><u></u><u></u></p><p class=3D"ox-e42666aa1a-MsoNo=
rmal"><span style=3D"color: #1f497d;">Bill</span><u></u><u></u></p><p class=
=3D"ox-e42666aa1a-MsoNormal"><span style=3D"color: #1f497d;">&#160;</span><=
u></u><u></u></p><p class=3D"ox-e42666aa1a-MsoNormal"><strong>From:</strong=
> Triumphs [<a href=3D"mailto:[email-masked]" target=3D"_b=
lank" rel=3D"noopener">mailto:triumphs-bounces@<wbr/>autox.team.net</a>] <s=
trong>On Behalf Of </strong>Don Hiscock<br> <strong>Sent:</strong> Thursday=
, January 17, 2019 5:47 PM<br> <strong>To:</strong> John Macartney &#60;<a =
href=3D"mailto:[email-masked]" target=3D"_blank" rel=3D"noope=
ner">[email-masked]</a>&#62;<wbr/>; Triumphs &#60;<a href=3D"=
mailto:[email-masked]" target=3D"_blank" rel=3D"noopener">triumphs=
@autox.team.net</a>&#62;<br> <strong>Subject:</strong> Re: [TR] Paint code<=
u></u><u></u></p><p class=3D"ox-e42666aa1a-MsoNormal">&#160;<u></u><u></u><=
/p><div><div><p class=3D"ox-e42666aa1a-MsoNormal">Here&#39;s an image of th=
e Coventry assembly line taken by a member of the tour group on Triumph USA=
&#39;s 1958 Rally of Europe for new owners who took their delivery at the f=
actory and toured the Continent.&#160; One can see some of the various mars=
halling marks on the engines ready to be used on the line.<u></u><u></u></p=
><div><p class=3D"ox-e42666aa1a-MsoNormal"><a href=3D"https://photos.smugmu=
g.com/photos/i-b5KrzK2/0/86ac2744/O/i-b5KrzK2.jpg" target=3D"_blank" rel=3D=
"noopener">https://photos.smugmug.com/<wbr/>photos/i-b5KrzK2/0/86ac2744/O/<=
wbr/>i-b5KrzK2.jpg</a><u></u><u></u></p></div></div></div><p class=3D"ox-e4=
2666aa1a-MsoNormal">&#160;<u></u><u></u></p><div><div><p class=3D"ox-e42666=
aa1a-MsoNormal">On Thu, Jan 17, 2019 at 5:38 PM John Macartney &#60;<a href=
=3D"mailto:[email-masked]" target=3D"_blank" rel=3D"noopener"=
>[email-masked]</a>&#62; wrote:<u></u><u></u></p></div><block=
quote><div><p class=3D"ox-e42666aa1a-MsoNormal">Thing is Jack, that this fa=
r down the track, no one knows! In fact, I doubt the majority of people at =
the factory did either:)<u></u><u></u></p><div><p class=3D"ox-e42666aa1a-Ms=
oNormal">&#160;<u></u><u></u></p></div><div><p class=3D"ox-e42666aa1a-MsoNo=
rmal" style=3D"margin-bottom: 12.0pt;">Cheers, John<u></u><u></u></p><div><=
p class=3D"ox-e42666aa1a-MsoNormal">Sent from my iPad<u></u><u></u></p></di=
v><div><p class=3D"ox-e42666aa1a-MsoNormal" style=3D"margin-bottom: 12.0pt;=
"><br> On 17 Jan 2019, at 17:50, Jack McGahey &#60;<a href=3D"mailto:McGahe=
[email-masked]" target=3D"_blank" rel=3D"noopener">[email-masked]</a>&#62; =
wrote:<u></u><u></u></p></div><blockquote><div><p class=3D"ox-e42666aa1a-Ms=
oNormal">I have those markings on my TR6 block - reapplied after engine reb=
uild during restoration.<u></u><u></u></p><div><p class=3D"ox-e42666aa1a-Ms=
oNormal">&#160;<u></u><u></u></p></div><div><p class=3D"ox-e42666aa1a-MsoNo=
rmal">I can&#8217;t speak about TRA, but I can say that neither VTR or 6-pa=
ck look for these markings, or deduct for their absence, during Concours ju=
dging - and I&#8217;ve never heard anybody say they knew what they meant or=
 why they are there.&#160;<u></u><u></u></p></div><div><p class=3D"ox-e4266=
6aa1a-MsoNormal">&#160;<u></u><u></u></p></div><div><p class=3D"ox-e42666aa=
1a-MsoNormal">Cheers,<u></u><u></u></p></div><div><p class=3D"ox-e42666aa1a=
-MsoNormal" style=3D"margin-bottom: 12.0pt;">Jack Mc<u></u><u></u></p><div>=
<p class=3D"ox-e42666aa1a-MsoNormal">Sent from my iPad<u></u><u></u></p></d=
iv><div><p class=3D"ox-e42666aa1a-MsoNormal" style=3D"margin-bottom: 12.0pt=
;"><br> On Jan 17, 2019, at 9:27 AM, John Macartney &#60;<a href=3D"mailto:=
[email-masked]" target=3D"_blank" rel=3D"noopener">john.macar=
[email-masked]</a>&#62; wrote:<u></u><u></u></p></div><blockquote><div>=
<div><p class=3D"ox-e42666aa1a-MsoNormal">Jim<u></u><u></u></p><p class=3D"=
ox-e42666aa1a-MsoNormal">&#160;<u></u><u></u></p><p class=3D"ox-e42666aa1a-=
MsoNormal">In the rebuild of your car, did you by chance find any obscure m=
arkings in yellow or white chinagraph chalk on the engine block? These were=
 common identifiers used at the factory that were understood by those who w=
orked in engine assembly &#8211; but no-one else. Primarily, the mark was t=
o distinguish the machined but unassembled block as being an ultimate engin=
e for a North America spec car. Not all the blocks had these marks but I do=
 know many others have encountered them years later and wondered what the h=
ell they were. Being anxious to replicate what had been there after re-pain=
ting the block, they replaced the code. I&#8217;d be very surprised if TRA =
or VTR have extra marks in their judging books &#8211; or even deduct marks=
 if they weren&#8217;t there.<u></u><u></u></p><p class=3D"ox-e42666aa1a-Ms=
oNormal">&#160;<u></u><u></u></p><p class=3D"ox-e42666aa1a-MsoNormal">Cheer=
s, Jonmac<u></u><u></u></p><p class=3D"ox-e42666aa1a-MsoNormal">&#160;<u></=
u><u></u></p><div><div style=3D"border: none; border-top: solid #e1e1e1 1.0=
pt; padding: 3.0pt 0in 0in 0in;"><p class=3D"ox-e42666aa1a-MsoNormal"><stro=
ng>From:</strong> Triumphs &#60;<a href=3D"mailto:[email-masked]=
am.net" target=3D"_blank" rel=3D"noopener">triumphs-bounces@autox.<wbr/>tea=
mnet</a>&#62; <strong>On Behalf Of </strong>Jim Henningsen<br> <strong>Sent=
:</strong> 17 January 2019 12:31<br> <strong>To:</strong> <a href=3D"mailto=
:[email-masked]" target=3D"_blank" rel=3D"noopener">[email-masked]</a><=
br> <strong>Cc:</strong> Triumphs &#60;<a href=3D"mailto:[email-masked]=
m.net" target=3D"_blank" rel=3D"noopener">[email-masked]</a>&#62;<=
br> <strong>Subject:</strong> Re: [TR] Paint code<u></u><u></u></p></div></=
div><p class=3D"ox-e42666aa1a-MsoNormal">&#160;<u></u><u></u></p><p class=
=3D"ox-e42666aa1a-MsoNormal">Bill:<u></u><u></u></p><div><p class=3D"ox-e42=
666aa1a-MsoNormal">I have the TRA judging guide for the TR4 and have been u=
sing it as my plumb line for the restoration going back to 2010 when I purc=
hased the car.&#160; The trick is what to tell the auto paint store for a c=
olor to match that would be acceptable to judges.&#160; My goal isn&#8217;t=
 to beat everyone in a concours but to faithfully recreate the car as it wa=
s born.&#160; I am not interested in trophies.&#160; Over the 8 years resto=
ring this car, s I have sometimes found it hard to get info from the expert=
 judges and respected restorers of these cars. I&#8217;d love to know more =
specifics on the color and or source that experts in TRA think correct.&#16=
0; Also, I heard Macy&#8217;s Garage had an early TR4at the last TRA event.=
&#160; Does anyone have any detailed photos of that car they could share.&#=
160; The few I saw looked magnificent and they have such a great reputation=
. &#160;<u></u><u></u></p></div><div><p class=3D"ox-e42666aa1a-MsoNormal">T=
hanks so much,<u></u><u></u></p></div><div><p class=3D"ox-e42666aa1a-MsoNor=
mal" style=3D"margin-bottom: 12.0pt;">Jim Henningsen<u></u><u></u></p><div>=
<p class=3D"ox-e42666aa1a-MsoNormal">Sent from my iPad<u></u><u></u></p></d=
iv><div><p class=3D"ox-e42666aa1a-MsoNormal" style=3D"margin-bottom: 12.0pt=
;"><br> On Jan 16, 2019, at 10:42 PM, <a href=3D"mailto:[email-masked]" t=
arget=3D"_blank" rel=3D"noopener">[email-masked]</a> &#60;<a href=3D"mail=
to:[email-masked]" target=3D"_blank" rel=3D"noopener">[email-masked]</a=
>&#62; wrote:<u></u><u></u></p></div><blockquote><div><div><p class=3D"ox-e=
42666aa1a-MsoNormal">Judging guide Reference Should be TRA, my oversight.&#=
160;<u></u><u></u></p></div><div><p class=3D"ox-e42666aa1a-MsoNormal">Bill<=
u></u><u></u></p></div><div><p class=3D"ox-e42666aa1a-MsoNormal">&#160;<u><=
/u><u></u></p></div><div><p class=3D"ox-e42666aa1a-MsoNormal" style=3D"marg=
in-bottom: 12.0pt;">On Jan 16, 2019, at 8:29 PM, <a href=3D"mailto:Wbeech@f=
lash.net" target=3D"_blank" rel=3D"noopener">[email-masked]</a> &#60;<a h=
ref=3D"mailto:[email-masked]" target=3D"_blank" rel=3D"noopener">wbeech@f=
lash.net</a>&#62; wrote:<u></u><u></u></p></div><div><p class=3D"ox-e42666a=
a1a-MsoNormal">If y&#8217;all will allow one more &#8220;authority&#8221; t=
o weigh in, the VTR Judging Guidlines state, &#8220;The canister is painted=
 ice blue (specific color unknown) which takes a pale green caste with age.=
&#8221;<u></u><u></u></p><div><p class=3D"ox-e42666aa1a-MsoNormal">&#160;<u=
></u><u></u></p></div><div><p class=3D"ox-e42666aa1a-MsoNormal">I&#8217;ll =
stick with my Valspar Peacock Blue.&#160;<u></u><u></u></p></div><div><p cl=
ass=3D"ox-e42666aa1a-MsoNormal">&#160;<u></u><u></u></p></div><div><p class=
=3D"ox-e42666aa1a-MsoNormal">Cheers,<u></u><u></u></p></div><div><p class=
=3D"ox-e42666aa1a-MsoNormal" style=3D"margin-bottom: 12.0pt;">Bill<u></u><u=
></u></p><div><p class=3D"ox-e42666aa1a-MsoNormal">Sent from my Motorola 80=
00X<u></u><u></u></p></div><div><p class=3D"ox-e42666aa1a-MsoNormal" style=
=3D"margin-bottom: 12.0pt;"><br> On Jan 16, 2019, at 2:09 PM, Don Hiscock &=
#60;<a href=3D"mailto:[email-masked]" target=3D"_blank" rel=3D"noope=
ner">[email-masked]</a>&#62; wrote:<u></u><u></u></p></div><div><div=
><div><p class=3D"ox-e42666aa1a-MsoNormal">The TR Register (UK) forum had a=
 thread on the subject of oil filter canister housings a few years ago.<u><=
/u><u></u></p><div><p class=3D"ox-e42666aa1a-MsoNormal"><a href=3D"https://=
wwwtr-register.co.uk/forums/index.php?/topic/44252-oil-filter-bowl/" target=
=3D"_blank" rel=3D"noopener">https://www.tr-register.co.uk/<wbr/>forums/ind=
ex.php?/topic/44252-<wbr/>oil-filter-bowl/</a><u></u><u></u></p></div><div>=
<p class=3D"ox-e42666aa1a-MsoNormal">&#160;<u></u><u></u></p></div><div><p =
class=3D"ox-e42666aa1a-MsoNormal">Note especially the comments by our late,=
 great friend Alec Pringle about his experience with lots of variations and=
 the quite realistic comment that S-T were a lot more worried about keeping=
 lines going and spares supplied than getting details &#34;right&#34; aroun=
d shade.<u></u><u></u></p></div><div><p class=3D"ox-e42666aa1a-MsoNormal">&=
#160;<u></u><u></u></p></div><div><p class=3D"ox-e42666aa1a-MsoNormal">The =
thread has some useful info, but this is one of those don&#39;t-sweat-it su=
bjects around our cars.<u></u><u></u></p></div><div><p class=3D"ox-e42666aa=
1a-MsoNormal">&#160;<u></u><u></u></p></div><div><p class=3D"ox-e42666aa1a-=
MsoNormal">Don<u></u><u></u></p></div><div><p class=3D"ox-e42666aa1a-MsoNor=
mal">1962 TR3B TSF202L<u></u><u></u></p></div></div></div><p class=3D"ox-e4=
2666aa1a-MsoNormal">&#160;<u></u><u></u></p><div><div><p class=3D"ox-e42666=
aa1a-MsoNormal">On Tue, Jan 15, 2019 at 11:01 PM James Henningsen &#60;<a h=
ref=3D"mailto:[email-masked]" target=3D"_blank" rel=3D"noopener">trguy75=
@gmail.com</a>&#62; wrote:<u></u><u></u></p></div><blockquote><p class=3D"o=
x-e42666aa1a-MsoNormal">Anyone have a source for correct paint color on ear=
ly 1962 TR4 oil filter canister housing.&#160; TRA judging manual says ice =
blue that patinas to a pale green.&#160; Looking for a color code I can giv=
e my paint shop.&#160; &#160;Thanks to any concours experts out there. <br>=
 Jim Henningsen <br> Ocala FL<br> <br> <br> Sent from my iPhone<br> ** <a h=
ref=3D"mailto:[email-masked]" target=3D"_blank" rel=3D"noopener">t=
[email-masked]</a> **<br> <br> Donate: <a href=3D"http://www.team.n=
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man/<wbr/>options/triumphs/don.hiscock@<wbr/>gmail.com</a><u></u><u></u></p=
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</u></p></div></blockquote></div></div><div><p class=3D"ox-e42666aa1a-MsoNo=
rmal">&#160;<u></u><u></u></p><table style=3D"border: none; border-top: sol=
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=20
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From: Geo Hahn <[email-masked]>
Date: Thu, 14 Feb 2019 18:45:53 -0700

--0000000000003178240581e4f0f9

--0000000000003178200581e4f0f7
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Listers -

Some years back Jonmac was kind enough to give me permission to repeat his
telling of this bit of STC history in our club newsletter.  I held it until
the November issue where is was most appropriate and well-received.

I have attached the PDF version of that newsletter with the story on page
3.  Hopefully it comes across okay, I do not recall how the list handles
attachments.

Geo

On Sun, Feb 10, 2019 at 6:30 PM John Macartney <[email-masked]=
k>
wrote:

Bill Beecher also asked much the same. I=E2=80=99m more than happy to reiss=
ue it
> but wouldn=E2=80=99t it be better if it was offered by one of you to TVT=
=E2=80=99s new
> editor? He says he wants material and I know that the history that Paul
> Richardson and I write about seems to have a US/Canada following. As Paul
> is TVTs UK correspondent, I think the matter needs to be squared with him
> first via the editor and if he wants what I wrote (which his predecessor
> preferred not to use) then I=E2=80=99m happy to send it over for everyone=
 to read.
> John, if you still have that  article I bet I=E2=80=99m not the only one =
that
> would like to see it. This was an important time for Triumph and the
> British car industry and the role that returning servicemen and women
> played a role would be of interest to me.
>
>
>
> Stan
>
>

--0000000000003178200581e4f0f7
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<div dir=3D"ltr"><div dir=3D"ltr">Listers -<div><br></div><div>Some years b=
ack Jonmac was kind enough to give me permission to repeat his telling of t=
his bit of STC history in our club newsletter.=C2=A0 I held it until the No=
vember issue where is was most appropriate and well-received.</div><div><br=
></div><div>I have attached the PDF version of that newsletter with the sto=
ry on page 3.=C2=A0 Hopefully it comes across okay, I do not recall how the=
 list handles attachments.</div><div><br></div><div>Geo</div></div><br><div=
 class=3D"gmail_quote"><div dir=3D"ltr" class=3D"gmail_attr">On Sun, Feb 10=
, 2019 at 6:30 PM John Macartney &lt;<a href=3D"mailto:John.Macartney@ukpip=
s.org.uk">[email-masked]</a>&gt; wrote:<br></div><div dir=3D"=
ltr" class=3D"gmail_attr"><br></div><blockquote class=3D"gmail_quote" style=
=3D"margin:0px 0px 0px 0.8ex;border-left:1px solid rgb(204,204,204);padding=
-left:1ex"><div dir=3D"auto">Bill Beecher also asked much the same. I=E2=80=
=99m more than happy to reissue it but wouldn=E2=80=99t it be better if it =
was offered by one of you to TVT=E2=80=99s new editor? He says he wants mat=
erial and I know that the history that Paul Richardson and I write about se=
ems to have a US/Canada following. As Paul is TVTs UK correspondent, I thin=
k the matter needs to be squared with him first via the editor and if he wa=
nts what I wrote (which his predecessor preferred not to use) then I=E2=80=
=99m happy to send it over for everyone to read.<div><br></div><div>Jonmac<=
br><br><div dir=3D"ltr"><br>On 10 Feb 2019, at 22:44, Stan Foster &lt;<a hr=
ef=3D"mailto:[email-masked]" target=3D"_blank">[email-masked]</a>&gt; wro=
te:<br><br></div><blockquote type=3D"cite"><div dir=3D"ltr">

<div class=3D"gmail-m_6827464817607404849WordSection1">
<p class=3D"MsoNormal">John, if you still have that=C2=A0 article I bet I=
=E2=80=99m not the only one that would like to see it. This was an importan=
t time for Triumph and the British car industry and the role that returning=
 servicemen and women played a role would be of interest
 to me.<u></u><u></u></p>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal"><u></u>=C2=A0<u></u></p>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal">Stan</p></div></div></blockquote></div></div>
</blockquote></div></div>

--0000000000003178200581e4f0f7--

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---

From: "[email-masked]" <[email-masked]>
Date: Thu, 14 Feb 2019 20:59:43 -0600

--===============4094549802278523651==
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	charset=utf-8
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Thank you Geo,
I remember that email and sharing it with our club back then.  A beautiful r=
eminder of using the abilities that one has and looking past those that are m=
issing.  I had recently purchased a new commission plate for my TR3, I decid=
ed not to use it. =20
Bill
TS30800L

Sent from my DynaTAC 8000X

On Feb 14, 2019, at 7:45 PM, Geo Hahn <[email-masked]> wrote:

Listers -

Some years back Jonmac was kind enough to give me permission to repeat his t=
elling of this bit of STC history in our club newsletter.  I held it until t=
he November issue where is was most appropriate and well-received.

I have attached the PDF version of that newsletter with the story on page 3.=
  Hopefully it comes across okay, I do not recall how the list handles attac=
hments.

Geo

> On Sun, Feb 10, 2019 at 6:30 PM John Macartney <[email-masked].=
uk> wrote:
>=20
> Bill Beecher also asked much the same. I=E2=80=99m more than happy to reis=
sue it but wouldn=E2=80=99t it be better if it was offered by one of you to T=
VT=E2=80=99s new editor? He says he wants material and I know that the histo=
ry that Paul Richardson and I write about seems to have a US/Canada followin=
g. As Paul is TVTs UK correspondent, I think the matter needs to be squared w=
ith him first via the editor and if he wants what I wrote (which his predece=
ssor preferred not to use) then I=E2=80=99m happy to send it over for everyo=
ne to read.
>> Stan

<November_2014.pdf>

ash.net

--Apple-Mail-BDF5CD37-414F-4253-9310-C7C6E620BF46
	charset=utf-8
Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable

<html><head><meta http-equiv=3D"content-type" content=3D"text/html; charset=3D=
utf-8"></head><body dir=3D"auto">Thank you Geo,<div>I remember that email an=
d sharing it with our club back then. &nbsp;A beautiful reminder of using th=
e abilities that one has and looking past those that are missing. &nbsp;I ha=
d recently purchased a new commission plate for my TR3, I decided not to use=
 it. &nbsp;</div><div>Bill</div><div>TS30800L<br><br><div id=3D"AppleMailSig=
nature" dir=3D"ltr">Sent from my DynaTAC 8000X</div><div dir=3D"ltr"><br>On =
Feb 14, 2019, at 7:45 PM, Geo Hahn &lt;<a href=3D"mailto:[email-masked]=
m">[email-masked]</a>&gt; wrote:<br><br></div><div dir=3D"ltr"><div di=
r=3D"ltr"><div dir=3D"ltr">Listers -<div><br></div><div>Some years back Jonm=
ac was kind enough to give me permission to repeat his telling of this bit o=
f STC history in our club newsletter.&nbsp; I held it until the November iss=
ue where is was most appropriate and well-received.</div><div><br></div><div=
>I have attached the PDF version of that newsletter with the story on page 3=
.&nbsp; Hopefully it comes across okay, I do not recall how the list handles=
 attachments.</div><div><br></div><div>Geo</div></div><br><div class=3D"gmai=
l_quote"><div dir=3D"ltr" class=3D"gmail_attr">On Sun, Feb 10, 2019 at 6:30 P=
M John Macartney &lt;<a href=3D"mailto:[email-masked]">John.Ma=
[email-masked]</a>&gt; wrote:<br></div><div dir=3D"ltr" class=3D"gmai=
l_attr"><br></div><blockquote class=3D"gmail_quote" style=3D"margin:0px 0px 0=
px 0.8ex;border-left:1px solid rgb(204,204,204);padding-left:1ex"><div dir=3D=
"auto">Bill Beecher also asked much the same. I=E2=80=99m more than happy to=
 reissue it but wouldn=E2=80=99t it be better if it was offered by one of yo=
u to TVT=E2=80=99s new editor? He says he wants material and I know that the=
 history that Paul Richardson and I write about seems to have a US/Canada fo=
llowing. As Paul is TVTs UK correspondent, I think the matter needs to be sq=
uared with him first via the editor and if he wants what I wrote (which his p=
redecessor preferred not to use) then I=E2=80=99m happy to send it over for e=
veryone to read.<div><br></div><div>Jonmac<br><br><div dir=3D"ltr"><br>On 10=
 Feb 2019, at 22:44, Stan Foster &lt;<a href=3D"mailto:[email-masked]" targ=
et=3D"_blank">[email-masked]</a>&gt; wrote:<br><br></div><blockquote type=3D=
"cite"><div dir=3D"ltr">

</div><div dir=3D"ltr">&lt;November_2014.pdf&gt;</div><div dir=3D"ltr"><span=
>** <a href=3D"mailto:[email-masked]">[email-masked]</a> *=
*</span><br><span></span><br><span>Donate: <a href=3D"http://www.team.net/do=
nate.html">http://www.team.net/donate.html</a></span><br><span>Archive: <a h=
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/triumphs</a> &nbsp;<a href=3D"http://www.team.net/archive">http://www.team.=
net/archive</a></span><br><span></span><br><span>Unsubscribe/Manage: <a href=
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autox.team.net/mailman/options/triumphs/[email-masked]</a></span><br></div=
></div></body></html>=

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