As I recall, you've got two heat problems. One is that the starter
seems weak with a hot engine, and the other being this clanking
sound.
The weak cranking may well be over advanced ignition timing.
When a healthy engine is cranked over warm, it tends to fire up
almost instantly because there is vaporized fuel sitting in the
cylinders, ready to fire. If the ignition timing is over advanced,
the firing can take place before the starter gets a good spin
going on the crankshaft. The classic sound of this is a starter
that goes "er....er..er.erererer". Retard the timing a little and
see how it does.
The sound, I'm not sure of, but it might (only might) be related
to ignition timing as well, since you described it as only
being heard when starting a warm engine. If the flywheel and
starter gear teeth are backlashing, this can create a clank
sound.
Another posibility is that the bendix assembly is worn or sticky,
and the warmth of the engine heat causes enough change
in the lubrication of the mechanism that it clangs down against
either it's own stops or the flywheel.
Removing the starter (not a hard job) and examining it will
reveal quite a bit about who is clanking into whom.
>>> "Will Slater" <slaterw@bluffton.edu> 10/25 11:46 AM >>>
Thanks for the insights. I had not realized a starter could propel a car. It
truly seems peculiar that heat of the engine would be the source of the
problem since it is not near the exhaust. I wonder if the clanking sound as
it starts is an indication of a related starter problem or something else.
The clanking happens virtually every time I start it. A friend speculated
that the clanking might be the flywheel. Another speculated that it might be
carbon build up might be the cause of the hot start problem coupled with a
weakened starter.
I think Doug's comment
" I think the gear reduction is expensive overkill, and would tend to be
bought by people who are using the "replace parts until it starts working
better" approach to auto maintenance.' points to a sound approach to auto
repair. I don't want to unnecessarily replace parts and would like to find
that actual problem and resolve it rather than simply treat the symptoms. My
knowledge of engines is admittedly pretty scant and so makes diagnosis
particularly difficult. So, I am wondering where to go from here. Are their
tests I could/should make to get at the actual source of the problem?
-----Original Message-----
From: Nolan Penney [mailto:npenney@mde.state.md.us]
Sent: Wednesday, October 24, 2001 7:51 AM
To: spitfires@autox.team.net; slaterw@bluffton.edu
Subject: Re: hot start syndrome??
It is my understanding that the Isuzu Trooper starter motor is a gear
reduction
unit that fits into a Spitfire. Cannot elaborate beyond that.
I find the hot start issue with a Spitfire to be peculiar. Normally, a hot
starter
motor is heated up by virtue of its proximity of the exhaust. This is
particularly
an issue with headers. The standard fix is to install a shield around the
starter
to keep the heat from the headers from soaking the starter motor. But with
the Spitfire having the starter on the opposite side of the exhaust, I just
find
it peculiar.
The oem starter design is not fragile, and is in fact robust enough to have
"motored" my Spitfire along in various gears on an as need basis (as in when
it died crossing an intersection, etc). Now my original starter had gone
bad
and was unable to provide adequate starting power, especially when warmed
up. I did replace it with an oem type, and have had no problems whatsoever
cranking the engine over. I didn't go with the Isuzu starter because I
hadn't
heard of it at the time. I must confess though, never on any of my engines
have I had a gear reduction starter.
>>> "Will Slater" <slaterw@bluffton.edu> 10/23 5:53 PM >>>
I just saw a reference to "hot start syndrome" in an ad by Ted Schumacher in
the Spitfire and GT magazine. He say that a gear ratio starter is guaranteed
fix the problem. I have noticed with my Spit that as I start it often makes
a loud kind of clanking noise. That is the only time I hear it. I notice
that after driving for an hour or so and stopping for gas my Spit is hard to
start. It has always started but it gets worrisome especially the farther I
am from home! What can folks on the list tell me about this syndrome? I have
seen regular starters for $66 these HD geared starters were $195-$245 in the
magazine ads. As always I appreciate your help.
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