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yes, its all odd.im sure it was pushing 15 amps back into the battery.=C2=
=A0no motor running and lights on shows a dischargeand with the in line 35 =
amp fuse and it having blown also leads me to believe its true.
i know it can blow the battery up. seen it twice in my life
i hate messing with those bloody control boxes. that's why i went to an alt=
ernator in the first place.
From: Randall <TR3driver@ca.rr.com>
To: 'Frank Fisher' <yellowtr3@yahoo.com>; 'Triumphs List' <triumphs@autox.=
team.net>=20
Sent: Friday, October 7, 2016 3:36 PM
Subject: RE: [TR] tr3 generator woes
=20
> at idle the amp meter read that the generator was pushing 15 amps back (+=
)
That alone seems very odd to me.=C2=A0 There is some variation, and of cour=
se two
different units fitted as original; but I've never seen a stock TR3
generator that could put out 15 amps at idle.=C2=A0 Are you sure it was cha=
rging
and not discharging?
> i didn't think the tr3 generator was capable of putting out 35 amps? i
> guess im wrong?
It can do it, but not for long!=C2=A0 The control box should limit the flow=
of
current to well under 35 amps even right after starting.=C2=A0 It can go a =
little
higher than the rated current (either 19 or 22 amps, depending on whether
it's the earlier C39 or later C40 generator) for a minute or two, but any
more than that risks overheating and damaging the generator.
Even with a heavily discharged battery, the voltage should quickly rise to
where the control box limits the current.=C2=A0 But it is possible to have =
a
shorted cell and still start the car.=C2=A0 That can lead to overcharging a=
nd
again can damage the generator.=C2=A0 So IMO it's wise to keep an eye on th=
e
ammeter, and if you should see more than 20 amps (the ignition draws 2 or 3
amps) for more than just a minute or two after starting; stop and
investigate.=C2=A0 If necessary, shut the engine off, pull the wire off the=
'F'
terminal, and drive home without the generator.
Worth noting that continuous overcharging can also damage the rest of the
car.=C2=A0 An overcharged lead-acid battery generates an explosive mixture =
of
hydrogen and oxygen (that "boiling" you see in the electrolyte is actually
water being converted back into it's component gases).=C2=A0 If a spark hap=
pens
or something gets hot enough, the mixture can explode, blowing the battery
apart and even setting fire to the car!
I'll never forget some stranger knocking on the door and asking "Did you
know your car was smoking?"!=C2=A0 Although in that case, it was a non-LBC =
with a
shorted battery and a home-made battery charger.=C2=A0 Fortunately I got th=
e fire
out before the damage was too severe, but it burned the paint off the hood
and ruined nearby hoses & wires.
> first thing is to get the in line fuse out.
Yeah, the fuse is a bad idea, IMO.=C2=A0 If it should blow, most likely the
generator field will remain connected to the battery (through the cutout an=
d
regulator relays), so the output voltage will go very high and, very likely=
,
ruin the unit.=C2=A0 Just like with current, the generator is quite capable=
of
developing enough voltage to ruin itself.
Although perhaps not necessary, I think I would disassemble the points on
the regulator relay for inspection and cleaning.=C2=A0 IMO this is a period=
ic
maintenance item every 10 years or so (even though again, the book says
leave it alone).
Right after that, I would check and adjust the contact gaps for both relays
in the control box, followed by adjusting the tension on the regulator
relay.=C2=A0 The book claims these adjustments are made during manufacture;=
but
no manufacturer has been doing that for a long time.=C2=A0 So even brand ne=
w
units need to be checked and (usually) adjusted.
As a side note, the TR4 workshop manual gives an easier alternative to
disconnecting the wires from A and A1.=C2=A0 Instead, leave the wires conne=
cted
and place a piece of paper or thin cardboard in the cutout contacts.=C2=A0 =
I find
it helpful to tear it into a rough "U" shape so it stays in place easier.
If it still doesn't act right; try the troubleshooting steps given at
http://tinyurl.com/hu23223
-- Randall
=20
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<html><head></head><body><div style=3D"color:#000; background-color:#fff; f=
ont-family:HelveticaNeue, Helvetica Neue, Helvetica, Arial, Lucida Grande, =
sans-serif;font-size:16px"><div id=3D"yui_3_16_0_ym19_1_1475870055324_7230"=
><span>yes, its all odd.</span></div><div dir=3D"ltr" id=3D"yui_3_16_0_ym19=
_1_1475870055324_7232"><span id=3D"yui_3_16_0_ym19_1_1475870055324_7231">im=
sure it was pushing 15 amps back into the battery. </span></div><div =
dir=3D"ltr" id=3D"yui_3_16_0_ym19_1_1475870055324_7233"><span>no motor runn=
ing and lights on shows a discharge</span></div><div dir=3D"ltr" id=3D"yui_=
3_16_0_ym19_1_1475870055324_7200"><span>and with the in line 35 amp fuse an=
d it having blown also leads me to believe its true.</span></div><div dir=
=3D"ltr" id=3D"yui_3_16_0_ym19_1_1475870055324_7200"><span><br></span></div=
><div dir=3D"ltr" id=3D"yui_3_16_0_ym19_1_1475870055324_7200"><span id=3D"y=
ui_3_16_0_ym19_1_1475870055324_7234">i know it can blow the battery up. see=
n it twice in my life</span></div><div dir=3D"ltr" id=3D"yui_3_16_0_ym19_1_=
1475870055324_7199"><span><br></span></div><div dir=3D"ltr" id=3D"yui_3_16_=
0_ym19_1_1475870055324_7198"><span><br></span></div><div dir=3D"ltr" id=3D"=
yui_3_16_0_ym19_1_1475870055324_7196"><span id=3D"yui_3_16_0_ym19_1_1475870=
055324_7197">i hate messing with those bloody control boxes. that's why i w=
ent to an alternator in the first place.</span></div><div class=3D"qtdSepar=
ateBR" id=3D"yui_3_16_0_ym19_1_1475870055324_7195"><br><br></div><div class=
=3D"yahoo_quoted" id=3D"yui_3_16_0_ym19_1_1475870055324_7078" style=3D"disp=
lay: block;"> <div style=3D"font-family: HelveticaNeue, Helvetica Neue, He=
lvetica, Arial, Lucida Grande, sans-serif; font-size: 16px;" id=3D"yui_3_16=
_0_ym19_1_1475870055324_7077"> <div style=3D"font-family: HelveticaNeue, He=
lvetica Neue, Helvetica, Arial, Lucida Grande, sans-serif; font-size: 16px;=
" id=3D"yui_3_16_0_ym19_1_1475870055324_7076"> <div dir=3D"ltr" id=3D"yui_3=
_16_0_ym19_1_1475870055324_7170"> <font size=3D"2" face=3D"Arial" id=3D"yui=
_3_16_0_ym19_1_1475870055324_7169"> <hr size=3D"1" id=3D"yui_3_16_0_ym19_1_=
1475870055324_7214"> <b><span style=3D"font-weight:bold;">From:</span></b> =
Randall <TR3driver@ca.rr.com><br> <b><span style=3D"font-weight: bold=
;">To:</span></b> 'Frank Fisher' <yellowtr3@yahoo.com>; 'Triumphs Lis=
t' <triumphs@autox.team.net> <br> <b><span style=3D"font-weight: bold=
;">Sent:</span></b> Friday, October 7, 2016 3:36 PM<br> <b><span style=3D"f=
ont-weight: bold;">Subject:</span></b> RE: [TR] tr3 generator woes<br> </fo=
nt> </div> <div class=3D"y_msg_container" id=3D"yui_3_16_0_ym19_1_147587005=
5324_7075"><br>> at idle the amp meter read that the generator was pushi=
ng 15 amps back (+)<br clear=3D"none"><br clear=3D"none">That alone seems v=
ery odd to me. There is some variation, and of course two<br clear=3D=
"none">different units fitted as original; but I've never seen a stock TR3<=
br clear=3D"none">generator that could put out 15 amps at idle. Are y=
ou sure it was charging<br clear=3D"none">and not discharging?<br clear=3D"=
none"><br clear=3D"none">> i didn't think the tr3 generator was capable =
of putting out 35 amps? i<br clear=3D"none">> guess im wrong?<br clear=
=3D"none"><br clear=3D"none">It can do it, but not for long! The cont=
rol box should limit the flow of<br clear=3D"none">current to well under 35=
amps even right after starting. It can go a little<br clear=3D"none"=
>higher than the rated current (either 19 or 22 amps, depending on whether<=
br clear=3D"none">it's the earlier C39 or later C40 generator) for a minute=
or two, but any<br clear=3D"none">more than that risks overheating and dam=
aging the generator.<br clear=3D"none"><br clear=3D"none">Even with a heavi=
ly discharged battery, the voltage should quickly rise to<br clear=3D"none"=
>where the control box limits the current. But it is possible to have=
a<br clear=3D"none">shorted cell and still start the car. That can l=
ead to overcharging and<br clear=3D"none">again can damage the generator.&n=
bsp; So IMO it's wise to keep an eye on the<br clear=3D"none">ammeter, and =
if you should see more than 20 amps (the ignition draws 2 or 3<br clear=3D"=
none">amps) for more than just a minute or two after starting; stop and<br =
clear=3D"none">investigate. If necessary, shut the engine off, pull t=
he wire off the 'F'<br clear=3D"none">terminal, and drive home without the =
generator.<br clear=3D"none"><br clear=3D"none">Worth noting that continuou=
s overcharging can also damage the rest of the<br clear=3D"none">car. =
An overcharged lead-acid battery generates an explosive mixture of<br clea=
r=3D"none">hydrogen and oxygen (that "boiling" you see in the electrolyte i=
s actually<br clear=3D"none">water being converted back into it's component=
gases). If a spark happens<br clear=3D"none">or something gets hot e=
nough, the mixture can explode, blowing the battery<br clear=3D"none">apart=
and even setting fire to the car!<br clear=3D"none"><br clear=3D"none">I'l=
l never forget some stranger knocking on the door and asking "Did you<br cl=
ear=3D"none">know your car was smoking?"! Although in that case, it w=
as a non-LBC with a<br clear=3D"none">shorted battery and a home-made batte=
ry charger. Fortunately I got the fire<br clear=3D"none">out before t=
he damage was too severe, but it burned the paint off the hood<br clear=3D"=
none">and ruined nearby hoses & wires.<div class=3D"yqt0369416723" id=
=3D"yqtfd52911"><br clear=3D"none"><br clear=3D"none">> first thing is t=
o get the in line fuse out.</div><br clear=3D"none"><br clear=3D"none">Yeah=
, the fuse is a bad idea, IMO. If it should blow, most likely the<br =
clear=3D"none">generator field will remain connected to the battery (throug=
h the cutout and<br clear=3D"none">regulator relays), so the output voltage=
will go very high and, very likely,<br clear=3D"none">ruin the unit. =
Just like with current, the generator is quite capable of<br clear=3D"none=
">developing enough voltage to ruin itself.<br clear=3D"none"><br clear=3D"=
none">Although perhaps not necessary, I think I would disassemble the point=
s on<br clear=3D"none">the regulator relay for inspection and cleaning.&nbs=
p; IMO this is a periodic<br clear=3D"none">maintenance item every 10 years=
or so (even though again, the book says<br clear=3D"none">leave it alone).=
<br clear=3D"none"><br clear=3D"none">Right after that, I would check and a=
djust the contact gaps for both relays<br clear=3D"none">in the control box=
, followed by adjusting the tension on the regulator<br clear=3D"none">rela=
y. The book claims these adjustments are made during manufacture; but=
<br clear=3D"none">no manufacturer has been doing that for a long time.&nbs=
p; So even brand new<br clear=3D"none">units need to be checked and (usuall=
y) adjusted.<br clear=3D"none"><br clear=3D"none">As a side note, the TR4 w=
orkshop manual gives an easier alternative to<br clear=3D"none">disconnecti=
ng the wires from A and A1. Instead, leave the wires connected<br cle=
ar=3D"none">and place a piece of paper or thin cardboard in the cutout cont=
acts. I find<br clear=3D"none">it helpful to tear it into a rough "U"=
shape so it stays in place easier.<br clear=3D"none"><br clear=3D"none">If=
it still doesn't act right; try the troubleshooting steps given at<br clea=
r=3D"none"><a shape=3D"rect" href=3D"http://tinyurl.com/hu23223"; target=3D"=
_blank" id=3D"yui_3_16_0_ym19_1_1475870055324_7235">http://tinyurl.com/hu23=
223</a><br clear=3D"none"><br clear=3D"none">-- Randall<div class=3D"yqt036=
9416723" id=3D"yqtfd67707"><br clear=3D"none"><br clear=3D"none"></div><br>=
<br></div> </div> </div> </div></div></body></html>
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