Subject: Re: [Mgs] MGB gas-tank dipstick

From: Richard Lindsay <[email-masked]>
Date: Fri, 06 Jan 2023 10:09:08 -0600

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From: Max Heim <[email-masked]>
Date: Fri, 6 Jan 2023 10:16:33 -0800

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Agree that the sender refit is not a difficult job.

I additionally wanted to point out why the dipstick method is =
practically useless. If you look at the fuel gauge markings on a Mk. I =
MGB, you will see that the scale does not consist of even increments =E2=80=
=94 each =E2=80=9Cquarter=E2=80=9D is a different size =E2=80=94 it is =
not remotely a linear scale. So any dipstick reading is no more than a =
wild guess. You could determine the difference between a mostly full =
tank, a partial tank, and a very low tank, but that=E2=80=99s about it.

--
Max Heim
'66 MGB

> On Jan 6, 2023, at 8:09 AM, Richard Lindsay <[email-masked]> =
wrote:
>=20
>    I write to support Hans's advice. The fuel level sender replacement =
is an easy job, working through the right-rear wheelwell. But be sure to =
include a new gasket.=20
>    I did the reverse! I replaced the fuel tank, cleaned the sender, =
and installed it with a new sealing gasket.
>=20
> Rick - '72 MGB, '53 MG TD
>=20

--Apple-Mail=_782B963B-E450-43AC-BD30-FD294290B1F6
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<html><head><meta http-equiv=3D"Content-Type" content=3D"text/html; =
charset=3Dutf-8"></head><body style=3D"word-wrap: break-word; =
-webkit-nbsp-mode: space; line-break: after-white-space;" class=3D"">Agree=
 that the sender refit is not a difficult job.<div class=3D""><br =
class=3D""></div><div class=3D"">I additionally wanted to point out why =
the dipstick method is practically useless. If you look at the fuel =
gauge markings on a Mk. I MGB, you will see that the scale does not =
consist of even increments =E2=80=94 each =E2=80=9Cquarter=E2=80=9D is a =
different size =E2=80=94 it is not remotely a linear scale. So any =
dipstick reading is no more than a wild guess. You could determine the =
difference between a mostly full tank, a partial tank, and a very low =
tank, but that=E2=80=99s about it.</div><div class=3D""><br =
class=3D""><div class=3D"">
<div style=3D"color: rgb(0, 0, 0); letter-spacing: normal; text-align: =
start; text-indent: 0px; text-transform: none; white-space: normal; =
word-spacing: 0px; -webkit-text-stroke-width: 0px; word-wrap: =
break-word; -webkit-nbsp-mode: space; -webkit-line-break: =
after-white-space;" class=3D""><div style=3D"color: rgb(0, 0, 0); =
letter-spacing: normal; text-align: start; text-indent: 0px; =
text-transform: none; white-space: normal; word-spacing: 0px; =
-webkit-text-stroke-width: 0px; word-wrap: break-word; =
-webkit-nbsp-mode: space; -webkit-line-break: after-white-space;" =
class=3D""><div style=3D"margin: 0px; font-size: 13px;" =
class=3D"">--</div><div style=3D"margin: 0px; font-size: 13px; =
min-height: 16px;" class=3D"">Max Heim</div><div style=3D"margin: 0px; =
font-size: 13px;" class=3D"">'66 MGB</div></div></div>
</div>

<div><br class=3D""><blockquote type=3D"cite" class=3D""><div =
class=3D"">On Jan 6, 2023, at 8:09 AM, Richard Lindsay &lt;<a =
href=3D"mailto:[email-masked]" class=3D"">[email-masked]</a>&gt;=
 wrote:</div><br class=3D"Apple-interchange-newline"><div class=3D""><div =
dir=3D"auto" class=3D"">&nbsp; &nbsp;I write to support Hans's advice. =
The fuel level sender replacement is an easy job, working through the =
right-rear wheelwell. But be sure to include a new gasket.&nbsp;<div =
dir=3D"auto" class=3D"">&nbsp; &nbsp;I did the reverse! I replaced the =
fuel tank, cleaned the sender, and installed it with a new sealing =
gasket.</div><div dir=3D"auto" class=3D""><br class=3D""></div><div =
dir=3D"auto" class=3D"">Rick - '72 MGB, '53 MG =
TD</div></div>_______________________________________________<br =
class=3D""><br class=3D""></div></blockquote></div><br =
class=3D""></div></body></html>=

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[email-masked]

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From: S.Carr <[email-masked]>
Date: Fri, 6 Jan 2023 19:53:09 -0500

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You could determine the difference between a mostly full tank, a partial ta=
nk, and a very low tank, but that=E2=80=99s about it =E2=80=93 and that=E2=
=80=99s all we want, so we can judge whether we can make it to the next gas=
 station.  (Ran out of gas only once=E2=80=94in the TD, coming home from Wa=
tkins Glen (dash warning light failed)=E2=80=94luckily another club member =
came along & got us some.)

Sent from Mail for Windows

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tp-equiv=3DContent-Type content=3D"text/html; charset=3Dutf-8"><meta name=
=3DGenerator content=3D"Microsoft Word 15 (filtered medium)"><style><!--
/* Font Definitions */
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	{font-family:"Cambria Math";
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'word-wrap:break-word'><div class=3DWordSection1><p class=3DMsoNormal><span=
 style=3D'font-size:14.0pt'>You could determine the difference between a mo=
stly full tank, a partial tank, and a very low tank, but that=E2=80=99s abo=
ut it =E2=80=93 </span>and that=E2=80=99s all we want, so we can judge whet=
her we can make it to the next gas station.=C2=A0 (Ran out of gas only once=
=E2=80=94in the TD, coming home from Watkins Glen (dash warning light faile=
d)=E2=80=94luckily another club member came along &amp; got us some.)<o:p><=
/o:p></p><p class=3DMsoNormal><o:p>&nbsp;</o:p></p><p class=3DMsoNormal>Sen=
t from <a href=3D"https://go.microsoft.com/fwlink/?LinkId=3D550986">Mail</a=
> for Windows</p></div></body></html>=

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[email-masked]

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From: Max Heim <[email-masked]>
Date: Fri, 6 Jan 2023 17:05:23 -0800

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Right=E2=80=A6 so no calibration marks needed, because they won=E2=80=99t =
mean anything. Just eyeball the depth of the damp area.

Your big problem is that the =E2=80=9Cstick=E2=80=9D needs to be =
flexible to have any hope of bottoming out, given the bend in the filler =
neck. For instance, a strip of lath. Just hope it doesn=E2=80=99t break =
off in the tank. I have cut a strip of corrugated cardboard for this =
purpose. Single use only, and then you have to safely dispose of a =
gasoline-soaked piece of cardboard...

Seriously, I don=E2=80=99t understand going to great lengths to avoid =
fixing something that is easily fixed. I am never satisfied unless every =
component of my MG is functioning as intended. Unsurprisingly, =
everything works.

--
Max Heim
[email-masked]

> On Jan 6, 2023, at 4:53 PM, S.Carr <[email-masked]> wrote:
>=20
> You could determine the difference between a mostly full tank, a =
partial tank, and a very low tank, but that=E2=80=99s about it =E2=80=93 =
and that=E2=80=99s all we want, so we can judge whether we can make it =
to the next gas station.  (Ran out of gas only once=E2=80=94in the TD, =
coming home from Watkins Glen (dash warning light failed)=E2=80=94luckily =
another club member came along & got us some.)
> =20
> Sent from Mail <https://go.microsoft.com/fwlink/?LinkId=3D550986> for =
Windows

--Apple-Mail=_33889517-D6EA-49F7-9624-948280D8B7CA
Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable
	charset=utf-8

<html><head><meta http-equiv=3D"Content-Type" content=3D"text/html; =
charset=3Dutf-8"></head><body style=3D"word-wrap: break-word; =
-webkit-nbsp-mode: space; line-break: after-white-space;" =
class=3D"">Right=E2=80=A6 so no calibration marks needed, because they =
won=E2=80=99t mean anything. Just eyeball the depth of the damp =
area.<div class=3D""><br class=3D""></div><div class=3D"">Your big =
problem is that the =E2=80=9Cstick=E2=80=9D needs to be flexible to have =
any hope of bottoming out, given the bend in the filler neck. For =
instance, a strip of lath. Just hope it doesn=E2=80=99t break off in the =
tank. I have cut a strip of corrugated cardboard for this purpose. =
Single use only, and then you have to safely dispose of a =
gasoline-soaked piece of cardboard...</div><div class=3D""><br =
class=3D""></div><div class=3D"">Seriously, I don=E2=80=99t understand =
going to great lengths to avoid fixing something that is easily fixed. I =
am never satisfied unless every component of my MG is functioning as =
intended. Unsurprisingly, everything works.</div><div class=3D""><div =
class=3D""><br class=3D""><div class=3D"">
<div class=3D"">--</div><div class=3D"">Max Heim</div><div class=3D""><a =
href=3D"mailto:[email-masked]" class=3D"">[email-masked]</a></div><div=
 class=3D""><br class=3D""></div><br class=3D"Apple-interchange-newline">

</div>

<div><br class=3D""><blockquote type=3D"cite" class=3D""><div =
class=3D"">On Jan 6, 2023, at 4:53 PM, S.Carr &lt;<a =
href=3D"mailto:[email-masked]" class=3D"">[email-masked]</a>&gt; =
wrote:</div><br class=3D"Apple-interchange-newline"><div class=3D""><div =
class=3D"WordSection1" style=3D"page: WordSection1; caret-color: rgb(0, =
0, 0); font-family: Verdana; font-size: 13px; font-style: normal; =
font-variant-caps: normal; font-weight: normal; letter-spacing: normal; =
text-align: start; text-indent: 0px; text-transform: none; white-space: =
normal; word-spacing: 0px; -webkit-text-stroke-width: 0px; =
text-decoration: none;"><div style=3D"margin: 0in; font-size: 11pt; =
font-family: Calibri, sans-serif;" class=3D""><span style=3D"font-size: =
14pt;" class=3D"">You could determine the difference between a mostly =
full tank, a partial tank, and a very low tank, but that=E2=80=99s about =
it =E2=80=93<span class=3D"Apple-converted-space">&nbsp;</span></span>and =
that=E2=80=99s all we want, so we can judge whether we can make it to =
the next gas station.&nbsp; (Ran out of gas only once=E2=80=94in the TD, =
coming home from Watkins Glen (dash warning light failed)=E2=80=94luckily =
another club member came along &amp; got us some.)<o:p =
class=3D""></o:p></div><div style=3D"margin: 0in; font-size: 11pt; =
font-family: Calibri, sans-serif;" class=3D""><o:p =
class=3D"">&nbsp;</o:p></div><div style=3D"margin: 0in; font-size: 11pt; =
font-family: Calibri, sans-serif;" class=3D"">Sent from<span =
class=3D"Apple-converted-space">&nbsp;</span><a =
href=3D"https://go.microsoft.com/fwlink/?LinkId=3D550986" style=3D"color: =
blue; text-decoration: underline;" class=3D"">Mail</a><span =
class=3D"Apple-converted-space">&nbsp;</span>for =
Windows</div></div></div></blockquote></div><br =
class=3D""></div></div></body></html>=

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[email-masked]

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From: PaulHunt73 <[email-masked]> imzNFnABQYJCapnEw61kxwCzixhgYTEdt9ruBkX76/Em1UXUws2ART6/ziq/QF5J3SQ5BqwSXNBlbu8MS6hZy1gWc+cnqXiCur0=
Date: Sat, 7 Jan 2023 10:47:47 +0000

The gauge markings aren't linear because the sender characteristics are 
not linear, despite the resistance wire former changing width at one 
point i.e. the length of each turn and the windings changing from single 
to double at another i.e doubling how much resistance is added/removed 
for a given movement of the float.  The result is that the gauge 
markings are *about* right, although both of mine drop rather suddenly 
towards one quarter shortly after they have passed half.

There were two tank necks, it is possible that one doesn't allow a 
straight dipstick, but you could still use a weight on non absorbent 
string to get an approximate depth for the purposes of seeing whether 
the gauge is way out or not,  which was the object of the exercise as 
far as I can remember.

The gauge is only a reminder that it might be time to fill up on a long 
run - it's not like a temp or oil gauge which might exhibit a sudden 
change and be a harbinger of bad news - and each time you do it 
shouldn't be beyond the wit of man to compare what the gauge said when 
you stopped and if you brim it how much fuel went in.

Changing the sender willy-nilly when you have now idea what is wrong, or 
indeed if anything *is* wrong, does not appeal to me at all.

PaulH.

On 06/01/2023 18:16, Max Heim wrote:
> I additionally wanted to point out why the dipstick method is 
> practically useless. If you look at the fuel gauge markings on a Mk. I 
> MGB, you will see that the scale does not consist of even increments — 
> each “quarter” is a different size — it is not remotely a linear 
> scale. So any dipstick reading is no more than a wild guess. You could 
> determine the difference between a mostly full tank, a partial tank, 
> and a very low tank, but that’s about it.

[email-masked]
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