Subject: Re: [Mgs] Ridiculous nw cars

From: PaulHunt73 via Mgs <[email-masked]>
Date: Tue, 10 Mar 2020 14:22:10 -0000 ZYP2DhTojBSJG7JZNfhSo87GhlHD+/4+ewnRcyxfzn2UFUQc1VEdC+d7fhmPeropyMpAPrx0oVAc8w==

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With you whole-heartedly.  Plus stupid front driving lights that flash =
on and off every time you twitch the steering wheel distracting every =
one else; stupid indicator talks that return to the centre when you =
indicate and have to be pushed the other way to cancel them ... but go =
to far and they start flashing the other way; ditto main/dip stalks =
where you don't know whether they are on or off simply by feeling the =
position of the stalk; stupid light clusters that are a triumph of =
'styling' over function and you don't see come on unless you are looking =
right at them, and then only if the sun isn't at a particular angle; =
big-brother systems that in real-time transmit back to the manufacturer =
exactly where you are and what you are doing down to which door was =
opened when.  Let alone the removal of any and all feedback as to what =
is happening between the car and the road and the driving 'experience' =
is reduced to sitting in an armchair watching TV - which is about all =
the attention drivers of them pay to what it going on outside.

My MG ZS 180 is 15 years old, has only done 50k but I'm going to have to =
replace it soon because spares are getting harder and harder to find.  I =
have a B roadster and a factory V8 and use them in preference, but am =
not willing to 'sacrifice' them to winter salt.=20

PaulH.

----- Original Message -----=20

  I have this gripe about new cars and this is the only big platform I =
have on which to sound off....
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<DIV><FONT size=3D2>With you whole-heartedly.&nbsp; Plus stupid front =
driving=20
lights that flash on and off every time you twitch the =
steering&nbsp;wheel=20
distracting every one else; stupid indicator talks that return to the=20
centre&nbsp;when you indicate and have to be pushed the other way =
to&nbsp;cancel=20
them ... but go to far and they start flashing the other way; ditto =
main/dip=20
stalks&nbsp;where you don't know whether they are on or off simply by =
feeling=20
the position of the stalk; stupid light clusters that are a triumph of =
'styling'=20
over function and you don't see come on unless you are looking right at =
them,=20
and then only if the sun isn't at a particular angle; big-brother =
systems that=20
in real-time transmit back to the manufacturer exactly where you are and =
what=20
you are doing down to which door was opened when.&nbsp; Let alone the =
removal of=20
any and all feedback as to what is happening between the car and the =
road and=20
the driving 'experience' is reduced to sitting in an armchair watching =
TV -=20
which is about all the attention drivers of them pay to what it going on =

outside.</FONT></DIV>
<DIV><FONT size=3D2></FONT>&nbsp;</DIV>
<DIV><FONT size=3D2>My MG ZS 180 is 15 years old, has only done 50k but =
I'm going=20
to have to&nbsp;replace it soon because spares are getting harder and =
harder to=20
find.&nbsp; I have a B roadster and a factory V8 and use them in =
preference, but=20
am not willing to 'sacrifice' them to&nbsp;winter =
salt.&nbsp;</FONT></DIV>
<DIV><FONT size=3D2></FONT>&nbsp;</DIV>
<DIV><FONT size=3D2>PaulH.</FONT></DIV>
<DIV><FONT size=3D2></FONT>&nbsp;</DIV>
<DIV>----- Original Message ----- </DIV>
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style=3D"BORDER-LEFT: #000000 2px solid; PADDING-LEFT: 5px; =
PADDING-RIGHT: 0px; MARGIN-LEFT: 5px; MARGIN-RIGHT: 0px">
  <DIV style=3D"FONT: 10pt arial; BACKGROUND: #e4e4e4; font-color: =
black"><BR>I=20
  have this gripe about new cars and this is the only big platform I =
have on=20
  which to sound off....</DIV></BLOCKQUOTE></BODY></HTML>

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From: Richard Lindsay via Mgs <[email-masked]>
Date: Tue, 10 Mar 2020 10:58:32 -0500

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[email-masked]

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From: David Breneman via Mgs <[email-masked]>
Date: Tue, 10 Mar 2020 09:12:47 -0700

I don’t really care about fancy stuff inside new cars, because the driver has the option of not using them. But the thing that *really* irates me is LED tail lights. The obnoxious flicker causes them to break into a stream of strobe-like red images that fill your field of view whenever you move your eyes. I’m a libertarian at heart, but I’d gladly ban this nuisance from our nation’s roads in a heartbeat.
_______________________________________________

[email-masked]
Donate: http://www.team.net/donate.html
Suggested annual donation  $12.75

---

From: Steve Shoyer via Mgs <[email-masked]>
Date: Tue, 10 Mar 2020 12:54:47 -0400

Some of the newer safety devices are good to have.  If my son (fairly 
new driver at the time) had been driving a car with a collision 
avoidance system, he might not have totaled the car when he ran into 
someone.  The car we got as a replacement system has collision 
avoidance, and the rest of the stuff that comes along with it.

My everyday car is ready to be replaced, and I agree about all the junk 
in the new cars that's not really needed.  I hate paying for stuff I 
don't want and probably won't use, and I especially hate to pay to have 
someone fix it in a year or two when it stops working.  That being said, 
I almost took a car off my list because my cell phone doesn't fit in the 
built-in wireless charger.  First world problems, I guess.

--Steve (1980 MGB)

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This email has been checked for viruses by AVG.
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From: Max Heim via Mgs <[email-masked]>
Date: Tue, 10 Mar 2020 10:03:38 -0700

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I was saying the same thing 20 years ago. Power windows! Power door =
locks! Power seats, for chrissake! Remote entry and alarms systems! =
Keyless starters! Not a one of them necessary. Each one a potential =
expensive repair down the road.

Our newest car is a 2001 Toyota Echo without a single one of these mod =
cons. 135K and hopefully will go much longer. I really do not want to be =
forced into a car with one of those key fob gadgets.

I do have a phone charger plugged into the cigar lighter socket in the =
MGB.

--
Max Heim
'66 MGB

> On Mar 10, 2020, at 9:54 AM, Steve Shoyer via Mgs <[email-masked]> =
wrote:
>=20
> Some of the newer safety devices are good to have.  If my son (fairly =
new driver at the time) had been driving a car with a collision =
avoidance system, he might not have totaled the car when he ran into =
someone.  The car we got as a replacement system has collision =
avoidance, and the rest of the stuff that comes along with it.
>=20
> My everyday car is ready to be replaced, and I agree about all the =
junk in the new cars that's not really needed.  I hate paying for stuff =
I don't want and probably won't use, and I especially hate to pay to =
have someone fix it in a year or two when it stops working.  That being =
said, I almost took a car off my list because my cell phone doesn't fit =
in the built-in wireless charger.  First world problems, I guess.
>=20
>=20

--Apple-Mail=_75AC5FAD-1B2C-456F-8DBC-E4F377A53E3B
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<html><head><meta http-equiv=3D"Content-Type" content=3D"text/html =
charset=3Dus-ascii"></head><body style=3D"word-wrap: break-word; =
-webkit-nbsp-mode: space; -webkit-line-break: after-white-space;" =
class=3D"">I was saying the same thing 20 years ago. Power windows! =
Power door locks! Power seats, for chrissake! Remote entry and alarms =
systems! Keyless starters! Not a one of them necessary. Each one a =
potential expensive repair down the road.<div class=3D""><br =
class=3D""></div><div class=3D"">Our newest car is a 2001 Toyota Echo =
without a single one of these mod cons. 135K and hopefully will go much =
longer. I really do not want to be forced into a car with one of those =
key fob gadgets.</div><div class=3D""><br class=3D""></div><div =
class=3D"">I do have a phone charger plugged into the cigar lighter =
socket in the MGB.</div><div class=3D""><br class=3D""><div class=3D"">
<div style=3D"color: rgb(0, 0, 0); letter-spacing: normal; text-align: =
start; text-indent: 0px; text-transform: none; white-space: normal; =
word-spacing: 0px; -webkit-text-stroke-width: 0px; word-wrap: =
break-word; -webkit-nbsp-mode: space; -webkit-line-break: =
after-white-space;" class=3D""><div style=3D"color: rgb(0, 0, 0); =
letter-spacing: normal; text-align: start; text-indent: 0px; =
text-transform: none; white-space: normal; word-spacing: 0px; =
-webkit-text-stroke-width: 0px; word-wrap: break-word; =
-webkit-nbsp-mode: space; -webkit-line-break: after-white-space;" =
class=3D""><div style=3D"margin: 0px; font-size: 13px;" =
class=3D"">--</div><div style=3D"margin: 0px; font-size: 13px; =
min-height: 16px;" class=3D"">Max Heim</div><div style=3D"margin: 0px; =
font-size: 13px;" class=3D"">'66 MGB</div></div></div>
</div>

<br class=3D""><div><blockquote type=3D"cite" class=3D""><div =
class=3D"">On Mar 10, 2020, at 9:54 AM, Steve Shoyer via Mgs &lt;<a =
href=3D"mailto:[email-masked]" class=3D"">[email-masked]</a>&gt; =
wrote:</div><br class=3D"Apple-interchange-newline"><div class=3D""><div =
class=3D"">Some of the newer safety devices are good to have.&nbsp; If =
my son (fairly new driver at the time) had been driving a car with a =
collision avoidance system, he might not have totaled the car when he =
ran into someone.&nbsp; The car we got as a replacement system has =
collision avoidance, and the rest of the stuff that comes along with =
it.<br class=3D""><br class=3D"">My everyday car is ready to be =
replaced, and I agree about all the junk in the new cars that's not =
really needed.&nbsp; I hate paying for stuff I don't want and probably =
won't use, and I especially hate to pay to have someone fix it in a year =
or two when it stops working.&nbsp; That being said, I almost took a car =
off my list because my cell phone doesn't fit in the built-in wireless =
charger.&nbsp; First world problems, I guess.<br class=3D""><br =
class=3D"">--Steve (1980 MGB)<br class=3D""><br =
class=3D""></div></div></blockquote></div><br =
class=3D""></div></body></html>=

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[email-masked]

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From: Michael MacLean via Mgs <[email-masked]>
Date: Tue, 10 Mar 2020 17:12:43 +0000 (UTC)

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 The one thing I have not heard from you guys yet is "And you kids get off =
my lawn too!"
Mike MacLean69 MGB GT60 Bugeye56 Austin Healey BN2 LeMans2012 Honda Accord =
LX2002 Harley Davidson Heritage Springer

    On Tuesday, March 10, 2020, 10:03:44 AM PDT, Max Heim via Mgs <mgs@auto=
x.team.net> wrote: =20
=20
 I was saying the same thing 20 years ago. Power windows! Power door locks!=
 Power seats, for chrissake! Remote entry and alarms systems! Keyless start=
ers! Not a one of them necessary. Each one a potential expensive repair dow=
n the road.
Our newest car is a 2001 Toyota Echo without a single one of these mod cons=
. 135K and hopefully will go much longer. I really do not want to be forced=
 into a car with one of those key fob gadgets.
I do have a phone charger plugged into the cigar lighter socket in the MGB.
--Max Heim'66 MGB

On Mar 10, 2020, at 9:54 AM, Steve Shoyer via Mgs <[email-masked]> wrot=
e:
Some of the newer safety devices are good to have.=C2=A0 If my son (fairly =
new driver at the time) had been driving a car with a collision avoidance s=
ystem, he might not have totaled the car when he ran into someone.=C2=A0 Th=
e car we got as a replacement system has collision avoidance, and the rest =
of the stuff that comes along with it.

My everyday car is ready to be replaced, and I agree about all the junk in =
the new cars that's not really needed.=C2=A0 I hate paying for stuff I don'=
t want and probably won't use, and I especially hate to pay to have someone=
 fix it in a year or two when it stops working.=C2=A0 That being said, I al=
most took a car off my list because my cell phone doesn't fit in the built-=
in wireless charger.=C2=A0 First world problems, I guess.

--Steve (1980 MGB)

[email-masked]

Unsubscribe: http://autox.team.net/mailman/options/mgs/rrengineer.mike@att.=
net
 =20
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<html><head></head><body><div class=3D"ydp94a97bcdyahoo-style-wrap" style=
=3D"font-family:times new roman, new york, times, serif;font-size:16px;"><d=
iv></div>
        <div dir=3D"ltr" data-setdir=3D"false">The one thing I have not hea=
rd from you guys yet is "And you kids get off my lawn too!"</div><div dir=
=3D"ltr" data-setdir=3D"false"><br></div><div dir=3D"ltr" data-setdir=3D"fa=
lse">Mike MacLean</div><div dir=3D"ltr" data-setdir=3D"false">69 MGB GT</di=
v><div dir=3D"ltr" data-setdir=3D"false">60 Bugeye</div><div dir=3D"ltr" da=
ta-setdir=3D"false">56 Austin Healey BN2 LeMans</div><div dir=3D"ltr" data-=
setdir=3D"false">2012 Honda Accord LX</div><div dir=3D"ltr" data-setdir=3D"=
false">2002 Harley Davidson Heritage Springer<br></div><div><br></div>
       =20
        </div><div id=3D"yahoo_quoted_4320276891" class=3D"yahoo_quoted">
            <div style=3D"font-family:'Helvetica Neue', Helvetica, Arial, s=
ans-serif;font-size:13px;color:#26282a;">
               =20
                <div>
                    On Tuesday, March 10, 2020, 10:03:44 AM PDT, Max Heim v=
ia Mgs &lt;[email-masked]&gt; wrote:
                </div>
                <div><br></div>
                <div><br></div>
                <div><div id=3D"yiv1450297804"><div>I was saying the same t=
hing 20 years ago. Power windows! Power door locks! Power seats, for chriss=
ake! Remote entry and alarms systems! Keyless starters! Not a one of them n=
ecessary. Each one a potential expensive repair down the road.<div class=3D=
"yiv1450297804"><br class=3D"yiv1450297804" clear=3D"none"></div><div class=
=3D"yiv1450297804">Our newest car is a 2001 Toyota Echo without a single on=
e of these mod cons. 135K and hopefully will go much longer. I really do no=
t want to be forced into a car with one of those key fob gadgets.</div><div=
 class=3D"yiv1450297804"><br class=3D"yiv1450297804" clear=3D"none"></div><=
div class=3D"yiv1450297804">I do have a phone charger plugged into the ciga=
r lighter socket in the MGB.</div><div class=3D"yiv1450297804"><br class=3D=
"yiv1450297804" clear=3D"none"><div class=3D"yiv1450297804">
<div class=3D"yiv1450297804" style=3D"color:rgb(0, 0, 0);letter-spacing:nor=
mal;text-indent:0px;text-transform:none;white-space:normal;word-spacing:0px=
;word-wrap:break-word;"><div class=3D"yiv1450297804" style=3D"color:rgb(0, =
0, 0);letter-spacing:normal;text-indent:0px;text-transform:none;white-space=
:normal;word-spacing:0px;word-wrap:break-word;"><div class=3D"yiv1450297804=
" style=3D"margin:0px;font-size:13px;">--</div><div class=3D"yiv1450297804"=
 style=3D"margin:0px;font-size:13px;min-height:16px;">Max Heim</div><div cl=
ass=3D"yiv1450297804" style=3D"margin:0px;font-size:13px;">'66 MGB</div></d=
iv></div>
</div>

<br class=3D"yiv1450297804" clear=3D"none"><div><blockquote class=3D"yiv145=
0297804" type=3D"cite"><div class=3D"yiv1450297804yqt5226817195" id=3D"yiv1=
450297804yqtfd78278"><div class=3D"yiv1450297804">On Mar 10, 2020, at 9:54 =
AM, Steve Shoyer via Mgs &lt;<a rel=3D"nofollow" shape=3D"rect" class=3D"yi=
v1450297804" ymailto=3D"mailto:[email-masked]" target=3D"_blank" href=
=3D"mailto:[email-masked]">[email-masked]</a>&gt; wrote:</div><br c=
lass=3D"yiv1450297804Apple-interchange-newline" clear=3D"none"><div class=
=3D"yiv1450297804"><div class=3D"yiv1450297804">Some of the newer safety de=
vices are good to have.&nbsp; If my son (fairly new driver at the time) had=
 been driving a car with a collision avoidance system, he might not have to=
taled the car when he ran into someone.&nbsp; The car we got as a replaceme=
nt system has collision avoidance, and the rest of the stuff that comes alo=
ng with it.<br class=3D"yiv1450297804" clear=3D"none"><br class=3D"yiv14502=
97804" clear=3D"none">My everyday car is ready to be replaced, and I agree =
about all the junk in the new cars that's not really needed.&nbsp; I hate p=
aying for stuff I don't want and probably won't use, and I especially hate =
to pay to have someone fix it in a year or two when it stops working.&nbsp;=
 That being said, I almost took a car off my list because my cell phone doe=
sn't fit in the built-in wireless charger.&nbsp; First world problems, I gu=
ess.<br class=3D"yiv1450297804" clear=3D"none"><br class=3D"yiv1450297804" =
clear=3D"none">--Steve (1980 MGB)<br class=3D"yiv1450297804" clear=3D"none"=
><br class=3D"yiv1450297804" clear=3D"none"></div></div></div></blockquote>=
</div><div class=3D"yiv1450297804yqt5226817195" id=3D"yiv1450297804yqtfd813=
60"><br class=3D"yiv1450297804" clear=3D"none"></div></div></div></div><div=
 class=3D"yqt5226817195" id=3D"yqtfd23406">________________________________=
_______________<br clear=3D"none"><br clear=3D"none"><a shape=3D"rect" ymai=
lto=3D"mailto:[email-masked]" href=3D"mailto:[email-masked]">Mgs@au=
tox.team.net</a><br clear=3D"none">Donate: <a shape=3D"rect" href=3D"http:/=
/www.team.net/donate.html" target=3D"_blank">http://www.team.net/donate.htm=
l</a><br clear=3D"none">Suggested annual donation&nbsp; $12.75<br clear=3D"=
none"><br clear=3D"none">Archive: <a shape=3D"rect" href=3D"http://www.team=
.net/pipermail/mgs " target=3D"_blank">http://www.team.net/pipermail/mgs </=
a><a shape=3D"rect" href=3D"http://autox.team.net/archive" target=3D"_blank=
">http://autox.team.net/archive</a><br clear=3D"none"><br clear=3D"none">Un=
subscribe: <a shape=3D"rect" href=3D"http://autox.team.net/mailman/options/=
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n/options/mgs/[email-masked]</a><br clear=3D"none"></div></div>
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[email-masked]

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From: Max Heim via Mgs <[email-masked]>
Date: Tue, 10 Mar 2020 10:22:16 -0700

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I almost said that, but decided to avoid the clich=C3=A9. And I don=E2=80=99=
t have a lawn.

--
Max Heim
'66 MGB

> On Mar 10, 2020, at 10:12 AM, Michael MacLean =
<[email-masked]> wrote:
>=20
> The one thing I have not heard from you guys yet is "And you kids get =
off my lawn too!"
>=20
> Mike MacLean
> 69 MGB GT
> 60 Bugeye
> 56 Austin Healey BN2 LeMans
> 2012 Honda Accord LX
> 2002 Harley Davidson Heritage Springer
>=20
> On Tuesday, March 10, 2020, 10:03:44 AM PDT, Max Heim via Mgs =
MGB.
>=20
> --
> Max Heim
> '66 MGB
>=20
>> On Mar 10, 2020, at 9:54 AM, Steve Shoyer via Mgs <[email-masked] =
>>=20
> Donate: http://www.team.net/donate.html =
<http://www.team.net/donate.html>
> Archive: http://www.team.net/pipermail/mgs  =
<http://www.team.net/pipermail/mgs>http://autox.team.net/archive =
<http://autox.team.net/archive>
> Unsubscribe: =
http://autox.team.net/mailman/options/mgs/[email-masked] =
<http://autox.team.net/mailman/options/mgs/[email-masked]>

--Apple-Mail=_9BB872CB-01C3-4108-8355-549A550B796D
Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable
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<html><head><meta http-equiv=3D"Content-Type" content=3D"text/html =
charset=3Dutf-8"></head><body style=3D"word-wrap: break-word; =
-webkit-nbsp-mode: space; -webkit-line-break: after-white-space;" =
class=3D"">I almost said that, but decided to avoid the clich=C3=A9. And =
I don=E2=80=99t have a lawn.<div class=3D""><br class=3D""><div =
class=3D"">
<div style=3D"color: rgb(0, 0, 0); letter-spacing: normal; text-align: =
start; text-indent: 0px; text-transform: none; white-space: normal; =
word-spacing: 0px; -webkit-text-stroke-width: 0px; word-wrap: =
break-word; -webkit-nbsp-mode: space; -webkit-line-break: =
after-white-space;" class=3D""><div style=3D"color: rgb(0, 0, 0); =
letter-spacing: normal; text-align: start; text-indent: 0px; =
text-transform: none; white-space: normal; word-spacing: 0px; =
-webkit-text-stroke-width: 0px; word-wrap: break-word; =
-webkit-nbsp-mode: space; -webkit-line-break: after-white-space;" =
class=3D""><div style=3D"margin: 0px; font-size: 13px;" =
class=3D"">--</div><div style=3D"margin: 0px; font-size: 13px; =
min-height: 16px;" class=3D"">Max Heim</div><div style=3D"margin: 0px; =
font-size: 13px;" class=3D"">'66 MGB</div></div></div>
</div><div class=3D""><br class=3D"webkit-block-placeholder"></div><div =
class=3D""><br class=3D""></div>

<br class=3D""><div><blockquote type=3D"cite" class=3D""><div =
class=3D"">On Mar 10, 2020, at 10:12 AM, Michael MacLean &lt;<a =
href=3D"mailto:[email-masked]" =
class=3D"">[email-masked]</a>&gt; wrote:</div><br =
class=3D"Apple-interchange-newline"><div class=3D""><div class=3D""><div =
class=3D"ydp94a97bcdyahoo-style-wrap" style=3D"font-family:times new =
roman, new york, times, serif;font-size:16px;"><div class=3D""></div>
        <div dir=3D"ltr" data-setdir=3D"false" class=3D"">The one thing =
I have not heard from you guys yet is "And you kids get off my lawn =
too!"</div><div dir=3D"ltr" data-setdir=3D"false" class=3D""><br =
class=3D""></div><div dir=3D"ltr" data-setdir=3D"false" class=3D"">Mike =
MacLean</div><div dir=3D"ltr" data-setdir=3D"false" class=3D"">69 MGB =
GT</div><div dir=3D"ltr" data-setdir=3D"false" class=3D"">60 =
Bugeye</div><div dir=3D"ltr" data-setdir=3D"false" class=3D"">56 Austin =
Healey BN2 LeMans</div><div dir=3D"ltr" data-setdir=3D"false" =
class=3D"">2012 Honda Accord LX</div><div dir=3D"ltr" =
data-setdir=3D"false" class=3D"">2002 Harley Davidson Heritage =
Springer<br class=3D""></div><div class=3D""><br class=3D""></div>
       =20
        </div><div id=3D"yahoo_quoted_4320276891" class=3D"yahoo_quoted">
            <div style=3D"font-family:'Helvetica Neue', Helvetica, =
Arial, sans-serif;font-size:13px;color:#26282a;" class=3D"">
               =20
                <div class=3D"">
                    On Tuesday, March 10, 2020, 10:03:44 AM PDT, Max =
Heim via Mgs &lt;<a href=3D"mailto:[email-masked]" =
class=3D"">[email-masked]</a>&gt; wrote:
                </div>
                <div class=3D""><br class=3D""></div>
                <div class=3D""><br class=3D""></div>
                <div class=3D""><div id=3D"yiv1450297804" class=3D""><div =
class=3D"">I was saying the same thing 20 years ago. Power windows! =
Power door locks! Power seats, for chrissake! Remote entry and alarms =
systems! Keyless starters! Not a one of them necessary. Each one a =
potential expensive repair down the road.<div class=3D"yiv1450297804"><br =
class=3D"yiv1450297804" clear=3D"none"></div><div =
class=3D"yiv1450297804">Our newest car is a 2001 Toyota Echo without a =
single one of these mod cons. 135K and hopefully will go much longer. I =
really do not want to be forced into a car with one of those key fob =
gadgets.</div><div class=3D"yiv1450297804"><br class=3D"yiv1450297804" =
clear=3D"none"></div><div class=3D"yiv1450297804">I do have a phone =
charger plugged into the cigar lighter socket in the MGB.</div><div =
class=3D"yiv1450297804"><br class=3D"yiv1450297804" clear=3D"none"><div =
class=3D"yiv1450297804">
<div class=3D"yiv1450297804" style=3D"letter-spacing: normal; =
text-indent: 0px; text-transform: none; white-space: normal; =
word-spacing: 0px; word-wrap: break-word;"><div class=3D"yiv1450297804" =
style=3D"letter-spacing: normal; text-indent: 0px; text-transform: none; =
white-space: normal; word-spacing: 0px; word-wrap: break-word;"><div =
class=3D"yiv1450297804" style=3D"margin:0px;font-size:13px;">--</div><div =
class=3D"yiv1450297804" =
style=3D"margin:0px;font-size:13px;min-height:16px;">Max Heim</div><div =
class=3D"yiv1450297804" style=3D"margin:0px;font-size:13px;">'66 =
MGB</div></div></div>
</div>

<br class=3D"yiv1450297804" clear=3D"none"><div class=3D""><blockquote =
class=3D"yiv1450297804" type=3D"cite"><div =
class=3D"yiv1450297804yqt5226817195" id=3D"yiv1450297804yqtfd78278"><div =
class=3D"yiv1450297804">On Mar 10, 2020, at 9:54 AM, Steve Shoyer via =
Mgs &lt;<a rel=3D"nofollow" shape=3D"rect" class=3D"yiv1450297804" =
ymailto=3D"mailto:[email-masked]" target=3D"_blank" =
href=3D"mailto:[email-masked]">[email-masked]</a>&gt; =
wrote:</div><br class=3D"yiv1450297804Apple-interchange-newline" =
clear=3D"none"><div class=3D"yiv1450297804"><div =
class=3D"yiv1450297804">Some of the newer safety devices are good to =
have.&nbsp; If my son (fairly new driver at the time) had been driving a =
car with a collision avoidance system, he might not have totaled the car =
when he ran into someone.&nbsp; The car we got as a replacement system =
has collision avoidance, and the rest of the stuff that comes along with =
it.<br class=3D"yiv1450297804" clear=3D"none"><br class=3D"yiv1450297804" =
clear=3D"none">My everyday car is ready to be replaced, and I agree =
about all the junk in the new cars that's not really needed.&nbsp; I =
hate paying for stuff I don't want and probably won't use, and I =
especially hate to pay to have someone fix it in a year or two when it =
stops working.&nbsp; That being said, I almost took a car off my list =
because my cell phone doesn't fit in the built-in wireless =
charger.&nbsp; First world problems, I guess.<br class=3D"yiv1450297804" =
clear=3D"none"><br class=3D"yiv1450297804" clear=3D"none">--Steve (1980 =
MGB)<br class=3D"yiv1450297804" clear=3D"none"><br class=3D"yiv1450297804"=
 clear=3D"none"></div></div></div></blockquote></div><div =
class=3D"yiv1450297804yqt5226817195" id=3D"yiv1450297804yqtfd81360"><br =
class=3D"yiv1450297804" clear=3D"none"></div></div></div></div><div =
class=3D"yqt5226817195" =
id=3D"yqtfd23406">_______________________________________________<br =
clear=3D"none" class=3D""><br clear=3D"none" class=3D""><a shape=3D"rect" =
ymailto=3D"mailto:[email-masked]" href=3D"mailto:[email-masked]" =
class=3D"">[email-masked]</a><br clear=3D"none" class=3D"">Donate: =
<a shape=3D"rect" href=3D"http://www.team.net/donate.html" =
target=3D"_blank" class=3D"">http://www.team.net/donate.html</a><br =
clear=3D"none" class=3D"">Suggested annual donation&nbsp; $12.75<br =
clear=3D"none" class=3D""><br clear=3D"none" class=3D"">Archive: <a =
shape=3D"rect" href=3D"http://www.team.net/pipermail/mgs" =
target=3D"_blank" class=3D"">http://www.team.net/pipermail/mgs </a><a =
shape=3D"rect" href=3D"http://autox.team.net/archive" target=3D"_blank" =
class=3D"">http://autox.team.net/archive</a><br clear=3D"none" =
class=3D""><br clear=3D"none" class=3D"">Unsubscribe: <a shape=3D"rect" =
href=3D"http://autox.team.net/mailman/options/mgs/[email-masked]"=
 target=3D"_blank" =
class=3D"">http://autox.team.net/mailman/options/mgs/[email-masked]=
et</a><br clear=3D"none" class=3D""></div></div>
            </div>
        </div></div></div></blockquote></div><br =
class=3D""></div></body></html>=

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[email-masked]

--===============6923718829837332922==--

---

From: Robert's New iPad via Mgs <[email-masked]>
Date: Tue, 10 Mar 2020 13:48:57 -0400

--===============1567243061181044886==
	boundary=Apple-Mail-F60E502D-1393-474B-A092-1D03DB2D2A2A
Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit

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	charset=us-ascii
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   These are the kids you want to encourage, as in a few years they can be h=
ired to mow the lawn and to clear the driveway of snow. Meantime, they walk t=
he dog and occasionally bring the mail to the front door.=20
Bob

> On Mar 10, 2020, at 1:12 PM, Michael MacLean via Mgs <[email-masked]> w=
rote:
>=20
> The one thing I have not heard from you guys yet is "And you kids get off m=
y lawn too!"
> On Tuesday, March 10, 2020, 10:03:44 AM PDT, Max Heim via Mgs <[email-masked]=
> I was saying the same thing 20 years ago. Power windows! Power door locks!=
 Power seats, for chrissake! Remote entry and alarms systems! Keyless starte=
rs! Not a one of them necessary. Each one a potential expensive repair down t=
he road.
>=20
> Our newest car is a 2001 Toyota Echo without a single one of these mod con=
s. 135K and hopefully will go much longer. I really do not want to be forced=
 into a car with one of those key fob gadgets.
>=20
> I do have a phone charger plugged into the cigar lighter socket in the MGB=
.
>=20
> --
> Max Heim
> '66 MGB
>=20
>> On Mar 10, 2020, at 9:54 AM, Steve Shoyer via Mgs <[email-masked]> wr=
ote:
>>=20
>> Some of the newer safety devices are good to have.  If my son (fairly new=
 driver at the time) had been driving a car with a collision avoidance syste=
m, he might not have totaled the car when he ran into someone.  The car we g=
ot as a replacement system has collision avoidance, and the rest of the stuf=
f that comes along with it.
>>=20
>> My everyday car is ready to be replaced, and I agree about all the junk i=
n the new cars that's not really needed.  I hate paying for stuff I don't wa=
nt and probably won't use, and I especially hate to pay to have someone fix i=
t in a year or two when it stops working.  That being said, I almost took a c=
ar off my list because my cell phone doesn't fit in the built-in wireless ch=
arger.  First world problems, I guess.
> Unsubscribe: http://autox.team.net/mailman/options/mgs/rrengineer.mike@att=
.net
> Unsubscribe: http://autox.team.net/mailman/options/mgs/[email-masked]

--Apple-Mail-F60E502D-1393-474B-A092-1D03DB2D2A2A
	charset=utf-8
Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable

<html><head><meta http-equiv=3D"content-type" content=3D"text/html; charset=3D=
utf-8"></head><body dir=3D"auto"><div dir=3D"ltr"></div><div dir=3D"ltr">&nb=
sp; &nbsp;These are the kids you want to encourage, as in a few years they c=
an be hired to mow the lawn and to clear the driveway of snow. Meantime, the=
y walk the dog and occasionally bring the mail to the front door.&nbsp;</div=
><div dir=3D"ltr">Bob</div><div dir=3D"ltr"><br></div><div dir=3D"ltr"><br>O=
n Mar 10, 2020, at 1:12 PM, Michael MacLean via Mgs &lt;<a href=3D"mailto:mg=
[email-masked]">[email-masked]</a>&gt; wrote:<br><br></div><blockquote=
 type=3D"cite"><div dir=3D"ltr"><div class=3D"ydp94a97bcdyahoo-style-wrap" s=
tyle=3D"font-family:times new roman, new york, times, serif;font-size:16px;"=
><div></div>
        <div dir=3D"ltr" data-setdir=3D"false">The one thing I have not hear=
d from you guys yet is "And you kids get off my lawn too!"</div><div dir=3D"=
ltr" data-setdir=3D"false"><br></div><div dir=3D"ltr" data-setdir=3D"false">=
Mike MacLean</div><div dir=3D"ltr" data-setdir=3D"false">69 MGB GT</div><div=
 dir=3D"ltr" data-setdir=3D"false">60 Bugeye</div><div dir=3D"ltr" data-setd=
ir=3D"false">56 Austin Healey BN2 LeMans</div><div dir=3D"ltr" data-setdir=3D=
"false">2012 Honda Accord LX</div><div dir=3D"ltr" data-setdir=3D"false">200=
2 Harley Davidson Heritage Springer<br></div><div><br></div>
       =20
        </div><div id=3D"yahoo_quoted_4320276891" class=3D"yahoo_quoted">
            <div style=3D"font-family:'Helvetica Neue', Helvetica, Arial, sa=
ns-serif;font-size:13px;color:#26282a;">
               =20
                <div>
                    On Tuesday, March 10, 2020, 10:03:44 AM PDT, Max Heim vi=
a Mgs &lt;<a href=3D"mailto:[email-masked]">[email-masked]</a>&gt; w=
rote:
                </div>
                <div><br></div>
                <div><br></div>
                <div><div id=3D"yiv1450297804"><div>I was saying the same th=
ing 20 years ago. Power windows! Power door locks! Power seats, for chrissak=
e! Remote entry and alarms systems! Keyless starters! Not a one of them nece=
ssary. Each one a potential expensive repair down the road.<div class=3D"yiv=
1450297804"><br class=3D"yiv1450297804" clear=3D"none"></div><div class=3D"y=
iv1450297804">Our newest car is a 2001 Toyota Echo without a single one of t=
hese mod cons. 135K and hopefully will go much longer. I really do not want t=
o be forced into a car with one of those key fob gadgets.</div><div class=3D=
"yiv1450297804"><br class=3D"yiv1450297804" clear=3D"none"></div><div class=3D=
"yiv1450297804">I do have a phone charger plugged into the cigar lighter soc=
ket in the MGB.</div><div class=3D"yiv1450297804"><br class=3D"yiv1450297804=
" clear=3D"none"><div class=3D"yiv1450297804">
<div class=3D"yiv1450297804" style=3D"color:rgb(0, 0, 0);letter-spacing:norm=
al;text-indent:0px;text-transform:none;white-space:normal;word-spacing:0px;w=
ord-wrap:break-word;"><div class=3D"yiv1450297804" style=3D"color:rgb(0, 0, 0=
);letter-spacing:normal;text-indent:0px;text-transform:none;white-space:norm=
al;word-spacing:0px;word-wrap:break-word;"><div class=3D"yiv1450297804" styl=
e=3D"margin:0px;font-size:13px;">--</div><div class=3D"yiv1450297804" style=3D=
"margin:0px;font-size:13px;min-height:16px;">Max Heim</div><div class=3D"yiv=
1450297804" style=3D"margin:0px;font-size:13px;">'66 MGB</div></div></div>
</div>

<br class=3D"yiv1450297804" clear=3D"none"><div><blockquote class=3D"yiv1450=
297804" type=3D"cite"><div class=3D"yiv1450297804yqt5226817195" id=3D"yiv145=
0297804yqtfd78278"><div class=3D"yiv1450297804">On Mar 10, 2020, at 9:54 AM,=
 Steve Shoyer via Mgs &lt;<a rel=3D"nofollow" shape=3D"rect" class=3D"yiv145=
0297804" ymailto=3D"mailto:[email-masked]" target=3D"_blank" href=3D"mai=
lto:[email-masked]">[email-masked]</a>&gt; wrote:</div><br class=3D"=
yiv1450297804Apple-interchange-newline" clear=3D"none"><div class=3D"yiv1450=
297804"><div class=3D"yiv1450297804">Some of the newer safety devices are go=
od to have.&nbsp; If my son (fairly new driver at the time) had been driving=
 a car with a collision avoidance system, he might not have totaled the car w=
hen he ran into someone.&nbsp; The car we got as a replacement system has co=
llision avoidance, and the rest of the stuff that comes along with it.<br cl=
ass=3D"yiv1450297804" clear=3D"none"><br class=3D"yiv1450297804" clear=3D"no=
ne">My everyday car is ready to be replaced, and I agree about all the junk i=
n the new cars that's not really needed.&nbsp; I hate paying for stuff I don=
't want and probably won't use, and I especially hate to pay to have someone=
 fix it in a year or two when it stops working.&nbsp; That being said, I alm=
ost took a car off my list because my cell phone doesn't fit in the built-in=
 wireless charger.&nbsp; First world problems, I guess.<br class=3D"yiv14502=
97804" clear=3D"none"><br class=3D"yiv1450297804" clear=3D"none">--Steve (19=
80 MGB)<br class=3D"yiv1450297804" clear=3D"none"><br class=3D"yiv1450297804=
" clear=3D"none"></div></div></div></blockquote></div><div class=3D"yiv14502=
97804yqt5226817195" id=3D"yiv1450297804yqtfd81360"><br class=3D"yiv145029780=
4" clear=3D"none"></div></div></div></div><div class=3D"yqt5226817195" id=3D=
"yqtfd23406">_______________________________________________<br clear=3D"non=
e"><br clear=3D"none"><a shape=3D"rect" ymailto=3D"mailto:[email-masked]=
" href=3D"mailto:[email-masked]">[email-masked]</a><br clear=3D"none=
">Donate: <a shape=3D"rect" href=3D"http://www.team.net/donate.html" target=3D=
"_blank">http://www.team.net/donate.html</a><br clear=3D"none">Suggested ann=
ual donation&nbsp; $12.75<br clear=3D"none"><br clear=3D"none">Archive: <a s=
hape=3D"rect" href=3D"http://www.team.net/pipermail/mgs " target=3D"_blank">=
http://www.team.net/pipermail/mgs </a><a shape=3D"rect" href=3D"http://autox=
.team.net/archive" target=3D"_blank">http://autox.team.net/archive</a><br cl=
ear=3D"none"><br clear=3D"none">Unsubscribe: <a shape=3D"rect" href=3D"http:=
//autox.team.net/mailman/options/mgs/[email-masked]" target=3D"_bla=
nk">http://autox.team.net/mailman/options/mgs/[email-masked]</a><br=
 clear=3D"none"></div></div>
            </div>
        </div></div></blockquote><blockquote type=3D"cite"><div dir=3D"ltr">=
<span>_______________________________________________</span><br><span></span=
><br><span><a href=3D"mailto:[email-masked]">[email-masked]</a></spa=
n><br><span>Donate: <a href=3D"http://www.team.net/donate.html">http://www.t=
eam.net/donate.html</a></span><br><span>Suggested annual donation &nbsp;$12.=
75</span><br><span></span><br><span>Archive: <a href=3D"http://www.team.net/=
pipermail/mgs">http://www.team.net/pipermail/mgs</a> <a href=3D"http://autox=
.team.net/archive">http://autox.team.net/archive</a></span><br><span></span>=
<br><span>Unsubscribe: <a href=3D"http://autox.team.net/mailman/options/mgs/=
[email-masked]">http://autox.team.net/mailman/options/mgs/[email-masked]=
</a></span><br></div></blockquote></body></html>=

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[email-masked]

--===============1567243061181044886==--

---

From: Hans Duinhoven via Mgs <[email-masked]>
Date: Tue, 10 Mar 2020 19:30:16 +0100 boundary="----=_NextPart_000_0020_01D5F712.53D04DD0"

This is a multipart message in MIME format.

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Great story Barrie! 

Feel the same. All these modern gadgets make a car looking more like a toy =
than a vehicle.

All these electronics are prone to fail and they do.

So last weekend I went back to my favorite Puch 1973 moped. (also got two f=
rom 1970)

Fixed the shape of the aftermarket central stand and shortened the exhaust =
manifold for a better fit the exhaust.

Result was great =E2=80=93 more power and torque.

This vehicle is so basic, it has no electric starter, no indicators (my arm=
s are good indicators), only two gears for going simple and still mechanica=
l ignition with fixed timing. The carb is very simple and the moped is chai=
n driven.

All jobs can be done with very simple tools and it is a joy to ride!

The GT still is in the garage and will be on the road soon =E2=80=93 spring=
 weather is coming!

Cheers,

Hans

71 BGT W/W no OD NRG

Van: Mgs [mailto:[email-masked]] Namens Barrie Robinson via Mgs=

Verzonden: dinsdag 10 maart 2020 14:56
Aan: MGB List
Onderwerp: [Mgs] Ridiculous nw cars

-- Hello folks,

I have this gripe about new cars and this is the only big platform I have o=
n which to sound off.   I do have my own Aston Martin Feltham Club but that=
 is only 150 members.  I am getting exremely puzzled as my 2003 Golf is get=
ting a bit sad although it still goes like a rocket.   There is a little ru=
st and one of the courtesy lights does not work.   However, whenever I have=
 a look at new ones they are gadget rich and the dash is becoming like one =
from a 737.   Why on earth does there have to be a rear end crash avoiding =
system (used to be rear brake lights) as well as an unwanted-lane changing =
warning (used to be keeping eyes on the road) to say nothing of bluetooth (=
where is yellow and red?), Spotify (dog treatment?), Hands free telephone (=
used to be concentration on the road) and the dreaded in your face screen w=
hich like today's TV and Internet is intent on delivring information you do=
n't really need (when did you last ponder over your oil temperature?).    S=
o instead of forking out $30-40,000 I am going to have the Golf all tarted =
up and enjoy another 170k kilometers.   The only regret will be - it does n=
ot have a powered rear end tailgate - but maybe I could get that retro-fitt=
ed!   And in this day and age electonic/electrical gadgets die first ($$$$$=
)- and Lucas smoke is unattainable now.

I like my MGB GT so much that maybe another as a 'family' car could be an a=
lternative - but not 100% restored just road worthy and oiled up to the hll=
t to counter winter driving conditions.  Trouble is I would want to drop in=
 a Rover V8 as the engine bay was made for it on later cars - and the broom=
 broom is so much better. Or I coul find a Golf owned by a little old lady =
with a tiny mileage.  OMG, I am a little old man (I will not get a sex chan=
ge) with a low mileage Golf !!!!  Oh sherbert - now what do I do?   

Barrie
  <data:image/jpeg;filename=3DBarrie> 

-- 
Dit e-mailbericht is gecontroleerd op virussen met Avast antivirussoftware.=

https://www.avast.com/antivirus

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<o:idmap v:ext=3D"edit" data=3D"1" />
</o:shapelayout></xml><![endif]--></head><body lang=3DNL link=3Dblue vlink=
=3Dpurple><div class=3DWordSection1><p class=3DMsoNormal><span style=3D'fon=
t-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri","sans-serif";color:#1F497D'>Great story=
 Barrie! <o:p></o:p></span></p><p class=3DMsoNormal><span style=3D'font-siz=
e:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri","sans-serif";color:#1F497D'><o:p>&nbsp;</o:p=
></span></p><p class=3DMsoNormal><span lang=3DEN-US style=3D'font-size:11.0=
pt;font-family:"Calibri","sans-serif";color:#1F497D'>Feel the same. All the=
se modern gadgets make a car looking more like a toy than a vehicle.<o:p></=
o:p></span></p><p class=3DMsoNormal><span lang=3DEN-US style=3D'font-size:1=
1.0pt;font-family:"Calibri","sans-serif";color:#1F497D'>All these electroni=
cs are prone to fail and they do.<o:p></o:p></span></p><p class=3DMsoNormal=
><span lang=3DEN-US style=3D'font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri","sans-s=
erif";color:#1F497D'>So last weekend I went back to my favorite Puch 1973 m=
oped. (also got two from 1970)<o:p></o:p></span></p><p class=3DMsoNormal><s=
pan lang=3DEN-US style=3D'font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri","sans-seri=
f";color:#1F497D'>Fixed the shape of the aftermarket central stand and shor=
tened the exhaust manifold for a better fit the exhaust.<o:p></o:p></span><=
/p><p class=3DMsoNormal><span lang=3DEN-US style=3D'font-size:11.0pt;font-f=
amily:"Calibri","sans-serif";color:#1F497D'>Result was great =E2=80=93 more=
 power and torque.<o:p></o:p></span></p><p class=3DMsoNormal><span lang=3DE=
N-US style=3D'font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri","sans-serif";color:#1F=
497D'>This vehicle is so basic, it has no electric starter, no indicators (=
my arms are good indicators), only two gears for going simple and still mec=
hanical ignition with fixed timing. The carb is very simple and the moped i=
s chain driven.<o:p></o:p></span></p><p class=3DMsoNormal><span lang=3DEN-U=
S style=3D'font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri","sans-serif";color:#1F497=
D'>All jobs can be done with very simple tools and it is a joy to ride!<o:p=
></o:p></span></p><p class=3DMsoNormal><span lang=3DEN-US style=3D'font-siz=
e:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri","sans-serif";color:#1F497D'><o:p>&nbsp;</o:p=
></span></p><p class=3DMsoNormal><span lang=3DEN-US style=3D'font-size:11.0=
pt;font-family:"Calibri","sans-serif";color:#1F497D'>The GT still is in the=
 garage and will be on the road soon =E2=80=93 spring weather is coming!<o:=
p></o:p></span></p><p class=3DMsoNormal><span lang=3DEN-US style=3D'font-si=
ze:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri","sans-serif";color:#1F497D'><o:p>&nbsp;</o:=
p></span></p><p class=3DMsoNormal><span lang=3DEN-US style=3D'font-size:11.=
0pt;font-family:"Calibri","sans-serif";color:#1F497D'>Cheers,<o:p></o:p></s=
pan></p><p class=3DMsoNormal><span lang=3DEN-US style=3D'font-size:11.0pt;f=
ont-family:"Calibri","sans-serif";color:#1F497D'>Hans<o:p></o:p></span></p>=
<p class=3DMsoNormal><span lang=3DEN-US style=3D'font-size:11.0pt;font-fami=
ly:"Calibri","sans-serif";color:#1F497D'>71 BGT W/W no OD NRG<o:p></o:p></s=
pan></p><p class=3DMsoNormal><span lang=3DEN-US style=3D'font-size:11.0pt;f=
ont-family:"Calibri","sans-serif";color:#1F497D'><o:p>&nbsp;</o:p></span></=
p><div><div style=3D'border:none;border-top:solid #B5C4DF 1.0pt;padding:3.0=
pt 0cm 0cm 0cm'><p class=3DMsoNormal><b><span style=3D'font-size:10.0pt;fon=
t-family:"Tahoma","sans-serif"'>Van:</span></b><span style=3D'font-size:10.=
0pt;font-family:"Tahoma","sans-serif"'> Mgs [mailto:[email-masked].=
net] <b>Namens </b>Barrie Robinson via Mgs<br><b>Verzonden:</b> dinsdag 10 =
maart 2020 14:56<br><b>Aan:</b> MGB List<br><b>Onderwerp:</b> [Mgs] Ridicul=
ous nw cars<o:p></o:p></span></p></div></div><p class=3DMsoNormal><o:p>&nbs=
p;</o:p></p><p class=3DMsoNormal><o:p>&nbsp;</o:p></p><div><p class=3DMsoNo=
rmal>-- Hello folks,<br><br>I have this gripe about new cars and this is th=
e only big platform I have on which to sound off.&nbsp;&nbsp; I do have my =
own Aston Martin Feltham Club but that is only 150 members.&nbsp; I am gett=
ing exremely puzzled as my 2003 Golf is getting a bit sad although it still=
 goes like a rocket.&nbsp;&nbsp; There is a little rust and one of the cour=
tesy lights does not work.&nbsp;&nbsp; However, whenever I have a look at n=
ew ones they are gadget rich and the dash is becoming like one from a 737.&=
nbsp;&nbsp; Why on earth does there have to be a rear end crash avoiding sy=
stem (used to be rear brake lights) as well as an unwanted-lane changing wa=
rning (used to be keeping eyes on the road) to say nothing of bluetooth (wh=
ere is yellow and red?), Spotify (dog treatment?), Hands free telephone (us=
ed to be concentration on the road) and the dreaded in your face screen whi=
ch like today's TV and Internet is intent on delivring information you don'=
t really need (when did you last ponder over your oil temperature?).&nbsp;&=
nbsp;&nbsp; So instead of forking out $30-40,000 I am going to have the Gol=
f all tarted up and enjoy another 170k kilometers.&nbsp;&nbsp; The only reg=
ret will be - it does not have a powered rear end tailgate - but maybe I co=
uld get that retro-fitted!&nbsp;&nbsp; And in this day and age electonic/el=
ectrical gadgets die first ($$$$$)- and Lucas smoke is unattainable now.<br=
><br>I like my MGB GT so much that maybe another as a 'family' car could be=
 an alternative - but not 100% restored just road worthy and oiled up to th=
e hllt to counter winter driving conditions.&nbsp; Trouble is I would want =
to drop in a Rover V8 as the engine bay was made for it on later cars - and=
 the broom broom is so much better. Or I coul find a Golf owned by a little=
 old lady with a tiny mileage.&nbsp; OMG, I am a little old man (I will not=
 get a sex change) with a low mileage Golf !!!!&nbsp; Oh sherbert - now wha=
t do I do?&nbsp;&nbsp; <br><br>Barrie<br><img id=3D"_x0000_i1025" src=3D"da=
ta:image/jpeg;filename=3DBarrie"><o:p></o:p></p></div></div><div id=3D"DAB4=
FAD8-2DD7-40BB-A1B8-4E2AA1F9FDF2"><br /> <table style=3D"border-top: 1px so=
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		<td style=3D"width: 470px; padding-top: 17px; color: #41424e; font-size: =
13px; font-family: Arial, Helvetica, sans-serif; line-height: 18px;">Virusv=
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ce=3Dlink&utm_campaign=3Dsig-email&utm_content=3Demailclient" target=3D"_bl=
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	</tr>
</table>
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[email-masked]

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---

From: Dan DiBiase via Mgs <[email-masked]>
Date: Tue, 10 Mar 2020 14:35:07 -0400

--===============6617225235720271832==

--0000000000003e029a05a0846368

Ok, I'm going to represent the non-Luddites among us ;-) ... I love new
technology and the possibilities it brings. My daughter has the newest car
in our family, a 2016 Jeep Grand Cherokee Limited 75th Anniversary Edition,
and it has every bell and whistle (and some sirens, too) available at the
time. Top of the line AWD system that is settable for various surfaces (or
auto), heated everything, cooled front seats, engine stop/start, gigantic
screen with plenty of info available, etc. The only thing I dislike
(besides the mass) is that the programmable instrument display only has a
digital speedometer (for some reason, I have a hard time holding a constant
speed with that thing).

My next car will be a Tesla, either a Model 3 or a Model Y (which I
prefer). I have a deposit on a Cybertruck (which I'll probably roll over to
the Model Y).

Dan D
'76B, '65B
Central NJ USA
http://dandibiase.cbintouch.com/

On Tue, Mar 10, 2020 at 9:56 AM Barrie Robinson via Mgs <[email-masked]>
wrote:

>
> -- Hello folks,
>
> I have this gripe about new cars and this is the only big platform I have
> on which to sound off.   I do have my own Aston Martin Feltham Club but
> that is only 150 members.  I am getting exremely puzzled as my 2003 Golf is
> getting a bit sad although it still goes like a rocket.   There is a little
> rust and one of the courtesy lights does not work.   However, whenever I
> have a look at new ones they are gadget rich and the dash is becoming like
> one from a 737.   Why on earth does there have to be a rear end crash
> avoiding system (used to be rear brake lights) as well as an unwanted-lane
> changing warning (used to be keeping eyes on the road) to say nothing of
> bluetooth (where is yellow and red?), Spotify (dog treatment?), Hands free
> telephone (used to be concentration on the road) and the dreaded in your
> face screen which like today's TV and Internet is intent on delivring
> information you don't really need (when did you last ponder over your oil
> temperature?).    So instead of forking out $30-40,000 I am going to have
> the Golf all tarted up and enjoy another 170k kilometers.   The only regret
> will be - it does not have a powered rear end tailgate - but maybe I could
> get that retro-fitted!   And in this day and age electonic/electrical
> gadgets die first ($$$$$)- and Lucas smoke is unattainable now.
>
> I like my MGB GT so much that maybe another as a 'family' car could be an
> alternative - but not 100% restored just road worthy and oiled up to the
> hllt to counter winter driving conditions.  Trouble is I would want to drop
> in a Rover V8 as the engine bay was made for it on later cars - and the
> broom broom is so much better. Or I coul find a Golf owned by a little old
> lady with a tiny mileage.  OMG, I am a little old man (I will not get a sex
> change) with a low mileage Golf !!!!  Oh sherbert - now what do I do?
>
> Barrie
> Unsubscribe:
> http://autox.team.net/mailman/options/mgs/[email-masked]
>

--0000000000003e029a05a0846368
Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable

<div dir=3D"ltr">Ok, I&#39;m going to represent the non-Luddites among us ;=
-) ... I love new technology and the possibilities it brings. My daughter h=
as the newest car in our family, a 2016 Jeep Grand Cherokee Limited 75th An=
niversary Edition, and it has every bell and whistle (and some sirens, too)=
 available at the time. Top of the line AWD system that is settable for var=
ious surfaces (or auto), heated everything, cooled front seats, engine stop=
/start, gigantic screen with plenty of info available, etc. The only thing =
I dislike (besides the mass) is that the programmable instrument display on=
ly has a digital speedometer (for some reason, I have a hard time holding a=
 constant speed with that thing).=C2=A0<div><br></div><div>My next car will=
 be a Tesla, either a Model 3 or a Model Y (which I prefer). I have a depos=
it on a Cybertruck (which I&#39;ll probably roll over to the Model Y).=C2=
=A0<div><br></div><div>Dan D</div><div>&#39;76B, &#39;65B</div><div>Central=
 NJ USA<br clear=3D"all"><div><div dir=3D"ltr" class=3D"gmail_signature" da=
ta-smartmail=3D"gmail_signature"><div dir=3D"ltr"><a href=3D"http://dandibi=
ase.cbintouch.com/" target=3D"_blank">http://dandibiase.cbintouch.com/</a><=
/div></div></div><br></div></div></div><br><div class=3D"gmail_quote"><div =
dir=3D"ltr" class=3D"gmail_attr">On Tue, Mar 10, 2020 at 9:56 AM Barrie Rob=
inson via Mgs &lt;<a href=3D"mailto:[email-masked]">[email-masked]<=
/a>&gt; wrote:<br></div><blockquote class=3D"gmail_quote" style=3D"margin:0=
px 0px 0px 0.8ex;border-left:1px solid rgb(204,204,204);padding-left:1ex">
 =20

   =20
 =20
  <div>
    <br>
    <div>-- Hello folks,<br>
      <br>
      I have this gripe about new cars and this is the only big platform
      I have on which to sound off.=C2=A0=C2=A0 I do have my own Aston Mart=
in
      Feltham Club but that is only 150 members.=C2=A0 I am getting exremel=
y
      puzzled as my 2003 Golf is getting a bit sad although it still
      goes like a rocket.=C2=A0=C2=A0 There is a little rust and one of the
      courtesy lights does not work.=C2=A0=C2=A0 However, whenever I have a=
 look
      at new ones they are gadget rich and the dash is becoming like one
      from a 737.=C2=A0=C2=A0 Why on earth does there have to be a rear end=
 crash
      avoiding system (used to be rear brake lights) as well as an
      unwanted-lane changing warning (used to be keeping eyes on the
      road) to say nothing of bluetooth (where is yellow and red?),
      Spotify (dog treatment?), Hands free telephone (used to be
      concentration on the road) and the dreaded in your face screen
      which like today&#39;s TV and Internet is intent on delivring
      information you don&#39;t really need (when did you last ponder over
      your oil temperature?).=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0 So instead of forking out $=
30-40,000 I
      am going to have the Golf all tarted up and enjoy another 170k
      kilometers.=C2=A0=C2=A0 The only regret will be - it does not have a =
powered
      rear end tailgate - but maybe I could get that retro-fitted!=C2=A0=C2=
=A0 And
      in this day and age electonic/electrical gadgets die first
      ($$$$$)- and Lucas smoke is unattainable now.<br>
      <br>
      I like my MGB GT so much that maybe another as a &#39;family&#39; car
      could be an alternative - but not 100% restored just road worthy
      and oiled up to the hllt to counter winter driving conditions.=C2=A0
      Trouble is I would want to drop in a Rover V8 as the engine bay
      was made for it on later cars - and the broom broom is so much
      better. Or I coul find a Golf owned by a little old lady with a
      tiny mileage.=C2=A0 OMG, I am a little old man (I will not get a sex
      change) with a low mileage Golf !!!!=C2=A0 Oh sherbert - now what do =
I
      do?=C2=A0=C2=A0 <br>
      <br>
      Barrie<br>
      <img border=3D"0"></div>
  </div>

_______________________________________________<br>
<br>
<a href=3D"mailto:[email-masked]" target=3D"_blank">[email-masked]<=
/a><br>
et=3D"_blank">http://www.team.net/donate.html</a><br>
<br>
Archive: <a href=3D"http://www.team.net/pipermail/mgs" rel=3D"noreferrer" t=
arget=3D"_blank">http://www.team.net/pipermail/mgs</a> <a href=3D"http://au=
tox.team.net/archive" rel=3D"noreferrer" target=3D"_blank">http://autox.tea=
m.net/archive</a><br>
<br>
Unsubscribe: <a href=3D"http://autox.team.net/mailman/options/mgs/dan.dibia=
[email-masked]" rel=3D"noreferrer" target=3D"_blank">http://autox.team.net/ma=
ilman/options/mgs/[email-masked]</a><br>
</blockquote></div>

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[email-masked]

--===============6617225235720271832==--

---

From: dave via Mgs <[email-masked]>
Date: Tue, 10 Mar 2020 13:36:03 -0500

--===============4759613353703045829==
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I would never say that!  I refuse to be a grumpy old man!!!

=20

From: Mgs <[email-masked]> On Behalf Of Michael MacLean via =
Mgs
Sent: Tuesday, March 10, 2020 12:13 PM
To: MGs <[email-masked]>; Max Heim <[email-masked]>
Subject: Re: [Mgs] Ridiculous new cars

=20

=20

Mike MacLean

69 MGB GT

60 Bugeye

2012 Honda Accord LX

=20

=20

=20

=20

=20

=20

--

Max Heim

'66 MGB

=20

=20

My everyday car is ready to be replaced, and I agree about all the junk =
in the new cars that's not really needed.  I hate paying for stuff I =
don't want and probably won't use, and I especially hate to pay to have =
someone fix it in a year or two when it stops working.  That being said, =
I almost took a car off my list because my cell phone doesn't fit in the =
built-in wireless charger.  First world problems, I guess.

--Steve (1980 MGB)

=20

Archive: http://www.team.net/pipermail/mgs  =
<http://www.team.net/pipermail/mgs%20> http://autox.team.net/archive

Unsubscribe: =
http://autox.team.net/mailman/options/mgs/[email-masked]

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<html xmlns:v=3D"urn:schemas-microsoft-com:vml" =
xmlns:o=3D"urn:schemas-microsoft-com:office:office" =
xmlns:w=3D"urn:schemas-microsoft-com:office:word" =
xmlns:m=3D"http://schemas.microsoft.com/office/2004/12/omml" =
xmlns=3D"http://www.w3.org/TR/REC-html40"><head><meta =
http-equiv=3DContent-Type content=3D"text/html; charset=3Dutf-8"><meta =
name=3DGenerator content=3D"Microsoft Word 15 (filtered =
medium)"><style><!--
/* Font Definitions */
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	{margin:0in;
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<o:idmap v:ext=3D"edit" data=3D"1" />
</o:shapelayout></xml><![endif]--></head><body lang=3DEN-US link=3Dblue =
vlink=3Dpurple><div class=3DWordSection1><p class=3DMsoNormal>I would =
never say that!=C2=A0 I refuse to be a grumpy old =
man!!!<o:p></o:p></p><p class=3DMsoNormal><o:p>&nbsp;</o:p></p><div><div =
style=3D'border:none;border-top:solid #E1E1E1 1.0pt;padding:3.0pt 0in =
0in 0in'><p class=3DMsoNormal><b>From:</b> Mgs =
&lt;[email-masked]&gt; <b>On Behalf Of </b>Michael MacLean =
via Mgs<br><b>Sent:</b> Tuesday, March 10, 2020 12:13 PM<br><b>To:</b> =
MGs &lt;[email-masked]&gt;; Max Heim =
&lt;[email-masked]&gt;<br><b>Subject:</b> Re: [Mgs] Ridiculous new =
cars<o:p></o:p></p></div></div><p =
class=3DMsoNormal><o:p>&nbsp;</o:p></p><div><div><p =
class=3DMsoNormal><span style=3D'font-size:12.0pt;font-family:"Times New =
Roman",serif'>The one thing I have not heard from you guys yet is =
&quot;And you kids get off my lawn =
too!&quot;<o:p></o:p></span></p></div><div><p class=3DMsoNormal><span =
style=3D'font-size:12.0pt;font-family:"Times New =
Roman",serif'><o:p>&nbsp;</o:p></span></p></div><div><p =
class=3DMsoNormal><span style=3D'font-size:12.0pt;font-family:"Times New =
Roman",serif'>Mike MacLean<o:p></o:p></span></p></div><div><p =
class=3DMsoNormal><span style=3D'font-size:12.0pt;font-family:"Times New =
Roman",serif'>69 MGB GT<o:p></o:p></span></p></div><div><p =
class=3DMsoNormal><span style=3D'font-size:12.0pt;font-family:"Times New =
Roman",serif'>60 Bugeye<o:p></o:p></span></p></div><div><p =
class=3DMsoNormal><span style=3D'font-size:12.0pt;font-family:"Times New =
Roman",serif'>56 Austin Healey BN2 =
LeMans<o:p></o:p></span></p></div><div><p class=3DMsoNormal><span =
style=3D'font-size:12.0pt;font-family:"Times New Roman",serif'>2012 =
Honda Accord LX<o:p></o:p></span></p></div><div><p =
class=3DMsoNormal><span style=3D'font-size:12.0pt;font-family:"Times New =
Roman",serif'>2002 Harley Davidson Heritage =
Springer<o:p></o:p></span></p></div><div><p class=3DMsoNormal><span =
style=3D'font-size:12.0pt;font-family:"Times New =
Roman",serif'><o:p>&nbsp;</o:p></span></p></div></div><div =
id=3D"yahoo_quoted_4320276891"><div><div><p class=3DMsoNormal><span =
style=3D'font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Helvetica",sans-serif;color:#26282=
A'>On Tuesday, March 10, 2020, 10:03:44 AM PDT, Max Heim via Mgs &lt;<a =
href=3D"mailto:[email-masked]">[email-masked]</a>&gt; wrote: =
<o:p></o:p></span></p></div><div><p class=3DMsoNormal><span =
style=3D'font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Helvetica",sans-serif;color:#26282=
A'><o:p>&nbsp;</o:p></span></p></div><div><p class=3DMsoNormal><span =
style=3D'font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Helvetica",sans-serif;color:#26282=
A'><o:p>&nbsp;</o:p></span></p></div><div><div =
id=3Dyiv1450297804><div><p class=3DMsoNormal><span =
style=3D'font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Helvetica",sans-serif;color:#26282=
A'>I was saying the same thing 20 years ago. Power windows! Power door =
locks! Power seats, for chrissake! Remote entry and alarms systems! =
Keyless starters! Not a one of them necessary. Each one a potential =
expensive repair down the road.<o:p></o:p></span></p><div><p =
class=3DMsoNormal><span =
style=3D'font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Helvetica",sans-serif;color:#26282=
A'><o:p>&nbsp;</o:p></span></p></div><div><p class=3DMsoNormal><span =
style=3D'font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Helvetica",sans-serif;color:#26282=
A'>Our newest car is a 2001 Toyota Echo without a single one of these =
mod cons. 135K and hopefully will go much longer. I really do not want =
to be forced into a car with one of those key fob =
gadgets.<o:p></o:p></span></p></div><div><p class=3DMsoNormal><span =
style=3D'font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Helvetica",sans-serif;color:#26282=
A'><o:p>&nbsp;</o:p></span></p></div><div><p class=3DMsoNormal><span =
style=3D'font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Helvetica",sans-serif;color:#26282=
A'>I do have a phone charger plugged into the cigar lighter socket in =
the MGB.<o:p></o:p></span></p></div><div><p class=3DMsoNormal><span =
style=3D'font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Helvetica",sans-serif;color:#26282=
A'><o:p>&nbsp;</o:p></span></p><div><div><div><div><p =
class=3DMsoNormal><span =
style=3D'font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Helvetica",sans-serif;color:black'=
>--<o:p></o:p></span></p></div><div><p class=3DMsoNormal><span =
style=3D'font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Helvetica",sans-serif;color:black'=
>Max Heim<o:p></o:p></span></p></div><div><p class=3DMsoNormal><span =
style=3D'font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Helvetica",sans-serif;color:black'=
>'66 MGB<o:p></o:p></span></p></div></div></div></div><p =
class=3DMsoNormal><span =
style=3D'font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Helvetica",sans-serif;color:#26282=
A'><o:p>&nbsp;</o:p></span></p><div><blockquote =
style=3D'margin-top:5.0pt;margin-bottom:5.0pt'><div =
id=3Dyiv1450297804yqtfd78278><div><p class=3DMsoNormal><span =
style=3D'font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Helvetica",sans-serif;color:#26282=
A'>On Mar 10, 2020, at 9:54 AM, Steve Shoyer via Mgs &lt;<a =
href=3D"mailto:[email-masked]" =
target=3D"_blank">[email-masked]</a>&gt; =
wrote:<o:p></o:p></span></p></div><p class=3DMsoNormal><span =
style=3D'font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Helvetica",sans-serif;color:#26282=
A'><o:p>&nbsp;</o:p></span></p><div><div><p class=3DMsoNormal =
style=3D'margin-bottom:12.0pt'><span =
style=3D'font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Helvetica",sans-serif;color:#26282=
A'>Some of the newer safety devices are good to have.&nbsp; If my son =
(fairly new driver at the time) had been driving a car with a collision =
avoidance system, he might not have totaled the car when he ran into =
someone.&nbsp; The car we got as a replacement system has collision =
avoidance, and the rest of the stuff that comes along with it.<br><br>My =
everyday car is ready to be replaced, and I agree about all the junk in =
the new cars that's not really needed.&nbsp; I hate paying for stuff I =
don't want and probably won't use, and I especially hate to pay to have =
someone fix it in a year or two when it stops working.&nbsp; That being =
said, I almost took a car off my list because my cell phone doesn't fit =
in the built-in wireless charger.&nbsp; First world problems, I =
guess.<br><br>--Steve (1980 =
MGB)<o:p></o:p></span></p></div></div></div></blockquote></div><div =
id=3Dyiv1450297804yqtfd81360><p class=3DMsoNormal><span =
style=3D'font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Helvetica",sans-serif;color:#26282=
A'><o:p>&nbsp;</o:p></span></p></div></div></div></div><div =
id=3Dyqtfd23406><p class=3DMsoNormal><span =
style=3D'font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Helvetica",sans-serif;color:#26282=
A'>_______________________________________________<br><br><a =
href=3D"mailto:[email-masked]">[email-masked]</a><br>Donate: <a =
href=3D"http://www.team.net/donate.html" =
target=3D"_blank">http://www.team.net/donate.html</a><br>Suggested =
annual donation&nbsp; $12.75<br><br>Archive: <a =
href=3D"http://www.team.net/pipermail/mgs%20" =
target=3D"_blank">http://www.team.net/pipermail/mgs </a><a =
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target=3D"_blank">http://autox.team.net/archive</a><br><br>Unsubscribe: =
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href=3D"http://autox.team.net/mailman/options/mgs/[email-masked]=
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[email-masked]</a><o:p></o:p></span></p></div></div></div></div></div></body>=
</html>
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From: dave via Mgs <[email-masked]>
Date: Tue, 10 Mar 2020 13:41:51 -0500

Something positive about that newfangled devices:  my sister-in-law is a TERRIBLE driver, doesn't pay attention and wanders out of her lane.  She has totaled a number of cars.  They got her a new car and its constantly harassing her, making her a much better driver

On the other hand, a friend tells me that if you try to accelerate on a 2 lane road to speed up before you pass the car's braking system works against you; you have to go into the other lane to do that.  That's not so good.

I wouldn't know - our newest car is a 2011; my daily is a 2006 honda accord.  I'm going to go waaay off topic here - in 2006 and 2007 only Honda made a 4 door accord with a V6 and a 6 speed transmission.  It’s a hoot to drive!  I bought a used one in 2008 and drove it until 3 years ago when I found another 2006 with 27,000 miles on it.  Bought it right away, sold the old one with 135k miles on it.  My net cost to replace the high mileage one with a low mileage one was about $5k.  it has 71k on it now; I expect to drive it for another decade.

-----Original Message-----
From: Mgs <[email-masked]> On Behalf Of Steve Shoyer via Mgs
Sent: Tuesday, March 10, 2020 11:55 AM
To: MGs <[email-masked]>
Subject: Re: [Mgs] Ridiculous new cars

Some of the newer safety devices are good to have.  If my son (fairly new driver at the time) had been driving a car with a collision avoidance system, he might not have totaled the car when he ran into someone.  The car we got as a replacement system has collision avoidance, and the rest of the stuff that comes along with it.

My everyday car is ready to be replaced, and I agree about all the junk in the new cars that's not really needed.  I hate paying for stuff I don't want and probably won't use, and I especially hate to pay to have someone fix it in a year or two when it stops working.  That being said, I almost took a car off my list because my cell phone doesn't fit in the built-in wireless charger.  First world problems, I guess.

--Steve (1980 MGB)

[email-masked]

Unsubscribe: http://autox.team.net/mailman/options/mgs/[email-masked]

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---

From: Max Heim via Mgs <[email-masked]>
Date: Tue, 10 Mar 2020 12:02:21 -0700

--===============7293514696471455671==
 boundary="Apple-Mail=_6116B2BA-F5C1-41ED-9B2A-E1E892AB03AE"

--Apple-Mail=_6116B2BA-F5C1-41ED-9B2A-E1E892AB03AE
Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable
	charset=utf-8

As a designer with experience in human factors design and UX design, I =
can state that digital numeric speedometer displays are completely =
inappropriate. The constant flickering of numerals (64,65,66,65) conveys =
zero information and distracts the eye from the road. Personally, I =
think they should be banned. With an analog needle (or a digital =
representation of an analog needle), these tiny variations in speed are =
unnoticeable, and one can actually check the current speed with =
peripheral vision detecting the rough angle of the needle, without =
having to consciously parse individual numerals. The old LCD displays =
were the worst, because all these numerals look the same at a glance: 2, =
3, 5, 6, 8, 9. Also 1 and 7. But it doesn=E2=80=99t matter how they =
gussy up the numeral font, it=E2=80=99s just a bad idea.
=20
The same goes for every instrument. Which display conveys more useful =
information with less concentration required? =E2=80=9CF=E2=80=9D, or =
=E2=80=9C17.9gal remaining=E2=80=9D?

Touchscreen controls are another abomination that shouldn=E2=80=99t be =
allowed in automotive systems that are active while the vehicle is in =
motion. You absolutely have to take your eyes off the road to manipulate =
them. All active vehicle controls should feature tactile feedback, so =
they can be operated by touch. The classic headlight push/pull knob is a =
great example that has yet to be improved upon. The rotary stalk switch =
on more modern cars is actually a step backward, because the direction =
of rotation needed is not obvious.

--
Max Heim
'66 MGB

> On Mar 10, 2020, at 11:35 AM, Dan DiBiase via Mgs <[email-masked]> =
wrote:
>=20
> Ok, I'm going to represent the non-Luddites among us ;-) ... I love =
new technology and the possibilities it brings. My daughter has the =
newest car in our family, a 2016 Jeep Grand Cherokee Limited 75th =
Anniversary Edition, and it has every bell and whistle (and some sirens, =
too) available at the time. Top of the line AWD system that is settable =
for various surfaces (or auto), heated everything, cooled front seats, =
engine stop/start, gigantic screen with plenty of info available, etc. =
The only thing I dislike (besides the mass) is that the programmable =
instrument display only has a digital speedometer (for some reason, I =
have a hard time holding a constant speed with that thing).=20
>=20
> My next car will be a Tesla, either a Model 3 or a Model Y (which I =
prefer). I have a deposit on a Cybertruck (which I'll probably roll over =
to the Model Y).=20
>=20
> Dan D
> '76B, '65B
> Central NJ USA
> http://dandibiase.cbintouch.com/ <http://dandibiase.cbintouch.com/>
>=20
> On Tue, Mar 10, 2020 at 9:56 AM Barrie Robinson via Mgs =
>=20
> -- Hello folks,
>=20
have on which to sound off.   I do have my own Aston Martin Feltham Club =
but that is only 150 members.  I am getting exremely puzzled as my 2003 =
Golf is getting a bit sad although it still goes like a rocket.   There =
is a little rust and one of the courtesy lights does not work.   =
However, whenever I have a look at new ones they are gadget rich and the =
dash is becoming like one from a 737.   Why on earth does there have to =
be a rear end crash avoiding system (used to be rear brake lights) as =
well as an unwanted-lane changing warning (used to be keeping eyes on =
the road) to say nothing of bluetooth (where is yellow and red?), =
Spotify (dog treatment?), Hands free telephone (used to be concentration =
on the road) and the dreaded in your face screen which like today's TV =
and Internet is intent on delivring information you don't really need =
(when did you last ponder over your oil temperature?).    So instead of =
forking out $30-40,000 I am going to have the Golf all tarted up and =
enjoy another 170k kilometers.   The only regret will be - it does not =
have a powered rear end tailgate - but maybe I could get that =
retro-fitted!   And in this day and age electonic/electrical gadgets die =
first ($$$$$)- and Lucas smoke is unattainable now.
>=20
> I like my MGB GT so much that maybe another as a 'family' car could be =
an alternative - but not 100% restored just road worthy and oiled up to =
the hllt to counter winter driving conditions.  Trouble is I would want =
to drop in a Rover V8 as the engine bay was made for it on later cars - =
and the broom broom is so much better. Or I coul find a Golf owned by a =
little old lady with a tiny mileage.  OMG, I am a little old man (I will =
not get a sex change) with a low mileage Golf !!!!  Oh sherbert - now =
what do I do?  =20
> Archive: http://www.team.net/pipermail/mgs =
<http://www.team.net/pipermail/mgs> http://autox.team.net/archive =
<http://autox.team.net/archive>
> Unsubscribe: =
http://autox.team.net/mailman/options/mgs/[email-masked] =
<http://autox.team.net/mailman/options/mgs/[email-masked]>
http://autox.team.net/archive
> Unsubscribe: =
http://autox.team.net/mailman/options/mgs/[email-masked]

--Apple-Mail=_6116B2BA-F5C1-41ED-9B2A-E1E892AB03AE
Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable
	charset=utf-8

<html><head><meta http-equiv=3D"Content-Type" content=3D"text/html =
charset=3Dutf-8"></head><body style=3D"word-wrap: break-word; =
-webkit-nbsp-mode: space; -webkit-line-break: after-white-space;" =
class=3D"">As a designer with experience in human factors design and UX =
design, I can state that digital numeric speedometer displays are =
completely inappropriate. The constant flickering of numerals =
(64,65,66,65) conveys zero information and distracts the eye from the =
road. Personally, I think they should be banned. With an analog needle =
(or a digital representation of an analog needle), these tiny variations =
in speed are unnoticeable, and one can actually check the current speed =
with peripheral vision detecting the rough angle of the needle, without =
having to consciously parse individual numerals. The old LCD displays =
were the worst, because all these numerals look the same at a glance: 2, =
3, 5, 6, 8, 9. Also 1 and 7. But it doesn=E2=80=99t matter how they =
gussy up the numeral font, it=E2=80=99s just a bad idea.<div =
class=3D"">&nbsp;</div><div class=3D"">The same goes for every =
instrument. Which display conveys more useful information with less =
concentration required? =E2=80=9CF=E2=80=9D, or =E2=80=9C17.9gal =
remaining=E2=80=9D?<br class=3D""><div class=3D""><br =
class=3D""></div><div class=3D"">Touchscreen controls are another =
abomination that shouldn=E2=80=99t be allowed in automotive systems that =
are active while the vehicle is in motion. You absolutely have to take =
your eyes off the road to manipulate them. All active vehicle controls =
should feature tactile feedback, so they can be operated by touch. The =
classic headlight push/pull knob is a great example that has yet to be =
improved upon. The rotary stalk switch on more modern cars is actually a =
step backward, because the direction of rotation needed is not =
obvious.</div><div class=3D""><br class=3D""></div><div class=3D""><div =
class=3D"">
<div style=3D"color: rgb(0, 0, 0); letter-spacing: normal; text-align: =
start; text-indent: 0px; text-transform: none; white-space: normal; =
word-spacing: 0px; -webkit-text-stroke-width: 0px; word-wrap: =
break-word; -webkit-nbsp-mode: space; -webkit-line-break: =
after-white-space;" class=3D""><div style=3D"color: rgb(0, 0, 0); =
letter-spacing: normal; text-align: start; text-indent: 0px; =
text-transform: none; white-space: normal; word-spacing: 0px; =
-webkit-text-stroke-width: 0px; word-wrap: break-word; =
-webkit-nbsp-mode: space; -webkit-line-break: after-white-space;" =
class=3D""><div style=3D"margin: 0px; font-size: 13px;" =
class=3D"">--</div><div style=3D"margin: 0px; font-size: 13px; =
min-height: 16px;" class=3D"">Max Heim</div><div style=3D"margin: 0px; =
font-size: 13px;" class=3D"">'66 MGB</div></div></div>
</div><div class=3D""><br class=3D"webkit-block-placeholder"></div><div =
class=3D""><br class=3D""></div>

<br class=3D""><div><blockquote type=3D"cite" class=3D""><div =
class=3D"">On Mar 10, 2020, at 11:35 AM, Dan DiBiase via Mgs &lt;<a =
href=3D"mailto:[email-masked]" class=3D"">[email-masked]</a>&gt; =
wrote:</div><br class=3D"Apple-interchange-newline"><div class=3D""><div =
dir=3D"ltr" class=3D"">Ok, I'm going to represent the non-Luddites among =
us ;-) ... I love new technology and the possibilities it brings. My =
daughter has the newest car in our family, a 2016 Jeep Grand Cherokee =
Limited 75th Anniversary Edition, and it has every bell and whistle (and =
some sirens, too) available at the time. Top of the line AWD system that =
is settable for various surfaces (or auto), heated everything, cooled =
front seats, engine stop/start, gigantic screen with plenty of info =
available, etc. The only thing I dislike (besides the mass) is that the =
programmable instrument display only has a digital speedometer (for some =
reason, I have a hard time holding a constant speed with that =
thing).&nbsp;<div class=3D""><br class=3D""></div><div class=3D"">My =
next car will be a Tesla, either a Model 3 or a Model Y (which I =
prefer). I have a deposit on a Cybertruck (which I'll probably roll over =
to the Model Y).&nbsp;<div class=3D""><br class=3D""></div><div =
class=3D"">Dan D</div><div class=3D"">'76B, '65B</div><div =
class=3D"">Central NJ USA<br clear=3D"all" class=3D""><div class=3D""><div=
 dir=3D"ltr" class=3D"gmail_signature" =
data-smartmail=3D"gmail_signature"><div dir=3D"ltr" class=3D""><a =
href=3D"http://dandibiase.cbintouch.com/" target=3D"_blank" =
class=3D"">http://dandibiase.cbintouch.com/</a></div></div></div><br =
class=3D""></div></div></div><br class=3D""><div =
class=3D"gmail_quote"><div dir=3D"ltr" class=3D"gmail_attr">On Tue, Mar =
10, 2020 at 9:56 AM Barrie Robinson via Mgs &lt;<a =
href=3D"mailto:[email-masked]" class=3D"">[email-masked]</a>&gt; =
wrote:<br class=3D""></div><blockquote class=3D"gmail_quote" =
style=3D"margin:0px 0px 0px 0.8ex;border-left:1px solid =
rgb(204,204,204);padding-left:1ex">
 =20

   =20
 =20
  <div class=3D"">
    <br class=3D"">
    <div class=3D"">-- Hello folks,<br class=3D"">
      <br class=3D"">
      I have this gripe about new cars and this is the only big platform
      I have on which to sound off.&nbsp;&nbsp; I do have my own Aston =
Martin
      Feltham Club but that is only 150 members.&nbsp; I am getting =
exremely
      puzzled as my 2003 Golf is getting a bit sad although it still
      goes like a rocket.&nbsp;&nbsp; There is a little rust and one of =
the
      courtesy lights does not work.&nbsp;&nbsp; However, whenever I =
have a look
      at new ones they are gadget rich and the dash is becoming like one
      from a 737.&nbsp;&nbsp; Why on earth does there have to be a rear =
end crash
      avoiding system (used to be rear brake lights) as well as an
      unwanted-lane changing warning (used to be keeping eyes on the
      road) to say nothing of bluetooth (where is yellow and red?),
      Spotify (dog treatment?), Hands free telephone (used to be
      concentration on the road) and the dreaded in your face screen
      which like today's TV and Internet is intent on delivring
      information you don't really need (when did you last ponder over
      your oil temperature?).&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp; So instead of forking =
out $30-40,000 I
      am going to have the Golf all tarted up and enjoy another 170k
      kilometers.&nbsp;&nbsp; The only regret will be - it does not have =
a powered
      rear end tailgate - but maybe I could get that =
retro-fitted!&nbsp;&nbsp; And
      in this day and age electonic/electrical gadgets die first
      ($$$$$)- and Lucas smoke is unattainable now.<br class=3D"">
      <br class=3D"">
      I like my MGB GT so much that maybe another as a 'family' car
      could be an alternative - but not 100% restored just road worthy
      and oiled up to the hllt to counter winter driving =
conditions.&nbsp;
      Trouble is I would want to drop in a Rover V8 as the engine bay
      was made for it on later cars - and the broom broom is so much
      better. Or I coul find a Golf owned by a little old lady with a
      tiny mileage.&nbsp; OMG, I am a little old man (I will not get a =
sex
      change) with a low mileage Golf !!!!&nbsp; Oh sherbert - now what =
do I
      do?&nbsp;&nbsp; <br class=3D"">
      <br class=3D"">
      Barrie<br class=3D"">
      <img border=3D"0" class=3D""></div>
  </div>

_______________________________________________<br class=3D"">
<br class=3D"">
<a href=3D"mailto:[email-masked]" target=3D"_blank" =
class=3D"">[email-masked]</a><br class=3D"">
target=3D"_blank" class=3D"">http://www.team.net/donate.html</a><br =
class=3D"">
<br class=3D"">
Archive: <a href=3D"http://www.team.net/pipermail/mgs" rel=3D"noreferrer" =
target=3D"_blank" class=3D"">http://www.team.net/pipermail/mgs</a> <a =
href=3D"http://autox.team.net/archive" rel=3D"noreferrer" =
target=3D"_blank" class=3D"">http://autox.team.net/archive</a><br =
class=3D"">
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class=3D"">http://autox.team.net/mailman/options/mgs/[email-masked]=
</a><br class=3D"">
</blockquote></div>
_______________________________________________<br class=3D""><br =
class=3D""><a href=3D"mailto:[email-masked]" =
class=3D"">[email-masked]</a><br class=3D"">Donate: =
&nbsp;$12.75<br class=3D""><br class=3D"">Archive: =
http://www.team.net/pipermail/mgs http://autox.team.net/archive<br =
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[email-masked]

--===============7293514696471455671==--

---

From: Barrie Robinson via Mgs <[email-masked]>
Date: Tue, 10 Mar 2020 15:50:39 -0400

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One of my most favourite car trips was from Kuala Lumpur to Singapore in 
a TR2.   Wind in my hair, sun beating down on me, totally devoid of 
useless information and just a simple dial for revs and speed.   No 
flashing screens , no awkward pointing at a glass plate, no googled eye 
searches - Just joy of the engine noise and driving.   All this while 
not worrying about the terrorists pinging at me - well.it was 1953 
during the "Emergency" (not described as war for political reasons).   I 
do feel sorry for those having to drive in a "modern"car !!!

HOWEVER, I do have tach(one wire connection) and speedo(GPS fed) from 
SpeedHut in my MGB GT V8.

Barrie

On 3/10/2020 3:02 PM, Max Heim via Mgs wrote:
> As a designer with experience in human factors design and UX design, I 
> can state that digital numeric speedometer displays are completely 
> inappropriate. The constant flickering of numerals (64,65,66,65) 
> conveys zero information and distracts the eye from the road. 
> Personally, I think they should be banned. With an analog needle (or a 
> digital representation of an analog needle), these tiny variations in 
> speed are unnoticeable, and one can actually check the current speed 
> with peripheral vision detecting the rough angle of the needle, 
> without having to consciously parse individual numerals. The old LCD 
> displays were the worst, because all these numerals look the same at a 
> glance: 2, 3, 5, 6, 8, 9. Also 1 and 7. But it doesn’t matter how they 
> gussy up the numeral font, it’s just a bad idea.
> The same goes for every instrument. Which display conveys more useful 
> information with less concentration required? “F”, or “17.9gal remaining”?
>
> Touchscreen controls are another abomination that shouldn’t be allowed 
> in automotive systems that are active while the vehicle is in motion. 
> You absolutely have to take your eyes off the road to manipulate them. 
> All active vehicle controls should feature tactile feedback, so they 
> can be operated by touch. The classic headlight push/pull knob is a 
> great example that has yet to be improved upon. The rotary stalk 
> switch on more modern cars is actually a step backward, because the 
> direction of rotation needed is not obvious.
>
> --
> Max Heim
> '66 MGB
>
>
>
>> On Mar 10, 2020, at 11:35 AM, Dan DiBiase via Mgs <[email-masked] 
>>
>> Ok, I'm going to represent the non-Luddites among us ;-) ... I love 
>> new technology and the possibilities it brings. My daughter has the 
>> newest car in our family, a 2016 Jeep Grand Cherokee Limited 75th 
>> Anniversary Edition, and it has every bell and whistle (and some 
>> sirens, too) available at the time. Top of the line AWD system that 
>> is settable for various surfaces (or auto), heated everything, cooled 
>> front seats, engine stop/start, gigantic screen with plenty of info 
>> available, etc. The only thing I dislike (besides the mass) is that 
>> the programmable instrument display only has a digital speedometer 
>> (for some reason, I have a hard time holding a constant speed with 
>> that thing).
>>
>> prefer). I have a deposit on a Cybertruck (which I'll probably roll 
>> over to the Model Y).
>>
>> Dan D
>> '76B, '65B
>> Central NJ USA
>> On Tue, Mar 10, 2020 at 9:56 AM Barrie Robinson via Mgs 
>>
>>
>>     -- Hello folks,
>>
>>     I have this gripe about new cars and this is the only big
>>     platform I have on which to sound off.   I do have my own Aston
>>     Martin Feltham Club but that is only 150 members.  I am getting
>>     exremely puzzled as my 2003 Golf is getting a bit sad although it
>>     still goes like a rocket. There is a little rust and one of the
>>     courtesy lights does not work.   However, whenever I have a look
>>     at new ones they are gadget rich and the dash is becoming like
>>     one from a 737.   Why on earth does there have to be a rear end
>>     crash avoiding system (used to be rear brake lights) as well as
>>     an unwanted-lane changing warning (used to be keeping eyes on the
>>     your oil temperature?).    So instead of forking out $30-40,000 I
>>     kilometers.   The only regret will be - it does not have a
>>     powered rear end tailgate - but maybe I could get that
>>     retro-fitted!   And in this day and age electonic/electrical
>>     and oiled up to the hllt to counter winter driving conditions.
>>     tiny mileage.  OMG, I am a little old man (I will not get a sex
>> Unsubscribe: http://autox.team.net/mailman/options/mgs/[email-masked]
>
>
> Unsubscribe: http://autox.team.net/mailman/options/mgs/[email-masked]

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    <font size="-1"><font face="Arial">One of my most favourite car
        trips was from Kuala Lumpur to Singapore in a TR2.   Wind in my
        hair, sun beating down on me, totally devoid of useless
        information and just a simple dial for revs and speed.   No
        flashing screens , no awkward pointing at a glass plate, no
        googled eye searches - Just joy of the engine noise and
        driving.   All this while not worrying about the terrorists
        pinging at me - well.it was 1953 during the "Emergency" (not
        described as war for political reasons).   I do feel sorry for
        those having to drive in a "modern"car !!!<br>
        <br>
        HOWEVER, I do have tach(one wire connection) and speedo(GPS fed)
        from SpeedHut in my MGB GT V8.<br>
        <br>
        Barrie<br>
      </font></font><br>
    <div class="moz-cite-prefix">On 3/10/2020 3:02 PM, Max Heim via Mgs
      wrote:<br>
    </div>
    <blockquote type="cite"
      cite="mid:[email-masked]">
      <meta http-equiv="Content-Type" content="text/html; charset=UTF-8">
      As a designer with experience in human factors design and UX
      design, I can state that digital numeric speedometer displays are
      completely inappropriate. The constant flickering of numerals
      (64,65,66,65) conveys zero information and distracts the eye from
      the road. Personally, I think they should be banned. With an
      analog needle (or a digital representation of an analog needle),
      these tiny variations in speed are unnoticeable, and one can
      actually check the current speed with peripheral vision detecting
      the rough angle of the needle, without having to consciously parse
      individual numerals. The old LCD displays were the worst, because
      all these numerals look the same at a glance: 2, 3, 5, 6, 8, 9.
      Also 1 and 7. But it doesn’t matter how they gussy up the numeral
      font, it’s just a bad idea.
      <div class=""> </div>
      <div class="">The same goes for every instrument. Which display
        conveys more useful information with less concentration
        required? “F”, or “17.9gal remaining”?<br class="">
        <div class=""><br class="">
        </div>
        <div class="">Touchscreen controls are another abomination that
          shouldn’t be allowed in automotive systems that are active
          while the vehicle is in motion. You absolutely have to take
          your eyes off the road to manipulate them. All active vehicle
          controls should feature tactile feedback, so they can be
          operated by touch. The classic headlight push/pull knob is a
          great example that has yet to be improved upon. The rotary
          stalk switch on more modern cars is actually a step backward,
          because the direction of rotation needed is not obvious.</div>
        <div class=""><br class="">
        </div>
        <div class="">
          <div class="">
            <div style="color: rgb(0, 0, 0); letter-spacing: normal;
              text-align: start; text-indent: 0px; text-transform: none;
              white-space: normal; word-spacing: 0px;
              -webkit-text-stroke-width: 0px; word-wrap: break-word;
              -webkit-nbsp-mode: space; -webkit-line-break:
              after-white-space;" class="">
              <div style="color: rgb(0, 0, 0); letter-spacing: normal;
                text-align: start; text-indent: 0px; text-transform:
                none; white-space: normal; word-spacing: 0px;
                -webkit-text-stroke-width: 0px; word-wrap: break-word;
                -webkit-nbsp-mode: space; -webkit-line-break:
                after-white-space;" class="">
                <div style="margin: 0px; font-size: 13px;" class="">--</div>
                <div style="margin: 0px; font-size: 13px; min-height:
                  16px;" class="">Max Heim</div>
                <div style="margin: 0px; font-size: 13px;" class="">'66
                  MGB</div>
              </div>
            </div>
          </div>
          <div class=""><br class="webkit-block-placeholder">
          </div>
          <div class=""><br class="">
          </div>
          <br class="">
          <div>
            <blockquote type="cite" class="">
              <div class="">On Mar 10, 2020, at 11:35 AM, Dan DiBiase
                via Mgs &lt;<a href="mailto:[email-masked]" class=""
                  moz-do-not-send="true">[email-masked]</a>&gt;
                wrote:</div>
              <br class="Apple-interchange-newline">
              <div class="">
                <div dir="ltr" class="">Ok, I'm going to represent the
                  non-Luddites among us ;-) ... I love new technology
                  and the possibilities it brings. My daughter has the
                  newest car in our family, a 2016 Jeep Grand Cherokee
                  Limited 75th Anniversary Edition, and it has every
                  bell and whistle (and some sirens, too) available at
                  the time. Top of the line AWD system that is settable
                  for various surfaces (or auto), heated everything,
                  cooled front seats, engine stop/start, gigantic screen
                  with plenty of info available, etc. The only thing I
                  dislike (besides the mass) is that the programmable
                  instrument display only has a digital speedometer (for
                  some reason, I have a hard time holding a constant
                  speed with that thing). 
                  <div class=""><br class="">
                  </div>
                  <div class="">My next car will be a Tesla, either a
                    Model 3 or a Model Y (which I prefer). I have a
                    deposit on a Cybertruck (which I'll probably roll
                    over to the Model Y). 
                    <div class=""><br class="">
                    </div>
                    <div class="">Dan D</div>
                    <div class="">'76B, '65B</div>
                    <div class="">Central NJ USA<br class="" clear="all">
                      <div class="">
                        <div dir="ltr" class="gmail_signature"
                          data-smartmail="gmail_signature">
                          <div dir="ltr" class=""><a
                              href="http://dandibiase.cbintouch.com/"
                              target="_blank" class=""
                              moz-do-not-send="true">http://dandibiase.cbintouch.com/</a></div>
                        </div>
                      </div>
                      <br class="">
                    </div>
                  </div>
                </div>
                <br class="">
                <div class="gmail_quote">
                  <div dir="ltr" class="gmail_attr">On Tue, Mar 10, 2020
                    at 9:56 AM Barrie Robinson via Mgs &lt;<a
                      href="mailto:[email-masked]" class=""
                      moz-do-not-send="true">[email-masked]</a>&gt;
                    wrote:<br class="">
                  </div>
                  <blockquote class="gmail_quote" style="margin:0px 0px
                    0px 0.8ex;border-left:1px solid
                    rgb(204,204,204);padding-left:1ex">
                    <div class=""> <br class="">
                      <div class="">-- Hello folks,<br class="">
                        <br class="">
                        I have this gripe about new cars and this is the
                        only big platform I have on which to sound
                        off.   I do have my own Aston Martin Feltham
                        Club but that is only 150 members.  I am getting
                        exremely puzzled as my 2003 Golf is getting a
                        bit sad although it still goes like a rocket.  
                        There is a little rust and one of the courtesy
                        lights does not work.   However, whenever I have
                        a look at new ones they are gadget rich and the
                        dash is becoming like one from a 737.   Why on
                        earth does there have to be a rear end crash
                        avoiding system (used to be rear brake lights)
                        as well as an unwanted-lane changing warning
                        (used to be keeping eyes on the road) to say
                        nothing of bluetooth (where is yellow and red?),
                        Spotify (dog treatment?), Hands free telephone
                        (used to be concentration on the road) and the
                        dreaded in your face screen which like today's
                        TV and Internet is intent on delivring
                        information you don't really need (when did you
                        last ponder over your oil temperature?).    So
                        instead of forking out $30-40,000 I am going to
                        have the Golf all tarted up and enjoy another
                        170k kilometers.   The only regret will be - it
                        does not have a powered rear end tailgate - but
                        maybe I could get that retro-fitted!   And in
                        this day and age electonic/electrical gadgets
                        die first ($$$$$)- and Lucas smoke is
                        unattainable now.<br class="">
                        <br class="">
                        I like my MGB GT so much that maybe another as a
                        'family' car could be an alternative - but not
                        100% restored just road worthy and oiled up to
                        the hllt to counter winter driving conditions. 
                        Trouble is I would want to drop in a Rover V8 as
                        the engine bay was made for it on later cars -
                        and the broom broom is so much better. Or I coul
                        find a Golf owned by a little old lady with a
                        tiny mileage.  OMG, I am a little old man (I
                        will not get a sex change) with a low mileage
                        Golf !!!!  Oh sherbert - now what do I do?   <br
                          class="">
                        <br class="">
                        Barrie<br class="">
                        <img class="" moz-do-not-send="true" border="0"></div>
                    </div>
                    _______________________________________________<br
                      class="">
                    <br class="">
                    <a href="mailto:[email-masked]" target="_blank"
                      class="" moz-do-not-send="true">[email-masked]</a><br
                      class="">
                    Donate: <a href="http://www.team.net/donate.html"
                      rel="noreferrer" target="_blank" class=""
                      moz-do-not-send="true">http://www.team.net/donate.html</a><br
                      class="">
                    Suggested annual donation  $12.75<br class="">
                    <br class="">
                    Archive: <a
                      href="http://www.team.net/pipermail/mgs"
                      rel="noreferrer" target="_blank" class=""
                      moz-do-not-send="true">http://www.team.net/pipermail/mgs</a>
                    <a href="http://autox.team.net/archive"
                      rel="noreferrer" target="_blank" class=""
                      moz-do-not-send="true">http://autox.team.net/archive</a><br
                      class="">
                    <br class="">
                    Unsubscribe: <a
                      href="http://autox.team.net/mailman/options/mgs/[email-masked]"
                      rel="noreferrer" target="_blank" class=""
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                      class="">
                  </blockquote>
                </div>
                _______________________________________________<br
                  class="">
                <br class="">
                <a href="mailto:[email-masked]" class=""
                  moz-do-not-send="true">[email-masked]</a><br
                  class="">
                Donate: <a class="moz-txt-link-freetext" href="http://www.team.net/donate.html">http://www.team.net/donate.html</a><br class="">
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                Archive: <a class="moz-txt-link-freetext" href="http://www.team.net/pipermail/mgs">http://www.team.net/pipermail/mgs</a>
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                  class="">
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            </blockquote>
          </div>
          <br class="">
        </div>
      </div>
      <br>
      <fieldset class="mimeAttachmentHeader"></fieldset>
      <pre class="moz-quote-pre" wrap="">_______________________________________________

<a class="moz-txt-link-abbreviated" href="mailto:[email-masked]">[email-masked]</a>

Archive: <a class="moz-txt-link-freetext" href="http://www.team.net/pipermail/mgs">http://www.team.net/pipermail/mgs</a> <a class="moz-txt-link-freetext" href="http://autox.team.net/archive">http://autox.team.net/archive</a>

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[email-masked]

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---

From: David Breneman via Mgs <[email-masked]>
Date: Tue, 10 Mar 2020 19:57:37 +0000 (UTC)

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On Tuesday, March 10, 2020, 12:02:31 PM PDT, Max Heim via Mgs <[email-masked]> wrote:
[About digital displays]
The Air Force did a study about this decades ago, and they found thatthe best way to convey information to a pilot was with a round gauge,white on black printing, with the nominal value at the middle of theneedle's travel, preferably 12:00 or 6:00, depending on orientation.

David Breneman [email-masked] 

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<html><head></head><body><div class=3D"ydp7b3e685byahoo-style-wrap" style=
=3D"font-family: verdana, helvetica, sans-serif; font-size: 13px;"><div><di=
v dir=3D"ltr" data-setdir=3D"false"><span>On Tuesday, March 10, 2020, 12:02=
:31 PM PDT, Max Heim via Mgs &lt;[email-masked]&gt; wrote:</span></div>=
<div dir=3D"ltr" data-setdir=3D"false"><span><br></span></div><div dir=3D"l=
tr" data-setdir=3D"false"><span>[About digital displays]</span></div><div d=
ir=3D"ltr" data-setdir=3D"false"><span><br></span></div><div dir=3D"ltr" da=
ta-setdir=3D"false"><span>The Air Force did a study about this decades ago,=
 and they found that</span></div><div dir=3D"ltr" data-setdir=3D"false"><sp=
an>the best way to convey information to a pilot was with a round gauge,</s=
pan></div><div dir=3D"ltr" data-setdir=3D"false"><span>white on black print=
ing, with the nominal value at the middle of the</span></div><div dir=3D"lt=
r" data-setdir=3D"false"><span>needle's travel, preferably 12:00 or 6:00, d=
epending on orientation.</span></div><div dir=3D"ltr" data-setdir=3D"false"=
><span></span><br></div><div><br></div><div class=3D"ydp7b3e685bsignature">=
David Breneman         [email-masked]</div></div>
        <div><br></div><br></div></body></html>
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[email-masked]

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---

From: Richard Lindsay via Mgs <[email-masked]>
Date: Tue, 10 Mar 2020 15:33:33 -0500

--===============3816512164331390863==

--0000000000004128c205a0860980

One of the advantages of having multiple cars with different gear selector
locations, different pedals, manual gearboxes, automatics, and Tiptronic
padels, etc., is that when I drive these cars I have to THINK about
driving. That makes me also acutely aware of the road and surrounding
traffic!

Rick

On Tue, Mar 10, 2020, 10:58 AM Richard Lindsay via Mgs <[email-masked]>
wrote:

>    Love your post, Barry. My newest car is 10 years old. My oldest is 67
> years old. The most 'modern' doodad on the newer car is cruise control,
> ABS, and a bluetooth phone option.
>    My youngest sports car is 12 years old, a Porsche 987 Cayman. It is
> pure car with no candy doodads. It is the best car I have ever owned!
>    My MG TD is quite primitive and of course, it's even more
> just-plain-car than any of the others. It does have turn signals, as long
> as one holds the switch in position.
>    Here are my cars (I am one lucky dude!):
>
> '10 Mercedes E350
> '09 Toyota Highlander
> '08 Porsche Cayman
> '97 Nissan Hardbody
> '79 Ferrari 308GTB
> '79 Lancia Beta Zagato
> '75 Triumph TR6
> '73 Jaguar E-Type
> '71 Volvo 1800E
> '53 MG TD
>
> Rick
>
>
> On Mar 10, 2020 8:56 AM, Barrie Robinson via Mgs <[email-masked]>
> wrote:
>
>
> -- Hello folks,
>
> On Mar 10, 2020 8:56 AM, Barrie Robinson via Mgs <[email-masked]>
> wrote:
>
>
> -- Hello folks,
>
> On Mar 10, 2020 8:56 AM, Barrie Robinson via Mgs <[email-masked]>
> wrote:
>
>
> -- Hello folks,
>
> http://autox.team.net/mailman/options/mgs/[email-masked]
>

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<div dir=3D"auto"><div>One of the advantages of having multiple cars with d=
ifferent gear selector locations, different pedals, manual gearboxes, autom=
atics, and Tiptronic padels, etc., is that when I drive these cars I have t=
o THINK about driving. That makes me also acutely aware of the road and sur=
rounding traffic!</div><div dir=3D"auto"><br></div><div dir=3D"auto">Rick<b=
r><br><div class=3D"gmail_quote" dir=3D"auto"><div dir=3D"ltr" class=3D"gma=
il_attr">On Tue, Mar 10, 2020, 10:58 AM Richard Lindsay via Mgs &lt;<a href=
=3D"mailto:[email-masked]">[email-masked]</a>&gt; wrote:<br></div><=
blockquote class=3D"gmail_quote" style=3D"margin:0 0 0 .8ex;border-left:1px=
 #ccc solid;padding-left:1ex"><div dir=3D"auto"><div dir=3D"auto"><div dir=
=3D"auto">=C2=A0 =C2=A0Love your post, Barry. My newest car is 10 years old=
. My oldest is 67 years old. The most &#39;modern&#39; doodad on the newer =
car is cruise control, ABS, and a bluetooth phone option.<div dir=3D"auto">=
=C2=A0 =C2=A0My youngest sports car is 12 years old, a Porsche 987 Cayman. =
It is pure car with no candy doodads. It is the best car I have ever owned!=
</div><div dir=3D"auto">=C2=A0 =C2=A0My MG TD is quite primitive and of cou=
rse, it&#39;s even more just-plain-car than any of the others. It does have=
 turn signals, as long as one holds the switch in position.</div><div dir=
=3D"auto">=C2=A0 =C2=A0Here are my cars (I am one lucky dude!):</div><div d=
ir=3D"auto"><br></div><div dir=3D"auto">&#39;10 Mercedes E350</div><div dir=
=3D"auto">&#39;09 Toyota Highlander</div><div dir=3D"auto">&#39;08 Porsche =
Cayman</div><div dir=3D"auto">&#39;97 Nissan Hardbody</div><div dir=3D"auto=
">&#39;79 Ferrari 308GTB</div><div dir=3D"auto">&#39;79 Lancia Beta Zagato<=
/div><div dir=3D"auto">&#39;75 Triumph TR6</div><div dir=3D"auto">&#39;73 J=
aguar E-Type</div><div dir=3D"auto">&#39;71 Volvo 1800E</div><div dir=3D"au=
to">&#39;53 MG TD</div><div dir=3D"auto"><br></div><div dir=3D"auto">Rick</=
div><div dir=3D"auto"><br></div></div><div><br><div>On Mar 10, 2020 8:56 AM=
, Barrie Robinson via Mgs &lt;<a href=3D"mailto:[email-masked]" target=
=3D"_blank" rel=3D"noreferrer">[email-masked]</a>&gt; wrote:<br type=3D=
"attribution"><blockquote style=3D"margin:0 0 0 0.8ex;border-left:1px #ccc =
solid;padding-left:1ex"><div>
    <br>
    <div>-- Hello folks,<br>
      <br>
      I have this gripe about new cars and this is the only big platform
      I have on which to sound off.=C2=A0=C2=A0 I do have my own Aston Mart=
in
      Feltham Club but that is only 150 members.=C2=A0 I am getting exremel=
y
      puzzled as my 2003 Golf is getting a bit sad although it still
      goes like a rocket.=C2=A0=C2=A0 There is a little rust and one of the
      courtesy lights does not work.=C2=A0=C2=A0 However, whenever I have a=
 look
      at new ones they are gadget rich and the dash is becoming like one
      from a 737.=C2=A0=C2=A0 Why on earth does there have to be a rear end=
 crash
      avoiding system (used to be rear brake lights) as well as an
      unwanted-lane changing warning (used to be keeping eyes on the
      road) to say nothing of bluetooth (where is yellow and red?),
      Spotify (dog treatment?), Hands free telephone (used to be
      concentration on the road) and the dreaded in your face screen
      which like today&#39;s TV and Internet is intent on delivring
      information you don&#39;t really need (when did you last ponder over
      your oil temperature?).=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0 So instead of forking out $=
30-40,000 I
      am going to have the Golf all tarted up and enjoy another 170k
      kilometers.=C2=A0=C2=A0 The only regret will be - it does not have a =
powered
      rear end tailgate - but maybe I could get that retro-fitted!=C2=A0=C2=
=A0 And
      in this day and age electonic/electrical gadgets die first
      ($$$$$)- and Lucas smoke is unattainable now.<br>
      <br>
      I like my MGB GT so much that maybe another as a &#39;family&#39; car
      could be an alternative - but not 100% restored just road worthy
      and oiled up to the hllt to counter winter driving conditions.=C2=A0
      Trouble is I would want to drop in a Rover V8 as the engine bay
      was made for it on later cars - and the broom broom is so much
      better. Or I coul find a Golf owned by a little old lady with a
      tiny mileage.=C2=A0 OMG, I am a little old man (I will not get a sex
      change) with a low mileage Golf !!!!=C2=A0 Oh sherbert - now what do =
I
      do?=C2=A0=C2=A0 <br>
      <br>
      Barrie<br>
      <img border=3D"0"></div>
  </div>
</blockquote></div><br></div></div><div><br><div>On Mar 10, 2020 8:56 AM, B=
arrie Robinson via Mgs &lt;<a href=3D"mailto:[email-masked]" target=3D"=
_blank" rel=3D"noreferrer">[email-masked]</a>&gt; wrote:<br type=3D"att=
ribution"><blockquote style=3D"margin:0 0 0 0.8ex;border-left:1px #ccc soli=
d;padding-left:1ex"><div>
    <br>
    <div>-- Hello folks,<br>
      <br>
      I have this gripe about new cars and this is the only big platform
      I have on which to sound off.=C2=A0=C2=A0 I do have my own Aston Mart=
in
      Feltham Club but that is only 150 members.=C2=A0 I am getting exremel=
y
      puzzled as my 2003 Golf is getting a bit sad although it still
      goes like a rocket.=C2=A0=C2=A0 There is a little rust and one of the
      courtesy lights does not work.=C2=A0=C2=A0 However, whenever I have a=
 look
      at new ones they are gadget rich and the dash is becoming like one
      from a 737.=C2=A0=C2=A0 Why on earth does there have to be a rear end=
 crash
      avoiding system (used to be rear brake lights) as well as an
      unwanted-lane changing warning (used to be keeping eyes on the
      road) to say nothing of bluetooth (where is yellow and red?),
      Spotify (dog treatment?), Hands free telephone (used to be
      concentration on the road) and the dreaded in your face screen
      which like today&#39;s TV and Internet is intent on delivring
      information you don&#39;t really need (when did you last ponder over
      your oil temperature?).=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0 So instead of forking out $=
30-40,000 I
      am going to have the Golf all tarted up and enjoy another 170k
      kilometers.=C2=A0=C2=A0 The only regret will be - it does not have a =
powered
      rear end tailgate - but maybe I could get that retro-fitted!=C2=A0=C2=
=A0 And
      in this day and age electonic/electrical gadgets die first
      ($$$$$)- and Lucas smoke is unattainable now.<br>
      <br>
      I like my MGB GT so much that maybe another as a &#39;family&#39; car
      could be an alternative - but not 100% restored just road worthy
      and oiled up to the hllt to counter winter driving conditions.=C2=A0
      Trouble is I would want to drop in a Rover V8 as the engine bay
      was made for it on later cars - and the broom broom is so much
      better. Or I coul find a Golf owned by a little old lady with a
      tiny mileage.=C2=A0 OMG, I am a little old man (I will not get a sex
      change) with a low mileage Golf !!!!=C2=A0 Oh sherbert - now what do =
I
      do?=C2=A0=C2=A0 <br>
      <br>
      Barrie<br>
      <img border=3D"0"></div>
  </div>
</blockquote></div><br></div></div><div class=3D"gmail_extra"><br><div clas=
s=3D"gmail_quote">On Mar 10, 2020 8:56 AM, Barrie Robinson via Mgs &lt;<a h=
ref=3D"mailto:[email-masked]" target=3D"_blank" rel=3D"noreferrer">mgs@=
autox.team.net</a>&gt; wrote:<br type=3D"attribution"><blockquote style=3D"=
margin:0 0 0 .8ex;border-left:1px #ccc solid;padding-left:1ex"><div>
    <br>
    <div>-- Hello folks,<br>
      <br>
      I have this gripe about new cars and this is the only big platform
      I have on which to sound off.=C2=A0=C2=A0 I do have my own Aston Mart=
in
      Feltham Club but that is only 150 members.=C2=A0 I am getting exremel=
y
      puzzled as my 2003 Golf is getting a bit sad although it still
      goes like a rocket.=C2=A0=C2=A0 There is a little rust and one of the
      courtesy lights does not work.=C2=A0=C2=A0 However, whenever I have a=
 look
      at new ones they are gadget rich and the dash is becoming like one
      from a 737.=C2=A0=C2=A0 Why on earth does there have to be a rear end=
 crash
      avoiding system (used to be rear brake lights) as well as an
      unwanted-lane changing warning (used to be keeping eyes on the
      road) to say nothing of bluetooth (where is yellow and red?),
      Spotify (dog treatment?), Hands free telephone (used to be
      concentration on the road) and the dreaded in your face screen
      which like today&#39;s TV and Internet is intent on delivring
      information you don&#39;t really need (when did you last ponder over
      your oil temperature?).=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0 So instead of forking out $=
30-40,000 I
      am going to have the Golf all tarted up and enjoy another 170k
      kilometers.=C2=A0=C2=A0 The only regret will be - it does not have a =
powered
      rear end tailgate - but maybe I could get that retro-fitted!=C2=A0=C2=
=A0 And
      in this day and age electonic/electrical gadgets die first
      ($$$$$)- and Lucas smoke is unattainable now.<br>
      <br>
      I like my MGB GT so much that maybe another as a &#39;family&#39; car
      could be an alternative - but not 100% restored just road worthy
      and oiled up to the hllt to counter winter driving conditions.=C2=A0
      Trouble is I would want to drop in a Rover V8 as the engine bay
      was made for it on later cars - and the broom broom is so much
      better. Or I coul find a Golf owned by a little old lady with a
      tiny mileage.=C2=A0 OMG, I am a little old man (I will not get a sex
      change) with a low mileage Golf !!!!=C2=A0 Oh sherbert - now what do =
I
      do?=C2=A0=C2=A0 <br>
      <br>
      Barrie<br>
      <img border=3D"0"></div>
  </div>
</blockquote></div><br></div>______________________________________________=
_<br>
<br>
<a href=3D"mailto:[email-masked]" target=3D"_blank" rel=3D"noreferrer">=
[email-masked]</a><br>
errer" target=3D"_blank">http://www.team.net/donate.html</a><br>
<br>
Archive: <a href=3D"http://www.team.net/pipermail/mgs" rel=3D"noreferrer no=
referrer" target=3D"_blank">http://www.team.net/pipermail/mgs</a> <a href=
=3D"http://autox.team.net/archive" rel=3D"noreferrer noreferrer" target=3D"=
_blank">http://autox.team.net/archive</a><br>
<br>
Unsubscribe: <a href=3D"http://autox.team.net/mailman/options/mgs/richardol=
[email-masked]" rel=3D"noreferrer noreferrer" target=3D"_blank">http://au=
tox.team.net/mailman/options/mgs/[email-masked]</a><br>
</blockquote></div></div></div>

--0000000000004128c205a0860980--

--===============3816512164331390863==
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[email-masked]

--===============3816512164331390863==--

---

From: Max Heim via Mgs <[email-masked]>
Date: Tue, 10 Mar 2020 14:45:07 -0700

--===============5128735103615103476==
 boundary="Apple-Mail=_7BEE0CF4-40DC-4574-AABF-5D926CFE9B09"

--Apple-Mail=_7BEE0CF4-40DC-4574-AABF-5D926CFE9B09
Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable
	charset=utf-8

Yes, actually, the authority on this topic is the study done for the US =
military in the 40s. They were in a position where they had to train =
millions of raw recruits in a short period of time, on unfamiliar =
equipment. So they wanted to institute consistent controls across all =
the equipment, because of the rapid turnover of technologies in wartime, =
and the dozens of different manufacturers of aircraft, tanks and =
vehicles. Plus, they knew this equipment would be operated under stress =
(that=E2=80=99s an understatement) and in poor weather and lighting =
conditions. Pretty much every one of their recommendations is still =
valid; unfortunately, modern designers trained on onscreen apps feel =
they can reinvent the wheel at will without considering any of these =
factors.

--
Max Heim
'66 MGB

> On Mar 10, 2020, at 12:57 PM, David Breneman via Mgs =
<[email-masked]> wrote:
>=20
> On Tuesday, March 10, 2020, 12:02:31 PM PDT, Max Heim via Mgs =
<[email-masked]> wrote:
>=20
> [About digital displays]
>=20
> The Air Force did a study about this decades ago, and they found that
> the best way to convey information to a pilot was with a round gauge,
> white on black printing, with the nominal value at the middle of the
> needle's travel, preferably 12:00 or 6:00, depending on orientation.
>=20
>=20

--Apple-Mail=_7BEE0CF4-40DC-4574-AABF-5D926CFE9B09
Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable
	charset=utf-8

<html><head><meta http-equiv=3D"Content-Type" content=3D"text/html =
charset=3Dutf-8"></head><body style=3D"word-wrap: break-word; =
-webkit-nbsp-mode: space; -webkit-line-break: after-white-space;" =
class=3D"">Yes, actually, the authority on this topic is the study done =
for the US military in the 40s. They were in a position where they had =
to train millions of raw recruits in a short period of time, on =
unfamiliar equipment. So they wanted to institute consistent controls =
across all the equipment, because of the rapid turnover of technologies =
in wartime, and the dozens of different manufacturers of aircraft, tanks =
and vehicles. Plus, they knew this equipment would be operated under =
stress (that=E2=80=99s an understatement) and in poor weather and =
lighting conditions. Pretty much every one of their recommendations is =
still valid; unfortunately, modern designers trained on onscreen apps =
feel they can reinvent the wheel at will without considering any of =
these factors.<div class=3D""><br class=3D""></div><div class=3D""><br =
class=3D""><div class=3D"">
<div style=3D"color: rgb(0, 0, 0); letter-spacing: normal; text-align: =
start; text-indent: 0px; text-transform: none; white-space: normal; =
word-spacing: 0px; -webkit-text-stroke-width: 0px; word-wrap: =
break-word; -webkit-nbsp-mode: space; -webkit-line-break: =
after-white-space;" class=3D""><div style=3D"color: rgb(0, 0, 0); =
letter-spacing: normal; text-align: start; text-indent: 0px; =
text-transform: none; white-space: normal; word-spacing: 0px; =
-webkit-text-stroke-width: 0px; word-wrap: break-word; =
-webkit-nbsp-mode: space; -webkit-line-break: after-white-space;" =
class=3D""><div style=3D"margin: 0px; font-size: 13px;" =
class=3D"">--</div><div style=3D"margin: 0px; font-size: 13px; =
min-height: 16px;" class=3D"">Max Heim</div><div style=3D"margin: 0px; =
font-size: 13px;" class=3D"">'66 MGB</div></div></div>
</div>

<br class=3D""><div><blockquote type=3D"cite" class=3D""><div =
class=3D"">On Mar 10, 2020, at 12:57 PM, David Breneman via Mgs &lt;<a =
href=3D"mailto:[email-masked]" class=3D"">[email-masked]</a>&gt; =
wrote:</div><br class=3D"Apple-interchange-newline"><div class=3D""><div =
class=3D""><div class=3D"ydp7b3e685byahoo-style-wrap" =
style=3D"font-family: verdana, helvetica, sans-serif; font-size: =
13px;"><div class=3D""><div dir=3D"ltr" data-setdir=3D"false" =
class=3D""><span class=3D"">On Tuesday, March 10, 2020, 12:02:31 PM PDT, =
Max Heim via Mgs &lt;<a href=3D"mailto:[email-masked]" =
class=3D"">[email-masked]</a>&gt; wrote:</span></div><div dir=3D"ltr" =
data-setdir=3D"false" class=3D""><span class=3D""><br =
class=3D""></span></div><div dir=3D"ltr" data-setdir=3D"false" =
class=3D""><span class=3D"">[About digital displays]</span></div><div =
dir=3D"ltr" data-setdir=3D"false" class=3D""><span class=3D""><br =
class=3D""></span></div><div dir=3D"ltr" data-setdir=3D"false" =
class=3D""><span class=3D"">The Air Force did a study about this decades =
ago, and they found that</span></div><div dir=3D"ltr" =
data-setdir=3D"false" class=3D""><span class=3D"">the best way to convey =
information to a pilot was with a round gauge,</span></div><div =
dir=3D"ltr" data-setdir=3D"false" class=3D""><span class=3D"">white on =
black printing, with the nominal value at the middle of =
the</span></div><div dir=3D"ltr" data-setdir=3D"false" class=3D""><span =
class=3D"">needle's travel, preferably 12:00 or 6:00, depending on =
orientation.</span></div><div dir=3D"ltr" data-setdir=3D"false" =
class=3D""><span class=3D""></span><br class=3D""></div><div =
class=3D""><br class=3D""></div><div class=3D"ydp7b3e685bsignature">David =
Breneman         <a href=3D"mailto:[email-masked]" =
class=3D"">[email-masked]</a></div></div>
        <div class=3D""><br class=3D""></div><br =
class=3D""></div></div></div></blockquote></div><br =
class=3D""></div></body></html>=

--Apple-Mail=_7BEE0CF4-40DC-4574-AABF-5D926CFE9B09--

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[email-masked]

--===============5128735103615103476==--

---

From: PaulHunt73 via Mgs <[email-masked]>
Date: Wed, 11 Mar 2020 08:36:18 -0000 gfq4kd1ZscVVwOI95hyrjyjKPZaJfVULpJtETWYmtNFc5R3yW322hDpZ

--===============1428985391374652240==
	boundary="----=_NextPart_000_0095_01D5F780.22C8B0B0"

------=_NextPart_000_0095_01D5F780.22C8B0B0
	charset="utf-8"
Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable

Never mind anything else, digital displays HAVE to be read.  With =
analogue you just glance at the angle of the needle and you should know =
what speed you are doing, and that the fuel, temp and oil pressures are =
good ... oh I forgot, that wouldn't apply to a lot of drivers these days =
who don't even realise they have an indicator bulb blown when one side =
starts flashing at double speed.  But trying to keep an EXACT speed?  =
Really?

PaulH.
  ----- Original Message ----- 
------=_NextPart_000_0095_01D5F780.22C8B0B0
	charset="utf-8"
Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable

=EF=BB=BF<!DOCTYPE HTML PUBLIC "-//W3C//DTD HTML 4.0 Transitional//EN">
<HTML><HEAD>
<META content=3D"text/html; charset=3Dutf-8" http-equiv=3DContent-Type>
<META name=3DGENERATOR content=3D"MSHTML 8.00.6001.23588">
<STYLE></STYLE>
</HEAD>
<BODY=20
style=3D"WORD-WRAP: break-word; -webkit-nbsp-mode: space; =
-webkit-line-break: after-white-space"=20
bgColor=3D#ffffff>
<DIV><FONT size=3D2>Never mind anything else, digital displays&nbsp;HAVE =
to be=20
read.&nbsp; With analogue you just glance at the angle of the needle and =
you=20
should know what speed you are doing,&nbsp;and&nbsp;that the fuel, temp =
and oil=20
pressures are good&nbsp;... oh I forgot, that wouldn't apply to a lot of =
drivers=20
these days who don't even realise they have an indicator bulb blown when =
one=20
side starts flashing at double speed.&nbsp; But trying to keep =
an&nbsp;EXACT=20
speed?&nbsp; Really?</FONT></DIV>
<DIV><FONT size=3D2></FONT>&nbsp;</DIV>
<DIV><FONT size=3D2>PaulH.</FONT></DIV>
<BLOCKQUOTE=20
style=3D"BORDER-LEFT: #000000 2px solid; PADDING-LEFT: 5px; =
PADDING-RIGHT: 0px; MARGIN-LEFT: 5px; MARGIN-RIGHT: 0px">
  <DIV style=3D"FONT: 10pt arial">----- Original Message -----=20
</DIV></BLOCKQUOTE></BODY></HTML>

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[email-masked]

--===============1428985391374652240==--

---

From: PaulHunt73 via Mgs <[email-masked]>
Date: Wed, 11 Mar 2020 08:42:46 -0000 gfq4kd1ZscVVwPlzWdnDWkfx9YJlSQldu+FGPfWQFHFSnJnw5AvZemex+KOL3WaQUM+/58PxZYu86sRGRx709k6c+zeNIeucmD0=

--===============4748135209597634623==
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Which is why some classic race cars have the tach orientated so maximum =
permitted rpm has the needle vertical.
  ----- Original Message -----=20

------=_NextPart_000_00DE_01D5F781.09AFB690

=EF=BB=BF<!DOCTYPE HTML PUBLIC "-//W3C//DTD HTML 4.0 Transitional//EN">
<HTML><HEAD>
<META content=3D"text/html; charset=3Dutf-8" http-equiv=3DContent-Type>
<META name=3DGENERATOR content=3D"MSHTML 8.00.6001.23588">
<STYLE></STYLE>
</HEAD>
<BODY bgColor=3D#ffffff>
<DIV><FONT size=3D2>Which is why some classic race cars have the tach =
orientated=20
so maximum permitted rpm has the needle vertical.</FONT></DIV>
<BLOCKQUOTE=20
style=3D"BORDER-LEFT: #000000 2px solid; PADDING-LEFT: 5px; =
PADDING-RIGHT: 0px; MARGIN-LEFT: 5px; MARGIN-RIGHT: 0px">
  <DIV style=3D"FONT: 10pt arial">----- Original Message ----- </DIV>
  <DIV=20
  style=3D"FONT: 10pt arial; BACKGROUND: #e4e4e4; font-color: =
black"><SPAN><BR></SPAN>&nbsp;</DIV>
  <DIV style=3D"FONT-FAMILY: verdana, helvetica, sans-serif; FONT-SIZE: =
13px"=20
  class=3Dydp7b3e685byahoo-style-wrap>
  <DIV>
  <DIV dir=3Dltr data-setdir=3D"false"><SPAN>The Air Force did a study =
about this=20
  decades ago, and they found that</SPAN></DIV>
  <DIV dir=3Dltr data-setdir=3D"false"><SPAN>the best way to convey =
information to a=20
  pilot was with a round gauge,</SPAN></DIV>
  <DIV dir=3Dltr data-setdir=3D"false"><SPAN>white on black printing, =
with the=20
  nominal value at the middle of the</SPAN></DIV>
  <DIV dir=3Dltr data-setdir=3D"false"><SPAN>needle's travel, preferably =
12:00 or=20
  6:00, depending on=20
orientation.</SPAN></DIV></DIV></DIV></BLOCKQUOTE></BODY></HTML>

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[email-masked]

--===============4748135209597634623==--

---

From: PaulHunt73 via Mgs <[email-masked]>
Date: Wed, 11 Mar 2020 08:44:00 -0000 xXjkPYbh+SyIgIXO0gE6z6MRawnjlrBTxjHgakp7Q088wP8PRQeIaS4A/GshszIgG2c3Y5EMEPpJyrGI26JzLGtFpCWAhMhZdDPSdZSfGTUeAukuk65QGfmS

--===============8670710379444375574==
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More like makes you think too much about what is going on inside the =
car, rather than outside which is where your attention SHOULD be.
  ----- Original Message ----- 
------=_NextPart_000_0102_01D5F781.35EA3140
	charset="utf-8"
Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable

=EF=BB=BF<!DOCTYPE HTML PUBLIC "-//W3C//DTD HTML 4.0 Transitional//EN">
<HTML><HEAD>
<META content=3D"text/html; charset=3Dutf-8" http-equiv=3DContent-Type>
<META name=3DGENERATOR content=3D"MSHTML 8.00.6001.23588">
<STYLE></STYLE>
</HEAD>
<BODY bgColor=3D#ffffff>
<DIV><FONT size=3D2>More like makes you think too much about what is =
going on=20
inside the car, rather than outside which is where your attention SHOULD =

be.</FONT></DIV>
<BLOCKQUOTE=20

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[email-masked]

--===============8670710379444375574==--

---

From: PaulHunt73 via Mgs <[email-masked]>
Date: Wed, 11 Mar 2020 08:46:37 -0000 xXjkPYbh+SyIgL5lWse2juiomZzBKP1gMTg6mywqAS6TIghVt9xwkRVZpTEE2kfbBIe6oad5Z9TTbQ==

--===============6974212095850997699==
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	charset="utf-8"
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Never mind 'considering', in the constant quest for a marketing angle =
they deliberately make theirs different to everybody else's.
  ----- Original Message -----=20
  ...  modern designers trained on onscreen apps feel they can reinvent =
the wheel at will without considering any of these factors.
------=_NextPart_000_0120_01D5F781.939D7770
	charset="utf-8"
Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable

=EF=BB=BF<!DOCTYPE HTML PUBLIC "-//W3C//DTD HTML 4.0 Transitional//EN">
<HTML><HEAD>
<META content=3D"text/html; charset=3Dutf-8" http-equiv=3DContent-Type>
<META name=3DGENERATOR content=3D"MSHTML 8.00.6001.23588">
<STYLE></STYLE>
</HEAD>
<BODY=20
style=3D"WORD-WRAP: break-word; -webkit-nbsp-mode: space; =
-webkit-line-break: after-white-space"=20
bgColor=3D#ffffff>
<DIV><FONT size=3D2>Never mind 'considering', in the constant quest for =
a=20
marketing angle they deliberately make theirs different to everybody=20
else's.</FONT></DIV>
<BLOCKQUOTE=20
style=3D"BORDER-LEFT: #000000 2px solid; PADDING-LEFT: 5px; =
PADDING-RIGHT: 0px; MARGIN-LEFT: 5px; MARGIN-RIGHT: 0px">
  <DIV style=3D"FONT: 10pt arial">----- Original Message ----- =
</DIV><FONT=20
  size=3D2>... </FONT>&nbsp;modern designers trained on onscreen apps =
feel they=20
  can reinvent the wheel at will without considering any of these=20
factors.</BLOCKQUOTE></BODY></HTML>

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[email-masked]

--===============6974212095850997699==--

---

From: PaulHunt73 via Mgs <[email-masked]>
Date: Wed, 11 Mar 2020 08:51:02 -0000 8UyGJmJZf9zWcvbJeNyY1RuSewPCk6JDSHu1CnHS/s8m0uw+fZIYk6Hk4sfwvz1u27h2qosewCWAyQ==

--===============0098306888719216315==
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I have had to tell my neighbour to stop their visitors parking on my =
drive!
  ----- Original Message -----=20

  The one thing I have not heard from you guys yet is "And you kids get =
off my lawn too!"
------=_NextPart_000_0183_01D5F782.319F99D0
	charset="utf-8"
Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable

=EF=BB=BF<!DOCTYPE HTML PUBLIC "-//W3C//DTD HTML 4.0 Transitional//EN">
<HTML><HEAD>
<META content=3D"text/html; charset=3Dutf-8" http-equiv=3DContent-Type>
<META name=3DGENERATOR content=3D"MSHTML 8.00.6001.23588">
<STYLE></STYLE>
</HEAD>
<BODY bgColor=3D#ffffff>
<DIV><FONT size=3D2>I have had to tell&nbsp;my neighbour to stop their =
visitors=20
parking on my drive!</FONT></DIV>
<BLOCKQUOTE=20
style=3D"BORDER-LEFT: #000000 2px solid; PADDING-LEFT: 5px; =
PADDING-RIGHT: 0px; MARGIN-LEFT: 5px; MARGIN-RIGHT: 0px">
  <DIV style=3D"FONT: 10pt arial">----- Original Message ----- </DIV>
  <DIV><FONT size=3D2></FONT><FONT size=3D2></FONT><BR></DIV>
  <DIV=20
  style=3D"FONT-FAMILY: times new roman, new york, times, serif; =
FONT-SIZE: 16px"=20
  class=3Dydp94a97bcdyahoo-style-wrap>
  <DIV></DIV>
  <DIV dir=3Dltr data-setdir=3D"false">The one thing I have not heard =
from you guys=20
  yet is "And you kids get off my lawn=20
too!"</DIV></DIV></BLOCKQUOTE></BODY></HTML>

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[email-masked]

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---

From: Robert's New iPad via Mgs <[email-masked]>
Date: Wed, 11 Mar 2020 07:19:26 -0400

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   Did their GPS-guided self-parking feature put them into your drive?
Bob

> On Mar 11, 2020, at 4:51 AM, PaulHunt73 via Mgs <[email-masked]> wrote=
:
>=20
> I have had to tell my neighbour to stop their visitors parking on my drive=
!
y lawn too!"

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<html><head><meta http-equiv="content-type" content="text/html; charset=utf-8"></head><body dir="auto"><div dir="ltr"></div><div dir="ltr">&nbsp; &nbsp;Did their GPS-guided self-parking feature put them into your drive?</div><div dir="ltr">Bob</div><div dir="ltr"><br></div><div dir="ltr"><br>On Mar 11, 2020, at 4:51 AM, PaulHunt73 via Mgs &lt;<a href="mailto:[email-masked]">[email-masked]</a>&gt; wrote:<br><br></div><blockquote type="cite"><div dir="ltr">

<meta content="text/html; charset=utf-8" http-equiv="Content-Type">
<meta name="GENERATOR" content="MSHTML 8.00.6001.23588">
<style></style>

<div><font size="2">I have had to tell&nbsp;my neighbour to stop their visitors 
parking on my drive!</font></div>
<blockquote style="BORDER-LEFT: #000000 2px solid; PADDING-LEFT: 5px; PADDING-RIGHT: 0px; MARGIN-LEFT: 5px; MARGIN-RIGHT: 0px">
  <div style="FONT: 10pt arial">----- Original Message ----- </div>
  <div><font size="2"></font><font size="2"></font><br></div>
  <div style="FONT-FAMILY: times new roman, new york, times, serif; FONT-SIZE: 16px" class="ydp94a97bcdyahoo-style-wrap">
  <div></div>
  <div dir="ltr" data-setdir="false">The one thing I have not heard from you guys 
  yet is "And you kids get off my lawn 
too!"</div></div></blockquote>
</div></blockquote><blockquote type="cite"><div dir="ltr"><span>_______________________________________________</span><br><span></span><br><span><a href="mailto:[email-masked]">[email-masked]</a></span><br><span>Donate: <a href="http://www.team.net/donate.html">http://www.team.net/donate.html</a></span><br><span>Suggested annual donation &nbsp;$12.75</span><br><span></span><br><span>Archive: <a href="http://www.team.net/pipermail/mgs">http://www.team.net/pipermail/mgs</a> <a href="http://autox.team.net/archive">http://autox.team.net/archive</a></span><br><span></span><br><span>Unsubscribe: <a href="http://autox.team.net/mailman/options/mgs/[email-masked]">http://autox.team.net/mailman/options/mgs/[email-masked]</a></span><br></div></blockquote></body></html>
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[email-masked]

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---

From: PaulHunt73 via Mgs <[email-masked]>
Date: Wed, 11 Mar 2020 11:35:11 -0000 IUVbfzXED/QnrYh1ValGARKtTbZJddeL+8RJjwp4v6WpJ6s325yspO9M

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Huh, they might have an excuse then.  No, they are ... although perhaps =
I'd better not say what demographic group they belong to.
  ----- Original Message -----=20
  From: Robert's New iPad=20
  To: PaulHunt73=20
  Cc: MGs ; Max Heim=20
  Sent: Wednesday, March 11, 2020 11:19 AM
  Subject: Re: [Mgs] Ridiculous new cars

  On Mar 11, 2020, at 4:51 AM, PaulHunt73 via Mgs <[email-masked]> =
wrote:

      The one thing I have not heard from you guys yet is "And you kids =
get off my lawn too!"
    _______________________________________________

    [email-masked]

    Unsubscribe: =
http://autox.team.net/mailman/options/mgs/[email-masked]

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<!DOCTYPE HTML PUBLIC "-//W3C//DTD HTML 4.0 Transitional//EN">
<HTML><HEAD>
<META content=3D"text/html; charset=3Diso-8859-1" =
http-equiv=3DContent-Type>
<META name=3DGENERATOR content=3D"MSHTML 8.00.6001.23588"></HEAD>
<BODY dir=3Dauto bgColor=3D#ffffff>
<DIV><FONT size=3D2>Huh, they might have an excuse then.&nbsp; No, they =
are ...=20
although perhaps I'd better not say what demographic group they belong=20
to.</FONT></DIV>
<BLOCKQUOTE=20
style=3D"BORDER-LEFT: #000000 2px solid; PADDING-LEFT: 5px; =
PADDING-RIGHT: 0px; MARGIN-LEFT: 5px; MARGIN-RIGHT: 0px"=20
dir=3Dltr>
  <DIV style=3D"FONT: 10pt arial">----- Original Message ----- </DIV>
  <DIV=20
  style=3D"FONT: 10pt arial; BACKGROUND: #e4e4e4; font-color: =
black"><B>From:</B>=20
  <A title=[email-masked] href=3D"mailto:[email-masked]">Robert's =
New iPad</A>=20
  </DIV>
  <DIV style=3D"FONT: 10pt arial"><B>To:</B> <A =
title=[email-masked]=20
  href=3D"mailto:[email-masked]">PaulHunt73</A> </DIV>
  <DIV style=3D"FONT: 10pt arial"><B>Cc:</B> <A =
title=[email-masked]=20
  href=3D"mailto:[email-masked]">MGs</A> ; <A =
title=[email-masked]=20
  href=3D"mailto:[email-masked]">Max Heim</A> </DIV>
  <DIV style=3D"FONT: 10pt arial"><B>Sent:</B> Wednesday, March 11, 2020 =
11:19=20
  AM</DIV>
  <DIV style=3D"FONT: 10pt arial"><B>Subject:</B> Re: [Mgs] Ridiculous =
new=20
  cars</DIV>
  <DIV><BR></DIV>
  <DIV dir=3Dltr></DIV>
  <DIV dir=3Dltr>&nbsp; &nbsp;Did their GPS-guided self-parking feature =
put them=20
  into your drive?</DIV>
  <DIV dir=3Dltr>Bob</DIV>
  <DIV dir=3Dltr><BR></DIV>
  <DIV dir=3Dltr><BR>On Mar 11, 2020, at 4:51 AM, PaulHunt73 via Mgs =
&lt;<A=20
  href=3D"mailto:[email-masked]">[email-masked]</A>&gt;=20
  wrote:<BR><BR></DIV>
  <BLOCKQUOTE type=3D"cite">
    <DIV dir=3Dltr>
    <META name=3DGENERATOR content=3D"MSHTML 8.00.6001.23588">
    <STYLE></STYLE>

    <DIV><FONT size=3D2>I have had to tell&nbsp;my neighbour to stop =
their=20
    visitors parking on my drive!</FONT></DIV>
    <BLOCKQUOTE=20
    style=3D"BORDER-LEFT: #000000 2px solid; PADDING-LEFT: 5px; =
PADDING-RIGHT: 0px; MARGIN-LEFT: 5px; MARGIN-RIGHT: 0px">
      <DIV style=3D"FONT: 10pt arial">----- Original Message ----- =
</DIV>
      <DIV><FONT size=3D2></FONT><FONT size=3D2></FONT><BR></DIV>
      <DIV=20
      style=3D"FONT-FAMILY: times new roman, new york, times, serif; =
FONT-SIZE: 16px"=20
      class=3Dydp94a97bcdyahoo-style-wrap>
      <DIV></DIV>
      <DIV dir=3Dltr data-setdir=3D"false">The one thing I have not =
heard from you=20
      guys yet is "And you kids get off my lawn=20
    too!"</DIV></DIV></BLOCKQUOTE></DIV></BLOCKQUOTE>
  <BLOCKQUOTE type=3D"cite">
    <DIV=20
    =
dir=3Dltr><SPAN>_______________________________________________</SPAN><BR=
><SPAN></SPAN><BR><SPAN><A=20
    =
href=3D"mailto:[email-masked]">[email-masked]</A></SPAN><BR><SPAN=
>Donate:=20
    <A=20
    =
href=3D"http://www.team.net/donate.html">http://www.team.net/donate.html<=
/A></SPAN><BR><SPAN>Suggested=20
    annual donation =
&nbsp;$12.75</SPAN><BR><SPAN></SPAN><BR><SPAN>Archive: <A=20
    =
href=3D"http://www.team.net/pipermail/mgs">http://www.team.net/pipermail/=
mgs</A>=20
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    =
href=3D"http://autox.team.net/archive">http://autox.team.net/archive</A><=
/SPAN><BR><SPAN></SPAN><BR><SPAN>Unsubscribe:=20
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    =
href=3D"http://autox.team.net/mailman/options/mgs/[email-masked]">http:=
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