Subject: Re: [Mgs] Coughing, spitting, and dying

From: <[email-masked]>
Date: Wed, 4 May 2022 15:25:37 -0400

This is a multipart message in MIME format.

--===============4526485528748297418==
	boundary="----=_NextPart_000_003D_01D85FCB.35305770"
Content-Language: en-us

This is a multipart message in MIME format.

------=_NextPart_000_003D_01D85FCB.35305770
	charset="UTF-8"
Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable

To all of you who responded to my cry for help, THANK YOU so much for =
your suggestions. As it turns out, the root cause of the problem was =
timing. The stock distributor had been upgraded several years ago to a =
Pertronix electronic module which had worked itself loose inside the =
distributor causing the timing to become erratic. Tugging on the leads =
to the coil would cause the engine to increase its RPMs and run =
smoothly. Pushing them back into the distributor reintroduced the =
backfire and coughing.=20

=20

Thanks again for everyone=E2=80=99s help.

=20

Jim

=20

From: Mgs <[email-masked]> On Behalf Of John DiFede
Sent: Sunday, April 24, 2022 7:28 AM
To: Robert Rutherford <[email-masked]>
Cc: [email-masked]; MG Digest <[email-masked]>
Subject: Re: [Mgs] Coughing, spitting, and dying

=20

Sounds like a fuel problem.  The Edelbrock 1404 is a simple carburetor =
to work on as it is a copy of the Carter AFB carb used since the =
60=E2=80=99s.  Is your choke set properly when cold and hot?   The AFB =
used a mechanical fuel pump- make sure that facet pump you=E2=80=99re =
using has the correct fuel pressure for the AFB.  Also check your =
vacuum.  Is the vacuum reading steady or is the gauge needle fluctuating =
back and forth?   You may have a vacuum leak affecting fuel mixture.  =
When the engine is cold and the choke is on you have a rich mixture =
allowing the engine to run poorly.  Once the choke opens the mixture =
goes lean due to the vacuum leak possibly leading to your motor =
stalling. =20

Sent from my iPhone=20

On Apr 23, 2022, at 11:10 PM, Robert Rutherford <[email-masked] =

=EF=BB=BF Coughs, spits, dies - sounds like Covid to me.

On Apr 21, 2022, at 12:34 PM, Max Heim <[email-masked] =

=20

[=E2=96=B3EXTERNAL]

Sounds more like a carb/fuel issue to me. Can=E2=80=99t see how it would =
be electrical.

Sent from my iPad

On Apr 21, 2022, at 11:58 AM, [email-masked] =

=EF=BB=BF=20

Have an 80 MGB V8 conversion that has developed a problem I =
can=E2=80=99t get my hands around. When cold it coughs and sputters when =
first starting up and when warm will not run at idle without stalling =
after several minutes. Thinking it might be an electrical issue, I =
replaced the plugs, plug wires, distributor cap, coil, and battery. It =
has a PerTronix Ignitor module installed which I did not replace. The =
battery shows 12.7 volts on my meter. The alternator is producing 14.6 =
volts at ~1500 RPMs and 14.3 under load. Fuel is fed to an Edelbrock =
1404 carburetor via a Facet electric pump with new filters in the line =
at the pump and just before the carburetor. I use 93 octane non-ethanol =
gas. I appreciate any thoughts or suggestions you may have.

=20

Jim Ray

=20

=20

_______________________________________________

Archive: http://www.team.net/pipermail/mgs http://autox.team.net/archive

Unsubscribe: http://autox.team.net/mailman/options/mgs/[email-masked]

_______________________________________________

Archive:  <http://www.team.net/pipermail/mgs> =
http://www.team.net/pipermail/mgs  <http://autox.team.net/archive> =
http://autox.team.net/archive

Unsubscribe:  =
<http://autox.team.net/mailman/options/mgs/[email-masked]> =
http://autox.team.net/mailman/options/mgs/[email-masked]

_______________________________________________

Archive: http://www.team.net/pipermail/mgs http://autox.team.net/archive

Unsubscribe: http://autox.team.net/mailman/options/mgs/[email-masked]

------=_NextPart_000_003D_01D85FCB.35305770
	charset="UTF-8"
Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable

<html xmlns:v=3D"urn:schemas-microsoft-com:vml" =
xmlns:o=3D"urn:schemas-microsoft-com:office:office" =
xmlns:w=3D"urn:schemas-microsoft-com:office:word" =
xmlns:m=3D"http://schemas.microsoft.com/office/2004/12/omml" =
xmlns=3D"http://www.w3.org/TR/REC-html40"><head><meta =
http-equiv=3DContent-Type content=3D"text/html; charset=3Dutf-8"><meta =
name=3DGenerator content=3D"Microsoft Word 15 (filtered =
medium)"><style><!--
/* Font Definitions */
@font-face
	{font-family:Helvetica;
	panose-1:2 11 6 4 2 2 2 2 2 4;}
@font-face
	{font-family:"Cambria Math";
	panose-1:2 4 5 3 5 4 6 3 2 4;}
@font-face
	{font-family:Calibri;
	panose-1:2 15 5 2 2 2 4 3 2 4;}
@font-face
	{font-family:Tahoma;
	panose-1:2 11 6 4 3 5 4 4 2 4;}
/* Style Definitions */
p.MsoNormal, li.MsoNormal, div.MsoNormal
	{margin:0in;
	font-size:11.0pt;
	font-family:"Calibri",sans-serif;}
a:link, span.MsoHyperlink
	{mso-style-priority:99;
	color:blue;
	text-decoration:underline;}
span.apple-converted-space
	{mso-style-name:apple-converted-space;}
span.EmailStyle20
	{mso-style-type:personal-reply;
	font-family:"Calibri",sans-serif;
	color:windowtext;}
.MsoChpDefault
	{mso-style-type:export-only;
	font-size:10.0pt;}
@page WordSection1
	{size:8.5in 11.0in;
	margin:1.0in 1.0in 1.0in 1.0in;}
div.WordSection1
	{page:WordSection1;}
--></style><!--[if gte mso 9]><xml>
<o:shapedefaults v:ext=3D"edit" spidmax=3D"1026" />
</xml><![endif]--><!--[if gte mso 9]><xml>
<o:shapelayout v:ext=3D"edit">
<o:idmap v:ext=3D"edit" data=3D"1" />
</o:shapelayout></xml><![endif]--></head><body lang=3DEN-US link=3Dblue =
vlink=3Dpurple style=3D'word-wrap:break-word'><div =
class=3DWordSection1><p class=3DMsoNormal>To all of you who responded to =
my cry for help, THANK YOU so much for your suggestions. As it turns =
out, the root cause of the problem was timing. The stock distributor had =
been upgraded several years ago to a Pertronix electronic module which =
had worked itself loose inside the distributor causing the timing to =
become erratic. Tugging on the leads to the coil would cause the engine =
to increase its RPMs and run smoothly. Pushing them back into the =
distributor reintroduced the backfire and coughing. <o:p></o:p></p><p =
class=3DMsoNormal><o:p>&nbsp;</o:p></p><p class=3DMsoNormal>Thanks again =
for everyone=E2=80=99s help.<o:p></o:p></p><p =
class=3DMsoNormal><o:p>&nbsp;</o:p></p><p =
class=3DMsoNormal>Jim<o:p></o:p></p><p =
class=3DMsoNormal><o:p>&nbsp;</o:p></p><div><div =
style=3D'border:none;border-top:solid #E1E1E1 1.0pt;padding:3.0pt 0in =
0in 0in'><p class=3DMsoNormal><b>From:</b> Mgs =
&lt;[email-masked]&gt; <b>On Behalf Of </b>John =
DiFede<br><b>Sent:</b> Sunday, April 24, 2022 7:28 AM<br><b>To:</b> =
Robert Rutherford &lt;[email-masked]&gt;<br><b>Cc:</b> =
[email-masked]; MG Digest =
&lt;[email-masked]&gt;<br><b>Subject:</b> Re: [Mgs] Coughing, =
spitting, and dying<o:p></o:p></p></div></div><p =
class=3DMsoNormal><o:p>&nbsp;</o:p></p><p class=3DMsoNormal =
style=3D'margin-bottom:12.0pt'>Sounds like a fuel problem. &nbsp;The =
Edelbrock 1404 is a simple carburetor to work on as it is a copy of the =
Carter AFB carb used since the 60=E2=80=99s. &nbsp;Is your choke set =
properly when cold and hot? &nbsp; The AFB used a mechanical fuel pump- =
make sure that facet pump you=E2=80=99re using has the correct fuel =
pressure for the AFB. &nbsp;Also check your vacuum. &nbsp;Is the vacuum =
reading steady or is the gauge needle fluctuating back and forth? &nbsp; =
You may have a vacuum leak affecting fuel mixture. &nbsp;When the engine =
is cold and the choke is on you have a rich mixture allowing the engine =
to run poorly. &nbsp;Once the choke opens the mixture goes lean due to =
the vacuum leak possibly leading to your motor stalling. =
&nbsp;<o:p></o:p></p><div><p class=3DMsoNormal>Sent from my =
iPhone&nbsp;<o:p></o:p></p></div><div><p =
class=3DMsoNormal><br><br><o:p></o:p></p><blockquote =
style=3D'margin-top:5.0pt;margin-bottom:5.0pt'><p class=3DMsoNormal =
style=3D'margin-bottom:12.0pt'>On Apr 23, 2022, at 11:10 PM, Robert =
Rutherford &lt;<a =
href=3D"mailto:[email-masked]">[email-masked]</a>&gt; =
wrote:<o:p></o:p></p></blockquote></div><blockquote =
style=3D'margin-top:5.0pt;margin-bottom:5.0pt'><div><p =
class=3DMsoNormal>=EF=BB=BF Coughs, spits, dies - sounds like Covid to =
me.<o:p></o:p></p><div><p =
class=3DMsoNormal><br><br><o:p></o:p></p><blockquote =
style=3D'margin-top:5.0pt;margin-bottom:5.0pt'><div><p =
class=3DMsoNormal>On Apr 21, 2022, at 12:34 PM, Max Heim &lt;<a =
href=3D"mailto:[email-masked]">[email-masked]</a>&gt; =
wrote:<o:p></o:p></p></div><p =
class=3DMsoNormal><o:p>&nbsp;</o:p></p><div><table =
class=3DMsoNormalTable border=3D0 cellspacing=3D0 cellpadding=3D0 =
style=3D'caret-color: rgb(0, 0, 0);orphans: auto;widows: =
auto;-webkit-text-size-adjust: auto;-webkit-text-stroke-width: =
0px;word-spacing:0px'><tr><td style=3D'padding:0in 0in 0in 0in'><p =
class=3DMsoNormal style=3D'margin-bottom:7.5pt'><span =
style=3D'font-family:"Helvetica",sans-serif;color:red'>[</span><span =
style=3D'font-family:"Cambria =
Math",serif;color:red'>=E2=96=B3</span><span =
style=3D'font-family:"Helvetica",sans-serif;color:red'>EXTERNAL]<o:p></o:=
p></span></p></td></tr></table><p class=3DMsoNormal><span =
style=3D'font-size:9.0pt;font-family:"Helvetica",sans-serif'><br =
style=3D'caret-color: rgb(0, 0, 0);font-variant-caps: =
normal;text-align:start;-webkit-text-stroke-width: =
0px;word-spacing:0px'><br></span><o:p></o:p></p><div><p =
class=3DMsoNormal style=3D'margin-bottom:12.0pt'><span =
style=3D'font-size:9.0pt;font-family:"Helvetica",sans-serif'>Sounds more =
like a carb/fuel issue to me. Can=E2=80=99t see how it would be =
electrical.<o:p></o:p></span></p><div><p class=3DMsoNormal><span =
style=3D'font-size:9.0pt;font-family:"Helvetica",sans-serif'>Sent from =
my iPad<o:p></o:p></span></p></div><div><p class=3DMsoNormal><span =
style=3D'font-size:9.0pt;font-family:"Helvetica",sans-serif'><br><br><o:p=
></o:p></span></p><blockquote =
style=3D'margin-top:5.0pt;margin-bottom:5.0pt'><p class=3DMsoNormal =
style=3D'margin-bottom:12.0pt'><span =
style=3D'font-size:9.0pt;font-family:"Helvetica",sans-serif'>On Apr 21, =
2022, at 11:58 AM,<span class=3Dapple-converted-space>&nbsp;</span><a =
href=3D"mailto:[email-masked]">[email-masked]</a><span =
class=3Dapple-converted-space>&nbsp;</span>wrote:<o:p></o:p></span></p></=
blockquote></div><blockquote =
style=3D'margin-top:5.0pt;margin-bottom:5.0pt'><div><p =
class=3DMsoNormal><span =
style=3D'font-size:9.0pt;font-family:"Tahoma",sans-serif'>=EF=BB=BF</span=
><span style=3D'font-size:9.0pt;font-family:"Helvetica",sans-serif'> =
<o:p></o:p></span></p><div><p class=3DMsoNormal><span =
style=3D'font-size:12.0pt;font-family:"Arial",sans-serif'>Have an 80 MGB =
V8 conversion that has developed a problem I can=E2=80=99t get my hands =
around. When cold it coughs and sputters when first starting up and when =
warm will not run at idle without stalling after several minutes. =
Thinking it might be an electrical issue, I replaced the plugs, plug =
wires, distributor cap, coil, and battery. It has a PerTronix Ignitor =
module installed which I did not replace. The battery shows 12.7 volts =
on my meter. The alternator is producing 14.6 volts at ~1500 RPMs and =
14.3 under load. Fuel is fed to an Edelbrock 1404 carburetor via a Facet =
electric pump with new filters in the line at the pump and just before =
the carburetor. I use 93 octane non-ethanol gas. I appreciate any =
thoughts or suggestions you may have.</span><o:p></o:p></p></div><div><p =
class=3DMsoNormal><span =
style=3D'font-size:12.0pt;font-family:"Arial",sans-serif'>&nbsp;</span><o=
:p></o:p></p></div><div><p class=3DMsoNormal><span =
style=3D'font-size:12.0pt;font-family:"Arial",sans-serif'>Jim =
Ray</span><o:p></o:p></p></div><div><p class=3DMsoNormal><span =
style=3D'font-size:12.0pt;font-family:"Arial",sans-serif'>&nbsp;</span><o=
:p></o:p></p></div><div><p class=3DMsoNormal><span =
style=3D'font-size:12.0pt;font-family:"Arial",sans-serif;color:#373737'>&=
nbsp;</span><o:p></o:p></p></div><p class=3DMsoNormal><span =
style=3D'font-size:9.0pt;font-family:"Helvetica",sans-serif'>____________=
___________________________________<br><br><a =
href=3D"mailto:[email-masked]">[email-masked]</a><br>Donate:<span=
 class=3Dapple-converted-space>&nbsp;</span><a =
href=3D"http://www.team.net/donate.html">http://www.team.net/donate.html<=
/a><br>Suggested annual donation &nbsp;$12.75<br><br>Archive:<span =
class=3Dapple-converted-space>&nbsp;</span><a =
href=3D"http://www.team.net/pipermail/mgs">http://www.team.net/pipermail/=
mgs</a><span class=3Dapple-converted-space>&nbsp;</span><a =
href=3D"http://autox.team.net/archive">http://autox.team.net/archive</a><=
br><br>Unsubscribe:<span class=3Dapple-converted-space>&nbsp;</span><a =
href=3D"http://autox.team.net/mailman/options/mgs/[email-masked]">http:=
//autox.team.net/mailman/options/mgs/[email-masked]</a><o:p></o:p></spa=
n></p></div></blockquote></div><p class=3DMsoNormal><span =
style=3D'font-size:9.0pt;font-family:"Helvetica",sans-serif'>____________=
___________________________________<br><br></span><a =
href=3D"mailto:[email-masked]"><span =
style=3D'font-size:9.0pt;font-family:"Helvetica",sans-serif'>[email-masked]=
am.net</span></a><span =
style=3D'font-size:9.0pt;font-family:"Helvetica",sans-serif'><br>Donate:<=
span class=3Dapple-converted-space>&nbsp;</span></span><a =
href=3D"http://www.team.net/donate.html"><span =
style=3D'font-size:9.0pt;font-family:"Helvetica",sans-serif'>http://www.t=
eam.net/donate.html</span></a><span =
style=3D'font-size:9.0pt;font-family:"Helvetica",sans-serif'><br>Suggeste=
d annual donation &nbsp;$12.75<br><br>Archive:<span =
class=3Dapple-converted-space>&nbsp;</span></span><a =
href=3D"http://www.team.net/pipermail/mgs"><span =
style=3D'font-size:9.0pt;font-family:"Helvetica",sans-serif'>http://www.t=
eam.net/pipermail/mgs</span></a><span =
class=3Dapple-converted-space><span =
style=3D'font-size:9.0pt;font-family:"Helvetica",sans-serif'>&nbsp;</span=
></span><a href=3D"http://autox.team.net/archive"><span =
style=3D'font-size:9.0pt;font-family:"Helvetica",sans-serif'>http://autox=
.team.net/archive</span></a><span =
style=3D'font-size:9.0pt;font-family:"Helvetica",sans-serif'><br><br>Unsu=
bscribe:<span class=3Dapple-converted-space>&nbsp;</span></span><a =
href=3D"http://autox.team.net/mailman/options/mgs/[email-masked]"><=
span =
style=3D'font-size:9.0pt;font-family:"Helvetica",sans-serif'>http://autox=
.team.net/mailman/options/mgs/[email-masked]</span></a><o:p></o:p><=
/p></div></blockquote></div><p =
class=3DMsoNormal><br>_______________________________________________<br>=
<br><a =
href=3D"mailto:[email-masked]">[email-masked]</a><br>Donate: <a =
href=3D"http://www.team.net/donate.html">http://www.team.net/donate.html<=
/a><br>Suggested annual donation &nbsp;$12.75<br><br>Archive: <a =
href=3D"http://www.team.net/pipermail/mgs">http://www.team.net/pipermail/=
mgs</a> <a =
href=3D"http://autox.team.net/archive">http://autox.team.net/archive</a><=
br><br>Unsubscribe: <a =
href=3D"http://autox.team.net/mailman/options/mgs/[email-masked]">http=
://autox.team.net/mailman/options/mgs/[email-masked]</a><o:p></o:p></p=
></div></blockquote></div></body></html>
------=_NextPart_000_003D_01D85FCB.35305770--

--===============4526485528748297418==
Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit
Content-Disposition: inline

_______________________________________________

[email-masked]

Archive: http://www.team.net/pipermail/mgs http://autox.team.net/archive

Unsubscribe: http://autox.team.net/mailman/options/mgs/[email-masked]

--===============4526485528748297418==--

---

From: <[email-masked]>
Date: Sun, 8 May 2022 07:50:18 +0200

--===============4980546090346502277==
	boundary="----=_NextPart_000_001B_01D862B0.43404040"
Content-Language: en-nl

------=_NextPart_000_001B_01D862B0.43404040
	charset="utf-8"
Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable

Always good to learn of someone=E2=80=99s experiences=E2=80=A6

Hans

Van: Mgs <[email-masked]> Namens [email-masked]
Verzonden: Wednesday, 4 May 2022 21:26
Aan: 'John DiFede' <[email-masked]>; 'Robert Rutherford' <rrutherf@ucalg=
ary.ca>
CC: [email-masked]; 'MG Digest' <[email-masked]>
Onderwerp: Re: [Mgs] Coughing, spitting, and dying

To all of you who responded to my cry for help, THANK YOU so much for your =
suggestions. As it turns out, the root cause of the problem was timing. The=
 stock distributor had been upgraded several years ago to a Pertronix elect=
ronic module which had worked itself loose inside the distributor causing t=
he timing to become erratic. Tugging on the leads to the coil would cause t=
he engine to increase its RPMs and run smoothly. Pushing them back into the=
 distributor reintroduced the backfire and coughing. 

Jim

 On Behalf Of John DiFede

Sounds like a fuel problem.  The Edelbrock 1404 is a simple carburetor to w=
ork on as it is a copy of the Carter AFB carb used since the 60=E2=80=99s. =
 Is your choke set properly when cold and hot?   The AFB used a mechanical =
fuel pump- make sure that facet pump you=E2=80=99re using has the correct f=
uel pressure for the AFB.  Also check your vacuum.  Is the vacuum reading s=
teady or is the gauge needle fluctuating back and forth?   You may have a v=
acuum leak affecting fuel mixture.  When the engine is cold and the choke i=
s on you have a rich mixture allowing the engine to run poorly.  Once the c=
hoke opens the mixture goes lean due to the vacuum leak possibly leading to=
 your motor stalling.  

Sent from my iPhone 

On Apr 23, 2022, at 11:10 PM, Robert Rutherford <[email-masked] <mail=
to:[email-masked]> > wrote:

ic.net> > wrote:

[=E2=96=B3EXTERNAL]

Sounds more like a carb/fuel issue to me. Can=E2=80=99t see how it would be=
 electrical.

Sent from my iPad

>  wrote:

=EF=BB=BF 

Have an 80 MGB V8 conversion that has developed a problem I can=E2=80=99t g=
et my hands around. When cold it coughs and sputters when first starting up=
 and when warm will not run at idle without stalling after several minutes.=
 Thinking it might be an electrical issue, I replaced the plugs, plug wires=
, distributor cap, coil, and battery. It has a PerTronix Ignitor module ins=
talled which I did not replace. The battery shows 12.7 volts on my meter. T=
he alternator is producing 14.6 volts at ~1500 RPMs and 14.3 under load. Fu=
el is fed to an Edelbrock 1404 carburetor via a Facet electric pump with ne=
w filters in the line at the pump and just before the carburetor. I use 93 =
octane non-ethanol gas. I appreciate any thoughts or suggestions you may ha=
ve.

Jim Ray

Archive:  <http://www.team.net/pipermail/mgs> http://www.team.net/pipermail=
/mgs  <http://autox.team.net/archive> http://autox.team.net/archive

Unsubscribe:  <http://autox.team.net/mailman/options/mgs/rrutherf@ucalgary.=
ca> http://autox.team.net/mailman/options/mgs/[email-masked]

-- 
This email has been checked for viruses by Avast antivirus software.
https://www.avast.com/antivirus

------=_NextPart_000_001B_01D862B0.43404040
	charset="utf-8"
Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable

<html xmlns:v=3D"urn:schemas-microsoft-com:vml" xmlns:o=3D"urn:schemas-micr=
osoft-com:office:office" xmlns:w=3D"urn:schemas-microsoft-com:office:word" =
xmlns:m=3D"http://schemas.microsoft.com/office/2004/12/omml" xmlns=3D"http:=
//www.w3.org/TR/REC-html40"><head><meta http-equiv=3DContent-Type content=
=3D"text/html; charset=3Dutf-8"><meta name=3DGenerator content=3D"Microsoft=
 Word 15 (filtered medium)"><style><!--
/* Font Definitions */
@font-face
	{font-family:Helvetica;
	panose-1:2 11 6 4 2 2 2 2 2 4;}
@font-face
	{font-family:"Cambria Math";
	panose-1:2 4 5 3 5 4 6 3 2 4;}
@font-face
	{font-family:Calibri;
	panose-1:2 15 5 2 2 2 4 3 2 4;}
@font-face
	{font-family:Tahoma;
	panose-1:2 11 6 4 3 5 4 4 2 4;}
/* Style Definitions */
p.MsoNormal, li.MsoNormal, div.MsoNormal
	{margin:0cm;
	font-size:11.0pt;
	font-family:"Calibri",sans-serif;}
a:link, span.MsoHyperlink
	{mso-style-priority:99;
	color:blue;
	text-decoration:underline;}
span.apple-converted-space
	{mso-style-name:apple-converted-space;}
span.E-mailStijl21
	{mso-style-type:personal-reply;
	font-family:"Calibri",sans-serif;
	color:windowtext;}
=2EMsoChpDefault
	{mso-style-type:export-only;
	font-size:10.0pt;}
@page WordSection1
	{size:612.0pt 792.0pt;
	margin:72.0pt 72.0pt 72.0pt 72.0pt;}
div.WordSection1
	{page:WordSection1;}
--></style><!--[if gte mso 9]><xml>
<o:shapedefaults v:ext=3D"edit" spidmax=3D"1026" />
</xml><![endif]--><!--[if gte mso 9]><xml>
<o:shapelayout v:ext=3D"edit">
<o:idmap v:ext=3D"edit" data=3D"1" />
</o:shapelayout></xml><![endif]--></head><body lang=3DNL link=3Dblue vlink=
=3Dpurple style=3D'word-wrap:break-word'><div class=3DWordSection1><p class=
=3DMsoNormal><span lang=3DEN-GB style=3D'mso-fareast-language:EN-US'>Always=
 good to learn of someone=E2=80=99s experiences=E2=80=A6<o:p></o:p></span><=
/p><p class=3DMsoNormal><span lang=3DEN-GB style=3D'mso-fareast-language:EN=
-US'><o:p>&nbsp;</o:p></span></p><p class=3DMsoNormal><span lang=3DEN-GB st=
yle=3D'mso-fareast-language:EN-US'>Hans<o:p></o:p></span></p><p class=3DMso=
Normal><span lang=3DEN-GB style=3D'mso-fareast-language:EN-US'><o:p>&nbsp;<=
/o:p></span></p><div><div style=3D'border:none;border-top:solid #E1E1E1 1.0=
pt;padding:3.0pt 0cm 0cm 0cm'><p class=3DMsoNormal><b>Van:</b> Mgs &lt;mgs-=
[email-masked]&gt; <b>Namens </b>[email-masked]<br><b>Verzonden=
:</b> Wednesday, 4 May 2022 21:26<br><b>Aan:</b> 'John DiFede' &lt;difejo1@=
gmail.com&gt;; 'Robert Rutherford' &lt;[email-masked]&gt;<br><b>CC:</=
b> [email-masked]; 'MG Digest' &lt;[email-masked]&gt;<br><b>Onde=
rwerp:</b> Re: [Mgs] Coughing, spitting, and dying<o:p></o:p></p></div></di=
v><p class=3DMsoNormal><o:p>&nbsp;</o:p></p><p class=3DMsoNormal><span lang=
=3DEN-US>To all of you who responded to my cry for help, THANK YOU so much =
for your suggestions. As it turns out, the root cause of the problem was ti=
ming. The stock distributor had been upgraded several years ago to a Pertro=
nix electronic module which had worked itself loose inside the distributor =
causing the timing to become erratic. Tugging on the leads to the coil woul=
d cause the engine to increase its RPMs and run smoothly. Pushing them back=
 into the distributor reintroduced the backfire and coughing. <o:p></o:p></=
span></p><p class=3DMsoNormal><span lang=3DEN-US><o:p>&nbsp;</o:p></span></=
p><p class=3DMsoNormal><span lang=3DEN-US>Thanks again for everyone=E2=80=
=99s help.<o:p></o:p></span></p><p class=3DMsoNormal><span lang=3DEN-US><o:=
p>&nbsp;</o:p></span></p><p class=3DMsoNormal><span lang=3DEN-US>Jim<o:p></=
o:p></span></p><p class=3DMsoNormal><span lang=3DEN-US><o:p>&nbsp;</o:p></s=
pan></p><div><div style=3D'border:none;border-top:solid #E1E1E1 1.0pt;paddi=
ng:3.0pt 0cm 0cm 0cm'><p class=3DMsoNormal><b><span lang=3DEN-US>From:</spa=
n></b><span lang=3DEN-US> Mgs &lt;<a href=3D"mailto:[email-masked].=
net">[email-masked]</a>&gt; <b>On Behalf Of </b>John DiFede<br>=
<b>Sent:</b> Sunday, April 24, 2022 7:28 AM<br><b>To:</b> Robert Rutherford=
 &lt;<a href=3D"mailto:[email-masked]">[email-masked]</a>&gt;<b=
r><b>Cc:</b> <a href=3D"mailto:[email-masked]">[email-masked]=
</a>; MG Digest &lt;<a href=3D"mailto:[email-masked]">[email-masked]=
t</a>&gt;<br><b>Subject:</b> Re: [Mgs] Coughing, spitting, and dying<o:p></=
o:p></span></p></div></div><p class=3DMsoNormal><span lang=3DEN-US><o:p>&nb=
sp;</o:p></span></p><p class=3DMsoNormal style=3D'margin-bottom:12.0pt'><sp=
an lang=3DEN-US>Sounds like a fuel problem. &nbsp;The Edelbrock 1404 is a s=
imple carburetor to work on as it is a copy of the Carter AFB carb used sin=
ce the 60=E2=80=99s. &nbsp;Is your choke set properly when cold and hot? &n=
bsp; The AFB used a mechanical fuel pump- make sure that facet pump you=E2=
=80=99re using has the correct fuel pressure for the AFB. &nbsp;Also check =
your vacuum. &nbsp;Is the vacuum reading steady or is the gauge needle fluc=
tuating back and forth? &nbsp; You may have a vacuum leak affecting fuel mi=
xture. &nbsp;When the engine is cold and the choke is on you have a rich mi=
xture allowing the engine to run poorly. &nbsp;Once the choke opens the mix=
ture goes lean due to the vacuum leak possibly leading to your motor stalli=
ng. &nbsp;<o:p></o:p></span></p><div><p class=3DMsoNormal><span lang=3DEN-U=
S>Sent from my iPhone&nbsp;<o:p></o:p></span></p></div><div><p class=3DMsoN=
ormal style=3D'margin-bottom:12.0pt'><span lang=3DEN-US><o:p>&nbsp;</o:p></=
span></p><blockquote style=3D'margin-top:5.0pt;margin-bottom:5.0pt'><p clas=
s=3DMsoNormal style=3D'margin-bottom:12.0pt'><span lang=3DEN-US>On Apr 23, =
2022, at 11:10 PM, Robert Rutherford &lt;<a href=3D"mailto:rrutherf@ucalgar=
y.ca">[email-masked]</a>&gt; wrote:<o:p></o:p></span></p></blockquote=
></div><blockquote style=3D'margin-top:5.0pt;margin-bottom:5.0pt'><div><p c=
lass=3DMsoNormal><span lang=3DEN-US>=EF=BB=BF Coughs, spits, dies - sounds =
like Covid to me.<o:p></o:p></span></p><div><p class=3DMsoNormal style=3D'm=
argin-bottom:12.0pt'><span lang=3DEN-US><o:p>&nbsp;</o:p></span></p><blockq=
uote style=3D'margin-top:5.0pt;margin-bottom:5.0pt'><div><p class=3DMsoNorm=
al><span lang=3DEN-US>On Apr 21, 2022, at 12:34 PM, Max Heim &lt;<a href=3D=
"mailto:[email-masked]">[email-masked]</a>&gt; wrote:<o:p></o:p></span>=
</p></div><p class=3DMsoNormal><span lang=3DEN-US><o:p>&nbsp;</o:p></span><=
/p><div><table class=3DMsoNormalTable border=3D0 cellspacing=3D0 cellpaddin=
g=3D0 style=3D'caret-color: rgb(0, 0, 0);orphans: auto;widows: auto;-webkit=
-text-size-adjust: auto;-webkit-text-stroke-width: 0px;word-spacing:0px'><t=
r><td style=3D'padding:0cm 0cm 0cm 0cm'><p class=3DMsoNormal style=3D'margi=
n-bottom:7.5pt'><span style=3D'font-family:"Helvetica",sans-serif;color:red=
'>[</span><span style=3D'font-family:"Cambria Math",serif;color:red'>=E2=96=
=B3</span><span style=3D'font-family:"Helvetica",sans-serif;color:red'>EXTE=
RNAL]<o:p></o:p></span></p></td></tr></table><p class=3DMsoNormal style=3D'=
margin-bottom:12.0pt'><span lang=3DEN-US><o:p>&nbsp;</o:p></span></p><div><=
p class=3DMsoNormal style=3D'margin-bottom:12.0pt'><span lang=3DEN-US style=
=3D'font-size:9.0pt;font-family:"Helvetica",sans-serif'>Sounds more like a =
carb/fuel issue to me. Can=E2=80=99t see how it would be electrical.<o:p></=
o:p></span></p><div><p class=3DMsoNormal><span lang=3DEN-US style=3D'font-s=
ize:9.0pt;font-family:"Helvetica",sans-serif'>Sent from my iPad<o:p></o:p><=
/span></p></div><div><p class=3DMsoNormal style=3D'margin-bottom:12.0pt'><s=
pan lang=3DEN-US style=3D'font-size:9.0pt;font-family:"Helvetica",sans-seri=
f'><o:p>&nbsp;</o:p></span></p><blockquote style=3D'margin-top:5.0pt;margin=
-bottom:5.0pt'><p class=3DMsoNormal style=3D'margin-bottom:12.0pt'><span la=
ng=3DEN-US style=3D'font-size:9.0pt;font-family:"Helvetica",sans-serif'>On =
Apr 21, 2022, at 11:58 AM,<span class=3Dapple-converted-space>&nbsp;</span>=
<a href=3D"mailto:[email-masked]">[email-masked]</a><span class=3Da=
pple-converted-space>&nbsp;</span>wrote:<o:p></o:p></span></p></blockquote>=
</div><blockquote style=3D'margin-top:5.0pt;margin-bottom:5.0pt'><div><p cl=
ass=3DMsoNormal><span lang=3DEN-US style=3D'font-size:9.0pt;font-family:"Ta=
homa",sans-serif'>=EF=BB=BF</span><span lang=3DEN-US style=3D'font-size:9.0=
pt;font-family:"Helvetica",sans-serif'> <o:p></o:p></span></p><div><p class=
=3DMsoNormal><span lang=3DEN-US style=3D'font-size:12.0pt;font-family:"Aria=
l",sans-serif'>Have an 80 MGB V8 conversion that has developed a problem I =
can=E2=80=99t get my hands around. When cold it coughs and sputters when fi=
rst starting up and when warm will not run at idle without stalling after s=
everal minutes. Thinking it might be an electrical issue, I replaced the pl=
ugs, plug wires, distributor cap, coil, and battery. It has a PerTronix Ign=
itor module installed which I did not replace. The battery shows 12.7 volts=
 on my meter. The alternator is producing 14.6 volts at ~1500 RPMs and 14.3=
 under load. Fuel is fed to an Edelbrock 1404 carburetor via a Facet electr=
ic pump with new filters in the line at the pump and just before the carbur=
etor. I use 93 octane non-ethanol gas. I appreciate any thoughts or suggest=
ions you may have.</span><span lang=3DEN-US><o:p></o:p></span></p></div><di=
v><p class=3DMsoNormal><span lang=3DEN-US style=3D'font-size:12.0pt;font-fa=
mily:"Arial",sans-serif'>&nbsp;</span><span lang=3DEN-US><o:p></o:p></span>=
</p></div><div><p class=3DMsoNormal><span lang=3DEN-US style=3D'font-size:1=
2.0pt;font-family:"Arial",sans-serif'>Jim Ray</span><span lang=3DEN-US><o:p=
></o:p></span></p></div><div><p class=3DMsoNormal><span lang=3DEN-US style=
=3D'font-size:12.0pt;font-family:"Arial",sans-serif'>&nbsp;</span><span lan=
g=3DEN-US><o:p></o:p></span></p></div><div><p class=3DMsoNormal><span lang=
=3DEN-US style=3D'font-size:12.0pt;font-family:"Arial",sans-serif;color:#37=
3737'>&nbsp;</span><span lang=3DEN-US><o:p></o:p></span></p></div><p class=
=3DMsoNormal><span lang=3DEN-US style=3D'font-size:9.0pt;font-family:"Helve=
tica",sans-serif'>_______________________________________________<br><br><a=
 href=3D"mailto:[email-masked]">[email-masked]</a><br>Donate:<span =
class=3Dapple-converted-space>&nbsp;</span><a href=3D"http://www.team.net/d=
onate.html">http://www.team.net/donate.html</a><br>Suggested annual donatio=
n &nbsp;$12.75<br><br>Archive:<span class=3Dapple-converted-space>&nbsp;</s=
pan><a href=3D"http://www.team.net/pipermail/mgs">http://www.team.net/piper=
mail/mgs</a><span class=3Dapple-converted-space>&nbsp;</span><a href=3D"htt=
p://autox.team.net/archive">http://autox.team.net/archive</a><br><br>Unsubs=
cribe:<span class=3Dapple-converted-space>&nbsp;</span><a href=3D"http://au=
tox.team.net/mailman/options/mgs/[email-masked]">http://autox.team.net/ma=
ilman/options/mgs/[email-masked]</a><o:p></o:p></span></p></div></blockqu=
ote></div><p class=3DMsoNormal><span lang=3DEN-US style=3D'font-size:9.0pt;=
font-family:"Helvetica",sans-serif'>_______________________________________=
________<br><br></span><span lang=3DEN-US><a href=3D"mailto:[email-masked].=
net"><span style=3D'font-size:9.0pt;font-family:"Helvetica",sans-serif'>Mgs=
@autox.team.net</span></a></span><span lang=3DEN-US style=3D'font-size:9.0p=
t;font-family:"Helvetica",sans-serif'><br>Donate:<span class=3Dapple-conver=
ted-space>&nbsp;</span></span><span lang=3DEN-US><a href=3D"http://www.team=
=2Enet/donate.html"><span style=3D'font-size:9.0pt;font-family:"Helvetica",=
sans-serif'>http://www.team.net/donate.html</span></a></span><span lang=3DE=
N-US style=3D'font-size:9.0pt;font-family:"Helvetica",sans-serif'><br>Sugge=
sted annual donation &nbsp;$12.75<br><br>Archive:<span class=3Dapple-conver=
ted-space>&nbsp;</span></span><span lang=3DEN-US><a href=3D"http://www.team=
=2Enet/pipermail/mgs"><span style=3D'font-size:9.0pt;font-family:"Helvetica=
",sans-serif'>http://www.team.net/pipermail/mgs</span></a></span><span clas=
s=3Dapple-converted-space><span lang=3DEN-US style=3D'font-size:9.0pt;font-=
family:"Helvetica",sans-serif'>&nbsp;</span></span><span lang=3DEN-US><a hr=
ef=3D"http://autox.team.net/archive"><span style=3D'font-size:9.0pt;font-fa=
mily:"Helvetica",sans-serif'>http://autox.team.net/archive</span></a></span=
><span lang=3DEN-US style=3D'font-size:9.0pt;font-family:"Helvetica",sans-s=
erif'><br><br>Unsubscribe:<span class=3Dapple-converted-space>&nbsp;</span>=
</span><span lang=3DEN-US><a href=3D"http://autox.team.net/mailman/options/=
mgs/[email-masked]"><span style=3D'font-size:9.0pt;font-family:"Helve=
tica",sans-serif'>http://autox.team.net/mailman/options/mgs/rrutherf@ucalga=
ry.ca</span></a><o:p></o:p></span></p></div></blockquote></div><p class=3DM=
soNormal><span lang=3DEN-US><br>___________________________________________=
____<br><br><a href=3D"mailto:[email-masked]">[email-masked]</a><br=
>Donate: <a href=3D"http://www.team.net/donate.html">http://www.team.net/do=
nate.html</a><br>Suggested annual donation &nbsp;$12.75<br><br>Archive: <a =
href=3D"http://www.team.net/pipermail/mgs">http://www.team.net/pipermail/mg=
s</a> <a href=3D"http://autox.team.net/archive">http://autox.team.net/archi=
ve</a><br><br>Unsubscribe: <a href=3D"http://autox.team.net/mailman/options=
/mgs/[email-masked]">http://autox.team.net/mailman/options/mgs/difejo1@g=
mail.com</a><o:p></o:p></span></p></div></blockquote></div><div id=3D"DAB4F=
AD8-2DD7-40BB-A1B8-4E2AA1F9FDF2"><br />
<table style=3D"border-top: 1px solid #D3D4DE;">
	<tr>
        <td style=3D"width: 55px; padding-top: 13px;"><a href=3D"https://ww=
w.avast.com/sig-email?utm_medium=3Demail&utm_source=3Dlink&utm_campaign=3Ds=
ig-email&utm_content=3Demailclient" target=3D"_blank"><img src=3D"https://i=
pmcdn.avast.com/images/icons/icon-envelope-tick-round-orange-animated-no-re=
peat-v1.gif" alt=3D"" width=3D"46" height=3D"29" style=3D"width: 46px; heig=
ht: 29px;" /></a></td>
		<td style=3D"width: 470px; padding-top: 12px; color: #41424e; font-size: =
13px; font-family: Arial, Helvetica, sans-serif; line-height: 18px;">Virus-=
free. <a href=3D"https://www.avast.com/sig-email?utm_medium=3Demail&utm_sou=
rce=3Dlink&utm_campaign=3Dsig-email&utm_content=3Demailclient" target=3D"_b=
lank" style=3D"color: #4453ea;">www.avast.com</a>
		</td>
	</tr>
</table><a href=3D"#DAB4FAD8-2DD7-40BB-A1B8-4E2AA1F9FDF2" width=3D"1" heigh=
t=3D"1"> </a></div></body></html>
------=_NextPart_000_001B_01D862B0.43404040--

--===============4980546090346502277==
Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit
Content-Disposition: inline

[email-masked]

--===============4980546090346502277==--

---

From: Steve Shoyer <[email-masked]>
Date: Tue, 24 May 2022 20:52:48 -0400

Hi - the radio in my 1980 MGB had been flaky for a while.  It would work 
with the key in the accessory position but not in the run position.  I 
could wiggle the key backwards and the radio would come on, but if I 
wiggled too far the engine would turn off.  I assumed that the ignition 
switch wasn't positioned properly but as long as I could get it to work 
I forgot about it by the time I got home.

Until the radio wouldn't work at all.  No power was going to it. I tried 
to trace the white-green circuit and found that the white-green wire was 
melted about 2" from the ignition switch harness connector and the 
insulation had bonded the white-green to the other wires in the bundle.  
The other wires didn't seem to be damaged, and I was able to peel the 
wires apart without any problem.  I repaired the burned section of 
white-green and tried it again, this time resulting smoke coming from 
the steering column.  The white-green wire had melted along most of its 
length.

I had a spare ignition switch (not sure of its history, but maybe it 
came from a parts car) and swapped it in.  Strangely, it had a splice on 
the white-green wire near the connector.  It also started smoking.

I tried to check the old spare switch (before it melted) to see how the 
switch worked but I didn't learn anything.  I also tried to see if there 
was voltage on any of the wires in the connector that mates with the 
ignition switch, thinking that power comes into the switch on the brown 
wire and is distributed to the other wires depending on the switch's 
position.  I grounded the black lead of my multimeter to the chassis and 
started looking for DC voltage on the other wires.  At first I didn't 
see anything, but when I touched one of the wires (I think white-red) 
the starter kicked in.  I stopped there.

Any ideas as to what might be causing the wire to melt?  I didn't see 
any obvious problems with the wiring harness in the engine compartment, 
but it's very possible that I missed something. Also, when replacing the 
ignition switch, should I get an aftermarket switch or the Lucas 
switch?  The Lucas switch is about twice the cost of aftermarket so I'm 
leaning toward the aftermarket switch, especially if it might just burn 
up as soon as it's installed.

Another odd thing is that the car ran fine when the radio wasn't working 
at all.  I didn't get smoke from the wiring, although by then the 
white-green wire was burned away before it left the ignition switch harness.

Thanks.

--Steve (1980 MGB)

[email-masked]
Donate: http://www.team.net/donate.html
Suggested annual donation  $12.75

---

From: PaulHunt73 <[email-masked]> 6Tz405d3+FhDT3qEHxI374PxDXroNuDqJwwCPoldqvkan1/UVha3GdQ0gNyYhfnGCLmMCYIgjT7kh2oSbluSiPWhjfUY7a0C/vk=
Date: Fri, 27 May 2022 08:55:14 +0100

The wire is smoking because whatever it's feeding is shorted to earth, 
so you will have to follow that wire to the radio.  If you have a fuse 
in the wire going into the radio then it's not the radio itself or that 
would have blown.  Assuming there IS a fuse in there and not a nail or 
something.  If no fuse then it could be the radio so disconnect it and 
try again, and if it still smokes the short is between that point and 
the visible melting of the white/green.

It's not the switch that is faulty in this respect, although having been 
feeding a short-circuit the contacts in the switch may have been 
damaged.  It does sound as if the switch is iffy as well, maybe because 
of the short having been present in the past. So you need to find and 
fix the short before changing the switch or you are likely to damage 
that switch as well.  That wire should only go from the switch to the 
centre console for the radio ending at a bullet connector, it doesn't go 
via the engine compartment.

PaulH.

On 25/05/2022 01:52, Steve Shoyer wrote:
> Hi - the radio in my 1980 MGB had been flaky for a while.  It would 
> work with the key in the accessory position but not in the run 
> position.  I could wiggle the key backwards and the radio would come 
> on, but if I wiggled too far the engine would turn off.  I assumed 
> that the ignition switch wasn't positioned properly but as long as I 
> could get it to work I forgot about it by the time I got home.
>
> Until the radio wouldn't work at all.  No power was going to it. I 
> tried to trace the white-green circuit and found that the white-green 
> wire was melted about 2" from the ignition switch harness connector 
> and the insulation had bonded the white-green to the other wires in 
> the bundle.  The other wires didn't seem to be damaged, and I was able 
> to peel the wires apart without any problem.  I repaired the burned 
> section of white-green and tried it again, this time resulting smoke 
> coming from the steering column.  The white-green wire had melted 
> along most of its length.
>
> came from a parts car) and swapped it in.  Strangely, it had a splice 
> on the white-green wire near the connector.  It also started smoking.
>
> I tried to check the old spare switch (before it melted) to see how 
> the switch worked but I didn't learn anything.  I also tried to see if 
> there was voltage on any of the wires in the connector that mates with 
> the ignition switch, thinking that power comes into the switch on the 
> brown wire and is distributed to the other wires depending on the 
> switch's position.  I grounded the black lead of my multimeter to the 
> chassis and started looking for DC voltage on the other wires.  At 
> first I didn't see anything, but when I touched one of the wires (I 
> think white-red) the starter kicked in.  I stopped there.
>
> any obvious problems with the wiring harness in the engine 
> compartment, but it's very possible that I missed something. Also, 
> when replacing the ignition switch, should I get an aftermarket switch 
> or the Lucas switch?  The Lucas switch is about twice the cost of 
> aftermarket so I'm leaning toward the aftermarket switch, especially 
> if it might just burn up as soon as it's installed.
>
> Another odd thing is that the car ran fine when the radio wasn't 
> working at all.  I didn't get smoke from the wiring, although by then 
> the white-green wire was burned away before it left the ignition 
> switch harness.
>
> Thanks.
>
> --Steve (1980 MGB)
>
> Unsubscribe: 
> http://autox.team.net/mailman/options/mgs/[email-masked]

[email-masked]

---

From: "[email-masked]" <[email-masked]>
Date: Fri, 27 May 2022 11:09:00 -0400

This is a multi-part message in MIME format.
--------------fJmRsXAVtL0LXNCOz21FXQty
Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit

Steve - I fully agree with PaulH. Though the switch may now be 
compromised but it's highly unlikely it was the cause. The cause is a 
short circuit in the green/white (G/W) wire. Though there is no fuse 
indicated in the wiring diagrams for the car there may be one in the 
lead from the radio to the bullet connector of the G/W wire. If there is 
a fuse and it is not blown then the short is between the fuse and the 
ignition switch. The G/W does not go through the firewall.

There are some mildly sharp edges in the steering wheel supports that 
the wires run near - could be rubbing caused it or more likely someone 
working on the radio pulled it a bit much.

Also - having had a few ignition switches apart the way it is built it 
would be very hard for it to be misaligned. What can happen is where the 
shaft from the key mechanism can wear the plastic of the actual switch 
and cause it to not connect properly - the "If I wiggle it it works" or 
"If I wiggle it it doesn't work" syndrome.

I would replace the switch - after you find the problem. Last week I 
just purchased an aftermarket switch for my b - BPNorthwest has it for 
under $20, part number BHA5292.

Here's my comments on what connects to what and why - I'm doing this to 
help anyone trouble shooting and ignition switch and also to reinforce 
it in my head.

Brown (Br) wire is the 12v feed and is always hot.

Slate is the anti-run on - power only when the key is off.

G/W is accessory and running. The radio is connected to G/W so you can 
turn the radio on without the car running.

White (W) is to the fuel pump (inertia switch first), overdrive, 
ignition system (with ignition relay on later models) and it feeds the 
Green wire going to most instruments, turn signals and the like.

Red/white (R/W) is the power to the starter relay, seat belt module, 
hand brake, alternator warning lamp. On some models this wire doesn't go 
directly to the starter relay - it goes to the seat belt module so you 
can't start the car without buckling your seat belt :)

Purple is the connection to the horn - it works opposite of the other 
wires - in the end of the connector coming from under the dash it is 
always 12v. The purple wire from the connect on the switch should go to 
ground when the horn is pressed.

Here's a table of what should connect when on the switch.
Position 1 is off, then progressively 2 is accessory, 3 is running, 4 is 
starting.

You can test the switch by disconnecting the plug under the dash - 
connect one side of a meter or powered continuity tester to the brown 
wire and checking each of the other wires. Where there is an X you 
should get a connection. If not, the switch is bad. If you get a 
connection on a spot that does not have an X the switch is bad.

Position     S  G/W    W     R/W   Br    Purple
-------------------------------------------------------------------------
1            |  X |        |      |        |    X  |           |
2            |     |   X   |      |        |    X  |           |
3            |     |   X   |  X  |        |    X  |           |
4            |     |        |  X  |   X   |    X  |           |

leon ...
https://leonsmgb.com

On 5/27/22 3:55 AM, PaulHunt73 wrote:
> in the wire going into the radio then it's not the radio itself or 
> that would have blown.  Assuming there IS a fuse in there and not a 
> nail or something.  If no fuse then it could be the radio so 
> disconnect it and try again, and if it still smokes the short is 
> between that point and the visible melting of the white/green.
>
> It's not the switch that is faulty in this respect, although having 
> been feeding a short-circuit the contacts in the switch may have been 
> damaged.  It does sound as if the switch is iffy as well, maybe 
> because of the short having been present in the past. So you need to 
> find and fix the short before changing the switch or you are likely to 
> damage that switch as well.  That wire should only go from the switch 
> to the centre console for the radio ending at a bullet connector, it 
> doesn't go via the engine compartment.
>
> PaulH.
>
>
>> the bundle.  The other wires didn't seem to be damaged, and I was 
>> able to peel the wires apart without any problem.  I repaired the 
>> burned section of white-green and tried it again, this time resulting 
>> smoke coming from the steering column.  The white-green wire had 
>> melted along most of its length.
>>
>> the switch worked but I didn't learn anything.  I also tried to see 
>> if there was voltage on any of the wires in the connector that mates 
>> with the ignition switch, thinking that power comes into the switch 
>> on the brown wire and is distributed to the other wires depending on 
>> the switch's position.  I grounded the black lead of my multimeter to 
>> the chassis and started looking for DC voltage on the other wires.  
>> At first I didn't see anything, but when I touched one of the wires 
>> (I think white-red) the starter kicked in.  I stopped there.
>>
>> when replacing the ignition switch, should I get an aftermarket 
>> switch or the Lucas switch?  The Lucas switch is about twice the cost 
>> of aftermarket so I'm leaning toward the aftermarket switch, 
>> especially if it might just burn up as soon as it's installed.
>>
> Unsubscribe: http://autox.team.net/mailman/options/mgs/[email-masked]
--------------fJmRsXAVtL0LXNCOz21FXQty
Content-Disposition: attachment; filename="leon.vcf"
Content-Transfer-Encoding: base64

bnVsbA==

--------------fJmRsXAVtL0LXNCOz21FXQty
Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit
Content-Disposition: inline

[email-masked]

--------------fJmRsXAVtL0LXNCOz21FXQty--

---

From: PaulHunt73 <[email-masked]> ydoj/nLnwKZUatWAj3GSUUtWmwBWAnDLolg54Nonuu444Ga/66X9hw7+dG4vouYJQbOIdXbsRV7pqbuqbbbwTh4nwgqtTek8UkA=
Date: Fri, 27 May 2022 16:41:22 +0100

Some amendments:

White/red (not red/white, that is instrument illumination) from the 
ignition switch is for the starter.  The alternator warning lamp has a 
white wire from the ignition switch.

Purple/pink on the ignition switch, not purple, for the 'key in, door 
open' warning and is at earth/ground when the key is in. Purple is the 
fused always hot supply from the fusebox to horns, courtesy lights, 
headlamp flasher etc. but not associated with the ignition switch.

PaulH.

On 27/05/2022 16:09, [email-masked] wrote:
> lead from the radio to the bullet connector of the G/W wire. If there 
> is a fuse and it is not blown then the short is between the fuse and 
> the ignition switch. The G/W does not go through the firewall.
>
> would be very hard for it to be misaligned. What can happen is where 
> the shaft from the key mechanism can wear the plastic of the actual 
> switch and cause it to not connect properly - the "If I wiggle it it 
> works" or "If I wiggle it it doesn't work" syndrome.
>
> Here's my comments on what connects to what and why - I'm doing this 
> to help anyone trouble shooting and ignition switch and also to 
> reinforce it in my head.
>
> hand brake, alternator warning lamp. On some models this wire doesn't 
> go directly to the starter relay - it goes to the seat belt module so 
> you can't start the car without buckling your seat belt :)
>
> always 12v. The purple wire from the connect on the switch should go 
> to ground when the horn is pressed.
>
> Position 1 is off, then progressively 2 is accessory, 3 is running, 4 
> is starting.
>

[email-masked]

---

From: "[email-masked]" <[email-masked]>
Date: Fri, 27 May 2022 11:59:07 -0400

This is a multi-part message in MIME format.
--------------0MGghwkfUOA4KnjNMoEm4GL0
Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit

agreed.

On 5/27/22 11:41 AM, PaulHunt73 wrote:
>> the wires run near - could be rubbing caused it or more likely 
>> someone working on the radio pulled it a bit much.
>>
>> Also - having had a few ignition switches apart the way it is built 
>> it would be very hard for it to be misaligned. What can happen is 
>> where the shaft from the key mechanism can wear the plastic of the 
>> actual switch and cause it to not connect properly - the "If I wiggle 
>> it it works" or "If I wiggle it it doesn't work" syndrome.
>>
>> just purchased an aftermarket switch for my b - BPNorthwest has it 
>> for under $20, part number BHA5292.
>>
>> G/W is accessory and running. The radio is connected to G/W so you 
>> can turn the radio on without the car running.
>>
>> ignition system (with ignition relay on later models) and it feeds 
>> the Green wire going to most instruments, turn signals and the like.
>>
--------------0MGghwkfUOA4KnjNMoEm4GL0
Content-Disposition: attachment; filename="leon.vcf"
Content-Transfer-Encoding: base64

bnVsbA==

--------------0MGghwkfUOA4KnjNMoEm4GL0
Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit
Content-Disposition: inline

[email-masked]

--------------0MGghwkfUOA4KnjNMoEm4GL0--

---

From: <[email-masked]>
Date: Sat, 28 May 2022 10:43:13 +0200

--===============7009095079695440421==
	boundary="----=_NextPart_000_0032_01D8727F.BBAE3940"
Content-Language: en-nl

------=_NextPart_000_0032_01D8727F.BBAE3940
	boundary="----=_NextPart_001_0033_01D8727F.BBAE6050"

------=_NextPart_001_0033_01D8727F.BBAE6050
	charset="utf-8"
Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable

Hi Steve,

The burnt wire only is a feed to the radio - see this part of the diagram.

It seems, that the radio itself is making a short to ground. 

Pity two ignition switches have been damaged by this.

The problem with MGB=E2=80=99s is that many parts of the wiring are poorly =
protected against short circuits.

Another radio is easy to find I think.

If you want to preserve the radio because of originality, it should be repa=
ired.

Hope this helps.

Cheers,

Hans

71 BGT

-----Oorspronkelijk bericht-----
Van: Mgs <[email-masked]> Namens Steve Shoyer
Verzonden: Wednesday, 25 May 2022 02:53
Aan: [email-masked]
Onderwerp: [Mgs] 80B, melted white-green wire from ignition switch

Hi - the radio in my 1980 MGB had been flaky for a while.  It would work wi=
th the key in the accessory position but not in the run position.  I could =
wiggle the key backwards and the radio would come on, but if I wiggled too =
far the engine would turn off.  I assumed that the ignition switch wasn't p=
ositioned properly but as long as I could get it to work I forgot about it =
by the time I got home.

Until the radio wouldn't work at all.  No power was going to it. I tried to=
 trace the white-green circuit and found that the white-green wire was melt=
ed about 2" from the ignition switch harness connector and the insulation h=
ad bonded the white-green to the other wires in the bundle. The other wires=
 didn't seem to be damaged, and I was able to peel the wires apart without =
any problem.  I repaired the burned section of white-green and tried it aga=
in, this time resulting smoke coming from the steering column.  The white-g=
reen wire had melted along most of its length.

I had a spare ignition switch (not sure of its history, but maybe it came f=
rom a parts car) and swapped it in.  Strangely, it had a splice on the whit=
e-green wire near the connector.  It also started smoking.

I tried to check the old spare switch (before it melted) to see how the swi=
tch worked but I didn't learn anything.  I also tried to see if there was v=
oltage on any of the wires in the connector that mates with the ignition sw=
itch, thinking that power comes into the switch on the brown wire and is di=
stributed to the other wires depending on the switch's position.  I grounde=
d the black lead of my multimeter to the chassis and started looking for DC=
 voltage on the other wires.  At first I didn't see anything, but when I to=
uched one of the wires (I think white-red) the starter kicked in.  I stoppe=
d there.

Any ideas as to what might be causing the wire to melt?  I didn't see any o=
bvious problems with the wiring harness in the engine compartment, but it's=
 very possible that I missed something. Also, when replacing the ignition s=
witch, should I get an aftermarket switch or the Lucas switch?  The Lucas s=
witch is about twice the cost of aftermarket so I'm leaning toward the afte=
rmarket switch, especially if it might just burn up as soon as it's install=
ed.

Another odd thing is that the car ran fine when the radio wasn't working at=
 all.  I didn't get smoke from the wiring, although by then the white-green=
 wire was burned away before it left the ignition switch harness.

Thanks.

--Steve (1980 MGB)

 

Unsubscribe:  <http://autox.team.net/mailman/options/mgs/h.duinhoven@planet=
=2Enl> http://autox.team.net/mailman/options/mgs/[email-masked]

------=_NextPart_001_0033_01D8727F.BBAE6050
	charset="utf-8"
Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable

<html xmlns:v=3D"urn:schemas-microsoft-com:vml" xmlns:o=3D"urn:schemas-micr=
osoft-com:office:office" xmlns:w=3D"urn:schemas-microsoft-com:office:word" =
xmlns:m=3D"http://schemas.microsoft.com/office/2004/12/omml" xmlns=3D"http:=
//www.w3.org/TR/REC-html40"><head><meta http-equiv=3DContent-Type content=
=3D"text/html; charset=3Dutf-8"><meta name=3DGenerator content=3D"Microsoft=
 Word 15 (filtered medium)"><!--[if !mso]><style>v\:* {behavior:url(#defaul=
t#VML);}
o\:* {behavior:url(#default#VML);}
w\:* {behavior:url(#default#VML);}
=2Eshape {behavior:url(#default#VML);}
</style><![endif]--><style><!--
/* Font Definitions */
@font-face
	{font-family:"Cambria Math";
	panose-1:2 4 5 3 5 4 6 3 2 4;}
@font-face
	{font-family:Calibri;
	panose-1:2 15 5 2 2 2 4 3 2 4;}
/* Style Definitions */
p.MsoPlainText, li.MsoPlainText, div.MsoPlainText
	{mso-style-priority:99;
	mso-style-link:"Tekst zonder opmaak Char";
	margin:0cm;
	font-size:11.0pt;
	font-family:"Calibri",sans-serif;
	mso-fareast-language:EN-US;}
span.TekstzonderopmaakChar
	{mso-style-name:"Tekst zonder opmaak Char";
	mso-style-priority:99;
	mso-style-link:"Tekst zonder opmaak";
	font-family:"Calibri",sans-serif;}
span.E-mailStijl20
	{mso-style-type:personal-compose;
	font-family:"Calibri",sans-serif;
	color:windowtext;}
=2EMsoChpDefault
	{mso-style-type:export-only;
	font-family:"Calibri",sans-serif;
	mso-fareast-language:EN-US;}
@page WordSection1
	{size:612.0pt 792.0pt;
	margin:72.0pt 72.0pt 72.0pt 72.0pt;}
div.WordSection1
	{page:WordSection1;}
--></style><!--[if gte mso 9]><xml>
<o:shapedefaults v:ext=3D"edit" spidmax=3D"1026" />
</xml><![endif]--><!--[if gte mso 9]><xml>
<o:shapelayout v:ext=3D"edit">
<o:idmap v:ext=3D"edit" data=3D"1" />
</o:shapelayout></xml><![endif]--></head><body lang=3DNL link=3D"#0563C1" v=
link=3D"#954F72" style=3D'word-wrap:break-word'><div class=3DWordSection1><=
p class=3DMsoPlainText><span lang=3DEN-GB>Hi Steve,<o:p></o:p></span></p><p=
 class=3DMsoPlainText><span lang=3DEN-GB><o:p>&nbsp;</o:p></span></p><p cla=
ss=3DMsoPlainText><span lang=3DEN-GB>The burnt wire only is a feed to the r=
adio - see this part of the diagram.<o:p></o:p></span></p><p class=3DMsoPla=
inText><span lang=3DEN-GB><img width=3D700 height=3D346 style=3D'width:7.29=
16in;height:3.6041in' id=3D"Afbeelding_x0020_1" src=3D"cid:image001.png@01D=
8727E.FF8BAFE0"></span><span lang=3DEN-GB><o:p></o:p></span></p><p class=3D=
MsoPlainText><span lang=3DEN-GB><o:p>&nbsp;</o:p></span></p><p class=3DMsoP=
lainText><span lang=3DEN-GB>It seems, that the radio itself is making a sho=
rt to ground. <o:p></o:p></span></p><p class=3DMsoPlainText><span lang=3DEN=
-GB>Pity two ignition switches have been damaged by this.<o:p></o:p></span>=
</p><p class=3DMsoPlainText><span lang=3DEN-GB><o:p>&nbsp;</o:p></span></p>=
<p class=3DMsoPlainText><span lang=3DEN-GB>The problem with MGB=E2=80=99s i=
s that many parts of the wiring are poorly protected against short circuits=
=2E<o:p></o:p></span></p><p class=3DMsoPlainText><span lang=3DEN-GB>Another=
 radio is easy to find I think.<o:p></o:p></span></p><p class=3DMsoPlainTex=
t><span lang=3DEN-GB>If you want to preserve the radio because of originali=
ty, it should be repaired.<o:p></o:p></span></p><p class=3DMsoPlainText><sp=
an lang=3DEN-GB><o:p>&nbsp;</o:p></span></p><p class=3DMsoPlainText><span l=
ang=3DEN-GB>Hope this helps.<o:p></o:p></span></p><p class=3DMsoPlainText><=
span lang=3DEN-GB><o:p>&nbsp;</o:p></span></p><p class=3DMsoPlainText><span=
 lang=3DEN-GB>Cheers,<o:p></o:p></span></p><p class=3DMsoPlainText><span la=
ng=3DEN-GB>Hans<o:p></o:p></span></p><p class=3DMsoPlainText><span lang=3DE=
N-GB>71 BGT<o:p></o:p></span></p><p class=3DMsoPlainText><span lang=3DEN-GB=
><o:p>&nbsp;</o:p></span></p><p class=3DMsoPlainText><span lang=3DEN-GB><o:=
p>&nbsp;</o:p></span></p><p class=3DMsoPlainText><span lang=3DEN-GB><o:p>&n=
bsp;</o:p></span></p><p class=3DMsoPlainText><span style=3D'mso-fareast-lan=
guage:NL'>-----Oorspronkelijk bericht-----<br>Van: Mgs &lt;mgs-bounces@auto=
x.team.net&gt; Namens Steve Shoyer<br>Verzonden: Wednesday, 25 May 2022 02:=
53<br>Aan: [email-masked]<br>Onderwerp: [Mgs] 80B, melted white-green w=
ire from ignition switch</span></p><p class=3DMsoPlainText><o:p>&nbsp;</o:p=
></p><p class=3DMsoPlainText>Hi - the radio in my 1980 MGB had been flaky f=
or a while.&nbsp; It would work with the key in the accessory position but =
not in the run position.&nbsp; I could wiggle the key backwards and the rad=
io would come on, but if I wiggled too far the engine would turn off.&nbsp;=
 I assumed that the ignition switch wasn't positioned properly but as long =
as I could get it to work I forgot about it by the time I got home.<o:p></o=
:p></p><p class=3DMsoPlainText><o:p>&nbsp;</o:p></p><p class=3DMsoPlainText=
>Until the radio wouldn't work at all.&nbsp; No power was going to it. I tr=
ied to trace the white-green circuit and found that the white-green wire wa=
s melted about 2&quot; from the ignition switch harness connector and the i=
nsulation had bonded the white-green to the other wires in the bundle. The =
other wires didn't seem to be damaged, and I was able to peel the wires apa=
rt without any problem.&nbsp; I repaired the burned section of white-green =
and tried it again, this time resulting smoke coming from the steering colu=
mn.&nbsp; The white-green wire had melted along most of its length.<o:p></o=
:p></p><p class=3DMsoPlainText><o:p>&nbsp;</o:p></p><p class=3DMsoPlainText=
>I had a spare ignition switch (not sure of its history, but maybe it came =
from a parts car) and swapped it in.&nbsp; Strangely, it had a splice on th=
e white-green wire near the connector.&nbsp; It also started smoking.<o:p><=
/o:p></p><p class=3DMsoPlainText><o:p>&nbsp;</o:p></p><p class=3DMsoPlainTe=
xt>I tried to check the old spare switch (before it melted) to see how the =
switch worked but I didn't learn anything.&nbsp; I also tried to see if the=
re was voltage on any of the wires in the connector that mates with the ign=
ition switch, thinking that power comes into the switch on the brown wire a=
nd is distributed to the other wires depending on the switch's position.&nb=
sp; I grounded the black lead of my multimeter to the chassis and started l=
ooking for DC voltage on the other wires.&nbsp; At first I didn't see anyth=
ing, but when I touched one of the wires (I think white-red) the starter ki=
cked in.&nbsp; I stopped there.<o:p></o:p></p><p class=3DMsoPlainText><o:p>=
&nbsp;</o:p></p><p class=3DMsoPlainText>Any ideas as to what might be causi=
ng the wire to melt?&nbsp; I didn't see any obvious problems with the wirin=
g harness in the engine compartment, but it's very possible that I missed s=
omething. Also, when replacing the ignition switch, should I get an afterma=
rket switch or the Lucas switch?&nbsp; The Lucas switch is about twice the =
cost of aftermarket so I'm leaning toward the aftermarket switch, especiall=
y if it might just burn up as soon as it's installed.<o:p></o:p></p><p clas=
s=3DMsoPlainText><o:p>&nbsp;</o:p></p><p class=3DMsoPlainText>Another odd t=
hing is that the car ran fine when the radio wasn't working at all.&nbsp; I=
 didn't get smoke from the wiring, although by then the white-green wire wa=
s burned away before it left the ignition switch harness.<o:p></o:p></p><p =
class=3DMsoPlainText><o:p>&nbsp;</o:p></p><p class=3DMsoPlainText>Thanks.<o=
:p></o:p></p><p class=3DMsoPlainText><o:p>&nbsp;</o:p></p><p class=3DMsoPla=
inText>--Steve (1980 MGB)<o:p></o:p></p><p class=3DMsoPlainText><o:p>&nbsp;=
</o:p></p><p class=3DMsoPlainText>_________________________________________=
______<o:p></o:p></p><p class=3DMsoPlainText><o:p>&nbsp;</o:p></p><p class=
=3DMsoPlainText><a href=3D"mailto:[email-masked]"><span style=3D'color:=
windowtext;text-decoration:none'>[email-masked]</span></a><o:p></o:p></=
p><p class=3DMsoPlainText>Donate: <a href=3D"http://www.team.net/donate.htm=
l"><span style=3D'color:windowtext;text-decoration:none'>http://www.team.ne=
t/donate.html</span></a><o:p></o:p></p><p class=3DMsoPlainText>Suggested an=
nual donation=C2=A0 $12.75<o:p></o:p></p><p class=3DMsoPlainText><o:p>&nbsp=
;</o:p></p><p class=3DMsoPlainText>Archive: <a href=3D"http://www.team.net/=
pipermail/mgs"><span style=3D'color:windowtext;text-decoration:none'>http:/=
/www.team.net/pipermail/mgs</span></a> <a href=3D"http://autox.team.net/arc=
hive"><span style=3D'color:windowtext;text-decoration:none'>http://autox.te=
am.net/archive</span></a><o:p></o:p></p><p class=3DMsoPlainText><o:p>&nbsp;=
</o:p></p><p class=3DMsoPlainText>Unsubscribe: <a href=3D"http://autox.team=
=2Enet/mailman/options/mgs/[email-masked]"><span style=3D'color:wind=
owtext;text-decoration:none'>http://autox.team.net/mailman/options/mgs/h.du=
[email-masked]</span></a><o:p></o:p></p></div><div id=3D"DAB4FAD8-2DD7-4=
0BB-A1B8-4E2AA1F9FDF2"><br />
<table style=3D"border-top: 1px solid #D3D4DE;">
	<tr>
        <td style=3D"width: 55px; padding-top: 13px;"><a href=3D"https://ww=
w.avast.com/sig-email?utm_medium=3Demail&utm_source=3Dlink&utm_campaign=3Ds=
ig-email&utm_content=3Demailclient" target=3D"_blank"><img src=3D"https://i=
pmcdn.avast.com/images/icons/icon-envelope-tick-round-orange-animated-no-re=
peat-v1.gif" alt=3D"" width=3D"46" height=3D"29" style=3D"width: 46px; heig=
ht: 29px;" /></a></td>
		<td style=3D"width: 470px; padding-top: 12px; color: #41424e; font-size: =
13px; font-family: Arial, Helvetica, sans-serif; line-height: 18px;">Virus-=
free. <a href=3D"https://www.avast.com/sig-email?utm_medium=3Demail&utm_sou=
rce=3Dlink&utm_campaign=3Dsig-email&utm_content=3Demailclient" target=3D"_b=
lank" style=3D"color: #4453ea;">www.avast.com</a>
		</td>
	</tr>
</table><a href=3D"#DAB4FAD8-2DD7-40BB-A1B8-4E2AA1F9FDF2" width=3D"1" heigh=
t=3D"1"> </a></div></body></html>
------=_NextPart_001_0033_01D8727F.BBAE6050--

------=_NextPart_000_0032_01D8727F.BBAE3940
	name="image001.png"
Content-Transfer-Encoding: base64
Content-ID: <[email-masked]>

------=_NextPart_000_0032_01D8727F.BBAE3940--

--===============7009095079695440421==
Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit
Content-Disposition: inline

[email-masked]

--===============7009095079695440421==--

---

From: Steve Shoyer <[email-masked]>
Date: Tue, 31 May 2022 04:08:55 -0400

Thanks to everyone who replied to my question.  I think I understand 
what probably happened.  I think the bullet connection between the 
white-green feed to the radio and the radio's wiring harness (which had 
an inline fuse) must have loosened and allowed the bare connector to 
short to ground, possibly on the heater control cable. When I removed 
the radio, there was no longer continuity between the white-green 
connector coming from the ignition switch and ground.  I replaced the 
ignition switch with a new aftermarket one, and I also replaced the 
radio.  The one that I had been using seemed fine, but it had a CD 
player so it was about 6" deep.  I picked up a new one without a CD 
player (a Jensen unit with Bluetooth for $36) that's less than 2" deep, 
so there's a lot more room behind the radio and it should be less likely 
to cause strain on the wiring.  This radio uses the same style of wiring 
harness as my old one so it was an easy swap.  Nothing melted when I 
tried the new switch and radio, so I think I'm good now.  I might try to 
use a zip-tie to hold the radio wiring in place and reduce the 
possibility of pulling the power connection apart.  I put in a 5A fuse 
for the switched power rather than the 10A fuse that came with the 
radio, hoping that it would blow quickly if there was a short somewhere 
in the circuit that I didn't see.

--Steve (1980 MGB)

[email-masked]

---

From: PaulHunt73 <[email-masked]> WBGWIllGVNyts82cpMD5ZVPcHjTaUXC5WWZSgpOZfq932gC7hPcMLi0gTNXESvoE51UHrgklar8Xo2bU/u/7fsRb9fiopcoMFxo=
Date: Tue, 31 May 2022 11:13:27 +0100

5A or 10A, or even the original 17A, would protect the cars wiring in 
the event of a short but it needs to be as close to the supply i.e. at 
the ignition switch to do that.  Fuses in the wires that go into the 
radio are there to prevent very thin internal wires from actually 
burning in the event of an internal short, they won't protect the cars 
wiring if the short is on the supply side of that fuse.  So if the same 
fault should happen again, you will get the same result.

PaulH.

On 31/05/2022 09:08, Steve Shoyer wrote:
> I put in a 5A fuse for the switched power rather than the 10A fuse 
> that came with the radio, hoping that it would blow quickly if there 
> was a short somewhere in the circuit that I didn't see.
>

[email-masked]

---

From: Robert's New iPad <[email-masked]>
Date: Tue, 31 May 2022 07:44:25 -0400

In the Jan/Feb 2022 issue of MG Driver, David Wright, of Southern British Car Club, wrote a useful article about fuses.
	He noted that the fuse rating standards were changed in 1980, from the rating being the ‘blow’ current to the rating now being ‘operating current.  It is an interesting article, with graphs and all, with the takeaway being that we owners of pre 1980 cars must be especially careful that the modern fuses we buy are not stronger than we realise.
	His conclusion is that the modern AGC 15 and 3AGC 15 are the available equivalent of the Lucas 35 amp fuses; the modern SFE 20 or AGC 20 the equivalent of Lucas 50 amp fuses.  
	All MGB drivers have installed an inline fuse into both fuel pump and overdrive wires, haven’t we? 
Bob

> On May 31, 2022, at 6:13 AM, PaulHunt73 <[email-masked]> wrote:
> 
> 5A or 10A, or even the original 17A, would protect the cars wiring in the event of a short but it needs to be as close to the supply i.e. at the ignition switch to do that.  Fuses in the wires that go into the radio are there to prevent very thin internal wires from actually burning in the event of an internal short, they won't protect the cars wiring if the short is on the supply side of that fuse.  So if the same fault should happen again, you will get the same result.
> 
> PaulH.
> 
>> I put in a 5A fuse for the switched power rather than the 10A fuse that came with the radio, hoping that it would blow quickly if there was a short somewhere in the circuit that I didn't see.
>> 
> Unsubscribe: http://autox.team.net/mailman/options/mgs/[email-masked]

[email-masked]

---

From: PaulHunt73 <[email-masked]> JaCm1InzEk8/VCNmp6fP7YUkfd9k4zFKA5cn3DoqwB3Uo3Yg1O2TElYQdVNDYN77OHgmAEQ0iEphfpL2jq9RF6ZEcoC1wGLOdsPyZ1hUmzS+6nR/EYoKZlaY
Date: Tue, 31 May 2022 13:01:25 +0100

The original 17/35 fuses are still available in the UK, often (but not 
always) showing both figures.  You do have to be careful to get the 
correct one where only one figure is shown, I have some examples where 
it is the higher figure i.e. the 'blow' figure and not the 'continuous' 
that is shown.

"All MGB drivers have installed an inline fuse into both fuel pump and 
overdrive wires, haven’t we?"

Ha ha, I doubt it!  I have both by the heater shelf on my V8, which 
proved very useful when I had a sunk carb float.  I cross-connected the 
two and used the overdrive switch to turn the fuel pump on and off as 
needed.

PaulH.

[email-masked]

---

From: Robert's New iPad <[email-masked]>
Date: Tue, 31 May 2022 08:07:57 -0400

That cross-connection is a clever idea. It would have been useful for a friend, just a week or two ago, whose front HIF float sank.  I will suggest that to him, and look to see how easily that might be accomplished in my car.

> On May 31, 2022, at 8:01 AM, PaulHunt73 <[email-masked]> wrote:
> 
> The original 17/35 fuses are still available in the UK, often (but not always) showing both figures.  You do have to be careful to get the correct one where only one figure is shown, I have some examples where it is the higher figure i.e. the 'blow' figure and not the 'continuous' that is shown.
> 
> "All MGB drivers have installed an inline fuse into both fuel pump and overdrive wires, haven’t we?"
> 
> Ha ha, I doubt it!  I have both by the heater shelf on my V8, which proved very useful when I had a sunk carb float.  I cross-connected the two and used the overdrive switch to turn the fuel pump on and off as needed.
> 
> PaulH.
> 

[email-masked]

---

From: PaulHunt73 <[email-masked]> +nmklcAotzJGZwyQi+8+KBz4KZE4tpN6jTeVVTTkUSs2Hr/N5lQ2Xj7SNhLaY2H2s+AgNfToi2n08DUN9xwYytGf0QWz1/EvGewZhlnwKtv335pysBQ8LKkD
Date: Tue, 31 May 2022 14:10:12 +0100

That was the most convenient position for connecting the OD fuse on the 
75 V8 without cutting wires, and fortuitous.  On the 73 with dash OD 
switch I had fitted the fuse at the switch, so cross-connecting the 
fuses isn't directly possible.  However for most years the same effect 
can be obtained by swapping over the white and yellow wires at the 
bullet connectors in the engine bay, including where fuses have not been 
fitted in either circuit.  On later North American models with OD on 4th 
gear only it would involve white and white/brown wires.

PaulH.

[email-masked]

---

From: <[email-masked]>
Date: Tue, 31 May 2022 21:47:09 +0200

Oh that darn heater cable again - it made a short in my GT as well after it went lose from its control position!

-----Oorspronkelijk bericht-----
Van: Mgs <[email-masked]> Namens Steve Shoyer
Verzonden: Tuesday, 31 May 2022 10:09
Aan: [email-masked]
Onderwerp: Re: [Mgs] 80B, melted white-green wire from ignition switch

Thanks to everyone who replied to my question.  I think I understand what probably happened.  I think the bullet connection between the white-green feed to the radio and the radio's wiring harness (which had an inline fuse) must have loosened and allowed the bare connector to short to ground, possibly on the heater control cable. When I removed the radio, there was no longer continuity between the white-green connector coming from the ignition switch and ground.  I replaced the ignition switch with a new aftermarket one, and I also replaced the radio.  The one that I had been using seemed fine, but it had a CD player so it was about 6" deep.  I picked up a new one without a CD player (a Jensen unit with Bluetooth for $36) that's less than 2" deep, so there's a lot more room behind the radio and it should be less likely to cause strain on the wiring.  This radio uses the same style of wiring harness as my old one so it was an easy swap.  Nothing melted when I tried the new switch and radio, so I think I'm good now.  I might try to use a zip-tie to hold the radio wiring in place and reduce the possibility of pulling the power connection apart.  I put in a 5A fuse for the switched power rather than the 10A fuse that came with the radio, hoping that it would blow quickly if there was a short somewhere in the circuit that I didn't see.

--Steve (1980 MGB)

[email-masked]

Unsubscribe: http://autox.team.net/mailman/options/mgs/[email-masked]

[email-masked]

---

From: Robert's New iPad <[email-masked]>
Date: Tue, 31 May 2022 16:06:30 -0400

Fried heater cable is usually because the earth strap(s) from engine to body are not conducting properly.
	I have two on my GT, and check their fasteners a couple of times each year.
Bob

> On May 31, 2022, at 3:47 PM, <[email-masked]> <[email-masked]> wrote:
> 
> Thanks to everyone who replied to my question.  I think I understand what probably happened.  I think the bullet connection between the white-green feed to the radio and the radio's wiring harness (which had an inline fuse) must have loosened and allowed the bare connector to short to ground, possibly on the heater control cable. When I removed the radio, there was no longer continuity between the white-green connector coming from the ignition switch and ground.  I replaced the ignition switch with a new aftermarket one, and I also replaced the radio.  The one that I had been using seemed fine, but it had a CD player so it was about 6" deep.  I picked up a new one without a CD player (a Jensen unit with Bluetooth for $36) that's less than 2" deep, so there's a lot more room behind the radio and it should be less likely to cause strain on the wiring.  This radio uses the same style of wiring harness as my old one so it was an easy swap.  Nothing melted when I tried the new switch and 
> radio, so I think I'm good now.  I might try to use a zip-tie to hold the radio wiring in place and reduce the possibility of pulling the power connection apart.  I put in a 5A fuse for the switched power rather than the 10A fuse that came with the radio, hoping that it would blow quickly if there was a short somewhere in the circuit that I didn't see.
> 
> --Steve (1980 MGB)
> 

[email-masked]