Subject: [Mgs] early 5 main mgb engine/starter

From: dave northrup <[email-masked]>
Date: Sat, 8 Jun 2024 16:59:47 +0000

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Early 5 main mgb engine in a 58 mga.  Received in kit form; been working on=
 this thing for 18 months.

I think the conclusion is pretty obvious; just looking for confirmation.

The starter would turn the engine over, then just spin.  Wait until it stop=
s, try again.  Usually after a few tries the engine would start.

Now it just spins.  Was that a sign that the starter was going?  Is it now =
gone?  And doesn't activate the gear so the engine doesn't turn over?

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<p class=3D"MsoNormal">Early 5 main mgb engine in a 58 mga.&nbsp; Received =
in kit form; been working on this thing for 18 months.&nbsp;
<o:p></o:p></p>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal"><o:p>&nbsp;</o:p></p>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal">I think the conclusion is pretty obvious; just looki=
ng for confirmation.<o:p></o:p></p>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal"><o:p>&nbsp;</o:p></p>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal">The starter would turn the engine over, then just sp=
in.&nbsp; Wait until it stops, try again.&nbsp; Usually after a few tries t=
he engine would start.
<o:p></o:p></p>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal"><o:p>&nbsp;</o:p></p>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal">Now it just spins.&nbsp; Was that a sign that the st=
arter was going?&nbsp; Is it now gone?&nbsp; And doesn&#8217;t activate the=
 gear so the engine doesn&#8217;t turn over?<o:p></o:p></p>
</div>
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From: Allen Hess <[email-masked]>
Date: Sat, 8 Jun 2024 15:30:25 -0400

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I suggest finding a local shop and having it rebuilt, though those shops are=
 fewer these days. Sounds like the motor is good (=E2=80=9Cspins=E2=80=9D) s=
o problem lies with the pinion, pinion engagement fork or the solenoid is we=
ak and won=E2=80=99t pull/push the fork to engage pinion to flywheel. Outsid=
e chance the ring gear is worn. Check Moss for illustrations 33, 45, 46, 48.=

Allen Hess

Early 5 main mgb engine in a 58 mga.  Received in kit form; been working on t=
his thing for 18 months.=20
=20
I think the conclusion is pretty obvious; just looking for confirmation.
=20
The starter would turn the engine over, then just spin.  Wait until it stops=
, try again.  Usually after a few tries the engine would start.
=20
Now it just spins.  Was that a sign that the starter was going?  Is it now g=
one?  And doesn=E2=80=99t activate the gear so the engine doesn=E2=80=99t tu=
rn over?=

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<html><head><meta http-equiv=3D"content-type" content=3D"text/html; charset=3D=
utf-8"></head><body dir=3D"auto"><p class=3D"MsoNormal" style=3D"-webkit-tex=
t-size-adjust: auto; margin: 0in 0in 0.0001pt; font-size: 11pt; font-family:=
 Calibri, sans-serif;">I suggest finding a local shop and having it rebuilt,=
 though those shops are fewer these days. Sounds like the motor is good (=E2=
=80=9Cspins=E2=80=9D) so problem lies with the pinion, pinion engagement for=
k or the solenoid is weak and won=E2=80=99t pull/push the fork to engage pin=
ion to flywheel. Outside chance the ring gear is worn. Check Moss for illust=
rations 33, 45, 46, 48.</p><p class=3D"MsoNormal" style=3D"-webkit-text-size=
-adjust: auto; margin: 0in 0in 0.0001pt; font-size: 11pt; font-family: Calib=
ri, sans-serif;"><br></p><p class=3D"MsoNormal" style=3D"-webkit-text-size-a=
djust: auto; margin: 0in 0in 0.0001pt; font-size: 11pt; font-family: Calibri=
, sans-serif;">Allen Hess</p><p class=3D"MsoNormal" style=3D"-webkit-text-si=
ze-adjust: auto; margin: 0in 0in 0.0001pt; font-size: 11pt; font-family: Cal=
ibri, sans-serif;"><br></p><p class=3D"MsoNormal" style=3D"-webkit-text-size=
-adjust: auto; margin: 0in 0in 0.0001pt; font-size: 11pt; font-family: Calib=
ri, sans-serif;"><br></p><p class=3D"MsoNormal" style=3D"-webkit-text-size-a=
djust: auto; margin: 0in 0in 0.0001pt; font-size: 11pt; font-family: Calibri=
, sans-serif;">Early 5 main mgb engine in a 58 mga.&nbsp; Received in kit fo=
rm; been working on this thing for 18 months.&nbsp;<o:p></o:p></p><p class=3D=
"MsoNormal" style=3D"-webkit-text-size-adjust: auto; margin: 0in 0in 0.0001p=
t; font-size: 11pt; font-family: Calibri, sans-serif;"><o:p>&nbsp;</o:p></p>=
<p class=3D"MsoNormal" style=3D"-webkit-text-size-adjust: auto; margin: 0in 0=
in 0.0001pt; font-size: 11pt; font-family: Calibri, sans-serif;">I think the=
 conclusion is pretty obvious; just looking for confirmation.<o:p></o:p></p>=
<p class=3D"MsoNormal" style=3D"-webkit-text-size-adjust: auto; margin: 0in 0=
in 0.0001pt; font-size: 11pt; font-family: Calibri, sans-serif;"><o:p>&nbsp;=
</o:p></p><p class=3D"MsoNormal" style=3D"-webkit-text-size-adjust: auto; ma=
rgin: 0in 0in 0.0001pt; font-size: 11pt; font-family: Calibri, sans-serif;">=
The starter would turn the engine over, then just spin.&nbsp; Wait until it s=
tops, try again.&nbsp; Usually after a few tries the engine would start.<o:p=
></o:p></p><p class=3D"MsoNormal" style=3D"-webkit-text-size-adjust: auto; m=
argin: 0in 0in 0.0001pt; font-size: 11pt; font-family: Calibri, sans-serif;"=
><o:p>&nbsp;</o:p></p><p class=3D"MsoNormal" style=3D"-webkit-text-size-adju=
st: auto; margin: 0in 0in 0.0001pt; font-size: 11pt; font-family: Calibri, s=
ans-serif;">Now it just spins.&nbsp; Was that a sign that the starter was go=
ing?&nbsp; Is it now gone?&nbsp; And doesn=E2=80=99t activate the gear so th=
e engine doesn=E2=80=99t turn over?</p></body></html>=

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[email-masked]

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From: dave northrup <[email-masked]>
Date: Sat, 8 Jun 2024 23:45:50 +0000

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I just removed the starter.  I think its good news that it was stuck and to=
ok a hammer to dislodge it.  Interestingly enough, in an MGA, with an early=
 5 main MGB engine, you have to remove the distributor to get the starter o=
ut.  It will not go out under the car.

Its been only a few months since I started and ran the car.

From: dave northrup
Sent: Saturday, June 8, 2024 12:00 PM
To: [email-masked]
Subject: early 5 main mgb engine/starter

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<p class=3D"MsoNormal"><span style=3D"color:#1F497D">I just removed the sta=
rter.&nbsp; I think its good news that it was stuck and took a hammer to di=
slodge it.&nbsp; Interestingly enough, in an MGA, with an early 5 main MGB =
engine, you have to remove the distributor to
 get the starter out.&nbsp; It will not go out under the car.<o:p></o:p></s=
pan></p>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal"><span style=3D"color:#1F497D"><o:p>&nbsp;</o:p></spa=
n></p>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal"><span style=3D"color:#1F497D">Its been only a few mo=
nths since I started and ran the car.&nbsp;
<o:p></o:p></span></p>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal"><a name=3D"_MailEndCompose"><span style=3D"color:#1F=
497D"><o:p>&nbsp;</o:p></span></a></p>
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<p class=3D"MsoNormal"><b>From:</b> dave northrup <br>
<b>Sent:</b> Saturday, June 8, 2024 12:00 PM<br>
<b>To:</b> [email-masked]<br>
<b>Subject:</b> early 5 main mgb engine/starter<o:p></o:p></p>
</div>
</div>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal"><o:p>&nbsp;</o:p></p>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal">Early 5 main mgb engine in a 58 mga.&nbsp; Received =
in kit form; been working on this thing for 18 months.&nbsp;
<o:p></o:p></p>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal"><o:p>&nbsp;</o:p></p>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal">I think the conclusion is pretty obvious; just looki=
ng for confirmation.<o:p></o:p></p>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal"><o:p>&nbsp;</o:p></p>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal">The starter would turn the engine over, then just sp=
in.&nbsp; Wait until it stops, try again.&nbsp; Usually after a few tries t=
he engine would start.
<o:p></o:p></p>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal"><o:p>&nbsp;</o:p></p>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal">Now it just spins.&nbsp; Was that a sign that the st=
arter was going?&nbsp; Is it now gone?&nbsp; And doesn&#8217;t activate the=
 gear so the engine doesn&#8217;t turn over?<o:p></o:p></p>
</div>
</body>
</html>

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[email-masked]

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From: dave northrup <[email-masked]>
Date: Sat, 8 Jun 2024 23:54:48 +0000

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One lister had suggested the ring gear might be the problem.  I am EXTREMEL=
Y happy to report that it looks fine, both teeth and location

From: dave northrup
Sent: Saturday, June 8, 2024 6:46 PM
To: [email-masked]
Subject: RE: early 5 main mgb engine/starter

From: dave northrup

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span.EmailStyle19
<p class=3D"MsoNormal"><span style=3D"color:#1F497D">One lister had suggest=
ed the ring gear might be the problem.&nbsp; I am EXTREMELY happy to report=
 that it looks fine, both teeth and location<o:p></o:p></span></p>
<b>Sent:</b> Saturday, June 8, 2024 6:46 PM<br>
<b>Subject:</b> RE: early 5 main mgb engine/starter<o:p></o:p></p>

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[email-masked]

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From: Max Heim <[email-masked]>
Date: Sat, 8 Jun 2024 23:01:12 -0400

Larry took the words right out of my mouth — his description could scarcely be improved. I got so disgusted with the Bendix starter chewing up its pinion and consequently chewing up the flywheel that I went looking for a 4-synchro trans to swap in (since I was replacing the flywheel anyway). Finding an OD trans made it a win-win.

Sent from my iPad

> On Jun 8, 2024, at 7:26 PM, Larry Colen <[email-masked]> wrote:
> 
> There's always "percussive" maintenance.  :-)
> 
> It sounds like the inny-outie thingy-bobber is getting stuck.  Maybe take it out, and if the little gearjobber isn't moving freely, clean and lube it.  On the other hand if the motor isn't spinning fast enough it might not be throwing the gearjobber out far enough to engage with the flywheel.
> 
> On second thought, this is probably too technical, never mind me, and pay attention to the guys that actually know what they're talking about.
> 
>> On Jun 8, 2024, at 3:25 PM, Robert's New iPad <[email-masked]> wrote:
>> 
>> Dave,
>>    There are two types of starters that could be on your engine.  
>>    Early, like those on MGA, were Bendix-type, in which the inertia of the pinion caused it to unwind on starter motor shaft. It unwound on the coarse threads until the pinion meshed with teeth on the ring gear, then it stopped unwinding and the starter turned Bendix gear and the ring gear to start the engine.
>>    Later starters were called ‘pre-engaged’. In these, power from starter switch moved the electromagnet in the starter solenoid which has a lever that moves the pinion into engagement with the ring gear, then the solenoid powers the starter, which turns the gear and ring gear.
>>    If your starter is a cylinder, only a cylinder, like the cylinder-shape of the dynamo, it is Bendix type. If it has not been used in 18 months, it is possible that the Bendix gear is hanging on a tiny bit of rust on the coarse threads, so the Bendix is not turning the ring gear.   Disassemble, clean the threads, use a dry lubricant like teflon or graphite, and it should work as new. 
>>    If it is the later type, which you can identify by a smaller cylinder mounted on the starter, in line with its shaft, yours is pre-engaged.  You say the starter spins, so it is probably OK, the problem being non-engagement.  I would check again for free movement of the pinion. I’ve never faced this with a pre-engaged, but I don’t rule that out.
>> Bob
>> 
>> 
>>>> On Jun 8, 2024, at 1:33 PM, dave northrup <[email-masked]> wrote:
>>> 
>>> 
>>> Early 5 main mgb engine in a 58 mga.  Received in kit form; been working on this thing for 18 months. 
>>> 
>>> The starter would turn the engine over, then just spin.  Wait until it stops, try again.  Usually after a few tries the engine would start.
>>> 
>>> Now it just spins.  Was that a sign that the starter was going?  Is it now gone?  And doesn’t activate the gear so the engine doesn’t turn over?
>>> Donate: http://www.team.net/donate.html
>>> Suggested annual donation  $12.75
>>> 
>>> Unsubscribe: http://autox.team.net/mailman/options/mgs/[email-masked]
>> Donate: http://www.team.net/donate.html
>> Suggested annual donation  $12.75
>> 
>> Unsubscribe: http://autox.team.net/mailman/options/mgs/[email-masked]
> 
> --
> Larry Colen
> [email-masked].   sent from Mirkwood
> 
> 
> 
> Donate: http://www.team.net/donate.html
> Suggested annual donation  $12.75
> 
> Unsubscribe: http://autox.team.net/mailman/options/mgs/[email-masked]
> 

[email-masked]
Donate: http://www.team.net/donate.html
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