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Dave,
Against my better judgement. Whether your statements are actionable is
debatable.
However, the actionable in this case has nothing to do with free speech and
government action. Freedom of speech relates to the limitations on the
government taking action against you based on something you said (or wrote
or otherwise communicated).
That doesn't keep a party who may be injured or damaged by something you
say either verbally or in writing from suing you in a civil action. Or as
I like to say, in this great country of ours anybody can sue anybody for
anything.
Please don't make it political when it is not. Kind of a sad state of
affairs when every little thing that doesn't go somebody's way or is
perceived as an attack, insult, or slight, has to attributed to one "side"
or the other .
Greg Lemon
On Wed, Dec 27, 2023, 8:58 AM dave northrup <dave@ranteer.com> wrote:
> suggesting that my words are "actionable" shows an extreme ignorance of
> the law and the constitution.
>
>
>
> despite what the Biden administration, the DOJ, and liberal democrats hav=
e
> been pushing, this is a country of free speech and it means exactly that.
>
>
>
> the arson investigators will be seriously looking at this. the fire
> occurred at a time when no one would be working late and no one, includin=
g
> the volunteer firefighters or witnesses, would be around. And, if as som=
e
> have suggested, that the business was struggling, that just adds more fue=
l
> to the fire
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
> *From:* Jim Henningsen <trguy75@gmail.com>
> *Sent:* Wednesday, December 27, 2023 5:41 AM
> *To:* Larry Griffin <larrygriffin.nc@gmail.com>
> *Cc:* dave northrup <dave@ranteer.com>; Listserv Triumph <
> triumphs@autox.team.net>
> *Subject:* [Junk]Re: [TR] Roadster Factory Christmas day fire
>
>
>
> Larry and Steve,
>
> Well said and I completely agree with you. There is no place for positing
> such negative and actionable language on a public platform without facts
> and at a time of great loss. My heart is heavy for the Runyan family and
> TRF employees. TRF has been an important family member to me for the pas=
t
> 30 years and the loss is devastating to our Triumph community. My
> grandmother always taught me that if you don=E2=80=99t have something goo=
d to say
> then don=E2=80=99t say it.
>
> Jim Henningsen
>
>
>
>
>
> On Dec 27, 2023, at 5:39=E2=80=AFAM, Larry Griffin <larrygriffin.nc@gmail=
.com>
> wrote:
>
> =EF=BB=BF
>
> Dave, you are a valued member of this list. However, these comments are
> speculative. The problems concerning the investment program and the ill
> will from those that lost money is understandable. However, Albert is now
> the owner of TRF, not his father.
>
>
>
> The 3 cars in the showroom were saved by the firefighters before the fire
> got to that part of the building. Albert has worked extremely hard to ke=
ep
> the business going. If I remember correctly, he had to purchase TRF from
> Charles' estate at a value approved by the court. At the 6-pack Trials I
> understand he was excited and discussed plans for improvements coming in
> 2024. His sister's MG was destroyed in the fire along with more cars not =
in
> the showroom area. The value of those three cars saved would be small
> compared to the inventory including irreplaceable NOS parts and tooling
> patterns, etc. It will be up to the fire marshall to determine the cause =
of
> the fire.
>
>
>
> The total loss of TRF is a tragedy that will have a significant effect on
> our hobby. I can't imagine how hard this is for Albert and the wonderful
> current staff at TRF. They deserve our support, not speculation about wha=
t
> happened.
>
>
>
> On Tue, Dec 26, 2023 at 10:41=E2=80=AFPM dave northrup <dave@ranteer.com>=
wrote:
>
> Given how the people in the Roadster Factory Investment Program were
> treated after Charles Runyon died, it would not surprise me if this fire
> was deliberate but done in a way that will not arouse suspicion. I suspe=
ct
> the insurance payout will be much more than the living business would hav=
e
> brought in a sale. And coincidentally, the really valuable cars were in =
a
> different building and seemed to have survived.
>
>
>
>
>
>
> https://www.tribdem.com/news/roadster-factory-a-total-loss-after-christma=
s-morning-fire-armagh-chief-says/article_9fd287e2-a330-11ee-90de-7319c01644=
73.html
>
> ** triumphs@autox.team.net **
>
> Donate: http://www.team.net/donate.html
> Archive: http://www.team.net/pipermail/triumphs
> http://www.team.net/archive
>
> Unsubscribe/Manage:
> http://autox.team.net/mailman/options/triumphs/larrygriffin.nc@gmail.com
>
> ** triumphs@autox.team.net **
>
> Donate: http://www.team.net/donate.html
> Archive: http://www.team.net/pipermail/triumphs
> http://www.team.net/archive
>
> Unsubscribe/Manage:
> http://autox.team.net/mailman/options/triumphs/trguy75@gmail.com
>
> ** triumphs@autox.team.net **
>
> Donate: http://www.team.net/donate.html
> Archive: http://www.team.net/pipermail/triumphs
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>
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>
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<div dir=3D"auto"><div dir=3D"auto">Dave,<div dir=3D"auto"><br></div><div d=
ir=3D"auto">Against my better judgement.=C2=A0 Whether your statements are =
actionable is debatable.<div dir=3D"auto"><br></div><div dir=3D"auto">Howev=
er, the actionable in this case has nothing to do with free speech and gove=
rnment action.=C2=A0 Freedom of speech relates to the limitations on the go=
vernment taking action against you based on something you said (or wrote or=
otherwise communicated).</div><div dir=3D"auto"><br></div><div dir=3D"auto=
">That doesn't keep a party who may be injured or damaged by something =
you say either verbally or in writing from suing you in a civil action.=C2=
=A0 Or as I like to say, in this great country of ours anybody can sue anyb=
ody for anything.</div><div dir=3D"auto"><br></div><div dir=3D"auto">Please=
don't make it political when it is not.=C2=A0 =C2=A0Kind of a sad stat=
e of affairs when every little thing that doesn't go somebody's way=
or is perceived as an attack, insult, or slight, has to attributed to one =
"side" or the other .</div><div dir=3D"auto"><br></div><div dir=
=3D"auto">Greg Lemon=C2=A0</div></div></div><br><div class=3D"gmail_quote">=
<div dir=3D"ltr" class=3D"gmail_attr">On Wed, Dec 27, 2023, 8:58 AM dave no=
rthrup <<a href=3D"mailto:dave@ranteer.com"; target=3D"_blank" rel=3D"nor=
eferrer">dave@ranteer.com</a>> wrote:<br></div><blockquote class=3D"gmai=
l_quote" style=3D"margin:0 0 0 .8ex;border-left:1px #ccc solid;padding-left=
:1ex">
<div lang=3D"EN-US" link=3D"blue" vlink=3D"purple" style=3D"word-wrap:break=
-word">
<div>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal">suggesting that my words are "actionable" =
shows an extreme ignorance of the law and the constitution.<u></u><u></u></=
p>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal"><u></u>=C2=A0<u></u></p>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal">despite what the Biden administration, the DOJ, and =
liberal democrats have been pushing, this is a country of free speech and i=
t means exactly that.<u></u><u></u></p>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal"><u></u>=C2=A0<u></u></p>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal">the arson investigators will be seriously looking at=
this.=C2=A0 the fire occurred at a time when no one would be working late =
and no one, including the volunteer firefighters or witnesses, would be aro=
und.=C2=A0 And, if as some have suggested, that
the business was struggling, that just adds more fuel to the fire<u></u><u=
></u></p>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal"><u></u>=C2=A0<u></u></p>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal"><u></u>=C2=A0<u></u></p>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal"><u></u>=C2=A0<u></u></p>
<div>
<div style=3D"border:none;border-top:solid #e1e1e1 1.0pt;padding:3.0pt 0in =
0in 0in">
<p class=3D"MsoNormal"><b>From:</b> Jim Henningsen <<a href=3D"mailto:tr=
guy75@gmail.com" rel=3D"noreferrer noreferrer" target=3D"_blank">trguy75@gm=
ail.com</a>> <br>
<b>Sent:</b> Wednesday, December 27, 2023 5:41 AM<br>
<b>To:</b> Larry Griffin <<a href=3D"mailto:larrygriffin.nc@gmail.com"; r=
el=3D"noreferrer noreferrer" target=3D"_blank">larrygriffin.nc@gmail.com</a=
>><br>
<b>Cc:</b> dave northrup <<a href=3D"mailto:dave@ranteer.com"; rel=3D"nor=
eferrer noreferrer" target=3D"_blank">dave@ranteer.com</a>>; Listserv Tr=
iumph <<a href=3D"mailto:triumphs@autox.team.net"; rel=3D"noreferrer nore=
ferrer" target=3D"_blank">triumphs@autox.team.net</a>><br>
<b>Subject:</b> [Junk]Re: [TR] Roadster Factory Christmas day fire<u></u><u=
></u></p>
</div>
</div>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal"><u></u>=C2=A0<u></u></p>
<div>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal">Larry and Steve,<u></u><u></u></p>
</div>
<div>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal">Well said and I completely agree with you. There is =
no place for positing such negative and actionable language on a public pla=
tform without facts and at a time of great loss. My heart is heavy for the =
Runyan family and TRF employees.=C2=A0 TRF
has been an important family member to me for the past 30 years and the lo=
ss is devastating to our Triumph community.=C2=A0 My grandmother always tau=
ght me that if you don=E2=80=99t have something good to say then don=E2=80=
=99t say it.<u></u><u></u></p>
</div>
<div>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal">Jim Henningsen<u></u><u></u></p>
</div>
<div>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal"><u></u>=C2=A0<u></u></p>
</div>
<div>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal"><br>
<br>
<u></u><u></u></p>
<blockquote style=3D"margin-top:5.0pt;margin-bottom:5.0pt">
<p class=3D"MsoNormal" style=3D"margin-bottom:12.0pt">On Dec 27, 2023, at 5=
:39=E2=80=AFAM, Larry Griffin <<a href=3D"mailto:larrygriffin.nc@gmail.c=
om" rel=3D"noreferrer noreferrer" target=3D"_blank">larrygriffin.nc@gmail.c=
om</a>> wrote:<u></u><u></u></p>
</blockquote>
</div>
<blockquote style=3D"margin-top:5.0pt;margin-bottom:5.0pt">
<div>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal">=EF=BB=BF<u></u><u></u></p>
<div>
<div>
<div>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal"><span style=3D"font-family:"Arial",sans-se=
rif">Dave, you are a valued member of this list. However, these comments ar=
e speculative. The problems concerning the investment program and the ill w=
ill from those that lost money is understandable.
However, Albert is now the owner of TRF, not his father.<u></u><u></u></sp=
an></p>
</div>
<div>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal"><span style=3D"font-family:"Arial",sans-se=
rif"><u></u>=C2=A0<u></u></span></p>
</div>
<div>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal"><span style=3D"font-family:"Arial",sans-se=
rif">The 3 cars in the showroom were saved by the firefighters before the f=
ire got to that part of the building.=C2=A0 Albert has worked extremely har=
d to keep the business going. If I remember correctly,
he had to purchase TRF from Charles' estate at a value approved by the=
court. At the 6-pack Trials I understand he was excited and discussed plan=
s for improvements coming in 2024. His sister's MG was destroyed in the=
fire along with more cars not in the showroom
area. The value of those three cars saved would be small compared to the i=
nventory including irreplaceable NOS parts and tooling patterns, etc. It wi=
ll be up to the fire marshall to determine the cause of the fire.<u></u><u>=
</u></span></p>
</div>
<div>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal"><span style=3D"font-family:"Arial",sans-se=
rif"><u></u>=C2=A0<u></u></span></p>
</div>
<div>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal"><span style=3D"font-family:"Arial",sans-se=
rif">The total loss of TRF is a tragedy that will have a significant effect=
on our hobby. I can't imagine how hard this is for Albert and the wond=
erful current staff at TRF. They deserve our support,
not speculation about what happened.=C2=A0<u></u><u></u></span></p>
</div>
<div>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal"><span style=3D"font-family:"Arial",sans-se=
rif"><u></u>=C2=A0<u></u></span></p>
</div>
<div>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal"><span style=3D"font-family:"Arial",sans-se=
rif">On Tue, Dec 26, 2023 at 10:41=E2=80=AFPM dave northrup <<a href=3D"=
mailto:dave@ranteer.com"; rel=3D"noreferrer noreferrer" target=3D"_blank">da=
ve@ranteer.com</a>> wrote:<u></u><u></u></span></p>
</div>
</div>
<div>
<blockquote style=3D"border:none;border-left:solid #cccccc 1.0pt;padding:0i=
n 0in 0in 6.0pt;margin-left:4.8pt;margin-right:0in">
<div>
<div>
<div>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal">Given how the people in the Roadster Factory Investm=
ent Program were treated after Charles Runyon died, it would not surprise m=
e if this fire was deliberate but done in a way that
will not arouse suspicion.=C2=A0 I suspect the insurance payout will be mu=
ch more than the living business would have brought in a sale.=C2=A0 And co=
incidentally, the really valuable cars were in a different building and see=
med to have survived.
<u></u><u></u></p>
<div style=3D"border:none;border-top:solid #e1e1e1 1.0pt;padding:3.0pt 0in =
0in 0in">
<p class=3D"MsoNormal">=C2=A0<u></u><u></u></p>
</div>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal">=C2=A0<u></u><u></u></p>
<div>
<div>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal"><span style=3D"font-size:12.0pt"><a href=3D"https://=
www.tribdem.com/news/roadster-factory-a-total-loss-after-christmas-morning-=
fire-armagh-chief-says/article_9fd287e2-a330-11ee-90de-7319c0164473.html" r=
el=3D"noreferrer noreferrer" target=3D"_blank">https://www.tribdem.com/news=
/roadster-factory-a-total-loss-after-christmas-morning-fire-armagh-chief-sa=
ys/article_9fd287e2-a330-11ee-90de-7319c0164473.html</a></span><u></u><u></=
u></p>
</div>
</div>
</div>
</div>
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