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Re: [Healeys] Austin Healey 100 Misfire Diagnosis.

To: Don Anglesey <healey100s@live.com>
Subject: Re: [Healeys] Austin Healey 100 Misfire Diagnosis.
From: Jim Ryan <ryan@jimryan.com>
Date: Thu, 29 Sep 2022 15:24:06 -0400
Cc: Healey list <healeys@autox.team.net>
Delivered-to: mharc@autox.team.net
Delivered-to: healeys@autox.team.net
References: <CAB3i7LJ7O3Z58YEjEbdVVdpz7Q_9ovaggKrJBXLiwLQ2ksnPrQ@mail.gmail.com> <CAFBXTkK57aopOM4-+8+-59CHyryiQk_OO4i_jVW5+v-pGFvAbA@mail.gmail.com> <77e2342e-cd47-6cec-8b0b-be47f9d1eee4@comcast.net> <CAFBXTkLUh25V-PH1cPPhZs+-ARzXYURu0b_4Dr2jpkzF5BHP=A@mail.gmail.com> <CAL28cLWWZq0YiWQFhr+YO7Bx1C6J0OWufA560Xd9eATYgTXWkA@mail.gmail.com> <CAFBXTkK5EzwLHKog17S3kvqCk5FcejjAMsrdtT8EAnuz8wY8Kw@mail.gmail.com> <CAB3i7LKQgDNaD06mxvSdFXBHogvR=K-hnHzbz0Lg-VuETZZYNg@mail.gmail.com> <SA2PR06MB73537A571A161A69CBDE3C41FD579@SA2PR06MB7353.namprd06.prod.outlook.com>
--===============7187019528881458136==

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Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable

What happens if you don't turn the car off when you fill it up?

On Thu, Sep 29, 2022, 11:07 AM Don Anglesey via Healeys <
healeys@autox.team.net> wrote:

> I suspect that when the tank is filled any sediment or debris around the
> tank intake is redistributed thru the fuel then it settles again.  Classi=
c
> sign of bad fuel filter or sediment in tank.
>
> Don
>
>
>
>
>
> Sent from Mail <https://go.microsoft.com/fwlink/?LinkId=3D550986> for
> Windows
>
>
>
> *From: *Michael Salter <michaelsalter@gmail.com>
> *Sent: *Thursday, September 29, 2022 8:10 AM
> *To: *Alan Seigrist <healey.nut@gmail.com>
> *Cc: *Healey list <healeys@autox.team.net>
> *Subject: *Re: [Healeys] Austin Healey 100 Misfire Diagnosis.
>
>
>
> Thanks to all who have obviously given this misfire issue considerable
> thought. I will be sure to check all suggestions.
>
> I  should like to point out however that it is the immediate vanishing of
> the misfire after filling the fuel tank that has me confused.
>
> This has happened three times simce the problem appeared.
>
> I just don't understand how an ignition problem could change as a result
> of filling the tank.
>
> Furthermore I'm convinced that this is not a fuel starvation problem
> because the amount of engine power being used has no effect.
>
> Totally baffled.
>
> Thanks again to all ... I'll  report back.
>
>
>
> On Thu., Sep. 29, 2022, 9:14 a.m. Alan Seigrist via Healeys, <
> healeys@autox.team.net> wrote:
>
> Hi John -
>
>
>
> Yes, that was the point I was trying to make, sorry if it fell through ba=
d
> interpretation!  As Ed McMahon used to say, "You Are Correct Sir!"
>
>
>
> Cheers,
>
>
>
> Alan
>
>
>
> On Thu, Sep 29, 2022 at 7:53 PM john harper <ah100tech@gmail.com> wrote:
>
> Alan
>
>
>
> Coils can fail with heat and then recover when cooled. I had one that had
> these symptoms and when looking closely I saw that the insulating oil had
> run out through a very small crack in the bottom of the case.
>
>
>
> On Thu, 29 Sept 2022 at 10:34, Alan Seigrist <healey.nut@gmail.com> wrote=
:
>
> Michael -
>
> Just as a follow up to my email since the symptoms seem to manifest
> themself  ...
>
>    - whether the car is warmed up or not - this typically will exclude
>    anything related to fuel or the coil
>    - whether the car is under load or not - this typically will exclude
>    anything related to fuel
>    - whether the choke is pulled or not - this typically will exclude
>    anything related to fuel
>    - somewhat intermittent but systematically under all conditions -
>    suggests to me wiring / ground issues
>
> Given this I'd check (as a priority):
>
>    - Battery Master (when these fail they will ground the coil)
>    - primary ignition wire (white) from the switch to coil (cycle the
>    connections)
>    - motor ground straps (cycle the connections)
>    - loose wires in the dizzy
>    - loose ignition wires into the dizzy or spark plug
>
> Other things to possibly do (as secondary):
>
>    - replace rotor
>    - replace dizzy cap
>
> I don't think it would be contacts or condensor simply because this would
> either be very regular all the time, or maybe sensitive to temp.
>
> Best,
>
>
>
> Alan
>
>
>
> On Thu, Sep 29, 2022 at 4:46 PM Bob Spidell <bspidell@comcast.net> wrote:
>
> re: "... I don=E2=80=99t recall if that wire is separate from the distrib=
utor wire
> ..."
>
> It is (or should be). If the battery switch is in the 'OFF' position it
> grounds the coil primary so no spark.
>
> On 9/28/2022 8:34 PM, Alan Seigrist wrote:
>
> Hi Michael -
>
>
>
> Have you tried cycling the connections on the white wire from the ignitio=
n
> switch to the coil, and also from the coil to the distributor.
>
>
>
> You might also want to try disconnecting the black and white wire at the
> coil from the battery master switch - if it=E2=80=99s failing you=E2=80=
=99ll get weird
> symptoms like this.  If that wire is disconnected the car should run no
> problem.  I don=E2=80=99t recall if that wire is separate from the distri=
butor
> wire, if it isn=E2=80=99t you=E2=80=99ll have to disconnect it from under=
neath the master
> switch itself.
>
>
>
> Best,
>
>
>
> Alan
>
>
>
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--000000000000c5f94905e9d5d21e
Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable

<div dir=3D"auto">What happens if you don&#39;t turn the car off when you f=
ill it up?</div><br><div class=3D"gmail_quote"><div dir=3D"ltr" class=3D"gm=
ail_attr">On Thu, Sep 29, 2022, 11:07 AM Don Anglesey via Healeys &lt;<a hr=
ef=3D"mailto:healeys@autox.team.net";>healeys@autox.team.net</a>&gt; wrote:<=
br></div><blockquote class=3D"gmail_quote" style=3D"margin:0 0 0 .8ex;borde=
r-left:1px #ccc solid;padding-left:1ex">





<div lang=3D"EN-US" link=3D"blue" vlink=3D"#954F72" style=3D"word-wrap:brea=
k-word">
<div class=3D"m_-2192262898847993527WordSection1">
<p class=3D"MsoNormal">I suspect that when the tank is filled any sediment =
or debris around the tank intake is redistributed thru the fuel then it set=
tles again.=C2=A0 Classic sign of bad fuel filter or sediment in tank.</p>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal">Don</p>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal"><u></u>=C2=A0<u></u></p>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal"><u></u>=C2=A0<u></u></p>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal">Sent from <a href=3D"https://go.microsoft.com/fwlink=
/?LinkId=3D550986" target=3D"_blank" rel=3D"noreferrer">
Mail</a> for Windows</p>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal"><u></u>=C2=A0<u></u></p>
<div style=3D"border:none;border-top:solid #e1e1e1 1.0pt;padding:3.0pt 0in =
0in 0in">
<p class=3D"MsoNormal" style=3D"border:none;padding:0in"><b>From: </b><a hr=
ef=3D"mailto:michaelsalter@gmail.com"; target=3D"_blank" rel=3D"noreferrer">=
Michael Salter</a><br>
<b>Sent: </b>Thursday, September 29, 2022 8:10 AM<br>
<b>To: </b><a href=3D"mailto:healey.nut@gmail.com"; target=3D"_blank" rel=3D=
"noreferrer">Alan Seigrist</a><br>
<b>Cc: </b><a href=3D"mailto:healeys@autox.team.net"; target=3D"_blank" rel=
=3D"noreferrer">Healey list</a><br>
<b>Subject: </b>Re: [Healeys] Austin Healey 100 Misfire Diagnosis.</p>
</div>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal"><u></u>=C2=A0<u></u></p>
<div>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal">Thanks to all who have obviously given this misfire =
issue considerable thought. I will be sure to check all suggestions.=C2=A0<=
u></u><u></u></p>
<div>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal">I=C2=A0 should like to point out however that it is =
the immediate vanishing of the misfire after filling the fuel tank that has=
 me confused.=C2=A0<u></u><u></u></p>
</div>
<div>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal">This has happened three times simce the problem appe=
ared.<u></u><u></u></p>
</div>
<div>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal">I just don&#39;t understand how an ignition problem =
could change as a result of filling the tank.<u></u><u></u></p>
</div>
<div>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal">Furthermore I&#39;m convinced that this is not a fue=
l starvation problem because the amount of engine power being used has no e=
ffect.<u></u><u></u></p>
</div>
<div>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal">Totally baffled.<u></u><u></u></p>
</div>
<div>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal">Thanks again to all ... I&#39;ll=C2=A0 report back.<=
u></u><u></u></p>
</div>
</div>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal"><u></u>=C2=A0<u></u></p>
<div>
<div>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal">On Thu., Sep. 29, 2022, 9:14 a.m. Alan Seigrist via =
Healeys, &lt;<a href=3D"mailto:healeys@autox.team.net"; target=3D"_blank" re=
l=3D"noreferrer">healeys@autox.team.net</a>&gt; wrote:<u></u><u></u></p>
</div>
<blockquote style=3D"border:none;border-left:solid #cccccc 1.0pt;padding:0i=
n 0in 0in 6.0pt;margin-left:4.8pt;margin-right:0in">
<div>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal">Hi John -<u></u><u></u></p>
<div>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal"><u></u>=C2=A0<u></u></p>
</div>
<div>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal">Yes, that was the point I was trying to make, sorry =
if it fell through bad interpretation!=C2=A0 As Ed McMahon used to say, &qu=
ot;You Are Correct Sir!&quot;<u></u><u></u></p>
</div>
<div>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal"><u></u>=C2=A0<u></u></p>
</div>
<div>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal">Cheers,<u></u><u></u></p>
</div>
<div>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal"><u></u>=C2=A0<u></u></p>
</div>
<div>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal">Alan<u></u><u></u></p>
</div>
</div>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal"><u></u>=C2=A0<u></u></p>
<div>
<div>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal">On Thu, Sep 29, 2022 at 7:53 PM john harper &lt;<a h=
ref=3D"mailto:ah100tech@gmail.com"; target=3D"_blank" rel=3D"noreferrer">ah1=
00tech@gmail.com</a>&gt; wrote:<u></u><u></u></p>
</div>
<blockquote style=3D"border:none;border-left:solid #cccccc 1.0pt;padding:0i=
n 0in 0in 6.0pt;margin-left:4.8pt;margin-right:0in">
<div>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal">Alan<u></u><u></u></p>
<div>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal"><u></u>=C2=A0<u></u></p>
</div>
<div>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal">Coils can fail with heat and then recover when coole=
d. I had one that had these symptoms and when looking closely I saw that th=
e insulating oil had run out through a very small=C2=A0crack in the bottom =
of the case.<u></u><u></u></p>
</div>
</div>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal"><u></u>=C2=A0<u></u></p>
<div>
<div>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal">On Thu, 29 Sept 2022 at 10:34, Alan Seigrist &lt;<a =
href=3D"mailto:healey.nut@gmail.com"; target=3D"_blank" rel=3D"noreferrer">h=
ealey.nut@gmail.com</a>&gt; wrote:<u></u><u></u></p>
</div>
<blockquote style=3D"border:none;border-left:solid #cccccc 1.0pt;padding:0i=
n 0in 0in 6.0pt;margin-left:4.8pt;margin-right:0in">
<div>
<div>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal">Michael -<br>
<br>
Just as a follow up to my email since the symptoms seem to manifest themsel=
f=C2=A0=C2=A0...=C2=A0<u></u><u></u></p>
</div>
<div>
<ul type=3D"disc">
<li class=3D"MsoNormal">
whether the car is warmed up or not - this typically will exclude anything =
related to fuel or the coil<u></u><u></u></li><li class=3D"MsoNormal">
whether the car is under load or not - this typically will exclude anything=
 related to fuel<u></u><u></u></li><li class=3D"MsoNormal">
whether the choke is pulled or not - this typically will exclude anything r=
elated to fuel<u></u><u></u></li><li class=3D"MsoNormal">
somewhat intermittent but systematically under all conditions - suggests to=
 me wiring / ground issues<u></u><u></u></li></ul>
<div>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal">Given this I&#39;d check (as a priority):<u></u><u><=
/u></p>
<ul type=3D"disc">
<li class=3D"MsoNormal">
Battery Master (when these fail they will ground the coil)<u></u><u></u></l=
i><li class=3D"MsoNormal">
primary ignition wire (white) from the switch to coil (cycle the connection=
s)<u></u><u></u></li><li class=3D"MsoNormal">
motor ground straps (cycle the connections)<u></u><u></u></li><li class=3D"=
MsoNormal">
loose wires in the dizzy<u></u><u></u></li><li class=3D"MsoNormal">
loose ignition=C2=A0wires into the dizzy or spark plug<u></u><u></u></li></=
ul>
<div>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal">Other things to possibly do (as secondary):<u></u><u=
></u></p>
</div>
</div>
<div>
<ul type=3D"disc">
<li class=3D"MsoNormal">
replace rotor<u></u><u></u></li><li class=3D"MsoNormal">
replace dizzy cap<u></u><u></u></li></ul>
</div>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal">I don&#39;t think it would be contacts or condensor =
simply because this would either be very regular=C2=A0all the time, or mayb=
e sensitive to temp.<br>
<br>
Best,<u></u><u></u></p>
</div>
<div>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal"><u></u>=C2=A0<u></u></p>
</div>
<div>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal" style=3D"margin-bottom:12.0pt">Alan<u></u><u></u></p=
>
</div>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal"><u></u>=C2=A0<u></u></p>
<div>
<div>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal">On Thu, Sep 29, 2022 at 4:46 PM Bob Spidell &lt;<a h=
ref=3D"mailto:bspidell@comcast.net"; target=3D"_blank" rel=3D"noreferrer">bs=
pidell@comcast.net</a>&gt; wrote:<u></u><u></u></p>
</div>
<blockquote style=3D"border:none;border-left:solid #cccccc 1.0pt;padding:0i=
n 0in 0in 6.0pt;margin-left:4.8pt;margin-right:0in">
<div>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal" style=3D"margin-bottom:12.0pt">re: &quot;... I don=
=E2=80=99t recall if that wire is separate from the distributor wire ...&qu=
ot;<br>
<br>
It is (or should be). If the battery switch is in the &#39;OFF&#39; positio=
n it grounds the coil primary so no spark.<br>
<br>
<u></u><u></u></p>
<div>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal">On 9/28/2022 8:34 PM, Alan Seigrist wrote:<u></u><u>=
</u></p>
</div>
<blockquote style=3D"margin-top:5.0pt;margin-bottom:5.0pt">
<div>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal">Hi Michael -<u></u><u></u></p>
</div>
<div>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal"><u></u>=C2=A0<u></u></p>
</div>
<div>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal">Have you tried cycling the connections on the white =
wire from the ignition switch to the coil, and also from the coil to the di=
stributor.<u></u><u></u></p>
</div>
<div>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal"><u></u>=C2=A0<u></u></p>
</div>
<div>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal">You might also want to try disconnecting the black a=
nd white wire at the coil from the battery master switch - if it=E2=80=99s =
failing you=E2=80=99ll get weird symptoms like this.=C2=A0 If that wire is =
disconnected the car should run no problem.=C2=A0 I don=E2=80=99t recall
 if that wire is separate from the distributor wire, if it isn=E2=80=99t yo=
u=E2=80=99ll have to disconnect it from underneath the master switch itself=
.<u></u><u></u></p>
</div>
<div>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal"><u></u>=C2=A0<u></u></p>
</div>
<div>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal">Best,<u></u><u></u></p>
</div>
<div>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal"><u></u>=C2=A0<u></u></p>
</div>
<div>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal">Alan<u></u><u></u></p>
</div>
</blockquote>
</div>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal"><u></u>=C2=A0<u></u></p>
</blockquote>
</div>
</div>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal" style=3D"margin-bottom:12.0pt">_____________________=
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</blockquote>
</div>
</blockquote>
</div>
</blockquote>
</div>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal" style=3D"margin-right:0in;margin-bottom:12.0pt;margi=
n-left:4.8pt">
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<p class=3D"MsoNormal"><u></u>=C2=A0<u></u></p>
</div>
</div>

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</blockquote></div>

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