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I think that's the O-ring for the operating pistons. Mine were slightly
flat-sided at 200K+ miles.
On 4/17/2022 1:47 PM, gradea1@charter.net wrote:
>
> Don't think that issue has been resolved. Moss sells the replacement as:
> Austin Healey 100, 100-6, 3000 Clutch, Gearbox & Drivetrain
> Overdrive BN1 <https://mossmotors.com/overdrive-bn1> 76 O-RING BN1
>
> --79
>
> 866-690 <https://mossmotors.com/o-ring-27?assoc=172485>
>
> <https://mossmotors.com/o-ring-27?assoc=172485>
>
> O-RING 89 cents each-chafe them and replace them. Hank
>
> ---------------------------------------
>
> From: "Michael Salter via Healeys"
> To: "Bob Spidell"
> Cc: "healeys@autox.team.net"
> Sent: Sunday April 17 2022 12:04:24PM
> Subject: Re: [Healeys] Overdrive pressure not releasing.
>
> Actually Bob I've never used an "O" ringed accumulator.
> I spent a little time many years back looking into using "O" rings on
> the accumulator but couldn't resolve the issue of the ring being
> chaffed when passing over the radial drillings in the accumulator body.
> Does anyone know how that has been solved?
>
> M
>
> On Sun., Apr. 17, 2022, 2:49 p.m. Bob Spidell, <bspidell@comcast.net>
> wrote:
>
> Michael,
>
> Sounds like you're implying the O-ringed accumulator is superior
> to the metal ring (OEM) type? Wish I'd known about it when I
> rebuilt my O/D (I bought the DWM 'uprated' accumulator).
>
> I'll throw out another, very unlikely, potential cause: the cone
> clutch could be stuck together. I've heard of this happening, but
> have never experienced it my self--nor has anyone I know--but it's
> theoretically possible (esp. if the clutch is excessively worn).
> Could this be the reason the manual is adamant about replacing the
> 8 strong springs, of two lengths, that oppose the operating
> pistons on overhaul, regardless if they still seem robust?
>
>
> On 4/17/2022 9:31 AM, Michael Salter via Healeys wrote:
>
> Simon,
> Based upon your synopsis I conclude that the operating valve
> is NOT opening when either the solenoid lever or the setting
> lever is being moved to the position where the operating valve
> ball would normally be lifted off its seat.
> This conclusion is based upon your discovery that the pressure
> in the accumulator, as indicated on the gauge, does not leak
> away overnight.
> There is a small clearance between the operating valve push
> rod and the overdrive housing. If the operating valve ball was
> indeed lifted off its seat all the oil in the accumulator
> would, over time, leak past the operating rod thus discharge
> the accumulator.
> This process would indeed take some time but would certainly
> completely relieve most, if not all the residual accumulator
> pressure overnight.
> If however the operating valve ball is still in contact with
> its seat (i.e. not being lifted) the oil pressure would not
> reach the small clearance between the valve push rod and the
> housing and, other than past the accumulator rings there is
> nowhere for that pressure to be relieved.
> I would presume that Overdrive Spares installed an accumulator
> with an "O" ring rather than the original cast iron rings. If
> the original type accumulator piston was still fitted, oil
> would seep past the cast iron rings to relieve the pressure,
> albeit very slowly, and again the accumulator pressure would
> be discharged overnight..
> The cam on the operating shaft, the one which lifts the
> operating valve push rod and thus the operating valve ball, is
> locked to the shaft with a small taper pin. I would guess that
> the taper pin has either fallen out or sheared.
> Bad news is that this pin cannot be accessed without removing
> and disassembling the overdrive.
>
> M
>
> On Sat, Apr 16, 2022 at 1:19 PM Simon Lachlan via Healeys
> <healeys@autox.team.net> wrote:
>
> My OD is driving me mad and I definitely need some
> inspired advice. A bit of background first. Iâ??ll try to
> lay out all the facts in a logical sequence. (Iâ??m
> increasingly reluctant to link ODs with logic!)
>
> 1. Iâ??d say that the OD has done +/- 15k miles since a
> total rebuild by Overdrive Spares here in UK.
> 2. The OD had issues before Christmas (21) and was sorted
> out by OD Spares. The accumulator was uprated and
> pressure issues sorted.
> 3. OD functioned 100% on the few times Iâ??d been able to
> take it out since then until..
> 4. One day, the OD stopped functioning.
> 5. I checked the electrics. All fine there so I delved a
> bit deeper.
> 6. It had fried its solenoid which I replaced. Butâ?¦
> 7. That did not fix the problem soâ?¦
> 8. I decided that the operating valveâ??s adjustment might
> be off so..
> 9. I bought a dial gauge and hoped to sort it out
> precisely rather than by â??feelâ??, which I lack in this
> area.
> 10. Prior to using the gauge I decided to see if the OD
> was functioning at all so I raised the car on stands
> and fitted my pressure gauge.
> 11. I get a reading of 500psi rising a bit when I rev the
> engine but Iâ??d suppose that would drop when the oil
> warms up.
> 12. BUT, and this is where things go pear-shapedâ?¦moving
> the little lever on the RHS up and down does not
> engage/disengage OD. There is no change on the gauge
> to show OD engaging or disengaging.
> 13. AND, the gauge stays at 500psi even when the engine is
> off. Moving the lever 20 times has zero effect. Stayed
> at 500 overnight!
> 14. Of course, I checked for dirt in the operating valve
> area. None.
> 15. Likewise, the tiny hole in the â??valve â?? operatingâ??
> (the spindle thing which the ball sits on)â?¦.thatâ??s
> clear. And surely, the pressure would diminish
> overnight if something in that area was partially
> obstructed?
> 16. When I remove the pressure valve, thereâ??s a small
> spillage â?? no more than youâ??d expect â?? but repeating
> the pressure gauge process only returns the same results.
> 17. I see in the bible according to Norman Nock that
> â??Holding this lever with your thumb and index finger,
> you should be able to push the lever down lightly
> about â??â?? until you feel a slight spring pressure
> resistance. The lever should go down another ¼â?? after
> encountering the resistanceâ?¦â?¦â?? ie thereâ??s about â??â??
> movement up & down in that lever. Well, my lever does
> move and does lift the ball, but thereâ??s not â??â??
> movement there. Could that be the problem area???
> 18. Almost finishedâ?¦keep reading!
>
> So, Iâ??m stumped. Every time I learn something new about
> the OD, it has a new trick to baffle me.
>
> Iâ??ve no 100% sure way of telling whether itâ??s gone into OD
> Â and stuck there or whether itâ??s simply not going into OD
> at all.
>
> Iâ??ve done a lot of reading through my books and collection
> of advice from the various gurus and found reference to
> ODs being stuck but those seemed to be to do with â??weak
> springsâ?? which, particularly after a long lay-off,
> wouldnâ??t disengage. The cure for this being a good smack
> on the steel plate sandwiched in the OD from below. Well,
> that seems to be a stuck mechanism issue whereas Iâ??m
> facing a hydraulic conundrum. Or am I?
>
> There is what is usually referred to as the â??pressure
> relief valveâ?? adjacent to the accumulator. The name
> suggested that pressure might be stuck in that areaâ?¦.but
> surely not overnight?
>
> Any ideas? I am particularly reluctant to take the gearbox
> and OD out. Youâ??ll recall the ridiculous business of the
> defective clutch kit? Well, I forget whether we had the
> box in and out 3 times or 4. Iâ??d hoped not to do it again
> so soon or ever for that matter.
>
> Iâ??m hoping for a miracle of course but some sound advice
> would be a godsend����
>
> Thanks,
>
> Simon
>
>
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I think that's the O-ring for the operating pistons. Mine were
slightly flat-sided at 200K+ miles.<br>
<br>
<br>
<div class="moz-cite-prefix">On 4/17/2022 1:47 PM,
<a class="moz-txt-link-abbreviated"
href="mailto:gradea1@charter.net";>gradea1@charter.net</a> wrote:<br>
</div>
<blockquote type="cite"
cite="mid:d9ac28076cd9fad09d2e7f0ba11c77890f5cb021@webmail">
<meta http-equiv="content-type" content="text/html; charset=UTF-8">
<br>
Don't think that issue has been resolved. Moss sells the
replacement as:Â
<table class="data-table" id="product-applications-table"
style="margin: 0px; padding: 0px; border-collapse: collapse;
border-spacing: 0px; font-family: Lato, "Helvetica
Neue", Arial, sans-serif; color: rgb(99, 99, 99);
font-size: 14px; line-height: 1.5; width: 965px; border: 1px
solid rgb(237, 237, 237); border-radius: 10px; background-color:
rgb(255, 255, 255);">
<tbody style="box-sizing: border-box; margin: 0px; padding:
0px;">
<tr style="box-sizing: border-box; margin: 0px; padding: 0px;">
<td style="box-sizing: border-box; margin: 0px; padding:
15px 20px; vertical-align: top; border-bottom: none;
border-left: 1px solid rgb(237, 237, 237); border-right:
1px solid rgb(237, 237, 237);">Austin Healey 100, 100-6,
3000</td>
<td style="box-sizing: border-box; margin: 0px; padding:
15px 20px; vertical-align: top; border-bottom: none;
border-left: 1px solid rgb(237, 237, 237); border-right:
1px solid rgb(237, 237, 237);">Clutch, Gearbox &
Drivetrain</td>
<td style="box-sizing: border-box; margin: 0px; padding:
15px 20px; vertical-align: top; border-bottom: none;
border-left: 1px solid rgb(237, 237, 237); border-right:
1px solid rgb(237, 237, 237);"><a
href="https://mossmotors.com/overdrive-bn1";
style="box-sizing: border-box; margin: 0px; padding:
0px; touch-action: manipulation; color: rgb(50, 175,
255); text-decoration-line: none;"
moz-do-not-send="true">Overdrive BN1</a></td>
<td style="box-sizing: border-box; margin: 0px; padding:
15px 20px; vertical-align: top; border-bottom: none;
border-left: 1px solid rgb(237, 237, 237); border-right:
1px solid rgb(237, 237, 237);">76</td>
<td style="box-sizing: border-box; margin: 0px; padding:
15px 20px; vertical-align: top; border-bottom: none;
border-left: 1px solid rgb(237, 237, 237); border-right:
1px solid rgb(237, 237, 237);">O-RING</td>
<td style="box-sizing: border-box; margin: 0px; padding:
15px 20px; vertical-align: top; border-bottom: none;
border-left: 1px solid rgb(237, 237, 237); border-right:
1px solid rgb(237, 237, 237);">BN1</td>
</tr>
</tbody>
</table>
<p>--<span style="background-color: rgb(130, 141, 150); color:
rgb(255, 255, 255); font-size: 13px; font-family: Lato,
"Helvetica Neue", Arial, sans-serif; text-align:
center; white-space: nowrap;">79</span></p>
<span style="color: rgb(79, 80, 94); font-family: Lato,
"Helvetica Neue", Arial, sans-serif; font-size: 14px;
white-space: nowrap; background-color: rgb(244, 244, 244);">Â </span>
<div class="assoc-part" style="box-sizing: border-box; margin:
0px; padding: 10px 0px; width: 85.9531px; display: inline-block;
vertical-align: middle; overflow: hidden; text-overflow:
ellipsis; text-align: center; border-left: 1px solid rgb(193,
201, 204); border-right: 1px solid rgb(193, 201, 204);
min-height: 35px; color: rgb(79, 80, 94); font-family: Lato,
"Helvetica Neue", Arial, sans-serif; font-size: 14px;
white-space: nowrap;"><a
href="https://mossmotors.com/o-ring-27?assoc=172485";
style="box-sizing: border-box; margin: 0px; padding: 0px;
touch-action: manipulation; color: rgb(0, 78, 149);
text-decoration-line: none;" moz-do-not-send="true">866-690</a></div>
<span style="color: rgb(79, 80, 94); font-family: Lato,
"Helvetica Neue", Arial, sans-serif; font-size: 14px;
white-space: nowrap; background-color: rgb(244, 244, 244);">Â </span>
<p><a class="assoc-product-link"
href="https://mossmotors.com/o-ring-27?assoc=172485";
style="font-family: Lato, "Helvetica Neue", Arial,
sans-serif; font-size: 14px; white-space: nowrap; box-sizing:
border-box; margin: 0px; padding: 0px; touch-action:
manipulation; color: rgb(79, 80, 94); text-decoration-line:
none; outline: 0px; display: inline-block; vertical-align:
middle; width: calc(100% - 45px);" moz-do-not-send="true"><img
class="component-image" id="popup-image-24349"
src="https://mossmotors.com/media/catalog/product/cache/1/image/40x40/9df78eab33525d08d6e5fb8d27136e95/8/6/866-690_1.jpg";
style="box-sizing: border-box; margin: 0px; padding: 0px
20px 0px 10px; border: 0px; display: inline-block;
vertical-align: middle;" moz-do-not-send="true">Â </a></p>
<p style="box-sizing: border-box; margin: 0px; padding: 0px;
white-space: normal; display: inline-block; vertical-align:
middle; width: 307.828px;">O-RING 89 cents each-chafe them and
replace them. Hank</p>
<p>---------------------------------------</p>
From: "Michael Salter via Healeys" <healeys@autox.team.net><br>
To: "Bob Spidell"<br>
Cc: <a class="moz-txt-link-rfc2396E"
href="mailto:healeys@autox.team.net";>"healeys@autox.team.net"</a><br>
Sent: Sunday April 17 2022 12:04:24PM<br>
Subject: Re: [Healeys] Overdrive pressure not releasing.<br>
<br>
<div>Actually Bob I've never used an "O" ringed
accumulator.Â
<div>I spent a little time many years back looking into
using "O" rings on the accumulator but couldn't resolve the
issue
of the ring being chaffed when passing over the radial
drillings in
the accumulator body. </div>
<div>Does anyone know how that has been solved?</div>
<div><br>
</div>
<div>M</div>
</div>
<br>
<div class="gmail_quote">
<div dir="ltr" class="gmail_attr">On Sun., Apr. 17, 2022, 2:49
p.m.
Bob Spidell, <<a
moz-do-not-send="true">bspidell@comcast.net</a>>
wrote:<br>
</div>
<blockquote class="gmail_quote" style="margin:0 0 0
.8ex;border-left:1px #ccc solid;padding-left:1ex;">
<div>Michael,<br>
<br>
Sounds like you're implying the O-ringed accumulator is
superior to
the metal ring (OEM) type? Wish I'd known about it when I
rebuilt
my O/D (I bought the DWM 'uprated' accumulator).<br>
<br>
I'll throw out another, very unlikely, potential cause:
the cone
clutch could be stuck together. I've heard of this
happening, but
have never experienced it my self--nor has anyone I
know--but it's
theoretically possible (esp. if the clutch is excessively
worn).
Could this be the reason the manual is adamant about
replacing the
8 strong springs, of two lengths, that oppose the
operating pistons
on overhaul, regardless if they still seem robust?<br>
<br>
<br>
<div>On 4/17/2022 9:31 AM, Michael Salter via Healeys
wrote:<br>
</div>
<blockquote>
<div dir="ltr">
<div class="gmail_default" style="font-family:arial,
sans-serif;font-size:small;">Simon,</div>
<div class="gmail_default" style="font-family:arial,
sans-serif;font-size:small;">Based upon your
synopsis I conclude that the operating valve is NOT
opening when
either the solenoid lever or the setting lever is
being moved to
the position where the operating valve ball would
normally be
lifted off its seat.</div>
<div class="gmail_default" style="font-family:arial,
sans-serif;font-size:small;">This conclusion is
based upon your discovery that the pressure in the
accumulator, as
indicated on the gauge, does not leak away
overnight.</div>
<div class="gmail_default" style="font-family:arial,
sans-serif;font-size:small;">There is a small
clearance between the operating valve push rod and
the overdrive
housing. If the operating valve ball was indeed
lifted off its seat
all the oil in the accumulator would, over time,
leak past the
operating rod thus discharge the accumulator.<br>
</div>
<div class="gmail_default" style="font-family:arial,
sans-serif;font-size:small;">This process would
indeed take some time but would certainly completely
relieve most,
if not all the residual accumulator pressure
overnight.</div>
<div class="gmail_default" style="font-family:arial,
sans-serif;font-size:small;">If however the
operating valve ball is still in contact with its
seat (i.e. not
being lifted) the oil pressure would not reach the
small clearance
between the valve push rod and the housing and,
other than past the
accumulator rings there is nowhere for that pressure
to be
relieved.<br>
</div>
<div class="gmail_default" style="font-family:arial,
sans-serif;font-size:small;">I would presume that
Overdrive Spares installed an accumulator with an
"O" ring rather
than the original cast iron rings. If the original
type accumulator
piston was still fitted, oil would seep past the
cast iron rings to
relieve the pressure, albeit very slowly, and again
the accumulator
pressure would be discharged overnight..<br>
</div>
<div class="gmail_default" style="font-family:arial,
sans-serif;font-size:small;">The cam on the
operating shaft, the one which lifts the operating
valve push rod
and thus the operating valve ball, is locked to the
shaft with a
small taper pin. I would guess that the taper pin
has either fallen
out or sheared.<br>
</div>
<div class="gmail_default" style="font-family:arial,
sans-serif;font-size:small;">Bad news is that
this pin cannot be accessed without removing and
disassembling the
overdrive.</div>
<div class="gmail_default" style="font-family:arial,
sans-serif;font-size:small;"><br>
</div>
<div class="gmail_default" style="font-family:arial,
sans-serif;font-size:small;">M<br>
</div>
</div>
<br>
<div class="gmail_quote">
<div dir="ltr" class="gmail_attr">On Sat, Apr 16, 2022
at 1:19 PM
Simon Lachlan via Healeys <<a
moz-do-not-send="true">healeys@autox.team.net</a>>
wrote:<br>
</div>
<blockquote class="gmail_quote" style="margin:0px 0px
0px .8ex;border-left:1px solid
rgb(204,204,204);padding-left:1ex;">
<div lang="en-gb">
<div>
<p class="MsoNormal">My OD is driving me mad and
I definitely need
some inspired advice. A bit of background
first. Iâ??ll try to lay
out all the facts in a logical sequence. (Iâ??m
increasingly
reluctant to link ODs with logic!)</p>
<ol style="margin-top:0cm;" type="1" start="1">
<li style="margin-left:0cm;">Iâ??d say that the
OD has done +/- 15k
miles since a total rebuild by Overdrive
Spares here in UK.</li>
<li style="margin-left:0cm;">The OD had issues
before Christmas (21)
and was sorted out by OD Spares. The
accumulator was uprated and
pressure issues sorted.</li>
<li style="margin-left:0cm;">OD functioned
100% on the few times Iâ??d
been able to take it out since then until..</li>
<li style="margin-left:0cm;">One day, the OD
stopped
functioning.</li>
<li style="margin-left:0cm;">I checked the
electrics. All fine there
so I delved a bit deeper.</li>
<li style="margin-left:0cm;">It had fried its
solenoid which I
replaced. Butâ?¦</li>
<li style="margin-left:0cm;">That did not fix
the problem soâ?¦</li>
<li style="margin-left:0cm;">I decided that
the operating valveâ??s
adjustment might be off so..</li>
<li style="margin-left:0cm;">I bought a dial
gauge and hoped to sort
it out precisely rather than by â??feelâ??,
which I lack in this
area.</li>
<li style="margin-left:0cm;">Prior to using
the gauge I decided to
see if the OD was functioning at all so I
raised the car on stands
and fitted my pressure gauge.</li>
<li style="margin-left:0cm;">I get a reading
of 500psi rising a bit
when I rev the engine but Iâ??d suppose that
would drop when the oil
warms up.</li>
<li style="margin-left:0cm;">BUT, and this is
where things go
pear-shapedâ?¦moving the little lever on the
RHS up and down does not
engage/disengage OD. There is no change on
the gauge to show OD
engaging or disengaging.</li>
<li style="margin-left:0cm;">AND, the gauge
stays at 500psi even
when the engine is off. Moving the lever 20
times has zero effect.
Stayed at 500 overnight!</li>
<li style="margin-left:0cm;">Of course, I
checked for dirt in the
operating valve area. None.</li>
<li style="margin-left:0cm;">Likewise, the
tiny hole in the â??valve â??
operatingâ?? (the spindle thing which the ball
sits on)â?¦.thatâ??s
clear. And surely, the pressure would
diminish overnight if
something in that area was partially
obstructed?</li>
<li style="margin-left:0cm;">When I remove the
pressure valve,
thereâ??s a small spillage â?? no more than
youâ??d expect â?? but
repeating the pressure gauge process only
returns the same
results.</li>
<li style="margin-left:0cm;">I see in the
bible according to Norman
Nock that â??Holding this lever with your
thumb and index finger, you
should be able to push the lever down
lightly about â??â?? until you
feel a slight spring pressure resistance.
The lever should go down
another ¼â?? after encountering the
resistanceâ?¦â?¦â?? ie thereâ??s about â??â??
movement up & down in that lever. Well,
my lever does move and does
lift the ball, but thereâ??s not â??â?? movement
there. Could that be the
problem area???</li>
<li style="margin-left:0cm;">Almost
finishedâ?¦keep reading!</li>
</ol>
<p class="MsoNormal" style="margin-left:18pt;">So,
Iâ??m stumped.
Every time I learn something new about the OD,
it has a new trick
to baffle me.</p>
<p class="MsoNormal" style="margin-left:18pt;">Iâ??ve
no 100% sure way
of telling whether itâ??s gone into OD Â and
stuck there or
whether itâ??s simply not going into OD at all.</p>
<p class="MsoNormal" style="margin-left:18pt;">Iâ??ve
done a lot of
reading through my books and collection of
advice from the various
gurus and found reference to ODs being stuck
but those seemed to be
to do with â??weak springsâ?? which, particularly
after a long lay-off,
wouldnâ??t disengage. The cure for this being a
good smack on the
steel plate sandwiched in the OD from below.
Well, that seems to be
a stuck mechanism issue whereas Iâ??m facing a
hydraulic conundrum.
Or am I?</p>
<p class="MsoNormal" style="margin-left:18pt;">There
is what is
usually referred to as the â??pressure relief
valveâ?? adjacent to the
accumulator. The name suggested that pressure
might be stuck in
that areaâ?¦.but surely not overnight?</p>
<p class="MsoNormal" style="margin-left:18pt;">Â </p>
<p class="MsoNormal" style="margin-left:18pt;">Any
ideas? I am
particularly reluctant to take the gearbox and
OD out. Youâ??ll
recall the ridiculous business of the
defective clutch kit? Well, I
forget whether we had the box in and out 3
times or 4. Iâ??d hoped
not to do it again so soon or ever for that
matter.</p>
<p class="MsoNormal" style="margin-left:18pt;">Â </p>
<p class="MsoNormal" style="margin-left:18pt;">Iâ??m
hoping for a
miracle of course but some sound advice would
be a godsend����</p>
<p class="MsoNormal" style="margin-left:18pt;">Â </p>
<p class="MsoNormal"
style="margin-left:18pt;">Thanks,</p>
<p class="MsoNormal" style="margin-left:18pt;">Simon</p>
<p class="MsoNormal" style="margin-left:18pt;">Â </p>
</div>
</div>
<br>
</blockquote>
</div>
</blockquote>
</div>
</blockquote>
</div>
</healeys@autox.team.net></blockquote>
<br>
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