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RE: Vintage Racing Groups - long

To: "'Andres Sta. Maria'" <atocha@globe.com.ph>,
Subject: RE: Vintage Racing Groups - long
From: Andrew Pursey <MorrisOxford@s054.aone.net.au>
Date: Thu, 30 Oct 1997 10:43:45 +1100
Andy....

The normal procedure amongst Historic promoters here in Australia is to =
run engine capacity classes within groups Sa and Sb, although the CAMS =
Manual does not specify these sub-classes (whereas it does for Group N =
saloons, with differing capacity breakpoints within Na, Nb and Nc - note =
that due to entry numbers capacity classes are sometimes combined).

Thus, dependent on the number of entries you could expect to see the =
following capacity classes:

     Sa:     Under 1500cc     1501 to 2000cc     Over 2000cc

     Sb:     Under 1300cc     1301 to 1600cc     1601 to 2000cc     Over =
2000cc

     Sc:     No capacity classes at this stage due to only a couple of =
cars logbooked at present

However, capacity classes are combined at smaller race meetings so you =
do have some apparent mismatches - another good reason for having either =
trophy-free meetings, or, trophies for all finishers.  Maybe, if your =
grids are very small at this stage you should look at running handicaps =
where, if all goes to plan, all the cars reach the flag at the same time =
having had a staggered start.  This is good and works in many categories =
- I have reached the line in a Group N handicap race in a gaggle of 12 =
cars (mind you the timekeepers hate this massed finish).

A quick review of the programme for the last HSRCA all-Historic Race =
Meeting at Eastern Creek shows that the field in capacity class terms =
was as follows:

     Sa:     Under 1500:     Alfa Spyder  /  2 x AH Sprite  /  Turner =
Ford  /  2 x Lotus Elite Super 95

     Sa:     1501 to 2000:     Morgan +4  /  Porsche 356a  /  2 x =
Sunbeam Alpine  /  5 x MGA 1600

     Sa:     Over 2000:     2 x Triumph TR3A  /  Jaguar XK150  /  AH 100

     Sb:     Under 1300:     Lancia Fulvia  /  3 x MG Midget

     Sb:     1301 to 1600:     Tornado Talisman  /  2 x Lotus Europa  /  =
Ginetta G4  /  Lancia Fulvia  HF  /  Lotus Elan S4

     Sb:     1601 to 2000:     13 x MGB  /  Marcos GT  /  2 x Alfa GTV  =
/  2 x Datsun 2000  /  Sunbeam Alpine  /  Alfa Guilia GT  /  Porsche =
911E

     Sb:     Over 2000:     Ferrari Dino 246  /  Triumph TR6  /  Iso =
Rivolta GT  /  AH 3000  /  2 x Morgan +4  /  Motgan +8

Then, to totally confuse you there was Divisional racing, whereby the =
complete Group S field was split in two based purely on lap times set in =
official qualifying!  The main thing was the grids looked good and the =
drivers, generally, had a great time - so maybe this structure works, =
but, we do have enough Group S cars here in Australia to justify running =
the capacity classes, even within Divisional racing.  Group N saloon car =
Divisional racing tends to be all Group Na in the slow field, all Group =
Nc in the quick field and then Nb split based on known and likely =
performance, and, putting similar cars together (ie - all push rod =
Cortinas in the slower field, unless some of them are quick car/driver =
combination).

In contrast, last Sunday's race meeting at Wakefield Park was a combined =
Group S field covering Sa and Sb and with no classes or sub-groups.  =
There were 25 cars in the original field and despite the disparity in =
terms of capacity and handling most people seemed to find somebody to =
have a good dice with and it looked good for the spectators.

Hope this is of some help - if you have any other queries please email =
Jeremy or me.

BTW - ask Jeremy if he enjoys having the commentator perform extra =
duties by going out to collect front sway bar bolts that Jeremy's Jaguar =
Special deposits on the track.

....regards...Andrew "Axeman" Pursey....1955 Morris Oxford (racing in =
Group Na pre'58 Classic Saloons), 1956 Morris Isis (almost a daily =
driver) and 1996 Saab 900S Coupe (quality worse than most LBCs and Saab =
attitude to customers worse than BL ever was back in the 70s - don't buy =
a Saab)....alternate email saabsux@hotmail.com

-----Original Message-----
From:   Andres Sta. Maria [SMTP:atocha@globe.com.ph]
Sent:   Wednesday, October 29, 1997 9:53 PM
To:     Jeremy Braithwaite
Cc:     VINTAGE RACE LIST
Subject:        Re: Vintage Racing Groups

Jeremy,

If there are no subclasses, would an MGB, for instance, compete against =
a
427 Cobra, since both are in Sb?  We were following the FIA
displacement-based system last year, but this didn't factor in age,
handling, etc., and led to some mismatches.  We have a very small but =
very
varied field - Austin Healey Sprite to 327 Stingrays.  We are now are =
using
a combination of VARA and SVRA groupings, with some success, but wonder =
how
you do it.  Your historic program is reputed to be quite successful.

Sorry about the very basic questions, Jeremy, but you are talking to a
complete novice!  Many thanks, and we really appreciate the guidance.

Reagrds

Andy
MSCC, Manila

=00

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