Subject: [TR] problem gas?

From: Bob Labuz <[email-masked]>
Date: Wed, 12 Jun 2013 10:03:50 -0400

The only engine I have trouble starting in the spring is the 
roto-tiller. I have to remove the air filter and spray gas in order to 
get it started. I then run it on 1/2 choke for about 5 minutes. Then it 
does run but sounds lean. One of these days I will have to remove the 
carb and clean it out.

The mower, snowblower and power washer seem to be fine.

I use stable in every engine when in storage.

Starting 2 years ago, I started running  alcohol free gas in all 3 
Triumphs. I hope it stays available.

No problems starting or running in the spring after at least a 6 month nap.

Stabil is also used in the cars.

The problem I have heard about alcohol is it will cause problems with 
the engine internal alloy parts.

Not sure what is true.

Another thing I have heard is that alcohol does not pack as much punch 
as gas. But if that is so, why do some dragsters use 100% alcohol?

Bob

** [email-masked] **

Archive: http://www.team.net/archive

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From: Berger Bob <[email-masked]>
Date: Wed, 12 Jun 2013 09:17:16 -0500

I normally dont have problems with the fuel in my spitfire, but this past
weekend my manual choke would not return all the way when I pushed it off.
The knob was all the way in so I had to manually twist the choke mechanism to
get it to shut off.  I havent taken it apart yet to diagnose the problem but
Im wondering if it is gummed up.

Ill start by disconnecting the cable and see if the spring will return it on
its own.

Bob Berger
78 Spitfire
St. Louis, MO
NASS #627

On Jun 12, 2013, at 8:39 AM, Gary Klein wrote:

> Pretty certain.  The carbs idle jets in the mower/snowblower/generator
> become clogged and the engines will not idle correctly, if at all.
> Starting is a PIA.  The mower would not idle and Id have to increase the
> throttle slightly to get it to idle but even then, it would hunt.  Had to
> take off the carbs in each case and clean them and that's when I discovered
> the problem.
>
> My TR6 sits the most and it will start but it runs like crap and like the
> mower, needs some choke to idle.  I started using SeaFoam in it last year
> and it helped but not completely.  After I complete a few honeydew
> projects, I plan on removing and cleaning the carbs as I expect their idle
> circuits as clogged as well.
>
> The TR8 gets the most use and for the most part its OK.   I have
> experienced a strange loss of power situation.  The engine will not develop
> enough power to maintain even 55 mph.  I think, but have not verified,
> that perhaps one carb float valve may be sticking.  This occurred last year
> at the beginning of the driving season and once again before heading off to
> the Gathering in April.  What I did was to run a high concentration of
> Techron in the tank and it stopped the problem.  Is it the gas in this
> case?  Maybe or maybe not but Im thinking about removing the carbs and
> inspect them on the 8 after I get the 6 sorted out.
>
> So from my experience, I am fairly certain in at least the power equipment,
> it's the gas and I expect it's also a problem with the cars.
>
> Gary
>
> ---------------
>
> Date: Wed, 12 Jun 2013 07:53:59 -0400
> From: "Jerry Van Vlack" <[email-masked]>
> To: <[email-masked]>, <[email-masked]>
> Subject: Re: [TR] Fwd:  problem gas?
> Message-ID: <E51971E39E4440B69670B21E432B5951@UserTHINK>
> Content-Type: text/plain; format=flowed; charset="iso-8859-1";
> 	reply-type=original
>
> I have the same experience, car sits all winter with the gas that remained
> from the fall and fires up and runs fine at first spring start.
> Are you sure it's the gas?
>
> JVV
>
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From: Don Hiscock <[email-masked]>
Date: Wed, 12 Jun 2013 10:27:43 -0400

"Alcohol" is a general descriptor of a chemical class, not any particular
molecule.  Dragsters used methanol (a 1-carbon alcohol), and biofuels are
normally ethanol (2-carbon).  These alcohols have the advantage of high
octane ratings, and racers liked the detonation resistance fershure.  I'm
not sure how much "fuel" is methanol anymore -- others can probably update
us there.

>From Wikipedia:
One liter of ethanol contain 21.1 MJ, a liter of methanol 15.8 MJ and a
liter of gasoline approximately 32.6 MJ. In other words, for the same
energy content as one liter or one gallon of gasoline, one needs 1.6
liters/gallons of ethanol and 2.1 liters/gallons of methanol.

The one to watch is butanol -- the 4-carbon alcohol.  This one has energy
density similar to gasoline and easier storage/transport.  The biofuels
guys are working now on conventional or enzymatic cracking techniques to
take ethanol to butanol.

Don

On Wed, Jun 12, 2013 at 10:03 AM, Bob Labuz <[email-masked]> wrote:

> The only engine I have trouble starting in the spring is the roto-tiller.
> I have to remove the air filter and spray gas in order to get it started. I
> then run it on 1/2 choke for about 5 minutes. Then it does run but sounds
> lean. One of these days I will have to remove the carb and clean it out.
>
> The problem I have heard about alcohol is it will cause problems with the
> engine internal alloy parts.
>
> Not sure what is true.
>
> Another thing I have heard is that alcohol does not pack as much punch as
> gas. But if that is so, why do some dragsters use 100% alcohol?
>
> Bob
>
> Donate: http://www.team.net/donate.**html<http://www.team.net/donate.html>
> Unsubscribe/Manage: http://autox.team.net/mailman/**
> options/triumphs/don.hiscock@**gmail.com<http://autox.team.net/mailman/options/triumphs/[email-masked]>

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From: Tony Drews <[email-masked]>
Date: Wed, 12 Jun 2013 12:29:47 -0500

It's true that Alcohol (Ethanol) does not have the "energy density" 
of gasoline, and if you have a fuel injected car you generally get 
somewhat worse mileage out of 10% ethanol fuel than out of straight 
gas.  Dragsters run a much richer mixture with alcohol (Methanol) 
(and crazy compression ratios).  Top Fuel dragsters run 90% 
nitromethane and there's enough oxygen in the nitro that they can run 
mixtures rich enough that if combustion doesn't occur they'll 
sometimes blow up because they hydro-lock.  THAT's some crazy stuff.

Tony Drews

At 09:03 AM 6/12/2013, Bob Labuz wrote:
>Another thing I have heard is that alcohol does not pack as much 
>punch as gas. But if that is so, why do some dragsters use 100% alcohol?
>
>Bob