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Dangerous combination ... Tamiami Trail and a Lincoln =F0=9F=98=B3=F0=9F=
=98=B3
On Tue., Mar. 30, 2021, 5:24 p.m. , <rfbegani@gmail.com> wrote:
> While my BJ8 was still on stands after installing the engine and
> transmission, I took the rear brakes apart and installed new cylinders an=
d
> shoes, springs etc. It was a great deal of pushing and shoving to get th=
e
> first one apart so I could clean and oil those items which would be
> moving. Still, I had to take it apart and put it back together 3 times
> before the system looked and worked good. The left rear brake was easier
> and took only 2 assemblies to get it right. Then came the installation o=
f
> the emergency brake. Again 2-3 times before it was adjusted and operating=
.
>
>
>
> Fast forward to last week when turning on to the Tamiami Trail and
> accelerating up to the 45 mph speed limit in very little traffic I
> approached a cross access of the 4 lane divided highway and carefully
> watched 2 cars waiting to cross in front of me when the big old Lincoln
> Town Car pulled out in front of me. It was a good test of the brakes. A=
ll
> 4 activated at the same time, helped by my new Michelin tires we stopped =
a
> full car length away from the passenger side doors. I could see his Mrs.
> going into shock because the driver had come to a complete stop broadside
> in front of us.
>
>
>
> Before all this work on the brakes, my BJ8 rear wheels for years would
> activate independently as a result the car would slide sideways.
>
>
>
> Keep working on the brakes as the life you save might be your own.
>
>
>
> Best regards,
>
>
>
> Bob Begani
>
>
>
> *From:* Healeys <healeys-bounces@autox.team.net> *On Behalf Of *Harold
> Manifold via Healeys
> *Sent:* Tuesday, March 30, 2021 4:18 PM
> *To:* Roger Grace <roggrace@telus.net>; Bob Spidell <bspidell@comcast.net=
>
> *Cc:* Healeys <healeys@autox.team.net>
> *Subject:* Re: [Healeys] Rear brake adjustment
>
>
>
> Does this help? Note the difference between item 2 and 4.
>
>
>
> Harold Manifold
>
>
>
> *From: *Roger Grace via Healeys <healeys@autox.team.net>
> *Sent: *Tuesday, March 30, 2021 9:54 AM
> *To: *Bob Spidell <bspidell@comcast.net>
> *Cc: *Healeys <healeys@autox.team.net>
> *Subject: *Re: [Healeys] Rear brake adjustment
>
>
>
> Yes thank you; that sounds like a good explanation. As you say it is a
> bear of a job and just working up some stamina to tackle it again !
>
> rg
>
>
>
> On Mon, Mar 29, 2021 at 10:38 PM Bob Spidell <bspidell@comcast.net> wrote=
:
>
> re: "I note that the slave is tight on the back plate. How tight is
> normal floating ?"
>
> I just spent several hours on my back on a greasy floor working on my
> BN2's rear drums. I didn't see any text in the shop manual explaining
> installation; most I found was a pic in the Moss catalog showing that
> the curved spring, with the 'hooks,' should be installed above the
> cylinder (between the cylinder and the handbrake lever). First, I
> installed the flat plate against the backing plate with the spring plate
> on top of it. Not only would the cylinder not move freely--which enables
> the self-energizing aspect of the brakes--but the rubber dust boot had
> nothing to hold it in place. I then reversed the installation; i.e. the
> spring plate was still above the cylinder, but under the flat plate
> (hooks up). This way the cylinder would slide smoothly and easily, which
> makes sense because there is less contact area, but the rubber boot,
> which is beveled on the inner part fit naturally under the flat plate
> and would stay in place when vigorously sliding the cylinder
> back-and-forth. Contact surfaces were lightly greased.
>
> Short answer: the cylinder should slide smoothly and easily; otherwise
> the self-energizing feature could be defeated, and the cylinder could be
> stuck in the expanded position, which could explain your non-retracting
> problem.
>
> Bob
>
>
> On 3/29/2021 3:07 PM, Roger Grace via Healeys wrote:
> > BJ8 ph2.
> > I am Struggling to get consistent results for rear brake shoe adjustmen=
t.
> > All part of a project to get handbrake working properly - currently it
> > is almost vertical.
> > Background:
> > New shoes, slaves and springs etc with less than 4k mi. Almost no sign
> > of any wear yet.
> > Handbrake lever clevis pins removed.
> > Steady post adjusted so the peg just touches when brakes are adjusted
> > tight.
> > Then the adjustment set so you can just hear/feel slight brake drag.
> > All OK so far.
> >
> > Here is the problem:
> > When the handbrake lever is pushed with screwdriver or my hand it
> > moves with initial free play then clamps the shoes as it should.
> > However when released brakes do not fully retract, and shoes bind and
> > not at the same setting that started off with.
> > Same story with using the hydraulics; seems to hang up, in not quite
> > the off position. Both wheels are the same.
> > Shoes can be "reset" to original setting by rattling the adjuster
> > back and forth in the freeplay zone.
> > All looks fine when drum is off and you can see the shoe operation.
> >
> > My thoughts :
> > I observe that the new springs actually touch the inside of the shoes ?
> > Maybe some grease there ? Is this interference normal ?
> > Is it possible to incorrectly assemble the shoes/springs ?
> > See photo of RR.
> > I note that the slave is tight on the back plate. How tight is normal
> > floating ?
> > Maybe I assembled the slave cylinder clips incorrectly ?
> >
> > All suggestions appreciated
> > rg
> >
> >
> >
> >
> >
> >
> >
>
> _______________________________________________
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<div dir=3D"auto">Dangerous combination=C2=A0 ...=C2=A0<span style=3D"font-=
family:arial,sans-serif;font-size:18.6667px">Tamiami Trail and a Lincoln =
=F0=9F=98=B3=F0=9F=98=B3</span></div><br><div class=3D"gmail_quote"><div di=
r=3D"ltr" class=3D"gmail_attr">On Tue., Mar. 30, 2021, 5:24 p.m. , <<a h=
ref=3D"mailto:rfbegani@gmail.com";>rfbegani@gmail.com</a>> wrote:<br></di=
v><blockquote class=3D"gmail_quote" style=3D"margin:0 0 0 .8ex;border-left:=
1px #ccc solid;padding-left:1ex"><div lang=3D"EN-US" link=3D"blue" vlink=3D=
"#954F72" style=3D"word-wrap:break-word"><div class=3D"m_377553152585758157=
5WordSection1"><p class=3D"MsoNormal"><span style=3D"font-size:14.0pt;font-=
family:"Arial",sans-serif">While my BJ8 was still on stands after=
installing the engine and transmission, I took the rear brakes apart and i=
nstalled new cylinders and shoes, springs etc.=C2=A0 It was a great deal of=
pushing and shoving to get the first one apart so I could clean and oil th=
ose items which would be moving.=C2=A0 Still, I had to take it apart and pu=
t it back together 3 times before the system looked and worked good.=C2=A0 =
The left rear brake was easier and took only 2 assemblies to get it right.=
=C2=A0 Then came the installation of the emergency brake. Again 2-3 times b=
efore it was adjusted and operating.=C2=A0 <u></u><u></u></span></p><p clas=
s=3D"MsoNormal"><span style=3D"font-size:14.0pt;font-family:"Arial&quo=
t;,sans-serif"><u></u>=C2=A0<u></u></span></p><p class=3D"MsoNormal"><span =
style=3D"font-size:14.0pt;font-family:"Arial",sans-serif">Fast fo=
rward to last week when turning on to the Tamiami Trail and accelerating up=
to the 45 mph speed limit in very little traffic I approached a cross acce=
ss of the 4 lane divided highway and carefully watched 2 cars waiting to cr=
oss in front of me when the big old Lincoln Town Car pulled out in front of=
me.=C2=A0 It was a good test of the brakes.=C2=A0 All 4 activated at the s=
ame time, helped by my new Michelin tires we stopped a full car length away=
from the passenger side doors.=C2=A0 I could see his Mrs. going into shock=
because the driver had come to a complete stop broadside in front of us.=
=C2=A0 <u></u><u></u></span></p><p class=3D"MsoNormal"><span style=3D"font-=
size:14.0pt;font-family:"Arial",sans-serif"><u></u>=C2=A0<u></u><=
/span></p><p class=3D"MsoNormal"><span style=3D"font-size:14.0pt;font-famil=
y:"Arial",sans-serif">Before all this work on the brakes, my BJ8 =
rear wheels for years would activate independently as a result the car woul=
d slide sideways.=C2=A0 <u></u><u></u></span></p><p class=3D"MsoNormal"><sp=
an style=3D"font-size:14.0pt;font-family:"Arial",sans-serif"><u><=
/u>=C2=A0<u></u></span></p><p class=3D"MsoNormal"><span style=3D"font-size:=
14.0pt;font-family:"Arial",sans-serif">Keep working on the brakes=
as the life you save might be your own.<u></u><u></u></span></p><p class=
=3D"MsoNormal"><span style=3D"font-size:14.0pt;font-family:"Arial"=
;,sans-serif"><u></u>=C2=A0<u></u></span></p><p class=3D"MsoNormal"><span s=
tyle=3D"font-size:14.0pt;font-family:"Arial",sans-serif">Best reg=
ards,<u></u><u></u></span></p><p class=3D"MsoNormal"><span style=3D"font-si=
ze:14.0pt;font-family:"Arial",sans-serif"><u></u>=C2=A0<u></u></s=
pan></p><p class=3D"MsoNormal"><span style=3D"font-size:14.0pt;font-family:=
"Arial",sans-serif">Bob Begani<u></u><u></u></span></p><p class=
=3D"MsoNormal"><span style=3D"font-size:14.0pt;font-family:"Arial"=
;,sans-serif"><u></u>=C2=A0<u></u></span></p><div><div style=3D"border:none=
;border-top:solid #e1e1e1 1.0pt;padding:3.0pt 0in 0in 0in"><p class=3D"MsoN=
ormal"><b>From:</b> Healeys <<a href=3D"mailto:healeys-bounces@autox.tea=
m.net" target=3D"_blank" rel=3D"noreferrer">healeys-bounces@autox.team.net<=
/a>> <b>On Behalf Of </b>Harold Manifold via Healeys<br><b>Sent:</b> Tue=
sday, March 30, 2021 4:18 PM<br><b>To:</b> Roger Grace <<a href=3D"mailt=
o:roggrace@telus.net" target=3D"_blank" rel=3D"noreferrer">roggrace@telus.n=
et</a>>; Bob Spidell <<a href=3D"mailto:bspidell@comcast.net"; target=
=3D"_blank" rel=3D"noreferrer">bspidell@comcast.net</a>><br><b>Cc:</b> H=
ealeys <<a href=3D"mailto:healeys@autox.team.net"; target=3D"_blank" rel=
=3D"noreferrer">healeys@autox.team.net</a>><br><b>Subject:</b> Re: [Heal=
eys] Rear brake adjustment<u></u><u></u></p></div></div><p class=3D"MsoNorm=
al"><u></u>=C2=A0<u></u></p><p class=3D"MsoNormal">Does this help? Note the=
difference between item 2 and 4.<u></u><u></u></p><p class=3D"MsoNormal"><=
u></u>=C2=A0<u></u></p><p class=3D"MsoNormal">Harold Manifold<u></u><u></u>=
</p><p class=3D"MsoNormal"><u></u>=C2=A0<u></u></p><div style=3D"border:non=
e;border-top:solid #e1e1e1 1.0pt;padding:3.0pt 0in 0in 0in"><p class=3D"Mso=
Normal"><b>From: </b><a href=3D"mailto:healeys@autox.team.net"; target=3D"_b=
lank" rel=3D"noreferrer">Roger Grace via Healeys</a><br><b>Sent: </b>Tuesda=
y, March 30, 2021 9:54 AM<br><b>To: </b><a href=3D"mailto:bspidell@comcast.=
net" target=3D"_blank" rel=3D"noreferrer">Bob Spidell</a><br><b>Cc: </b><a =
href=3D"mailto:healeys@autox.team.net"; target=3D"_blank" rel=3D"noreferrer"=
>Healeys</a><br><b>Subject: </b>Re: [Healeys] Rear brake adjustment<u></u><=
u></u></p></div><p class=3D"MsoNormal"><u></u>=C2=A0<u></u></p><div><div><p=
class=3D"MsoNormal">Yes thank you;=C2=A0 that sounds like a good explanati=
on. As you say it is a bear of a job and just working up some stamina to ta=
ckle it again !<u></u><u></u></p></div><div><p class=3D"MsoNormal">rg<u></u=
><u></u></p></div></div><p class=3D"MsoNormal"><u></u>=C2=A0<u></u></p><div=
><div><p class=3D"MsoNormal">On Mon, Mar 29, 2021 at 10:38 PM Bob Spidell &=
lt;<a href=3D"mailto:bspidell@comcast.net"; target=3D"_blank" rel=3D"norefer=
rer">bspidell@comcast.net</a>> wrote:<u></u><u></u></p></div></div><p cl=
ass=3D"MsoNormal" style=3D"margin-right:0in;margin-bottom:12.0pt;margin-lef=
t:4.8pt">re: "I note that the slave is tight on the back plate. How ti=
ght is <br>normal floating ?"<br><br>I just spent several hours on my =
back on a greasy floor working on my <br>BN2's rear drums. I didn't=
see any text in the shop manual explaining <br>installation; most I found =
was a pic in the Moss catalog showing that <br>the curved spring, with the =
'hooks,' should be installed above the <br>cylinder (between the cy=
linder and the handbrake lever). First, I <br>installed the flat plate agai=
nst the backing plate with the spring plate <br>on top of it. Not only woul=
d the cylinder not move freely--which enables <br>the self-energizing aspec=
t of the brakes--but the rubber dust boot had <br>nothing to hold it in pla=
ce. I then reversed the installation; i.e. the <br>spring plate was still a=
bove the cylinder, but under the flat plate <br>(hooks up). This way the cy=
linder would slide smoothly and easily, which <br>makes sense because there=
is less contact area, but the rubber boot, <br>which is beveled on the inn=
er part fit naturally under the flat plate <br>and would stay in place when=
vigorously sliding the cylinder <br>back-and-forth. Contact surfaces were =
lightly greased.<br><br>Short answer: the cylinder should slide smoothly an=
d easily; otherwise <br>the self-energizing feature could be defeated, and =
the cylinder could be <br>stuck in the expanded position, which could expla=
in your non-retracting <br>problem.<br><br>Bob<br><br><br>On 3/29/2021 3:07=
PM, Roger Grace via Healeys wrote:<br>> BJ8 ph2.<br>> I am Strugglin=
g to get consistent results for rear brake shoe adjustment.<br>> All par=
t of a project to get handbrake working properly - currently it <br>> is=
almost vertical.<br>> Background:<br>> New shoes, slaves and springs=
etc with less than 4k mi. Almost no sign <br>> of any wear yet.<br>>=
Handbrake lever clevis pins removed.<br>> Steady post adjusted so the p=
eg just touches when brakes are adjusted <br>> tight.<br>> Then the a=
djustment set so you can just hear/feel slight brake drag.<br>> All OK s=
o far.<br>><br>> Here is the problem:<br>> When the handbrake leve=
r is pushed with screwdriver or my hand it <br>> moves with initial free=
play then clamps the shoes as it should.=C2=A0 <br>> However=C2=A0 when=
released brakes do not fully retract, and shoes bind and <br>> not at=
=C2=A0 the same setting that started off with.<br>> Same story with usin=
g the hydraulics; seems to hang up, in not quite <br>> the off position.=
Both wheels are the same.<br>> Shoes can be "reset"=C2=A0 to =
original setting by rattling the adjuster <br>> back and forth in=C2=A0 =
the freeplay zone.<br>> All looks fine when drum is off and you can see =
the shoe operation.<br>><br>> My thoughts :<br>> I observe that th=
e new springs actually touch the inside of the shoes ?<br>> Maybe some g=
rease there ? Is this interference normal ?<br>> Is it possible to incor=
rectly assemble the shoes/springs ?<br>> See photo of RR.<br>> I note=
that the slave is tight on the back plate. How tight is normal <br>> fl=
oating ?<br>> Maybe I assembled the slave cylinder clips incorrectly ?<b=
r>><br>> All=C2=A0 suggestions appreciated<br>> rg<br>><br>>=
<br>><br>><br>><br>><br>><br><br>___________________________=
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