Subject: Re: [Spridgets] Rally Stopwatches

From: <[email-masked]>
Date: Sun, 30 Dec 2012 03:02:55 -0800

This is the equipment. Someone else will explain. I've seen these boards
with three watches in the 1950's.
http://www.cjbalm.com/auto-aero/mitem283.htm

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-----Original Message-----
From: [email-masked]
[mailto:[email-masked]] On Behalf Of Dean Hedin
Sent: Saturday, December 29, 2012 8:13 PM
To: Spridgets
Subject: [Spridgets] Rally Stopwatches

Explain to me (and others on the list)

How are rally stopwatches used?
Why are there usually two and why are there two different kinds of
stopwatches?
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From: "GUY DAY" <[email-masked]>
Date: Sun, 30 Dec 2012 13:02:41 -0000

Do you want to have an overall time, a combined time, stage time, split time 
or what?
One of the main purposes is to time yourself so you can verify the official 
times.
Frequently used in combination with your Halda trip meter 
(http://www.haldaman.com/halda3.html).

Guy R Day

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From: Kitterer Bob <[email-masked]>
Date: Sun, 30 Dec 2012 18:13:36 -0800

In the USA rallies were/are time, distance, speed (TDS) events.  The total distance is broken up into legs and it should take you a particular amount of time to do the leg.  However, you do not know the distance for the leg nor where the leg will end.  You also do not know what route you will be taking, you are handed instructions less than a minute prior to your departure.  The instructions are not the type that you can look at a map to determine where you are going, at least for the rallies I'v done.  They also indicate a that when you get to a certain point what average speed to maintain.

Now to the stop watches, I am familiar with three watch boards.  There was one watch for total time, started at the beginning of the leg. One was the time for the current average speed.  The third was the ending time for the last average speed section and for any specified stop times.  These along with the instructions were all handled by the navigator who was also constantly doing calculations to determine if you "were on time" or not so the driver could correct their speed.  By the way he was doing these calculations with a slide rule and using the dual Odometers for those who were really serious about these events.

For those not familiar with TDS rallies the difference between the time it took you to do a leg and the it should have taken is your "error", early or late and can not be made up.  The error for all legs are added up and the lowest error wins.

At least that's the way it was in this neighborhood.

On Dec 29, 2012, at 8:13 PM, Dean Hedin wrote:

> Why are there usually two and why are there two diferent kinds of
> stopwatches?
> ------------------------
> 
> [email-masked]
> 
> Unsubscribe/Manage: http://autox.team.net/mailman/options/spridgets/[email-masked]
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From: Rick Fisk <[email-masked]>
Date: Sun, 30 Dec 2012 21:46:37 -0500

Up in Orange County we called them "TSD" rallies.  Time, Speed, and Distance.
:-)  Usually run by the local SCCA club.

I ran in a bunch of them back in the 70's, best finish ever was a 3rd place.
Never bothered with stopwatches.  Lot of fun, but girlfriend/navigator and I
were usually not talking to each other by the end of a rally.  "LEFT in 1.267
miles at 22 MPH".  I meant "RIGHT".  Yeah, but you said LEFT!  On and on all
evening.  LOL

Rick

Sent from my keyboard

On Dec 30, 2012, at 9:13 PM, Kitterer Bob <[email-masked]> wrote:

> In the USA rallies were/are time, distance, speed (TDS) events.  The total
distance is broken up into legs and it should take you a particular amount of
time to do the leg.  However, you do not know the distance for the leg nor
where the leg will end.  You also do not know what route you will be taking,
you are handed instructions less than a minute prior to your departure.  The
instructions are not the type that you can look at a map to determine where
you are going, at least for the rallies I'v done.  They also indicate a that
when you get to a certain point what average speed to maintain.
>
> Now to the stop watches, I am familiar with three watch boards.  There was
one watch for total time, started at the beginning of the leg. One was the
time for the current average speed.  The third was the ending time for the
last average speed section and for any specified stop times.  These along with
the instructions were all handled by the navigator who was also constantly
doing calculations to determine if you "were on time" or not so the driver
could correct their speed.  By the way he was doing these calculations with a
slide rule and using the dual Odometers for those who were really serious
about these events.
>
> For those not familiar with TDS rallies the difference between the time it
took you to do a leg and the it should have taken is your "error", early or
late and can not be made up.  The error for all legs are added up and the
lowest error wins.
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From: Allen Hefner <[email-masked]>
Date: Mon, 31 Dec 2012 10:38:23 -0500

(verbose)

Generally, the most famous twin mounted timepiece was the Halda Speedpilot
with the Heuer rallye set also popular. One timepiece was a stopwatch that
read in 1/100 minutes, rather than seconds. The other was a clock that read
time of day and is not a stopwatch.

If you have two stopwatches mounted on a plate, that would be used for
racing. One is used to measure lap time the other can be used for overall
race time, or so your pit crew can watch the guy in your mirror.

For a rally, you synchronize the time of day clock to the official time of
the rallymaster. The stop watch is basically to keep track of how fast you
are going. If you go 1/2 mile in 60 seconds, you are going 30 miles an
hour. Not exactly rocket science, but try going exactly 1/2 mile in exactly
60 seconds. The navigator is usually a very busy person.

My rally computer <http://www.rally.cc/> would measure distance to 1/1000
of a mile (roughly 5.25 feet), so you get a pretty accurate measurement.
Rallyes are timed to 1/100 minute, and you receive a penalty point for
every 1/100 minute early or late to a checkpoint. It is much easier to do
the math using 1/100 minute over seconds (or 10ths of seconds).

Example - One leg of a rally is 8.449 miles long and the average speed
assigned is 24 MPH. It should take you EXACTLY 2.84 minutes to complete
that leg, but you don't know how long the leg is so you have to stay at the
assigned average speed. The average speed can change in the middle of a leg
as well.

If you come in to the checkpoint at 2.86, you get a 2 point penalty. Top
rallyes rarely assign more than a coupla points to the best participants
over a hundred miles and 10 to 20 checkpoints.

A very accurate stopwatch lets you quickly calculate how fast you are going
so you can stay at the assigned average speed. Any variance has to be made
up before you get to a checkpoint, but you don't know where they are.

If you try this, please add a Stevens Rallye Indicator to complete your
equipment. It is a circular, analog calculator that takes your odometer
error into account for your measurements. Using a Stevens and a Halda will
keep you in a vintage rally class.

(/verbose)

Hope this helps.

 Allen Hefner
Former Phila. Region SCCA Rally Steward (retired)

*Current:*
2006 Chebbie
*Former:*
1963 Sunbeam Alpine Series III
1967 Triumph TR4A IRS
1964 VW Type I
1967 VW Type II
1967 Rover 2000TC
1977 MG Midget

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