Subject: Re: [Fot] TR4 transmission

From: Robert Lang via Fot <[email-masked]>
Date: Tue, 18 Jun 2019 14:24:51 +0000 (UTC)

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 Hi,
Those are THE questions, aren't they?
Okay - Quaife has a straight-cut gear set that uses dog-rings, no synchros.=
 Big $$$, 1600 UK pounds. Quaife just ran off a set and the one source that=
 I know of in the UK can get them:
Dennis Vessey - Quaife gear kits for Triumph TRs

|=20
|=20
|=20
|  |  |

 |

 |
|=20
|  |=20
Dennis Vessey - Quaife gear kits for Triumph TRs

metatags generator

Vesseys Triumph TR Dog-Engagement Gear Kit - developed with Quaife
 |

 |

 |

Note, if you decide to go that route, please contact me, I've been in conta=
ct with the vendor and I'm trying to place an order for this gearset. Maybe=
 we can save some shipping if we get a couple of sets.
Note too that Bastuck has dog box gear sets including one using the J-type =
overdrive. When I contacted them last fall, they had none in stock and ther=
e was no production scheduled.

Failing that option, there's the "Dolomite Close Ratio Gearset". This consi=
sts of a different input shaft and main 3rd gear along with the correspondi=
ng layshaft gears. You need to work the case to get these to pit, but they =
work great. These are helical gears. I've used this setup for around 20 yea=
rs, and it is really really good. Note: for the best total gear ratio optio=
n, get a later TR6 gearbox with the 16-tooth 1st laygear.

Now, the drawback to the helical gears is apparently excessive thrust force=
s and they effect the layshaft thrust washers as well as the layshaft needl=
e bearings. If you make torque and you have any end float for the layshaft,=
 you will spin the thrust washers and wreck the case. There are some workar=
ounds to compensate for excessive end float.
Note too that because of torque multiplication, the layshaft needle bearing=
s on the 1st gear end of the layshaft get beat really, really hard. One fix=
 is to install a double bearing on the layshaft (or buy a new one from Moss=
 or another source) that is set up for the double bearing. I've had Quantum=
 Mechanics install the double bearings, they seem to work better than the s=
tock setup. But even with that setup, the layshaft still gets pounded and y=
ou need to keep an eye on it.
As you may know, a lot of the racers are gravitating away from the stock an=
d/or modified Triumph gearboxes mostly because the quality consistency of r=
eplacement parts is all over the place and you need to know what you're get=
ting to spot the differences. That said, frequent oil changes and paying at=
tention to the detritus in the oil, you can stay ahead of problems.
If you're going to build a good gearbox, it will cost you as much or more t=
han some of the conversions out there, hence a lot of folks switch to Toyot=
a/T5/Rocket, etc.
Hopefully you'll get other good advice on this list, but that's where I'm a=
t right now (too). The Quaife gearset in the TR gearbox seems like the most=
 "vintage" solution, but ALL of the options have pluses and minuses. In the=
 spirit of full transparency, I'm also looking at Super T10 transmissions w=
hich are the same as the old Muncie "Rock Crusher" and there is a gearset a=
vailable with a 2.43 1st, 1.63 2nd, 1.23 3rd and 1 4th which is pretty clos=
e to the Dolomite Sprint setup. And the gearbox is 70 pounds which is reall=
y close to the stock box. Also, if you want to dish out more $$$, Gear Vend=
ors has an overdrive that bolts to the T-10, I haven't researched that enou=
gh to see if there are any particulars, but it is an option, albeit around =
$3k. But you get a BRAND NEW overdrive. Just sayin. A drawback to the Super=
 T10 is that you will need to make or source a bell housing, but that is do=
-able with a combo of a trashed TR gearbox, a competent machinist and more =
$$$. ;-)

Regards,Bob Lang339-927-4489

    On Tuesday, June 18, 2019, 9:02:31 AM EDT, Mike Deweerd via Fot <fot@au=
tox.team.net> wrote: =20
=20
 Amici=20
What is the preferred gearbox for the TR4 non overdrive and where is the be=
st source for getting such
I=E2=80=99m looking at the pros and cons of the straight cut gear set vs th=
e close ratio gear set (I=E2=80=99m assuming the close ratio is still helic=
al gears)=20
Please chime in with preferences and opinions=20
Cheers=20
Mike Deweerd #77

Sent from my iPhone
_______________________________________________
[email-masked]

http://www.fot-racing.com

Archive: http://autox.team.net/archive http://www.team.net/pipermail/fot
@yahoo.com

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dy><div class=3D"ydp435d1f9fyahoo-style-wrap" style=3D"font-family:Helvetic=
a Neue, Helvetica, Arial, sans-serif;font-size:13px;"><div></div>
        <div>Hi,</div><div><br></div><div>Those are THE questions, aren't t=
hey?</div><div><br></div><div>Okay - Quaife has a straight-cut gear set tha=
t uses dog-rings, no synchros. Big $$$, 1600 UK pounds. Quaife just ran off=
 a set and the one source that I know of in the UK can get them:</div><div>=
<br></div><div><a href=3D"http://www.vessey-classic-car-services.co.uk/triu=
mph-gear-kit.htm#.XQjuu3t7n64" rel=3D"nofollow" target=3D"_blank" class=3D"=
enhancr_card_1791886968">Dennis Vessey - Quaife gear kits for Triumph TRs</=
a></div><div><br></div><div id=3D"ydpd666f494enhancr_card_1791886968" class=
=3D"ydpd666f494yahoo-link-enhancr-card ydpd666f494ymail-preserve-class ydpd=
666f494ymail-preserve-style" style=3D"max-width:400px;font-family:Helvetica=
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=3D"YENHANCER" data-size=3D"MEDIUM" contenteditable=3D"false"><a href=3D"ht=
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" style=3D"background-color: rgb(255, 255, 255); background-repeat: repeat;=
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to; position: relative; z-index: 2; width: 100%; max-width: 400px; border-r=
adius: 0px 0px 2px 2px; border-top: 1px solid rgb(224, 228, 233);" cellspac=
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yle=3D"background-color:#ffffff;padding:16px 0 16px 12px;vertical-align:top=
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2px 24px 16px 12px;width:99%;font-family:Helvetica Neue, Segoe UI, Helvetic=
a, Arial, sans-serif;border-radius:0 0 2px 0"><h2 class=3D"ydpd666f494card-=
title" style=3D"font-size: 14px; line-height: 19px; margin: 0px 0px 6px; fo=
nt-family: Helvetica Neue, Segoe UI, Helvetica, Arial, sans-serif; color: r=
gb(38, 40, 42);">Dennis Vessey - Quaife gear kits for Triumph TRs</h2><p cl=
ass=3D"ydpd666f494card-richinfo-primary" style=3D"font-size:12px;line-heigh=
t:16px;margin:0 0 4px 0;color:#979ba7">metatags generator</p><p class=3D"yd=
pd666f494card-description" style=3D"font-size: 12px; line-height: 16px; mar=
gin: 0px; color: rgb(151, 155, 167);">Vesseys Triumph TR Dog-Engagement Gea=
r Kit - developed with Quaife</p></td></tr></tbody></table></td></tr></tbod=
y></table></td></tr></tbody></table></a></div><div><br></div><div><br></div=
><div><br></div><div>Note, if you decide to go that route, please contact m=
e, I've been in contact with the vendor and I'm trying to place an order fo=
r this gearset. Maybe we can save some shipping if we get a couple of sets.=
</div><div><br></div><div>Note too that Bastuck has dog box gear sets inclu=
ding one using the J-type overdrive. When I contacted them last fall, they =
had none in stock and there was no production scheduled.<br></div><div><br>=
</div><div>Failing that option, there's the "Dolomite Close Ratio Gearset".=
 This consists of a different input shaft and main 3rd gear along with the =
corresponding layshaft gears. You need to work the case to get these to pit=
, but they work great. These are helical gears. I've used this setup for ar=
ound 20 years, and it is really really good. Note: for the best total gear =
ratio option, get a later TR6 gearbox with the 16-tooth 1st laygear.<br></d=
iv><div><br></div><div>Now, the drawback to the helical gears is apparently=
 excessive thrust forces and they effect the layshaft thrust washers as wel=
l as the layshaft needle bearings. If you make torque and you have any end =
float for the layshaft, you will spin the thrust washers and wreck the case=
. There are some workarounds to compensate for excessive end float.</div><d=
iv><br></div><div>Note too that because of torque multiplication, the laysh=
aft needle bearings on the 1st gear end of the layshaft get beat really, re=
ally hard. One fix is to install a double bearing on the layshaft (or buy a=
 new one from Moss or another source) that is set up for the double bearing=
. I've had Quantum Mechanics install the double bearings, they seem to work=
 better than the stock setup. But even with that setup, the layshaft still =
gets pounded and you need to keep an eye on it.</div><div><br></div><div>As=
 you may know, a lot of the racers are gravitating away from the stock and/=
or modified Triumph gearboxes mostly because the quality consistency of rep=
lacement parts is all over the place and you need to know what you're getti=
ng to spot the differences. That said, frequent oil changes and paying atte=
ntion to the detritus in the oil, you can stay ahead of problems.</div><div=
><br></div><div>If you're going to build a good gearbox, it will cost you a=
s much or more than some of the conversions out there, hence a lot of folks=
 switch to Toyota/T5/Rocket, etc.</div><div><br></div><div>Hopefully you'll=
 get other good advice on this list, but that's where I'm at right now (too=
). The Quaife gearset in the TR gearbox seems like the most "vintage" solut=
ion, but ALL of the options have pluses and minuses. In the spirit of full =
transparency, I'm also looking at Super T10 transmissions which are the sam=
e as the old Muncie "Rock Crusher" and there is a gearset available with a =
2.43 1st, 1.63 2nd, 1.23 3rd and 1 4th which is pretty close to the Dolomit=
e Sprint setup. And the gearbox is 70 pounds which is really close to the s=
tock box. Also, if you want to dish out more $$$, Gear Vendors has an overd=
rive that bolts to the T-10, I haven't researched that enough to see if the=
re are any particulars, but it is an option, albeit around $3k. But you get=
 a BRAND NEW overdrive. Just sayin. A drawback to the Super T10 is that you=
 will need to make or source a bell housing, but that is do-able with a com=
bo of a trashed TR gearbox, a competent machinist and more $$$. ;-)<br></di=
v><div><br></div><div>Regards,</div><div>Bob Lang</div><div>339-927-4489<br=
></div><div><br></div>
       =20
        </div><div id=3D"ydpe091f580yahoo_quoted_1530796332" class=3D"ydpe0=
91f580yahoo_quoted">
            <div style=3D"font-family:'Helvetica Neue', Helvetica, Arial, s=
ans-serif;font-size:13px;color:#26282a;">
               =20
                <div>
                    On Tuesday, June 18, 2019, 9:02:31 AM EDT, Mike Deweerd=
 via Fot &lt;[email-masked]&gt; wrote:
                </div>
                <div><br></div>
                <div><br></div>
                <div><div dir=3D"ltr">Amici <br></div><div dir=3D"ltr">What=
 is the preferred gearbox for the TR4 non overdrive and where is the best s=
ource for getting such<br></div><div dir=3D"ltr">I=E2=80=99m looking at the=
 pros and cons of the straight cut gear set vs the close ratio gear set (I=
=E2=80=99m assuming the close ratio is still helical gears) <br></div><div =
dir=3D"ltr">Please chime in with preferences and opinions <br></div><div di=
r=3D"ltr">Cheers <br></div><div dir=3D"ltr">Mike Deweerd #77<br></div><div =
dir=3D"ltr"><br></div><div dir=3D"ltr"><br></div><div dir=3D"ltr"><br></div=
><div dir=3D"ltr">Sent from my iPhone<br></div><div dir=3D"ltr">___________=
____________________________________<br></div><div dir=3D"ltr"><a href=3D"m=
ailto:[email-masked]" rel=3D"nofollow" target=3D"_blank">[email-masked]=
.net</a><br></div><div dir=3D"ltr"><br></div><div dir=3D"ltr"><a href=3D"ht=
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From: Tony Drews via Fot <[email-masked]>
Date: Tue, 18 Jun 2019 11:19:28 -0500

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Nice summary!  I don't have much to add other than the Quaife gearset 
uses substantial needle bearings inside each of the gears, much larger 
input to mainshaft needle bearing, steel thrust washers within the 
stack.  Work of art.  Layshaft still uses semi-stock bearings.

When I blew up my tranny I ended up going with the Quaife and really 
like it.  No synchros to break, shifts are lightning quick, gear ratios 
work well.

Cheers, Tony Drews

On 6/18/2019 9:24 AM, Robert Lang via Fot wrote:
> Okay - Quaife has a straight-cut gear set that uses dog-rings, no 
> synchros. Big $$$, 1600 UK pounds. Quaife just ran off a set and the 
> one source that I know of in the UK can get them:
>
> <http://www.vessey-classic-car-services.co.uk/triumph-gear-kit.htm#.XQjuu3t7n64>
>
>
> 	
>
>
> 	
>
>
> <http://www.vessey-classic-car-services.co.uk/triumph-gear-kit.htm#.XQjuu3t7n64>
>
>
>
> Note, if you decide to go that route, please contact me, I've been in 
> contact with the vendor and I'm trying to place an order for this 
> gearset. Maybe we can save some shipping if we get a couple of sets.
>
> Note too that Bastuck has dog box gear sets including one using the 
> J-type overdrive. When I contacted them last fall, they had none in 
> stock and there was no production scheduled.
>
> Failing that option, there's the "Dolomite Close Ratio Gearset". This 
> consists of a different input shaft and main 3rd gear along with the 
> corresponding layshaft gears. You need to work the case to get these 
> to pit, but they work great. These are helical gears. I've used this 
> setup for around 20 years, and it is really really good. Note: for the 
> best total gear ratio option, get a later TR6 gearbox with the 
> 16-tooth 1st laygear.
>
> Now, the drawback to the helical gears is apparently excessive thrust 
> forces and they effect the layshaft thrust washers as well as the 
> layshaft needle bearings. If you make torque and you have any end 
> float for the layshaft, you will spin the thrust washers and wreck the 
> case. There are some workarounds to compensate for excessive end float.
>
> Note too that because of torque multiplication, the layshaft needle 
> bearings on the 1st gear end of the layshaft get beat really, really 
> hard. One fix is to install a double bearing on the layshaft (or buy a 
> new one from Moss or another source) that is set up for the double 
> bearing. I've had Quantum Mechanics install the double bearings, they 
> seem to work better than the stock setup. But even with that setup, 
> the layshaft still gets pounded and you need to keep an eye on it.
>
> As you may know, a lot of the racers are gravitating away from the 
> stock and/or modified Triumph gearboxes mostly because the quality 
> consistency of replacement parts is all over the place and you need to 
> know what you're getting to spot the differences. That said, frequent 
> oil changes and paying attention to the detritus in the oil, you can 
> stay ahead of problems.
>
> If you're going to build a good gearbox, it will cost you as much or 
> more than some of the conversions out there, hence a lot of folks 
> switch to Toyota/T5/Rocket, etc.
>
> Hopefully you'll get other good advice on this list, but that's where 
> I'm at right now (too). The Quaife gearset in the TR gearbox seems 
> like the most "vintage" solution, but ALL of the options have pluses 
> and minuses. In the spirit of full transparency, I'm also looking at 
> Super T10 transmissions which are the same as the old Muncie "Rock 
> Crusher" and there is a gearset available with a 2.43 1st, 1.63 2nd, 
> 1.23 3rd and 1 4th which is pretty close to the Dolomite Sprint setup. 
> And the gearbox is 70 pounds which is really close to the stock box. 
> Also, if you want to dish out more $$$, Gear Vendors has an overdrive 
> that bolts to the T-10, I haven't researched that enough to see if 
> there are any particulars, but it is an option, albeit around $3k. But 
> you get a BRAND NEW overdrive. Just sayin. A drawback to the Super T10 
> is that you will need to make or source a bell housing, but that is 
> do-able with a combo of a trashed TR gearbox, a competent machinist 
> and more $$$. ;-)
>
> Regards,
> Bob Lang
> 339-927-4489
>
> On Tuesday, June 18, 2019, 9:02:31 AM EDT, Mike Deweerd via Fot 
> <[email-masked]> wrote:
>
>
> Amici
> What is the preferred gearbox for the TR4 non overdrive and where is 
> the best source for getting such
> I’m looking at the pros and cons of the straight cut gear set vs the 
> close ratio gear set (I’m assuming the close ratio is still helical 
> gears)
> Please chime in with preferences and opinions
> Cheers
> Mike Deweerd #77
>
>
>
> Sent from my iPhone
> Donate: http://www.team.net/donate.html
> Archive: http://autox.team.net/archive <http://autox.team.net/archive 
> >http://www.team.net/pipermail/fot
> Unsubscribe/Manage: 
> http://autox.team.net/mailman/options/fot/[email-masked]
>
>
>
> Donate: http://www.team.net/donate.html
> Unsubscribe/Manage: http://autox.team.net/mailman/options/fot/[email-masked]
>
>

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    <p>Nice summary!  I don't have much to add other than the Quaife
      gearset uses substantial needle bearings inside each of the gears,
      much larger input to mainshaft needle bearing, steel thrust
      washers within the stack.  Work of art.  Layshaft still uses
      semi-stock bearings.</p>
    <p>When I blew up my tranny I ended up going with the Quaife and
      really like it.  No synchros to break, shifts are lightning quick,
      gear ratios work well.</p>
    <p>Cheers, Tony Drews<br>
    </p>
    <div class="moz-cite-prefix">On 6/18/2019 9:24 AM, Robert Lang via
      Fot wrote:<br>
    </div>
    <blockquote type="cite"
      cite="mid:[email-masked]">
      <meta http-equiv="content-type" content="text/html; charset=UTF-8">
      <!--[if gte mso 9]><xml><o:OfficeDocumentSettings><o:AllowPNG/><o:PixelsPerInch>96</o:PixelsPerInch></o:OfficeDocumentSettings></xml><![endif]-->
      <div class="ydp435d1f9fyahoo-style-wrap"
        style="font-family:Helvetica Neue, Helvetica, Arial,
        sans-serif;font-size:13px;">
        <div>Hi,</div>
        <div><br>
        </div>
        <div>Those are THE questions, aren't they?</div>
        <div><br>
        </div>
        <div>Okay - Quaife has a straight-cut gear set that uses
          dog-rings, no synchros. Big $$$, 1600 UK pounds. Quaife just
          ran off a set and the one source that I know of in the UK can
          get them:</div>
        <div><br>
        </div>
        <div><a
href="http://www.vessey-classic-car-services.co.uk/triumph-gear-kit.htm#.XQjuu3t7n64"
            rel="nofollow" target="_blank"
            class="enhancr_card_1791886968" moz-do-not-send="true">Dennis
            Vessey - Quaife gear kits for Triumph TRs</a></div>
        <div><br>
        </div>
        <div id="ydpd666f494enhancr_card_1791886968"
          class="ydpd666f494yahoo-link-enhancr-card
          ydpd666f494ymail-preserve-class
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          data-type="YENHANCER" data-size="MEDIUM"
          contenteditable="false"><a
href="http://www.vessey-classic-car-services.co.uk/triumph-gear-kit.htm#.XQjuu3t7n64"
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                              align="center">
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                                    style="background-color:#ffffff;padding:16px
                                    0 16px
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                                    style="vertical-align:middle;padding:12px
                                    24px 16px
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                                    Neue, Segoe UI, Helvetica, Arial,
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                                      6px; font-family: Helvetica Neue,
                                      Segoe UI, Helvetica, Arial,
                                      sans-serif; color: rgb(38, 40,
                                      42);">Dennis Vessey - Quaife gear
                                      kits for Triumph TRs</h2>
                                    <p
                                      class="ydpd666f494card-richinfo-primary"
style="font-size:12px;line-height:16px;margin:0 0 4px 0;color:#979ba7">metatags
                                      generator</p>
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                                      class="ydpd666f494card-description"
                                      style="font-size: 12px;
                                      line-height: 16px; margin: 0px;
                                      color: rgb(151, 155, 167);">Vesseys
                                      Triumph TR Dog-Engagement Gear Kit
                                      - developed with Quaife</p>
                                  </td>
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          </a></div>
        <div><br>
        </div>
        <div><br>
        </div>
        <div><br>
        </div>
        <div>Note, if you decide to go that route, please contact me,
          I've been in contact with the vendor and I'm trying to place
          an order for this gearset. Maybe we can save some shipping if
          we get a couple of sets.</div>
        <div><br>
        </div>
        <div>Note too that Bastuck has dog box gear sets including one
          using the J-type overdrive. When I contacted them last fall,
          they had none in stock and there was no production scheduled.<br>
        </div>
        <div><br>
        </div>
        <div>Failing that option, there's the "Dolomite Close Ratio
          Gearset". This consists of a different input shaft and main
          3rd gear along with the corresponding layshaft gears. You need
          to work the case to get these to pit, but they work great.
          These are helical gears. I've used this setup for around 20
          years, and it is really really good. Note: for the best total
          gear ratio option, get a later TR6 gearbox with the 16-tooth
          1st laygear.<br>
        </div>
        <div><br>
        </div>
        <div>Now, the drawback to the helical gears is apparently
          excessive thrust forces and they effect the layshaft thrust
          washers as well as the layshaft needle bearings. If you make
          torque and you have any end float for the layshaft, you will
          spin the thrust washers and wreck the case. There are some
          workarounds to compensate for excessive end float.</div>
        <div><br>
        </div>
        <div>Note too that because of torque multiplication, the
          layshaft needle bearings on the 1st gear end of the layshaft
          get beat really, really hard. One fix is to install a double
          bearing on the layshaft (or buy a new one from Moss or another
          source) that is set up for the double bearing. I've had
          Quantum Mechanics install the double bearings, they seem to
          work better than the stock setup. But even with that setup,
          the layshaft still gets pounded and you need to keep an eye on
          it.</div>
        <div><br>
        </div>
        <div>As you may know, a lot of the racers are gravitating away
          from the stock and/or modified Triumph gearboxes mostly
          because the quality consistency of replacement parts is all
          over the place and you need to know what you're getting to
          spot the differences. That said, frequent oil changes and
          paying attention to the detritus in the oil, you can stay
          ahead of problems.</div>
        <div><br>
        </div>
        <div>If you're going to build a good gearbox, it will cost you
          as much or more than some of the conversions out there, hence
          a lot of folks switch to Toyota/T5/Rocket, etc.</div>
        <div><br>
        </div>
        <div>Hopefully you'll get other good advice on this list, but
          that's where I'm at right now (too). The Quaife gearset in the
          TR gearbox seems like the most "vintage" solution, but ALL of
          the options have pluses and minuses. In the spirit of full
          transparency, I'm also looking at Super T10 transmissions
          which are the same as the old Muncie "Rock Crusher" and there
          is a gearset available with a 2.43 1st, 1.63 2nd, 1.23 3rd and
          1 4th which is pretty close to the Dolomite Sprint setup. And
          the gearbox is 70 pounds which is really close to the stock
          box. Also, if you want to dish out more $$$, Gear Vendors has
          an overdrive that bolts to the T-10, I haven't researched that
          enough to see if there are any particulars, but it is an
          option, albeit around $3k. But you get a BRAND NEW overdrive.
          Just sayin. A drawback to the Super T10 is that you will need
          to make or source a bell housing, but that is do-able with a
          combo of a trashed TR gearbox, a competent machinist and more
          $$$. ;-)<br>
        </div>
        <div><br>
        </div>
        <div>Regards,</div>
        <div>Bob Lang</div>
        <div>339-927-4489<br>
        </div>
        <div><br>
        </div>
      </div>
      <div id="ydpe091f580yahoo_quoted_1530796332"
        class="ydpe091f580yahoo_quoted">
        <div style="font-family:'Helvetica Neue', Helvetica, Arial,
          sans-serif;font-size:13px;color:#26282a;">
          <div> On Tuesday, June 18, 2019, 9:02:31 AM EDT, Mike Deweerd
            via Fot <a class="moz-txt-link-rfc2396E" href="mailto:[email-masked]">&lt;[email-masked]&gt;</a> wrote: </div>
          <div><br>
          </div>
          <div><br>
          </div>
          <div>
            <div dir="ltr">Amici <br>
            </div>
            <div dir="ltr">What is the preferred gearbox for the TR4 non
              overdrive and where is the best source for getting such<br>
            </div>
            <div dir="ltr">I’m looking at the pros and cons of the
              straight cut gear set vs the close ratio gear set (I’m
              assuming the close ratio is still helical gears) <br>
            </div>
            <div dir="ltr">Please chime in with preferences and opinions
              <br>
            </div>
            <div dir="ltr">Cheers <br>
            </div>
            <div dir="ltr">Mike Deweerd #77<br>
            </div>
            <div dir="ltr"><br>
            </div>
            <div dir="ltr"><br>
            </div>
            <div dir="ltr"><br>
            </div>
            <div dir="ltr">Sent from my iPhone<br>
            </div>
            <div dir="ltr">_______________________________________________<br>
            </div>
            <div dir="ltr"><a href="mailto:[email-masked]"
                rel="nofollow" target="_blank" moz-do-not-send="true">[email-masked]</a><br>
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      <fieldset class="mimeAttachmentHeader"></fieldset>
      <pre class="moz-quote-pre" wrap="">_______________________________________________
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From: Tony and Annie Garmey via Fot <[email-masked]>
Date: Tue, 18 Jun 2019 16:54:23 +0000

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---

From: Bob Kramer via Fot <[email-masked]>
Date: Tue, 18 Jun 2019 11:56:09 -0500

--===============4309914567944132288==

--00000000000004b327058b9c03b3
Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable

This email is a keeper. Nice job!.  I would add that for those of use that
have the spare later TR6 trannies to work with, the Dolomite gear sets are
a bargain priced solution.  I built one for the Ex-Lemons/Chump Beanito's
TR6  with a J-type overdrive that everyone loved at COTA.

Bob Kramer

On Tue, Jun 18, 2019 at 9:25 AM Robert Lang via Fot <[email-masked]>
wrote:

> synchros. Big $$$, 1600 UK pounds. Quaife just ran off a set and the one
> source that I know of in the UK can get them:
>
> <http://www.vessey-classic-car-services.co.uk/triumph-gear-kit.htm#.XQjuu=
3t7n64>
> <http://www.vessey-classic-car-services.co.uk/triumph-gear-kit.htm#.XQjuu=
3t7n64>
> contact with the vendor and I'm trying to place an order for this gearset=
.
> Maybe we can save some shipping if we get a couple of sets.
>
> Note too that Bastuck has dog box gear sets including one using the J-typ=
e
> overdrive. When I contacted them last fall, they had none in stock and
> there was no production scheduled.
>
> corresponding layshaft gears. You need to work the case to get these to
> pit, but they work great. These are helical gears. I've used this setup f=
or
> around 20 years, and it is really really good. Note: for the best total
> gear ratio option, get a later TR6 gearbox with the 16-tooth 1st laygear.
>
> forces and they effect the layshaft thrust washers as well as the layshaf=
t
> needle bearings. If you make torque and you have any end float for the
> layshaft, you will spin the thrust washers and wreck the case. There are
> some workarounds to compensate for excessive end float.
>
> bearings on the 1st gear end of the layshaft get beat really, really hard=
.
> One fix is to install a double bearing on the layshaft (or buy a new one
> from Moss or another source) that is set up for the double bearing. I've
> had Quantum Mechanics install the double bearings, they seem to work bett=
er
> than the stock setup. But even with that setup, the layshaft still gets
> pounded and you need to keep an eye on it.
>
> As you may know, a lot of the racers are gravitating away from the stock
> and/or modified Triumph gearboxes mostly because the quality consistency =
of
> replacement parts is all over the place and you need to know what you're
> getting to spot the differences. That said, frequent oil changes and payi=
ng
> attention to the detritus in the oil, you can stay ahead of problems.
>
> If you're going to build a good gearbox, it will cost you as much or more
> than some of the conversions out there, hence a lot of folks switch to
> Toyota/T5/Rocket, etc.
>
> Hopefully you'll get other good advice on this list, but that's where I'm
> at right now (too). The Quaife gearset in the TR gearbox seems like the
> most "vintage" solution, but ALL of the options have pluses and minuses. =
In
> the spirit of full transparency, I'm also looking at Super T10
> transmissions which are the same as the old Muncie "Rock Crusher" and the=
re
> is a gearset available with a 2.43 1st, 1.63 2nd, 1.23 3rd and 1 4th whic=
h
> is pretty close to the Dolomite Sprint setup. And the gearbox is 70 pound=
s
> which is really close to the stock box. Also, if you want to dish out mor=
e
> $$$, Gear Vendors has an overdrive that bolts to the T-10, I haven't
> researched that enough to see if there are any particulars, but it is an
> option, albeit around $3k. But you get a BRAND NEW overdrive. Just sayin.=
 A
> drawback to the Super T10 is that you will need to make or source a bell
> housing, but that is do-able with a combo of a trashed TR gearbox, a
> competent machinist and more $$$. ;-)
>
> Regards,
> Bob Lang
> 339-927-4489
>
> On Tuesday, June 18, 2019, 9:02:31 AM EDT, Mike Deweerd via Fot <
> [email-masked]> wrote:
>
>
> Amici
> What is the preferred gearbox for the TR4 non overdrive and where is the
> best source for getting such
> I=E2=80=99m looking at the pros and cons of the straight cut gear set vs =
the close
> ratio gear set (I=E2=80=99m assuming the close ratio is still helical gea=
rs)
> Unsubscribe/Manage <http://www.team.net/pipermail/fotUnsubscribe/Manage>:
> http://autox.team.net/mailman/options/fot/[email-masked]
>
>
>

--00000000000004b327058b9c03b3
Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable

<div dir=3D"ltr">This email is a keeper. Nice job!.=C2=A0 I would add that =
for those of use that have the spare later TR6 trannies to work with, the D=
olomite gear sets are a bargain priced solution.=C2=A0 I built one for the =
Ex-Lemons/Chump Beanito&#39;s TR6=C2=A0 with a J-type overdrive that everyo=
ne loved at COTA.=C2=A0<div><div><br clear=3D"all"><div><div dir=3D"ltr" cl=
ass=3D"gmail_signature" data-smartmail=3D"gmail_signature"><div dir=3D"ltr"=
>Bob Kramer</div></div></div><br></div></div></div><br><div class=3D"gmail_=
quote"><div dir=3D"ltr" class=3D"gmail_attr">On Tue, Jun 18, 2019 at 9:25 A=
M Robert Lang via Fot &lt;<a href=3D"mailto:[email-masked]">[email-masked]=
eam.net</a>&gt; wrote:<br></div><blockquote class=3D"gmail_quote" style=3D"=
margin:0px 0px 0px 0.8ex;border-left:1px solid rgb(204,204,204);padding-lef=
t:1ex"><div><div class=3D"gmail-m_-1553580064239954844ydp435d1f9fyahoo-styl=
e-wrap" style=3D"font-family:&quot;Helvetica Neue&quot;,Helvetica,Arial,san=
s-serif;font-size:13px"><div></div>
        <div>Hi,</div><div><br></div><div>Those are THE questions, aren&#39=
;t they?</div><div><br></div><div>Okay - Quaife has a straight-cut gear set=
 that uses dog-rings, no synchros. Big $$$, 1600 UK pounds. Quaife just ran=
 off a set and the one source that I know of in the UK can get them:</div><=
div><br></div><div><a href=3D"http://www.vessey-classic-car-services.co.uk/=
triumph-gear-kit.htm#.XQjuu3t7n64" rel=3D"nofollow" class=3D"gmail-m_-15535=
80064239954844enhancr_card_1791886968" target=3D"_blank">Dennis Vessey - Qu=
aife gear kits for Triumph TRs</a></div><div><br></div><div id=3D"gmail-m_-=
1553580064239954844ydpd666f494enhancr_card_1791886968" class=3D"gmail-m_-15=
53580064239954844ydpd666f494yahoo-link-enhancr-card gmail-m_-15535800642399=
54844ydpd666f494ymail-preserve-class gmail-m_-1553580064239954844ydpd666f49=
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p://www.vessey-classic-car-services.co.uk/triumph-gear-kit.htm#.XQjuu3t7n64=
" style=3D"text-decoration:none;color:rgb(0,0,0)" class=3D"gmail-m_-1553580=
064239954844ydpd666f494yahoo-enhancr-cardlink" rel=3D"nofollow" target=3D"_=
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th:400px" cellspacing=3D"0" cellpadding=3D"0" border=3D"0"><tbody><tr><td w=
idth=3D"400"><table class=3D"gmail-m_-1553580064239954844ydpd666f494card gm=
ail-m_-1553580064239954844ydpd666f494yahoo-ignore-table" style=3D"max-width=
:400px;border-width:1px;border-style:solid;border-color:rgb(224,228,233);bo=
rder-radius:2px" width=3D"100%" cellspacing=3D"0" cellpadding=3D"0" border=
=3D"0"><tbody><tr><td class=3D"gmail-m_-1553580064239954844ydpd666f494card-=
primary-image-cell" style=3D"background-color:rgb(0,0,0);background-repeat:=
no-repeat;background-size:cover;border-radius:2px 2px 0px 0px;min-height:17=
5px" valign=3D"top" height=3D"175" bgcolor=3D"#000000"><table class=3D"gmai=
l-m_-1553580064239954844ydpd666f494card-overlay-container-table gmail-m_-15=
53580064239954844ydpd666f494yahoo-ignore-table" style=3D"width:100%" cellsp=
acing=3D"0" cellpadding=3D"0" border=3D"0"><tbody><tr><td class=3D"gmail-m_=
-1553580064239954844ydpd666f494card-overlay-cell" style=3D"background-color=
:transparent;border-radius:2px 2px 0px 0px;min-height:175px" valign=3D"top"=
 bgcolor=3D"transparent"><table class=3D"gmail-m_-1553580064239954844ydpd66=
6f494yahoo-ignore-table" style=3D"width:100%;min-height:175px" height=3D"17=
5" border=3D"0"><tbody><tr><td class=3D"gmail-m_-1553580064239954844ydpd666=
f494card-richInfo2" style=3D"text-align:left;padding:15px 0px 0px 15px;vert=
ical-align:top"></td><td class=3D"gmail-m_-1553580064239954844ydpd666f494ca=
rd-actions" style=3D"text-align:right;padding:15px 15px 0px 0px;vertical-al=
ign:top"><div class=3D"gmail-m_-1553580064239954844ydpd666f494card-share-co=
ntainer"></div></td></tr></tbody></table></td></tr></tbody></table></td></t=
r><tr><td><table class=3D"gmail-m_-1553580064239954844ydpd666f494card-info =
gmail-m_-1553580064239954844ydpd666f494yahoo-ignore-table" style=3D"backgro=
und-color:rgb(255,255,255);background-repeat:repeat;background-image:none;b=
ackground-size:auto;width:100%;max-width:400px;border-radius:0px 0px 2px 2p=
x;border-top:1px solid rgb(224,228,233)" cellspacing=3D"0" cellpadding=3D"0=
" border=3D"0" align=3D"center"><tbody><tr><td style=3D"background-color:rg=
b(255,255,255);padding:16px 0px 16px 12px;vertical-align:top;border-radius:=
0px 0px 0px 2px"></td><td style=3D"vertical-align:middle;padding:12px 24px =
16px 12px;width:99%;font-family:&quot;Helvetica Neue&quot;,&quot;Segoe UI&q=
uot;,Helvetica,Arial,sans-serif;border-radius:0px 0px 2px"><h2 class=3D"gma=
il-m_-1553580064239954844ydpd666f494card-title" style=3D"font-size:14px;lin=
e-height:19px;margin:0px 0px 6px;font-family:&quot;Helvetica Neue&quot;,&qu=
ot;Segoe UI&quot;,Helvetica,Arial,sans-serif;color:rgb(38,40,42)">Dennis Ve=
ssey - Quaife gear kits for Triumph TRs</h2><p class=3D"gmail-m_-1553580064=
239954844ydpd666f494card-richinfo-primary" style=3D"font-size:12px;line-hei=
ght:16px;margin:0px 0px 4px;color:rgb(151,155,167)">metatags generator</p><=
p class=3D"gmail-m_-1553580064239954844ydpd666f494card-description" style=
=3D"font-size:12px;line-height:16px;margin:0px;color:rgb(151,155,167)">Vess=
eys Triumph TR Dog-Engagement Gear Kit - developed with Quaife</p></td></tr=
></tbody></table></td></tr></tbody></table></td></tr></tbody></table></a></=
div><div><br></div><div><br></div><div><br></div><div>Note, if you decide t=
o go that route, please contact me, I&#39;ve been in contact with the vendo=
r and I&#39;m trying to place an order for this gearset. Maybe we can save =
some shipping if we get a couple of sets.</div><div><br></div><div>Note too=
 that Bastuck has dog box gear sets including one using the J-type overdriv=
e. When I contacted them last fall, they had none in stock and there was no=
 production scheduled.<br></div><div><br></div><div>Failing that option, th=
ere&#39;s the &quot;Dolomite Close Ratio Gearset&quot;. This consists of a =
different input shaft and main 3rd gear along with the corresponding laysha=
ft gears. You need to work the case to get these to pit, but they work grea=
t. These are helical gears. I&#39;ve used this setup for around 20 years, a=
nd it is really really good. Note: for the best total gear ratio option, ge=
t a later TR6 gearbox with the 16-tooth 1st laygear.<br></div><div><br></di=
v><div>Now, the drawback to the helical gears is apparently excessive thrus=
t forces and they effect the layshaft thrust washers as well as the layshaf=
t needle bearings. If you make torque and you have any end float for the la=
yshaft, you will spin the thrust washers and wreck the case. There are some=
 workarounds to compensate for excessive end float.</div><div><br></div><di=
v>Note too that because of torque multiplication, the layshaft needle beari=
ngs on the 1st gear end of the layshaft get beat really, really hard. One f=
ix is to install a double bearing on the layshaft (or buy a new one from Mo=
ss or another source) that is set up for the double bearing. I&#39;ve had Q=
uantum Mechanics install the double bearings, they seem to work better than=
 the stock setup. But even with that setup, the layshaft still gets pounded=
 and you need to keep an eye on it.</div><div><br></div><div>As you may kno=
w, a lot of the racers are gravitating away from the stock and/or modified =
Triumph gearboxes mostly because the quality consistency of replacement par=
ts is all over the place and you need to know what you&#39;re getting to sp=
ot the differences. That said, frequent oil changes and paying attention to=
 the detritus in the oil, you can stay ahead of problems.</div><div><br></d=
iv><div>If you&#39;re going to build a good gearbox, it will cost you as mu=
ch or more than some of the conversions out there, hence a lot of folks swi=
tch to Toyota/T5/Rocket, etc.</div><div><br></div><div>Hopefully you&#39;ll=
 get other good advice on this list, but that&#39;s where I&#39;m at right =
now (too). The Quaife gearset in the TR gearbox seems like the most &quot;v=
intage&quot; solution, but ALL of the options have pluses and minuses. In t=
he spirit of full transparency, I&#39;m also looking at Super T10 transmiss=
ions which are the same as the old Muncie &quot;Rock Crusher&quot; and ther=
e is a gearset available with a 2.43 1st, 1.63 2nd, 1.23 3rd and 1 4th whic=
h is pretty close to the Dolomite Sprint setup. And the gearbox is 70 pound=
s which is really close to the stock box. Also, if you want to dish out mor=
e $$$, Gear Vendors has an overdrive that bolts to the T-10, I haven&#39;t =
researched that enough to see if there are any particulars, but it is an op=
tion, albeit around $3k. But you get a BRAND NEW overdrive. Just sayin. A d=
rawback to the Super T10 is that you will need to make or source a bell hou=
sing, but that is do-able with a combo of a trashed TR gearbox, a competent=
 machinist and more $$$. ;-)<br></div><div><br></div><div>Regards,</div><di=
v>Bob Lang</div><div>339-927-4489<br></div><div><br></div>
       =20
        </div><div id=3D"gmail-m_-1553580064239954844ydpe091f580yahoo_quote=
d_1530796332" class=3D"gmail-m_-1553580064239954844ydpe091f580yahoo_quoted"=
            <div style=3D"font-family:&quot;Helvetica Neue&quot;,Helvetica,=
Arial,sans-serif;font-size:13px;color:rgb(38,40,42)">
               =20
                <div>
                    On Tuesday, June 18, 2019, 9:02:31 AM EDT, Mike Deweerd=
 via Fot &lt;<a href=3D"mailto:[email-masked]" target=3D"_blank">fot@au=
tox.team.net</a>&gt; wrote:
                </div>
                <div><br></div>
                <div><br></div>
                <div><div dir=3D"ltr">Amici <br></div><div dir=3D"ltr">What=
 is the preferred gearbox for the TR4 non overdrive and where is the best s=
ource for getting such<br></div><div dir=3D"ltr">I=E2=80=99m looking at the=
 pros and cons of the straight cut gear set vs the close ratio gear set (I=
=E2=80=99m assuming the close ratio is still helical gears) <br></div><div =
dir=3D"ltr">Please chime in with preferences and opinions <br></div><div di=
r=3D"ltr">Cheers <br></div><div dir=3D"ltr">Mike Deweerd #77<br></div><div =
dir=3D"ltr"><br></div><div dir=3D"ltr"><br></div><div dir=3D"ltr"><br></div=
____________________________________<br></div><div dir=3D"ltr"><a href=3D"m=
ailto:[email-masked]" rel=3D"nofollow" target=3D"_blank">[email-masked]=
.net</a><br></div><div dir=3D"ltr"><br></div><div dir=3D"ltr"><a href=3D"ht=
tp://www.fot-racing.com" rel=3D"nofollow" target=3D"_blank">http://www.fot-=
racing.com</a><br></div><div dir=3D"ltr"><br></div><div dir=3D"ltr">Donate:=
 <a href=3D"http://www.team.net/donate.html" rel=3D"nofollow" target=3D"_bl=
ank">http://www.team.net/donate.html</a><br></div><div dir=3D"ltr">Archive:=
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k">http://autox.team.net/archive </a><a href=3D"http://www.team.net/piperma=
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o.com</a><br></div><div dir=3D"ltr"><br></div><div dir=3D"ltr"><br></div></=
div>
            </div>
        </div></div>_______________________________________________<br>
<a href=3D"mailto:[email-masked]" target=3D"_blank">[email-masked]<=
/a><br>
<br>
<a href=3D"http://www.fot-racing.com" rel=3D"noreferrer" target=3D"_blank">=
http://www.fot-racing.com</a><br>
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et=3D"_blank">http://www.team.net/donate.html</a><br>
Archive: <a href=3D"http://autox.team.net/archive" rel=3D"noreferrer" targe=
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et/pipermail/fotUnsubscribe/Manage" rel=3D"noreferrer" target=3D"_blank">ht=
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t/[email-masked]" rel=3D"noreferrer" target=3D"_blank">http://autox.te=
am.net/mailman/options/fot/[email-masked]</a><br>
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<br>
</blockquote></div>

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--===============4309914567944132288==--

---

From: "van.mulders.marcel--- via Fot" <[email-masked]>
Date: Tue, 18 Jun 2019 22:14:41 +0200 (CEST)

--===============2129398473124912066==
	boundary="=_4d4f97b1-db0d-4f17-973f-77c48787cf7b"

--=_4d4f97b1-db0d-4f17-973f-77c48787cf7b
Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable

Bastuck announced a new batch of dog box gear sets that should have been av=
ailable from february 2019 onwards. It took longer, but these sets are avai=
lable now.=20
Marcel.=20

Van: "fot" <[email-masked]>=20
Aan: "Tony Drews" <[email-masked]>=20
Cc: "fot" <[email-masked]>=20
Verzonden: Dinsdag 18 juni 2019 18:54:23=20
Onderwerp: Re: [Fot] TR4 transmission=20

I would add that you can buy individual parts for the quaife should you wea=
r out a hub or chip a tooth . Each component has laser engraved part number=
s .=20
T=20

Sent from my iPhone=20

On Jun 18, 2019, at 9:20 AM, Tony Drews via Fot < [ mailto:[email-masked]=
et | [email-masked] ] > wrote:=20

Nice summary! I don't have much to add other than the Quaife gearset uses s=
ubstantial needle bearings inside each of the gears, much larger input to m=
ainshaft needle bearing, steel thrust washers within the stack. Work of art=
. Layshaft still uses semi-stock bearings.=20

When I blew up my tranny I ended up going with the Quaife and really like i=
t. No synchros to break, shifts are lightning quick, gear ratios work well.=
=20

Cheers, Tony Drews=20
On 6/18/2019 9:24 AM, Robert Lang via Fot wrote:=20

BQ_BEGIN

Hi,=20

Those are THE questions, aren't they?=20

Okay - Quaife has a straight-cut gear set that uses dog-rings, no synchros.=
 Big $$$, 1600 UK pounds. Quaife just ran off a set and the one source that=
 I know of in the UK can get them:=20

[ http://www.vessey-classic-car-services.co.uk/triumph-gear-kit.htm#.XQjuu3=
t7n64 | Dennis Vessey - Quaife gear kits for Triumph TRs ]=20

[ http://www.vessey-classic-car-services.co.uk/triumph-gear-kit.htm#.XQjuu3=
t7n64 |=20

metatags generator

 ]=20

Note, if you decide to go that route, please contact me, I've been in conta=
ct with the vendor and I'm trying to place an order for this gearset. Maybe=
 we can save some shipping if we get a couple of sets.=20

Note too that Bastuck has dog box gear sets including one using the J-type =
overdrive. When I contacted them last fall, they had none in stock and ther=
e was no production scheduled.=20

n, get a later TR6 gearbox with the 16-tooth 1st laygear.=20

ounds to compensate for excessive end float.=20

ou need to keep an eye on it.=20

tention to the detritus in the oil, you can stay ahead of problems.=20

a/T5/Rocket, etc.=20

$$$. ;-)=20

Regards,=20
Bob Lang=20
339-927-4489=20

On Tuesday, June 18, 2019, 9:02:31 AM EDT, Mike Deweerd via Fot [ mailto:fo=
[email-masked] |=20
<[email-masked]> ] wrote:=20

Amici=20
st source for getting such=20
Mike Deweerd #77=20

Sent from my iPhone=20
_______________________________________________=20
[ mailto:[email-masked] | [email-masked] ]=20

[ http://www.fot-racing.com/ | http://www.fot-racing.com ]=20

Archive: [ http://autox.team.net/archive |=20
http://autox.team.net/archive  ] [ http://www.team.net/pipermail/fot | http=
://www.team.net/pipermail/fot ]=20
[email-masked] |=20
http://autox.team.net/mailman/options/fot/[email-masked] ]=20

_______________________________________________ [ mailto:[email-masked]=
 | [email-masked] ] [ http://www.fot-racing.com/ | http://www.fot-racin=
g.com ] Donate: [ http://www.team.net/donate.html | http://www.team.net/don=
ate.html ] Archive: [ http://autox.team.net/archive | http://autox.team.net=
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ail/fot ] Unsubscribe/Manage: [ http://autox.team.net/mailman/options/fot/t=
[email-masked] | http://autox.team.net/mailman/options/fot/tony@tonydrew=
s.com ]=20

BQ_END

BQ_BEGIN

_______________________________________________=20
[ mailto:[email-masked] | [email-masked] ]=20

[ http://www.fot-racing.com/ | http://www.fot-racing.com ]=20

 ]=20
Archive: [ http://autox.team.net/archive | http://autox.team.net/archive ] =
[ http://www.team.net/pipermail/fot | http://www.team.net/pipermail/fot ]=
=20
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BQ_END

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Archive: http://autox.team.net/archive http://www.team.net/pipermail/fot=20
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--=_4d4f97b1-db0d-4f17-973f-77c48787cf7b
Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable

<html><body><div style=3D"font-family: Verdana, Arial, Helvetica, sans-seri=
f; font-size: 10pt; color: #000000"><div>Bastuck announced a new batch of d=
og box gear sets that should have been available from february 2019 onwards=
. It took longer, but these sets are available now.</div><div>Marcel.</div>=
<div><br></div><hr id=3D"zwchr" data-marker=3D"__DIVIDER__"><div data-marke=
r=3D"__HEADERS__"><b>Van: </b>"fot" &lt;[email-masked]&gt;<br><b>Aan: <=
/b>"Tony Drews" &lt;[email-masked]&gt;<br><b>Cc: </b>"fot" &lt;fot@auto=
x.team.net&gt;<br><b>Verzonden: </b>Dinsdag 18 juni 2019 18:54:23<br><b>Ond=
erwerp: </b>Re: [Fot] TR4 transmission<br></div><br><div data-marker=3D"__Q=
UOTED_TEXT__">
I would add that you can buy individual parts for the quaife should you wea=
r out a hub or chip a tooth . Each component has laser engraved part number=
s .
<div>T<br>
<br>
<div id=3D"AppleMailSignature">Sent from my iPhone</div>
<div><br>
On Jun 18, 2019, at 9:20 AM, Tony Drews via Fot &lt;<a href=3D"mailto:fot@a=
utox.team.net" target=3D"_blank">[email-masked]</a>&gt; wrote:<br>
<br>
</div>
<blockquote>
<div>
<p>Nice summary!&nbsp; I don't have much to add other than the Quaife gears=
et uses substantial needle bearings inside each of the gears, much larger i=
nput to mainshaft needle bearing, steel thrust washers within the stack.&nb=
sp; Work of art.&nbsp; Layshaft still uses semi-stock
 bearings.</p>
<p>When I blew up my tranny I ended up going with the Quaife and really lik=
e it.&nbsp; No synchros to break, shifts are lightning quick, gear ratios w=
ork well.</p>
<p>Cheers, Tony Drews<br>
</p>
<div class=3D"moz-cite-prefix">On 6/18/2019 9:24 AM, Robert Lang via Fot wr=
ote:<br>
</div>
<blockquote cite=3D"mid:[email-masked]">

<div class=3D"ydp435d1f9fyahoo-style-wrap" style=3D"font-family:Helvetica N=
eue, Helvetica, Arial,
        sans-serif;font-size:13px;">
<div>Hi,</div>
<div><br>
</div>
<div>Those are THE questions, aren't they?</div>
<div><br>
</div>
<div>Okay - Quaife has a straight-cut gear set that uses dog-rings, no sync=
hros. Big $$$, 1600 UK pounds. Quaife just ran off a set and the one source=
 that I know of in the UK can get them:</div>
<div><br>
</div>
<div><a href=3D"http://www.vessey-classic-car-services.co.uk/triumph-gear-k=
it.htm#.XQjuu3t7n64" rel=3D"nofollow" target=3D"_blank" class=3D"enhancr_ca=
rd_1791886968">Dennis Vessey - Quaife gear kits for Triumph TRs</a></div>
<div><br>
</div>
<div id=3D"ydpd666f494enhancr_card_1791886968" class=3D"ydpd666f494yahoo-li=
nk-enhancr-card
          ydpd666f494ymail-preserve-class
          ydpd666f494ymail-preserve-style" style=3D"max-width:400px;font-fa=
mily:Helvetica Neue, Segoe UI,
          Helvetica, Arial, sans-serif">
<a href=3D"http://www.vessey-classic-car-services.co.uk/triumph-gear-kit.ht=
m#.XQjuu3t7n64" style=3D"text-decoration:none !important;color:#000
            !important" class=3D"ydpd666f494yahoo-enhancr-cardlink" rel=3D"=
nofollow" target=3D"_blank">
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              ydpd666f494yahoo-ignore-table" style=3D"max-width:400px" cell=
spacing=3D"0" cellpadding=3D"0" border=3D"0">
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                      ydpd666f494yahoo-ignore-table" style=3D"max-width:400=
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                      228, 233);border-radius:2px" width=3D"100%" cellspaci=
ng=3D"0" cellpadding=3D"0" border=3D"0">
<tbody>
<tr>
<td class=3D"ydpd666f494card-primary-image-cell" style=3D"background-color:=
 rgb(0, 0, 0);
                            background-repeat: no-repeat;
                            background-size: cover; position: relative;
                            border-radius: 2px 2px 0px 0px; min-height:
                            175px;" valign=3D"top" height=3D"175" bgcolor=
=3D"#000000" dfbackground=3D"https://s.yimg.com/lo/api/res/1.2/HCCuBMDwl4Ua=
IldBv8FhgQ--~A/Zmk9ZmlsbDt3PTQwMDtoPTIwMDthcHBpZD1pZXh0cmFjdA--/http://www.=
vessey-classic-car-services.co.uk/images/triumph-tr-gear-kit2.jpg.cf.jpg">

<table class=3D"ydpd666f494card-overlay-container-table
                              ydpd666f494yahoo-ignore-table" style=3D"width=
:100%" cellspacing=3D"0" cellpadding=3D"0" border=3D"0">
<tbody>
<tr>
<td class=3D"ydpd666f494card-overlay-cell" style=3D"background-color:
                                    transparent; border-radius: 2px 2px
                                    0px 0px; min-height: 175px;" valign=3D"=
top" bgcolor=3D"transparent" dfbackground=3D"https://s.yimg.com/cv/ae/nq/st=
orm/assets/enhancrV21/1/enhancr_gradient-400x175.png">

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ight:
                                      175px;" border=3D"0">
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<tr>
<td class=3D"ydpd666f494card-richInfo2" style=3D"text-align:left;padding:15=
px 0 0 15px;vertical-align:top">
<br>
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<td class=3D"ydpd666f494card-actions" style=3D"text-align:right;padding:15p=
x 15px 0 0;vertical-align:top">
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</table>
</td>
</tr>
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<td>
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round-color: rgb(255, 255,
                              255); background-repeat: repeat;
                              background-attachment: scroll;
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                              auto; position: relative; z-index: 2;
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<td style=3D"vertical-align:middle;padding:12px
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                                    Neue, Segoe UI, Helvetica, Arial,
                                    sans-serif;border-radius:0 0 2px 0">
<h2 class=3D"ydpd666f494card-title" style=3D"font-size: 14px;
                                      line-height: 19px; margin: 0px 0px
                                      6px; font-family: Helvetica Neue,
                                      Segoe UI, Helvetica, Arial,
                                      sans-serif; color: rgb(38, 40,
                                      42);">
Dennis Vessey - Quaife gear kits for Triumph TRs</h2>
<p class=3D"ydpd666f494card-richinfo-primary" style=3D"font-size:12px;line-=
height:16px;margin:0 0 4px 0;color:#979ba7">
metatags generator</p>
<p class=3D"ydpd666f494card-description" style=3D"font-size: 12px;
                                      line-height: 16px; margin: 0px;
                                      color: rgb(151, 155, 167);">
Vesseys Triumph TR Dog-Engagement Gear Kit - developed with Quaife</p>
</td>
</tr>
</tbody>
</table>
</td>
</tr>
</tbody>
</table>
</td>
</tr>
</tbody>
</table>
</a></div>
<div><br>
</div>
<div><br>
</div>
<div><br>
</div>
<div>Note, if you decide to go that route, please contact me, I've been in =
contact with the vendor and I'm trying to place an order for this gearset. =
Maybe we can save some shipping if we get a couple of sets.</div>
<div><br>
</div>
<div>Note too that Bastuck has dog box gear sets including one using the J-=
type overdrive. When I contacted them last fall, they had none in stock and=
 there was no production scheduled.<br>
</div>
<div><br>
</div>
<div>Failing that option, there's the "Dolomite Close Ratio Gearset". This =
consists of a different input shaft and main 3rd gear along with the corres=
ponding layshaft gears. You need to work the case to get these to pit, but =
they work great. These are helical
 gears. I've used this setup for around 20 years, and it is really really g=
ood. Note: for the best total gear ratio option, get a later TR6 gearbox wi=
th the 16-tooth 1st laygear.<br>
</div>
<div><br>
</div>
<div>Now, the drawback to the helical gears is apparently excessive thrust =
forces and they effect the layshaft thrust washers as well as the layshaft =
needle bearings. If you make torque and you have any end float for the lays=
haft, you will spin the thrust washers
 and wreck the case. There are some workarounds to compensate for excessive=
 end float.</div>
<div><br>
</div>
<div>Note too that because of torque multiplication, the layshaft needle be=
arings on the 1st gear end of the layshaft get beat really, really hard. On=
e fix is to install a double bearing on the layshaft (or buy a new one from=
 Moss or another source) that is
 set up for the double bearing. I've had Quantum Mechanics install the doub=
le bearings, they seem to work better than the stock setup. But even with t=
hat setup, the layshaft still gets pounded and you need to keep an eye on i=
t.</div>
<div><br>
</div>
<div>As you may know, a lot of the racers are gravitating away from the sto=
ck and/or modified Triumph gearboxes mostly because the quality consistency=
 of replacement parts is all over the place and you need to know what you'r=
e getting to spot the differences.
 That said, frequent oil changes and paying attention to the detritus in th=
e oil, you can stay ahead of problems.</div>
<div><br>
</div>
<div>If you're going to build a good gearbox, it will cost you as much or m=
ore than some of the conversions out there, hence a lot of folks switch to =
Toyota/T5/Rocket, etc.</div>
<div><br>
</div>
<div>Hopefully you'll get other good advice on this list, but that's where =
I'm at right now (too). The Quaife gearset in the TR gearbox seems like the=
 most "vintage" solution, but ALL of the options have pluses and minuses. I=
n the spirit of full transparency,
 I'm also looking at Super T10 transmissions which are the same as the old =
Muncie "Rock Crusher" and there is a gearset available with a 2.43 1st, 1.6=
3 2nd, 1.23 3rd and 1 4th which is pretty close to the Dolomite Sprint setu=
p. And the gearbox is 70 pounds
 which is really close to the stock box. Also, if you want to dish out more=
 $$$, Gear Vendors has an overdrive that bolts to the T-10, I haven't resea=
rched that enough to see if there are any particulars, but it is an option,=
 albeit around $3k. But you get
 a BRAND NEW overdrive. Just sayin. A drawback to the Super T10 is that you=
 will need to make or source a bell housing, but that is do-able with a com=
bo of a trashed TR gearbox, a competent machinist and more $$$. ;-)<br>
</div>
<div><br>
</div>
<div>Regards,</div>
<div>Bob Lang</div>
<div>339-927-4489<br>
</div>
<div><br>
</div>
</div>
<div id=3D"ydpe091f580yahoo_quoted_1530796332" class=3D"ydpe091f580yahoo_qu=
oted">
<div style=3D"font-family:'Helvetica Neue', Helvetica, Arial,
          sans-serif;font-size:13px;color:#26282a;">
<div>On Tuesday, June 18, 2019, 9:02:31 AM EDT, Mike Deweerd via Fot <a cla=
ss=3D"moz-txt-link-rfc2396E" href=3D"mailto:[email-masked]" target=3D"_=
blank">
&lt;[email-masked]&gt;</a> wrote: </div>
<div><br>
</div>
<div><br>
</div>
<div>
<div dir=3D"ltr">Amici <br>
</div>
<div dir=3D"ltr">What is the preferred gearbox for the TR4 non overdrive an=
d where is the best source for getting such<br>
</div>
<div dir=3D"ltr">I=E2=80=99m looking at the pros and cons of the straight c=
ut gear set vs the close ratio gear set (I=E2=80=99m assuming the close rat=
io is still helical gears)
<br>
</div>
<div dir=3D"ltr">Please chime in with preferences and opinions <br>
</div>
<div dir=3D"ltr">Cheers <br>
</div>
<div dir=3D"ltr">Mike Deweerd #77<br>
</div>
<div dir=3D"ltr"><br>
</div>
<div dir=3D"ltr"><br>
</div>
<div dir=3D"ltr"><br>
</div>
<div dir=3D"ltr">Sent from my iPhone<br>
</div>
<div dir=3D"ltr">_______________________________________________<br>
</div>
<div dir=3D"ltr"><a href=3D"mailto:[email-masked]" rel=3D"nofollow" tar=
get=3D"_blank">[email-masked]</a><br>
</div>
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</div>
<div dir=3D"ltr"><a href=3D"http://www.fot-racing.com" rel=3D"nofollow" tar=
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<fieldset class=3D"mimeAttachmentHeader"></fieldset>
<pre class=3D"moz-quote-pre">______________________________________________=
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<a class=3D"moz-txt-link-abbreviated" href=3D"mailto:[email-masked]" ta=
rget=3D"_blank">[email-masked]</a>

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</blockquote>
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--=_4d4f97b1-db0d-4f17-973f-77c48787cf7b--

--===============2129398473124912066==
Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit
Content-Disposition: inline

--===============2129398473124912066==--

---

From: Geoff Byrne via Fot <[email-masked]>
Date: Wed, 19 Jun 2019 21:13:30 +1000

--===============7544176125168073229==
	boundary=Apple-Mail-BD6F7A59-7325-450B-88CE-5A10D09A30A8
Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit

--Apple-Mail-BD6F7A59-7325-450B-88CE-5A10D09A30A8
	charset=utf-8
Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable

I=E2=80=99ve been racing my tr6 for over 15 years and gave up,on the synchro=
 box due to the inability to get good quality rings. Swapped to a quaiffe do=
g box and ended up buying another one from Vessey and a third from bustuck .=
 Having experienced several counter shaft needle bearing failures which can b=
e very costly I have developed a box with ball bearings on a fixed lay shaft=
. Does involved a bit of machining but as I have my own machine shop and the=
 time it not a problem for me. After four years of solid racing the ball bea=
ring are still perfect. Not for everyone but bullet proof.
If anyone is interested in details email me
Regards=20
Geoff Byrne TR6 racer down under

Sent from my iPad

> On 19 Jun 2019, at 6:14 am, van.mulders.marcel--- via Fot <[email-masked].=
net> wrote:
>=20
> Bastuck announced a new batch of dog box gear sets that should have been a=
vailable from february 2019 onwards. It took longer, but these sets are avai=
lable now.
> Marcel.
>=20
> Van: "fot" <[email-masked]>
> Aan: "Tony Drews" <[email-masked]>
> Cc: "fot" <[email-masked]>
> Verzonden: Dinsdag 18 juni 2019 18:54:23
> I would add that you can buy individual parts for the quaife should you we=
ar out a hub or chip a tooth . Each component has laser engraved part number=
s .
> T
>=20
> Sent from my iPhone
>=20
> On Jun 18, 2019, at 9:20 AM, Tony Drews via Fot <[email-masked]> wrote=
:
>=20
> Nice summary!  I don't have much to add other than the Quaife gearset uses=
 substantial needle bearings inside each of the gears, much larger input to m=
ainshaft needle bearing, steel thrust washers within the stack.  Work of art=
.  Layshaft still uses semi-stock bearings.

> Okay - Quaife has a straight-cut gear set that uses dog-rings, no synchros=
. Big $$$, 1600 UK pounds. Quaife just ran off a set and the one source that=
 I know of in the UK can get them:
> Note, if you decide to go that route, please contact me, I've been in cont=
act with the vendor and I'm trying to place an order for this gearset. Maybe=
 we can save some shipping if we get a couple of sets.
>=20
> Note too that Bastuck has dog box gear sets including one using the J-type=
>=20
> Failing that option, there's the "Dolomite Close Ratio Gearset". This cons=
ists of a different input shaft and main 3rd gear along with the correspondi=
ng layshaft gears. You need to work the case to get these to pit, but they w=
ork great. These are helical gears. I've used this setup for around 20 years=
, and it is really really good. Note: for the best total gear ratio option, g=
et a later TR6 gearbox with the 16-tooth 1st laygear.
>=20
> Now, the drawback to the helical gears is apparently excessive thrust forc=
es and they effect the layshaft thrust washers as well as the layshaft needl=
e bearings. If you make torque and you have any end float for the layshaft, y=
ou will spin the thrust washers and wreck the case. There are some workaroun=
ds to compensate for excessive end float.
>=20
> Note too that because of torque multiplication, the layshaft needle bearin=
gs on the 1st gear end of the layshaft get beat really, really hard. One fix=
 is to install a double bearing on the layshaft (or buy a new one from Moss o=
r another source) that is set up for the double bearing. I've had Quantum Me=
chanics install the double bearings, they seem to work better than the stock=
 setup. But even with that setup, the layshaft still gets pounded and you ne=
ed to keep an eye on it.
>=20
> As you may know, a lot of the racers are gravitating away from the stock a=
nd/or modified Triumph gearboxes mostly because the quality consistency of r=
eplacement parts is all over the place and you need to know what you're gett=
ing to spot the differences. That said, frequent oil changes and paying atte=
ntion to the detritus in the oil, you can stay ahead of problems.
> If you're going to build a good gearbox, it will cost you as much or more t=
han some of the conversions out there, hence a lot of folks switch to Toyota=
/T5/Rocket, etc.
> Hopefully you'll get other good advice on this list, but that's where I'm a=
t right now (too). The Quaife gearset in the TR gearbox seems like the most "=
vintage" solution, but ALL of the options have pluses and minuses. In the sp=
irit of full transparency, I'm also looking at Super T10 transmissions which=
 are the same as the old Muncie "Rock Crusher" and there is a gearset availa=
ble with a 2.43 1st, 1.63 2nd, 1.23 3rd and 1 4th which is pretty close to t=
he Dolomite Sprint setup. And the gearbox is 70 pounds which is really close=
 to the stock box. Also, if you want to dish out more $$$, Gear Vendors has a=
n overdrive that bolts to the T-10, I haven't researched that enough to see i=
f there are any particulars, but it is an option, albeit around $3k. But you=
 get a BRAND NEW overdrive. Just sayin. A drawback to the Super T10 is that y=
ou will need to make or source a bell housing, but that is do-able with a co=
mbo of a trashed TR gearbox, a competent machinist and more $$$. ;-)
>=20
> Regards,
> Bob Lang
> 339-927-4489
>=20
> On Tuesday, June 18, 2019, 9:02:31 AM EDT, Mike Deweerd via Fot <fot@autox=
.team.net> wrote:
>=20
>=20
> Amici=20
> What is the preferred gearbox for the TR4 non overdrive and where is the b=
est source for getting such
> I=E2=80=99m looking at the pros and cons of the straight cut gear set vs t=
he close ratio gear set (I=E2=80=99m assuming the close ratio is still helic=
al gears)=20
> Unsubscribe/Manage: http://autox.team.net/mailman/options/fot/robertlangtr=
[email-masked]
> Unsubscribe/Manage: http://autox.team.net/mailman/options/fot/tony@tonydre=
ws.com
> Unsubscribe/Manage: http://autox.team.net/mailman/options/fot/horizonracin=
[email-masked]
> Unsubscribe/Manage: http://autox.team.net/mailman/options/fot/van.mulders.=
[email-masked]
> Unsubscribe/Manage: http://autox.team.net/mailman/options/fot/gkbyrne@optu=
shome.com.au

--Apple-Mail-BD6F7A59-7325-450B-88CE-5A10D09A30A8
	charset=utf-8
Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable

<html><head><meta http-equiv=3D"content-type" content=3D"text/html; charset=3D=
utf-8"></head><body dir=3D"auto">I=E2=80=99ve been racing my tr6 for over 15=
 years and gave up,on the synchro box due to the inability to get good quali=
ty rings. Swapped to a quaiffe dog box and ended up buying another one from V=
essey and a third from bustuck . Having experienced several counter shaft ne=
edle bearing failures which can be very costly I have developed a box with b=
all bearings on a fixed lay shaft. Does involved a bit of machining but as I=
 have my own machine shop and the time it not a problem for me. After four y=
ears of solid racing the ball bearing are still perfect. Not for everyone bu=
t bullet proof.<div>If anyone is interested in details email me</div><div>Re=
gards&nbsp;</div><div>Geoff Byrne TR6 racer down under<br><br><div id=3D"App=
leMailSignature" dir=3D"ltr">Sent from my iPad</div><div dir=3D"ltr"><br>On 1=
9 Jun 2019, at 6:14 am, van.mulders.marcel--- via Fot &lt;<a href=3D"mailto:=
[email-masked]">[email-masked]</a>&gt; wrote:<br><br></div><blockquo=
te type=3D"cite"><div dir=3D"ltr"><div style=3D"font-family: Verdana, Arial,=
 Helvetica, sans-serif; font-size: 10pt; color: #000000"><div>Bastuck announ=
ced a new batch of dog box gear sets that should have been available from fe=
bruary 2019 onwards. It took longer, but these sets are available now.</div>=
<div>Marcel.</div><div><br></div><hr id=3D"zwchr" data-marker=3D"__DIVIDER__=
"><div data-marker=3D"__HEADERS__"><b>Van: </b>"fot" &lt;<a href=3D"mailto:f=
[email-masked]">[email-masked]</a>&gt;<br><b>Aan: </b>"Tony Drews" &l=
t;<a href=3D"mailto:[email-masked]">[email-masked]</a>&gt;<br><b>Cc:=
 </b>"fot" &lt;<a href=3D"mailto:[email-masked]">[email-masked]</a>&=
gt;<br><b>Verzonden: </b>Dinsdag 18 juni 2019 18:54:23<br><b>Onderwerp: </b>=
Re: [Fot] TR4 transmission<br></div><br><div data-marker=3D"__QUOTED_TEXT__"=
I would add that you can buy individual parts for the quaife should you wear=
 out a hub or chip a tooth . Each component has laser engraved part numbers .=

<div>T<br>
<br>
<div id=3D"AppleMailSignature">Sent from my iPhone</div>
<div><br>
On Jun 18, 2019, at 9:20 AM, Tony Drews via Fot &lt;<a href=3D"mailto:fot@au=
tox.team.net" target=3D"_blank">[email-masked]</a>&gt; wrote:<br>
<br>
</div>
<blockquote>
<div>
<p>Nice summary!&nbsp; I don't have much to add other than the Quaife gearse=
t uses substantial needle bearings inside each of the gears, much larger inp=
ut to mainshaft needle bearing, steel thrust washers within the stack.&nbsp;=
 Work of art.&nbsp; Layshaft still uses semi-stock
 bearings.</p>
<p>When I blew up my tranny I ended up going with the Quaife and really like=
 it.&nbsp; No synchros to break, shifts are lightning quick, gear ratios wor=
k well.</p>
<p>Cheers, Tony Drews<br>
</p>
<div class=3D"moz-cite-prefix">On 6/18/2019 9:24 AM, Robert Lang via Fot wro=
te:<br>
</div>
<blockquote cite=3D"mid:[email-masked]">

<div class=3D"ydp435d1f9fyahoo-style-wrap" style=3D"font-family:Helvetica Ne=
ue, Helvetica, Arial,
        sans-serif;font-size:13px;">
<div>Hi,</div>
<div><br>
</div>
<div>Those are THE questions, aren't they?</div>
<div><br>
</div>
<div>Okay - Quaife has a straight-cut gear set that uses dog-rings, no synch=
ros. Big $$$, 1600 UK pounds. Quaife just ran off a set and the one source t=
hat I know of in the UK can get them:</div>
<div><br>
</div>
<div><a href=3D"http://www.vessey-classic-car-services.co.uk/triumph-gear-ki=
t.htm#.XQjuu3t7n64" rel=3D"nofollow" target=3D"_blank" class=3D"enhancr_card=
_1791886968">Dennis Vessey - Quaife gear kits for Triumph TRs</a></div>
<div><br>
</div>
<div id=3D"ydpd666f494enhancr_card_1791886968" class=3D"ydpd666f494yahoo-lin=
k-enhancr-card
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#.XQjuu3t7n64" style=3D"text-decoration:none !important;color:#000
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<td class=3D"ydpd666f494card-richInfo2" style=3D"text-align:left;padding:15p=
x 0 0 15px;vertical-align:top">
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</table>
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</tr>
</tbody>
</table>
</td>
</tr>
<tr>
<td>
<table class=3D"ydpd666f494card-info
                              ydpd666f494yahoo-ignore-table" style=3D"backgr=
ound-color: rgb(255, 255,
                              255); background-repeat: repeat;
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                              auto; position: relative; z-index: 2;
                              width: 100%; max-width: 400px;
                              border-radius: 0px 0px 2px 2px;
                              border-top: 1px solid rgb(224, 228, 233);" cel=
lspacing=3D"0" cellpadding=3D"0" border=3D"0" align=3D"center">
<tbody>
<tr>
<td style=3D"background-color:#ffffff;padding:16px
                                    0 16px
                                    12px;vertical-align:top;border-radius:0
                                    0 0 2px">
<br>
</td>
<td style=3D"vertical-align:middle;padding:12px
                                    24px 16px
                                    12px;width:99%;font-family:Helvetica
                                    Neue, Segoe UI, Helvetica, Arial,
                                    sans-serif;border-radius:0 0 2px 0">
<h2 class=3D"ydpd666f494card-title" style=3D"font-size: 14px;
                                      line-height: 19px; margin: 0px 0px
                                      6px; font-family: Helvetica Neue,
                                      Segoe UI, Helvetica, Arial,
                                      sans-serif; color: rgb(38, 40,
                                      42);">
Dennis Vessey - Quaife gear kits for Triumph TRs</h2>
<p class=3D"ydpd666f494card-richinfo-primary" style=3D"font-size:12px;line-h=
eight:16px;margin:0 0 4px 0;color:#979ba7">
metatags generator</p>
<p class=3D"ydpd666f494card-description" style=3D"font-size: 12px;
                                      line-height: 16px; margin: 0px;
                                      color: rgb(151, 155, 167);">
Vesseys Triumph TR Dog-Engagement Gear Kit - developed with Quaife</p>
</td>
</tr>
</tbody>
</table>
</td>
</tr>
</tbody>
</table>
</td>
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</tbody>
</table>
</a></div>
<div><br>
</div>
<div><br>
</div>
<div><br>
</div>
<div>Note, if you decide to go that route, please contact me, I've been in c=
ontact with the vendor and I'm trying to place an order for this gearset. Ma=
ybe we can save some shipping if we get a couple of sets.</div>
<div><br>
</div>
<div>Note too that Bastuck has dog box gear sets including one using the J-t=
ype overdrive. When I contacted them last fall, they had none in stock and t=
here was no production scheduled.<br>
</div>
<div><br>
</div>
<div>Failing that option, there's the "Dolomite Close Ratio Gearset". This c=
onsists of a different input shaft and main 3rd gear along with the correspo=
nding layshaft gears. You need to work the case to get these to pit, but the=
y work great. These are helical
 gears. I've used this setup for around 20 years, and it is really really go=
od. Note: for the best total gear ratio option, get a later TR6 gearbox with=
 the 16-tooth 1st laygear.<br>
</div>
<div><br>
</div>
<div>Now, the drawback to the helical gears is apparently excessive thrust f=
orces and they effect the layshaft thrust washers as well as the layshaft ne=
edle bearings. If you make torque and you have any end float for the layshaf=
t, you will spin the thrust washers
 and wreck the case. There are some workarounds to compensate for excessive e=
nd float.</div>
<div><br>
</div>
<div>Note too that because of torque multiplication, the layshaft needle bea=
rings on the 1st gear end of the layshaft get beat really, really hard. One f=
ix is to install a double bearing on the layshaft (or buy a new one from Mos=
s or another source) that is
 set up for the double bearing. I've had Quantum Mechanics install the doubl=
e bearings, they seem to work better than the stock setup. But even with tha=
t setup, the layshaft still gets pounded and you need to keep an eye on it.<=
/div>
<div><br>
</div>
<div>As you may know, a lot of the racers are gravitating away from the stoc=
k and/or modified Triumph gearboxes mostly because the quality consistency o=
f replacement parts is all over the place and you need to know what you're g=
etting to spot the differences.
 That said, frequent oil changes and paying attention to the detritus in the=
 oil, you can stay ahead of problems.</div>
<div><br>
</div>
<div>If you're going to build a good gearbox, it will cost you as much or mo=
re than some of the conversions out there, hence a lot of folks switch to To=
yota/T5/Rocket, etc.</div>
<div><br>
</div>
<div>Hopefully you'll get other good advice on this list, but that's where I=
'm at right now (too). The Quaife gearset in the TR gearbox seems like the m=
ost "vintage" solution, but ALL of the options have pluses and minuses. In t=
he spirit of full transparency,
 I'm also looking at Super T10 transmissions which are the same as the old M=
uncie "Rock Crusher" and there is a gearset available with a 2.43 1st, 1.63 2=
nd, 1.23 3rd and 1 4th which is pretty close to the Dolomite Sprint setup. A=
nd the gearbox is 70 pounds
 which is really close to the stock box. Also, if you want to dish out more $=
$$, Gear Vendors has an overdrive that bolts to the T-10, I haven't research=
ed that enough to see if there are any particulars, but it is an option, alb=
eit around $3k. But you get
 a BRAND NEW overdrive. Just sayin. A drawback to the Super T10 is that you w=
ill need to make or source a bell housing, but that is do-able with a combo o=
f a trashed TR gearbox, a competent machinist and more $$$. ;-)<br>
</div>
<div><br>
</div>
<div>Regards,</div>
<div>Bob Lang</div>
<div>339-927-4489<br>
</div>
<div><br>
</div>
</div>
<div id=3D"ydpe091f580yahoo_quoted_1530796332" class=3D"ydpe091f580yahoo_quo=
ted">
<div style=3D"font-family:'Helvetica Neue', Helvetica, Arial,
          sans-serif;font-size:13px;color:#26282a;">
<div>On Tuesday, June 18, 2019, 9:02:31 AM EDT, Mike Deweerd via Fot <a clas=
s=3D"moz-txt-link-rfc2396E" href=3D"mailto:[email-masked]" target=3D"_bl=
ank">
&lt;[email-masked]&gt;</a> wrote: </div>
<div><br>
</div>
<div><br>
</div>
<div>
<div dir=3D"ltr">Amici <br>
</div>
<div dir=3D"ltr">What is the preferred gearbox for the TR4 non overdrive and=
 where is the best source for getting such<br>
</div>
<div dir=3D"ltr">I=E2=80=99m looking at the pros and cons of the straight cu=
t gear set vs the close ratio gear set (I=E2=80=99m assuming the close ratio=
 is still helical gears)
<br>
</div>
<div dir=3D"ltr">Please chime in with preferences and opinions <br>
</div>
<div dir=3D"ltr">Cheers <br>
</div>
<div dir=3D"ltr">Mike Deweerd #77<br>
</div>
<div dir=3D"ltr"><br>
</div>
<div dir=3D"ltr"><br>
</div>
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</div>
<div dir=3D"ltr">Sent from my iPhone<br>
</div>
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<pre class=3D"moz-quote-pre">_______________________________________________=

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From: Terry O’Beirne via Fot <[email-masked]>
Date: Wed, 19 Jun 2019 21:53:37 +0000

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---

From: "van.mulders.marcel--- via Fot" <[email-masked]>
Date: Thu, 20 Jun 2019 00:13:54 +0200 (CEST)

--===============8975650380829779792==
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The conversion to ball bearings sdeems very interesting. What size of ball =
bearings can be used? Doesn't it weaken the part on wich the countergears a=
re mounted too much?=20
Marcel=20

Van: "fot" <[email-masked]>=20
Aan: "Geoff Byrne" <[email-masked]>, "fot" <[email-masked]>=20
Verzonden: Woensdag 19 juni 2019 23:53:37=20
Onderwerp: Re: [Fot] TR4 transmission=20

I started converting our race boxes to taper rollers on the layshaft almost=
 30 years ago. Totally agree with Geoff that the replacement syncro rings a=
re generally very poor, but as yet, have not found the need or $ to convert=
 to a dog box, nice as that might be. I luckily still have a small stash of=
 original Leyland ST close ratio gears but as they dry up, will be forced i=
nto =E2=80=9Cplan B=E2=80=9D=20

Terry=20

Another down under racer=20

From: Fot <[email-masked]> On Behalf Of Geoff Byrne via Fot=20
Sent: 19 June 2019 21:14=20
To: [email-masked]=20
Cc: fot <[email-masked]>=20
Subject: Re: [Fot] TR4 transmission=20

I=E2=80=99ve been racing my tr6 for over 15 years and gave up,on the synchr=
o box due to the inability to get good quality rings. Swapped to a quaiffe =
dog box and ended up buying another one from Vessey and a third from bustuc=
k . Having experienced several counter shaft needle bearing failures which =
can be very costly I have developed a box with ball bearings on a fixed lay=
 shaft. Does involved a bit of machining but as I have my own machine shop =
and the time it not a problem for me. After four years of solid racing the =
ball bearing are still perfect. Not for everyone but bullet proof.=20

If anyone is interested in details email me=20

Regards=20

Geoff Byrne TR6 racer down under=20

Sent from my iPad=20

On 19 Jun 2019, at 6:14 am, van.mulders.marcel--- via Fot < [ mailto:fot@au=
tox.team.net | [email-masked] ] > wrote:=20

Marcel.=20

Van: "fot" < [ mailto:[email-masked] | [email-masked] ] >=20
Aan: "Tony Drews" < [ mailto:[email-masked] | [email-masked] ] >=20
Cc: "fot" < [ mailto:[email-masked] | [email-masked] ] >=20
Verzonden: Dinsdag 18 juni 2019 18:54:23=20
Onderwerp: Re: [Fot] TR4 transmission=20

T=20

Sent from my iPhone=20

BQ_BEGIN

Cheers, Tony Drews=20

BQ_BEGIN

Hi,=20

=09
=09
=09
=09=09
=09

=09=09Dennis Vessey - Quaife gear kits for Triumph TRs=20

metatags generator=20

Vesseys Triumph TR Dog-Engagement Gear Kit - developed with Quaife=20

Regards,=20

Bob Lang=20

339-927-4489=20

On Tuesday, June 18, 2019, 9:02:31 AM EDT, Mike Deweerd via Fot [ mailto:fo=
[email-masked] | <[email-masked]> ] wrote:=20

Amici=20

Cheers=20

Mike Deweerd #77=20

Sent from my iPhone=20

 ]=20

Archive: [ http://autox.team.net/archive%20 | http://autox.team.net/archive
 ] [ http://www.team.net/pipermail/fot | http://www.team.net/pipermail/fot =
]=20

[email-masked] |=20

ews.com | http://autox.team.net/mailman/options/fot/[email-masked] ]=20

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Archive: [ http://autox.team.net/archive | http://autox.team.net/archive ] =
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--></style></div><div>The conversion to ball bearings sdeems very interesti=
ng. What size of ball bearings can be used? Doesn't it weaken the part on w=
ich the countergears are mounted too much?</div><div>Marcel</div><div><br><=
/div><hr id=3D"zwchr" data-marker=3D"__DIVIDER__"><div data-marker=3D"__HEA=
DERS__"><b>Van: </b>"fot" &lt;[email-masked]&gt;<br><b>Aan: </b>"Geoff =
Byrne" &lt;[email-masked]&gt;, "fot" &lt;[email-masked]&gt;<br=
><b>Verzonden: </b>Woensdag 19 juni 2019 23:53:37<br><b>Onderwerp: </b>Re: =
[Fot] TR4 transmission<br></div><div><br></div><div data-marker=3D"__QUOTED=
_TEXT__">

<div class=3D"WordSection1">
<p class=3D"MsoNormal"><span style=3D"mso-fareast-language:EN-US">I started=
 converting our race boxes to taper rollers on the layshaft almost 30 years=
 ago. Totally agree with Geoff that the replacement syncro rings are genera=
lly very poor, but as yet, have not
 found the need or $ to convert to a dog box, nice as that might be. I luck=
ily still have a small stash of original Leyland ST close ratio gears but a=
s they dry up, will be forced into =E2=80=9Cplan B=E2=80=9D</span></p>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal"><span style=3D"mso-fareast-language:EN-US">&nbsp;</s=
pan></p>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal"><span style=3D"mso-fareast-language:EN-US">Terry </s=
pan></p>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal"><span style=3D"mso-fareast-language:EN-US">Another d=
own under racer</span></p>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal"><span style=3D"mso-fareast-language:EN-US">&nbsp;</s=
pan></p>
<div>
<div style=3D"border:none;border-top:solid #E1E1E1 1.0pt;padding:3.0pt 0cm =
0cm 0cm">
<p class=3D"MsoNormal"><b><span lang=3D"EN-US">From:</span></b><span lang=
=3D"EN-US"> Fot &lt;[email-masked]&gt;
<b>On Behalf Of </b>Geoff Byrne via Fot<br>
<b>Sent:</b> 19 June 2019 21:14<br>
<b>To:</b> [email-masked]<br>
<b>Cc:</b> fot &lt;[email-masked]&gt;<br>
<b>Subject:</b> Re: [Fot] TR4 transmission</span></p>
</div>
</div>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal">&nbsp;</p>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal">I=E2=80=99ve been racing my tr6 for over 15 years an=
d gave up,on the synchro box due to the inability to get good quality rings=
. Swapped to a quaiffe dog box and ended up buying another one from Vessey =
and a third from bustuck . Having experienced
 several counter shaft needle bearing failures which can be very costly I h=
ave developed a box with ball bearings on a fixed lay shaft. Does involved =
a bit of machining but as I have my own machine shop and the time it not a =
problem for me. After four years
 of solid racing the ball bearing are still perfect. Not for everyone but b=
ullet proof.</p>
<div>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal">If anyone is interested in details email me</p>
</div>
<div>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal">Regards&nbsp;</p>
</div>
<div>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal" style=3D"margin-bottom:12.0pt">Geoff Byrne TR6 racer=
 down under</p>
<div id=3D"AppleMailSignature">
<p class=3D"MsoNormal">Sent from my iPad</p>
</div>
<div>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal" style=3D"margin-bottom:12.0pt"><br>
On 19 Jun 2019, at 6:14 am, van.mulders.marcel--- via Fot &lt;<a href=3D"ma=
ilto:[email-masked]" target=3D"_blank">[email-masked]</a>&gt; wrote=
:</p>
</div>
<blockquote style=3D"margin-top:5.0pt;margin-bottom:5.0pt">
<div>
<div>
<div>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal"><span style=3D"font-size:10.0pt;font-family:&quot;Ve=
rdana&quot;,sans-serif;color:black">Bastuck announced a new batch of dog bo=
x gear sets that should have been available from february 2019 onwards. It =
took longer, but these sets are available now.</span></p>
</div>
<div>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal"><span style=3D"font-size:10.0pt;font-family:&quot;Ve=
rdana&quot;,sans-serif;color:black">Marcel.</span></p>
</div>
<div>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal"><span style=3D"font-size:10.0pt;font-family:&quot;Ve=
rdana&quot;,sans-serif;color:black">&nbsp;</span></p>
</div>
<div class=3D"MsoNormal" align=3D"center" style=3D"text-align:center"><span=
 style=3D"font-size:10.0pt;font-family:&quot;Verdana&quot;,sans-serif;color=
:black">
<hr size=3D"2" width=3D"100%" align=3D"center" id=3D"zwchr">
</span></div>
<div>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal"><b><span style=3D"font-size:10.0pt;font-family:&quot=
;Verdana&quot;,sans-serif;color:black">Van:
</span></b><span style=3D"font-size:10.0pt;font-family:&quot;Verdana&quot;,=
sans-serif;color:black">"fot" &lt;<a href=3D"mailto:[email-masked]" tar=
get=3D"_blank">[email-masked]</a>&gt;<br>
<b>Aan: </b>"Tony Drews" &lt;<a href=3D"mailto:[email-masked]" target=
=3D"_blank">[email-masked]</a>&gt;<br>
<b>Cc: </b>"fot" &lt;<a href=3D"mailto:[email-masked]" target=3D"_blank=
">[email-masked]</a>&gt;<br>
<b>Verzonden: </b>Dinsdag 18 juni 2019 18:54:23<br>
<b>Onderwerp: </b>Re: [Fot] TR4 transmission</span></p>
</div>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal"><span style=3D"font-size:10.0pt;font-family:&quot;Ve=
rdana&quot;,sans-serif;color:black">&nbsp;</span></p>
<div>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal"><span style=3D"font-size:10.0pt;font-family:&quot;Ve=
rdana&quot;,sans-serif;color:black">I would add that you can buy individual=
 parts for the quaife should you wear out a hub or chip a tooth . Each comp=
onent has laser engraved part numbers .
</span></p>
<div>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal" style=3D"margin-bottom:12.0pt"><span style=3D"font-s=
ize:10.0pt;font-family:&quot;Verdana&quot;,sans-serif;color:black">T</span>=
</p>
<div id=3D"AppleMailSignature">
<p class=3D"MsoNormal"><span style=3D"font-size:10.0pt;font-family:&quot;Ve=
rdana&quot;,sans-serif;color:black">Sent from my iPhone</span></p>
</div>
<div>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal" style=3D"margin-bottom:12.0pt"><span style=3D"font-s=
ize:10.0pt;font-family:&quot;Verdana&quot;,sans-serif;color:black"><br>
On Jun 18, 2019, at 9:20 AM, Tony Drews via Fot &lt;<a href=3D"mailto:fot@a=
utox.team.net" target=3D"_blank">[email-masked]</a>&gt; wrote:</span></=
p>
</div>
<blockquote style=3D"margin-top:5.0pt;margin-bottom:5.0pt">
<div>
<p><span style=3D"font-size:10.0pt;font-family:&quot;Verdana&quot;,sans-ser=
if;color:black">Nice summary!&nbsp; I don't have much to add other than the=
 Quaife gearset uses substantial needle bearings inside each of the gears, =
much larger input to mainshaft needle bearing, steel
 thrust washers within the stack.&nbsp; Work of art.&nbsp; Layshaft still u=
ses semi-stock bearings.</span></p>
<p><span style=3D"font-size:10.0pt;font-family:&quot;Verdana&quot;,sans-ser=
if;color:black">When I blew up my tranny I ended up going with the Quaife a=
nd really like it.&nbsp; No synchros to break, shifts are lightning quick, =
gear ratios work well.</span></p>
<p><span style=3D"font-size:10.0pt;font-family:&quot;Verdana&quot;,sans-ser=
if;color:black">Cheers, Tony Drews</span></p>
<div>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal"><span style=3D"font-size:10.0pt;font-family:&quot;Ve=
rdana&quot;,sans-serif;color:black">On 6/18/2019 9:24 AM, Robert Lang via F=
ot wrote:</span></p>
</div>
<blockquote style=3D"margin-top:5.0pt;margin-bottom:5.0pt">
<div>
<div>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal"><span style=3D"font-size:10.0pt;font-family:&quot;He=
lvetica&quot;,sans-serif;color:black">Hi,</span></p>
</div>
<div>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal"><span style=3D"font-size:10.0pt;font-family:&quot;He=
lvetica&quot;,sans-serif;color:black">&nbsp;</span></p>
</div>
<div>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal"><span style=3D"font-size:10.0pt;font-family:&quot;He=
lvetica&quot;,sans-serif;color:black">Those are THE questions, aren't they?=
</span></p>
</div>
<div>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal"><span style=3D"font-size:10.0pt;font-family:&quot;He=
lvetica&quot;,sans-serif;color:black">&nbsp;</span></p>
</div>
<div>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal"><span style=3D"font-size:10.0pt;font-family:&quot;He=
lvetica&quot;,sans-serif;color:black">Okay - Quaife has a straight-cut gear=
 set that uses dog-rings, no synchros. Big $$$, 1600 UK pounds. Quaife just=
 ran off a set and the one source that I know
 of in the UK can get them:</span></p>
</div>
<div>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal"><span style=3D"font-size:10.0pt;font-family:&quot;He=
lvetica&quot;,sans-serif;color:black">&nbsp;</span></p>
</div>
<div>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal"><span style=3D"font-size:10.0pt;font-family:&quot;He=
lvetica&quot;,sans-serif;color:black"><a href=3D"http://www.vessey-classic-=
car-services.co.uk/triumph-gear-kit.htm#.XQjuu3t7n64" target=3D"_blank">Den=
nis Vessey - Quaife gear kits for Triumph TRs</a></span></p>
</div>
<div>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal"><span style=3D"font-size:10.0pt;font-family:&quot;He=
lvetica&quot;,sans-serif;color:black">&nbsp;</span></p>
</div>
<div id=3D"ydpd666f494enhancr_card_1791886968">
<table class=3D"MsoNormalTable" border=3D"0" cellspacing=3D"0" cellpadding=
=3D"0" style=3D"max-width:300.0pt">
<tbody>
<tr>
<td width=3D"400" style=3D"width:300.0pt;padding:0cm 0cm 0cm 0cm">
<table class=3D"MsoNormalTable" border=3D"1" cellspacing=3D"0" cellpadding=
=3D"0" style=3D"max-width:300.0pt;border:solid windowtext 1.0pt">
<tbody>
<tr style=3D"height:131.25pt">
<td valign=3D"top" style=3D"border:none;background:black;padding:0cm 0cm 0c=
m 0cm;height:131.25pt">
<table class=3D"MsoNormalTable" border=3D"0" cellspacing=3D"0" cellpadding=
=3D"0" width=3D"100%" style=3D"width:100.0%">
<tbody>
<tr>
<td valign=3D"top" style=3D"padding:0cm 0cm 0cm 0cm">
<table class=3D"MsoNormalTable" border=3D"0" cellpadding=3D"0" width=3D"100=
%" style=3D"width:100.0%">
<tbody>
<tr>
<td valign=3D"top" style=3D"padding:11.25pt 0cm 0cm 11.25pt"></td>
<td valign=3D"top" style=3D"padding:11.25pt 11.25pt 0cm 0cm"></td>
</tr>
</tbody>
</table>
</td>
</tr>
</tbody>
</table>
</td>
</tr>
<tr>
<td style=3D"border:none;padding:0cm 0cm 0cm 0cm;border-radius:0
                                    0 0 2px">
<div align=3D"center">
<table class=3D"MsoNormalTable" border=3D"1" cellspacing=3D"0" cellpadding=
=3D"0" style=3D"max-width:300.0pt;border:none;border-top:solid #E0E4E9 1.0p=
t;background-color:rgb(255, 255,
                              255);background-size:
                              auto;border-radius: 0px 0px 2px 2px;backgroun=
d-attachment:scroll;z-index:2">
<tbody>
<tr>
<td valign=3D"top" style=3D"border:none;background:white;padding:12.0pt 0cm=
 12.0pt 9.0pt">
</td>
<td width=3D"99%" style=3D"width:99.0%;border:none;padding:9.0pt 18.0pt 12.=
0pt 9.0pt;border-radius:0 0 2px 0">
<h2 style=3D"mso-margin-top-alt:0cm;margin-right:0cm;margin-bottom:4.5pt;ma=
rgin-left:0cm;line-height:14.25pt;color:rgb(38, 40,
                                      42)">
<span style=3D"font-size:10.5pt;font-family:&quot;Segoe UI&quot;,sans-serif=
;color:windowtext">Dennis Vessey - Quaife gear kits for Triumph TRs</span><=
/h2>
<p class=3D"ydpd666f494card-richinfo-primary" style=3D"mso-margin-top-alt:0=
cm;margin-right:0cm;margin-bottom:3.0pt;margin-left:0cm;line-height:12.0pt"=
<span style=3D"font-size:9.0pt;font-family:&quot;Segoe UI&quot;,sans-serif;=
color:#979BA7">metatags generator</span></p>
<p class=3D"ydpd666f494card-description" style=3D"margin:0cm;margin-bottom:=
.0001pt;line-height:12.0pt">
<span style=3D"font-size:9.0pt;font-family:&quot;Segoe UI&quot;,sans-serif;=
color:#979BA7">Vesseys Triumph TR Dog-Engagement Gear Kit - developed with =
Quaife</span></p>
</td>
</tr>
</tbody>
</table>
</div>
</td>
</tr>
</tbody>
</table>
</td>
</tr>
</tbody>
</table>
</div>
<div>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal"><span style=3D"font-size:10.0pt;font-family:&quot;He=
lvetica&quot;,sans-serif;color:black">&nbsp;</span></p>
</div>
<div>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal"><span style=3D"font-size:10.0pt;font-family:&quot;He=
lvetica&quot;,sans-serif;color:black">&nbsp;</span></p>
</div>
<div>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal"><span style=3D"font-size:10.0pt;font-family:&quot;He=
lvetica&quot;,sans-serif;color:black">&nbsp;</span></p>
</div>
<div>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal"><span style=3D"font-size:10.0pt;font-family:&quot;He=
lvetica&quot;,sans-serif;color:black">Note, if you decide to go that route,=
 please contact me, I've been in contact with the vendor and I'm trying to =
place an order for this gearset. Maybe we can
 save some shipping if we get a couple of sets.</span></p>
</div>
<div>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal"><span style=3D"font-size:10.0pt;font-family:&quot;He=
lvetica&quot;,sans-serif;color:black">&nbsp;</span></p>
</div>
<div>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal"><span style=3D"font-size:10.0pt;font-family:&quot;He=
lvetica&quot;,sans-serif;color:black">Note too that Bastuck has dog box gea=
r sets including one using the J-type overdrive. When I contacted them last=
 fall, they had none in stock and there was no
 production scheduled.</span></p>
</div>
<div>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal"><span style=3D"font-size:10.0pt;font-family:&quot;He=
lvetica&quot;,sans-serif;color:black">&nbsp;</span></p>
</div>
<div>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal"><span style=3D"font-size:10.0pt;font-family:&quot;He=
lvetica&quot;,sans-serif;color:black">Failing that option, there's the "Dol=
omite Close Ratio Gearset". This consists of a different input shaft and ma=
in 3rd gear along with the corresponding layshaft
 gears. You need to work the case to get these to pit, but they work great.=
 These are helical gears. I've used this setup for around 20 years, and it =
is really really good. Note: for the best total gear ratio option, get a la=
ter TR6 gearbox with the 16-tooth
 1st laygear.</span></p>
</div>
<div>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal"><span style=3D"font-size:10.0pt;font-family:&quot;He=
lvetica&quot;,sans-serif;color:black">&nbsp;</span></p>
</div>
<div>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal"><span style=3D"font-size:10.0pt;font-family:&quot;He=
lvetica&quot;,sans-serif;color:black">Now, the drawback to the helical gear=
s is apparently excessive thrust forces and they effect the layshaft thrust=
 washers as well as the layshaft needle bearings.
 If you make torque and you have any end float for the layshaft, you will s=
pin the thrust washers and wreck the case. There are some workarounds to co=
mpensate for excessive end float.</span></p>
</div>
<div>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal"><span style=3D"font-size:10.0pt;font-family:&quot;He=
lvetica&quot;,sans-serif;color:black">&nbsp;</span></p>
</div>
<div>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal"><span style=3D"font-size:10.0pt;font-family:&quot;He=
lvetica&quot;,sans-serif;color:black">Note too that because of torque multi=
plication, the layshaft needle bearings on the 1st gear end of the layshaft=
 get beat really, really hard. One fix is to install
 a double bearing on the layshaft (or buy a new one from Moss or another so=
urce) that is set up for the double bearing. I've had Quantum Mechanics ins=
tall the double bearings, they seem to work better than the stock setup. Bu=
t even with that setup, the layshaft
 still gets pounded and you need to keep an eye on it.</span></p>
</div>
<div>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal"><span style=3D"font-size:10.0pt;font-family:&quot;He=
lvetica&quot;,sans-serif;color:black">&nbsp;</span></p>
</div>
<div>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal"><span style=3D"font-size:10.0pt;font-family:&quot;He=
lvetica&quot;,sans-serif;color:black">As you may know, a lot of the racers =
are gravitating away from the stock and/or modified Triumph gearboxes mostl=
y because the quality consistency of replacement
 parts is all over the place and you need to know what you're getting to sp=
ot the differences. That said, frequent oil changes and paying attention to=
 the detritus in the oil, you can stay ahead of problems.</span></p>
</div>
<div>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal"><span style=3D"font-size:10.0pt;font-family:&quot;He=
lvetica&quot;,sans-serif;color:black">&nbsp;</span></p>
</div>
<div>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal"><span style=3D"font-size:10.0pt;font-family:&quot;He=
lvetica&quot;,sans-serif;color:black">If you're going to build a good gearb=
ox, it will cost you as much or more than some of the conversions out there=
, hence a lot of folks switch to Toyota/T5/Rocket,
 etc.</span></p>
</div>
<div>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal"><span style=3D"font-size:10.0pt;font-family:&quot;He=
lvetica&quot;,sans-serif;color:black">&nbsp;</span></p>
</div>
<div>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal"><span style=3D"font-size:10.0pt;font-family:&quot;He=
lvetica&quot;,sans-serif;color:black">Hopefully you'll get other good advic=
e on this list, but that's where I'm at right now (too). The Quaife gearset=
 in the TR gearbox seems like the most "vintage"
 solution, but ALL of the options have pluses and minuses. In the spirit of=
 full transparency, I'm also looking at Super T10 transmissions which are t=
he same as the old Muncie "Rock Crusher" and there is a gearset available w=
ith a 2.43 1st, 1.63 2nd, 1.23 3rd
 and 1 4th which is pretty close to the Dolomite Sprint setup. And the gear=
box is 70 pounds which is really close to the stock box. Also, if you want =
to dish out more $$$, Gear Vendors has an overdrive that bolts to the T-10,=
 I haven't researched that enough
 to see if there are any particulars, but it is an option, albeit around $3=
k. But you get a BRAND NEW overdrive. Just sayin. A drawback to the Super T=
10 is that you will need to make or source a bell housing, but that is do-a=
ble with a combo of a trashed TR
 gearbox, a competent machinist and more $$$. ;-)</span></p>
</div>
<div>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal"><span style=3D"font-size:10.0pt;font-family:&quot;He=
lvetica&quot;,sans-serif;color:black">&nbsp;</span></p>
</div>
<div>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal"><span style=3D"font-size:10.0pt;font-family:&quot;He=
lvetica&quot;,sans-serif;color:black">Regards,</span></p>
</div>
<div>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal"><span style=3D"font-size:10.0pt;font-family:&quot;He=
lvetica&quot;,sans-serif;color:black">Bob Lang</span></p>
</div>
<div>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal"><span style=3D"font-size:10.0pt;font-family:&quot;He=
lvetica&quot;,sans-serif;color:black">339-927-4489</span></p>
</div>
<div>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal"><span style=3D"font-size:10.0pt;font-family:&quot;He=
lvetica&quot;,sans-serif;color:black">&nbsp;</span></p>
</div>
</div>
<div id=3D"ydpe091f580yahoo_quoted_1530796332">
<div>
<div>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal"><span style=3D"font-size:10.0pt;font-family:&quot;He=
lvetica&quot;,sans-serif;color:#26282A">On Tuesday, June 18, 2019, 9:02:31 =
AM EDT, Mike Deweerd via Fot
<a href=3D"mailto:[email-masked]" target=3D"_blank">&lt;[email-masked].=
net&gt;</a> wrote:
</span></p>
</div>
<div>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal"><span style=3D"font-size:10.0pt;font-family:&quot;He=
lvetica&quot;,sans-serif;color:#26282A">&nbsp;</span></p>
</div>
<div>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal"><span style=3D"font-size:10.0pt;font-family:&quot;He=
lvetica&quot;,sans-serif;color:#26282A">&nbsp;</span></p>
</div>
<div>
<div>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal"><span style=3D"font-size:10.0pt;font-family:&quot;He=
lvetica&quot;,sans-serif;color:#26282A">Amici
</span></p>
</div>
<div>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal"><span style=3D"font-size:10.0pt;font-family:&quot;He=
lvetica&quot;,sans-serif;color:#26282A">What is the preferred gearbox for t=
he TR4 non overdrive and where is the best source for getting such</span></=
p>
</div>
<div>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal"><span style=3D"font-size:10.0pt;font-family:&quot;He=
lvetica&quot;,sans-serif;color:#26282A">I=E2=80=99m looking at the pros and=
 cons of the straight cut gear set vs the close ratio gear set (I=E2=80=99m=
 assuming the close ratio is still helical gears)
</span></p>
</div>
<div>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal"><span style=3D"font-size:10.0pt;font-family:&quot;He=
lvetica&quot;,sans-serif;color:#26282A">Please chime in with preferences an=
d opinions
</span></p>
</div>
<div>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal"><span style=3D"font-size:10.0pt;font-family:&quot;He=
lvetica&quot;,sans-serif;color:#26282A">Cheers
</span></p>
</div>
<div>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal"><span style=3D"font-size:10.0pt;font-family:&quot;He=
lvetica&quot;,sans-serif;color:#26282A">Mike Deweerd #77</span></p>
</div>
<div>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal"><span style=3D"font-size:10.0pt;font-family:&quot;He=
lvetica&quot;,sans-serif;color:#26282A">&nbsp;</span></p>
</div>
<div>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal"><span style=3D"font-size:10.0pt;font-family:&quot;He=
lvetica&quot;,sans-serif;color:#26282A">&nbsp;</span></p>
</div>
<div>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal"><span style=3D"font-size:10.0pt;font-family:&quot;He=
lvetica&quot;,sans-serif;color:#26282A">&nbsp;</span></p>
</div>
<div>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal"><span style=3D"font-size:10.0pt;font-family:&quot;He=
lvetica&quot;,sans-serif;color:#26282A">Sent from my iPhone</span></p>
</div>
<div>
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--=_0b7e2cf7-0e33-4f36-b3a6-bbd1cff7b513--

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---

From: geoff byrne via Fot <[email-masked]>
Date: Mon, 24 Jun 2019 22:44:31 +1000

This is a multipart message in MIME format.

--===============1134404307774788628==
	boundary="----=_NextPart_000_0069_01D52ADE.64D4C670"
Content-Language: en-us

This is a multipart message in MIME format.

------=_NextPart_000_0069_01D52ADE.64D4C670
	charset="utf-8"
Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable

Terry

I would love to have the details on how you set up the box with tapered =
bearing I was not able to come up with a satisfactory method of fixing =
and sealing

Regards Geoff

=20

From: Terry O=E2=80=99Beirne [mailto:[email-masked]]=20
Sent: Thursday, June 20, 2019 7:54 AM
To: Geoff Byrne; [email-masked]
Subject: RE: [Fot] TR4 transmission

=20

I started converting our race boxes to taper rollers on the layshaft =
almost 30 years ago. Totally agree with Geoff that the replacement =
syncro rings are generally very poor, but as yet, have not found the =
need or $ to convert to a dog box, nice as that might be. I luckily =
still have a small stash of original Leyland ST close ratio gears but as =
they dry up, will be forced into =E2=80=9Cplan B=E2=80=9D

=20

Terry=20

Another down under racer

=20

From: Fot <[email-masked]> On Behalf Of Geoff Byrne via Fot
Sent: 19 June 2019 21:14
To: [email-masked]
Cc: fot <[email-masked]>
Subject: Re: [Fot] TR4 transmission

=20

I=E2=80=99ve been racing my tr6 for over 15 years and gave up,on the =
synchro box due to the inability to get good quality rings. Swapped to a =
quaiffe dog box and ended up buying another one from Vessey and a third =
from bustuck . Having experienced several counter shaft needle bearing =
failures which can be very costly I have developed a box with ball =
bearings on a fixed lay shaft. Does involved a bit of machining but as I =
have my own machine shop and the time it not a problem for me. After =
four years of solid racing the ball bearing are still perfect. Not for =
everyone but bullet proof.

Regards=20

Sent from my iPad

On 19 Jun 2019, at 6:14 am, van.mulders.marcel--- via Fot =
<[email-masked]> wrote:

Bastuck announced a new batch of dog box gear sets that should have been =
available from february 2019 onwards. It took longer, but these sets are =
available now.

Marcel.

=20

  _____ =20

Onderwerp: Re: [Fot] TR4 transmission

=20

I would add that you can buy individual parts for the quaife should you =
wear out a hub or chip a tooth . Each component has laser engraved part =
numbers .=20

T

Sent from my iPhone

On Jun 18, 2019, at 9:20 AM, Tony Drews via Fot <[email-masked]> =
wrote:

Nice summary!  I don't have much to add other than the Quaife gearset =
uses substantial needle bearings inside each of the gears, much larger =
input to mainshaft needle bearing, steel thrust washers within the =
stack.  Work of art.  Layshaft still uses semi-stock bearings.

When I blew up my tranny I ended up going with the Quaife and really =
like it.  No synchros to break, shifts are lightning quick, gear ratios =
work well.

Cheers, Tony Drews

Hi,

=20

=20

Okay - Quaife has a straight-cut gear set that uses dog-rings, no =
synchros. Big $$$, 1600 UK pounds. Quaife just ran off a set and the one =
source that I know of in the UK can get them:

=20

Dennis Vessey - Quaife gear kits for Triumph TRs =
<http://www.vessey-classic-car-services.co.uk/triumph-gear-kit.htm#.XQjuu=
3t7n64>=20

=20

	=09

=09

metatags generator

=20

=20

=20

Note, if you decide to go that route, please contact me, I've been in =
contact with the vendor and I'm trying to place an order for this =
gearset. Maybe we can save some shipping if we get a couple of sets.

=20

Note too that Bastuck has dog box gear sets including one using the =
J-type overdrive. When I contacted them last fall, they had none in =
stock and there was no production scheduled.

=20

Failing that option, there's the "Dolomite Close Ratio Gearset". This =
consists of a different input shaft and main 3rd gear along with the =
corresponding layshaft gears. You need to work the case to get these to =
pit, but they work great. These are helical gears. I've used this setup =
for around 20 years, and it is really really good. Note: for the best =
total gear ratio option, get a later TR6 gearbox with the 16-tooth 1st =
laygear.

=20

Now, the drawback to the helical gears is apparently excessive thrust =
forces and they effect the layshaft thrust washers as well as the =
layshaft needle bearings. If you make torque and you have any end float =
for the layshaft, you will spin the thrust washers and wreck the case. =
There are some workarounds to compensate for excessive end float.

=20

Note too that because of torque multiplication, the layshaft needle =
bearings on the 1st gear end of the layshaft get beat really, really =
hard. One fix is to install a double bearing on the layshaft (or buy a =
new one from Moss or another source) that is set up for the double =
bearing. I've had Quantum Mechanics install the double bearings, they =
seem to work better than the stock setup. But even with that setup, the =
layshaft still gets pounded and you need to keep an eye on it.

=20

As you may know, a lot of the racers are gravitating away from the stock =
and/or modified Triumph gearboxes mostly because the quality consistency =
of replacement parts is all over the place and you need to know what =
you're getting to spot the differences. That said, frequent oil changes =
and paying attention to the detritus in the oil, you can stay ahead of =
problems.

=20

If you're going to build a good gearbox, it will cost you as much or =
more than some of the conversions out there, hence a lot of folks switch =
to Toyota/T5/Rocket, etc.

=20

Hopefully you'll get other good advice on this list, but that's where =
I'm at right now (too). The Quaife gearset in the TR gearbox seems like =
the most "vintage" solution, but ALL of the options have pluses and =
minuses. In the spirit of full transparency, I'm also looking at Super =
T10 transmissions which are the same as the old Muncie "Rock Crusher" =
and there is a gearset available with a 2.43 1st, 1.63 2nd, 1.23 3rd and =
1 4th which is pretty close to the Dolomite Sprint setup. And the =
gearbox is 70 pounds which is really close to the stock box. Also, if =
you want to dish out more $$$, Gear Vendors has an overdrive that bolts =
to the T-10, I haven't researched that enough to see if there are any =
particulars, but it is an option, albeit around $3k. But you get a BRAND =
NEW overdrive. Just sayin. A drawback to the Super T10 is that you will =
need to make or source a bell housing, but that is do-able with a combo =
of a trashed TR gearbox, a competent machinist and more $$$. ;-)

=20

Regards,

Bob Lang

339-927-4489

=20

On Tuesday, June 18, 2019, 9:02:31 AM EDT, Mike Deweerd via Fot  =

=20

=20

Amici=20

What is the preferred gearbox for the TR4 non overdrive and where is the =
best source for getting such

I=E2=80=99m looking at the pros and cons of the straight cut gear set vs =
the close ratio gear set (I=E2=80=99m assuming the close ratio is still =
helical gears)=20

Cheers=20

Mike Deweerd #77

=20

=20

=20

Sent from my iPhone

[email-masked]

=20

=20

Archive: http://autox.team.net/archive  =
<http://autox.team.net/archive%20> http://www.team.net/pipermail/fot

=20

=20

=20

_______________________________________________
[email-masked]
=20
http://www.fot-racing.com
=20
Archive: http://autox.team.net/archive http://www.team.net/pipermail/fot
http://autox.team.net/mailman/options/fot/[email-masked]
=20
=20

Archive: http://autox.team.net/archive http://www.team.net/pipermail/fot
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vlink=3Dpurple><div class=3DWordSection1><p class=3DMsoNormal><span =
style=3D'color:#1F497D'>Terry<o:p></o:p></span></p><p =
class=3DMsoNormal><span style=3D'color:#1F497D'>I would love to have the =
details on how you set up the box with tapered bearing I was not able to =
come up with a satisfactory method of fixing and =
sealing<o:p></o:p></span></p><p class=3DMsoNormal><span =
style=3D'color:#1F497D'>Regards Geoff<o:p></o:p></span></p><p =
class=3DMsoNormal><span =
style=3D'color:#1F497D'><o:p>&nbsp;</o:p></span></p><div><div =
style=3D'border:none;border-top:solid #B5C4DF 1.0pt;padding:3.0pt 0in =
0in 0in'><p class=3DMsoNormal><b><span lang=3DEN-US =
style=3D'font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Tahoma","sans-serif"'>From:</span>=
</b><span lang=3DEN-US =
style=3D'font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Tahoma","sans-serif"'> Terry =
O=E2=80=99Beirne [mailto:[email-masked]] <br><b>Sent:</b> =
Thursday, June 20, 2019 7:54 AM<br><b>To:</b> Geoff Byrne; =
[email-masked]<br><b>Subject:</b> RE: [Fot] TR4 =
transmission<o:p></o:p></span></p></div></div><p =
class=3DMsoNormal><o:p>&nbsp;</o:p></p><p class=3DMsoNormal><span =
style=3D'mso-fareast-language:EN-US'>I started converting our race boxes =
to taper rollers on the layshaft almost 30 years ago. Totally agree with =
Geoff that the replacement syncro rings are generally very poor, but as =
yet, have not found the need or $ to convert to a dog box, nice as that =
might be. I luckily still have a small stash of original Leyland ST =
close ratio gears but as they dry up, will be forced into =E2=80=9Cplan =
B=E2=80=9D<o:p></o:p></span></p><p class=3DMsoNormal><span =
style=3D'mso-fareast-language:EN-US'><o:p>&nbsp;</o:p></span></p><p =
class=3DMsoNormal><span style=3D'mso-fareast-language:EN-US'>Terry =
<o:p></o:p></span></p><p class=3DMsoNormal><span =
style=3D'mso-fareast-language:EN-US'>Another down under =
racer<o:p></o:p></span></p><p class=3DMsoNormal><span =
style=3D'mso-fareast-language:EN-US'><o:p>&nbsp;</o:p></span></p><div><di=
v style=3D'border:none;border-top:solid #E1E1E1 1.0pt;padding:3.0pt 0in =
0in 0in'><p class=3DMsoNormal><b><span =
lang=3DEN-US>From:</span></b><span lang=3DEN-US> Fot =
&lt;[email-masked]&gt; <b>On Behalf Of </b>Geoff Byrne via =
Fot<br><b>Sent:</b> 19 June 2019 21:14<br><b>To:</b> =
[email-masked]<br><b>Cc:</b> fot =
&lt;[email-masked]&gt;<br><b>Subject:</b> Re: [Fot] TR4 =
transmission<o:p></o:p></span></p></div></div><p =
class=3DMsoNormal><o:p>&nbsp;</o:p></p><p class=3DMsoNormal>I=E2=80=99ve =
been racing my tr6 for over 15 years and gave up,on the synchro box due =
to the inability to get good quality rings. Swapped to a quaiffe dog box =
and ended up buying another one from Vessey and a third from bustuck . =
Having experienced several counter shaft needle bearing failures which =
can be very costly I have developed a box with ball bearings on a fixed =
lay shaft. Does involved a bit of machining but as I have my own machine =
shop and the time it not a problem for me. After four years of solid =
racing the ball bearing are still perfect. Not for everyone but bullet =
proof.<o:p></o:p></p><div><p class=3DMsoNormal>If anyone is interested =
in details email me<o:p></o:p></p></div><div><p =
class=3DMsoNormal>Regards&nbsp;<o:p></o:p></p></div><div><p =
class=3DMsoNormal style=3D'margin-bottom:12.0pt'>Geoff Byrne TR6 racer =
down under<o:p></o:p></p><div id=3DAppleMailSignature><p =
class=3DMsoNormal>Sent from my iPad<o:p></o:p></p></div><div><p =
class=3DMsoNormal style=3D'margin-bottom:12.0pt'><br>On 19 Jun 2019, at =
6:14 am, van.mulders.marcel--- via Fot &lt;<a =
href=3D"mailto:[email-masked]">[email-masked]</a>&gt; =
wrote:<o:p></o:p></p></div><blockquote =
style=3D'margin-top:5.0pt;margin-bottom:5.0pt'><div><div><div><p =
class=3DMsoNormal><span =
style=3D'font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Verdana","sans-serif";color:black'=
>Bastuck announced a new batch of dog box gear sets that should have =
been available from february 2019 onwards. It took longer, but these =
sets are available now.<o:p></o:p></span></p></div><div><p =
class=3DMsoNormal><span =
style=3D'font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Verdana","sans-serif";color:black'=
>Marcel.<o:p></o:p></span></p></div><div><p class=3DMsoNormal><span =
style=3D'font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Verdana","sans-serif";color:black'=
><o:p>&nbsp;</o:p></span></p></div><div class=3DMsoNormal align=3Dcenter =
style=3D'text-align:center'><span =
style=3D'font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Verdana","sans-serif";color:black'=
><hr size=3D2 width=3D"100%" align=3Dcenter></span></div><div><p =
class=3DMsoNormal><b><span =
style=3D'font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Verdana","sans-serif";color:black'=
>Van: </span></b><span =
style=3D'font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Verdana","sans-serif";color:black'=
>&quot;fot&quot; &lt;<a =
href=3D"mailto:[email-masked]">[email-masked]</a>&gt;<br><b>Aan: =
</b>&quot;Tony Drews&quot; &lt;<a =
href=3D"mailto:[email-masked]">[email-masked]</a>&gt;<br><b>Cc: =
</b>&quot;fot&quot; &lt;<a =
href=3D"mailto:[email-masked]">[email-masked]</a>&gt;<br><b>Verzo=
nden: </b>Dinsdag 18 juni 2019 18:54:23<br><b>Onderwerp: </b>Re: [Fot] =
TR4 transmission<o:p></o:p></span></p></div><p class=3DMsoNormal><span =
style=3D'font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Verdana","sans-serif";color:black'=
><o:p>&nbsp;</o:p></span></p><div><p class=3DMsoNormal><span =
style=3D'font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Verdana","sans-serif";color:black'=
>I would add that you can buy individual parts for the quaife should you =
wear out a hub or chip a tooth . Each component has laser engraved part =
numbers . <o:p></o:p></span></p><div><p class=3DMsoNormal =
style=3D'margin-bottom:12.0pt'><span =
style=3D'font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Verdana","sans-serif";color:black'=
>T<o:p></o:p></span></p><div id=3DAppleMailSignature><p =
class=3DMsoNormal><span =
style=3D'font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Verdana","sans-serif";color:black'=
>Sent from my iPhone<o:p></o:p></span></p></div><div><p =
class=3DMsoNormal style=3D'margin-bottom:12.0pt'><span =
style=3D'font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Verdana","sans-serif";color:black'=
><br>On Jun 18, 2019, at 9:20 AM, Tony Drews via Fot &lt;<a =
href=3D"mailto:[email-masked]" =
target=3D"_blank">[email-masked]</a>&gt; =
wrote:<o:p></o:p></span></p></div><blockquote =
style=3D'margin-top:5.0pt;margin-bottom:5.0pt'><div><p><span =
style=3D'font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Verdana","sans-serif";color:black'=
>Nice summary!&nbsp; I don't have much to add other than the Quaife =
gearset uses substantial needle bearings inside each of the gears, much =
larger input to mainshaft needle bearing, steel thrust washers within =
the stack.&nbsp; Work of art.&nbsp; Layshaft still uses semi-stock =
bearings.<o:p></o:p></span></p><p><span =
style=3D'font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Verdana","sans-serif";color:black'=
>When I blew up my tranny I ended up going with the Quaife and really =
like it.&nbsp; No synchros to break, shifts are lightning quick, gear =
ratios work well.<o:p></o:p></span></p><p><span =
style=3D'font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Verdana","sans-serif";color:black'=
>Cheers, Tony Drews<o:p></o:p></span></p><div><p class=3DMsoNormal><span =
style=3D'font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Verdana","sans-serif";color:black'=
>On 6/18/2019 9:24 AM, Robert Lang via Fot =
wrote:<o:p></o:p></span></p></div><blockquote =
style=3D'margin-top:5.0pt;margin-bottom:5.0pt'><div><div><p =
class=3DMsoNormal><span =
style=3D'font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Helvetica","sans-serif";color:blac=
k'>Hi,<o:p></o:p></span></p></div><div><p class=3DMsoNormal><span =
style=3D'font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Helvetica","sans-serif";color:blac=
k'><o:p>&nbsp;</o:p></span></p></div><div><p class=3DMsoNormal><span =
style=3D'font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Helvetica","sans-serif";color:blac=
k'>Those are THE questions, aren't =
they?<o:p></o:p></span></p></div><div><p class=3DMsoNormal><span =
style=3D'font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Helvetica","sans-serif";color:blac=
k'><o:p>&nbsp;</o:p></span></p></div><div><p class=3DMsoNormal><span =
style=3D'font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Helvetica","sans-serif";color:blac=
k'>Okay - Quaife has a straight-cut gear set that uses dog-rings, no =
synchros. Big $$$, 1600 UK pounds. Quaife just ran off a set and the one =
source that I know of in the UK can get =
them:<o:p></o:p></span></p></div><div><p class=3DMsoNormal><span =
style=3D'font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Helvetica","sans-serif";color:blac=
k'><o:p>&nbsp;</o:p></span></p></div><div><p class=3DMsoNormal><span =
style=3D'font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Helvetica","sans-serif";color:blac=
k'><a =
href=3D"http://www.vessey-classic-car-services.co.uk/triumph-gear-kit.htm=
#.XQjuu3t7n64" target=3D"_blank">Dennis Vessey - Quaife gear kits for =
Triumph TRs</a><o:p></o:p></span></p></div><div><p =
class=3DMsoNormal><span =
style=3D'font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Helvetica","sans-serif";color:blac=
k'><o:p>&nbsp;</o:p></span></p></div><div =
id=3D"ydpd666f494enhancr_card_1791886968"><table class=3DMsoNormalTable =
border=3D0 cellspacing=3D0 cellpadding=3D0><tr><td width=3D400 =
style=3D'width:300.0pt;padding:0in 0in 0in 0in'><table =
class=3DMsoNormalTable border=3D1 cellspacing=3D0 cellpadding=3D0 =
style=3D'border:solid windowtext 1.0pt'><tr =
style=3D'height:131.25pt'><td valign=3Dtop =
style=3D'border:none;background:black;padding:0in 0in 0in =
0in;height:131.25pt'><table class=3DMsoNormalTable border=3D0 =
cellspacing=3D0 cellpadding=3D0 width=3D"100%" =
style=3D'width:100.0%'><tr><td valign=3Dtop style=3D'padding:0in 0in 0in =
0in'><table class=3DMsoNormalTable border=3D0 cellpadding=3D0 =
width=3D"100%" style=3D'width:100.0%'><tr><td valign=3Dtop =
style=3D'padding:11.25pt 0in 0in 11.25pt'></td><td valign=3Dtop =
style=3D'padding:11.25pt 11.25pt 0in =
0in'></td></tr></table></td></tr></table></td></tr><tr><td =
style=3D'border:none;padding:0in 0in 0in 0in;border-radius:0
                                    0 0 2px'><div align=3Dcenter><table =
class=3DMsoNormalTable border=3D1 cellspacing=3D0 cellpadding=3D0 =
style=3D'border:none;border-top:solid #E0E4E9 =
1.0pt;max-width:300.0pt;background-color:rgb(255, 255,&#13;&#10;         =
                     255);background-size:
                              auto;border-radius: 0px 0px 2px =
2px;background-attachment:scroll;z-index:2'><tr><td valign=3Dtop =
style=3D'border:none;background:white;padding:12.0pt 0in 12.0pt =
9.0pt;max-width:300.0pt;background-color:rgb(255, 255,&#13;&#10;         =
                     255);background-size:
                              auto;border-radius: 0px 0px 2px =
2px;background-attachment:scroll;z-index:2'></td><td width=3D"99%" =
style=3D'width:99.0%;border:none;padding:9.0pt .25in 12.0pt =
9.0pt;border-radius:0 0 2px 0'><h2 =
style=3D'mso-margin-top-alt:0in;margin-right:0in;margin-bottom:4.5pt;marg=
in-left:0in;line-height:14.25pt;color:rgb(38, 40,&#13;&#10;              =
                        42)'><span =
style=3D'font-size:10.5pt;font-family:"Segoe UI","sans-serif"'>Dennis =
Vessey - Quaife gear kits for Triumph TRs<o:p></o:p></span></h2><p =
class=3Dydpd666f494card-richinfo-primary =
style=3D'mso-margin-top-alt:0in;margin-right:0in;margin-bottom:3.0pt;marg=
in-left:0in;line-height:12.0pt'><span =
style=3D'font-size:9.0pt;font-family:"Segoe =
UI","sans-serif";color:#979BA7'>metatags =
generator<o:p></o:p></span></p><p class=3Dydpd666f494card-description =
style=3D'margin:0in;margin-bottom:.0001pt;line-height:12.0pt'><span =
style=3D'font-size:9.0pt;font-family:"Segoe =
UI","sans-serif";color:#979BA7'>Vesseys Triumph TR Dog-Engagement Gear =
Kit - developed with =
Quaife<o:p></o:p></span></p></td></tr></table></div></td></tr></table></t=
d></tr></table></div><div><p class=3DMsoNormal><span =
style=3D'font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Helvetica","sans-serif";color:blac=
k'><o:p>&nbsp;</o:p></span></p></div><div><p class=3DMsoNormal><span =
style=3D'font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Helvetica","sans-serif";color:blac=
k'><o:p>&nbsp;</o:p></span></p></div><div><p class=3DMsoNormal><span =
style=3D'font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Helvetica","sans-serif";color:blac=
k'><o:p>&nbsp;</o:p></span></p></div><div><p class=3DMsoNormal><span =
style=3D'font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Helvetica","sans-serif";color:blac=
k'>Note, if you decide to go that route, please contact me, I've been in =
contact with the vendor and I'm trying to place an order for this =
gearset. Maybe we can save some shipping if we get a couple of =
sets.<o:p></o:p></span></p></div><div><p class=3DMsoNormal><span =
style=3D'font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Helvetica","sans-serif";color:blac=
k'><o:p>&nbsp;</o:p></span></p></div><div><p class=3DMsoNormal><span =
style=3D'font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Helvetica","sans-serif";color:blac=
k'>Note too that Bastuck has dog box gear sets including one using the =
J-type overdrive. When I contacted them last fall, they had none in =
stock and there was no production =
scheduled.<o:p></o:p></span></p></div><div><p class=3DMsoNormal><span =
style=3D'font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Helvetica","sans-serif";color:blac=
k'><o:p>&nbsp;</o:p></span></p></div><div><p class=3DMsoNormal><span =
style=3D'font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Helvetica","sans-serif";color:blac=
k'>Failing that option, there's the &quot;Dolomite Close Ratio =
Gearset&quot;. This consists of a different input shaft and main 3rd =
gear along with the corresponding layshaft gears. You need to work the =
case to get these to pit, but they work great. These are helical gears. =
I've used this setup for around 20 years, and it is really really good. =
Note: for the best total gear ratio option, get a later TR6 gearbox with =
the 16-tooth 1st laygear.<o:p></o:p></span></p></div><div><p =
class=3DMsoNormal><span =
style=3D'font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Helvetica","sans-serif";color:blac=
k'><o:p>&nbsp;</o:p></span></p></div><div><p class=3DMsoNormal><span =
style=3D'font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Helvetica","sans-serif";color:blac=
k'>Now, the drawback to the helical gears is apparently excessive thrust =
forces and they effect the layshaft thrust washers as well as the =
layshaft needle bearings. If you make torque and you have any end float =
for the layshaft, you will spin the thrust washers and wreck the case. =
There are some workarounds to compensate for excessive end =
float.<o:p></o:p></span></p></div><div><p class=3DMsoNormal><span =
style=3D'font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Helvetica","sans-serif";color:blac=
k'><o:p>&nbsp;</o:p></span></p></div><div><p class=3DMsoNormal><span =
style=3D'font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Helvetica","sans-serif";color:blac=
k'>Note too that because of torque multiplication, the layshaft needle =
bearings on the 1st gear end of the layshaft get beat really, really =
hard. One fix is to install a double bearing on the layshaft (or buy a =
new one from Moss or another source) that is set up for the double =
bearing. I've had Quantum Mechanics install the double bearings, they =
seem to work better than the stock setup. But even with that setup, the =
layshaft still gets pounded and you need to keep an eye on =
it.<o:p></o:p></span></p></div><div><p class=3DMsoNormal><span =
style=3D'font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Helvetica","sans-serif";color:blac=
k'><o:p>&nbsp;</o:p></span></p></div><div><p class=3DMsoNormal><span =
style=3D'font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Helvetica","sans-serif";color:blac=
k'>As you may know, a lot of the racers are gravitating away from the =
stock and/or modified Triumph gearboxes mostly because the quality =
consistency of replacement parts is all over the place and you need to =
know what you're getting to spot the differences. That said, frequent =
oil changes and paying attention to the detritus in the oil, you can =
stay ahead of problems.<o:p></o:p></span></p></div><div><p =
class=3DMsoNormal><span =
style=3D'font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Helvetica","sans-serif";color:blac=
k'><o:p>&nbsp;</o:p></span></p></div><div><p class=3DMsoNormal><span =
style=3D'font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Helvetica","sans-serif";color:blac=
k'>If you're going to build a good gearbox, it will cost you as much or =
more than some of the conversions out there, hence a lot of folks switch =
to Toyota/T5/Rocket, etc.<o:p></o:p></span></p></div><div><p =
class=3DMsoNormal><span =
style=3D'font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Helvetica","sans-serif";color:blac=
k'><o:p>&nbsp;</o:p></span></p></div><div><p class=3DMsoNormal><span =
style=3D'font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Helvetica","sans-serif";color:blac=
k'>Hopefully you'll get other good advice on this list, but that's where =
I'm at right now (too). The Quaife gearset in the TR gearbox seems like =
the most &quot;vintage&quot; solution, but ALL of the options have =
pluses and minuses. In the spirit of full transparency, I'm also looking =
at Super T10 transmissions which are the same as the old Muncie =
&quot;Rock Crusher&quot; and there is a gearset available with a 2.43 =
1st, 1.63 2nd, 1.23 3rd and 1 4th which is pretty close to the Dolomite =
Sprint setup. And the gearbox is 70 pounds which is really close to the =
stock box. Also, if you want to dish out more $$$, Gear Vendors has an =
overdrive that bolts to the T-10, I haven't researched that enough to =
see if there are any particulars, but it is an option, albeit around =
$3k. But you get a BRAND NEW overdrive. Just sayin. A drawback to the =
Super T10 is that you will need to make or source a bell housing, but =
that is do-able with a combo of a trashed TR gearbox, a competent =
machinist and more $$$. ;-)<o:p></o:p></span></p></div><div><p =
class=3DMsoNormal><span =
style=3D'font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Helvetica","sans-serif";color:blac=
k'><o:p>&nbsp;</o:p></span></p></div><div><p class=3DMsoNormal><span =
style=3D'font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Helvetica","sans-serif";color:blac=
k'>Regards,<o:p></o:p></span></p></div><div><p class=3DMsoNormal><span =
style=3D'font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Helvetica","sans-serif";color:blac=
k'>Bob Lang<o:p></o:p></span></p></div><div><p class=3DMsoNormal><span =
style=3D'font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Helvetica","sans-serif";color:blac=
k'>339-927-4489<o:p></o:p></span></p></div><div><p =
class=3DMsoNormal><span =
style=3D'font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Helvetica","sans-serif";color:blac=
k'><o:p>&nbsp;</o:p></span></p></div></div><div =
id=3D"ydpe091f580yahoo_quoted_1530796332"><div><div><p =
class=3DMsoNormal><span =
style=3D'font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Helvetica","sans-serif";color:#262=
82A'>On Tuesday, June 18, 2019, 9:02:31 AM EDT, Mike Deweerd via Fot <a =
href=3D"mailto:[email-masked]" =
target=3D"_blank">&lt;[email-masked]&gt;</a> wrote: =
<o:p></o:p></span></p></div><div><p class=3DMsoNormal><span =
style=3D'font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Helvetica","sans-serif";color:#262=
82A'><o:p>&nbsp;</o:p></span></p></div><div><p class=3DMsoNormal><span =
style=3D'font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Helvetica","sans-serif";color:#262=
82A'><o:p>&nbsp;</o:p></span></p></div><div><div><p =
class=3DMsoNormal><span =
style=3D'font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Helvetica","sans-serif";color:#262=
82A'>Amici <o:p></o:p></span></p></div><div><p class=3DMsoNormal><span =
style=3D'font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Helvetica","sans-serif";color:#262=
82A'>What is the preferred gearbox for the TR4 non overdrive and where =
is the best source for getting such<o:p></o:p></span></p></div><div><p =
class=3DMsoNormal><span =
style=3D'font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Helvetica","sans-serif";color:#262=
82A'>I=E2=80=99m looking at the pros and cons of the straight cut gear =
set vs the close ratio gear set (I=E2=80=99m assuming the close ratio is =
still helical gears) <o:p></o:p></span></p></div><div><p =
class=3DMsoNormal><span =
style=3D'font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Helvetica","sans-serif";color:#262=
82A'>Please chime in with preferences and opinions =
<o:p></o:p></span></p></div><div><p class=3DMsoNormal><span =
style=3D'font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Helvetica","sans-serif";color:#262=
82A'>Cheers <o:p></o:p></span></p></div><div><p class=3DMsoNormal><span =
style=3D'font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Helvetica","sans-serif";color:#262=
82A'>Mike Deweerd #77<o:p></o:p></span></p></div><div><p =
class=3DMsoNormal><span =
style=3D'font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Helvetica","sans-serif";color:#262=
82A'><o:p>&nbsp;</o:p></span></p></div><div><p class=3DMsoNormal><span =
style=3D'font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Helvetica","sans-serif";color:#262=
82A'><o:p>&nbsp;</o:p></span></p></div><div><p class=3DMsoNormal><span =
style=3D'font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Helvetica","sans-serif";color:#262=
82A'><o:p>&nbsp;</o:p></span></p></div><div><p class=3DMsoNormal><span =
style=3D'font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Helvetica","sans-serif";color:#262=
82A'>Sent from my iPhone<o:p></o:p></span></p></div><div><p =
class=3DMsoNormal><span =
style=3D'font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Helvetica","sans-serif";color:#262=
82A'>_______________________________________________<o:p></o:p></span></p=
></div><div><p class=3DMsoNormal><span =
style=3D'font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Helvetica","sans-serif";color:#262=
82A'><a href=3D"mailto:[email-masked]" =
target=3D"_blank">[email-masked]</a><o:p></o:p></span></p></div><div>=
<p class=3DMsoNormal><span =
style=3D'font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Helvetica","sans-serif";color:#262=
82A'><o:p>&nbsp;</o:p></span></p></div><div><p class=3DMsoNormal><span =
style=3D'font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Helvetica","sans-serif";color:#262=
82A'><a href=3D"http://www.fot-racing.com" =
target=3D"_blank">http://www.fot-racing.com</a><o:p></o:p></span></p></di=
v><div><p class=3DMsoNormal><span =
style=3D'font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Helvetica","sans-serif";color:#262=
82A'><o:p>&nbsp;</o:p></span></p></div><div><p class=3DMsoNormal><span =
style=3D'font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Helvetica","sans-serif";color:#262=
82A'>Donate: <a href=3D"http://www.team.net/donate.html" =
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@yahoo.com</a><o:p></o:p></span></p></div><div><p =
class=3DMsoNormal><span =
style=3D'font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Helvetica","sans-serif";color:#262=
82A'><o:p>&nbsp;</o:p></span></p></div><div><p class=3DMsoNormal><span =
style=3D'font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Helvetica","sans-serif";color:#262=
82A'><o:p>&nbsp;</o:p></span></p></div></div></div></div><p =
class=3DMsoNormal style=3D'margin-bottom:12.0pt'><span =
style=3D'font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Verdana","sans-serif";color:black'=
><o:p>&nbsp;</o:p></span></p><pre><span =
style=3D'color:black'>_______________________________________________<o:p=
></o:p></span></pre><pre><span style=3D'color:black'><a =
href=3D"mailto:[email-masked]" =
target=3D"_blank">[email-masked]</a><o:p></o:p></span></pre><pre><spa=
n style=3D'color:black'><o:p>&nbsp;</o:p></span></pre><pre><span =
style=3D'color:black'><a href=3D"http://www.fot-racing.com" =
target=3D"_blank">http://www.fot-racing.com</a><o:p></o:p></span></pre><p=
re><span style=3D'color:black'><o:p>&nbsp;</o:p></span></pre><pre><span =
style=3D'color:black'>Donate: <a =
href=3D"http://www.team.net/donate.html" =
target=3D"_blank">http://www.team.net/donate.html</a><o:p></o:p></span></=
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s.com</a><o:p></o:p></span></pre><pre><span =
style=3D'color:black'><o:p>&nbsp;</o:p></span></pre><pre><span =
style=3D'color:black'><o:p>&nbsp;</o:p></span></pre></blockquote></div></=
blockquote><blockquote =
style=3D'margin-top:5.0pt;margin-bottom:5.0pt'><div><p class=3DMsoNormal =
style=3D'margin-bottom:12.0pt'><span =
style=3D'font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Verdana","sans-serif";color:black'=
>_______________________________________________<br><a =
href=3D"mailto:[email-masked]" =
target=3D"_blank">[email-masked]</a><br><br><a =
href=3D"http://www.fot-racing.com" =
target=3D"_blank">http://www.fot-racing.com</a><br><br>Donate: <a =
href=3D"http://www.team.net/donate.html" =
target=3D"_blank">http://www.team.net/donate.html</a><br>Archive: <a =
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target=3D"_blank">http://autox.team.net/archive</a> <a =
href=3D"http://www.team.net/pipermail/fot" =
target=3D"_blank">http://www.team.net/pipermail/fot</a><br>Unsubscribe/Ma=
nage: <a =
href=3D"http://autox.team.net/mailman/options/fot/[email-masked]" =
target=3D"_blank">http://autox.team.net/mailman/options/fot/horizonracing=
@msn.com</a><o:p></o:p></span></p></div></blockquote></div><p =
class=3DMsoNormal><span =
style=3D'font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Verdana","sans-serif";color:black'=
><br>_______________________________________________<br><a =
href=3D"mailto:[email-masked]">[email-masked]</a><br><br><a =
href=3D"http://www.fot-racing.com">http://www.fot-racing.com</a><br><br>D=
onate: <a =
href=3D"http://www.team.net/donate.html">http://www.team.net/donate.html<=
/a><br>Archive: <a =
href=3D"http://autox.team.net/archive">http://autox.team.net/archive</a> =
<a =
href=3D"http://www.team.net/pipermail/fot">http://www.team.net/pipermail/=
fot</a><br>Unsubscribe/Manage: <a =
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net.be</a><o:p></o:p></span></p></div></div></div></blockquote><blockquot=
e style=3D'margin-top:5.0pt;margin-bottom:5.0pt'><div><p =
class=3DMsoNormal =
style=3D'margin-bottom:12.0pt'>__________________________________________=
_____<br><a =
href=3D"mailto:[email-masked]">[email-masked]</a><br><br><a =
href=3D"http://www.fot-racing.com">http://www.fot-racing.com</a><br><br>D=
onate: <a =
href=3D"http://www.team.net/donate.html">http://www.team.net/donate.html<=
/a><br>Archive: <a =
href=3D"http://autox.team.net/archive">http://autox.team.net/archive</a> =
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<o:p></o:p></p></div></blockquote></div></div></body></html>
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