--===============3818016651422146500==
Content-Language: en-US
boundary="_000_5DF59F06A5E05E47A21C0E72057265D901BFAA5012msgdb11utadut_"
--_000_5DF59F06A5E05E47A21C0E72057265D901BFAA5012msgdb11utadut_
Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable
I think Dave may have a point. I have not had any problems in older vehicle=
s, or with my TR3A, using 89 octane without a lead substitute, or additive.=
But, I do not drive that TR3A 15,000 miles per year, the national average =
for daily drivers. Someone who does and whose 60's era vehicle, or even old=
er, that still has original valve train metallurgy may not have the same ou=
tcome.
In my airplane I use 100LL fuel or ethanol free auto fuel. That lack of lea=
d in auto fuel is/was a serious concern for all pilots operating aircraft w=
ith older engines that had FAA permission to use ethanol free auto fuel but=
whose engines did not have the newer hardened valve seats, and other compo=
nents that eliminated the need for lead.
After I had the engine rebuilt to zero time, in part using Superior Air Par=
ts Millennium cylinder assemblies with hardened valve seats, valves, valve =
stems and updated valve guides, that eliminated any and all lead issues, in=
cluding any concerns regarding excess lead deposits.
Can something like this be done with a TR3 head, or is it prohibitively exp=
ensive?
Sincerely,
Randall Reihing
1959 TR3A
From: Triumphs [triumphs-bounces@autox.team.net] on behalf of David P [frog=
eye@porterscustom.com]
Sent: Monday, October 01, 2018 2:05 PM
To: triumphs@autox.team.net
Subject: Re: [TR] Lead Substitute
Guess I'll add another two cents.. as many will recall, a valve job was the=
bread and butter of repair shops (mine included) since the advent of unlea=
ded fuel I have not seen a single valve job and valve seat recession
only on a race engine. New chemicals have been added to replace the octane =
boosting and lubricating attributes of lead. Most of what is out there as a=
dvice is a total myth or marketing BS.. My opinion .
DaveP
On 10/1/2018 11:15 AM, Reihing, Randall S. wrote:
Checking the web I found that the Red Line lead substitute fuel additive is=
available through Amazon in 12 ounce bottles to treat 25 gallons for close=
to $17.00, plus shipping, and adds about $.70 per gallon to the cost of wh=
atever octane is selected.
An alternative might be 100 Low Lead, or 100LL, aviation fuel available at =
almost any airport and add it to the auto fuel. Shell Oil Co.'s web site li=
sts 100LL as having 0.56g/liter of lead per gallon, https://www.shell.com/b=
usiness-customers/aviation/aviation-fuel/avgas.html<https://urldefense.proo=
fpoint.com/v2/url?u=3Dhttps-3A__www.shell.com_business-2Dcustomers_aviation=
_aviation-2Dfuel_avgas.html&d=3DDwMD-g&c=3DheEcP2AsrLOv4XP8e7I9NA&r=3DM9Vli=
1OgG7_7RAFFVpeXHiQAUCpprOLL1VRvWP3OJtI&m=3Dr66tYSNXuHW4PCg5SzjQI-oFFHujZgSr=
VyT9KcNeDNA&s=3Dr78lsQjJ6ovAzk5ReL4vasC3CL4u5QsNeYTcg0wh5RE&e=3D>, which i=
s about 560 ppm, or parts per million per gallon. I don't know if one gallo=
n of 100LL could be diluted in today's auto fuel and be enough lead to for =
a TR3's valve seats.
An alternative might be to use a few gallons of 100LL ($4.75/gallon in Ohio=
) from time-to-time and maybe (hopefully) enough lead residue would build u=
p to protect the valve seats. Click on this link to see 100LL av gas cost p=
er state. http://www.airnav.com/fuel/greatdeals/long?type=3D1<https://urlde=
fense.proofpoint.com/v2/url?u=3Dhttp-3A__www.airnav.com_fuel_greatdeals_lon=
g-3Ftype-3D1&d=3DDwMD-g&c=3DheEcP2AsrLOv4XP8e7I9NA&r=3DM9Vli1OgG7_7RAFFVpeX=
HiQAUCpprOLL1VRvWP3OJtI&m=3Dr66tYSNXuHW4PCg5SzjQI-oFFHujZgSrVyT9KcNeDNA&s=
=3DvgDLOtEbOMGRJFozs7F4QcfBpMZMnsMivVVgn09qw5c&e=3D>
Maybe one of the lists math wizards could research how much lead was in aut=
o fuel before it was phased out and determine if 100LL can help.
Sincerely,
Randall Reihing
1959 TR3A
2/url?u=3Dhttp-3A__www.team.net_donate.html&d=3DDwMD-g&c=3DheEcP2AsrLOv4XP8=
e7I9NA&r=3DM9Vli1OgG7_7RAFFVpeXHiQAUCpprOLL1VRvWP3OJtI&m=3Dr66tYSNXuHW4PCg5=
SzjQI-oFFHujZgSrVyT9KcNeDNA&s=3DG7pHUZNeL_J4dFVrtuK9urhk7UD5DwSpKd_kEGTmlI0=
&e=3D>
Archive: http://www.team.net/pipermail/triumphs<https://urldefense.proofpoi=
nt.com/v2/url?u=3Dhttp-3A__www.team.net_pipermail_triumphs&d=3DDwMD-g&c=3Dh=
eEcP2AsrLOv4XP8e7I9NA&r=3DM9Vli1OgG7_7RAFFVpeXHiQAUCpprOLL1VRvWP3OJtI&m=3Dr=
66tYSNXuHW4PCg5SzjQI-oFFHujZgSrVyT9KcNeDNA&s=3D2idK3EKD4mDNUyM_DwxI_JfBlNOM=
Bum4toW168cf2uE&e=3D> http://www.team.net/archive<https://urldefense.proof=
point.com/v2/url?u=3Dhttp-3A__www.team.net_archive&d=3DDwMD-g&c=3DheEcP2Asr=
LOv4XP8e7I9NA&r=3DM9Vli1OgG7_7RAFFVpeXHiQAUCpprOLL1VRvWP3OJtI&m=3Dr66tYSNXu=
HW4PCg5SzjQI-oFFHujZgSrVyT9KcNeDNA&s=3DXCZxPknhYGgZDsvGENPi5wtQTPBVKgy15Yru=
qdaupK8&e=3D>
porterscustom.com<https://urldefense.proofpoint.com/v2/url?u=3Dhttp-3A__aut=
ox.team.net_mailman_options_triumphs_frogeye-40porterscustom.com&d=3DDwMD-g=
&c=3DheEcP2AsrLOv4XP8e7I9NA&r=3DM9Vli1OgG7_7RAFFVpeXHiQAUCpprOLL1VRvWP3OJtI=
&m=3Dr66tYSNXuHW4PCg5SzjQI-oFFHujZgSrVyT9KcNeDNA&s=3D8PklOO_d1U-iEEoSZ_xK9C=
ejZ0jTk-rwHM0sDLsad7I&e=3D>
--
Porter Custom Bicycles 2909 Arno St. NE Albuquerque, NM. 505-352-1378 My Wo=
rld go here: WWW.PORTERBIKES.COM/<https://urldefense.proofpoint.com/v2/url?=
u=3Dhttp-3A__WWW.PORTERBIKES.COM_&d=3DDwMD-g&c=3DheEcP2AsrLOv4XP8e7I9NA&r=
=3DM9Vli1OgG7_7RAFFVpeXHiQAUCpprOLL1VRvWP3OJtI&m=3Dr66tYSNXuHW4PCg5SzjQI-oF=
FHujZgSrVyT9KcNeDNA&s=3DskfmwteXDGADHqBgbYkdOeelWuNWCm9Gw6meykDjw9o&e=3D>
[https://ipmcdn.avast.com/images/icons/icon-envelope-tick-green-avg-v1.png]=
<https://urldefense.proofpoint.com/v2/url?u=3Dhttp-3A__www.avg.com_email-2D=
signature-3Futm-5Fmedium-3Demail-26utm-5Fsource-3Dlink-26utm-5Fcampaign-3Ds=
ig-2Demail-26utm-5Fcontent-3Demailclient&d=3DDwMD-g&c=3DheEcP2AsrLOv4XP8e7I=
9NA&r=3DM9Vli1OgG7_7RAFFVpeXHiQAUCpprOLL1VRvWP3OJtI&m=3Dr66tYSNXuHW4PCg5Szj=
QI-oFFHujZgSrVyT9KcNeDNA&s=3DHyDZgEgq5FjnSzGaiGqbNqGIe8fl21BVFNFyTBNGMCI&e=
=3D> Virus-free. www.avg.com<https://urldefense.proofpoint.com/v2/url?u=3Dh=
ttp-3A__www.avg.com_email-2Dsignature-3Futm-5Fmedium-3Demail-26utm-5Fsource=
-3Dlink-26utm-5Fcampaign-3Dsig-2Demail-26utm-5Fcontent-3Demailclient&d=3DDw=
MD-g&c=3DheEcP2AsrLOv4XP8e7I9NA&r=3DM9Vli1OgG7_7RAFFVpeXHiQAUCpprOLL1VRvWP3=
OJtI&m=3Dr66tYSNXuHW4PCg5SzjQI-oFFHujZgSrVyT9KcNeDNA&s=3DHyDZgEgq5FjnSzGaiG=
qbNqGIe8fl21BVFNFyTBNGMCI&e=3D>
--_000_5DF59F06A5E05E47A21C0E72057265D901BFAA5012msgdb11utadut_
Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable
<html dir=3D"ltr">
<head>
<meta http-equiv=3D"Content-Type" content=3D"text/html; charset=3Diso-8859-=
1">
</head>
<body bgcolor=3D"#FFFFFF" fpstyle=3D"1" ocsi=3D"0">
<div style=3D"direction: ltr;font-family: Tahoma;color: #000000;font-size: =
10pt;">I think Dave may have a point. I have not had any problems in older =
vehicles, or with my TR3A, using 89 octane without a lead substitute, or ad=
ditive. But, I do not drive that TR3A
15,000 miles per year, the national average for daily drivers. Someone who=
does and whose 60's era vehicle, or even older, that still has original va=
lve train metallurgy may not have the same outcome.
<div><br>
</div>
<div>In my airplane I use 100LL fuel or ethanol free auto fuel. That lack o=
f lead in auto fuel is/was a serious concern for all pilots operating aircr=
aft with older engines that had FAA permission to use ethanol free auto fue=
l but whose engines did not have
the newer hardened valve seats, and other components that eliminated the n=
eed for lead. </div>
<div><br>
</div>
<div>After I had the engine rebuilt to zero time, in part using Superior Ai=
r Parts Millennium cylinder assemblies with hardened valve seats, valves, v=
alve stems and updated valve guides, that eliminated any and all lead issue=
s, including any concerns regarding
excess lead deposits. </div>
<div><br>
</div>
<div>Can something like this be done with a TR3 head, or is it prohibitivel=
y expensive? </div>
<div><br>
</div>
<div>Sincerely,</div>
<div>Randall Reihing</div>
<div>1959 TR3A</div>
<div><br>
</div>
<div><b><br>
</b></div>
<div><b>From:</b><span style=3D"font-size: small;"> Triumphs [triumphs-boun=
ces@autox.team.net] on behalf of David P [frogeye@porterscustom.com]</span>
<div style=3D"font-family: Times New Roman; color: #000000; font-size: 16px=
">
<div id=3D"divRpF445770" style=3D"direction: ltr;"><font face=3D"Tahoma" si=
ze=3D"2" color=3D"#000000"><b>Sent:</b> Monday, October 01, 2018 2:05 PM<br=
>
<b>To:</b> triumphs@autox.team.net<br>
<b>Subject:</b> Re: [TR] Lead Substitute<br>
</font><br>
</div>
<div></div>
<div>
<p>Guess I'll add another two cents.. as many will recall, a valve job was =
the bread and butter of repair shops (mine included) since the advent of un=
leaded fuel I have not seen a single valve job and valve seat recession</p>
<p>only on a race engine. New chemicals have been added to replace the octa=
ne boosting and lubricating attributes of lead. Most of what is out there a=
s advice is a total myth or marketing BS.. My opinion .</p>
<p>DaveP<br>
</p>
<br>
<div class=3D"moz-cite-prefix">On 10/1/2018 11:15 AM, Reihing, Randall S. w=
rote:<br>
</div>
<blockquote type=3D"cite"><style type=3D"text/css" id=3D"owaParaStyle"></st=
yle>
<div style=3D"direction:ltr; font-family:Tahoma; color:#000000; font-size:1=
0pt">Checking the web I found that the Red Line lead substitute fuel additi=
ve is available through Amazon in 12 ounce bottles to treat 25 gallons for =
close to $17.00, plus shipping, and
adds about $.70 per gallon to the cost of whatever octane is selected.&nbs=
p;
<div><br>
</div>
<div>An alternative might be 100 Low Lead, or 100LL, aviation fuel availabl=
e at almost any airport and add it to the auto fuel. Shell Oil Co.'s web si=
te lists 100LL as having 0.56g/liter of lead per gallon, <a href=3D"ht=
tps://urldefense.proofpoint.com/v2/url?u=3Dhttps-3A__www.shell.com_business=
-2Dcustomers_aviation_aviation-2Dfuel_avgas.html&d=3DDwMD-g&c=3DheE=
cP2AsrLOv4XP8e7I9NA&r=3DM9Vli1OgG7_7RAFFVpeXHiQAUCpprOLL1VRvWP3OJtI&=
;m=3Dr66tYSNXuHW4PCg5SzjQI-oFFHujZgSrVyT9KcNeDNA&s=3Dr78lsQjJ6ovAzk5ReL=
4vasC3CL4u5QsNeYTcg0wh5RE&e=3D" target=3D"_blank" rel=3D"noopener noref=
errer">https://www.shell.com/business-customers/aviation/aviation-fuel/avga=
s.html</a>, <span style=3D"font-size:10pt"> which
is about 560 ppm, or parts per million per gallon. I don't know if one gal=
lon of 100LL could be diluted in today's auto fuel and be enough lead to fo=
r a TR3's valve seats. </span></div>
<div><br>
</div>
<div>An alternative might be to use a few gallons of 100LL ($4.75/gallon in=
Ohio) from time-to-time and maybe (hopefully) enough lead residue would bu=
ild up to protect the valve seats. Click on this link to see 100LL av gas c=
ost per state.<font color=3D"#0000ff"> </font><a href=3D"https://urlde=
fense.proofpoint.com/v2/url?u=3Dhttp-3A__www.airnav.com_fuel_greatdeals_lon=
g-3Ftype-3D1&d=3DDwMD-g&c=3DheEcP2AsrLOv4XP8e7I9NA&r=3DM9Vli1Og=
G7_7RAFFVpeXHiQAUCpprOLL1VRvWP3OJtI&m=3Dr66tYSNXuHW4PCg5SzjQI-oFFHujZgS=
rVyT9KcNeDNA&s=3DvgDLOtEbOMGRJFozs7F4QcfBpMZMnsMivVVgn09qw5c&e=3D" =
style=3D"font-size:10pt" target=3D"_blank" rel=3D"noopener noreferrer">http=
://www.airnav.com/fuel/greatdeals/long?type=3D1</a></div>
<div><br>
</div>
<div>Maybe one of the lists math wizards could research how much lead was i=
n auto fuel before it was phased out and determine if 100LL can help.</div>
<div><br>
</div>
<div>Sincerely,</div>
<div>Randall Reihing</div>
<div>1959 TR3A</div>
<div><br>
</div>
</div>
<br>
<fieldset class=3D"mimeAttachmentHeader" target=3D"_blank" rel=3D"noopener =
noreferrer">
</fieldset> <br>
<pre>** <a class=3D"moz-txt-link-abbreviated" href=3D"mailto:triumphs@autox=
.team.net" target=3D"_blank" rel=3D"noopener noreferrer">triumphs@autox.tea=
m.net</a> **=0A=
=0A=
point.com/v2/url?u=3Dhttp-3A__www.team.net_donate.html&d=3DDwMD-g&c=
=3DheEcP2AsrLOv4XP8e7I9NA&r=3DM9Vli1OgG7_7RAFFVpeXHiQAUCpprOLL1VRvWP3OJ=
tI&m=3Dr66tYSNXuHW4PCg5SzjQI-oFFHujZgSrVyT9KcNeDNA&s=3DG7pHUZNeL_J4=
dFVrtuK9urhk7UD5DwSpKd_kEGTmlI0&e=3D" target=3D"_blank" rel=3D"noopener=
noreferrer">http://www.team.net/donate.html</a>=0A=
Archive: <a class=3D"moz-txt-link-freetext" href=3D"https://urldefense.proo=
fpoint.com/v2/url?u=3Dhttp-3A__www.team.net_pipermail_triumphs&d=3DDwMD=
-g&c=3DheEcP2AsrLOv4XP8e7I9NA&r=3DM9Vli1OgG7_7RAFFVpeXHiQAUCpprOLL1=
VRvWP3OJtI&m=3Dr66tYSNXuHW4PCg5SzjQI-oFFHujZgSrVyT9KcNeDNA&s=3D2idK=
3EKD4mDNUyM_DwxI_JfBlNOMBum4toW168cf2uE&e=3D" target=3D"_blank" rel=3D"=
noopener noreferrer">http://www.team.net/pipermail/triumphs</a> <a class=
=3D"moz-txt-link-freetext" href=3D"https://urldefense.proofpoint.com/v2/url=
?u=3Dhttp-3A__www.team.net_archive&d=3DDwMD-g&c=3DheEcP2AsrLOv4XP8e=
7I9NA&r=3DM9Vli1OgG7_7RAFFVpeXHiQAUCpprOLL1VRvWP3OJtI&m=3Dr66tYSNXu=
HW4PCg5SzjQI-oFFHujZgSrVyT9KcNeDNA&s=3DXCZxPknhYGgZDsvGENPi5wtQTPBVKgy1=
5YruqdaupK8&e=3D" target=3D"_blank" rel=3D"noopener noreferrer">http://=
www.team.net/archive</a>=0A=
=0A=
efense.proofpoint.com/v2/url?u=3Dhttp-3A__autox.team.net_mailman_options_tr=
iumphs_frogeye-40porterscustom.com&d=3DDwMD-g&c=3DheEcP2AsrLOv4XP8e=
7I9NA&r=3DM9Vli1OgG7_7RAFFVpeXHiQAUCpprOLL1VRvWP3OJtI&m=3Dr66tYSNXu=
HW4PCg5SzjQI-oFFHujZgSrVyT9KcNeDNA&s=3D8PklOO_d1U-iEEoSZ_xK9CejZ0jTk-rw=
HM0sDLsad7I&e=3D" target=3D"_blank" rel=3D"noopener noreferrer">http://=
autox.team.net/mailman/options/triumphs/frogeye@porterscustom.com</a>=0A=
</pre>
</blockquote>
<br>
<pre class=3D"moz-signature" cols=3D"72">-- =0A=
Porter Custom Bicycles 2909 Arno St. NE Albuquerque, NM. 505-352-1378 My Wo=
rld go here: <a class=3D"moz-txt-link-abbreviated" href=3D"https://urldefen=
se.proofpoint.com/v2/url?u=3Dhttp-3A__WWW.PORTERBIKES.COM_&d=3DDwMD-g&a=
mp;c=3DheEcP2AsrLOv4XP8e7I9NA&r=3DM9Vli1OgG7_7RAFFVpeXHiQAUCpprOLL1VRvW=
P3OJtI&m=3Dr66tYSNXuHW4PCg5SzjQI-oFFHujZgSrVyT9KcNeDNA&s=3DskfmwteX=
DGADHqBgbYkdOeelWuNWCm9Gw6meykDjw9o&e=3D" target=3D"_blank" rel=3D"noop=
ener noreferrer">WWW.PORTERBIKES.COM/</a></pre>
<div id=3D"DAB4FAD8-2DD7-40BB-A1B8-4E2AA1F9FDF2"><br>
<table style=3D"border-top:1px solid #D3D4DE">
<tbody>
<tr>
<td style=3D"width:55px; padding-top:13px"><a href=3D"https://urldefense.pr=
oofpoint.com/v2/url?u=3Dhttp-3A__www.avg.com_email-2Dsignature-3Futm-5Fmedi=
um-3Demail-26utm-5Fsource-3Dlink-26utm-5Fcampaign-3Dsig-2Demail-26utm-5Fcon=
tent-3Demailclient&d=3DDwMD-g&c=3DheEcP2AsrLOv4XP8e7I9NA&r=3DM9=
Vli1OgG7_7RAFFVpeXHiQAUCpprOLL1VRvWP3OJtI&m=3Dr66tYSNXuHW4PCg5SzjQI-oFF=
HujZgSrVyT9KcNeDNA&s=3DHyDZgEgq5FjnSzGaiGqbNqGIe8fl21BVFNFyTBNGMCI&=
e=3D" target=3D"_blank" rel=3D"noopener noreferrer"><img src=3D"https://ipm=
cdn.avast.com/images/icons/icon-envelope-tick-green-avg-v1.png" alt=3D"" st=
yle=3D"width:46px; height:29px" height=3D"29" width=3D"46"></a></td>
<td style=3D"width:470px; padding-top:12px; color:#41424e; font-size:13px; =
font-family:Arial,Helvetica,sans-serif; line-height:18px">
Virus-free. <a href=3D"https://urldefense.proofpoint.com/v2/url?u=3Dhttp-3A=
__www.avg.com_email-2Dsignature-3Futm-5Fmedium-3Demail-26utm-5Fsource-3Dlin=
k-26utm-5Fcampaign-3Dsig-2Demail-26utm-5Fcontent-3Demailclient&d=3DDwMD=
-g&c=3DheEcP2AsrLOv4XP8e7I9NA&r=3DM9Vli1OgG7_7RAFFVpeXHiQAUCpprOLL1=
VRvWP3OJtI&m=3Dr66tYSNXuHW4PCg5SzjQI-oFFHujZgSrVyT9KcNeDNA&s=3DHyDZ=
gEgq5FjnSzGaiGqbNqGIe8fl21BVFNFyTBNGMCI&e=3D" style=3D"color:#4453ea" t=
arget=3D"_blank" rel=3D"noopener noreferrer">
www.avg.com</a> </td>
</tr>
</tbody>
</table>
<a href=3D"#DAB4FAD8-2DD7-40BB-A1B8-4E2AA1F9FDF2" height=3D"1" width=3D"1">=
</a></div>
</div>
</div>
</div>
</div>
</body>
</html>
--_000_5DF59F06A5E05E47A21C0E72057265D901BFAA5012msgdb11utadut_--
--===============3818016651422146500==
Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit
Content-Disposition: inline
** triumphs@autox.team.net **
Archive: http://www.team.net/pipermail/triumphs http://www.team.net/archive
--===============3818016651422146500==--
|
![https://ipmcdn.avast.com/images/icons/icon-envelope-tick-green-avg-v1.png]=](https://ipmcdn.avast.com/images/icons/icon-envelope-tick-green-avg-v1.png]=){kind=link}